I realize that we are in full swing, but always like to look forward to the following season while now taking into account possible portal transfers and additions, etc.
With that in mind, what are your best guesses for our starting 5 next season and first 5 (though I realize that Self rarely plays 10) off the bench? Who do you think will leave? What should we add?
Juan, Bobby, CB, Jalen (yes he’s coming back with a dramatic announcement), and Mitch in disguise
@rockchalkwyo Mitch in disguise? Clemence?
The 5 spot is a mystery to me next year. I’d like to see Zach but he/his circle see’s himself as a 4.
From what I gather anyway.
I agree the 5 spot is a major mystery. Zach/KJ obviously if Self sticks with the 4/1 lineup. Then you have the young freshman coming Zuby/Udeh that have the muscle/size/athleticism Self wants manning the paint but will obviously be works in progress to play the Self way. It's been a long time since we had this uncertainty about who's the guy in the post given we just went through a long stretch of Lucas/Doke/Dave.
I guess its possible Dave could come back another year given the covid year. His draft prospects are about as low as you'll see on a guy his size and production at a big school like KU.
So much uncertainty and young. For now this is what I see. I think it will change a lot between now and next fall
Juan, CB, Gradey, Wilson, Zach.
Bobby, KJ, Rice, Zuby, Udeh
@BeddieKU23 Fairly confident in Dave being gone.
I could easily see...
Dajuan, Bobby, CB, Gradey, pick a big.
If JWill could be convinced back, slot him into that line-up over Bobby or possibly Gradey. The post situation I have no idea. All the candidates will be guys that played 0 minutes this season or close enough to it.
@Kcmatt7 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
@BShark This is how I see it too. I'm hoping Udeh is able to play a significant role by the end of the season. 7'2 wingspan would really be a game changer in the post.
Not just the wingspan but he does look like a more functional athlete for his size. Of course that's just highlights etc so we don't know exactly how well he moves, jumps etc but he looks a lot closer to Doke then Dave
For my sanity Dave moving on is fine. I'm just saying at this point could it really be ruled out? I just don't see a basketball career for him after this. Another year here to perhaps make that a reality has worked for others.
I included J Will simply because at this point we don't know. He was told he wasn't close to NBA ready if ever at all so maybe he focuses on proving them wrong playing here. He'd certainly see his role increase even more next year with Och moving on.
I had Bobby there and I certainly think he could start next season but its difficult to start two guys that haven't shown the kind of offensive skill you need in the backcourt. Gradey developing into a scorer this year makes me think he has a legitimate shot at starting.
@BeddieKU23 I have to think Dave with a Master's degree will be gone. But yea I've felt with him and Jalen both that at this point maybe they'll be back
@BeddieKU23 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
For my sanity Dave moving on is fine. I'm just saying at this point could it really be ruled out? I just don't see a basketball career for him after this. Another year here to perhaps make that a reality has worked for others.
I included J Will simply because at this point we don't know. He was told he wasn't close to NBA ready if ever at all so maybe he focuses on proving them wrong playing here. He'd certainly see his role increase even more next year with Och moving on.
I had Bobby there and I certainly think he could start next season but its difficult to start two guys that haven't shown the kind of offensive skill you need in the backcourt. Gradey developing into a scorer this year makes me think he has a legitimate shot at starting.
Yea, that backcourt isn’t gonna cut it unless Bobby turns into Frank by next season, or if everybody else turns into Rush, WiggIns and Joel. That’d be nice. We need some scoring and shooting from the guards for sure.
I don’t know much about next year’s guys yet. I did see Grady play a few games. He honestly didn’t do much, but that was a while back and a small sample size.
So what does everybody think about Dave? Would you take him back or boot him?
@rockchalkjayhawk said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
@BeddieKU23 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
For my sanity Dave moving on is fine. I'm just saying at this point could it really be ruled out? I just don't see a basketball career for him after this. Another year here to perhaps make that a reality has worked for others.
I included J Will simply because at this point we don't know. He was told he wasn't close to NBA ready if ever at all so maybe he focuses on proving them wrong playing here. He'd certainly see his role increase even more next year with Och moving on.
I had Bobby there and I certainly think he could start next season but its difficult to start two guys that haven't shown the kind of offensive skill you need in the backcourt. Gradey developing into a scorer this year makes me think he has a legitimate shot at starting.
Yea, that backcourt isn’t gonna cut it unless Bobby turns into Frank by next season, or if everybody else turns into Rush, WiggIns and Joel. That’d be nice. We need some scoring and shooting from the guards for sure.
I don’t know much about next year’s guys yet. I did see Grady play a few games. He honestly didn’t do much, but that was a while back and a small sample size.
So what does everybody think about Dave? Would you take him back or boot him?
I think its highly unlikely given the recruiting efforts put into the frontcourt the past two cycles. But the covid year does make it possible I guess. I have my own thoughts regarding Dave but perhaps the staff would recruit him back if they felt the need. Self has kept Mitch around 6 years so I don't think he'd ever run out a starter that wanted to be here. However I think they made some promises to recruits and young bigs on the roster already that would make it difficult to make everyone happy.
I fully believe in Bobby for the future. He's yet to hit a shot outside the paint this season so its certainly a valid concern right now whether we can have Harris/Bobby out there a majority of minutes. I love the 2 guard lineup for spacing/ball handling/play-making but I would hate to see us put out a lineup that cannot score easily.
@BeddieKU23 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
@rockchalkjayhawk said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
@BeddieKU23 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
For my sanity Dave moving on is fine. I'm just saying at this point could it really be ruled out? I just don't see a basketball career for him after this. Another year here to perhaps make that a reality has worked for others.
I included J Will simply because at this point we don't know. He was told he wasn't close to NBA ready if ever at all so maybe he focuses on proving them wrong playing here. He'd certainly see his role increase even more next year with Och moving on.
I had Bobby there and I certainly think he could start next season but its difficult to start two guys that haven't shown the kind of offensive skill you need in the backcourt. Gradey developing into a scorer this year makes me think he has a legitimate shot at starting.
Yea, that backcourt isn’t gonna cut it unless Bobby turns into Frank by next season, or if everybody else turns into Rush, WiggIns and Joel. That’d be nice. We need some scoring and shooting from the guards for sure.
I don’t know much about next year’s guys yet. I did see Grady play a few games. He honestly didn’t do much, but that was a while back and a small sample size.
So what does everybody think about Dave? Would you take him back or boot him?
I think its highly unlikely given the recruiting efforts put into the frontcourt the past two cycles. But the covid year does make it possible I guess. I have my own thoughts regarding Dave but perhaps the staff would recruit him back if they felt the need. Self has kept Mitch around 6 years so I don't think he'd ever run out a starter that wanted to be here. However I think they made some promises to recruits and young bigs on the roster already that would make it difficult to make everyone happy.
I fully believe in Bobby for the future. He's yet to hit a shot outside the paint this season so its certainly a valid concern right now whether we can have Harris/Bobby out there a majority of minutes. I love the 2 guard lineup for spacing/ball handling/play-making but I would hate to see us put out a lineup that cannot score easily.
I like Bobby for sure. he showed some promise early on. Not sure of his entire skill set yet, so reluctant to say he's gonna be da man next year at guard.
Would i take Dave back next year? Hmmm. Tough one. We've seen good Dave, bad Dave and serviceable Dave -- all in the same game! So, guess you have to measure him against who he'd be competing with. Clemence i like. But he's not the same kind of player. Any big who can shoot seems like a nice modern upgrade at the C spot.
I would expect Self to have zero faith in a freshman big guy, so i guess either Dave or Clemence to fill that spot. KJ i'm sure you all know by now i love, but he's not a C, except for really small ball.
Wilson. another hmmm. if he comes back, he's likely the focus of the offense. But, doesn't seem like a good bet to have him back if he performs well the rest of the year.
Harris. He's just a cog in the machinery to me. If you compare him to the outstanding guys we've had at his position over the years, he just doesn't stand out. I'd prefer somebody with more size on defense and a lot more offensive skill.
Self may recruit a Big from portal.
@AsadZ said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
Self may recruit a Big from portal.
Why do you think that?
Just how I'm looking at the scholarship count:
Cuffe
NBA Risk: Braun, Wilson
My best guess as to a preliminary breakdown of minutes:
Zuby is just so raw that I think he ends up being the odd man out his freshman year. Rice isn't coming here to sit the bench. Still dominoes to fall I think. If Bill takes these 12 into next season I'll be ecstatic and surprised. Would be a testament to his ability to retain talent.
Both bigs Self has signed are a bit "raw" but what they may lack in finished skill they make up by being grown ass men. Same for Rice, that guy is coming to college physically prepared like KJ did this season.
The biggest concerns I see on paper are shooting and inexperience. I'm scared a bit but also pretty excited about seeing some of these young guys have real roles unlike this year where's it's basically last years team a year older plus Remy, when he plays
A lot of expectations really depends on whether or not Braun and Wilson are back. They both should be which along with Harris will give KU a ptlretty experienced core group. Outside of those three, the rotation is going to be hurting for quality experience. I think we see Yesufu become a much larger factor in the rotation which should help some in that department. I don't think Dave returns which will leave the 5 spot wide open. Clemence, Adams, Udeh, or possibly Wilson could all end up starting at the 5 next year, but I think Self wants Clemence in that spot. I think Self views Adams as a 4 and we're starting to see Adams play some 4 now.
I agree with others that think this team could potentially struggle to score next season. I'm also not sure about what the defense will look like next season. I'm also wondering if either Dick or Rice even starts next year because would either of them start over Braun or Wilson even with a higher ceiling than either of those guys.
@BeddieKU23 Insurance policy, we have seen time after time, talented Freshmen do not thrive until year 2 or 3 in Self's system.
I can confirm that KJ practices predominantly at the 4.
ETA: I would also expect CB and JWill to start if they are back. This subject came up on the phog recently and some people were floating line-ups that could not score at all. You do need some scoring punch so you can't run out a starting 5 that involves Harris, KJ and Udeh for example.
@Kcmatt7 said in Never too early starting 5 for 2022-23:
@BShark I am worried Bill goes away from the 4-1 next season. Despite his most recent best teams all playing 4-1. Of course he’ll probably make a FF run going back to the hi-low just to flip us all the bird lol
I'm not worried. In that...it will happen. At a minimum he is going to try it.
I haven’t heard anything lately on Wilson staying/going. Before the season it was he’s 100% gone almost no matter what. So I’ll stick with that.
First game: Harris, Braun, Dick, Adams, McCormack (lol jk… or am I?)
League play: Harris, Rice, Dick, Braun, Clemence
I wouldn’t rule out another guard in the portal, they’ll definitely want one if Rice goes G League.
Where is Wilson going China?
@BeddieKU23 literally anywhere they pay people to play basketball. I really hope not because he’s really starting to figure it out but that was the word in the summer/fall
Well. If that happens it is whatever it is.
Hopefully some bill recruiting and NIL makes a difference
@BeddieKU23 agreed. If he has a change of heart it really makes the lineups simple for next year. Harris Dick Braun Wilson PickYourBig
Hopefully he's watching Ochai real close and the impact that's had for him. I know Och has been on the NBA radar since he shed the red-shirt but it's literally exhibit A of what coming back and being the dude can do for you. Him and Braun have that opportunity sitting there in front of them.