🏀 KuBuckets Archive

A question for discussion:

Many games during, say, the past 6 years have seen KU make our signature runs off to a 12 or 15 or even 20 point lead. Then, it seems too often, we seem to let up on the gas and the other team--often of substantially lower pedigree--comes clawing back. With 4 minutes or so to go, we suddenly have a lead that is back to single digits. This past game, it got down to 10 when Tristan sank the 3 that allowed easier breathing. Sometimes, though, we end up losing an especially disappointing heartbreaker.

So, my topic is twofold:

First, what causes this? It has occurred while having two hard-as-nails determined All Americans. It has occurred when having seemingly less bull-headed players. The talent has varied, but the lack of a killer instinct seems consistent. Is it something in Self's late game strategy? Different defense (like football teams that adopt the dreaded "prevent defense" that prevents nothing)? His personality that conveys relaxing to the team?

Secondly, do all teams do this, and I just don't notice because I don't follow their games as consistently? Is it just the normal ebb and flow of every game, but I am more sensitive because of my emotional connection to KU?

@mayjay You're spot on. This can only come from coaching. You remember (don't know how old you are.....) but Roy's teams would get a lead on someone and then streeeeeeeeeeeeeeeetch it. They would stomp on their necks, show no mercy. It was a much more fun style of b-ball to watch, in my opinion. I'll take a 40 point win over a 2 point squeaker anytime.

@mayjay I'm at work, but remember w/the 3, its really hard to have a safe cushion. Think how many times we've come back?

@mayjay

Might be off base but I think some combination of rule changes & the way the game is played today has had a big impact on this.

With the rule changes specifically I mean the reduction in the shot clock and the freedom of movement rules that have made the game more offense friendly (promoting higher scoring games). More possessions in games. Less time for the old Self teams where you could mug the opponent.

Today's game has changed so much with the focus on perimeter shooting. Case in point KU has a 9 point lead in the 2nd half against Duke and in 2 possessions its a 1 score game. 10 years ago were 4 man's shooting 3's and could have a team eliminated an almost double digit deficit so quickly?

Good point about the Tristan 3. The game felt out of reach for Greensboro but if Tristan misses that shot do they come back down the court and score and make it single digits with plenty of time?

We have lacked defensive intensity for quite a few years now (what, about 7?), and it's a problem. I think that it needs to be priority again. Cause? Stale blood in the assistant ranks?

Marco said:

Stale blood in the assistant ranks?

Interesting point. I wonder if one of them will "decide" to retire during this NCAA stuff, which would, of course, make the NCAA unable to compel his testimony about his conversations....

But, that aside aside (yes, not a typo), the assistant coaches -- especially JH -- do an amazing job of recruiting in addition to skills and bench coaching. Norm seems less animated than before, but the others still are energetic, but I can't see how ass't coaches would undermine a cutthroat drive to polish the opponent off.

mayjay said:

Marco said:

Stale blood in the assistant ranks?

Interesting point. I wonder if one of them will "decide" to retire during this NCAA stuff, which would, of course, make the NCAA unable to compel his testimony about his conversations....

But, that aside aside (yes, not a typo), the assistant coaches -- especially JH -- do an amazing job of recruiting in addition to skills and bench coaching. Norm seems less animated than before, but the others still are energetic, but I can't see how ass't coaches would undermine a cutthroat drive to polish the opponent off.

I think that it could be. Compared to the lockdown D that we were known for during Coach's first 8 or 9 years what we put out on the court now is nothing. The vibe during that time was just electric, and the offense fed off of it.

I personally think it is just the nature of basketball. Basketball, at all levels, is very prone to "runs" and swings in momentum. I see this happening all over the country on a regular basis. To me, it seems that it always has. Basketball is a hard game to manage with a lead.

HighEliteMajor said:

I personally think it is just the nature of basketball. Basketball, at all levels, is very prone to "runs" and swings in momentum. I see this happening all over the country on a regular basis. To me, it seems that it always has. Basketball is a hard game to manage with a lead.

It helps to have D, though. Tech is doing it just fine.

I think the foot off the pedal analogy is true. The problem actually comes more on the offensive end than the defense. The O gets complacent. When buckets were coming seemingly without effort (think the 1st half of the semis in the 2008 tourney against UNC when we were up 40-16) and then players start getting a little fancy, forgetting fundamentals, trying to make sportscenter, and suddenly your comfy lead is down, the opposition is energized and you've got a ballgame on your hands.

Since you wondered if you notice it because you're hyper aware of what KU does, my Badger fandom has led me to observe it with them too! An hour after we lost to Duke, the Badgers led St. Mary's by a bunch and suddenly it disappeared into a disappointing loss!

@wissox "The O gets complacent."

I have noticed that these things happen when we tend to look like we are scared offensively. Less freedom of movement, tentative dribbling, and telegraphed passing seem to be from the fear of making mistakes--and ironically causes them. The whole Duke game seemed like that. As if everyone is diagramming plays on their minds and going over them a couple of times before executing them. (Except, of course, for the plays where they seemed to have no idea what to do, like the crazy jump passes under the basket--"Uh oh, now what? THROW IT!")

Defensive ability is the key to putting games away. To put a team away you have to get multiple stops consecutively. Let's say you're up 10 with 8 minutes left. With today's game, as noted above, that lead can disappear in less than two minutes. But if you can get four consecutive stops while getting scores on three of those possessions, the lead all of a sudden has ballooned to 16 or more.

On the other hand, if you can't get consistent stops, maybe the lead only goes from 10 to 12, or maybe even stays at 10 because you just trade baskets.

I can't remember the last time KU had a really, really good team defensively. They have had good defensive players, but I'm talking about a team of strong defenders. The type of team that could take a team out of their offense for a half a dozen possessions at a time. KU hasn't had that in a while, so teams can hang around unless KU hits them with a huge scoring flow (scores on four or five straight possessions) while the other team only scores on one or two in that stretch. We don't see many 12-0 runs from this team. It's more like 10-4 or 12-4, and its usually sparked by scoring rather than defense.

When they changed the rules is the last time. Travis releford team was the last best defensive team. Remember, we couldn't touch them anymore? We lost our D mojo.

@Crimsonorblue22 But that has been a while and our coaches should have adjusted for that.

Was just answering question.

I loathe monocausality, but it has to do with rule changes (more possessions, points of emphasis on defense), our lack of elite defensive talent over the years, and younger teams.

@FarmerJayhawk my new word, monocausality, I like it! Thx teach!

First off basketball is a game of runs, pretty much has been since the shot clock was implemented. Some of it as mentioned above is the age of the players, Evansville with a team full of upperclassmen beating UK last night is an example. That is also the reason we are seeing more upsets in March. The freedom of movement fouls and shorter shot clock also play a hand. In the NBA you’re not outta a game down 10 with 3 minutes to go because of the 24 seconds they get. I think KU hasn’t had team full of killers since 08 maybe 2011. We do have some tendencies to relax with a lead and a lot of that is on coaching IMO.