Brigham Young University Cougars - Tonight - 9pm - ESPN

If Self runs two bigs tonight we will have issues. Also, this Kansas team is not a good shooting team. Outside of Moss, I'm not expecting a make when a 3 goes up. This team's make up is speed and athleticism. I know he never does it but I don't get why Self doesn't press? Agbaji, Dotson, Garett all pressure, with Doke all the way back as a rim protector would speed the game up and get easy layups.

BShark

Nov 26, 2019 05:16 PM #35

@BigBad Sounds like we won't based on Self's comments.

BeddieKU23

Nov 26, 2019 05:32 PM #36

Yeah sounds like RIP to the 2 big lineup for now.

Crimsonorblue22

Nov 26, 2019 05:38 PM #37

Silvio and Dave aren't doing to great as the 1 in the 4-1. At least the last game. I can see maybe Tristan playing the 5 spot if doke gets in trouble??

BigBad

Nov 26, 2019 05:42 PM #38

I'm kind of getting sick of Self and co still mainly recruiting athletes over skill guys. I'm really getting tired of having a team full of guys that cant shoot. If we didn't have Dedric last year then we would have been HORRIFICALLY short on skill.

Crimsonorblue22

Nov 26, 2019 05:43 PM #39

@wrwlumpy great job as always! Do you have any idea how old these guys are? I know they do mission work and are older, just wondered how much older. Thx!

BShark

Nov 26, 2019 05:45 PM #40

The problem is guys that are athletic and very skilled go to the NBA in one year or less. Also very hard to land.

Self tried to add some shooters in the last class with McBride, Wilson and Braun. One quit, one got hurt (and wasn't ready anyway) and the other can't play defense well enough yet. In time I think Braun and Wilson will be good players for us and a good fit with Bryce. Lots of shooting.

Marco

Nov 26, 2019 05:48 PM #41

Crimsonorblue22 said:

Silvio and Dave aren't doing to great as the 1 in the 4-1. At least the last game. I can see maybe Tristan playing the 5 spot if doke gets in trouble??

Tonight's starting five should be Dok, Tristan, Braun, Dotson and Moss. Silvio, Agbaji and Garrett need to come off the bench, if for nothing else because they can play multiple positions giving us added depth - this is a prime example game where not having Wilson could hurt (though I expect us to win).

I know I'm going to catch hell for calling for Braun to start, so be it, but we need his outside shooting this season - no better time than the present. It will pay off bigtime come Big12 play.

jayballer73

Nov 26, 2019 05:52 PM #42

BigBad said:

I'm kind of getting sick of Self and co still mainly recruiting athletes over skill guys. I'm really getting tired of having a team full of guys that cant shoot. If we didn't have Dedric last year then we would have been HORRIFICALLY short on skill.

sorry not really sure if I following about not shooting - -we shot 55% for the game last night - - -and like 41. 8 - from the 3 - I can't holler about those numbers

jayballer73

Nov 26, 2019 05:53 PM #43

BeddieKU23 said:

Yeah sounds like RIP to the 2 big lineup for now.

for sure I think if we make the Championship and Virginia Tech happens to make it - -we MUST go 4 out to match up with those guys - and he said himself last night wasn't sure how much longer he could go 2 bigs

BigBad

Nov 26, 2019 06:12 PM #44

jayballer73 said:

BigBad said:

I'm kind of getting sick of Self and co still mainly recruiting athletes over skill guys. I'm really getting tired of having a team full of guys that cant shoot. If we didn't have Dedric last year then we would have been HORRIFICALLY short on skill.

sorry not really sure if I following about not shooting - -we shot 55% for the game last night - - -and like 41. 8 - from the 3 - I can't holler about those numbers

That was a Division TWO team with really no height or athleticism to contest jumpers. We were 12/29 which is 41% take away Moss and we are 9/25 from 3 at 36%. NOT GOOD. We have rim runners and protectors in Dave and Doke and we have a fast point guard. Our issue is and will continue to be outside shooting. If GOOD teams can pack on us we will lose. We need one to two of Dotson, Agbaji/Tristan to get hot each game to go with Moss to have a respected spread floor.

It isn't just numbers. It's obvious that guys are not comfortable shooters beyond the arc. Dotson uses way too much jump and lift on his 3s and will never be consistent. Agbaji has a bit of a hitchy jumper.

Self has never and I'm betting will never see value in a guy who truly stretches the floor but is below average on D. He won't recruit a kid like that often and if he does(Frankcamp/Greene) he can't deal with the lack of d and stops playing them.

Crimsonorblue22

Nov 26, 2019 06:19 PM #45

@Marco disagree! I like the second half starters, dot, och, Marcus, moss and doke. I'd put Tristan in for doke. Brawn doesn't play D, yet. I do think he can shoot.

HighEliteMajor

Nov 26, 2019 06:24 PM #46

@Crimsonorblue22 @Marco I like both of your lineups, though a touch early to start Braun I think. He may never be a starter which is ok. Neither of you (interestingly) mentioned McCormack. I like him, but just not with another big.

jayballer73

Nov 26, 2019 06:28 PM #47

BigBad said:

jayballer73 said:

BigBad said:

I'm kind of getting sick of Self and co still mainly recruiting athletes over skill guys. I'm really getting tired of having a team full of guys that cant shoot. If we didn't have Dedric last year then we would have been HORRIFICALLY short on skill.

sorry not really sure if I following about not shooting - -we shot 55% for the game last night - - -and like 41. 8 - from the 3 - I can't holler about those numbers

That was a Division TWO team with really no height or athleticism to contest jumpers. We were 12/29 which is 41% take away Moss and we are 9/25 from 3 at 36%. NOT GOOD. We have rim runners and protectors in Dave and Doke and we have a fast point guard. Our issue is and will continue to be outside shooting. If GOOD teams can pack on us we will lose. We need one to two of Dotson, Agbaji/Tristan to get hot each game to go with Moss to have a respected spread floor.

It isn't just numbers. It's obvious that guys are not comfortable shooters beyond the arc. Dotson uses way too much jump and lift on his 3s and will never be consistent. Agbaji has a bit of a hitchy jumper.

Self has never and I'm betting will never see value in a guy who truly stretches the floor but is below average on D. He won't recruit a kid like that often and if he does(Frankcamp/Greene) he can't deal with the lack of d and stops playing them.

True could be better for sure , we shoot 38% for the season - - Tech at 42.4 - -& Baylor at 40 % are the only 2 better then us in league. -- We do however lead the league in fg % @ 52 % - -8th best in the Nation - -Dayton which leads the nation in FG % is at 54 % - - -we are 2nd in the League in scoring at 84 PPG - - 51st in the Nation in 3 point shooting - -for sure could be better -BUT then again could be a hell of a lot worse too - how many teams are there? - what close to 300? - -I understand and agree with what your saying, please don't think I'm trying to be a smart as or anything -- just saying I think over the season we will probably get better. - The only reason I commented in the 1st place was I thought you were just talking about our overall shooting. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

BigBad

Nov 26, 2019 06:36 PM #48

The NBA has for years used college free throw shooting percentage as a barometer for improving 3 point percentage. There are many reasons for this but overall it generally works. After Moss and Dotson there is only one player on our team above a paltry 60% at the line and its David. Agbaji and Garrett will NOT improve their 3s this season. Neither has any touch and it won't get better as the competetion gets harder and the game speeds up.

We will win a ton of games based on our defense and will be ranked top 5 and maybe get another 1 seed. We will then run into a team in the tournament who can shoot the ball and we will have an awful day from beyond 15' and lose. It will be called a choke from those that are not paying attention. This is who we are.

If Marcus and Agbaji are in the lineup together(which I dont think is a winning formula in Selfs system), Self MUST unleash the defensive power of that lineup and press! Maybe I have too much scar tissue of watching Self press too late in NCAA tournament games when the grind it out game isnt working. We need to work on a solid pressing style now before late March comes and these bad shooters continue to struggle.

Crimsonorblue22

Nov 26, 2019 06:49 PM #49

I love to press! Not sure about a 3 day back to back tourney

BShark

Nov 26, 2019 07:11 PM #50

BigBad said:

The NBA has for years used college free throw shooting percentage as a barometer for improving 3 point percentage. There are many reasons for this but overall it generally works. After Moss and Dotson there is only one player on our team above a paltry 60% at the line and its David. Agbaji and Garrett will NOT improve their 3s this season. Neither has any touch and it won't get better as the competetion gets harder and the game speeds up.

We will win a ton of games based on our defense and will be ranked top 5 and maybe get another 1 seed. We will then run into a team in the tournament who can shoot the ball and we will have an awful day from beyond 15' and lose. It will be called a choke from those that are not paying attention. This is who we are.

If Marcus and Agbaji are in the lineup together(which I dont think is a winning formula in Selfs system), Self MUST unleash the defensive power of that lineup and press! Maybe I have too much scar tissue of watching Self press too late in NCAA tournament games when the grind it out game isnt working. We need to work on a solid pressing style now before late March comes and these bad shooters continue to struggle.

Agree but to me this season is already more enjoyable than last year. And as I mentioned earlier Self appears to be addressing shooting in recruiting. I wish McBride didn't quit.

jayballer73

Nov 26, 2019 09:27 PM #51

Wow - - Georgia was buried in the 1st half against Izzo's boy's -- -like 4 minutes to go in the game - -Georgia only down 4. Anthony Edwards has scored 28 points in the 2nd half - - JUMPIN - - -GEE - - HOSSA - -FATS

edited : - - Edwards ends up with 33 points in the 2nd half - - mercy

nwhawkfan

Nov 26, 2019 09:37 PM #52

Crimsonorblue22 said:

@wrwlumpy great job as always! Do you have any idea how old these guys are? I know they do mission work and are older, just wondered how much older. Thx!

Just thinking...when their fans chant "Who's your daddy?", they could almost be talking literally!

Seriously, though, I couldn't find any player age info on the BYU website. I'm guessing they average at least 4-5 years older than KU. Not just because of the missions, but because most of their players stick around to graduate.

Crimsonorblue22

Nov 26, 2019 10:06 PM #53

@nwhawkfan good one! Sounds like an antlers cheer?

nwhawkfan

Nov 26, 2019 10:42 PM #54

@Crimsonorblue22 Speaking of antlers. ain't a damn shame about Mizzou?

They lost their NCAA appeal today.

(Though they lost their appeal to me a long time before that...
Har har !)

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/ncaa-rejects-missouri-appeal-upholding-postseason-bowl-ban-sanctions-against-football-program/ ↗

Texas Hawk 10

Nov 26, 2019 10:54 PM #55

nwhawkfan said:

Crimsonorblue22 said:

@wrwlumpy great job as always! Do you have any idea how old these guys are? I know they do mission work and are older, just wondered how much older. Thx!

Just thinking...when their fans chant "Who's your daddy?", they could almost be talking literally!

Seriously, though, I couldn't find any player age info on the BYU website. I'm guessing they average at least 4-5 years older than KU. Not just because of the missions, but because most of their players stick around to graduate.

Mormon missions typically last for 2 years and occur after a student's freshman year. Not always the case, but this is the majority of their student athletes that go on mission.

nwhawkfan

Nov 26, 2019 11:06 PM #56

@Texas-Hawk-10 Thanks. Wasn't sure if it was 2 or 3 years.

wrwlumpy

Nov 27, 2019 12:44 AM #57

DanR

Nov 27, 2019 12:52 AM #58

@wrwlumpy is that punt pass and kick photo real? If so... LOLOLOLOLOL

jayballer73

Nov 27, 2019 01:27 AM #59

Tell ya what, IF we win tonight, no matter who we play for the Championship , we better be ready - -both really pesty, quick - will need our a game no matter how much size we got- -probably will for sure be another 4 guard.

Virginia Tech - -really drain the 3 - -Auburn = = = = =2 - -Dayton can shoot and play really good defense, - -IF we move on then we can't afford any slow start. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Edit : - Tell ya what IF we win - -and Dayton wins - - Toppin gonna be a Nightmare for Doke.

DanR

Nov 27, 2019 01:54 AM #60

Who are the announcers for the ku buy game?

dylans

Nov 27, 2019 02:05 AM #61

@DanR Jay Bilas (or Jake lol if you’re Walton)

wrwlumpy

Nov 27, 2019 02:33 AM #62

@DanR

wrwlumpy

Nov 27, 2019 02:45 AM #63

Dayton ahead of VT by 14 in 2nd half.

nwhawkfan

Nov 27, 2019 02:46 AM #64

Hope we can put BYU away early.

With less than a 20-hour turnaround till the final, Dayton looks like the kind of team it'll take a ton of energy to keep up with.