🏀 KuBuckets Archive

There have been considerable discussion here on Mitch lately. I'd like to bring another topic for discussion - Mitch's playing time and red shirt option heading into 2018.

Before starting the discussion, looking at depth and quality of guards available for next year, it is safe to assume that Self will rely mostly on a 4 guard line up.

With this in mind, first, let's assume either Dok or Billy are back next year. In this case we will have one of them plus Cedric, Silvio, McCormack and Lightfoot, Bigs playing with 4 guards most of the time. Self may use a lot of 3-2 line up here but I think Mitch will be our 4th Big option after Dok/Preston, Cedric and Silvio - limited playing time.

Now assuming both Dok/Billy are gone, Mitch would be our 3rd big option and minutes will increase somewhat but still limited unless foul trouble dictates otherwise.

In either case, barring any unforeseen circumstance, I do not see a significant role for Mitch next year. Thus I am wondering if Mitch should red shirt next year.

Will Mitch consider this option? Would an additional year in the system and extra work in the gym with Hudy make him a valuable contributor with increased playing time in his 3rd and 4th year. How do others feel?

Don't forget KJ who's really not a SF but could be a small ball 4. Regardless I think he's going to play so that's another guy that needs to be accounted for.

I hope Doke is back. Doke makes that frontcourt a real nightmare for the rest of the country, something we haven't had in a long time. Doke also limits the impact either Lawson or De Sousa/McCormack will have. Seems too crowded.

I think us as fans are more fixated on Lightfoot possibly redshirting then what is really going to happen. Next year he should have opportunity to focus his development on being a 4 which should make a huge difference. His outside shot has improved and could be something that separates himself from the other big's. Maybe Mitch will be in for a big jump from Soph to Jr year.

@BeddieKU23 I concur that front court could be too crowded and while we haven't seen some of the players, going strictly by ranking and highlights, Mitch would find it difficult to have decent amount of PT.

I think another way of looking a this is: Do you want Mitch tying up a scholarship for 5 years?

Man I'd be pissed if I was lightfoot and hearing I might be redshirted. As has been discussed he has been asked to play the five as an under sized and has blocked shots, took charges, scored a few, made some fts and generally been very valuable to This team. Is he going to be an all time great here? I doubt it but he's invaluable to this team and will be relied on for his experience and steady hand next year. I'd be shocked if he took a shirt. Now, if he wants another year on campus to further his education more power to him because I also think we'll be alright without him too.

@wissox Shooting 56 % - -from the field - - -shooting 86 % from the line - - -shooting 50 % - -from the 3 pt line - -& lading the team in blocks with 20 - - -all while playing out of position - - just sayin - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Changed profile name lol, decided seein as how I get people's feathers ruffled seems to be very easily -that proverbial burr I decided to change the name as people want to try and use as a whippin post lol - -ok - -go for it. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

I wouldn't assume Lightfoot red shirts next year. These sorts of issues tend to sort themselves out. You never know what can happen with injuries, eligibility, productivity, etc. It will all sort itself out.

Lightfoot has a whole summer, plus whatever is left in this season, to take a step forward. He should be playing more in position, so that always helps. I don't see him as a starter, but he could be a very helpful, experienced reserve.

@AsadZ

I think any decision that would involve Mitch redshirting is probably centered around what doke does at seasons end. If he leaves Mitch will be needed. Self will look to him to lead what will be a team lacking experience. I can't see Mitch being shut down for a year in that situation. I would love to see what a redshirt year would do for Mitch but I think that won't happen and we will probably be very happy to see his development going into next year. Always a chance he could be the next Luke Maye?

@AsadZ Transfer candidate? I know he loves KU but if he is never gonna play the 3, PT may win out over Crimson and Blue love.

Good discussion, along with @jaybate-1-0's reference to attrition.

If Mitch redshirts, he pretty much eliminates the transfer option later, unless he graduates. So it's a big career decision.

What I keep coming back to is that anyone with any intelligence and perspective (relying on his parents) would have foreseen this exact situation at Kansas. Maybe not at New Mexico St. So I say he stays here and is a four or five year player, depending upon whether he redshirts. This assumes his parents have one collective brain that functions.

If I'm Mitch's parents, and we knew this coming in (meaning, we aren't surprised by the possible logjam), I would 100% encourage a redshirt. You get 5 years of free education, and you increase your chances of playing professionally somewhere.

As to @dylans' point, yes, I would. I think you can hold a scholarship like this for a program player. Maybe two. In fact, I think it's very beneficial. But it does burn a scholarship if there is not production, and how do you cast aside a program player after a redshirt?

But @justanotherfan is probably right. We're looking at this in the moment of today. Things work out. Players coming in that aren't as good as expected. Broken ankles. Sick grandmas. Bongs. Nudges out the door.

Assuming no Doke and no Preston (hologram or not), we still have DeSousa, McCormack, and Lawson down low. An experienced guy in that mix seems like something Self would want.

It would not surprise me if Mitch is the #3 big next season, and it would not surprise me if he redshirts. It will surprise me if he's a starter, or if he transfers (assuming his parents were wise enough anticipate this). If Doke stays as @BeddieKU23 mentions, or if Preston materializes and stays, Mitch just won't be in the mix next season.

@HighEliteMajor You have covered most of the bases, the vital points to this future decision. Right now, at this very moment, it would appear that Udoka would benefit his game and bankroll in a huge way by returning for a 3rd season. A silent but significant factor in this discussion: will Dedric walk the straight and narrow, then play to his super capability? Preston? Who knows. I have kinda written him off and away already; but, obviously, there is yet a tiger in that tank. The new tall and h.s. talented recruit (shucks, I haven't even nailed down his name yet) will be green, but will post some shining moments...combined with the flipside. So, back to Mitch. I should think that he and his parents would cherish the opportunity to his spending 5 years in the program. From my distance, I can't see a downside. Mitch is content in Lawrence, and appears bent on doing whatever he can to contribute. If I were he I would snap up that once in a lifetime opportunity in a heartbeat! Self already is bracing up his brood of guards for playing more New Bill Self Style Basketball next season. This might be the best chance for the offering of that red shirt.

@HighEliteMajor exactly what I was thinking on the matter. KU is going to recruit the best players in the country, everyone with a brain knows they will get recruited over to an extent. As for the redshirt year it worked out quite well for some local guys named Releford and Morningstar.

@kjayhawks ...and C. Teahan.

@kjayhawks Not to mention how well it works for transfers who come to Lawrence and practice for a year with the team, essentially but not technically wearing a red shirt.

BeddieKU23 said:

Don't forget KJ who's really not a SF but could be a small ball 4. Regardless I think he's going to play so that's another guy that needs to be accounted for.

I hope Doke is back. Doke makes that frontcourt a real nightmare for the rest of the country, something we haven't had in a long time. Doke also limits the impact either Lawson or De Sousa/McCormack will have. Seems too crowded.

I think us as fans are more fixated on Lightfoot possibly redshirting then what is really going to happen. Next year he should have opportunity to focus his development on being a 4 which should make a huge difference. His outside shot has improved and could be something that separates himself from the other big's. Maybe Mitch will be in for a big jump from Soph to Jr year.

If Doke is back, get ready for big ball most of the time. Also Dedric is going to play a lot. My guess is McCormack will be the mop up guy. He plans to be a 4 year player and graduate plus he could use the developmental year anyway. The path likely immediately opens up for him to be the starting center the year after with Doke and Dedric going pro.

KJ is definitely going to get some run. Admittedly I was wrong on him with my initial assessment. It seems like Self is high on him as well. At 6'7''-8'' and 210 pounds he should be fine at the 4.

But yeah however this shakes out there are going to be players unhappy with their playing time. A good problem to have again...

HighEliteMajor said:

Good discussion, along with @jaybate-1-0's reference to attrition.

If Mitch redshirts, he pretty much eliminates the transfer option later, unless he graduates. So it's a big career decision.

What I keep coming back to is that anyone with any intelligence and perspective (relying on his parents) would have foreseen this exact situation at Kansas. Maybe not at New Mexico St. So I say he stays here and is a four or five year player, depending upon whether he redshirts. This assumes his parents have one collective brain that functions.

If I'm Mitch's parents, and we knew this coming in (meaning, we aren't surprised by the possible logjam), I would 100% encourage a redshirt. You get 5 years of free education, and you increase your chances of playing professionally somewhere.

As to @dylans' point, yes, I would. I think you can hold a scholarship like this for a program player. Maybe two. In fact, I think it's very beneficial. But it does burn a scholarship if there is not production, and how do you cast aside a program player after a redshirt?

But @justanotherfan is probably right. We're looking at this in the moment of today. Things work out. Players coming in that aren't as good as expected. Broken ankles. Sick grandmas. Bongs. Nudges out the door.

Assuming no Doke and no Preston (hologram or not), we still have DeSousa, McCormack, and Lawson down low. An experienced guy in that mix seems like something Self would want.

It would not surprise me if Mitch is the #3 big next season, and it would not surprise me if he redshirts. It will surprise me if he's a starter, or if he transfers (assuming his parents were wise enough anticipate this). If Doke stays as @BeddieKU23 mentions, or if Preston materializes and stays, Mitch just won't be in the mix next season.

Great post. I have some comments.

Based on comments from a user that knows his family (don't think they are around anymore) I don't think a transfer is very likely it all. It definitely sounds like Mitch knew it was going to be a war for PT most years.

Totally agree that it's fine to have him on scholarship for 5 years. He isn't scaring off elite talent. If he scares a kid off...I don't think we wanted them anyway.

If Doke and Preston are gone I'd bet on Mitch playing more than people think. Even in that situation I think Self could get away with playing him exclusively at the 4 which would be much better for him.

I really hope Doke is back though, he would make next year extremely exciting.

@REHawk Also Lucas

kjayhawks said:

@HighEliteMajor exactly what I was thinking on the matter. KU is going to recruit the best players in the country, everyone with a brain knows they will get recruited over to an extent. As for the redshirt year it worked out quite well for some local guys named Releford and Morningstar.

This is why Mitch Ballock isn't a fightin scrappin KU Hawk.

Who is KJ?

@wissox one of the Lawson brothers

It might surprise some people to know that there are still student athletes for whom a degree comes first. Kids that are studying Engineering, like Mitch is, seem to be more concerned about finishing their degree and less so on going to the NBA. If sports are more important then you go to West Virginia and study Sports Management, it must really be a good program since 6 players on the UWV team are in that program.

Unless Mitch is planning on getting a Master’s degree, my guess is he will not red shirt, will complete his engineering degree in 4 years and move on with his career. He has already achieved his dream of playing for KU and it is my guess that he does not have NBA aspirations. Of course I could be completely wrong.

@JayHawkFanToo

He's certainly at the right place if he does have NBA dreams which I'm sure he has. I really do think he'll make a development jump at some point, could be between this year and his Jr season or Jr year to Sr year. Luke Maye of North Carolina had a few big games last season as a soph and now is their leading scorer. Not saying Mitch's situation is the same but maybe there will be a point this season Mitch has one of those games where everything clicks and he builds off that.