Agree @JayDocMD Last night we really needed a PG, but Greene was not. And White has been playing well, so Greene seemed redundant and we were never in danger of losing the game. But 3 minutes was very short especially given the fact he played pretty well during that time.
Wishawk
393 posts
@konkeyDong Sounds like the games will be impacted by the referees much more than in the past. It will depend on the style and mood of the referees, and sometimes the fouls get called while not other times. I'm a soccer referee. By the soccer laws, the games are called according the spirit of the game. Some fouls are called while others are not based on the referee's interpretation of advantage to the team. So most of the fouls are ignored and the teams are generally allowed to play with minimal interference from the referee unless someone commits a blatant foul or endangers others.
Sorry for all the non-basketball related comments, but I saw similarities. And I agree the new changes are not good for basketball.
Paraphrase Matt Tait's speculation before last night's game ↗
"I have no doubt that Mason could play 35 minutes if he needed to. So why not let him run wild for 20 minutes and see if that allows KU to build a big halftime lead."
But Mason played less than 4 minutes in the first half after collecting 2 quick fouls. And when he went to the bench, KU was down by 2 points. So Frankamp didn't get any chance of redshirting. Or maybe Coach Self saw the tendencies of Mason, and considered Frankamp probably would be required to backup Mason even if Tharpe were available.
Conner played quite a bit point last night. He obviously was not a driving PG, and generally tried to avoid the on-ball pressure. I wish he'd embraced the PG role and made himself more available as an outlet and facilitator. But I think he still sees himself as a scoring threat rather than a facilitator who helps others score.
Last night we finally saw the BIG lineup we all anticipated. It was pretty exciting to see. I think Selden was an adequate emergency PG, but ULM isn't an elite team and none of our PGs were pressured as they would when facing a top team like Duke. But there is a lot of potential in that lineup and I'm sure we will see the big lineup again in the future.
I think after just one game, the issues are mostly mental. Our freshmen are thinking too much or not thinking at all. Maybe Coach's quote on Tyshawn is very applicable here, "can make plays you can’t coach, then he can make plays you wonder if he’s ever been coached." Mason might be a case of not thinking at all, and Selden and Frankamp might be thinking too much.
One last note, I think Frankamp should have redshirted had that option been available. His passes lacked zip and he can really use some Hudyizaton.
NBC Sports recap of today's game ↗
@KANSAS\" target="_blank" rel="noopener">CBS Sports recap of the game ↗
Gary Parrish: Wiggins, Randle and Parker all impressive in college debuts ↗
Thanks, @Lulufulu85
I think this one belongs to a better place. I'm moving it to Q&A.
KU Athletics article of Tommie Smith ↗
Don't know if it was posted already, but thought it's good on a game day.
@DanR Or you may substitute Adams with Frank Mason. He collected a couple of those phantom hand check fouls. Wonder how much Coach Self anticipated Mason's defensive tendencies and decided he needed Conner Frankamp as the backup, just in case Mason gets a couple quick ones and has to sit.
@approxinfinity WOW that's extreme!
Glad my wife doesn't watch sports. When KU BBall is on, I want her as far away from MY TV as possible. :)
We both are KU grads, so she understands.
@bskeet Great find!
"Self Basketball 101 is usually a multiyear course. The advanced seminar is a matter of weeks."
And when is our first game?
@JayDocMD I'm betting my bottom dollar someone in your IT dept is a secret Jayhawks fan. ;)
I believe Coach K will take full advantage of the new rules. And he is a master of managing the referees. He will have all of his player drive at the opposing players, and whine to the officials of every non-call legitimate or not. And eventually the officials will be like the old husbands and do whatever the old wives tell them. Then Coach K will again dominate the college BB this decade. Yikes. :(
Joe Dooley article at kusports.com ↗
My understanding is Coach Dooley was an east coast guy, and Coach Townsend is a west coast guy. And now Coach Howard is midwest. Who did Coach Roberts bring or is there any noise made by Coach Roberts from the east?
Does anyone know who were the primary recruiters of the current crop at KU? It's kind of interesting that Wiggins, Selden, Greene, Embiid, Tharpe, White, Mason are all from the east and Oubre is from the west.
@drgnslayr I think there is more sunshine here. That got to be enough.
Hey, Dragon! I think Canadians play with pucks, not balls. Give me Embiid any day, and bet Wiggins won't touch the ball even if he is on all fours. :o
@Kip_McSmithers Your in-laws were lucky. Hope they are "football" fans. My opinion Arsenal has the right brand of football. It's always enjoyable to watch no matter win or lose. I'd love to see a match there in person, Arsenal against Tottenham. That will be like Kansas against Missouri in the old days.
@AzHawk97 Hey, don't laugh my favorite Özil. He is going to be a star brighter than Wiggins. My Arsenal hasn't won anything for eight years, but I have faith they will give the professor something this term. :)
Up Gooners!
Looks like he is looking for some familiar faces. We don't have Jaybate, but HEM and Michael are with us. :)
"icthawkfan316 here. I don't post or even follow as much during the offseason - only so many times I can see guys list what they think the starting line-up and rotation should be - so seeing everybody's name is odd. Not that I care to put my name to it, but come on...Jaybate is Jaybate. HEM is HEM. StupidMichael is StupidMichael. This is just weird. Maybe there should be a dual moniker. For example: icthawkfan316/Kye Clark. Just to keep the familiarity. What is the underlying reason for the change anyway? Anybody know?
Anyway, not much to add just yet, other than to say it looks like maybe Coach Self's praise of Frank Mason during the offseason might be the rare occasion where it was not just "coach speak", and he really might be a steal (given his ranking). Really optimistic after watching this guy in the exhibition games. Trying to reel myself in, as they were in fact just exhibition games. We'll know more soon, but he looks like the real deal! RCJHGKU!"
@ParisHawk Jason King's story is indeed a great read.
Love Langford. He is a great guy, and so is his mom. We have had so many quality guys through the program over the years. Reading the article gave me both warmth and chills at the same time. The article should be archived somewhere on this site permanently, but don't know if it will be an issues with copyrights. Maybe ask Jason about it?
@AzHawk97 Thanks for sharing.
It's awesome the professor docked 20 points from someone using the phone in his class.
@konkeyDong I really like your analysis of Black's performance and what's allowed by a defender. Black looked tentative in the game. And it was almost comical at times when he raised his arm trying to defend the quicker opponents, he looked like saying, please don't hurt me. If it's not for the new rules, he might spread out his arms straight and firm, and make anybody think twice before trying to drive against the solid wall.
I'm feeling a lot of hurt with the Packers missing Aaron Rodgers. Hopefully Tharpe will only miss one game.
@approxinfinity Beautiful!
I'm feeling the weight of all the clicks on this site by the users. Is it just me or other also experience glitches? I had to reload this page several times in order to display properly. It will be interesting to see tonight's page hit stat on this site. It will only go up from here. :)
I'm reposting my reply to @Mr_Miyagi here, just to stay current. :)
The game was sloppy, and the Jayhawks need a lot of improvement from their defense on the perimeter. And often times several guys jumped up trying to block the shots by the FHSU's penetrating players, but ended up missing the rebounds, so FHSU scored quite few points on putbacks and long range bombs.
For the game, White still impressed and made some really nice plays, such as a spin move to the basket and scored. Ellis was very efficient and one of the best players as usual. Mason did really well penetrating and dishing out assists. And I believe both he and Tharpe had a good game with very good A/T ratio. Selden made a lot of improvement from the first game, but if I were the coach, I'd put White ahead of Selden at this point. Embiid showed a lot of improvement from last game, and I think he will start over Black by the end of the season. I don't know about Black's game. To my untrained eyes, he didn't play a good game, 3 point and 3 rebounds or something like that. It's very low production for a senior BIG man in my opinion. Manning looked better than Frankamp though Frankamp did hit 2 3 pointers. So I think a redshirt year will help him tremendously. Greene can shoot and handles the ball pretty well for a guy 6'7", so my pick for Greene to play over Frankamp.
All of the freshmen made improvement and freshmen mistakes, but all of them had good plays and show flashes of potential. Mason's behind the back save/pass to Traylor was terrific.
Landen Lucas didn't do much, and for whatever reason didn't try to score towards the end of the game.
I really love the blocks by Wiggins (3 blocks?), but thought he should have better performance on the offensive end even though he had a couple highlight dunks, a 3 pointer, and a few baskets here and there. Guess I was expecting a superman performance after all the hype. ;)
Oh @approxinfinity You could have spilled a few beans to save me a click over to the dark side. ;)
But seriously I still read kusports.com regularly, but I stay on the brighter side most of the time. :P
@brooksmd Yo da man!
Thanks! (Y)
@Mr_Miyagi The game was sloppy, and the Jayhawks need a lot of improvement from their defense on the perimeter. And often times several guys jumped up trying to block the shots by the FHSU's penetrating player, but ended up missing the rebound, so FHSU scored quite few points on putbacks and long range bombs.
For the game, White still impressed and made some really nice plays, such as a spin move to the basket and scored. Ellis was very efficient and one of the best players as usual. Mason did really well penetrating and dishing out assist. And I believe bot he and Tharpe had a good game with very good A/T ratio. Selden made a lot of improvement from the first game, but if I were the coach, I'd put White ahead of Selden at this point. Embiid showed a lot of improvement from last game, and I think he will start over Black by the end of the season. I don't know about Black's game. To my untrained eyes, he didn't play a good game, 3 point and 3 rebounds or something like that. It's very low production for a senior BIG man in my opinion. Manning looked better than Frankamp though Frankamp did hit 2 3pointers. So I think a redshirt year will help him tremendously. Greene can shoot and handles the ball pretty well for a guy 6'7", so my pick for Greene to play over Frankamp.
All of the freshmen made freshmen mistakes, but all of them had good plays. Mason's behind the back save/pass to Ellis (not sure) was terrific.
Landen Lucas didn't do much, and for whatever reason didn't try to score towards the end of the game.
I really love the blocks by Wiggins (3 blocks?), but thought he should have better performance on the offensive end even though he had a couple highlight dunks, a 3 pointer, and a few baskets here and there. Guess I was expecting a superman performance after all the hype. ;)
@JayHawkFanToo I think it's easier to open a link in a new tab or window by right clicking it than implementing as a feature of the site unless the majority of the posters prefer it as a feature. If you are using a tablet, press and hold the link a little longer than a tap, you will get a list of options and opening the linked page in a new window should be one of the options. Just a thought.
"Joining Wiggins on the AP 2013-14 Preseason All-America team are Marcus Smart (Oklahoma State), Doug McDermott (Creighton), Russ Smith (Louisville) and Mitch McGary (Michigan)."
So Mitch McGary of Michigan was no fluke last season. No wonder he dominated in that ill-fated game.
RE: KU-Fort Hays State Preview
Gary Bedore is definitely slipping, "Mason — who scored five points with one assist and three turnovers while playing 18 minutes as Tharpe’s understudy in last Tuesday’s 84-55 opening exhibition rout of Pittsburg State"
Which game was he watching?
Green Bay's "Tharpe" (Rodgers) went down and "Mason" (Wallace) had to take over. But a win is a win. Congratulations! (punch)
How do you get -2?
@brooksmd I'm surprised the students actually study with that much booz flowing around Madison. It's a party town on football Saturdays for sure.
@approxinfinity I think the downside is that it's unfair to the players who are ranked outside of top 100, committed their future to KU, but won't play meaningful minutes. All athletes want to compete regardless of their potential. Adams wanted to play so bad though in my opinion he has very slim chance of playing basketball professionally. I'm not sure if Hunter Mickelson and Landen Lucas signed up as practice players at KU. They will want to play meaningful minutes at some point, but with the current trend of recruiting, their chance of extended play is not very optimistic. So they will have to ask themselves, "to stay or not to stay."
In 2014, we may have Embiid (I see a small chance of OAD), possibly Okafor or Alexander, Ellis (junior), Mickelson (junior-RS), Traylor (junior-RS), Lucas (sophomore-RS). So Mickelson and Lucas may not play.
Many speculated Embiid might be gone after 2 years, and Ellis may be gone after junior year. So in 2015, we will have Mickelson (senior), Lucas (junior-RS), Traylor (senior-RS). But with the current success in recruiting, it's quite possible there will be a highly ranked sophomore and a highly ranked freshman. That means Lucas won't play until 2016 when he is a senior. Even that is not a guarantee.
@RockChalkinTexas Followup 2013-2014 Roster
0 PG Frank Mason (Rivals 76, 2013) Freshman, 5-11
1 SG Wayne Selden Jr (Rivals 12, 2013) Freshman, 6-5
3 SF Andrew White III (Rivals 51, 2012) Sophomore, 6-6
4 F Justin Wesley Senior-walkon, 6-9
5 G Evan Manning Sophomore-walkon, 6-3
10 PG Naadir Tharpe (Rivals 92, 2011) Junior, 5-11
11 G Tyler Self Sophomore-walkon, 6-2
14 SF Brannen Greene (Rivals 29, 2013) Freshman, 6-7
15 G Christian Garrett Junior-walkon, 6-3
20 G Niko Roberts Senior-walkon, 5-11
21 C Joel Embiid (Rivals 25, 2013) Freshman, 7-0
22 SF Andrew Wiggins (Rivals 1, 2013) Freshman, 6-8
23 PG/SG Conner Frankemp (Rivals 34, 2013) Freshman, 6-0
25 C Tarik Black (Rivals 54, 2010) Senior, 6-9
31 PF Jamari Traylor (Rivals 141, 2011) Sophomore-RS, 6-8
33 C/PF Landen Lucas (Rivals 150+, 2012) Sophomore-RS, 6-10
34 PF Perry Ellis (Rivals 24, 2012) Sophomore, 6-8
42 C/PF Hunter Mickelson (Rivals 100, 2011) Junior-RS, 6-10
@nuleafjhawk Yes, I agree with you about Coach's record, but I really hate seeing players who committed to the team, but got run off. Officially Coach Self never removed anyone's scholarship, but many left, Peters, Adams, Doyle, etc. Maybe they saw the writing on the wall? But he could have avoided this situation by holding the scholarships to the next year. I'm not against offering the scholarships to any player to keep an operating roster, especially when all of the targets were missed. But once that goal is achieved, he should consider who he can add next year rather than throwing a bone to someone, then show that someone to the door when a better one shows up and needs that scholly. To me, it's a broken promise, and he could have avoided it.
@approxinfinity Great job on the front page! I like it now it has today's features, and also the next game scheduled. I usually dive into the BBall section or unread right away, but now I have reasons to start from the home page. It's really helpful to see all the links together.
Thanks.
PS. I'm still a little uncomfortable about being able to modifying others' posts. I think it's better you and a few limited admins have this capability. And I wonder if it's possible to implement a suggest removal button and temporarily hide a post until an admin approves it. Just a thought.
I'd like to see Coach Self changes his tactic in filling up the roster when he misses all of his targets. Filling the roster with subpar talent does not help the program, but creates dilemma of how to get rid of them or making them riding the bench. I personally don't like the signing of Mickelson, Doyle, Anderson, etc. or even Lucas. Coach Self should have hold over the scholarship to the following year and offer to someone who can contribute significantly. And I still believe Coach Self is honest and I think offering to the players who can actually contribute significantly will help him keeping his words true to his sales pitch to the recruits (but of course, I don't know what he said to Hunter or Braeden). But in this case, I agree with HEM and many posters here that we should avoid offering to players who are outside of top 100. I think a top 10 nationally ranked player should be able to contribute significantly even as a freshman while the others probably will take a year or two before putting everything together, such as Ellis.
@Lulufulu85 It's another hype of Wigginsmania. I haven't never seen either TRob or Wiggins in person, but have seen TRob in picture plenty of times. TRob's body is a LOT thicker than Wiggins. I'd say comparing to TRob, Wiggins is very skinny. :)
200 vs 250 at the same height. :O
@drgnslayr I think not only the media hype Wiggins, but the fans too, evidently in your comments. McLemore talked about "COULD", but didn't. Part of the reason might be his skill set or lack of, part of it was his personality. We came to the conclusion based on the whole season he played. I don't remember anyone making this type of comments while he redshirted. And of course, we all heard how much the Jayhawks improve after he became eligible to practice, but nobody imagined he would become a player like he did after the redshirt year. He was after a Rivals 34 rated player out of high school. So he jumped almost 30 players to be drafted 7th overall. In other words, McLemore was a bit raw or/and less talented than Wiggins out of high school. But to say Wiggins "WILL" dominate in college after playing only 1 college exhibit game is just hype in my opinion. There is no doubt Wiggins has a lot of talent and potential, but I might be in the minority and believe he needs to prove his worth before being compared to Danny Manning, or even McLemore.
The reply is to slayr's comments, but please don't take it as a personal attack. Just disagreeing with some of the "hype".
@approxinfinity Thanks for the support. But I'm not sure about having the ability to delete or modify others' posts. I don't mind helping, but do you have the ability to bring any post back if it gets accidentally deleted?
@Mr_Miyagi It is indeed a very good read. Love the stories of Wilt. Thanks for sharing.
I'd like to suggest the capability of pinning a post to the top (managed by the admins) of a forum. Some of the post may have some importance, but don't receive a lot of followup comments. And without the followup comments they may drop to the bottom or slip out of sight. This way we can have all the lists to the articles in one place. Or maybe this can be part of the BLOG, and I think the blogs deserve a permanent space along side of quote of the day. And these blogs can be the articles of this site. And I'd suggest the admins manage the blogs, and have the ability to promote any post to be part of the blogs.
I'd also like to suggest one of 8 blocks on the home page is dedicated to Q&A, such as the list of smileys, how to embed photos, what HTML codes are allowed, etc. As this site grows, it will be more and more difficult to find the helpful tips from all the posters.
And I may also suggest maybe you can invite a few posters to be limited admins to manage the posts and posters. I really appreciate your effort and dedication. This site is great for us Jayhawks fans. But I hope you don't burn your self up with all the work. FOE is very appropriate in this case. :)
Thanks.
I'd suggest you apply for a photo journalist pass working for KUbuckets.com with KU Athletics and you might be able to bring in any kind of cannon as your imagination and pocket book allows. :)
According to some, "SEC Preview: Kentucky is too deep and talented to flop" ↗
I like this writer's writing style, and he has some good points too.
1. PF Perry Ellis (Rivals 24, 2012) Sophomore 2. PG Naadir Tharpe (Rivals 92, 2011) Junior 3. SF Andrew Wiggins (Rivals 1, 2013) Freshman 4. SG Wayne Selden Jr (Rivals 12 2013) Freshman 5. C Tarik Black (Rivals 54, 2010) Senior 6. C Joel Embiid (Rivals 25, 2013) Freshman 7. PG/SG Conner Frankemp (Rivals 34, 2013) Freshman 8. SF Andrew White III (Rivals 51, 2012) Sophomore 9. SF Brannen Greene (Rivals 29, 2013) Freshman 10. C/PF Landen Lucas (Rivals 150+, 2012) Sophomore, RS 11. PF Jamari Traylor (Rivals 141, 2011) Sophomore, RS 12. PG Frank Mason (Rivals 76, 2013) Freshman 13. C/PF Hunter Mickelson (Rivals 100, 2011) RS
And Oubre is Rivals 12, Alexander 4, Okafor 1, and Jones 5 for 2014. I believe Selden and Oubre will want to be here for multiple years. So we will have a log jam for a few years in the 2-3 position. Chalmers was Rivals 12 and Collins was 21 when they came out of high school, and both stayed for multiple years at KU. If Jones comes, will he be here for 2 years? Jones will be a short PG by the NBA standard at 6'1".
I'd like to bring HEM's excellent analysis back to the top again from another thread from yesterday
"The Greene/Frankamp thing is concerning to me. And this goes directly to landing to Wiggins. Wiggins' signing impacts both. I agree with farside .. I think Greene is the real deal. But roster numbers are the issue. Greene and Frankamp can count.
It really goes back to the Peters/Traylor/Lucas discussion from last season. It was pretty clear that one of them would get pushed out voluntarily or involuntarily, It was numbers. Lots of posters protested that suggestion. But you have kids that get one chance at college hoops. Roadblocks and being on the bench don't sit well. Milton Doyle ditched after seeing his competition in Europe. Smart move. And now we know why Self helped Adams with his decision, right?
Now, for 2014-15 .. we have Tharpe, Mason, Frankamp, White, Greene, and Oubre. One certainly won't play. I think the non-player comes from the same list as this season .. White, Greene, or Frankamp. White was the redshirt speculation, but that has ended. Tharpe and Mason are your ballhandlers and Oubre is a top 10ish player (I'm presuming he's in the rotation at least). So White, Greene, or Frankamp.
While the logic set forth by Parishawk on Greene redshirting makes sense, my hunch says Frankamp. He's in state, a clear four year player, no clear position, needs the weight room, etc. With Greene, he's out of state, not a clear 4 year player, bigger guy, appears more game ready, and appears to be a bigger risk to transfer.
What is the price of the Wiggins' signing? Could it be a Greene transfer? I hope not. A Frankamp redshirt would maybe establish the pecking order, and thus may make Greene feel a bit better.
Remember what we were saying about Adams and Tharpe this time last season .. we were looking at numbers with the incoming freshmen. Selden had just committed -- Greene, Frankamp, with White in the fold too. Adams ended up leaving. It could have been Tharpe.
It's just an interesting dynamic worth watching."
Assuming Coach Self will play top 9 players this year, Black, Ellis, Wiggins, Selden, Tharpe, Mason, White, Traylor, Embiid. So Greene, Frankamp, Lucas won't play. Lucas already redshirted and I assume he understands his role on the team.
In 2014, Black and Wiggins will be gone, we added Oubre. If we also land Okafor and Jones, we will have Okafor, Ellis, White, Oubre, Tharpe, Jones, Embiid, Selden, Mason or Greene. Again we have Mason or Greene, Frankamp, Lucas, Traylor not playing. Even if we don't land Okafor or Jones, but land Alexander, I still don't see how Frankamp break into the rotation. I understand both Greene and Frankamp are Rivals top 30 players out of high school, and both have Kansas connections. But how big of Jayhawks fans are they? Are they going to be happy to only play significantly when they become seniors? I'd like to point to Royce Woolridge, Zach Peters, Adams, Doyle who signed up, but moved away to look for playing time elsewhere. Provided all of them are low ranked players, but that also makes the situation more serious. Frankamp is a good player and top 30 ranked. I'd really hate to see him giving up and transfer out.
Some thoughts from last night's game.
1. Landen Lucas is playing really hard and pushing for backup minutes, but will he be able to break into the rotation of the bigs? I think the current order is Black, Ellis, Traylor, Embiid, Lucas, but Lucas made a strong push to replace Traylor last night. One thing concerns me is that he didn't appear as conditioned as Black, Traylor or Embiid. Or is that the others just didn't show being gassed?
2. Andrew White III made huge improvement from last season, appeared to be very confident on offense and hustled on defense. Great to see. Question is "will he be able to replace Selden as a starter?" Guess we have Game 2 coming up and we should see much improved play from Selden. I think Wayne's performance last night was due to nervousness, and should have it under control after a couple of real games.
3. I think Wiggins is as valuable in defense as in offense. His block on the perimeter was brilliant. If White continues his current form, I can see White playing the 3 and Wiggins playing the 2. And it will create a huge advantage for Wiggins to have 3-5 inches of height advantage over the opponent 2 guards.
4. Black was good. HEM had an excellent report on his Memphis career in another thread. He didn't show much in assist or passing in last night's game, but he rebounded, and played hard though probably was a little reckless. Deserve a blue card. :) But I like his shooting form at the freethrow line. Hopefully he will cause more fouls on the opponents than himself and earn more points from the freethrow line.