🏀 KuBuckets Archive

Was listening to the local sports talk off WiBw - -out here in Topeka. - -they were talking to I think his name maybe was FitzGerald can't remember I think he is the beat writer for K-State sports.

Guess he had written an article - he just kept saying he didn't want to wrote the Article - -he didn't want to write the article - but basically all about Coach Synder, - -Talking about how the program was tailing off - -how their talent had been decreasing and it was starting to catch up with them. Talking about How Coach Synder was talking about he didn't know IF he could fix it like in the past

Talking about how a lot of people were saying they didn't want to see Coach Synder leave with a tarnished reputation where the program has fallen back to close to where they were when he came back and took back over from Prince. - -A lot of People are talking like they want to see him retire NOW.

Fitzgerald thinks it's time, that the program is regressin and Coach Synder looks tired - -said there is something just not right with this team - - -talked about how players were acting on the field against Iklahoma - -said that score could of been alot worse if OU Coach hadn't backed off - -saying something just isn't right with this team

FitzGerald says it's time for Coach Synder to retire -- truly unrest in Aggieville. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

It absolutely is time for Snyder to retire. He has health issues and he has quit trusting his coaching staff. I get that he wants his son to be the coach after him, but it isn't his decision. Nor should it be. It isn't a family business.

Kcmatt7 said:

It absolutely is time for Snyder to retire. He has health issues and he has quit trusting his coaching staff. I get that he wants his son to be the coach after him, but it isn't his decision. Nor should it be. It isn't a family business.

Ya they were talking about how stubborn Coach Synder was, thye said possibility of even losing to KU - - nobody wants to lose to KU they said lol

I agree its time for Snyder to move on forsure, but I wouldn't count them out for a Bowl game at this point. They have TCU then KU in the next 2 Saturdays. Now if they win both they still need a win over ISU or Tech to become bowl eligible but stranger things have happened. If he doesn't make a Bowl game returning pretty much his whole offense then he should be let go. IT pretty much comes down to if the Athletic department has the spine to stand up to him because it's a hostage situation at this point.

KSU football was nothing before Snyder and it’ll be nothing after Snyder. They’d better ride these last couple years out. Even a losing it Snyder is a better coach than KU has had, maybe ever. That really hurts to type. KU football is a joke.

@kjayhawks I guess from what I heard was there is a lot of unrest with the team -- transfers coming and such - -pretty sure , they were also mentioning this -- sounds like some friction. - possibly like your saying now is the time , even Synder said he didn't know if he had the answers for this team, pretty tired. - -FitzGerald said when he was doing the interview that there was just something different , said for sure this team was digressing.

They were talking about how the talent level of the players was on the decline and not getting better players to replace the one's they had

Snyder's stubbornness made him a very good coach, but it also kept him from ever becoming a great one.

Snyder was insistent on doing things his way. As a result, he never tried to upgrade KSU's overall talent base to include more four star prospects. That meant that even as the rest of the conference upgraded their coaching staffs, he never upgraded his talent to match theirs. Look around the Big 12 now. Where does KSU have a distinct coaching advantage? I'd argue that they don't have a significant advantage over anyone other than KU. And with KSU's talent deficit, that makes winning in conference pretty tough.

Add to that the fact that college football has changed over the last 30 years.

When Snyder started at KSU, you could schedule four non conference games and play your other seven conference games. If you scheduled four easy wins, you could go 2-5 or 3-4 in conference and still advance to a bowl. Then it was 12 games, but the same four non conference, with eight conference games. You could go 6-6 and make a bowl. Snyder took full advantage of this. Excluding his first year when the team went 1-10, Snyder's teams lost seven regular season non-conference games between 1990 and 2005. That's 16 years. Snyder basically scheduled himself four guaranteed wins just about every season.

Snyder still doesn't lose many non conference regular season games now (seven more over the last 10 years), but he only gets three non conference games now instead of four. On top of that, he's no longer coaching in college football's desert, having weak programs at KU, MU and Iowa State to regularly pick up wins against. When Snyder started, he had seven wins on his schedule before he played a single game (maybe eight when Oklahoma State was down). Now, he has three or four. He has to scuffle to get bowl eligible. And in three of the last four years (including this one) KSU has had to scramble down the stretch to get enough wins to get bowl eligible.

Snyder can't schedule his way to a bowl (Big 12 put pressure on K-State to schedule stronger non conference opponents or be shut out of the early season TV schedule), so he has to have a P5 team on the slate. He can't pick on anyone in conference (other than KU right now). There's no clear path back to success for KSU because Snyder's blueprint depended on scheduling weaker opponents in non-conference and honing his execution against teams that couldn't blow him off the field with talent. Without that, Snyder is stuck.

This was always how it was going to end for KSU. Snyder elevated their win total without ever elevating the program. It was a mirage of success built mostly on the struggles of other programs around him. It's time to pay the piper.

@dylans I agree, he is the only one that has had any sustained success there. However I'm not a guy that believes he's near as good as their fan base thinks. He has a losing postseason record, .33 win percentage against ranked foes, .12 win percentage vs top 10 ranked foes, has only beaten a ranked team twice when he himself was not ranked and has a losing road record. Snyder is good at getting under talent teams to play mistake free and at a higher level than they should. He is best at beating weak teams at home and they are known to schedule 7-8 home games each season. He hasn't been great since his return outside of 2012 with a class that Prince recruited by the way. The old days when he drew the easy south schedules were his best days.

@justanotherfan Snyder did make an effort in the late 90's and early 2000's to go after a lot more 4 and 5 star players. Those players largely had no interest in coming to KSU and led to their slide after 2003 and Snyder's first retirement.

@justanotherfan True. Now that stubbornness that you talk about is one of the problems that they are having now. - -Him and his stubbornness in not wanting to step don now -- him being stubborn about wanting his son take his place as the next Coach. - As you say has hasn't been able to keep up. --

Iowa state is not a team that he can take for granted any more- -I'm really impressed with the Coach Iowa State now has - -that's no longer an automatic win like they used to be for Synder . They was mentioning yesterday on the cast - saying that they truly believe they miss out on that possible National Championship a few years back when they had that pretty - -really good team how long ago was that? - -3-4 years ago? they said.

You have to respect the Guy for what he did with that K-State program - -and I do , but he has to turn loose and realize it's time to retire and enjoy the rest of his life - - let someone else take the reins - don't water down what he has - -I hate K-State - -but yet I have to give Coach props - And I do - - but time to call it quit's - -don't ruin what you have accomplished Coach - - -ROCKCHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Kcmatt7 said:

It absolutely is time for Snyder to retire. He has health issues and he has quit trusting his coaching staff. I get that he wants his son to be the coach after him, but it isn't his decision. Nor should it be. It isn't a family business.

Well...the stadium is named after his family, the owns the rights to the Powercat logo, his kid is an assistant coach, has had a say on gets hired and fired and he has as much power within the AD as Coach Self has at KU. After all these years he probably believes it is a family business but in the process he is losing all the good will accumulated and risking tarnishing his reputation. He needs to move on and let his kid stand on his own.

I agree largely that the game has passed Snyder by, especially in getting talent. As of last year (and pretty sure it hasn’t changed) he never went on the road to recruit and his staff didn’t go on the road during the season. Can’t compete for Big 12 talent like that.

More trouble in the little apple, more and more people are calling for Snyder’s removal as head coach. Rumors of Seth Littrell are floating around KSU boards like crazy. I guess several fans and players are upset that Snyder basically blamed the loss on a blotched FG attempt, the holder fumbled the snap on a chip shot and panicked. Instead trying to put it down or run, he threw up in the air and TCU picks it off giving the ball at 20 instead of inside the 10. Then the same player on a missed extra point had the laces pointed in and cause the misfire to tie the game late. I agree that those plays made a difference (didn’t watch) but in a one point loss you could probably point at 20 or plays that weren’t made, kinda like our Nichols loss. So many opportunities that we just missed, anyhow it’s fun seeing Snyder get some heat.

They also pulled a Beaty and punted from the TCU 34 yard line for a touchback lol

Snyder is out. Matter of when. Could be tomorrow.

@FarmerJayhawk fired or stepping down?

@Woodrow really the former but officially the latter.

Not surprised at all if this it for Snyder. I said way earlier in the year when they began to struggle that this was looking like he was done. I think the extension was done for recruiting. Most people / fans thought this was a 9-10 win team. They have grossly underachieved and honestly looked poorly coached in some games.

Will be very interesting to see who they get next. If Long can make a great hire KU has a chance to significantly close the gap on these two programs.

Talked to a guy who was on the sideline 20ft from Snyder an entire game. He said Bill didn’t say a word the entire game to any player or coach in person. It was weird. He just stood there with an assistant following 5ft behind him carrying stuff for him.

The old guys lost touch it seems.

@Woodrow

The extension was likely a prearranged parting gift. He made $3.45M this season and it goes up by $300K the next two seasons and has 2 more seasons after that, so he will leave with a $15M buyout. The KSU Athletic Department will take a heavy hit.

@JayHawkFanToo I think it may just be $3M to buy him out. At least from what I'm reading.

@Kcmatt7

His contract was renewed this last August and was for 5 years. Most contract indicate that if fired for cause there is no payout but otherwise the reminder of the contract is owed. Now, if he wants to go somewhere he can buy out the reminder of his contract for a year’s pay, typically. If he is “retiring” voluntarily then the payout might be considerably smaller. It will be interesting to see how his departure is officially alleged since it might have heavy monetary implications. If the buyout is only $3M then I just can’t imagine KSU not doing it

@JayHawkFanToo I skimmed through the contract and that's how I read it at least. It was a "Termination Clause" and they could terminate the contract without cause for a $3M buyout paid quarterly over the next few years.

If that I am interpreting it correctly, I think the writing is on the walls.

@Kcmatt7

I agree. If $3M is all it will cost them then it is very doable.

https://www.kansas.com/sports/college/big-12/kansas-state/article221278545.html ↗

@BShark I wouldn’t normally say this is a big deal, Graham had the same thing happen his junior here but man 3 guys this season? That’s crazy maybe Snyder should try a different method of punishment.

kjayhawks said:

@BShark I wouldn’t normally say this is a big deal, Graham had the same thing happen his junior here but man 3 guys this season? That’s crazy maybe Snyder should try a different method of punishment.

The offenses aren't particularly serious (all parking/traffic related), but the fact that several players all failed to appear or take care of these tickets reveals an underlying problem within the program - lack of oversight.

It's a little thing, but could point to some bigger issues under the surface.

@justanotherfan

I agree. Interesting that the police is arresting football players for parking tickets, they must not be very busy and feel the need to stop this crime wave created by football players. Their stipend must be very low that they cannot afford a parking ticket.

@kjayhawks @justanotherfan The unregistered vehicle would be interesting. I was told KSU did it "the right way" :thinking:

BShark said:

@kjayhawks @justanotherfan The unregistered vehicle would be interesting. I was told KSU did it "the right way" :thinking:

"Unregistered" could simply mean that the tags were out of date. It doesn't necessarily mean that the vehicle was given improperly. Of course, everything about Billy Preston came from a one car accident.

@JayHawkFanToo Not too far off base. I had a KSU football player pull a gun on me in Manhattan (in 1999) because I pulled up behind him at a stop sign. I guess he wanted me to blow thru it past and around him? Craziness.

I’m hearing that Head Coach Bill Snyder will announce his retirement within the next 48 hours. I think that’s huge if it happens, Les maybe able to flip some guys over to Hawks.

kjayhawks said:

I’m hearing that Head Coach Bill Snyder will announce his retirement within the next 48 hours. I think that’s huge if it happens, Les maybe able to flip some guys over to Hawks.

Jim Leavitt is the guy KSU administration has wanted for awhile and Leavitt has a specific clause in his contract that he doesn't have pay his early exit buyout if he takes the KSU job.

@Texas-Hawk-10 Right, so the question becomes did Synder retire on his own terms? Or is he agreeing to retire because they have agreed to let Sean Synder coach? Will Synder have a role in the athletic department again and run off the next coach as he did Prince (I don’t believe Prince was great but he won more games in each of his 3 seasons than Synder did in the previous 2 seasons and recruited several starters on the 2012 B12 title team)? Either way I think it could be huge for Les trying to flip guys, Leavitt is a good coach but doesn’t have the resume or flash of Miles.

It kinda strange how close KSUs and KUs seasons are both teams had a defense good enough to win outside of a few games. KU isn’t far from having 7 wins and KSU isn’t far from having 9 wins. I’m sure blowing a 17 point lead in the final 12 minutes in Ames will leave a bad taste in the mouths of fans and booster of KSU. All while was Snyder failed to see how obvious it was that Thompson was a better option at QB, that itself probably cost them a few games.

Bill Snyder is being forced out and it will be likely be Jim Leavitt being announced in the next week or two.

TV stations in KC were saying last evening that it was likely Snyder’s last game as HC at KSU..

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Bill Snyder is being forced out and it will be likely be Jim Leavitt being announced in the next week or two.

I’ve heard Hocutt at Tech May try to land Leavitt himself.

FarmerJayhawk said:

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Bill Snyder is being forced out and it will be likely be Jim Leavitt being announced in the next week or two.

I’ve heard Hocutt at Tech May try to land Leavitt himself.

I think Vrenables is the guy to watch a Tech.

Woodrow said:

FarmerJayhawk said:

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Bill Snyder is being forced out and it will be likely be Jim Leavitt being announced in the next week or two.

I’ve heard Hocutt at Tech May try to land Leavitt himself.

I think Vrenables is the guy to watch a Tech.

Seth Littrell is Tech's if they want him. That's the P5 job Littrell wants.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Woodrow said:

FarmerJayhawk said:

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Bill Snyder is being forced out and it will be likely be Jim Leavitt being announced in the next week or two.

I’ve heard Hocutt at Tech May try to land Leavitt himself.

I think Vrenables is the guy to watch a Tech.

Seth Littrell is Tech's if they want him. That's the P5 job Littrell wants.

That would be the smart move. Not sure if Hocutt will go that route. Is he different enough than Kliff?

🐦 View Tweet?s=21

This guy has some interesting stuff on his timeline about Tech candidates

So Kliff is out at TT and sounds like Synder is out at KSU. I've read some interesting things on both blogs today. Both schools seem to think Ventables is headed their way. TT athletics Director is a former roommate of Ventables at KSU. I've also heard that Ventables would never return to KSU because he hooked up with a high profile boosters daughter while he was there and it didn't end well. I'd be shocked if KSU spends the money on his buy out and the contract it would take to sign him (second highest paid assistant in CFB). I'd say Litrell to TT and Leavitt to KSU seems possible if Riley doesn't go to the NFL. But we how much of a hard ass Synder is, it wouldnt shock me if Sean is announced as HC either.

I'm not sure that Littrell would want the Tech job. I honestly believe he could do better. When the cowboys were struggling rumors were flying about Riley heading to Dallas and Littrell heading to Norman. I'd still fire Garrett if I was Dallas, it's taken the NFC easy falling apart and injuries to make them relevant again. The cowboys also have a very easy schedule compared to most.

The only reason Seth Littrell wouldn't take the Texas Tech job, where he spent 4 years under Leach, is because he would prefer the North Carolina job, where he spent 2 years as the associate head coach. Littrell is going to have his pick of Lubbock or Chapel Hill. I just don't see Venables taking the Tech job even though that's who their admins want. The one thing in Tech's favor though for Venables is their AD's relationship with Venables going back to their KSU days.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

The only reason Seth Littrell wouldn't take the Texas Tech job, where he spent 4 years under Leach, is because he would prefer the North Carolina job, where he spent 2 years as the associate head coach. Littrell is going to have his pick of Lubbock or Chapel Hill. I just don't see Venables taking the Tech job even though that's who their admins want. The one thing in Tech's favor though for Venables is their AD's relationship with Venables going back to their KSU days.

Couldn't agree more. Though it looks more and more likely that Mack Brown of all people is going to UNC. I don't quite get it but I guess if that's what Bubba wants, fine. Rumor is he has to have someone with P5 HC experience, and there aren't that many guys out there fitting that description. Leavitt may be more likely at TTU. Going to be awkward for Hocutt bidding against his alma mater.

@FarmerJayhawk It would be funny if Brown ended up at UNC, Ventables at TT and Leavitt at Louisville. Just because that would leave KSU scrabbling lol

Mack Brown coached at UNC before Texas so I'm guessing UNC would be hoping to get a repeat of his first tenure there which was very successful.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

Mack Brown coached at UNC before Texas so I'm guessing UNC would be hoping to get a repeat of his first tenure there which was very successful.

That's certainly the idea. Also some donors who ponied up for Fedora's buyout really want Mack to return, with the intention of hiring an all-star staff with a HCIW.

There are likely to be at least eight P5 openings this season, with some potential name jobs (Southern Cal?) open. Maryland will be open. There could be a couple of ACC jobs (Louisville, UNC) open. If KSU wants to act, they better act fast because things will heat up quickly this week.

The other thing to be aware of for KSU is that since Snyder effectively forced Prince out the last time around, and wields so much influence in that athletic department, some of the coaching candidates may not want to take that job if Snyder (or his son) is going to be around the program. Add to that the fact that the Texas Tech job is the better job in the Big 12 (particularly since KU just hired Les Miles), and K-State may be heading for some tough sledding.

@justanotherfan USC isn't going to be available this year and Louisville and UNC are both open although UNC is likely hiring Mack Brown again tomorrow.

Seems to be some conflicting report out of kittyville. - - Several people saying that it's done that some guy named Kileman from NDSU will be the next Coach - -well Tim Fitzgerald from Power Cat is saying that with the people who he is talking it's Littrell -he was then asked if KSU will have a Coach by next week. -- He said ya he feels really confident they will have Seth by then - -we shall see. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

This is pretty petty ↗ any way you look at it. No wonder why so many players left; the Snyders really did think they owned the program

JayHawkFanToo said:

This is pretty petty ↗ any way you look at it. No wonder why so many players left; the Snyders really did think they owned the program

I've heard rumors of similar things from inside that program for years. If Snyder does not (or did not) like you while you were within the program, labelled you a troublemaker or whatever, he would withhold your ring or delay your transfer request - petty stuff.

As the article indicates, its the type of stuff that is tough for the player to make noise about in the moment - it looks bad to transfer while tangled up in a dispute with your former school/coach.

Snyder and his family think they own Manhattan (to some extent, they do). I think Snyder's large shadow is going to affect their coaching search more than they realize.

@justanotherfan

I agree. Any coach considering the position should have it as part of the contract that there will be no interference or influence from Snyder. I understand that it is difficult to cut all ties with a coach that did so much for the program but keeping him as an “ambassador” and maintaining ties with the program could end up being a bad decision moving forward.

@JayHawkFanToo I’ve questioned it myself on several occasions. Starting in 02 when they were beating KU by 60 and put back in there starters on Defense as soon as KU crossed mid field late in the fourth (they had already lost 3 games and weren’t trying to get BCS votes ether). I’ve never hoped for a player on any team to get hurt but I would’ve laughed if one of their starters got hurt then. Seemed pretty classless to me and I believe it was last year one transferring player went public about he was like a slave owner and was blocking him from transferring. I have a friend of a friends son that grew up a KSU fan and transferred up from Juco a couple of years back. He said Snyder played favorites like crazy, was a complete a**hole and transfered to Tabor for his senior year. He and his family are no longer KSU fans lol. The way he was holding the university hostage I questioned if he would actually retire. One thing to consider when hiring a new coach is that Synder is still in the athletic department and will probably interfere with the next guy if he doesn’t see the things that are going on as good (Ron Prince who went 7-6, 5–7, 5-7 and recruited several starters including Klein on the 2012 B12 title team after Snyder went 4-8 and 5-7 in final 2 seasons).

@kjayhawks

Behind the friendly, grandfatherly facade lies a ruthless individual that controlled and ruled the program with an iron fist and stayed long after he should have retired because KSU would not acquiesce to his demand that his son be named to succeed him. The new coach better have an ironclad clause in his contract that Snyder will not interfere. I am sure Snyder lurking behind the scenes will keep some potential coaches away.

The current hold up in signing a new coach is that Snyder wants, at a minimum, that his son be kept on staff, if not named the new coach. Most new head coaches want to bring in their own staff, so its tough to insist that the new coach retain the current special teams coach. But that's just another way for Snyder to keep the new coach under his thumb.

Sean Snyder was kept on staff by Prince (we all see how that turned out). I am sure the current candidates are keeping that in mind.

Why does it matter what Snyder wants? Dude was fired, regardless of the story the public was given.

dylans said:

Why does it matter what Snyder wants? Dude was fired, regardless of the story the public was given.

Snyder is incredibly influential at KSU. He's the most powerful man on that campus by a large margin. He has more "juice" than the president and AD combined.

Snyder has more influence at KSU than Bill Self does at KU, and its not particularly close. He basically has a say in anything he wants to have a say in. They teach a leadership class based on his 16 pillars or whatever he calls them.

I'm not sure there is a person at a D1 school with more power and influence at their university than Snyder has at KSU.

@justanotherfan but not enough to get his son hired.

justanotherfan said:

dylans said:

Why does it matter what Snyder wants? Dude was fired, regardless of the story the public was given.

Snyder is incredibly influential at KSU. He's the most powerful man on that campus by a large margin. He has more "juice" than the president and AD combined.

Snyder has more influence at KSU than Bill Self does at KU, and its not particularly close. He basically has a say in anything he wants to have a say in. They teach a leadership class based on his 16 pillars or whatever he calls them.

I'm not sure there is a person at a D1 school with more power and influence at their university than Snyder has at KSU.

Had. His act has gotten ahem old. It’s sunset time. Hope it doesn’t Paterno him, but I do hope for KSU he disappears only to return for fund raisers as requested.

dylans said:

Why does it matter what Snyder wants? Dude was fired, regardless of the story the public was given.

Because it’s in his contract that he gets input on the next coaching hire.

@FarmerJayhawk what was that official title?

@FarmerJayhawk As in he has a say, or input that can be ignored? Seems like he’s run his course in Manhattan. I’d listen to what he has to say and do whatever I wanted, were I the AD. Or is Snyder the AD too?

Oh yeah, ambassador, does that mean he chooses the next coach?

If he really gets a big say in who the next coach is and what he does, they may as well kept him around another year or 2 because that is going to run off several coaches. Coaches want to run the ship without someone over their shoulder at every turn.

dylans said:

@FarmerJayhawk As in he has a say, or input that can be ignored? Seems like he’s run his course in Manhattan. I’d listen to what he has to say and do whatever I wanted, were I the AD. Or is Snyder the AD too?

I believe the language is “give appropriate input on hiring the next coach” or something really similar. I think it’s intentionally ambiguous. If he gets his way it’ll be Leavitt. Sean isn’t interested.

@FarmerJayhawk The lack of interest is similiar in the fan base out here regarding Sean. Actually it’s more of a please, no! Leavitt perks up ears. Littrel gets a blank stare.

What has really surprised me is that in virtually every list of "possible coaches" I've seen, Leavitt is NOT on the list! I had kinda understood that he was a shoo-in to replace Snyder. I don't think he's even been "interviewed" in Manhattan by the AD like several others have been. Guess the guy from NDSU who seemed to be the front runner for a while was not offered, at least not yet. Does sound like there is a "tug of war" going on in Manhattan between someone(s). Thought they would have decided by now....but the longer they wait I think the better for us!

The scoop that I got was Littrell was offered the job but they wouldn't allow him to bring in his whole staff and couldn't agree with North Texas on the buyout. So hard to tell fact from fiction on these deals til someones name is on the dotted line and announced.

@dylans Not to nitpick, but aren't there lots of blank stares among that fanbase in general?

KSU has a new coach ↗, Chris Klieman from North Dakota State.

@JayHawkFanToo Well he's already undefeated as an assistant in Manhattan 🤣🤣

Good hire imo.

@Kcmatt7 I actually think it is a great hire for KSU. He fits what they need very well. I also don't think he will jump ship if he is successful for a few years like Littrell, Brown, Norvelle, etc.. would have. He knows how to develop talent and find under the radar guys.

I also saw a quote from the Miege coach saying he is very impressed with him and has a relationship with him from NDSU recruiting some Miege players.

This is a good hire for KSU provided he can do his job without interference from Snyder. The biggest challenge for him is going to be recruiting. The step up from FCS to P5 is probably three steps up the recruiting ladder. It will be interesting to see how he does recruiting against Texas and Oklahoma.

justanotherfan said:

“It will be interesting to see how he does recruiting against Texas and Oklahoma.”

And Les Miles for the Kansas kids!

He has an outstanding record at NDSU but it is a big jump to a P5 program and time will tell how well he does at the higher level. Obviously KSU thinks highly of him and offered a very good contract. The question is how long before he gets tired of dealing with Snyder who thinks he owns the program. I guess what happens to Sean Snyder will be telling, if he stays or gets promoted we will see Snyder's fingerprint all over; if he is let go then it will mark a new direction for the program, and an overdue end of the Snyder era.

JayHawkFanToo said:

He has an outstanding record at NDSU but it is a big jump to a P5 program and time will tell how well he does at the higher level. Obviously KSU thinks highly of him and offered a very good contract. The question is how long before he gets tired of dealing with Snyder who thinks he owns the program. I guess what happens to Sean Snyder will be telling, if he stays or gets promoted we will see Snyder's fingerprint all over; if he is let go then it will mark a new direction for the program, and an overdue end of the Snyder era.

Was just getting ready to say the same thing - -and saw you just stated what I was thinking. - -Ya he did well at North Dakota St - - and yes he had a couple of upsets against P-5 schools. However while it's nice to have that upset -HUGE difference from that and having to compete/battle against P-5 schools - -week in - - -week out. Day - -after - -day - - after - - day. - -and trying to match up with some of these jaugernauts - -is a totally whole different ball game there sparky.

He WAS NOT their # 1 pick -- as a matter of fact they had several pull out - -It was basically down to this guy and Brown from Troy right? - -the biggest hang up was Synder - -the 1st choice wanted to bring his whole staff - -KSU nixed that, ha d another one from Memphis say - - -umm - -NOPE- - I THINK Ol Bill has turned this into a cluster - we will see - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73

NDSU recent record against P5 teams is pretty damn good, much better than KU.

!0_1544560110252_upload-46777e01-1e07-4153-a632-1d47a62cb95c ↗

And yet -- -we shall see -- guess that's why we play the game --- as always ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

One thing to note, is that he inherited a well oiled machine at NDSU and has maintained it well but he hasn't had to build anything let alone at the P5 level. NDSU has had good success against FBS competition but it ain't like they have played a ton of good schools, only one ranked team on that list and several crappy programs kansas included.

@kjayhawks

NDSU has dominated its class and successfully punched well above it’s weight class against P5 competition. A solid program any way you look at it.

@JayHawkFanToo

Just to add a bit of context to the chart, Klieman was head coach at NDSU since 2014. He only oversaw the wins over Iowa State and Iowa. Still pretty good, but that record isn't entirely due to Klieman.

@justanotherfan

I was talking about the program, very solid.

JayHawkFanToo said:

@justanotherfan

I was talking about the program, very solid.

Programwise, NDSU has been better than Alabama, and for longer.

@JayHawkFanToo No one would question the greatness of the program. I'm just saying I think I'd rather have him in Manhattan than Littrell or Leavitt. Those guys built programs at the FBS level from scratch, I'm not saying KSU is in shambles but the cabinet isn't full either. I personally think the Sunflower Showdown is better in all sports when we both have respectable teams but I don't want KSU to have a ton of success.