🏀 KuBuckets Archive

Ok we are in that moment of nothing really to talk about. So is anybody interested about talking the power 5 or conference realignment?

If you are, here is a couple points that I have. This ideal of the big 12 expanding isn't going to happen period. Why should they? The way I see things is the BG1, SEC, and the Pac are safe. The BG1 and the SEC are safe because they are big boys. The Pac is safe because of the time zone they live in. That leaves the Big 12 and the ACC.

With the this new 4 team playoff and the potential to jump to 8 the concept of the power 5 doesn't work. Nobody wants to be left out. If this was a poker game I would say the Big 12 holds the cards. They have UT and OU and the ACC has nothing to match it. Yet the Big 12 has it's problems too. Overall I think the Big 12 is just fine, but this is a new era of tv contracts, and nobody wants to play second fiddle. Especially UT and OU.

I've been traveling a lot of message boards and I have to say I'm laughing. The ACC faithful think they are safe and that the Big 12 is in trouble. :D I don't see it that way. With all the teams the ACC has including ND as a partial member they still couldn't ink a tv contract better than the Big 12.

Yet I wonder? the other night hanging out in the garage drinking a few cold ones. What would happen if the ACC and the Big 12 merged? Why play second fiddle? When you could really build a super conference? I know it won't happen but hey it's a dead period here. You could have ND, UT, OU, FSU, NC and KU just to start with. Yes I realize some teams are going to be left out, but hey this is unchartered waters we live in.

So am I wasting my time or are you interested?

@DoubleDD
Don't know-I just know we were solid, then on the ropes for a while in danger of losing a chair when the music stopped, and now we are a solid power conference.

I would rather play it safe with the Big 12(ten) than roll the dice

@DoubleDD

It is just a matter of time before the music starts and stops again and everyone has to grab a chair.

All of these recent changes haven't had time to settle in for a long period to see if they actually work. I have my doubts that everyone will be happy. Long travel, time zones, expenses, and the lack of historic rivalries seems to be blasting out to me as some of the issues.

When Missouri left the B12 I think we all realized it was the end of one of the true rivalries in college sports. There was a story behind it, dating back to days before the universities were formed. These rivalries simply can not be replaced... much like an art-deco cinema house being scraped to make a parking lot will ever match the long term value offered by the cinema, which was a piece of history.

There was a lot of short-sightedness and fear-based reactions behind most of the conference changes. Decision-makers could only see the short-term gain of having a bigger parking lot.

I don't pretend to have answers on this topic, but my gut says that the B12 needs to maintain some Midwest integrity. I don't know if that can realistically be preserved at this point, but it is something we should all keep in our minds.

There are still some old rivalries and heritage left in this league. KU-KSU.... OU-OSU.... OU-UT...

Now... just imagine for a second we had kept our original B12 teams while the rest of the country played musical chairs... imagine what a dominant conference we would have. I'm certain it would be the most-dominant and prestigious conference in the country had it stayed together. Neb-OU... KU-MU... UT-A&M... CU-legal pot?

@drgnslayr I know right? However the powers at NU and A&M thought they were more than they really are. To be honest I don't blame CU and even (shaking my head) MU. They had to do what they thought was right at the time.

I guess my point is everybody seems to think the Big 12 needs to add schools just to survive and I don't agree. I mean if the ACC and the Big 12 are the two in trouble of being picked off then why not join forces and create a truly super conference. I was looking at both conferences and if they joined forces they would create something I'm not even sure the SEC could rival. Only problem is a few schools would be left out.

It really doesn't matter it won't happen. The Big 12 is sitting back waiting for the BG1 and the SEC to pick apart the ACC. They're looking for scrapes. All my life I've seen people and businesses be reactive when they could just be proactive. I really hate the ideal that KU is waiting to see what UT is going to do. I really do.

@DoubleDD

I do believe CU was the only team with a legitimate reason to "go west."

The biggest mistake we could make as a conference is make ANOTHER knee-jerk reaction to add teams that will never really contribute to the conference. We've already done that. We really don't need anymore horny toads.

The problem is, once you get these under-producing schools in it is almost impossible to kick them out.

I'm not against us adding two teams to make it a conference of 12 (which is our name), as long as those teams will be definite contributors to the conference when it comes to both status and financially. They should also make sense as a cultural fit to the B12.

I know... we'll recruit NU and A&M!

These A&M grads are doing back flips about the SEC.
All they want is a game against hated Texas-otherwise they don't give a sh*t about the Big 12. I don't know about NU, but there must be some who miss the long term affiliations going back to big 8 and before.

Forgive me but I recently spent some time w two mizzery grads. After mentioning they were now in the SEC, they admitted they missed the B12 and playing Kansas.

@JayhawkRock78

And at least A&M stands a chance to win a conference title in the B12.

Oh heck...

What the heck....

Let's spend every university dollar we have right now on developing football.

And then after a few years of building real football, let's invite Mizzou back to our conference!

Imagine dominating their arzes in both basketball and football?

The trouble with uniting the ACC and Big 12 is that the ideal conference has 16 teams or less. Anything more becomes to difficult to manage. The current conference roster in the Big 12 and ACC is as follows:

Baylor, Boston College, Clemson, Duke, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, Louisville, Miami, North Carolina, NC State, Notre Dame (except football), Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Pitt, Syracuse, Texas, TCU, Texas Tech, Virginia, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, West Virginia.

That's 25 schools. The only option is to have a superconference that is really two conferences of 12 divided into six groups of 4, dropping Notre Dame unless they agree to participate in all sports.

The schools group fairly easily by fours:

The West Plains: Kansas, Kansas State, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Tobacco Road: Duke, UNC, NC State, Wake Forest

Northeast: Boston College, Pitt, Syracuse, West Virginia

Lone Star: Baylor, Texas, TCU, Texas Tech

East Plains: Iowa State, Louisville, Virginia, Virginia Tech

South: Clemson, Florida State, Georgia Tech, Miami

Other than that Eastern Plains division, everything else divides fairly nicely. The West Plains, East Plains and Northeast would be one "conference." The South, Lone Star and Tobacco Road would be the other "conference." Each school would play their division foes each year, plus one school from each of the other 5 divisions, so that every four years you would play everyone in the superconference, and every 8 years would be a home and home in football. The team in each conference with the best record would play in a superconference title game.

For basketball, you would have home and homes against your division (6 games), plus one game against each team in your super conference (8 more games) and one game against two teams in each of the other three divisions (6 games). Yes, that's a 20 game conference schedule, but it breaks out nicely because every two years you would have played everybody, and every four years you would play a home and home.

The divisions would keep things from getting too unwieldy because the superconference tournament would seed based on conference record.

It's probably much too complex to ever happen, but there is at least one way to do it.

@justanotherfan
IF, and a big IF that ever happened I think your plan is well thought out.

@DoubleDD I can't really say I'm interested in this topic right now because I am expecting a black swan event (something so unlikely that I can't even think what it might be). Maybe the O'Bannon thing blows up and college basketball is acquired by Netflix. Or all the high school players unionize. Or something else unimaginable. Conference realignment seems so last year.

@justanotherfan WOW!! Finally someone has an idea that makes some kind of sense. Sorry, Bro, that's the kiss of death.

Actually I believe that 10 is the ideal number of schools for a conference. You get to play the other 9 schools in football, alternating location every year, and home and away games against all other conference teams in basketball. It is the perfect number of conference games for both sports.

@drgnslayr My joke-at-ourselves post for today: When you said "we really dont need anymore horny toads...", I chuckled and thought: "Well, boy howdy, they actually DID beat us in football, and basketball (when WildBill showed up in Dallas with his Topeka-Y team...)...so, yes, we do not need any more horny toads..." (lol!)

@justanotherfan--Love it, but to me ND has to be all in or no deal. I was thinking a few schools would have to be left behind, but you showed me how it could work. I say why not. Why sit back and let the BG1 and the SEC decide what's going to happen? Lets stop this madness and create the greatest super conference ever! (Yea I know it isn't going to happen)

@DoubleDD

There are just so many moving parts to making a conference this big. How to handle minor sports, how to handle travel. Those trips to Syracuse and BC in the winter would be brutal. Teams would be spread from Lubbock, Texas to Coral Gables, Florida to Chestnut Hill, Massachusetts.

You would have to figure out bowl affiliations and TV schedules. The easiest thing to do would be to break the TV schedule into parts, so that each division would show in the viewing area, so the states of Kansas and Oklahoma wouldn't be stuck with a Big Monday game showing UNC and Pitt, but would see KU and Louisville instead. You would have to do two different games each week to give options, but that might create double the money. Same thing in football. You would need to offer ESPN two games so that UT fans wouldn't be stuck watching Florida State and Virginia instead of Texas and UNC.

@justanotherfan -- I get what your saying but if you're the super conference that can control the east coast, Midwest and the South couldn't you kind of call your shots? I'm just thinking outside the box here. Everybody thinks the Big 12 and the ACC are the weakest of the Power 5. Yet if they combined they would become the power. Not only would the alliance put the BG1 and the SEC in their place put it would take power from the networks. Think about it? A conference network of this size would be a must have. They wouldn't have to force their conference network on anybody. The people, the fan bases would be screaming to have it.

Not to mention instead of a football conference championship you could have a conference 4 team playoff in football for a conference Champion. :D. Also the basketball tournament would just be crazy. What do you think?

One problem ND has to be all in and that means one school has to be out. :(

@DoubleDD

I agree about ND being in and making the conference better. I also think Louisville is a must. UVA and Va Tech would probably be a package. I can't see the Big XII agreeing to a merger without an original member like Iowa State included. WVU fits too well with the group in the northeast.

Basically, the concept of ND is sound, but the practicality of it is not. ND would be a tough sell, while everyone else probably would be pretty agreeable. And with that many schools, you don't necessarily need Notre Dame. Further, ND could be the destabilizing force, because they would want to bring in their NBC deal, while this conference would have the ESPN/ABC thing already in place.

If KU were in a conference that extended to a coast, it would be to our advantage for recruiting -- at least in basketball where we have a brand.

In the model mentioned, the exposure we would get in New York and Boston area would bring us access to talent that is currently harder to attract.

That would be true of all the other schools in the conference.

But the unique advantage is that we are geographically on the western edge of that (imaginary) conference, so we would have greater access and exposure to recruits in the west than most of the other schools.