🏀 KuBuckets Archive

Not sure if I'm doing this right as this is the first time posting a new topic (as opposed to simply responding), but here goes. Link to story on whether Joel will play Saturday:

http://www2.kusports.com/news/2014/feb/13/self-decision-joel-embiids-availability-coming-fri/ ↗ ↗

To me, it's a head scratcher why Self just wouldn't err on the side of caution and sit him for the TCU game. The only thing I can think of is he talks himself into it because hey, TCU beat us last year with a veteran team (albeit on the road, not in AFH), and Self is of the extremely macho school of thinking that if you can play through injuries, you play, rather than recover.

Tried to get the scoop on Jamari from my brother living in Lawrence (20 years old, semi "in the know" ), but really it's just rumors that I won't post for mass visibility here. If true though, it's nothing too serious and I would think he would be available soon.

Sorry if the link to this article has been posted elsewhere, or if I didn't do it right. Still getting used to things here!

@icthawkfan316 maybe Embiid just needed proof he was ok? I don't think Self will risk his health.

@icthawkfan316 I've added the article on the News Headlines thread. Thanks!

@Crimsonorblue22 I'm not saying that he necessarily "risks" his players' health. Certainly I think if there was a chance Joel could make it worse we'd be hearing something different. But let's face it - Bill is a tough guy. And we have countless examples throughout the years of guys playing through injuries. He expects it, and if you play he expects you to perform. He's also a "win every game at all costs" guy. It's why we don't see him develop his bench as much as perhaps some of the posters would like. He'd rather win every game, from the non-conference straight through the conference season, rather than play young players early and risk a loss here and there for the sake of player development. I think this is why we also see him not sitting down his players to get them closer to 100%. There's a difference between there being no risk of further injury and needing time to recover. I think at times he has a difficulty seeing the big picture, which is due to him being a fierce competitor. It's part of what makes him great at what he does, but I just think this is one of the drawbacks.

@icthawkfan316 I agree w/you!

In earlier posts about Joel, people have said the next 2 games might be good for him to miss (if that is needed).
I think some of us might be taking Tech way too lightly. Look at their conference results. They have not been beaten badly. I think their biggest loss has been about 11 to ISU in the first game. I recall ISU pulled away late. They've played everyone tough and won some big games.
True....they might on paper be the 2nd worst team in the conference (ignoring the standings), but I think this will be a tough game.
I agree that if Joel is hurting we would all want to take the long view and get him healthy....miss the Tech game by all means if that is what is best for his health and performance in the tournament.
I don't think victory is as "certain" as some have inferred.

@Hawk8086

Right on!

I'm hopeful Embiid will rest at least one more game. I'm hopeful that Self has just created the concept of him being 50/50 in order to make it difficult for TCU and Tech to prep to play us.

Coaching during league play is like a good game of poker... coaches like to play their hands close to the chest and there are plenty of bluffs used to keep other players guessing.

This sounds like one of those poker games. Self is sending out bluff signals (I hope).

Plus... it is a good thing to keep Embiid from the lineup now. We need to continue to strengthen our defense and by removing Embiid from the lineup the rest of the team can't use him as a crutch any longer. His teammates need to toughen up and face the challenge without him. This is to our benefit later on... when Embiid is back!

@Hawk8086

As I mentioned in another post, the conference teams have done dramatic switch from the start of conference play. The teams I wanted to play the least were OSU, ISU and Baylor and now, they are the teams (along with TCU) I would want to play the most. On the other hand, the teams I was least afraid of were TCU, Texas Tech. and West Virginia; with the exception of TCU, the other two teams along with Texas are the ones I would not want to play now.

TCU will not be a problem, KU beat them by 20+ points at their place and it should win easily at AFH.

Texas Tech. is playing well with consecutive wins over OU (in Norman) and OSU and we have two games left with them; two tough games for sure. West Virginia destroyed ISU at home and played KU fairly close the majority of the game at AFH; it will be a tough game in Morgantown.

The Texas game will be interesting. I am sure the KU staff is going over the KSU-Texas game video to figure out how KSU was able to jump all over Texas and likely use a similar approach.

On different but related note, is there any coach in Division I worse that Scott Drew? Next to KU, Baylor has the most talent in the league and yet there they sit next to last with a 3-8 record.

This is where the conflict exists between a player's best interests and a coach's best interests.

For Joel Embiid, given his size, his potential and the situation, it is unquestionably in his best interests to sit until his knee and back are absolutely healthy.

For Bill Self, given Embiid's unique ability, it is undoubtedly in his best interests to have Embiid in the lineup as long as Embiid can contribute at an 80% level.

So what to do? Does Self ignore his own best interests and sit Embiid for the next week or two, possibly jeopardizing the quest for conference title 10, or does he play him and risk a more substantial injury if Joel is trying to compensate?

Does Embiid ignore his own best interests and "gut it out", putting himself at risk as a big man to injure his knees or back? It is well known that big guys are at a unique risk when it comes to back and leg injuries because of their size. Does Embiid ignore that? Should he? Or does he say he can't go and risk being labeled "soft?'"

Honestly, I don't know what the best course of action is here. It would be easier on Embiid if Self ruled him out of the lineup, but its unlikely that happens unless the injury is more substantial than we are being told.

I must say, by resting Embiid, Coach Self restored my faith that he will do what's the best for his players. Playing hurt for the college may win the coaches, the school and fans games, but it may also shorten the players' playing career in the long run. It's not for the best interest of the players. When a coach says he has the players' best interest, but still plays the players hurt, it simply shows the coach has no integrity. The coach is ultimately responsible for his players just like a parent is for his/her children. I'd never put my son in harms way and I expect the coach the same.