🏀 KuBuckets Archive

I’ve been hearing how the current USA Men’s basketball team would beat the 1992 team. I’m just going to say that’s probably recency bias. The current team needed a last second layup from LeBron James to clinch the win against Sudan. The 1992 team was in a 32 point nail biter as its closest game. The international game has improved dramatically, but Sudan is hardly a power house. I’m disheartened by the lack of focus/defensive intensity/general give a 💩. I’d like to see more effort when representing the country. Just kick their butts thoroughly enough to enjoy the 4th quarter from the bench instead of losing focus so quickly that they have to play to the wire - at least that’s my desire.

As a reminder of what full game effort can do to the competition. - as the late great Logoman Jerry West said, “ ...you know competitive people the word dogs comes up a lot that guy's a dog, I was a wolf. Okay I used to eat dogs.” That’s the mentality I love. Jordan had it. Kobe had it. Maybe Anthony Edwards will have it, the previous group really doesn’t.

https://usopm.org/1992-mens-basketball-team/ ↗

On talent and skill this group is better and it’s not remotely close. We’ll see how they do when the games count

Drive is definitely lacking if this is the overwhelmingly more talented and skilled group. “Soft” I believe is what our coach would say. A team that would get bounced early in the tournament, is the best comp I’ve got.

@FarmerJayhawk my son tried to argue as you did. We spent some time looking at Michael and Lebron highlights. Keep in mind that guys were in their prime in 92. Lebron Curry and Durant are not in their prime.

@approxinfinity a few guys aren’t that’s for sure. But we also have Ant, Tatum, AD, Bam, etc. that are. Magic and Bird were over the hill in 92. Just as an example, the leading scorer on that team was Barkley. Would he even be able to make the team in 24?

I was just talking about this with my kids how the Olympics don’t seem to matter anymore. Professional athletes are just going thru the motions and showing effort. It’s sad I remember them being a huge deal as a kid and loved watching them on one of the 3 channels we had. The dream team would mop the floor with these guys.

@approxinfinity said in Dream Team 2024 vs 1992:

@FarmerJayhawk my son tried to argue as you did. We spent some time looking at Michael and Lebron highlights. Keep in mind that guys were in their prime in 92. Lebron Curry and Durant are not in their prime.

MJ is by far the best player out of either group. He was in his prime at that point and there is nobody that touches prime MJ.

The 1992 roster included:

C- David Robinson, Patrick Ewing

PF- Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Christian Laettner

SF- Larry Bird, Scottie Pippen, Chris Mullin

SG- Michael Jordan, Clyde Drexler

PG- Magic Johnson, John Stockton

This year's roster includes:

C- Joel Embiid, Anthony Davis

PF- Bam Adebayo, Lebron James

SF- Kevin Durant, Jayson Tatum

SG- Anthony Edwards, Derrick White, Devin Booker

PG- Steph Curry, Tyrese Haliburton, Jrue Holiday

The biggest differences between the rosters is that the 2024 team is much more guard heavy because of the evolution of the game.

At the center spot, I think I'd give a slight edge to the Dream Team.

At the 4 spot, I'd say it's a push. Barkley and Malone were in their promes and both were better than Adebayo, but Bam is better than Laettner was. Lebron is a push with Barkley and Malone because he's still a top 5 player in the NBA today after all these years.

At the SF spot, I'd give the edge to the 2024 team. Bird was chosen as a legacy player amd was a shell of himself at that point because of his back and KD and Tatum are a better duo than Pippen and Mullin.

At the SG spot, the Dream Team has the edge. Prime MJ is the GOAT, and prime Drexler was better than the current crop of guards other than Booker. Drexler led Portland to multiple NBA Finals during his career there.

I'd give the PG edge to the 2024 team because of their depth. Magic wasn't Magic anymore amd although I think prime Stockton was better than any of the 2024 PG's individually, he's not better by a significant margin.

As for an actual game, I'd probably pick the Dream Team in a close game. The 2024 team isn't great defensively, but is a much better shooting team than the Dream Team.

@FarmerJayhawk Yes. This team is super soft. They would get killed by those old timers. They’ve never even seen anyone play defense like that. It would be hilarious to watch Jordan make them cry. 😂 Durant and James are the biggest weenies you could hope for and they’re past their prime.

Edwards isn’t quite ready for prime time. He does have the proper attitude. One of the few players on the team that would have earn minutes for the 1992 team.

Tatum and Adabayo would have had Laetners role on the 1992 team deep bench.

The NBA players now would have a hard time with the physicality of 90s basketball. Just like the 2022 team would’ve been destroyed by the 2008 KU basketball team - defense is much different now as in no one plays good defense. Case in point Sudan scored 99 points.

The problem is for people too young to have watched, they have no clue how much the game has regressed on the defensive side. They also have no idea that it would not matter who you paired with prime Jordan, he would win.

They were in their primes, not the announcers you see today.

Pippen 26
David Robinson 26
Karl Malone 28
Jordan 29
Ewing 29
Barkley 29
Stockton 30
Magic 32
Bird 35

-Edwards 22
Tatum 26
Bam 27
Embiid 30
Davis 31
Durant 35
Curry 36
James 39

The 1992 roster had a total of 267,000 career points, 23 championship titles, 100 All-NBA selections, and 14 MVP Awards.

The 2024 Team USA roster 189,000 career points, 15 championship titles, 59 All-NBA selections, and 8 MVP Awards.

Michael Jordan replied:

"I guess we'll never know. I'd like to think that we had 11 Hall of Famers on that team, and whenever they get 11 Hall of Famers, you call and ask me who had the better Dream Team. Remember now, they learned from us. We didn't learn from them." Michael Jordan in 2012 talking about a different forgotten “dream team”.

I wish there was a way to watch them play a series home and home in each era.

The first two games in 2024 are easily taken by the modern team behind a barrage of 3 point shooting. Davis goes down to a non-contact injury proving glass doesn’t belong on the court.

Pissed by the modern officiating and play style the 92 squad evens the series 2-2. Ewing accidentally breaks Embiid cheek bone with an elbow - the mask returns, but hinders play. Barkley mocks him mercilessly. Bruised and battered LeBron slips on his own tears during the press conference. Everyone gets a good laugh.

Game 5 is won by the 2024 squad, but it’s a nail biter as Curry is starting to develop ptsd from all the vicious hand checking back in the 90s.

Game 6 again goes to the home team with defense carrying the team to victory.

Game 7. Jordan says what is this? Never played in one before. Ahead of his 65 point effort in a 20 point win. Magic and Bird get in for the mop up minutes and run the score up a bit.

Barkley gives a speech after the win that offends the alphabet groups. Jordan goes to the front and collects on his gambling winnings. Pippen is still stuck in that horrible contract. Durrant, Curry, and James play a couple more years before retiring. Having been on a court with true greatness Edwards finds that missing gear and goes on to have a career to rival the greats.

@dylans nah it would be super competitive. Most of those guys are small and not skilled or athletic compared to the 24 team. E.g. KD would almost be the tallest guy on the 92 team and LeBron would be the heaviest.

If you go by league scoring averages the early 90's were hot garbage on defense. These "elite defenses" allowed no fewer than 105 points per game in the entire decade leading up to the Dream Team. The O Rating was higher in 92 than last year. A whoooole lot of nostalgia going on there. Part of that is free throws are way down, from like 28 to 21 per game and fouls are down about 5 per game.

Actual lol at Jordan could carry anyone to a title. Prime Jordan didn't even get to a Finals until 1991. He never won a thing without Pippen, who was really good in his own right. The only guy that maybe could carry a team on his back was Wilt and even then the Celtics owned him.

Well the 08 team was absurdly more talented than the 22 team so I don't care which era they play, 08 wins every single time.

Really weird thing to put in all their career stats since all those guys are retired and the 2024 team clearly has a long way to go. Just look at the guys you listed and their ages. On average the two teams are more or less identical, 92 was a year older than 24 and that's entirely due to LeBron who's still preeeetty good.

@FarmerJayhawk The team who beat Germany by 4 and South Sudan by 1? If you wish upon a star 💫

@dylans happens to the best of them…

https://www.basketballnetwork.net/old-school/charles-barkley-recalls-dream-team-scrimmage-vs-college-all-stars ↗

@approxinfinity Hopefully this team coalesces a bit and looks better when Durant plays. It would be shameful to lose a game.

@approxinfinity no that can’t be right. I’ve been told there were no close games and they just rolled everyone because they just played so, so hard. That team was so tough they literally couldn’t lose.

@FarmerJayhawk The way you interpret data is interesting. Did you see that they were playing kids and didn’t want to humiliate them? There is a reason they didn’t try. The 2024 team doesn’t try because they are soft and ~~not as good as they think~~ arrogant, not because they are trying to be nice. Will LeBron win another Bronze? Goodnes I hope not. What a disgrace that would be.

@dylans thats also what Charles Barkley said happened right? No way that guys ego had a revisionist memory? Im just playing devils advocate. In large part, I agree with you here.

But there are parallels. South Sudan def played like it was their game seven.

I also stumbled on someones post suggesting that in 88 a Michael led college team beat the USA team 8 out of 8 times, but i didnt verify. If so, i think that might show how much a prime (or young even) Michael is a difference maker.

@dylans they’re the first or second best basketball team assembled in history. They’re by in large playing with their food in games that don’t count

@FarmerJayhawk that sounds an awful lot like Kentucky every year under Calipari.

@Texas-Hawk-10 I think that’s a fair assessment, this years team plays zero defense to me is the main issue. If they played Jordan likely goes for 60 plus.

@dylans if Cal returned half the team from winning it all last time around and replaced those who left with even better players

@FarmerJayhawk The 2024 team isn’t even the second best USA basketball team that would be the 2012 team when these guys were in their prime.

@kjayhawks said in Dream Team 2024 vs 1992:

@Texas-Hawk-10 I think that’s a fair assessment, this years team plays zero defense to me is the main issue. If they played Jordan likely goes for 60 plus.

We're also comparing this team playing exhibition games at less than full strength. I want to wait until after the Olympics to fully assess how good this group really is. Another major thing to consider is just how much better the rest of the world is now compared to 1992. Now, over 20% of the league is foreign born compared to less than 5% back in 1992.

@Texas-Hawk-10 i’d be curious the average and median stats for foreign born vs domestic. I would be curious if the former would be higher.

@Texas-Hawk-10 interesting… this guy answers my speculation. domestic PER is still higher. Its the top international talent, not the mean, that is great:

https://www.bruinsportsanalytics.com/post/international-players-nba ↗

@dylans these days our guys seem to think yelling "defense" is playing defense. I've seen some people say just wait until the actual games start and they are playing their hardest but I don't buy that at all frankly.

@BShark said in Dream Team 2024 vs 1992:

@dylans these days our guys seem to think yelling "defense" is playing defense.

😂 😂 😂

Now we need someone else to backup @FarmerJayhawk! I see no end to the debate!!! This could be a great (the greatest?!? Squad)…if they played defense. Do we have some advanced stat guy that can put together an obvious angle we are missing?

@approxinfinity said in Dream Team 2024 vs 1992:

@Texas-Hawk-10 interesting… this guy answers my speculation. domestic PER is still higher. Its the top international talent, not the mean, that is great:

https://www.bruinsportsanalytics.com/post/international-players-nba ↗

The PER numbers he used were from 5 and 6 seasons ago and the difference between both seasons was less than 1 point which isn't a significant difference in regards to PER. PER is also a flawed metric to base how good a player is overall because it's heavily biased towards offense.

Back in 1991-92, there were only 23 foreign born players in the NBA. This past season, there was 125 foreign born players in the NBA. The Dream Team was largely responsible for the growth of the game internationally and a lot of those players choosing basketball instead of other sports like soccer.

The overall quality of international countries has increased significantly in the past 32 years and that gap between the US and everyone else is nowhere near what it 32 years ago.

The days of expecting the US to blow everyone out by 40+ is over. It can still happen, but that's no longer the expectation anymore because the world is much better now than in 1992. The US should beat Serbia in their first game of group play, but they won't have the best player on the court that game, Serbia will.

https://www.espn.com/olympics/story/_/id/40638009/steve-kerr-team-usa-raise-intensity-paris-olympics ↗

Kerr is right. Lots of unrealized potential.

Btw Shayok of UVA / ISU repute was on that S Sudan team

This lineup is so much better. Love Jo but he’s not right and the ball tends to stick

Agreed on Embiid. Things looked way off the other day with him in the lineup, at least in the first half. black hole with turnovers. Second half was better. Maybe it's matchup dependent.

Embiid is...kind of bad? Bit of a flopping free throw merchant if we are being honest and the international refs are letting guys get away with a lot more contact than you see in an NBA game.

@BShark well he’s also on one leg and led the NBA in PER last year

Matchups are key for footers success.

The team is playing well. Embiid played well the first half before tweeting his ankle and sitting the second.

@dylans Is tweeting an ankle considered vulgar now and so bad that he had to sit out the 2nd half? Are we harkening back to the 1890's? I knew we were becoming more conservative in the national dialogue, but maybe this is taking it too far. I guess the benching could be due to using a phone in the middle of the game.

FYI, I knew that you meant tweaking (not the meth kind) an ankle, but I could not resist.

@patoh3 too much ankle for the Amish crowd

@dylans Wilt would have been a combination of a Great White Shark and a Nile Crocodile! 🦈 🐊

lol

Team America fuck yeah

What a game

Defense is optional these days.

Steph isn’t human

STEPH CURRY - - is " THE MAN "

@FarmerJayhawk said in Dream Team 2024 vs 1992:

Steph isn’t human

Still thankful he didn't just heave something up at the end of that elite eight game lol