🏀 KuBuckets Archive

This feels like a new problem to solve in college sports. There's another space to argue the merits of NIL, paying players, or player movement. It's one thing to recruit talented players (from HS or the portal). It's another to 'stay old' and have good culture guys who can also play and develop. The reality of trying to find the right mix on a team each year seems like what KU's coaching staff hasn't figured out...especially this season.

While I obviously don't know what happens behind closed doors, all of us can see that guys like Storr and Dickinson aren't 'KU guys'. Effort issues. Little to no defensive intensity. Body language is garbage. There's a reason we loved guys like Travis Releford, Thomas Robinson, Devonte Graham...they fought. They played hard. That used to be the KU culture and it seems lost.

Like our board friend @wissox I also follow Wisconsin (grew up there...KU alum). What has been really interesting about their team this year is that the perception after last season was that they would take a significant down turn. Storr (leading scorer) leaving for KU. Their 3-yr starting PG (Hepburn) left for Louisville. Also lost a 3-yr starter at the 4. Instead, there's been a mix of development amongst returners and the RIGHT GUYS who fit the culture that they got in the portal and the results have been far better than anyone has expected. Maybe they stumbled into it luckily or maybe not. Regardless, it seems like maintaining the culture of a program and finding talent that fits that culture has really helped there.

All of that to say...as long as KU pays mercenaries who come and play for the highest bidder, I find it hard to imagine that they'll get back to having the culture like the KU teams that we all loved. I also wonder whether having a solid culture and recruiting for fit might be as important as anything in our current climate of college sports.

Been interesting to compare the two. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say Gard has adjusted his philosophy a lot more (?) than Self. UW is one of the top scoring teams in the country now, scored 58 in the 2nd half yesterday in W. Lafayette. Many had the same complaint about Gard as a lot of you guys do with Self, that he's stubborn, won't change. Gard will get COY votes this year because of it. He's could match Self for conference championships in the last 5 years too if they keep winning with 3 since 2020.

Well said it's like Christan tweeted out " PLAY for the name that's on the front of your Jersey- -not what it says on the back. - Now there was Anothe Dog that was a stud at Ku played with heart , guts, and didn't back down for anything or anyone. Look at Jalen Wilson- when things got bd we needee that bucket he was there , didn't always work out but the most time it did instead of didn't.

A lot of these guys now--- -they don't give a rats ass about the school, they are going to the highest bidder.- IF I'm paying boy you better do something- Dickinson is such a bad. fit-- - I'll say this yet again - - -Where the hell is THE DOG on this team ?-- -Where is the leader ?- -Someone who is going to take charge and refuse to lose? - -ANYONE ?

@focojayhawk 100% well said and I think you are right

I’ve dogged on Self and truly do think it’s his problem as he brought all these turds in but those guys still had chances to adjust their attitude and they haven’t

Think we might still have to build the core of our team through the HS ranks. It’s hard to teach or instill culture to guys who might be mercenaries

I think Bill has come to the same conclusion, bringing in Hunter felt unnatural when we did it and i wouldnt be surprised if he considers a lot of the portal usage we did these past few years as his hand being forced.

If Bill is going to stick around I anticipate that he tries to go back to building out of HS with just a few portal pieces. The key is that the HS kids need to have a very high ceiling.

@approxinfinity

What would be the plan if he decided to build through the HS ranks in terms of his future here. Next year he has a sure fire OAD and Tiller. Calderon is rumored that he might not make it to campus. You have just Elmarko, Passmore, Flory to build around from the current roster of HS kids. You can add Jamari and Zach if you want but they dont seem like players you build your next phase with. It doesn't seem like there is an emphasis on adding a bunch of HS kids for this cycle but perhaps when the spring rolls around some guys become targets. Everything is so NIL based today recruiting players isn't the same as it was even a few years ago. I do agree that building through HS prospects is probably the way to ensure you can build and sustain the culture within.

Self has clearly gone with staying old through the portal the last few years and it really hasn't worked out that well. Personally I think it's just getting the right fits. Hunter besides being 7'2 is not the kind of big Self builds his program around. Storr is another example of poor fit and those two make the most money on the team. That's where a GM or someone who can effectively manage the NIL portion while also understanding you get the right fit to play under the coach. I wonder who is handling portal scouting and who's doing the leg work to vet these players.

Is it still tampering to talk to a player on another team that isn't seeking to transfer? Would having a GM give Bill a layer of deniability to do so? Are the right fit guys those guys in other programs who would be culture guys here but are trying to make it work for their other team?

@approxinfinity

Tampering is happening every day and there's no penalties currently.

Alright. Well if its not tampering we absolutely need to have a GM to be looking at every single player in America and try to recruit the right ones here.

If we are picking our transfer guys from those who declare their intent to transfer and are fishing for the highest bidder while our competition is actively recruiting players that are culturally savvy and having success in other programs… no wonder we are a dumpster fire and getting left in the dust!

@approxinfinity

That's what's happening in College Football currently. No player is safe.

I think its slower to hit Basketball but they should get ahead of it especially with the house settlement for NIL coming at some point. Transfer Scouting certain looks like a weakness currently.

We have played our way into the vast middle of the NCAA basketball road. I think we have a very good roster that collectively does not play that way. The thing that I see is the seemingly bewildered looking plays we make on offense. We play good enough defense once we get behind but can't take advantage of it.

@focojayhawk I think you could change your title from "Mercenaries" to "Quitters" and it would fit better.

These transfers are guys who literally quit their teams--they aren't coming to KU to play with pride and leave it all out there on the court. Maybe Mayo, who moved up from a 2nd tier division.

I realize we've had a few key transfers in the past, and clearly you can stick one in the starting lineup and maybe have a key guy off the bench. That's been a pretty good strategy. Beyond that, you water down the culture and tradition of physical--and mental--toughness.

I think that's why KJ is out there so much. He actually cares. He's also the only tie left to the chain of tough big men... Morris brothers, Embiid, T-Rob, Doke, Big Dave and even Mitch Lightfoot. None of those guys would be putting up with half assed effort.

@DanR sure. But Flory seems to give more of a rats ass than Hunter and close to? As much as KJ. Always with the Flory! I know I am a broken record.

@approxinfinity Hey now, stop being such a Flory advocate!:face_with_raised_eyebrow:

Don't really put that much on the transfers tbh. They've largely been bad but they don't play a ton either. I lay most of the blame at the feet of the "Big 3" of the roster and Bill. These guys were expected to be leaders and standard bearers for the university and they've been a joke.

ole! ↗

@approxinfinity

Don't stop with Flory.

Self doesn't disciple poor play from Hunt and that's 2 years running now. Infuriating. Flory is far from perfect, we all see his weaknesses. I definitely have fatigue at this point from this situation and will refrain from saying much else at this point.

For coaches with at least 100 games, Bill Self leads all BIG coaches in winning percentage, Bo Ryan is 2nd. As Mel Allen used to say, "How about that".

@wissox Mel Allens been robbed, bro.

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