Dotson will go to UF it appears. Carey is down to Cuse/UConn/Miami because KU didn't prioritize him. Already out on Locke and others.
Maybe if the staff tries really hard they can get back in there with Dosunmu.
Hopefully Grimes is a Jayhawk and the staff only has to go rummage through the heap for a single guard and not two.
U G L Y.
Dotson to Florida, or anywhere isn't done yet. Still think he ends up a Jayhawk.
Zion Griffin to ISU.
@jayballer54 I'm calling it now based on what I'm reading.
Maybe this will help to keep y'all optimistic on recruiting: KU was to have an in-house with the other Zion today. He has several lined up this week, from which he will make choices for official visits.
I'm not convinced Dotson goes anywhere but Lawrence. If anything, he may have been irritated everyone thought it was a done deal. Let him get the Florida visit done, then we'll see. Losing Zion Griffin was a bummer. He's the next Burton at ISU.
debby downers
Grimes has cancelled his KU visit and will visit Kentucky on that date instead.
@BShark I DO have to say - - - even though I still feel confident about getting Grimes & Dotson there sure seems to be some negative trends coming out of the recruits.
This to me all seems to go down a road we have walked before, and that is do we have a staff that closes the deal? IF for a reason we were to lose out on these guys - -these are two that were considered heavy leans the entire year and then to lose out? - - That tells me that SOMEONE is dropping the ball. - -It happened last year with Ayton & now if it happens again this year? - -What is going on? is it time to question Howard - - - -is it time to question Snacks?
This would just be an indicator that for some reason guys aren't finishing the deal. I am no expert - -by far but you have to stay on these guys 24/7 - -it can't be the theory well things look pretty solid for this guy so let's concentrate on other recruits as we have these guys locked down - Or is it that we are trying to battle the Mega Bluebloods for these guys and end up losing out and then end up missing on others because we spend TO much time on the elite - -elite- - and end up missing on both? -Something smells - -maybe it's time for a shakeup in your recruiting staff. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I'm guessing but I think Zion coming for Late Night had something to do with the Grimes situation. Zion is the center of attention that night and I can imagine the staff wants to bring in Grimes when they can focus solely on him. You don't want him feeling like he's not getting the attention he wants. The other way to look at this is negatively especially coming off an in-home visit and he's canceling a visit? Grimes has canceled visits to KU a few times now since the summer and has constantly deflected the media from getting him to say KU is the favorite or he's a lean/lock to KU. Enough of that negativity though. Optimistically we hope Grimes is coming back at a later date for a visit and everything pointing to KU being his destination holds true..
In the same light, it might have been better to have Zion here a different weekend but we all know the Zion camp is running things so if they say they are coming you just roll out the carpet for them. With a player like Zion maybe its best to have your big showcase night with your top prospect there to see it. The exposure he'll get will be 2nd to none compared to a normal football weekend (where he just went to Clemson and KU is no Clemson). The more I think about it, Zion will get to see how much Lawrence is centered around the BB team and that can't hurt things. Honestly, KU should be trying to get Dotson on campus for another unofficial for LN. The chemistry between Zion & Devon would be easy to sell with them both on campus at the same time.
Even without landing anyone, this team is still capable of making a run next season.
Top 10 lineup. Landing any of these guys just makes us more of a NC favorite. I honestly expect to still land Dotson, but perhaps not Grimes at this point. Losing either of them is a huge miss for the staff, but Bill was smart enough to take high level transfers that he can count on if he did swing and miss. Not a bad way to hedge bets... Take the sure thing and then swing for the fences the rest of the time you're recruiting.
With De Sousa and Dotson being on the same visit, Dotson is in the bag. If De Sousa had that good of a time, so did Devon. He probably feels like he HAS to visit Florida out of courtesy I'm sure. But I'm as confident as ever he ends up in Crimson and Blue.
Grimes worries me for several reasons and I could see that slipping.
I would say Langford could still be in the picture. Staff is visiting with him tomorrow. They need to get him on campus. A Langford and Zion combo could be amazing to watch.
Grimes's visit to Late Night was planned to be unofficial anyway. I can't really blame the kid for taking a paid trip elsewhere when he'd have to pay to come to Late Night.
@Kcmatt7 That line-up has no depth and one guard. However of course the staff will land more players, who they will be I do not know. I read a lot of concerning stuff about Dotson, we will see.
Oh and apparently KU made Antwann Jones final 4. He does not have a KU offer. Top 75 guard.
Grimes broke down the pitch and what he likes most about his four finalists:
Texas: Coach Smart has really stressed how me and Matt Coleman could complement each other perfectly. Matt’s more of a passing point guard and I’m more of a scoring guard and he’d be able to look for me and we’d be able to play really well in that offense. I know most of those guys there because most of those guys are from Houston and I feel like we could play really well together in their system.
Kentucky: They came in on Sunday and their main pitch is to see me and another guard they get to be able to come in there and have the same goal, which is win a National Championship and just really get to the next level. They feel like they would be a great fit for me to get to my goals of making the NBA and also develop me on the court as a leader and as a person off the court. That was their pitch.
Kansas: They say I’m their top priority right now and they have to sign me. They see me coming in and playing right away and being the leader of that team and being the primary scorer and lead the team in scoring and be able to play with other good guards and other good players like the Lawson brothers. I could come in and be the man at Kansas for sure.
Marquette: They’ve been consistent the whole summer. They were 3 deep at almost every game and front row at every game. Their whole message is I’m the only guard they are recruiting. Come in there and be in the backcourt with Markus Howard. He’s a shooter and we can both shoot the ball pretty well and really just take over the program and try and take it to the new level.
There is a range of sophistication in those pitches. Texas and Kentucky sound competent and appear to be appealing to the rational mind: they have a plan and they are thinking of how he fits into their system and how his goals and their goal align. Kansas and Marquette sound like they are appealing to the ego.. The pitches sound desperate -- like all the eggs are in one basket -- and full of promises that kids what to hear; superficial.
Very interesting.
@BShark I seen it - -I'm not including Marquette. I think they are a non factor. -- Smart is becoming a pain in the ass, like a tiny burr underneath the saddle , but someone we have to take into accountability -especially with Coleman there and then knowing most of there players and Grimes being from Texas. - Smart has done a good job at attracting quality players, going to be someone to contend with in a year or two.
As far as Kentucky's spill to Grimes - -they said nothing that KU couldn't do for him if he chose to come here: - -Grimes being with another guard they are hoping to bring it ( Quickley ) with the same goal of National Championship? - - -KU matches that with hopefully bringing in another guard ( Dotson ) what kid doesn't come in with not the aspiration of winning a National Championship? - -Kentucky feels they really get him to the next level - - Why wouldn't he feel KU couldn't get him to the next level - -no difference there. - -Kentucky feels they would be a great fit for Grimes to get to my goals of making NBA - -and KU wouldn't? - -so their spill ain't squat - -they have nothing with that approach that we don't have.
As far as KU -- uhhh I don't know if he is quoting EXACT words from the staff or not. - -I have a LITTLE trouble thinking Coach Self actually came out and said that we HAVE TO SIGN HIM. - -I'm just not quite sure Coach would ever come out and say we HAVE to, with or without him we will survive, I mean ya a priority sure but HAVE TO SIGN I don't see the Coach telling a kid that. Plus I'm not for sure positive they are going to tell him that he will be our primary scorer - - I'm not sure we need a primary scorer like he says led the team in scoring. KU has usually for the most part been a very balanced scoring team - -makes me wonder if he will be a black hole when he has the ball - - he has some cockiness, not a bad thing stating that he could come in and be THE MAN at Kansas for sure, I like the kid would be a huge get but maybe reading to much into it but their are some things that he says makes me kind of wonder - is he a kid that never see's a shot that he didn't like? - it's all about Team at KU - -we shall see -
Grimes says he is working on to solidfy official visits working on to finalize later this week,
He wants to take visits - - see the campus - -& see the practices, get overall view of the campus - -see how each Coach views him in their system. - -Not in a hurry to make College Choice.- - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Self has missed on kids before by taking the other approach and telling the kid they will have to earn it. Maybe he changes it up based on his read on the kid now. From everything I've read before this is very much inline with it. Comments such as Grimes knows he has a starting spot at KU if he wants it etc...
If KU gets Grimes but doesn't get Zion I could see him and Dedric being the primary offensive options. The kid is an electric scorer.
I have some concerns about the recent developments too. Things are heating up for sure. Definitely some plusses and minuses.
Losing Zion G to ISU stinks, was hoping he would make it to late night. Great signing by them not letting him off campus without the commit.
Zion W coming to late night is big big big. Would be awesome to land him. He will be a superstar.
David McCormack - i think KU is in a good spot, sounds like a decision might be nearing. This would solitify the post if he picked KU.
The most important piece in my opinion is Dotson. We need guards badly, real badly. He would be a cornerstone on the team. The guy is a stud and reminds me of Frank how he gets into the lane at will. I havent seen anything to suggest he is Florida bound, he hasnt even made it to his visit yet. Not sure where that came from but makes me nervous nonetheless.
Seeing Grimes go to Kentucky when he was supposed to be at KU is concerning for sure. As previously pointed out, the KU visit was unofficial so if there is any saving grace to hold onto that might be it.
I have wondered, in Dotson's comments he said Self told him he is the best PG in the country, what did Grimes think of that? On the same token, Grimes just said Self told him he is their top priority right now. What does Dotson and Zion think about that? I hope everybody is mature enough to understand that there is some salesmanship going on here. I just hope that it doesnt make it seem like Self isnt a straight shooter. Dont want him to lose credibility over these various comments.
My biggest question is, Grimes is now down to the four schools. Kentucky, KU , Texas , & Marquette, so we made his final four and he made the statement that he was in the process up sitting up his officials hoping to have them sit by this weekend.
Ok so we made the final four , he had planned on coming to KU on Sept 30th I guess on a un-official but cancelled that visit and is going to Kentucky instead. So my question is this seeing as how we are one of the final four left Why didn't he just make Sept 30th an official visit in stead of his planned un-official and cancel. He already had made the plans to be here that weekend, I'm sure they would of made it official - -I don't get that, I mean he is still going to take the official here, so why not the 30th? - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Because he wants to visit KU for a game.
If Vick is back he at least provides some scoring punch. A line-up of Moore, Garrett, Cunliffe or KJ, Dedric and De Sousa would struggle to score. Dedric the only proven scorer among them. Spacing nightmare. Of course I'm probably worrying about nothing but I'm interested to see who Self ends up with.
We need actual games to start this season already.
@HighEliteMajor I'd take that. Self probably would too.
RockkChalkk said:
I have some concerns about the recent developments too. Things are heating up for sure. Definitely some plusses and minuses.
Losing Zion G to ISU stinks, was hoping he would make it to late night. Great signing by them not letting him off campus without the commit.
Zion W coming to late night is big big big. Would be awesome to land him. He will be a superstar.
David McCormack - i think KU is in a good spot, sounds like a decision might be nearing. This would solitify the post if he picked KU.
The most important piece in my opinion is Dotson. We need guards badly, real badly. He would be a cornerstone on the team. The guy is a stud and reminds me of Frank how he gets into the lane at will. I havent seen anything to suggest he is Florida bound, he hasnt even made it to his visit yet. Not sure where that came from but makes me nervous nonetheless.
Seeing Grimes go to Kentucky when he was supposed to be at KU is concerning for sure. As previously pointed out, the KU visit was unofficial so if there is any saving grace to hold onto that might be it.
I have wondered, in Dotson's comments he said Self told him he is the best PG in the country, what did Grimes think of that? On the same token, Grimes just said Self told him he is their top priority right now. What does Dotson and Zion think about that? I hope everybody is mature enough to understand that there is some salesmanship going on here. I just hope that it doesnt make it seem like Self isnt a straight shooter. Dont want him to lose credibility over these various comments.
We might be hurt by the fact that we have Charlie at PG and perhaps Florida does not have that type of competition at PG? Also, you wonder how the guys that will be back for sure next year feel about Grimes saying that Self led him to believe that he could be "the man". But that is the environment when you go after the top guys in the country.
Self is certainly catering to what guys want to hear and I think that's a positive step with how things are today in the recruiting world. I don't blame him for putting that kind of talk out there. Grimes has the talent to be a lead scorer type as a freshman given what is leaving after this year. If I'm a recruit and a HOF coach is saying "hey your good enough to be our best player next year" that would certainly raise my interest in going there. But I'm not these 17-18 year old kids that take so many other things into consideration.
@BShark Bill could easily take the page out of the 38-1 UK team though. GO BIG. Like just go really big, make the game super clunky, and then run as hard as you can in transition. Win games 70 to 60 where half of the points are offensive rebounds and the other half are from turnovers. Other teams don't get second chance points because our lineup of 4 guys who can all get 10 rebounds any given night are crashing the boards.
It would be ugly to watch. But I think that team would win a lot of games still.
Maybe I'm in the minority but I am scared about next years team. We picked up 3 transfers so we know Self is aware of the fact that a lot of talent is likely leaving. Anytime a team is faced with possibly replacing its top 6 players there is going to be concern. Of course we happen to have a coach that is well versed in roster turnover and cooking a whole new batch of players is a strength of his. But this could be the biggest reload in some time and that cannot be overlooked. We should have nothing to worry about given Self's track record but every coach eventually gets into a situation that becomes hard to overcome and this certainly looks like one of those situations right now.
When games start its going to be important to see how ready Garrett is after showing promise in Italy. He could be the guy we need to make the biggest leap depending on how things play out.
I think KJ is a little better then I might have thought, his brother certainly has the bigger reputation but we should get a ton of production/value from both. I just hope Dedric gets his head on straight and takes advantage of the situation he's now in because he certainly has the potential to be Big 12 POY and a All-American candidate.
I think Moore would be a perfect backup to an elite level recruit (insert Dotson). I'm just not sold on him being the type of player we need with this group. I think Moore will be better in years 2 & 3 at KU then just expecting him to be the type of guard KU has gotten used to having on the floor. I would love for him to change my mind though.
Beyond that there is doubt Vick & Doke will be back. Either of the 2 coming back would be huge and if both decided to return then KU definitely has the foundation for another championship level squad. But losing both man that's tough.
I don't care how people spin it this team absolutely needs recruits such as Dotson, Grimes & Zion to keep up. That's why Self has a chance with all 3 of them because the exodus of talent leaving is so great. Normally we get 1-2 really good recruits and settle for guys that are willing to play behind more established veterans. The wrinkle this year is we added 3 starter level transfers, not just rotation pieces. Self has to add elite level pieces, its not a "we're fine" without them situation
@BeddieKU23 I'd be worried if we hadn't picked up the transfers. But that is not the case. Dedric is All-American level good. Moore proved himself in a P5 conference as a very solid PG.
Those two things can take a team a long ways.
If Doke, Preston and/or Vick are back that adds another scorer. Garrett looks like he is going to be significantly better than I thought. Him in his So. year will be a legit NBA prospect.
Throw in the combination at the 4 of De Sousa, Lightfoot and KJ and you can play anyone's style of game or create mismatches at that position.
That team would have enough to be a top 10 team. Maybe not a NC team, but a top 10. When you throw in a guy like Zion that changes the team all by himself. If we were to land two of the 3, i think we would be favorites to win it all. If we landed all 3 I would think that we would be heavy favorites.
But putting out a top 10 team after losing all 5 starters is amazing. Nobody else does that consistently. Not UK, not Duke, nobody but Bill.
According to the most recent Crystal Ball predictions which you can take them or leave them, here are the players in the top 50 KU is in the run...
- #26 Devon Dotson - KU-81%, Florida 19%
- #17 Quentin Grimes - KU - 100%
- #2 Zion Williamson - KU 43%, UK - 29%, Duke 14%, UNC - 7%
- #21 Emmitt Williams 0 Oregon, 67%, KU - 17%, Florida - 17%
- #49 Jalen Carey - Syracuse 71%, KU -14%
I would say KU is in great shape with Grimes and Dotson and good shape with Zion; nothing to be alarmed at this point. :smiley:
I have no disagreement with your optimistic approach to what the roster may look like next year. My concern for next year isn't the sky is falling, I'm closer to the status quo then the ledge.
I just have concerns about replacing a starting 5 and the detail that goes with that. I also think KU could land better talent at positions it normally has NBA talent. All 3 transfers come with limitations in some way. Dedric would be in the NBA if he didn't but that's beside the point. Moore is always going to be playing against players bigger then him and must become a more efficient shooter/facilitator. KJ has to establish what position he's going to play and continue to improve his shooting.
If Self is able to land Zion and Grimes then I would have very little concern going forward. Both of them have reputations that speak for themselves. Dotson is a cherry on top kind of recruit for KU with Moore in the fold. I thought he proved all summer he was every bit as good as any PG in the class. Big Dave McCormack would give KU great size to pair in the post with De Sousa and the Lawsons/Lightfoot. I also think he's starting to realize how good he could be after reshaping his body and learning how to play to his strengths. Hopefully any concern I have is alleviated as we find out who's joining and who ends up leaving.
KU does not appear to be a likely destination for McCormack with OSU, Duke and Georgia being the candidates.
KU still rocking a 0% on Silvio De Sousa's crystal ball.
KU, Xavier and NC State are the players with McCormack with that caveat that if Duke ever amped it up they'd be in strong contention.
@JayHawkFanToo Oh sorry to say but I think KU is a MAJOR player for McCormack - just off the basis of him visiting KU on his own dime and then returning for an official on late night.
On top if you read what he had to say about the University overall, about KU being the foundatation, the founder of Basketball, how is looking at more then just the game, how he brought up different aspects about KU oh ya I think we are a MAJOR player for him no doubt. him talking about Naismith sorry but I think I'm spot on with this - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@JayHawkFanToo I am curious why you say that? Duke ..OK...but the others?
He eliminated Georgetown in his last cut down.
I'm not saying the crystal ball is completely irrelevant, but it's not the whole picture.
@jayballer54 Agree-- in fact, even if those are the words that were uttered, we don't know that it was Self vs. someone else on the staff..
@BShark Agree with you on this 1000000000% bud. - I am starting to laugh at these dam CB"s more and more all the time - -I don't think they know anymore then throwing at a dart board. - -just like you pointed out remember Ayton? - now even though it's not final look at Dotson. - -just couldn't agree more. - - McCormack we are heavlly involved and good shape with. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Recruits always say good things about programs they visit, particularly if they plan to take an all expense paid official visit in the near future.
If you were a high end recruit, wouldn't you take all the allowed offcial visit where they treat you like royalty and send you home with some cool school gear to boot? I know I would.
McCormack is friends with OSU assistant coach David Kontaxis who has worked seven years with AAU programs in the Washington, D.C. area, including McCormack’s Team Loaded. McCormack was on an unofficial visit to OSU and apparently made a side trip to Lawrence although he is expected to make an offcial visit later on.
I am not saying that KU is not in play but if you take the comments of recruits after visit as the key, we would have gotten a heck of a lot more top players that visited and had glowing comments about KU. Wouldn't you agree?
@JayHawkFanToo I'm not taking his remarks as a key - -I'll will say this I'll predict right here - -right now he WILL NOT land at Oklahoma State. - -If not KU then he will land at Duke, they have been in on him for quite some time - No Oklahoma State commit here, mark it own. - - As we pretty well knew ya Oklahoma St right now is his leader in the CB - - And? - -That CB crap is less and less credible all the time, we know that from personal experiences, it's a crap shoot with the analysts, like taking a dart and throwing at a dart board - -Again mark it down - it will not happen for Okla St with this kid. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
So, if you are not using his comments as the main reason, why do you think KU is in? The unofficial visit? He has made 9 unofficial visits so far.
McCormack is coming back for late night not even a month after unofficially visiting here. I think KU has been able to get in his ear about Doke's pending NBA decision and the opportunity for him here. He's an Adidas kid as well which helps.
Steve Smith, his coach for Oak Hill said he enjoyed his unoffical here and that NC St & Xavier were also schools he was considering with Duke/UCLA also trying to get visits (if he makes it that far). This was his quote " I don’t know if he’ll go past September, he’s getting kind of antsy and I think he likes a couple schools."
If NC St & Xavier are the biggest competition then we have to like our chances. The way he's changed his body and has started to play through the change he's made he's got NBA upside down the road. I think KU with Hudy and its history with bigs is the perfect spot for him. There might even be a starting spot for grabs when he gets here..
@JayHawkFanToo Ahhh...McCormack's relationship with the OSU assistant is big.
@JayHawkFanToo How about you tell me if KU is NOT a major player tell me why if he isn't that interested in the University why is he making two visits for one. - -You said he was close for the un- official -- AND? - - he comes here on this un official , if he is not that interested , if he is not serious - -why come back on an official? - - If he didn't see anything that interested - -if he doesn't like what the staff had to say - - if he didn't like the environment - the campus - - the facilities - -why waste an official visit on a school that is not that serious of player in your recruitment? - - Wouldn't you as a recruit want to use your officials for schools that you were seriously considering? - -Would you just want to waste one of your officials when you knew there was no way or little chance of committing there? - - I know if I were a recruit - -I'm taking my officials to schools that I'm interested in , and have a true chance of landing me. - -McCormack is not the only player that has had a friend - - had a previous Coach or connection that is now at another school and that recruit not end up there because they were there.
I'm going to a School because of a lot of other things other then just a friend being there or previous Coach or whatever. I'm going to a school that I feel gives me the best chance to help me improve my skills - develop me to advance to the next level. I'm going to a school for exposure, tradition, and OTHER things he mentioned. - not because of some guy that use to Coach me or a friend. - -McCormack feels really good about our staff - -loves our history of the game -Ya I think your under estimating KU and over estimating a former Coach or whoever the hell this guy is. To say we are insinuate KU isn't a major player with him - is just way off base - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
BeddieKU23 said:
McCormack is coming back for late night not even a month after unofficially visiting here. I think KU has been able to get in his ear about Doke's pending NBA decision and the opportunity for him here. He's an Adidas kid as well which helps.
Steve Smith, his coach for Oak Hill said he enjoyed his unoffical here and that NC St & Xavier were also schools he was considering with Duke/UCLA also trying to get visits (if he makes it that far). This was his quote " I don’t know if he’ll go past September, he’s getting kind of antsy and I think he likes a couple schools."
If NC St & Xavier are the biggest competition then we have to like our chances. The way he's changed his body and has started to play through the change he's made he's got NBA upside down the road. I think KU with Hudy and its history with bigs is the perfect spot for him. There might even be a starting spot for grabs when he gets here..
Agree. He'd also be a good fit at KU which seems important to him.
Also it's not IMG or Brewster but current staff at KU seems to have an ok relationship with Oak Hill.
I haven't seen McCormack mention Oklahoma St since the summer. It doesn't sound like they are getting one of his official visits either. So unless something changes it sounds like them hiring his AAU coach didn't end up having a big effect on what he's going to do. The CB's will change and they could go KU's way after his official...
Well read where we landed on a recruits final five once again. Doesn't really amount to a lot I don't think but Louis King announced final five of: - - Oregon , NC State , Seton Hall , KU , & Purdue.
Seems like a pretty solid at this point to Oregon, not really thinking much chance here but you never know stranger things have happened. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Grimes has cut Arizona from consideration.. that's huge
Honestly, not super high on Louis King. He's not a great athlete, his handle is probably roughly average and he's an above average but not elite shooter. I am just not sure how he transitions to a collegiate wing at KU and is anything more than Andrew White. Maybe others have a different take, but I just don't see it.
This class is top heavy, but light on depth, so he could get ranked top 25 or top 30, but really be more like a 40-60 guy. For comparison's sake, in 2016, the highest a player rated lower than 90 was ranked in ESPN's 100 was 29th. In 2017, an 89 got you ranked 31st. In 2015, 2014 and 2013 it went 20, 30 and 23.
A deep class takes players rated above 90 to about 30. Anything less than that, the class lacks depth. The first player rated less than 90 is at 25. But what is even more telling is that this class only has 4 guys rated 95 or higher. There aren't really any truly elite prospects, and there's not a lot of depth. 2018 is going to be a year where not a lot of freshmen arrive on campus ready to contribute because there just aren't any elite level guys.
I think Self has seen that possibility and has planned for it with the Lawson brothers, Charlie Moore and Sam Cunliffe, all of whom are likely to be more ready to contribute than any prospect outside the top 12-15 in the 2018 class. Throw in Marcus Garrett and you have a solid starting five whether Vick returns or not.
Self may have done it again - we just don't know it yet.
@BeddieKU23 Soooo now what? - -that what leaves KU & ? down to 2 now right?
@justanotherfan ya I really haven't hear a lot of super positive reviews on him either. - Not a lot of vibes ya know what I mean? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Agree to an extent on King. He's kind of a jack of all trades type wing. He's actually the type I would expect to see land at Villanova. I think he's an excellent catch and shoot type, rebounder and defender. Those traits fit at KU but if we are going to keep recruiting the uber elite wings maybe he isn't the best fit in that light.
I think the most interesting part of King's recruitment has been that Calipari turned him down after he basically begged them for an offer this summer. King played for Cal during Team USA ball and still didn't impress Cal enough to get him that offer. That could be because King figures to be a multi-year player in College at a position that is routinely producing OAD types every season.
I think King's ranking will even out a bit more across the platforms and he'll end up in that 20's to low 30's range. It seems if Oregon has his attention and if he doesn't land there I'm not sure where he'd go unless KU was out of the Zion race and had a chance to get him in the spring..
@BeddieKU23 Wait -- Grimes didn't have Arizona in his final 4. - -He is down to Ku , Kentucky , Marquette & Texas - -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
He's really down to 1 school but these kids have to play it out
Just read where Devon's dad said their in home visit with Coach Self and Howard went great last night. Siad lots of questions asked like about KU academics - - - KU support staff- - - to where they will live- - - what will they eat - - - and How closely they will be monitored.
According to Dotson father Dana - - -says they like what they heard.Said that see hi coming in and being their starting PG from day 1. - -says how they stressed that over and over.
The ONE thing that needs to be brought out is though 1st is that it is NOT a promise , 2ndly nor is it a guarantee - -What they told Dana is They Believe. that is what they think.
Dana said visit went great, Said KU - -Coach Self talked about why KU is the best fit for Devon, talked a lot about the vison for Devon what is and should be important for Devon and how KU fits those wants. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I did not say KU is not in play, I just said that he does not seem to THE program in play at this time.
You talk about wasting an offcial visit...well, once he makes all five offcial visits will you said he wasted the four other official visits? I think not. Remember, he made 9 unofficial visits on his own dime.
I know the crystal ball is not the be all, end all of recruiting predictions; however, many of the raters (obviously not all) are well informed and competent analysts that have a lot more inside information than we do. You can take the individual prediction any way you want based on your opinion of the rater but, when you look at the overall trend, in most cases is not that bad and at this time KU dose not seem to be ahead of the other schools.
Again, I am not saying KU is not in play, obviously it is since he has scheduled an offcial visit but that is just an indicator that KU is in play, that is all. Do you know how many top players have taken offcial visit to KU and signed with other programs? It happens, it's the nature of the process.
As I said before, the only sure prospect is the one that has signed the LOI.
@JayHawkFanToo No he won't of wasted ANY of his five officials - -as they are his Officials. and with them being officials they are schools that are in serious contention, and as far as CB's are concerned I think a lot of people are starting to see how much weight they in reality hold - - -not much, too many cases of recruits being seen as CB leaders for a certain school and end up somewhere else.
Like many many others other then myself on other sites have said a lot of times with these analysts if they see one analyst make a prediction and they think this guy might have a little more info - -then they jump the train goin off his prediction whether they believe it or not -educated guess - that's it. - -but anyways we will see where he lands but I'll stick with my prediction - -he WILL NOT end up at Oklahoma St, a lot better chance of Duke as they have been on him for quite awhile. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@JayHawkFanToo Let me turn your own question back to you, that you ask me. -- . You asked me if I'm not using the comments as the main reason I see KU as being a major player, then is it the un-official visit? You say he has had 9 un-official so far.
So let me turn it around right back to you. If your not just using the CB'S as the main reason that you see KU as being that school that is NOT the program in play at this time- -then what is the reason you don't see KU as the Program in play at this time? ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Just checkin' in. But I definitely WILL be coming to KU. Big Davy Mac and Z-Will will also be joining me.
Just read Grimes dates for his officials. - -Texas, Sept 22nd. - - Kentucky , Sept 29th - - KU , Oct 13 - -& Marquette , Oct 20th
We shall see what happens. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
If we can't land a legacy, who we offered and were all over for an entire YEAR before UK, who TF can we land?
Grimes is coming here. We have visited him nearly 10 times. We were the 3rd school to offer him. We have put the time and effort in. We have done all of the right things. If we lost him to UK, I just don't see how there couldn't be something dirty going on. This would be the last straw for me. I couldn't NOT believe that Nike, Adidas and agents 100% dictate where most top 25 kids go.
You keep misquoting me even when I specifically said in two separate posts...I am not saying KU is not in play.
KU is very much in play but based on what I have read to date it is not the leader, OSU is by virtue of the relationship he has with the assistant coach there that was his AAU coach.
For the third time, I am not saying KU is not in play...
How are they the leader if there is no official visit scheduled to OSU at this point
2018-19 is shaping up to be a year where a more veteran team could emerge for the national title simply because the depth isn't there for the incoming class.
Unless one team is able to sign four top 15 players, it's hard to see a team dominated by freshmen rising above the fray.
Teams that have top returning players should rocket to the top over the course of the season. Of course, the risk is that this parity just means lots of teams have a shot at the title rather than just a handful because the talent levels will be so close come tournament time.
NC ST landed a top 100 center yesterday. Important because big dave visited there. Have to think that's another positive sign
Looks like a PF but I doubt it hurts KU. I think KU is well positioned here.
And yeah if Grimes ends up at UK I just...fwrlt241351 3l41rw4...
KU is clearly the leader on Grimes, Dotson and Zion and there is plenty of information to back that up. The information on Big Dave is not readily available only that he has made 9 unofficial visit, one official and one scheduled official to KU; seems logical that he would make all the available official visits.
The most recent predictions, including Jerry Meyer who many in the forum respect indicate OSU. KU would seem to be in a good place but no one has updated his prediction. McCormack has said the right things about the places he visited but not really given any indication on his final destination. McCormack might very well end up at KUand if KU gets the other 3 prospects, it could be one of the better classes ever.
As I have said before, the only sure prospect is the one that has signed a LOI, until then, every program is in play. Remember when Ayton was just about 100% KU? So much for that...😂
@JayHawkFanToo and for the THIRD time -- -he WILL NOT end up at Okla St - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BeddieKU23 He doesn't know. - -All he knows or so he thinks anyways is that KU is not the leader good for him - I'm tired of trying to lead a horse to water. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
OK. So only your opinion counts? Got it.
Remember that absent facts all we can offer is opinions and they are just that...opinions, and as such they are not right or wrong just different....unless they are your apparently in which case they are right and others wrong.
I never said or implied you were wrong, I simply asked for the rationale for your opinion; I would appreciate if you would extend others the same courtesy.
@JayHawkFanToo right. - -and you never answered my question when I turned it back to you. - - - Still waiting - -thanks. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Must be nice to have a decent football program. Dotson and his dad sure looked like they were into that game... Would suck if Florida football just helped them land Dotson.
You need to take the blinders off and actually read what I wrote, the answer is there...it is just not what you want it to be so you just ignore it. Nothing else I can add.
@JayHawkFanToo ok, thanks for the insight. - -so enlightening, I hope I can one day when I grow up be able to comprehend like you thank you. - have a great day. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Ok so @jayballer54 I'm curious why you are so certain about where Dave isn't going? You've stated several times that's what you believe, but haven't supported your argument. Just assume I haven't read any of the recruiting stuff from the crystal ball (as I think it's bunk) don't pay for 247 sports (why would I?) and only get info from free internet sources that hopefully don't contain a million viruses (ESPN and KUSports mainly). So what information that is making you so confident that McCormack is going to one school or another? I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe one way or another just curious what your thoughts are.
OK, guys, let me get this straight. Both of you have an opinion of who is the leader for some recruit, neither of you has any definitive actual information on the subject, both of you have cited some information that you claim supports your opinion, each of you challenges the sources of each other's opinion, both of you claim you (a) supported your own and (b) asked for why the other one has an opinion that seems very strong, and you both seem to agree that CBs and recruit comments are not definitive predictors of a player's ultimate destination.
Now you decide to start snarling at each other, blah blah blah--typifying way too much internet interaction.
Can you both please try to repeat the words, "We are each entitled to our own opinion" without adding nasty comments?
Here is my own, as if it matters: the relationship with the OSU coach gives a good reason why OSU is in the mix, but we know from many many recruitments that offers from blue bloods (esp Duke and UK) can often win over personal ties. You each have valid points. But you both keep asking for proof of opinions--it doesn't work that way!
@dylans I can ask the same question as to why people feel so confident That we are not a major player for him. - -Look this could go on banter back and forth - -not worth it, at least not to me, I've have more serious thing to concentrate on such as my upcoming Stress tests on my heart and multiple other tests concerning my heart - that's some for me to really concentrate. Look we can opposite opinions, it's some just only want to hear their favorable side. CB'S are a bunch of crap - -been proven multiple times tell me that isn't so. If you put your belief in CB'S then you must still believe in Santa Claus too lmao.
Don't need proof, it's me - it's my gut feeling and I will say again and feel very very confident - -David McCormack WILL NOT commit to Oklahoma St, again David McCormack WILL NOT commit to Oklahoma State. period. - like I said it is fruitless to keep going back and forth back and forth I have an opinion just as others have theire.
You may think mine is crazy unfounded ridicilious what ever that's fine, that's people's right to think that. I have no problem with that just as I have my right. - Is this not an open forum? - -Are we always suppose to agree 100 with one another? if sooooo then I don't honestly know what to tell ya, Hell 'm suppose to agree with the ol lady 100% of the time - -doesn't happen - -still married lmao. Tis is not the first time people have agreed won't be the last. I'm just not going to pursue this particular question any further , before it gets out of hand. I enjoy this room anyways bottom line we all want whats best for KYU I think we can all agree on that - -My thoughts McCormack is either here at KU - -or Duke but no way in hell will he land at Oklahoma St -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 You can save money by just having the doctor attach the EKG leads to your chest after a lengthy session on the Board. No other stress inducers necessary!
@jayballer54 I wasn't disagreeing with ya. I just was wondering what you were basing your opinion on. I have no info one way or the other. There has been zero back and forth between us, I have read this whole thread and was wondering where you were coming from. Here I was hopeful that you'd have a link to read or some positive distraction. That's all.
David McCormack schedules official visit to OK St. for Oct. 14th per reports.
Interesting notes on the Dotson front. According to Matt He didn't see the ending of the Florida game (which is the only positive it seems on that front).
Florida insider is awful confident he announces for them in the next week. He says he has ties to the Dotson recruitment. Surprisingly no CB action yet to Florida but I get the sense the writing is on the wall.
Would be interesting to know why there was even information leaking saying he was done to KU in July/August if in fact that ended up being false. Information like that is not helpful to anyone and just creates the sense that KU has missed on yet another target they went for. Maybe he was Florida's all along with the PT available and the relationship they formed with the staff and the KU talk was junk. In the end a majority of these kids just don't want to live in Kansas no matter how good the facilities, the coach, the team, the history etc..
Further I'm not sure what Self has to do to land elite point guards at this point if Dotson goes to Florida. Shouldn't Frank Mason's success have changed things? It seems as though KU has to literally have zero PG's on the roster for that to happen. Disappointing if this happens.
KU has not had a single first round PG under Self. They have had high recruits - Collins, Chalmers, Selby. They have had all conference and all Americans - Mason, Miles, Taylor. But they have not had a first rounder. That's a boatload of highly talented guys that have not, for one reason or another, translated to NBA stardom.
Every single guy I listed, with the exception of Selby, was a very good collegiate player at a minimum. Several of those guys were legitimately great collegiate players. But Self has yet to solve the jump from college to the NBA at the PG position. That's why the success of Newman this year is so important. Self has to show other PGs that he can take a highly talented player and make them a lottery pick from the PG position.
We knock Calipari on this board all the time, but his PGs almost never miss when they come in that highly touted. Wall and Bledsoe are legit stars. Knight is a starter. Fox was a lottery pick. Tyler Ulis is a solid NBA backup. That track record is pretty impressive. Self can't match that, and he's had McDs AA's at his disposal.
Newman is a referendum on Self's ability to translate talent to draft pick at the PG position. At this point, that's the only thing that can really change the current perception of Self (in my eyes) on the recruiting front at PG.
@justanotherfan Newman is a shooting guard, right?
Newman is an NBA PG. He doesn't really have a future in the NBA as a 2 because of his size, so I am considering him a PG for this exercise. It actually benefits KU if others consider him a PG as well, because recruits will see a scoring PG at KU, which could lead to some recruiting currency later on. I hope Self has Newman playing on-ball at least 40% of the time, letting him run the show sometimes even with Devonte on the floor.
I agree that Self has a reputation with PG's that is hard to overcome when he's recruiting the very best in the land. Dotson should be a player Self can get though. There has been a significant amount of time and effort placed on securing his commitment.
What is Mike White offering that Self can't? Mike White certainly has even less of a reputation for putting his players into the NBA.
I would say Devon and his family putting his NBA future in the hands of Mike White is a far riskier move then Bill Self. And while Dotson has seen his stock rise considerably from where it was in the spring I wouldn't consider him a 1st round type at the moment unless he magically becomes a better athlete and perimeter shooter. I would also question what Florida has put into the league that stands out at the point guard position?
@BeddieKU23 I'm not going to say one way or another with Devon. - -I'm just going to have that old scenario wait and see approach I guess. - -I mean as is so typical after a visit these guys are going to put out nothing but positive things for their fans to read. - -99-100 they aren't going to put out anything saying that a recruit says sorry but nope I'm am not interested in your school - -your school sucks or negative material like that. - I'm not saying obviously that's what Devon said - -I'm not saying he didn't say a lot of positive things about Florida - -chances are he did -what recruit doesn't?
Almost any recruit even the recruits after they visit KU have nothing but good things to say about the school, it's just the way it seems to go after a visit. - -So chances are he did tell this Insider positive things for Florida. -Let's sit back for a couple of days and just watch - -see, I agree if it does turn out this way - - then I am stumped - -I just don't get it, but we shall see. But for this guy sounds like he thumping his chest pretty hard about something happening within the week? - - umm I don't know about all that. - -Something tells me we STILL aren't in as bad as shape as some may think - might be wrong but. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Let's think of this like investments. In one case, you have an investor with a long track record, but it's a record of mediocre returns with your type of product (i.e. PGs), even over a long term (i.e., lots of talent, just a few second round picks, or undrafted free agents after good college careers).
On the other hand, you have an investor with a much shorter high level track record who has never really done much at this level. On the one hand, you're looking at the unknown. On the other hand, it's the unknown against a record of underperformance in this particular area. In this situation, Mike White's lack of history is actually a benefit in a direct competition against Self because he doesn't have his past shortcomings weighing him down (something White has no doubt pointed out to Dotson and his family).
I'm not saying White is a better coach, obviously. Just that if you're Dotson and you're putting your draft future into one program or another, the program that hasn't produced a first rounder with multiple McDs AAs and collegiate stars may not be your first choice because you can't even argue that Self hasn't had talent at the position, or that Self hasn't had guys play well at the point. They just haven't translated to the NBA.
BeddieKU23 said:
I agree that Self has a reputation with PG's that is hard to overcome when he's recruiting the very best in the land. Dotson should be a player Self can get though. There has been a significant amount of time and effort placed on securing his commitment.
What is Mike White offering that Self can't? Mike White certainly has even less of a reputation for putting his players into the NBA.
I would say Devon and his family putting his NBA future in the hands of Mike White is a far riskier move then Bill Self. And while Dotson has seen his stock rise considerably from where it was in the spring I wouldn't consider him a 1st round type at the moment unless he magically becomes a better athlete and perimeter shooter. I would also question what Florida has put into the league that stands out at the point guard position?
I honestly don't think it matters much where Dotson goes. Florida has been on him a long time too. All that said it would be a tough miss to swallow, especially since Self/the staff made the choice to go hard after Grimes and Dotson when they could have just as easily pressed on Carey and/or Ayo who I believe KU had a great shot at before slow playing due to Grimes/Dotson.
Honestly if Dotson goes to UF then Grimes becomes a near must land recruit. And I'm hesitant to say that any recruit is must land for KU. KU would obviously move on if Grimes picked UK (he very well might, as UK wants the first to commit of Grimes and Keldon Johnson) but it would be pretty awful when you consider... His mom went to KU, he is an Adidas kid, KU was his third D1 offer/has been on him since forever and he is tremendously talented.
Good debate. A few more points.
Has Self ever landed a PG that was a sure-thing 1st round pick without his coaching?
Collins- lack of height and weight concerns always limited his stock. That's why he stayed all 4 years.
Chalmers- wasn't the primary PG at KU, lacked elite athleticism, left at the right time. Did win NBA titles despite not going in the 1st round.
Selby- injury, suspension, definitely can be argued KU hurt his stock. Definitely didn't stick around long enough to fix what went wrong. Unfair for Self to be judged based off him. But I understand he will be regardless.
I can't say he's ever been given the keys to an elite PG talent to prove otherwise. But he took a no-named 3-4 star PG Frank Mason and molded him into a NPOY.
You mentioned Calipari with his success with the PG's and frankly most of them would have been drafted highly regardless of landing at Kentucky with Cal. Cal certainly didn't hurt their stock, if anything he enhanced it. He's 2nd to none in that regard. When he gets guys with a ton of hype they rarely disappoint.
What bothers me is Self didn't hurt Andrew Wiggins stock, he still went 1st. Embiid blew up, went top 5 despite injury. Jackson just went top 5 in a loaded draft. He certainly gives the elite every chance to succeed at KU and keep their draft stock high. So I'm stunned that top ranked PG's choose to go elsewhere despite the opportunity for PT and to be coached by one of the game's best.
Does Dotson have a 1st round NBA future? I don't think he does judging him right now. I don't see the elite size, athleticism, shooting ability that PG's often have to possess to be drafted in the 1st round. He's in the same mold as Collins, Chalmers & Selby, even Russel Robinson. I think he's going to be excellent at the College level and with some development in College could work his way into the 1st round given the right timing.
Grimes is pretty clearly the superior player in my eyes. He's more explosive, stronger and a tick better shooter. He's also the better athlete. Dotson's vision may be better, but even that I wouldn't say for certain.
I'm actually a bit surprised that Grimes isn't a top ten guy in such a thin class. I'm surprised Quickley is ahead of Grimes. I understand why people are high on Garland, but I would have Garland ahead of Jones and Grimes right behind Garland. Grimes just looks like he will be more able to transition to college with his strength and athleticism. Jones is basically a carbon copy of his brother (not that this is a bad thing), but I don't see how that puts him ahead of those other guys. Perhaps its that Grimes is classified as a 2, but I see him more as a combo guy (particularly because these HS guys all come out handling the ball anyway).
Agree, its going to be very hard to understand missing on him. Maybe I was little consumed with how confident Slater was saying he was going to KU. I also felt confident in Adidas putting him at KU especially with the way the Zion & Dotson teaming up in Vegas went. But it seems the Dotson's haven't been swayed by outside influence and they are making a unbiased decision. I always knew that Florida had developed a great relationship with him but I didn't think this would potentially end up this way given all that KU has done to land him. Crazy, makes you want to give up on the recruiting all together
Grimes isn't top 10 because he didn't play on the Nike circuit. Nike just has a ton of influence on everything.
He was sick during the 1st eval period and it wasn't until the later sessions that he proved to everyone that he was still one of the best players in his class. I agree with everything else though, he has the size and athletic ability that is going to translate to College and the NBA..
Grimes will be a great one, hopefully at KU. Like if KU can't get Grimes (for all the reasons that have already been mentioned) it makes you wonder who CAN they get.
BShark said:
Grimes will be a great one, hopefully at KU. Like if KU can't get Grimes (for all the reasons that have already been mentioned) it makes you wonder who CAN they get.
Exactly, losing on Grimes would put a big dent in where KU falls in the pecking order of recruiting at this point
jayballer54 said:
@BeddieKU23 I'm not going to say one way or another with Devon. - -I'm just going to have that old scenario wait and see approach I guess. - -I mean as is so typical after a visit these guys are going to put out nothing but positive things for their fans to read. - -99-100 they aren't going to put out anything saying that a recruit says sorry but nope I'm am not interested in your school - -your school sucks or negative material like that. - I'm not saying obviously that's what Devon said - -I'm not saying he didn't say a lot of positive things about Florida - -chances are he did -what recruit doesn't?
Almost any recruit even the recruits after they visit KU have nothing but good things to say about the school, it's just the way it seems to go after a visit. - -So chances are he did tell this Insider positive things for Florida. -Let's sit back for a couple of days and just watch - -see, I agree if it does turn out this way - - then I am stumped - -I just don't get it, but we shall see. But for this guy sounds like he thumping his chest pretty hard about something happening within the week? - - umm I don't know about all that. - -Something tells me we STILL aren't in as bad as shape as some may think - might be wrong but. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Actually this person from the Florida site has been talking about Dotson to Florida for a while now (july) and has said its been all but done since August as well. He says he has intel from the staff/travel ball that are close with the Dotson Family. They all seem to take his intel as legitimate there. Everything I see is he's either a coach on the AAU scene or connected in some respect to it and has access to these recruits for firsthand information.
Either the media and recruiting sites overstated Dotson's intentions or Florida was always the favorite and KU being the bigger school overshadowed that fact and we've all gotten caught in the fact that Dotson was not KU's to lose but Florida's.
We probably got a little too ahead of ourselves with the Zion and Devon pairing in Vegas and maybe at the time all the momentum was KU could get him to commit but that settled and KU had Dotson on campus before Florida for whatever reason. We can visit him all we want but it looks at least how I'm seeing things is Florida has won this battle and this past weekends visit likely sealed it up. If he announces soon we'll know its Florida.
@justanotherfan Ok, that makes sense. I simply have no idea on Newman's level of ballhandling. We were spoiled with Mason. Graham isn't in that league with the ball.
Remember that Mario Chalmers did not play PG at KU, RussRob did, but he had to move to PG on the NBA. He did pretty well at his new position but now he seems to be unable to hook up with a team because of his previous injury. I am sure he is pretty much set for life even if he does not play another game in the NBA although you would think there is a team out there that could use him.
@JayHawkFanToo he signed w/Memphis
You are correct, I forgot about it. He will be playing with McLemore. :smiley:
@JayHawkFanToo and selden
Indeed...too late to get coffee. :smile:
I suspect I will be watching a lot of their games.
I'm thinking that we would be seeing some movement in the CB from or about Devon if it indeed was he was going to commit or there was a huge swing in Florida favor wouldn't w by now - -something?
Or hear something from Devon about his trip to Florida - -I'm not talking about from some Florida insider - -I'm talking about Devon talking about his trip how I went, what he though possible decision date - not some insider giving his input - -Just silence right now. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DY LONG BABY
Well, just answered my own question from a post of just a few minutes ago.
Article from Zags Blog says Devon is now weighing his options. His dad Dana said the visit with Florida was a good visit. Got the chance to hang around Florida players, he attended a class , two practices , met the academics , met the strength and conditioning and attended the foot ball game Saturday which I read he didn't stay for the length of the game.
Met with the Coaching staff several times, which they told him he would have the ball in his hands from day one - -as they are losing their starting PG ( Ja"Quan Newton. )- - said they run an up tempo and can see Devon fitting right in.
Also said Devon visited KU last month and KU could be losing a lot including our Pg Graham. - -Said Devon is going to take the weekend off from visits and consider his options & next actions.
It did mention that UCLA , Clemson , & Maryland had shown interest but did not mention anything else about them. - -Sounds like he has visited who he wants and it WILL BE either KU or Florida to me. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Florida coaches meeting with DD again today at school as well as in-home. Sounds like an all out blitz.
They are not visiting anywhere this weekend as its his mother's birthday I believe.
If Maryland gets an official visit then we know he hasn't made his mind up. If he doesn't he'll be announcing for Florida.
@RockkChalkk YA KU was to have an in home last night I think from what I read - -Roberts. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
See where KU just got a CB for McCormack from Evan Daniels , that's always good to know - -think we got a legit shot. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Three in a row. A few more guys followed with picks for McCormack to KU. Chad Lykins and Dain Ervin. Wonder what they all heard/saw that made them submit the picks.
@RockkChalkk Ya, I just now seen that, that looks good , somebody has picked something up from somewhere. - - Now as I previously stated earlier that he would not land at Oklahoma St, & still say that, but now to go off what he said about KU after his visit, people was asking why I felt that way - well now not only am I going from the statements he made- -& now picking up CB"S - and for the one's going off the CB and Oklahoma St - umm ya - -Oklahoma St went from leading in the CB to now last in the CB'S.
I'm still not putting a lot into the CB - BUT - - they do follow the trend of what the way he sounded after his visit to KU. - -To me from what he said about his visit to KU - just sounds like we are in a good spot with him. - -Usually when you start seeing a lot of CB'S when there is smoke - -there is fire. - Somebody has picked up on something. - -We shall see. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
To follow up on McCormack , just picked up our 4th CB of the day for him to land here. - Jerry Meyer just predicted KU- -ummm something up? - - Something must be goin on , someone maybe caught wind of something. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Jerry Meyer is pretty legit, I pay attention to what he picks as he usually makes his own decisions vs just seeing what everyone else does and doing the same thing. This is certainly a good sign.
@RockkChalkk Well read from the Shiver where we was suppose to visit him today - -maybe something came from that? - -I dunno hope. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
And yet still ANOTHER CB for KU with McCormack - our 5th today. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Jerry Meyer had McCormack going to OSU; this is big positive development for KU, no doubt about it.
KU has always been in deep with McCormack, good to see some crystal ball action though.
Things are heating up in another croooootment. The parts they are a movin'.
sounds great. Big Dave would be a great addition to the team. It also means Doke isn't coming back (sad face)
KU Picked up two CB picks for Immanuel Quickley yesterday too. Hmmm.
I know nothing about recruiting other than Silvio DeSousa is KU's to lose.
RockkChalkk said:
KU Picked up two CB picks for Immanuel Quickley yesterday too. Hmmm.
Would have felt better about those if it was Slater or Meyer. Instead it was the whack job (to put it nicely) from Maryland's site and a Miami insider.
@RockkChalkk Ya I seen that this morning too. - -what the hell is up with that? The recruiting scene is going whacko right now. - been thought of is Quickley is a lock to UK - I think he still is but we won't know for sure I guess until he commits. - -I suppose anything would be possible.
Play this out as a weird scenario - -look at this - for some Bizarre reason Quickley ends up let's say at KU , as we know Kentucky is now trying to step in and ssteal Grimes , so Grimes ends up at Kentucky - - -Quickley ends up at KU - -and Dotson ends up at Florida how crazy would that be? Just makes you wonder why these two guys made predictions for Quickley and KU. - It was Jeff Enman- Maryland Insider and then a guy named Charlie Strauzer - -I dunno.
Saw this morning KU ended up with 7 CB'S for McCormack yesterday - -got to be something there just has to be - and him coming in for late night? - -time to close the deal. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BeddieKU23 I would have too , but who knows in this crazy world of whacky recruiting. - -I still think he is a lock for Kentucky but, what goes on in a 18-19 yr old kids head ya know? - -Can change their mind faster then a woman changes her clothes 36 times in one day lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Leverage to get a bigger payout from Kentucky... :smiley:
@JayHawkFanToo I just saw where the Maryland insider changed his pick back to Kentucky lmao. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
looks like the word is out. a whole slew of cb's for Dave today
BShark said:
Things are heating up in another croooootment. The parts they are a movin'.
Throw us a bone..........need the info...:)
@BeddieKU23 Sure looks like it. - -I counted 4 so far today as you said, including one from slater , that makes it 11 CB'S that I've seen in like the last 24 hours, so at least that's some possible good news right? - got a question , maybe you can help is McCormack a fluid guy/ smooth? haven't really seen a lot of video on him -do you know? - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Don’t be surprised if McCormack commits after Late Night. Also, Quickley is going to Kentucky. No idea where the KU buzz came from, but it seems to just be a rumor.
Ummmm , still waitin for that bone B-shark - - you got some inside poop? - who is the other crootment lol? - -let us have the scoop there - -JUMPIN GEE HOSSA FATS lol -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@FarmerJayhawk People were getting buzz from CB' picks just two off 247 sports , but one of those already changed his pick back to Kentucky. - Quickly pretty well been seen as a Kentucky commit for quite some time , nothings changed. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I just meant McCormack guys sorry for the confusion. Seems pretty obvious that something leaked/got out with this big of a crystal ball run.
Btw Dotson to UF looks done.
Michael Devoe a 4* PG from Florida meets with coach White and cancels his UF visit. Wanted Florida big time. Now after the cancellation he says he will announce in a couple days and everyone switches their cb picks to Georgia Tech.
Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. Sucks!
Howard was in to visit McCormack yesterday and will be in Texas to see Grimes today. If Howard closes on both, it's probably time for even his most fervent detractors to shut up about him.
@BShark Ya seems like your right, someone slipped somewhere maybe. - -But I have to try and keep things in check, as we all know we get to feeling good - - confident about a recruit and then get screwed in the end - -pretty tired of getting my hopes up and then just not even getting kissed in the end. -But looks good at this point. - I like someone else said I think if things keep going the way they are wouldn't be surprised to see maybe him commit shortly after his late night visit. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BShark Dammm man , that is just so crazy. - - -Another Ayton. All we had seen in this recruitment was how heavy a KU lean he was, clear back from last year. - -I just don't get these guys. Welp I sure hope we can put the hammer on Grimes , secure him.
So lets look at this. - -In reality how many do we feel we gonna need to fill for next year? - - - We know Devonte is gone , We know SVI is gone , We know Newman is gone. - -So there is three open , pretty good chance Doke is gone , so possible four - - - then we come to Preston ? - - good year , more then likely gone. - -So my best guess is we looking a reasonably good chance at least of 5 open? - -then didn't we still have a open Scholi from this year? - -that would make six if we did. - -Got some work to do.
If we could land Grimes - - De Sousa - -And McCormack - -that would be pretty solid , but would need a couple of others to complete right? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Well if we lose 6, yea we will need more guys. 1 scholarship short as is, PLUS we lose 6 guys.
Going to need to land at least 5 players. Leaves room to pick up a transfer or 2, something I believe Self will continue doing on a yearly basis at this point.
One thing I'll say about McCormack - -he is a big boy. 6'9 - - -290. Like 247 said in the article about how we are trending for him , we pair him with De -Sousa that's a pretty physical dual , they talk about how bout like to mix it up, not a bad thing - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Hawk8086 said:
@BShark So where does that leave us as far as a PG? Haven't all the others been leaning elsewhere?
Hope that they can get back in with Ayo. Ship has probably sailed there and has definitely sailed with Carey, Locke etc...
Grimes isn't a PG, but he would still be huge to land and serviceable. Moore, Garrett and Grimes is enough ball handling if it ends up that the other guard signing would be a developmental type. Maybe look at grad transfers. Names will pop up in terms of recruits and grad transfers, your guess is about as good as mine for what those names will be.
A guy who's not highly ranked (60ish) but is in Des Moines is Tyger Campbell. Personally, I'm surprised we didn't swoop in and really make a push on him hard. I just checked 247 and he's not signed and doesn't look like a commitment is imminent. We are all in on Dotson (who live in NC?) I guess. That never made sense to me. I'd rather have the Campbell in the hand, than the Dotson in the bush. But .... we win all the time, and Self makes those decisions. So perhaps this is just irrelevant chatter.
@HighEliteMajor Wouldn't be a bad idea. There were some MSU rumours but the MSU people have said MSU is no longer interested. Which does make sense because they will have 2 other PG on their roster.
Campbell was committed to DePaul for a while. We recruited his teammates but not him. I also thought he was a 2019 kid. He's good from the games I saw but he was a bit small for what Self likes. Maybe there is some interest at some point but it doesn't seem like he's trying to recruit himself towards KU either
@BeddieKU23 @BShark Just checked .. he reclassified to 2018. I first heard of him from a friend that saw him play in a tourney in Columbia or Hutch -- some tourney close to KC (can't remember which one). Said he was the best player on the floor.
Another name will come up.
I'm not so sure that the Quickley thing is dead yet. Adidas guy. Adidas could be moving heaven and earth behind the scenes to get the Quickley/Zion show to come to Lawrence.
Every year, I think to myself, how has Bill Self never landed an elite PG? He has clearly developed them extremely well. Sherron Collins should have had a career trajectory just like Ty Lawsons, if you know, he didn't get fat. Mario made it. Robinson played overseas for forever. DG and Frank were ranked 100ish and will be playing in the league. He made Tyshawn an All-American. Yet, he just can't land an elite PG. It's almost like he sold his soul or something and his punishment from the basketball Gods is Tyler and never landing a OAD PG.
And then I think, Adidas will hand him one when the timing is right. But, alas, another year passes and we will be without an elite PG recruit on the roster. While somehow UK can secure a PG commit while having 2 on the roster already. Neither of whom will be going pro after this season. Dumbfounds me. Recruiting is the least logical thing I have ever followed. Which makes it by far one of the most frustrating things in sports...
@BeddieKU23 well how much smaller could this Campbell kid be then Jacobs? - -saying might be a bit small - -can't be any smaller then 5'10/ -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Smaller guards that played for Self (including the already committed Jacobs) have been extremely athletic. Not sure where Tyger is at athletically. Never looked into him much.
@Kcmatt7 Agree of course other names will come up it just really sucks with Dotson given the time KU sunk into this one (heavily on him early) and that none of the other "big boys" swooped in, it's freaking Florida.
I hope Dotson will look at his college choice as a business decision. One program is way more likely than the other to be always be in the national spotlight, likely being ranked top 5 most of the year, conference champions, consideration for #1 seed, poised for a final 4 run, etc. And with all of that comes mega publicity. Being the quarterback of that team puts him front and center of that spotlight. When you are basically auditioning yourself to get a job at the next level, you should want to be on the big stage.
Jerry Meyer said on twitter that the reason for all of the David McCormack CB picks in the last two days was "Intel getting out." When asked if it was reliable intel he responded saying "Guess we will find out. Reliable to me but reliable enough to me to change my pick to Kansas. Wouldn't say intel if thought unreliable."
Good stuff.
Immanuel Quickley making his announcement tomorrow at 6:00pm. This has been viewed to be a heavy heavy heavy lean for UK for a loooong time. It will either be KU or UK. While small, I do think KU has a chance. He officially visited UK last weekend. Norm was in town to visit with him today. This is an Adidas kid, not sure if it matters in this case but never know. Its a big piece off the board, we shall find out soon.
@RockkChalkk Well it at least will possibly put other pieces into play, I am pretty sure we all know he is UKbound - -no shocker there, more players seem to be committing early this year - -or maybe it's just me. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Welcome and we expect you to pack phone inside the uniforms and check in from inside the huddle during games, okay?
Rock Chalk!
jayballer54 said:
@BeddieKU23 well how much smaller could this Campbell kid be then Jacobs? - -saying might be a bit small - -can't be any smaller then 5'10/ -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
With his hair it makes him much taller. Campbell is a twig though and unless he's filled out his body or figured out how to jump higher he's not in the mold of Mason or Jacobs that make up for being small with ridiculous athletic ability.
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 @BShark Just checked .. he reclassified to 2018. I first heard of him from a friend that saw him play in a tourney in Columbia or Hutch -- some tourney close to KC (can't remember which one). Said he was the best player on the floor.
He's a very good floor leader. Definite starter at the College level. I've seen some of his HS games on TV and he's a gamer. He just lacks some things Self usually goes after (mainly athletic ability). The difference between him and Dotson for example is noticeable to me. But we seem to have lost the Dotson sweepstakes and now sit yet again looking for another ball-handler.
RockkChalkk said:
Immanuel Quickley making his announcement tomorrow at 6:00pm. This has been viewed to be a heavy heavy heavy lean for UK for a loooong time. It will either be KU or UK. While small, I do think KU has a chance. He officially visited UK last weekend. Norm was in town to visit with him today. This is an Adidas kid, not sure if it matters in this case but never know. Its a big piece off the board, we shall find out soon.
He's announcing for Kentucky as fuel for Cal to use with Zion this weekend. This has been engineered in such a way to use as bait. I have no doubts KU pressed hard this week but we would have heard otherwise if he was going to KU.
RockkChalkk said:
I hope Dotson will look at his college choice as a business decision. One program is way more likely than the other to be always be in the national spotlight, likely being ranked top 5 most of the year, conference champions, consideration for #1 seed, poised for a final 4 run, etc. And with all of that comes mega publicity. Being the quarterback of that team puts him front and center of that spotlight. When you are basically auditioning yourself to get a job at the next level, you should want to be on the big stage.
From everything I've read Dotson and his family have been a refreshing case of a family well aware of their decision and not letting outside influence dictate where he's going. If that was the case Adidas would have locked him up in Vegas this summer with Zion.
The starting spot at Florida is available. Mike White has reshaped Florida to compete with Kentucky again in the SEC. He'll be on TV in a conference that gets plenty of attention. Going to Florida is a business decision if you look at it as well.
I still think the presence of Charlie Moore hurt KU's overall pitch. They probably didn't believe he'd start from day 1 over him given Self's history. If Moore wasn't at KU elite PG's would have signed here
@BeddieKU23 So you really think Charlie Moore cost us an elite point guard? I'm not holding a high opinion of Moore at the moment -- more of a middling/average opinion. So that just kind of makes me sick.
BeddieKU23 said:
jayballer54 said:
@BeddieKU23 well how much smaller could this Campbell kid be then Jacobs? - -saying might be a bit small - -can't be any smaller then 5'10/ -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
With his hair it makes him much taller. Campbell is a twig though and unless he's filled out his body or figured out how to jump higher he's not in the mold of Mason or Jacobs that make up for being small with ridiculous athletic ability.
Even Sherron was pretty athletic before he got fat.
@HighEliteMajor Where were you using for rankings? I remember Mason was around #50 on 247 which was the highest anywhere but his composite rating was still super low, under 100 and I don't recall Graham being near top 30 anywhere. He was 100-ish in 247 ranking and their composite. Vick oddly enough I do remember had some high rankings.
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 So you really think Charlie Moore cost us an elite point guard? I'm not holding a high opinion of Moore at the moment -- more of a middling/average opinion. So that just kind of makes me sick.
Completely agree. We need Moore to text his buddy Ayo now.
Btw as for Quickley the kid is dyed in the wool Kentucky truuuuuuuuuue blue. You guys know how much Jacobs loves KU, well Quickley loves UK that much. He just hadn't committed already because Cal has been using him as a recruiting tool which looks better if he isn't officially committed.
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 So you really think Charlie Moore cost us an elite point guard? I'm not holding a high opinion of Moore at the moment -- more of a middling/average opinion. So that just kind of makes me sick.
Yes I do, I remember, faintly, stating such after we landed Moore out of the blue. Maybe I'll look to find it. Maybe I'm reaching for straws with that statement but if Charlie Moore wasn't on the roster wouldn't KU have unlimited playing time to sell at both a starting PG spot and a backup position to the Elites?
All things being equal between Florida & KU in his recruitment, Florida has a graduating PG with just one other PG on the roster, an incoming freshman ranked #256th. KU has a graduating PG and a transfer, Moore was a Top 100 kid in 2016 who started as a freshman at Cal. It's not out of the realm to think the Dotson's think he's in line to start at KU next year which limits his potential as a freshman. The Dotson's have made it clear they want the ball, not to be the side-show to another.
Further after the 2016 recruiting cycle misses on Trae Young & Sexton for similar circumstances, both felt returning players (Graham, Newman) stood in their way. They both found situations they were guaranteed to start without a upperclassmen in the way. It seems Devon will seek the same situation.
BeddieKU23 said:
RockkChalkk said:
I hope Dotson will look at his college choice as a business decision. One program is way more likely than the other to be always be in the national spotlight, likely being ranked top 5 most of the year, conference champions, consideration for #1 seed, poised for a final 4 run, etc. And with all of that comes mega publicity. Being the quarterback of that team puts him front and center of that spotlight. When you are basically auditioning yourself to get a job at the next level, you should want to be on the big stage.
From everything I've read Dotson and his family have been a refreshing case of a family well aware of their decision and not letting outside influence dictate where he's going. If that was the case Adidas would have locked him up in Vegas this summer with Zion.
The starting spot at Florida is available. Mike White has reshaped Florida to compete with Kentucky again in the SEC. He'll be on TV in a conference that gets plenty of attention. Going to Florida is a business decision if you look at it as well.
I still think the presence of Charlie Moore hurt KU's overall pitch. They probably didn't believe he'd start from day 1 over him given Self's history. If Moore wasn't at KU elite PG's would have signed here
See and this is where I have a problem with that whole approach , and attitude from player - I just don't get it. -You say That the Dotson family or Devon probably didn't think he would start here at KU from day 1. My feeling on this IF you as a player , a future recruit if you got that fire in your stomach , that competiveness , the desire - -if you are suppose to be one of the elite pg in the nation , why would you shy away from competition and proving YOUR the one who deserves to start & be that guy that should have the ball in your hands from day 1? - -Any supposed elite PG or ANY player shouldn't be or would I want them to be a guy that would shy away from competition. - If your as good as you think you are , if your as good and feel you should come in and start from day 1, then back your game up - just don't talk the game - - -do the game.
If it was me as a recruit , I wouldn't give a dam who was there, if I felt like I should be able to come right in and have the ball , then no matter who was there my whole approach would be let's do this - -let me show you, what these guys afraid their inflated ego's take a hit? - -maybe find out they quite as good as what they thought? They find out they might have to actually prove they belong? - To me if a kid runs because of another player at that position and afraid to work and prove he deserves if that is what the Coach wants to see - -Then I guess it's better he does go somewhere else. - -I want a kid who has that fire and competiveness who is willing to work - not a kid who just want his spot given to him - -a kid who wants someone to stroke his ego - -we don't need that type of kid. I want a kid with the attitude towards the others like HEY don't hate the player - -hate the game. -I will never understand a highly rated player that's afraid of a challenge - -nothing is just given to you in life - a real person reaches out and takes what they want. - -It's that time for someone to get in Devon's ear and say " Don't get Scared now " Act like you got a pair, stand up and prove you belong.
Hell if you want to be real - - the starting spot will be available here too next season. I don't feel is just going to automatically tell Charlie Moore that you have the spot given next year. Again someone going to have to step up and earn that spot. - Why not Devon? Charlie Moore is not that good where he just automatically has that spot locked up , so Devon come in and compete for the spot , show people you are as good as you think you are. - -As far as being on TV not even close. KU on National TV far more then you will be at Florida - ALOT more National exposure .Ya sure Devon might be on the SEC Channel sometimes - -but National almost weekly such as ESPN - -ESPN 2 - - ESPNU - - CBS ya pretty much weekly I one spot or another here, not even close. - -As far as conference - the better conference, - -who in the SEC other then Kentucky is better? - Tradition? - -KU hands down. - -Coach? - -KU hands down. - -Basketball atmosphere ? - -KU hands down. - -I'll never understand why a kid shies away from competition if that's the reason. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@HighEliteMajor pretty much what I posted in my reply to the statement. - -Charlie Moore in no way if I were a recruit would scare me away if I wanted to come. - -I'd come in and compete - If I were as good as I thought I would have no problem battling Charlie Moore for the spot. - -why should he scare ANY elite pg guards off? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Charlie Moore has to be a factor in this. Dotson sort of "blew up" this summer comparably to what recruiting scouts thought of him coming into the summer. He was hovering in that Top 50 range, now he's top 25ish.
He knows he's good, people have noticed and he's going to go somewhere where he can start from day 1. It's not just coming in as a freshman and having the spot to yourself, its the what if after as well, if Dotson isn't NBA ready after his freshman year he wants the spot as a Soph etc. That way if Florida recruits other PG's he knows he has the upper hand against them. At KU there is no telling if Moore could improve to the point where Self plays him over Dotson or pushes Dotson for playing time. What if Grimes signs as expected. I'm sure the Dotson family is aware Grimes is likely ending up at KU where he takes the SG spot or secondary ball-handling position. I had thought there was room for everyone but its clear, at least to me, Charlie Moore is part of the reason Florida has been able to gain the upper hand.
Some sources of Florida now saying it will be Maryland.. Under Armour and his friend/Maryland Commit Wiggins playing a part.. Interesting
Grimes is probably wanting to see how Newman works out at KU. Grimes and Newman are actually fairly similar players. Both are too small to play the 2 in the NBA, but both have NBA level skills - they just have to start sliding over to the point.
So Grimes is probably watching to see how Self utilizes Newman this year. Grimes is an excellent passer - good vision, good feel. He's not necessarily a "natural PG" in the Chris Paul mode, but he's a PG in the John Wall-Russell Westbrook category - scorer that can handle and get other people involved.
Newman is really the first player like that to play under Self since his Illinois days. I think Grimes wants to find out if Newman capitalizes on his talent at KU. If he does, there's no reason for Grimes not to come on down. If that happens, I don't think we will even remember that we didn't land Dotson.
@BeddieKU23 hmmmm, well if his visit went over that well - -not saying it didn't , finding it kind of strange that now a week later, we haven't really seen any CB movement to Florida. Even after a week, I would of thought you would of seen a pretty big shift by now - -only a couple. - Article said he is weighing is options, which means to me he is still not solidly sold on Florida. Still an open ball game I think - -far from over If he is that committed to Florida now - -why not just come out and announce. We are STILL in this thing bottom line. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG
@BeddieKU23 Wow what a whacky world recruiting is , these kids I tell ya. - -I still say we are in it. - - I don't see Maryland hell my dam head is spinning to fast for this old man lol. - - - that would be kind of like an Ayton thing, coming out of no where, Never heard anything serious about Maryland - -I don't see it. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
David McCormack is announcing Sunday. Gotta say I like the timing...
@justanotherfan Your writing off the Dotson scenario to soon. - -If you read BeddieKu23 - last post you now see where some are saying NOW it could be Maryland. - -Kid is not sold yet , big reason why he is weighing his options still. - -KU is still in this thick , take it to the bank, what's the ol adage - - it's not over til the fat lady sings? - -well she hasn't even started to stretch her vocal cords yet. -- ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BAB
BShark said:
David McCormack is announcing Sunday. Gotta say I like the timing...
AWSOMENESS. - -that sounds good. - where did you read that? - - Unless he cancelled his late night visit got to be good. - Looking at the scenario , made his un-official here, plus unless he cancelled his visit for late night here - the things he had to say about Ku after his visit - -the recent CB movement -and it is like two weeks yet before he was scheduled to visit Okla State , and he is announcing Sunday?
I know never count your chicklets before they hatch - - -BUT you would have to think. - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BShark Here is the rivals link I found on Graham .. 36. He was of course originally 2013 class, and was not in the top 100 from what I have seen.
https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2014/devonte-graham-9850 ↗
BShark said:
David McCormack is announcing Sunday. Gotta say I like the timing...
BOOM
I'm feelin' the McCormack thing.
This is another homerun hit for the staff. Thanks to Billy Preston as well.
This is some craziness. So @BeddieKU23 thinks Moore is keeping some of the Guard recruits from committing. Sadly I think it could be right. However, come on man, if you are Dotson or Grimes how can you be scared of competing against a vertically challenged guy that was barely in the top 100? I'm not trying to knock Moore, its just fact. If these recruits really fancy themselves as NBA caliber players, they are going to have to compete against others much better than Moore to make it. If they decide to take Easy Street and not challenge themselves along the way I'm thinking there will be a rude awakening one day.
So if the hypothesis is true, how come it doesn't seem to apply to the big men? De Souza has committed, Big Dave seems to be ready to do the same, it didn't seem to bother them. There is much more room at the guard spot, meaning less returning players and Self has shown he will mostly play three guards and even 4 at a time if his personnel dictates it. It seems like an illogical conclusion to reach but nobody ever said logic would decide where these kids choose to go.
Like the use of Easy Street, isn't that the same philosphy Sexton and Young took in the 2016 class. Instead of competing with Graham and Newman they took the path to the least resistance. Self pressed hard on both to come to KU. He's done the same to Dotson/Grimes this season. Not illogical to think both take the illogical path again. Marquette is recruiting Grimes with their entire staff, Texas wants Grimes in state, Calipari is selling the NBA dream. We just have no idea how these kids think, what motivates them, how afraid they are of competition.
@BeddieKU23 McCormick and De-Sousa makes a very sweet pair. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I don't know how credible the Florida people claiming all this Dotson movement. Seems illogical and there's a whole bunch of other news he/she claims to know about all their other targets going to other schools. Seems very unlikely their top target at PG, SF, PF all said No to Florida on the same day..I'm not buying it but their fanbase is running with some stuff
@RockkChalkk There is a huge difference between wanting to compete on court against the best, from wanting to compete for playing time against kids who might not be as talented on court but are willing to work harder and do even more than the coaches ask.
Not saying this is what is happening, only that it can explain why someone could shy away from trying to beat Moore if he is in the Mason mold (remember FM's training video?).
HighEliteMajor said:
@BShark Here is the rivals link I found on Graham .. 36. He was of course originally 2013 class, and was not in the top 100 from what I have seen.
https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/2014/devonte-graham-9850 ↗
Thanks. It's crazy sometimes the discrepancy between the sites.
I already mentioned 247 and composite but ESPN, Graham was unranked but 4 stars. Supposedly 41 on Scout but I don't remember him being that high on Scout...wonder if they changed it well after the fact.
But it doesn't really matter, Graham is a great Jayhawk, that's what matters.
BeddieKU23 said:
This is another homerun hit for the staff. Thanks to Billy Preston as well.
Now we want things to go well. Adding Oak Hill to the good ins list along with Mac Irvin Fire, Brewster and IMG would be :fire: :fire: :fire:
@BeddieKU23 - - All I have to say is , sit back and watch. - -This is far from a done deal to Florida. -- I'm not so fast to accept defeat , Again after a week from being removed from his visit to Florida, if he was at the juncture where welp everyone up and saying Florida got him locked up - - -- - -it's over , - - maybe it is - -maybe it isn't. Again one of my questions would be is why aren't we seeing a lot more CB movement to Florida - just like McCormack did with us when we became the heavy lean? - - We saw a lot of CB movement to us. - - It's been a week since his visit to Florida and yet we aren't seeing very much movement or changing of the CB at all - why not? - if he suddenly became so solid for Florida - -why no movement. The big Florida insider was so sure but yet we have seen nothing or much , why not? - Why if he was rock solid on Florida after his visit why like it was stated in the article , why is he weighing his options? - - If it was a done deal to Florida like some are trying to say - - no options to weigh - -he set on Florida then just announce like Quickley - De-Sousa , and others.
Again let's just see - I'm tellin ya we are still right there for Devon. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
RockkChalkk said:
So if the hypothesis is true, how come it doesn't seem to apply to the big men? De Souza has committed, Big Dave seems to be ready to do the same, it didn't seem to bother them. There is much more room at the guard spot, meaning less returning players and Self has shown he will mostly play three guards and even 4 at a time if his personnel dictates it. It seems like an illogical conclusion to reach but nobody ever said logic would decide where these kids choose to go.
If you assume Bill is telling recruits that Preston and Doke are gone after this year, it does make some sense. Assuming the info is good and McCormack picks KU one of De Sousa and McCormack will be a back-up though, because Dedric is starting barring injury. Of course being the third big on a Self team still means solid minutes if he trusts you.
@BShark \just as a little more to go along about these recruiting sites and the differences , some of the players KU is in the recruit's top 5 picks in the class of 2019 these sites are big time difference on some.
Take for example Rivals has Markese as the # 88 player in the Nation - - -247 has him as the # 74 player in the Nation. - - -Marcedus Leech -Rivals has him as the # 84 player in the Nation. - - -247 has him as the # 57 ranked player in the Nation. -on the other side - -Malik Hall -- rivals has him as the # 55 ranked player in the Nation - - 247 has him as the # 92 ranked player in the /nation - -and then one other one Grant Sherfield -- -Rivals has him as the # 54 ranked player in the Nation - - 247 has him as the # 90 ranked player in the Nation.
I don't understand what some of these services are seeing or not seeing in the same players, how do they get such a huge difference - -crazy. -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Leech will go to UK if offered fwiw.
19 is going to be an interesting class. I really really like Malik Hall's game but is there room for him with JRE and Chandler Lawson being likely takes? So much talent with legit, strong KU ties in the class. Gotta close em.
Keeping my eye on Samuell Williamson who I mentioned awhile back. KU legacy recruit. KU had been by far his best offer but others have taken notice of his big summer. Now a top 150 recruit and picked up offers from OU, TAMU, LSU and Marquette.
The one that has claimed Dotson to Florida isn't chiming in on what appears to be a Florida fan gone mad. He did say if he didn't commit in the next week that could open the door for someone else. It's clear the Dotson's are taking more time then anyone has expected. Recruiting circles said he would be done just after August. He went on vacation came back and took visits. The hurricane further pushed it out. The Florida visit, now a possible Maryland visit if they decide to do that next week. Who knows. I have no more speculating to make on this one
BeddieKU23 said:
The one that has claimed Dotson to Florida isn't chiming in on what appears to be a Florida fan gone mad. He did say if he didn't commit in the next week that could open the door for someone else. It's clear the Dotson's are taking more time then anyone has expected. Recruiting circles said he would be done just after August. He went on vacation came back and took visits. The hurricane further pushed it out. The Florida visit, now a possible Maryland visit if they decide to do that next week. Who knows. I have no more speculating to make on this one
Yeah, Dotson situation is crazy.
This is from some random poster on the phog...
"Dotson situation remains wide open. He will likely visit Maryland.
He didnt have a great official visit at KU."
Same poster said his family is pushing him to Florida.
I have now read from multiple places that Dotson's visit to KU sucked. None are super credible and it could be parroting but it was on all different sites by different user names. Could be complete bs who really knows? We will likely never know exactly why if true.
More Dotson stuff from another Phog poster BigCKU...
His family is pushing him to stay on the East coast and Florida is getting the most run from them. Haven't heard anything about coaches. He personally likes KU a little more than Florida and had his family signed off on KU he probably would have committed months ago. I can't speak on how his visit with from his side but from KU side it didn't go any different than 99% of recruits visits.
One thing I was told with the Dotson recruitment is obviously Self wasn't able to win over the family like he does in most recruitments. Charming the family is one of Self's best attributes on the recruiting trail but every now and then Self just is unable to do it. Dotson is one of those recruitments.
Those are from my KU sources. One is someone who works at the school and worked on the weekends for me in Topeka this past summer. The other is a family member who is close to the program and more specifically close to several of the KU boosters. Obviously not going to divulge names so don't try.
The Florida and Maryland guys have been saying that Florida has got in very strongly with the family over the other schools. The Mom wants him close to home. The father wants close to home and wants his son to start immediately.
BShark said:
Leech will go to UK if offered fwiw.
19 is going to be an interesting class. I really really like Malik Hall's game but is there room for him with JRE and Chandler Lawson being likely takes? So much talent with legit, strong KU ties in the class. Gotta close em.
Keeping my eye on Samuell Williamson who I mentioned awhile back. KU legacy recruit. KU had been by far his best offer but others have taken notice of his big summer. Now a top 150 recruit and picked up offers from OU, TAMU, LSU and Marquette.
Hmmm, really haven't heard anything on Williamson. Looked and he is not on either Rivals - -or 247 top 100 recruits for 2019. While I was killing time , I decided to go to the different sites and check these guys out for 2019. - Went through the list of both Rivals and 247 top 100
So with having said that as far as the 2019 recruits go Ku is listed as one of the top 5 schools on 21 out of the 100 top 100 recruits, each one of these 21 list KU as one of their top 5 schools we are on the following: # 3 , 4 , 5, 6, 7, 10 , 11 , 16 , 17 , 18 , 23 , 27 , 28 , 32 , 34 ,38 , 54 ,55 ,74 ,84, and the our commit # 88 Markese.
KU leads on 7 of these kids at the present, they are as follows Hurt ( we know that's no longer the case ) - - -Robinson Earl - - -Zach Harvey- - - -Chandler Lawson - - -Grant Sherfield - - - Malik Hall - - - & Marcedus Leech. - - Then we are in a deadlock for # 32 Josh Green 50/50 with UCLA. - -As far as Marcedus Leech goes, you saying Kentucky. - -He is not even listing Kentucky as one of his top 5 Schools. - His Five are KU - - -Iowa State - - -LSU- - - -Miami - - & Missouri. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Leech called UK his dream school. That being said he visited and Cal did NOT offer, so if UK never offers, KU has a real shot.
There are now about 30 insiders claiming Dotson information. Some people should just not be allowed to post on message boards.
Imo KU has an excellent chance at JRE, Chandler, Harvey and Hall in terms of kids that I think could announce committing to KU whenever they want.
@BShark With Graham, ESPN would have taken him out of the 2013 rankings because he went to prep school (but he might have been too low to include anyway at that point). And they don't include prep school guys in rankings for their new class -- so he's not in 2014 (though he is listed as four stars). Odd.
But hey, we know he's good. Every bit that #36.
Here is the 247 profile of S Williamson for you @jayballer54 http://247sports.com/player/samuell-williamson-46043096 ↗
I think he has a wait and see offer. Kid was previously unranked with only total crap offers at the time KU offered. Picking up some actually solid offers lately. As previously mentioned his mom and big bro graduated from KU so if KU presses, gotta think they can get it done.
@BeddieKU23 LOL, suddenly they have all become experts right my friend? -- I hear you 100%. - -where are you getting all this from bud? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
BShark said:
Imo KU has an excellent chance at JRE, Chandler, Harvey and Hall in terms of kids that I think could announce committing to KU whenever they want.
More Lawsons coming for late night Chandler & Johnathan - I think I had herd that Johnathan might be the best of the group.
One thing though DJ Jeffries shows no interest in us right now - -a cousin right? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
McCormack pitch seems pretty simple. Give him a before and after picture of Doke. Should have been enough to seal the deal right there.
jayballer54 said:
@BShark Well thanks for that info -- - Tell me have you ever heard anything on this Grant Sherfield? - - -I know he is a 6'2 shooting guard out of Texas you heard any inside on him? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
He's actually from Wichita originally. I remember reading that he was a bit upset that KU took a commitment from Jacobs.
I think it boils down to how many guards does KU need in the class. Jacobs already committed and a good shot at Harvey, that's already two guards, might not need more than that.
Personally, as a third guard take I'd favour Josh Green or Jalen Lecque if KU could real either in. Sherfield isn't a bad player by any means, and likely multiple years.
jayballer54 said:
@BeddieKU23 LOL, suddenly they have all become experts right my friend? -- I hear you 100%. - -where are you getting all this from bud? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
What is this in reference to? If you tell me that, I can answer.
If you mean Leech then this: http://247sports.com/Article/Kentucky-Wildcats-hosting-top-50-junior-Marcedus-Leech-for-unoff-53378575 ↗
"That's been my dream since I was a kid. If I get that offer, they’ll be on the top of my list," Leech said. "I like everything. I like how they play, how they get up and down. I like Coach [John] Calipari. He does a lot with his guys and I'm looking forward to my visit there."
Kcmatt7 said:
McCormack pitch seems pretty simple. Give him a before and after picture of Doke. Should have been enough to seal the deal right there.
Not sure it mattered in this one but Embiid is still paying dividends too. KU offered 7' Serbian stud Balsa Koprivica and when he tweeted about the offer he used a picture of Embiid, lol.
@BShark No when I made that post I was referring about BeddieKu23 post, saying that suddenly there was like 30 Florida insiders talking about Dotson - -and BeddieKu23 saying people lie that shouldn't be allowed on the boards lol that's what I was referring to. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@RockkChalkk interesting question about fear of commitment in guards vs big men when in situations that involve competition. Maybe guards need to start to be seen and drafted while bigs can be drafted on height and athleticism alone, regardless of PT?
approxinfinity said:
@RockkChalkk interesting question about fear of commitment in guards vs big men when in situations that involve competition. Maybe guards need to start to be seen and drafted while bigs can be drafted on height and athleticism alone, regardless of PT?
Cheick Diallo agrees.
NBA scouts will always be tempted by height and potential.
Quickley officially to UK and McCormack expected to announce tomorrow, most likely for KU.
Front court will be in great shape and should discourage Grimes from UK.
I think Grimes ends up at KU anyway but what we really want to see is Keldon Johnson go to UK.
Worth noting that McCormack played on the same AAU team that Andrew White and Frank Mason did.
Grimes and McCormack to KU? Sold.
HighEliteMajor said:
Grimes and McCormack to KU? Sold.
Provided it does shake out this way, I think that covers KU's needs out of this class. Shores up the front court* and adds a ball handling guard.
*Regardless of what anyone thinks or how ready Preston may or may not be to go pro, Self straight up told recruits that he won't be here next year. McCormack himself mentioned it awhile back after his visit.
So then we get into wants. I think the staff wants a pure PG, a guy that can run the show. Dotson would be ideal, and from what I've read recently he is keeping his recruitment open.
Then you could swing for the fences with Zion and add developmental prospects as needed depending on who leaves early.
Slater posting some stuff about Zion.
Talking about Zion's mother not wanting him to be far away from home. What is it lately and KU recruits being negatively recruited by their mothers. Good lord let your son do what he wants!
FYI Zion didn't make it to Kentucky for his visit due to personal reasons. Makes you wonder whether he'll be at Late Night..
General news tangentially related to KU: after news leaked about McCormack and KU, Ian Steere decommitted from Creighton and got some crystal ball picks for NC State. Brutal for Creighton.
BeddieKU23 said:
Slater posting some stuff about Zion.
Talking about Zion's mother not wanting him to be far away from home. What is it lately and KU recruits being negatively recruited by their mothers. Good lord let your son do what he wants!
Josh Jackson and Billy Preston though!
Honestly it's very important to recruit the parents. Self is typically very good at this.
I would at least understand it with Zion. Kansas is very far from SC and it's just one year. Would be hilarious if he picked Clemson.
This will change, so only relevant until it changes, but the offers compared to the player ranking here LOL: http://247sports.com/player/filip-petrusev-46041501 ↗
KU is full up in the post or I'd say they should be very interested in him. I'd be on him being top 50 by the time it's all said and done.
@BeddieKU23 Well, for one thing, not all mothers can move to Lawrence to see their kids play. I think being able to see your kid prove himself on a national stage would be pretty important to most parents. Everyone else gets to weigh in. Why not mothers?
@mayjay not like she couldn't watch literally every game from her living room... And half of his games will be 5-6 hours away at the closest. The closeness logic has dumbfounded me ever since ESPN3 started airing literally every game.
Now if we are getting negatively recruited toward mothers because of our problems last year, makes sense. I know I would be if I were an opposing coach.
We all know his one year in College is meaningless in the bigger picture for Zion. He's a perfect example of someone who would go to the NBA out of HS. It's his brand, his following, his star potential that would be advantageous to KU for his one year.
If mom is not on board of him leaving the state we all know what happens..
@BeddieKU23 Think of it as the last time Mom might be able to be a big part of his life. These kids have already lived a life different from what other HS kids have. I am only saying it is legit for parents to express their wishes, too. "Family over everything" doesn't only apply to teams. Somehow I think Zion will be successful wherever he wants to go. Let's not be like UK fans and start acting like there is something wrong with the priorities of players who consider going somewhere else.
jayballer54 said:
@BShark But what does that have anything to do with KU ? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
NC State was one of the main competitors for McCormack. Took an official there and their coach visited McCormack I think more than once. Just an example of the domino effect that can sometimes happen in recruiting.
Agreed, I guess I wasn't trying to dismiss the importance family should have in their child's life and decision making.
We've seen what happens when guidance is absent (Mitchell Robinson).
Zion has a tight nit family from everything we've seen reported. Most parents do want their child close to home. It's natural.
I know I faced the same dilemma when I was going to College, my parents didn't support me going out of state even as a non-athlete. I ended up staying closer to home, things worked out. But when your young you have these dreams. We can all forget that these kids are young and even with a known name doesn't take away from the fact he's still a kid that's going to make an important decision for his future, regardless if the decision is likely a formality to bigger things in the near future.
My gripe was, we seem to be getting into some high profile recruitment's and hearing the distance from home theme stressed by the parents. Usually that ends up being a sign (for KU) they don't stray far from the nest. We all know Self and KU face a ton of obstacles to land top tier talent and having a lack of elite prospects in their backyard every year to recruit only adds to those obstacles.
BShark said:
General news tangentially related to KU: after news leaked about McCormack and KU, Ian Steere decommitted from Creighton and got some crystal ball picks for NC State. Brutal for Creighton.
I saw that and thought the same thing. Steere is a quality big, not surprised he might end up in-state after all
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
General news tangentially related to KU: after news leaked about McCormack and KU, Ian Steere decommitted from Creighton and got some crystal ball picks for NC State. Brutal for Creighton.
I saw that and thought the same thing. Steere is a quality big, not surprised he might end up in-state after all
Yeah when KU showed interest I was thinking he'd be a solid get. Good 4 year player in a class light on bigs. I can't blame KU for not pressing for him though* and things sure worked out with LB gifting De Sousa and then KU closing fast on McCormack.
*Which brings up an interesting topic. More and more "lower level" schools are prioritizing fringe top 100-150 recruits and getting them early. The kids want to play so it makes sense for them as well. But until you get the kid actually signed it opens up the door for stuff like this. Loads of early period commitments in this class and I think we will see a lot more before it's all said and done.
Agreed, I think there is something like 30 or so Top 100 kids left on the board. Many of them seem to be set to go somewhere by November. We may see only a handful waiting until spring which kind of goes against what has been Self's penchant for closing in the spring. I'm sure we'll see yet again a ton of de-commits, kids getting out of LOI's etc after the year plays by. That trend is going no where. Nice to see 2 Top rated bigs committed early. Definitely a refreshing take from the norm
At the end of the day, Zion can go to KU if that's the right spot for him. Mom may not be super thrilled about him being far away, but every KU game is on TV and that's a pretty easy flight if they want to come out for a game or two. If not here, I really hope he stays in-state so he's not at a rival school. Someone may have said it earlier, but Self is amazing with parents, so he should be able to assure Mom that they'll take the best care of Zion.
@BeddieKU23 The thing I would say is let's just use Zion for an example even though there have been others. - Why should it be any different for Zion going to Kentucky , whether then KU ? - -Mom want's him to stay close to home? - Fine Clemson - -South Carolina, but where I have the problem like that kind of like you I think to a degree is they want them close to home yet he lands at Kentucky? - that's not close, close is in-state.
There are others that have seen in the past where Mom or Dad or whatever want them to stay close you see a kid from the West Coast or Midwest parents want them to stay close yet they end up at Duke - - Kentucky - -North Carolina so where is the logic in that? - I don't get it. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BShark Agree, I mean look at us this year, we already have two for early commit this year where as the last 3-4 years seems like we been scrambling in the spring. Seeing a lot more early commits and think we are far from done. - -I STILL think call me crazy but I STILL think when it's all said and done we end up wit Devon, maybe cause he has been my boy from day one , maybe I'm speaking with my heart but not my head - -I just think when it's over he still lands here & I think it might be a fall signing too.
I think also we end up with Grimes But I think he will be a spring signing hoping the best to get both - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
If he lands at Kentucky, its still the SEC where SC is and he'll play a lot of games in the general area of his family including South Carolina at least once a year. Duke, same thing would play Clemson and others within shouting distance. If he stays in-state then you have to think the family had some influence there and if distance from home is a deciding factor we know KU won't be a serious option. We'll see, I'm not surprised by this development if its significant. We are used to fighting a real uphill battle for out of state recruits
FarmerJayhawk said:
At the end of the day, Zion can go to KU if that's the right spot for him. Mom may not be super thrilled about him being far away, but every KU game is on TV and that's a pretty easy flight if they want to come out for a game or two. If not here, I really hope he stays in-state so he's not at a rival school. Someone may have said it earlier, but Self is amazing with parents, so he should be able to assure Mom that they'll take the best care of Zion.
Interesting, there has been some chatter Self didn't win over the Dotson family during his recruitment/during his visit. Who knows how truthful that is but generally I've always though Self was good with the families of kids.
@BeddieKU23 I’ve heard that too. Sometimes guys just have an off day. The in-home was better from what I’ve heard.
If you were a mother of a top prospect, wouldn't you want him to prove himself at the higher level at a program like KU where he will have considerably bigger exposure rather than a second tier program like Clemson? Wanting him to go to a lesser program so he is close to home seemes like a very selfish thing to do.
FarmerJayhawk said:
@BeddieKU23 I’ve heard that too. Sometimes guys just have an off day. The in-home was better from what I’ve heard.
This has been a tough recruitment to trust any info on especially lately. Was a relatively quiet one then all of sudden we have insiders and sources coming out of the woodworks and posting on MB's about him. Its conceivable nobody knows anything.
I wish Slater hadn't dropped any information regarding an all but wrapped up commitment to KU during the summer as now we have no commitment and no idea what's going on. If he wasn't sold after an unofficial on his own dime, an official and 2 in-home visits its hard to be positive he ends up here.
That TBD official to Maryland could be the game changer in this. His friend and fellow Terp commit working him, UA making their pitch, staying closer to home in the Big-10.. Just seems to convenient at this stage
I am not sure if you meant going to Maryland and staying in the ACC. Maryland is in the Big 10 now.
@JayHawkFanToo I might be happier about S Carolina, close to him and off of a F4 year.
@BeddieKU23 Sometimes maybe the Mom wants to keep her baby in check. Of course, as with Cliff, once in a while, it would be best if the athlete could keep Mom in check!
Yup I realized my brain freeze after. Hard to believe they are not in the ACC anymore
mayjay said:
@JayHawkFanToo I might be happier about S Carolina, close to him and off of a F4 year.
@BeddieKU23 Sometimes maybe the Mom wants to keep her baby in check. Of course, as with Cliff, once in a while, it would be best if the athlete could keep Mom in check!
Too funny, has there ever been a situation other then the Ball family where an athlete wished their parent(s), had guidance to stop them from bad decisions!
Well again I still will say and will hold ground until officially otherwise - I think Ku is in still good shape - not maybe solid but very good shape with Devon. Now I have a question , I just saw off 247 sports , that Andrew Nembhard the # 28 player a 6 '4 PG has , that Florida picked up 3 CB'S for him just today , and under his profile it shows 100 % Florida. So my question is , does this possibly mean that Florida knows that maybe they are no longer a factor for Devon? - -Is there a leak somewhere as to why all of a sudden that Andrew has 3 CB'S predictions for Florida today ? Is this a sign that maybe someone knows something. - I have this feeling. - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Nembhard going to UF would be great for KU re: Dotson.
He's visiting them this weekend, it's his last visit and the staff apparently has a good relationship with him. Im not surprised some are reading the tea leaves with that one.
Florida wants 2 guards and they have tried to sell multiple guys on that philosphy. They even brought in Dotson and Elijah Weaver together which could have hurt them. No info to back that up but I'm sure it was on both minds as they hosted them together.
If they land him well that would seem to be positive for KU... this Maryland thing needs to be cleared up
@BShark That is kind of what I'm thinking guy. - -Like I said it is showing him 100 % Florida and picking up those CB'S - -makes me wonder if they realized that they might not be and option for Devon any longer or feel like their chances have slipped by , so now they working harder for this guy. - Makes me think something is going on, something leaked like with McCormack.
Like I said I'm still in on my Boy Devon , been there since day one & I'll continue to hang on till He commits somewhere. - I still think in the end - - - -he lands here. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
It's about landing kids and coaching. KSU was foolish for firing Martin.
South Carolina's best players last year.
Sindarius Thornwell #32 ranked in class of 2013. SR.
PJ Dozier #25 ranked in class of 2015. SO.
Chris Silva #161 ranked in class of 2015. SO.
They also had a foreign player that was probably underranked a bit. Then mostly role players. Martin is a hell of a coach.
They will be tested this year though. They lost ten yes TEN players from last year's roster including their far and away two best in Dozier and Thornwell.
Maryland is the first team I actually followed back when Lefty Driesell was the coach and I agree, hard to think of Maryland being anywhere other than the ACC.
Devon Dotson will visit Maryland this weekend.
@JayHawkFanToo No, I just live here in Zion's state and posted about USC's history like 40 times in the past 2 years. So obviously my opinion on this possibility is ill-informed. Thanks for setting me straight!
BShark said:
Devon Dotson will visit Maryland this weekend.
Welp, as expected this one is dragging on now.
I warn everyone and do themselves a favor and don't visit Maryland's board. I thought it was the just the whack job insider that was delusional but apparently if you read them speak its a disease that has spread throughout.
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
Devon Dotson will visit Maryland this weekend.
Welp, as expected this one is dragging on now.
I warn everyone and do themselves a favor and don't visit Maryland's board. I thought it was the just the whack job insider that was delusional but apparently if you read them speak its a disease that has spread throughout.
I think it's hilarious but for sure anyone that is easily angered (like my boy @jayballer54 ) should stay away.
The real problem is Turge would still be coaching this theoretical fab five.
I just want Grimes. This is where I'm at with it. Then find some random guard to fill the roster.
BShark said:
I just want Grimes. This is where I'm at with it. Then find some random guard to fill the roster.
Agreed, the more this process has played out Grimes is the real cornerstone to the class. If we miss on him, its time for some shakeup in the assistant ranks
@BeddieKU23 Who goes? Howard landed McCormack. Towns was the lead on De Sousa. Norm was the lead on Dotson, but Norm isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
At least our coaches aren't getting popped for something like this.
Also, @jaybate-1-0 proof that brands do in fact pay high schoolers. Adidas rep caught paying $100k to a kid so he signs with Adidas. On the bright side, at least Adidas is trying. Just clearly not as good at is as Nike. Although, 3 of the coaches arrested were Nike schools... So maybe not.
I don't see how Maryland lands any sort of "fab five". Maybe a "kinda okay five", but that doesn't have the same ring to it.
The original Fab Five were ranked the following: #1 (Chris Webber), #3 (Juwan Howard), #5 (Jalen Rose), #9 (Jimmy King) and #84 (Ray Jackson). Some services had Jackson ranked higher than that - perhaps in the 30s. Either way, to equal that, Maryland would need 3 guys in the top 5 and four in the top 10, plus another from the top 100.
Here are the top players in the class that are undeclared right now:
The rest of the top 10 is already committed.
Maryland has two commitments so far - Jalen Smith, the #15 player in the country, and Aaron Wiggins, the #39 player in the country. The only other five star considering Maryland is Moses Brown, the #17 player. Dotson is ranked 26. Weaver and Nembhard are in the 40s. Jarius Hamilton is in the 50s. Noah Locke is 64. Eric Ayala is 91. If they got their best possible group (Smith, Wiggins, Brown, Dotson and Weaver), we are still talking about guys ranked 15, 17, 26, 39 and 42. Not exactly the "Fab Five."
It bugs me when teams sign five ranked guys and then want to call it the "Fab Five". If you don't sign at least three top 10 guys, those words shouldn't be coming out of your mouth. Maryland does not have a Fab Five class. They just have a class that might end up with five guys in it.
Bugs me too.
That's why I said whatever water they are drinking, I politely decline.
FYI Johnson visits Maryland this weekend..
@BeddieKU23 Lol that's funny, I think to a degree this is the way it is on almost everyone's board isn't it? - -some obviously worse then others right? - -lol - -what board was this insane talk on- fill me in I wanna see lol - -is it a premium board or free let me know I love reading this kind of stuff . - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BAB
@BeddieKU23 Aren't these the same delusional people that thought once they got the supposedly most talented Pg Melo Trimble didn't they think he was the 2nd coming and thought guaraunteed NC with him at the leadership? - -This should be fun lmao. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Honestly I don't know who goes and I wouldn't want to make that decision but Townsend/Roberts are not getting any younger.
I feel there is value to Howard that he's starting to find that he relates to this younger generation (Newman, McCormack among others).
I just view it was as unacceptable if we can't close on the guy who's got so many things pointing in KU's direction.
Not sure its free but its the Maryland board on 247.
Trimble was a very good College PG. If they thought he was the 2nd coming of something they just had unrealistic expectations. Even KU is guilty of that.
Welp read from the Maryland site about if they get Dotson the fab five - -So it's a done deal guys, just mail the NC to Maryland lmao - -anyone up for a game of Badminton lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
Welp read from the Maryland site about if they get Dotson the fab five - -So it's a done deal guys, just mail the NC to Maryland lmao - -anyone up for a game of Badminton lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
What about pin the tail on the donkey?
BeddieKU23 said:
Not sure its free but its the Maryland board on 247.
Trimble was a very good College PG. If they thought he was the 2nd coming of something they just had unrealistic expectations. Even KU is guilty of that.
Ya I just got through reading off there 247 - your right - actually pretty amusing. welp might just as well cancel the season -Maryland has the NC wrapped up now - -you play badminton or maybe Croquet lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
According to ESPN we only have 4 games this year, must have been in response to the Fab Five coming to Maryland.
Hopefully we are tournament ready..
!0_1506439975379_upload-762d04c1-4f99-485d-acbe-fecffd42bbf4 ↗
BeddieKU23 said:
jayballer54 said:
Welp read from the Maryland site about if they get Dotson the fab five - -So it's a done deal guys, just mail the NC to Maryland lmao - -anyone up for a game of Badminton lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
What about pin the tail on the donkey?
Sure that's a fu game. - -hope we can make it a team sport lol. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BeddieKU23 WOW - -really short season, got a shotof going in-defeated though. - -what ya think? - -wonder how many games Maryland has? lol - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Maryland has a full schedule of course.
Yeah maybe we should print those 10-0 shirts early..
Going to need that badminton league going to fill the gaps.. That last game in January is going to leave both the players and fans a little rusty
@BeddieKU23 @jayballer54
Pin the tail on the turtle.
Incidentally, UMd people who are so excited seem to forget that the original Fab 5 did not ever win a NC, and eventually the school was put on probation for NCAA violations. Sure, go for it, Maryland! (To be fair, I don't see Turgeon as countenancing anything bad, but as Coach Calimari knows, you can get into all types of trouble when players feel entitled to cheat.)
Self and Howard checking in with Grimes today. Yeeeehaw.
This is two visits within a week. Wonder if we are trying to close here.
BShark said:
This is two visits within a week. Wonder if we are trying to close here.
would be greeeattt ( frosted flakes voice)
BShark said:
FarmerJayhawk said:
@BShark and Dotson.
Busy busy busy. Would love to see some early guard commits.
If I were advising a recruit right now, I would say "no early commits anywhere".
Way too much uncertainty about what schools will be allowed to compete in which games with which players and which coaches.
Not to mention these top recruits may already have accepted money and are waiting for the badges to knock on their doors...
@ParisHawk Very fair point.
If we are clean, our pastures: green.
@approxinfinity Was just going to say that. If somehow we get out of this completely unscathed, lookout.
With Pitino being fired, I'd have to say the Romeo sweepstakes are going to heat up. KU would have to look like the favorite at this point I would think.
Kcmatt7 said:
@approxinfinity Was just going to say that. If somehow we get out of this completely unscathed, lookout.
With Pitino being fired, I'd have to say the Romeo sweepstakes are going to heat up. KU would have to look like the favorite at this point I would think.
Sounding like Romeo will be a spring time decision, lots of people saying that now. Would make sense. See how rosters shape up, if any other programs get murdered by the FBI etc...
Dotson should decide within the next week or so.
I would agree with most of what's in that article. I would probably go a step further and start talking to Grimes about playing in the backcourt with Langford. There's a video of a shooting contest between Grimes and Langford on youtube. Langford's stroke is much cleaner - it's also notable that he's at least an inch or so taller than Grimes, which matches up with the reports that Grimes is 6-4ish, while Langford is between 6-5 and 6-6.
Grimes' best future is playing on the ball. If he's a wing player, he's a dime a dozen at the next level. At 6-4, he's a big PG that could be a game changer. It all depends on whether Grimes wants to peak as a very good college player, or as a very good NBA player.
If Grimes and Langford both come to KU, look out. I didn't really have Langford on the radar because he was headed to Louisville, but if he flips, this whole investigation could really turn college hoops on its ear because there could be more changes coming.
EJ Montgomery has decommitted from Auburn. No surprise there. KU is fine on bigs, provided De Sousa isn't caught up in this mess. Some shady coach is involved with De Sousa. It's not the guy he visited KU with but he did move from Monteverde to IMG with this coach.
The Grimes/Langford duo is a game changer at KU if it happens. Langford has some things he needs to clean up effort wise and defensively. Lots of stuff out there that the game is just so easy for him at this point and he's bored. Self would definitely change that quickly.
I've long maintained Self needs to land these type of guys to compete next year. Some combination of Dotson, Grimes, Langford at guard to go with the transfers and 2 big men we have on board is a dynamite reload
Is it illegal for a recruit to receive money? As long as he pays taxes on the money it is likely not illegal. Of course he would no longer be able to play college sports but other than that I am not sure there are any other consequences. A cash payment made to a third or fourth or fifth party might be difficult to trace.
BeddieKU23 said:
The Grimes/Langford duo is a game changer at KU if it happens. Langford has some things he needs to clean up effort wise and defensively. Lots of stuff out there that the game is just so easy for him at this point and he's bored. Self would definitely change that quickly.
I've long maintained Self needs to land these type of guys to compete next year. Some combination of Dotson, Grimes, Langford at guard to go with the transfers and 2 big men we have on board is a dynamite reload
Buckets would rain from the sky.
Also, a defensive line-up of Grimes/Garrett/Langford/SDS/McCormack would be pretty good. And by pretty good I mean stifling. SARAN WRAP. Now I do think Dedric will start, but say you NEED a stop and the other team has taken a timeout, I'd say you go to this line-up.
@BShark Think through this with me. Who are the recruits we should actually be worried about?
Guys that were possibly affected:
- Oubre - Recruited by Norm - Finalists were UK and KU
- Diallo - Recruited by Norm - Finalists were UK and KU
- Doke - Recruited by Norm - Finalists were KU, FSU and UNC
- Embiid - Not sure who he was recruited by. Down to UVA and UT. Not so worried about him.
- Wiggins - Recruited by Townsend - Finalists FSU and UK
- Bragg - Recruited by Norm - Finalists were UK and KU
- Jackson - Recruited by Townsend - Finalists MSU, Ariz.
- Cliff - Recruited by Snacks - Finalists Illinois and Depaul
Looking at this, I'm less worried. Cliff's mom took out a loan. Doesn't seem likely they got paid. If KU were in a bidding war, looks like UK would also be involved in many of these.
If anything, this was Self knowing that Adidas would take care of him without any contact from his staff to Adidas. A sort of unspoken agreement. Bill would do his part, and Adidas would do theirs with no contact necessary.
On a side not, Towns can close top 5 kids and Norm has kicked UK's ass lately.
@Kcmatt7 I'm more worried about recruits KU missed out on, but was potentially in a bidding war for. Now if by some miracle KU wasn't offering to pay Ayton, Tarc etc...and it's AZ's money that pulled them to AZ then...well fuck AZ and good for KU...
On some level all the African players worry me a little bit because there is no doubt they have/had sleazy people around them.
Kcmatt7 said:
If anything, this was Self knowing that Adidas would take care of him without any contact from his staff to Adidas. A sort of unspoken agreement. Bill would do his part, and Adidas would do theirs with no contact necessary.
This would be an excellent scenario for KU.
@BShark I'm far less worried now that I know we lost the recruits. It was always a weird thought how Arizona was able to keep up on the recruiting trail with KU, UCLA, UK and Duke.
I'm fairly confident that Bill was smart enough to have 1000 degrees of separation from the Adidas reps. And to make sure that his assistants knew not to even talk to them. I'm not saying that Adidas wasn't trying to pay players to go to KU, but Bill probably didn't know which ones were up for sale. At least, that is what it looks like at the moment.
Kcmatt7 said:
@BShark I'm far less worried now that I know we lost the recruits. It was always a weird thought how Arizona was able to keep up on the recruiting trail with KU, UCLA, UK and Duke.
I'm fairly confident that Bill was smart enough to have 1000 degrees of separation from the Adidas reps. And to make sure that his assistants knew not to even talk to them. I'm not saying that Adidas wasn't trying to pay players to go to KU, but Bill probably didn't know which ones were up for sale. At least, that is what it looks like at the moment.
Something that I think bodes well for KU is that it's not like every kid that goes pro after being at KU signs with Adidas. In fact, far from it.
In a phone conversation recorded by the FBI, Dawkins told Sood and an undercover agent that "the path to securing commitments from college athletes was through assistant coaches...because 'the head coach...ain't willing to (take bribes) cause they're making too much money. And it's too risky,'" the complaint says.
Odds are very good Bill isn't involved in this. And out assistants get paid very well and have bright futures. Not worth $20k. The more I read, the more I feel better.
Gregg Doyle, formerly of CBS (I think), and now in Indianapolis is reporting that Romeo Langford is down to either Indiana or Kansas. I'm assuming the Louisville situation has convinced him otherwise because wasn't Louisville the assumed destination for Langford for a long time?
Yup. Langford also set up his official visit for Oct 27th
JayHawkFanToo said:
Is it illegal for a recruit to receive money? As long as he pays taxes on the money it is likely not illegal. Of course he would no longer be able to play college sports but other than that I am not sure there are any other consequences. A cash payment made to a third or fourth or fifth party might be difficult to trace.
"Badge at the door" doesn't necessarily mean being arrested, but being interviewed / investigated / obliged to testify, yes.
Did not mean to imply an arrest. They can be invited to testify but unless they have leverage, I am not sure they could force them to testify and even then, all they have to do is take the fifth...just sayin'...
@ParisHawk Do scholarship players have to fill out financial aid forms, even pro forma? I had to (and my annoyed Dad did, also) to receive a minimal $100 honorary scholarship even tho we were not asking for anything needs-based.
If so, maybe there could be charges for unreported assets--if federal or state, unsure.
@JayHawkFanToo I don't mean to argue with what you say. My main point was simply that recruits have more reasons than usual to keep a low profile and commit when and if the smoke clears.
That can be true whatever the legal risks.
Just kind of curious. Wouldn't you think that with everything that is going on right now with this FBI investigation on the corruption and fraud wouldn't you think that recruits would have more of a tendency to wait until spring before committing? I mean one reason would be to see what Schools had took a hit in this thing and then another just to see what players had been effected and /or what players were going to return. - -I think this might slow down the commits until the spring period - maybe that is just me. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
It could happen. Maybe you see some guys hold out to see the fallout. It all depends on what those kids feel like doing. If any of them are scared the schools they are considering are at risk of getting in trouble I would definitely back off from any immediate plans.
If I was the two kids committed to Arizona I would definitely be looking at my options closely. There is no telling what the fall out for Sean Miller and the program will be with all those allegations they are facing. An Assistant coach is fired, one recruit was paid, at least 1 current player was paid. I wouldn't be making travel arrangements for Tuscon anytime soon if I was them. The same goes for USC. They have signed what 3-4 Top 100 kids and if any of them were recruited by the assistant I'd be looking elsewhere.
If it gets any bigger, the NCAA might allow individual to transfer from schools caught in the net; heck, it might allow all recruits with signed LOI to reconsider their destinations. We might end up with a reboot of the entire 2018 class recruiting.
@BeddieKU23 Ya those are my train of thoughts on this exactly. - -That's why I am wondering if that's what we will see, a lot of these kids might just hit the brakes until spring to see what schools take a hit from this. - -Hmmm I wonder what Ayton is thinking? - -I've read where his family took 500, 000 and already spent it. - -If this is True then I would think that his amateur status took a SERIOUS hit/ - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Some great news regarding your boy Dotson posted on 247...
So it would be KU vs MD essentially. Gotta hope and think KU can win out there... Esp since MD has a better PG than Moore on the roster.
BShark said:
@jayballer54 Some great news regarding your boy Dotson posted on 247...
Ok, buddy, soo you gonna have to give me the poop as the 247/shiver is VIP I don't do the Vip. - -I'm thinking Florida no longer an option for my boy as the one's I'm thinking going there more likely then not from what I could dig up would be - -- Andrew Nembhard - -& Noah Locke - -is that who you talking about? - -that makes Maryland and us as the two has to be. - -I STILL saying we in great shape and my boy - -my boy that I've been on his wagon since day one will end up here at KU can sure use him, the kid is sooo dam quick - -fearless taking the ball to the hole love the kid - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Dotson and Langford and/or Grimes? would be very nice!
dylans said:
Dotson and Langford and/or Grimes? would be very nice!
I think Dotson + Grimes is most likely. Would be killer.
Someone just posted that Dotson will pop for Maryland by Wednesday so who really knows?
@approxinfinity Unlikely. He listed KU but KU hadn't even been out to see him yet.
Kcmatt7 said:
@BShark well it seemed fine to OSU. Things could change. A lot more scholarships to fill.. I think we are due for new names to start popping up.
Dotson and Grimes deciding early would be good either way. Obviously better if they pick KU.
Maryland would still take Dotson but it looks like they want to also take Ayala. Ayala obviously isn't going to Miami now and it looks like he is getting squeezed out of his Cuse offer by Carey. Ayala is def a PG and Maryland will still have Cowan as well. I think it's fairly easy to sell Dotson on the starting PG spot but of course I have seen Maryland fans pointing to our roster having Moore + Garrett and Grimes being a likely addition.
Could be KU only gets one of Grimes and Dotson which would be totally fine.
I am having a hard time figuring out which posts are being responded to when there is just a name and no quote or specific player mentioned since we have multiple parallel posts from multiple posters about multiple players! Can y'all at least include the kid's name rather than just "he"? Thanks!
mayjay said:
I am having a hard time figuring out which posts are being responded to when there is just a name and no quote or specific player mentioned since we have multiple parallel posts from multiple posters about multiple players! Can y'all at least include the kid's name rather than just "he"? Thanks!
Who are you responding to? :laughing:
@RockkChalkk "Who are you responding to? :laughing: "
Good point! Here in th' South, though, we just say "y'all" and it covers all possibilities.
Jesse Newell had a podcast with Matt Scott. Pretty good.
Sounds like Harvey is legitimately interested in hearing from other schools. Reading between the lines, it sounds like JRE will be a Jayhawk for sure. Lines up with other things I have read and/or heard.
FarmerJayhawk said:
@BShark I listened to that too. Really solid podcast. 2019 should be a low volume recruiting year. Get JRE, Lawson, and Harvey to go along with Jacobs and call it good. Not sure we have a shot with many top guys in 19.
Agree. That's a great class especially if the staff closes 18 as we are hoping.
Malik Hall is a really appealing player if needed but might not be room. Similar position as JRE and Chandler.
If he is willing to likely redshirt (barring rapid development) I feel that Samuell Williamson would be a solid legacy take and 4-5 year guy.
Rumour mill saying Dotson will commit to MD shortly.
Well we have hear it's over all but done - -Devon is headed to Florida great connection with the staff - -done deal - -Well evidentally not that great of connection. - -If Devon was sold and had such the great connection then they wouldn't be recruiting these other two as hard.
Now we are hearing going to commit any minute or Maryland , well if he does hope it's soon I'm not getting any younger - - No did-respect intended to you B-Shark just nobody knows what the hell for sure is going on till he OFFICALLY signs - -same goes for Grimes - -people now so sure he is landing at Kentucky - -hmmmm guess what else I heard - - the world is coming to an end tomorrow, wonder which will happen first lmao. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
From what I can tell reading articles and posts on the Maryland board.
Dotson will be KU or MD. Ayala (another guard) would like to commit to Maryland, but the Maryland staff is holding out hope for Dotson. Should be decided soon one way or the other.
So good at basketball. Can't wait for him to commit.
One time KU target Noah Locke will announce his decision tomm.
Important why? Because he's likely going to Florida.
While a lot of people like to put him in the "combo guard" role he's 6'2 and has limited options for position versatility. He might not be a natural PG but he's unlikely going to be a full-time SG in College I would think. Might throw a wrench into Dotson's plans...
BeddieKU23 said:
One time KU target Noah Locke will announce his decision tomm.
Important why? Because he's likely going to Florida.
While a lot of people like to put him in the "combo guard" role he's 6'2 and has limited options for position versatility. He might not be a natural PG but he's unlikely going to be a full-time SG in College I would think. Might throw a wrench into Dotson's plans...
From some random MD poster.
Talked to my buddy this morning and he said that the Dotson family seems to be torn between schools. They love Kansas, but are worried about PT due to a possible commitment from Grimes. Florida seems to be running third as of right now, but is apparently still in it due to their longstanding relationship. A commitment from Nembhard would eliminate Florida, however that seems to be weeks away with his OV scheduled for mid-October. Maryland gave them a lot to think about on this visit though and I think Maryland’s pitch to Dotson resonated with him and the family.
Here's my tidbits for the day:
Dotson: Seems like Florida is out with all of the other PG type players set to commit there in the near future. The Maryland insider on 247 has changed his CB pick to foggy. According to Dotson's family, his MD visit was "good." It just feels to me that there is a hangup with Dotson over committing to KU and maybe @BShark is correct that it is a PT concern over Grimes. There was also that note earlier that Self didn't win over the family on the visit, maybe there is some truth to that. Dunno but it sure feels like he is hunting for another option. Problem is, each of these places are going to feel like a major settling when you stack them up to the facilities and tradition at KU.
My opinion, Dotson should be the one to take control of the situation and just commit. There is no doubt he will play a ton of minutes from day 1 even if Grimes goes there too. Don't shy away from the competition if that is the holdup, embrace it. I personally think if they both come that they will both play 30+ minutes a game. Dotson is a taylor made guard for the KU system, even if Grimes is the better pro prospect, I can't see Dotson not playing as many minutes as he can handle. I've watched a lot of KU basketball over the years and Dotson would be a superstar for the jayhawks.
On a site note, I actually think Grimes is going to end up at Kentucky anyway. Just a gut feeling.
Romeo Langford: Saw a note on twitter from a guy that overheard some coaches talking and the inside sources are saying that he is Kansas bound and will wait until the season is over to do his commitment.
Jermaine Harris: PF ranked about #80 or so in the composite was supposed to visit KU this coming weekend but it sounds like he is making his announcement this Friday. Haven't seen the official cancellation of his visit yet but if the announcement is definitely Friday then it isn't going to be KU. It might end up being West Va though.
@RockkChalkk I'd be actual money that it will best West Virginia for Harris. No sense in him visiting KU at this point anyway, KU is now stacked inside for next season.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
One time KU target Noah Locke will announce his decision tomm.
Important why? Because he's likely going to Florida.
While a lot of people like to put him in the "combo guard" role he's 6'2 and has limited options for position versatility. He might not be a natural PG but he's unlikely going to be a full-time SG in College I would think. Might throw a wrench into Dotson's plans...
From some random MD poster.
Talked to my buddy this morning and he said that the Dotson family seems to be torn between schools. They love Kansas, but are worried about PT due to a possible commitment from Grimes. Florida seems to be running third as of right now, but is apparently still in it due to their longstanding relationship. A commitment from Nembhard would eliminate Florida, however that seems to be weeks away with his OV scheduled for mid-October. Maryland gave them a lot to think about on this visit though and I think Maryland’s pitch to Dotson resonated with him and the family.
See this is what confuses me , some say Grimes plays the point , but he could very easily play the 2 as a SG and Devon run the team at PG - -If Devon was out then Grimes could always slide over and take the PG during that time. - -Grimes has stated that he wouldn't have any problems sliding to the 2 as long as he could play along side some other very good players - -Ummm Excuse me - here is where Devon would step in , Quinten slide to the 2 and Devon run point , they wouldn't even be competing for time - -they could both very easily be on the floor at the same time.
I think you'll will see Devon announce pretty soon , whether it be KU or Maryland - -one way or the other, I think Florida is out. - -With Them in on Nembard heavily and also Locke showing major interest there - -I just don't see it. I think Florida realized the ship had sailed with Devon thus this is why we are seeing the other activity with others for them now. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
And now the real waiting begins. - - -Dotson - - -Grimes - -Pretty sure Devon is now done with Visits. - - I believe these are the next two that will commit & I feel Devon is not that far away.
I think we will see Devon and Quentin commit early. - -I also think Romeo and Zion will be spring - -these seem to be the 4 that we now are in on heavily- - -Time I drawing closer.
Some others have their gut feeling , just like I have mine - -nothing more - -nothing less and my gut is telling me just like day one , in the end Devon will commit to KU - -m gut is also saying when it is all said and done Quentin will ALSO commit to KU may take longer but in the end run - - umm ya.
Romeo 50/50 - -& Zion I just feel in the end we lose out - -just me. - - IF somehow we do end up with Quinten , Devon & Romeo to go along with De-Sousa & McCormack - -that my friends would be a huge class - - - - keeping my fingers crossed and my gut in check. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Well this will add for reading , maybe give you a little hee hee. And yes for those before you ask - -Like I do normally - Yes I do scoop over other boards - -yes I am still married - - and yes we get along super. - -I say this just so we can get that out and people won't have to worry as to why I spend so much time on other boards lmao.
Anyways found this amusing of the Kentucky board, Thread was if anyone had heard how the Grimes visit had went this weekend?
Response poster said he had read somewhere that Grimes had talked a lot about Kansas and how great their crowd was. - - Said he couldn't remember where read and don't know if it was true or not. ( lol )
That set off this response: - -Why would you even respond if you are going to put something ignorant like that for an answer. - -( hey that fired up the Kentucky people right? - - I mean of course all fully expecting Grimes to Say Oh my visit to Kentucky was un-believable - Coach Cal is a super Coach - -the fans were awesome - -loved my visit - simply the best. - -Then when this poster posts this - - lmao - -OH HELL NO THIS CAN'T BE . - -Of course probably a troll but damn still funny.
Then another responded : Unfortunately I read the same thing on our pay board - - - -ooops - - uh oh - -this can't be - -this can't be - -can it ? - - lmao. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Grimes loves Kansas. The original crystal ball run on him happened because he straight up told a Kentucky reporter that Kansas was his favourite. Now a kid can always make a business decision and go elsewhere, but I do love KU's chances with Grimes.
And if we land Grimes and not Dotson ultimately we are landing the best player. It will still suck that all that time was spent recruiting him and he didn't want to compete for a starting spot here. We will see, nothing is set in stone, he went to 2 visits and didn't rush to commit so honestly I can see them going back to the best school recruiting him. Just a weird recruitment from the outside
@jayballer54 ESPN is reporting that Andrew Nembhard has verbally committed to Florida. Let the dominoes fall ...
Welp , Chris Fisher and Jerry Meyer Just Gave CB predictions for KU for Devon Dotson.- - Jerry Meyer CB is pretty substantial. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
Welp , Chris Fisher and Jerry Meyer Just Gave CB predictions for KU for Devon Dotson.- - Jerry Meyer CB is pretty substantial. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Jerry has had predictions for KU, UF and MD for Dotson during this recruitment. Including multiple times for KU. I think this is the third or fourth in fact lol.
I feel really good about Grimes and Dotson signing with KU early.
@BSharK Ahhh, but this is AFTER his Maryland visit and Florida getting their commit and more then likely another tomorrow - -I'm tellin ya my boy gonna come - -OR as Kurt Angle says - -IT'S TRUE - -IT'S DAMN TRUE LMAO - - -oh ye of little faith lmao - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
FarmerJayhawk said:
I feel really good about Grimes and Dotson signing with KU early.
Me to. -- -stand back and watch. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
hmmmm, some rumor going around I guess that maybe Zion going to announce Friday? - - hmmmmmm. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Highly doubt the Zion one is true.
Dotson before the end of October.. Is he going to end his before Grimes visits KU or wait?? Has to be the biggest development we are waiting on at this point.
FarmerJayhawk said:
I feel really good about Grimes and Dotson signing with KU early.
Love the optimism. That was my feeling in the summer when AAU was going on and that was hotly debated here about which guards we'd land.
Self will get a x-mas card if he comes through here
BeddieKU23 said:
Highly doubt the Zion one is true.
Dotson before the end of October.. Is he going to end his before Grimes visits KU or wait?? Has to be the biggest development we are waiting on at this point.
The rumour, fwiw, is that he verbally committed to KU on the visit and will announce Friday. The guy that posted it has been wrong (and right) before so yeah we will see.
What I think will happen is Zion won't announce (much to our dismay), he'll visit more schools including Kentucky for their Big Blue Madness which I'm sure UK will engineer it so Quickley is there as well. He hasn't taken his officials to either in-state school yet right or Duke? Duke probably is out after they land Barrett. Then Kentucky puts the pressure on Zion and his family..
BeddieKU23 said:
Heck of a rumor. If he ended up announcing friday without visiting Kentucky boy I'm sure the collective internet will open an investigation against us
The internet would implode. Twitter would crash.
The whole thing seems unlikely to me, but we can dream.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Heck of a rumor. If he ended up announcing friday without visiting Kentucky boy I'm sure the collective internet will open an investigation against us
The internet would implode. Twitter would crash.
The whole thing seems unlikely to me, but we can dream.
Definitely, we did as much as we could on the visit. Late Night had a crazy atmosphere. Lil Yachty is a perfect example of Self understanding what kids like today. We'll see how it goes!
Zion and Big Dave in the pic. Dotson just commented on it.
approxinfinity said:
@BShark wait you sure thats Dotson? Name says Jelani Richards
ddotson_1👀👀👀
https://www.instagram.com/ddotson_1/ ↗
I'm fairly sure
take this for what its worth. IT'S a Maryland Fan slanting his opinion to Maryland, of course but he did deliver by asking for info from his "source". But apparently he's got a buddy close with the Dotson circle. How many of THOSE have we heard in the past 2 weeks... I don't think its any earth shattering information but he definitely tries to alleviate the concerns Maryland had while raising ones for Kansas that weren't really an issue before. It's funny how each side is playing the other card in this.
Update:
Just got off the phone with my buddy. As of this morning, a decision has yet to be made. Dotson is looking to commit by the end of the week, however his choice between MD and KU is still day-to-day. KU is NOT a lock, if his family had been sold on KU or Florida, there would have been no MD visit. My buddy also reiterated that Florida was unofficially out, prior to the Nembhard commitment.
In the MD OV this weekend, it seems that the staff was able to fully alleviate the concerns of Dotson playing with Cowan. They see the Melo-Cowan tandem last year as a model for how Dotson and Cowan would play. KU is providing heavy competition however. The only knock on KU is that Dotson doesn’t possess a relationship with anyone on the roster besides Devonte Graham, who will graduate this year. The addition of Wiggins to the MD class is one of the reasons why MD is still in it. A commitment from Ayala would likely knock MD out of Dotson’s recruitment, despite the staff’s efforts to tell the family that they could play together. KU’s staff has placed great emphasis on Dotson and Grimes being able to coexist, however Dotson’s family are not completely sold as of right now. The next few days will be interesting.
My prediction remains with Maryland.
The one thing I'll give them (Maryland) is if the Dotson family wasn't trying to keep him home he would have been KU already. Since they are playing the stay close to home and making Aaron Wiggins as big of a factor in this situation it makes you think he's maybe going to choose being with his friend over his own decision. Why else would Maryland have been an option this late in the game if it wasn't that exactly. Maryland would have never been on his radar if his best friend wasn't going there and wasn't recruiting him to go with him.
KU and Florida did their work early, Florida bailed once he wasn't ready to commit to them and wait it out. KU has remained quiet on the recruiting front for other targets. They have said to Dotson and Grimes, the ball is in your court come here and play from day 1. Otherwise why would Self not be offering others and looking at option c's and d's (Dosonmu, Carey etc)..
Have a question. - As I check 247 daily wanting to know is anyone else that checks it out sometimes if you've been there today did you have trouble pulling the CB'S up? - I can get the Player rankings but can't pul the prediction up of the latest news feed am I the only one having trouble trying to get that to come up today? - - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Hmmmm , so scuttle butt saying that Zion verbally committed to Self Saturday - -hmmmm probably not true - BUT - -some rumor of Zion saying he was going to announce Friday. - Some talk about Dotson wanting to announce by the end of the week. -- Hmmm Williamson - -Dotson - - -Dotson - - -Williamson - - -Friday/End of the week. - -Hmm connection? - Yeah, no, maybe? - -Had been some talk about the two making reference of possibly liking to play with the other. Again connection? -- Some smoke? - - Some fire? - - maybe , possibly. - - Is this a reach? - -more then likely - -very possibly - -just a random thought. - You got to admit - it does make you stop even if it is just for a second yes ? - - - - Man I have got to lay off the Diet Coke doing strange things to my thought process - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Maryland's board trying to say maybe, sort of, but could, possibly, think about, committing to someone this week.
Matt saying
"Seeing how his dad is out of town for the rest of the week - it's highly doubtful it will be this week. Next week at the earliest."
Which idiot do we believe?
BeddieKU23 said:
Maryland's board trying to say maybe, sort of, but could, possibly, think about, committing to someone this week.
Matt saying
"Seeing how his dad is out of town for the rest of the week - it's highly doubtful it will be this week. Next week at the earliest."
Which idiot do we believe?
Well pull this from an article of rivals from a poster off the Phog
Dana Dotson saying probably within a week or so as far as Devon Announcing , he told rivals this now that the Maryland visit is over. He said about his visit to Maryland what Dana DID ask was for a projected depth chart. He said we wanted to see who do you REALLY expect to be back for next year.
Dana said Anthony Cowan started as a freshman & will definitely will start as a Sophomore . So how they asked so how do you play two guys because Anthony is 5'11 - 6' and is even smaller then Devon they said so how do you play those two guys? - -He said and then their 2017 class has a bunch of wings that are pretty good and they are looking to bring in wings in 2018.
So if your playing a two PG your playing a wing at the 3 or possibly 4 if you go 4 out and 1 in. - -Dana said we had a lot of questions.
KU figures to l be in need of guards following the graduation of Devonte Graham - - -And Svi Mykhailiuk and the likely loss of Malik Newman and possibly LaGerald Vick. - - So sounds like probably anywhere up to a week we should know. - keeping fingers crossed for my boy. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Well looks like Quentin's visit to Kentucky went pretty good. - -Said Cal's message was about putting him in the league , being able to play and practice against other 5 star players, Cal said if he landed 3 guards how he could play the 3 guards, talking to Quentin about them feeling that he was one of the better guards in this class and if he came in and put in the work they feel he could be a one and done.
Was feeling pretty cozy about Quentin but after this read ummm maybe not so much , I mean still feel we are in pretty decent shape only maybe not quite as decent a we were. - - His AAU coach said that Quentin parents not in any big hurry But he couldn't really see Quentin pushing this into 2018 - probably a fall time decision.
Says Quentin still has 2 visits left Marquette & KU he has had all his in home visits. Says Quentin knows pretty much each one's sell to him on how he would fit in , now just wants to see the Campus - -see the facilities, check out the training/weight room conditioning facilities and such The dorms . - -Here is where when Quentin meets I'm sure Coach Hudy - she needs to make that strong pitch - Hudy does a remarkable job with the players - -they are talk very positive about her. -I think our weight/conditioning facilities take a back seat to no one. - -I think our Campus is one of the more beautiful one's around - - Bring him in and close the deal - -Give him a Strong show.
Might turn out being a good thing for us that he DID switch his visit - -this way we can give him more one on one attention in place of late night -give him that more concentrated attention. - - -Something STILL tells me he will end here - -IF we sell him on his visit. - MAKE THAT STRONG IMPRESSION - -rock chalk all day long baby
@jayballer54 No crystal ball picks from the Kentucky hacks though. I think he is still KU STRONG.
There is a reason Dotson is mulling it over so hard. Grimes is almost a lock. If he wasn't, Dotson would be a Jayhawk already IMO.
@jayballer54 Also he didn't switch his KU visit. He was going to visit for late night on his own dime and visit KU again. He was going to do both. I don't think it's a huge deal though.
BShark said:
There is a reason Dotson is mulling it over so hard. Grimes is almost a lock. If he wasn't, Dotson would be a Jayhawk already IMO.
That shouldn't matter at all. - -If Dotson is concerned about Grimes taking his playing time at point, that's just crazy. - Grimes has said repeatedly he has no problems with playing at the 2 and letting someone else run the point. - -Would be no problem with both on the floor and getting their minutes at the same time - I don't buy that at all. - -Grimes committing to KU should have no effect with Dotson. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Well, you can think what you want. However people that know the Dotsons have said it's a concern. A big reason Maryland wasn't being considered initially is that they will have an entrenched starter in Cowan. Maryland staff has been working to alleviate those concerns. Florida was eliminated because of Nembhard. If Ayala committed to MD (he would if he could) then MD would be out. Speaking of which if Dotson does pick KU, look for Ayala to commit to MD shortly after that.
Lots of certainty here in differing opinions without direct information--what must it be like, I wonder, for a staff to be going through the non-stop reading of the tea leaves?
mayjay said:
Lots of certainty here in differing opinions without direct information--what must it be like, I wonder, for a staff to be going through the non-stop reading of the tea leaves?
The concern with Grimes as well as Maryland's guard situation is straight from Dotson's dad. He has been very transparent throughout the recruitment. So I would assume his dad has been straight up with the coaching staffs. Honestly KU might have got lucky here. Florida was in deep but didn't want to wait.
Florida is CLEANING UP btw, like hot damn.
@BShark We went through lots of analyzing and agonizing through the transparent (pun?) family of now-forgotten whathizname who chose Oklahoma. What'd it get us except lots of ups and downs, and the thrill of seeing them think HCBS could not develop a PG. Bitch slap that, FM! Anyway, I just find it hard to get excited or dismayed by anything out of all the "concerns" even if quoted, and then there is social media.
@BShark Well as far as Grimes part of the whole thing from Grimes stand point it's really not what I think - it's what has been said by Grimes himself. - Sooo if that is the case for real with Dotson then - - maybe we don't need him here, we will take Grimes and call it good.
I have no use for people that aren't willing to work for their spot. - So if Dotson or family is trying to dictate playing time which it sounds like they are with the examples you give - if that's the case - are they afraid of competition? If indeed your son is as good as you say he is and yet he is not up to the challenge? Then step plain and simple, If I were the Coach I want competitors, I'm not handing anything to anybody - -you work for your spot - your earn your spot , that's the way it was when I played , that's the way I'm sure it is now.
So if they just want a starting spot handed to him - -then see ya. Would love for hi here but only if he is willing to earn it, that falls more under of a case like it's all about me , me, me - -instead of we we we. - -" Team " - -We will see. - -So again NOT really about if that's what I wanna think , others players willing to change for the team - -he can to - -lots of playing time for both. -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Sounds like you're backing off your boy a little, @jayballer54. Can't say I blame you. I'm getting tired of the back and forth as well.
His family's been pretty transparent about the recruiting process...more so than any other recruit in my recent memory. Unfortunately, the transparency isn't winning them any points.
Dotson (or his parents or both) want a situation without another serious point guard/2 guard to compete with, in other words, nonnegotiable, guaranteed minutes. Not the make-up of a championship caliber team.
Lately we're hearing he's reluctant to go to KU bc he doesn't have any friends on the current roster.
Are you kidding? So now schools are expected to provide not just minutes but built-in relational security blankets. This whole recruitment is starting to spell INSECURITY.
ajvan said:
Sounds like you're backing off your boy a little, @jayballer54. Can't say I blame you. I'm getting tired of the back and forth as well.
His family's been pretty transparent about the recruiting process...more so than any other recruit in my recent memory. Unfortunately, the transparency isn't winning them any points.
Dotson (or his parents or both) want a situation without another serious point guard/2 guard to compete with, in other words, nonnegotiable, guaranteed minutes. Not the make-up of a championship caliber team.
Lately we're hearing he's reluctant to go to KU bc he doesn't have any friends on the current roster.
Are you kidding? So now schools are expected to provide not just minutes but built-in relational security blankets. This whole recruitment is starting to spell INSECURITY.
Agreed. -- ya I guess I might be backing up at least a little if this is truly the case. I mean I believe your saying pretty much the same as I am.
Again if this is what these parents want - -no competition and the position just to be handed to their kid whether he is actually THAT good for that to happen? - -your right, is this what we want? - not the kind of make up I want for our team. If your good - -and you know your good , then you shouldn't have to worry about getting you quote unquote minutes cause no one going to be able to keep you off the floor. - -Sorry but I am going to have to use a phrase that normally I am not crazy about because it comes from that piece of crap down the road BUT in this case I'll borrow it - - " SHOW ME " - prove to me your that good to just have this handed to you.
I think Devon is a very good talent , but why not step up to the challenge if your as good as your parents and others say - ya think LeBron ever backed away from a challenge while playing? - -the old phrase - -you talk the talk - -so walk the walk.
As far as having friends? -- Great if it turns out you have friends at the school you choose? -then so be it. -- But how many of us when we graduated from High School we had friends - -very close friends , and we said we would always be friends and stay close forever? - -Just because a friend chose a different route in their life did that stop us from choosing the best route for us with the understanding well my friend isn't doing this so I'm not going to do it either without my friend? - -Devon is now at a point in his life - he is now becoming an adult - time to cut some cords, just as we have chose a certain path whether our friends do or not - -we chose what we thought was the best route for us. - -Devon needs to choose the best school, the one he feels gives him the best chance for the next level, whether his friends are there or not. -
Who knows maybe it turns out best if he DOES choose another school.- -If he is afraid of competition and as you say he has insecurity issues - -so be it - -let him commit to another , we land Grimes and hell maybe get back into the recruiting of the James kid we was recruiting for awhile as he de-commited from .OSU - we were in on him not as highly ranked but still a good player. - -Let Grimes run the point and James get some time at the 2. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 KU never recruited the kid that decommitted from OSU. He was hoping KU would.
Don't forget that KU still has Charlie Moore, a very good PG that will have a full season of experience at KU and Markese Jacobs in 2019. Also, Marcus Garret can always play some PG. I know many think he cannot play PG in Division I but he was named the Texas Gatorade player of the year playing PG; I think he can and at 6'5" he would be a very tall PG and a nightmare to guard.
@JayHawkFanToo KU is in trouble if Moore is starting at PG. Self might agree with me, based on what he said during the scrimmage.
Self LOVES Garrett though, that seems pretty easy to tell. Garrett will find time one way or another. Maybe loads of time next year depending on who KU adds.
@jayballer54 I don't think Lebron ever backed away from a challenge, but if anyone ever went to a team of his because they thought they could beat him out for playing time...well, that guy should have asked a few questions.
I think it is legit for a player to want to be top dog. And to want guaranteed playing time means really just not worrying that a few mistakes will kick you to the end of the bench.
I am not one of them, but some people here have argued this is what happened to Diallo, Cliff, Bragg (year 1), and even Hunter. Theoretically, they all might have made different choices if they knew there would be a short string.
We do not believe HCBS makes PT guarantees, but what happened to them is no doubt the type of thing presumed OADs wish to avoid when having concerns like those you discuss.
mayjay said:
We do not believe HCBS makes PT guarantees,
Unless your name is Quentin Grimes. Now, obviously there is a bit of recruit speak going on but Self told Grimes (according to Grimes) that he would be one of the two focal points of the entire team next year along with Dedric.
I seem to remember the talk was that Wiggins had been assured he would have plenty of playing time and Oubre was promised Wiggins spot. Other than that, I cannot recall any other players being promised playing time, although some players like Josh Jackson pretty much know they will get playing time.
@BShark I wonder how promises like that would get enforced? And it seems like it would sort of piss off ZW to hear that. "Sure, Z, we promised being the focal point to two other guys. But you will be the MAN! More than a focus! You will be central! Svi, Vick, Devonte--they have all signed agreements to not want to be a focus!"
@JayHawkFanToo Boy, was I WRONG! Temporary temporal distortion. I think I was just hoping they could sneak 5 years in. Or maybe I was just an idiot!
And, you do deserve this, thank you for the correction!
@JayHawkFanToo Now, that is really funny because after I drafted my guilty plea, I was going to add a reference to that story as a mitigating factor, but I didn't have a strong factual case, i.e., it would have been a baldfaced lie.
Nas Little to UNC. Roy isn't afraid of anything, lol.
Jalen Carey to Syracuse. File this one under KU really better not miss on their top guard targets. Let this walking bucket get away imo.
Funny how quickly Little went everywhere but the schools that wanted to pay him. Huge get for Roy though, a OAD for sure.
Agree about Carey. The reassuring part with him is if the staff wasn't confident they were getting the others they would have kept channels open with him. We've seen that time and time again. Now we wait.. and wait..
Should be next week for Dotson. Grimes toward the end of the month/early November.
Well , not seeing any kind of CB movement or predictions at all after the weekends of visits to Kentucky & Maryland. Sure would think if things went really well like some on their boards are talking we would be seeing something towards them - -something - -anything. - I see nothing to make me think things have shifted in their favor - not even their own people have shown anything. - -things that make you go - -hmmmmmmm. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
Well , not seeing any kind of CB movement or predictions at all after the weekends of visits to Kentucky & Maryland. Sure would think if things went really well like some on their boards are talking we would be seeing something towards them - -something - -anything. - I see nothing to make me think things have shifted in their favor - not even their own people have shown anything. - -things that make you go - -hmmmmmmm. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I think with both camps they are not letting out information regarding their choices. Both families are being air-tight about their plans (unlike Big Dave where his intel got out) . I think when both pick concrete dates then we can really monitor it. I do agree it is positive that neither has seen anything change since the visits. Hopefully it continues.
I think the Maryland guy wants to put his in for his team but he knows the intel isn't saying that. Every day he's been running new click-bait articles for his fans. I'm sure he'll be one of the few that puts one in for Maryland as his date next week gets closer..
BeddieKU23 said:
jayballer54 said:
Well , not seeing any kind of CB movement or predictions at all after the weekends of visits to Kentucky & Maryland. Sure would think if things went really well like some on their boards are talking we would be seeing something towards them - -something - -anything. - I see nothing to make me think things have shifted in their favor - not even their own people have shown anything. - -things that make you go - -hmmmmmmm. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I think with both camps they are not letting out information regarding their choices. Both families are being air-tight about their plans (unlike Big Dave where his intel got out) . I think when both pick concrete dates then we can really monitor it. I do agree it is positive that neither has seen anything change since the visits. Hopefully it continues.
Ya , I just have to feel surely if it went as well as some of their posters are trying to come across, one would think you would see SOME KIND of movement I mean it's been almost a full week since the visits and yet see very little on the recruitment. - -I'm hearing quite a bit that Devon will announce probably next week. - -I'm still riding my boy till the end. - -The fat lady hasn't even warmed up yet lmao think she is going to sit this one out lol. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Maryland fan who supposedly has a buddy close to Devon says he's now a Maryland Lean. Didn't see that one coming did we
"Update: I talked to my buddy this morning. This will likely be my last update till Dotson’s commitment. The Dotson family has tightened their circle, with very little information coming out. My buddy believes that they have either reached a decision or have heard about a leaking of information from their circle. For the first time in our communications, he told me he now believes Dotson is a MD lean, however that could very well change. He said that if Dotson had committed this week, he would’ve put money on KU. This recruitment is going down to the wire. I doubt I’ll get any more information until the commitment."
Not that we were really worried here but
BShark said:
Not that we were really worried here but
![alt text]
was that recent?
@BeddieKU23 Two days ago on his birthday.
KU has offered Trendon Watford. He might visit soon.
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
Not that we were really worried here but
![alt text]
was that recent?
who is the pic of below? - - Is that Grimes? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Chandler Lawson, who we fully expect to be a Hawk.
Ok , so I have a question. - -let's play out a worst case Scenario at the 2 spot. - -Lets say we Don't land Quentin - - OR Romeo , so then what about this guy?
Jules Bernhard # 43 in the Nation, believe I read some where about a week or so ago that he was surposedly going to make a visit to KU - -I think that's right. I know right now 247 has him 100 % UCLA but what's up with this kid? - - What do we know about him? - -Is this someone we would want? - -6'6 SG - fill me in any good? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 Not leaving the west coast unfortunately.
Stud alert. KU has a solid in here too, his older brother was at SMU when Snacks was there.
Well guys , today is the big day for KU ( jk jk ) as you know. Remember today is the day when we get the official commitment announcement from Zion Williamson saying he has committed to KU (lol ) REMEMBER? - - - if you remember right the 100% rock solid rumor mill has it that Zion secretly verbally committed to KU & Coach Self last weekend at late night and was going to announce his decision today. Now as you know this is from the powerful rumor mill lol , so it HAS TO BE right? - no way would they make this up and run with it.
So I'm so excited about landing Zion probably party all day lol. - - -Uh Oh - -wait seems to be a little conflict of interest - -seems Kentucky rumor mill has it that Zion will visit there ( at least their hoping ) nothing official for their Big Blue Madness and THAT'S when he is going to announce he has committed to Kentucky - - Now I'm confused lol. - That can't be can it? - Two rumor mills and each telling different versions lol - -Oh the old rumor mill - so trustworthy - -right along there with Scuttlebutt. - - - -I'm telling you I'm stoked - jk jk crazy stuff my friends BUT remember it's a done deal - -Zion to KU - -rumor mill says soo lmao. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
the rumor mill fell into the rum bottle a little too deep.
anyways today should be a funny/interesting/maddening day when the NCAA releases its penalties to UNC and suspends all operations at Cleveland St instead for the next 20 years.
BShark said:
Stud alert. KU has a solid in here too, his older brother was at SMU when Snacks was there.
Smart to be getting ahead of these types
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
Stud alert. KU has a solid in here too, his older brother was at SMU when Snacks was there.
Smart to be getting ahead of these types
He's already 6'5''. Maybe he could be our Anthony Davis.
His other decent offers already are LSU, TAMU and Okie Lite.
BeddieKU23 said:
the rumor mill fell into the rum bottle a little too deep.
anyways today should be a funny/interesting/maddening day when the NCAA releases its penalties to UNC and suspends all operations at Cleveland St instead for the next 20 years.
The rum bottle thing is pretty good lmao. - - -I like that. As far as N. Carolina thing - - I read where the NCAA is not putting out their findings today - -So you and I won't know sounds like. - Well not today anyways - -wanting to keep it sssshhhhhhhhhhh.
N Carolina should be in a world of Tarheel Doggie doo - -BUT being it's N Carolina and how they are with the NCAA -- God Forbid we punish the Good Ol Boys. I mean damn 5 level infractions. - -Lack of institutional control - - fake classes to help out struggling student athletes so they can remain eligible? - -Come on.
UNC Wilmington -is in a world of crap - -Death penality for sure. (jk JK ) - -just my feeble attempt at humor early
On a serious note though , what do we think they will be handed? - -Me - -I'm thinking nothing severe at all.- - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Don't know if this was mentioned yet but KU is officially OUT for Jermaine Harris due to the front court being, well, pretty full.
Harris would have been a bit of a project as a four year player. Good body and athleticism, but very raw skill wise. His hands aren't great and he doesn't really shoot it or handle it well. It's a loss in that we won't have him around for four years, but he probably was two years away from making an impact at KU regardless.
@justanotherfan Looks like West Virginia is passing on him, though admittedly I don't know the full situation there.
Could just be he sees the roster situation there and will pick a smaller school in hopes for earlier pt.
Looks like this N Carolina thing is ummm ya. -A poster commenting off a locked thread said: - - heard the reason they not disclosing infractions /penalities today , the reason it was pushed back per UNC request, don't want this to be on the same date of a 4 Billon Capital Campaign announcement. - -hmmmm wonder why lmao. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Ian Steere to NC State as expected.
BShark said:
@justanotherfan Looks like West Virginia is passing on him, though admittedly I don't know the full situation there.
Could just be he sees the roster situation there and will pick a smaller school in hopes for earlier pt.
I think because their top incoming PF was ineligble this year and will join them in 2018. Harris always said he was looking for a place to play right away. I don't think Harris was even in the same stratosphere of talent as De Sousa or McCormack so its a great thing we didn't have to go back and grease the wheel with him.
Well that's no surprise with UNC. They have played this one off for years what's another few days, weeks, months, years at this point.. They even let them get another championship while they were waiting.
I don't expect anything significant to happen which is sad because what happened was definitely significant. I guess we'll wait a bit longer to see what the big bad wolf has to say. It certainly has bark but no bite
BeddieKU23 said:
BShark said:
@justanotherfan Looks like West Virginia is passing on him, though admittedly I don't know the full situation there.
Could just be he sees the roster situation there and will pick a smaller school in hopes for earlier pt.
I think because their top incoming PF was ineligble this year and will join them in 2018. Harris always said he was looking for a place to play right away. I don't think Harris was even in the same stratosphere of talent as De Sousa or McCormack so its a great thing we didn't have to go back and grease the wheel with him.
Agree. Would have preferred Steere over him tbh. However earlier when I was talking about them as potential options, I had no idea LB would gift De Sousa to Self. :grin:
An unfair Nike UK advantage. Also in that article is a video of him discussing Bol Bol.
Now isn't it universal that coaches can't talk about recruits until they are signed? Why is he allowed to speak openly about a player he doesn't have the right to talk about at this point in time.. I'll never understand the rules
Kind of a brilliant move for him to take the reins of that team, honestly. I don't think it'll make much difference with the guys we're after. UK is getting some buzz with Grimes, but I don't think it's real at all. Zion may end up there, but that depends on who stays and who goes from UK at the end of the season too. He won't go to UK with Vanderbilt and Washington still there IMO.
Jermaine Harris to URI. :thinking:
Vanderbilt injured his foot and he will be out for at least 3 months and his chances of being OAD likely diminished. Kyrie Irving was injured most of his only season at Duke and did not hurt him at all and was the first pick of the draft, he was a much better prospect than Vanderbilt though.
BeddieKU23 said:
An unfair Nike UK advantage. Also in that article is a video of him discussing Bol Bol.
Now isn't it universal that coaches can't talk about recruits until they are signed? Why is he allowed to speak openly about a player he doesn't have the right to talk about at this point in time.. I'll never understand the rules
As a troll of the UK board - one of the threads was Bol's mother wants answers. - -I guess they wanting to know why Bol Bol was cut from a team that Cal was Coaching this past summer, - -Guess it hurt his feelings.
Bol is suppose to be going to UK for a visit - -mom wants answers - said she was a little upset Bol got cut too. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Well FWIW I reckon - -read off the Phog that Eric Bossi predicted today that we get Grimes & Langford. - -He is from the Rivals isn't he? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
They also predicted wrong for Keldon Johnson, so tifwiw.
Well here ya go. This ought to give you some chuckle on a Friday kind of slow with our targets so - -something to tickle ya maybe.
As I was trolling UK board a UK poster said in regards to the UK/KU recruiting of Zion this HAS to be " THE STATEMENT " of the century. - He said: Self at KU is a good Coach - -KU is a good basketball team - -BUT - -there is the infamous BUT - - Zion is in the elite group of kids that would rather play a style of play that allows for you - - -WAIT - - -WAIT - --WAIT FOR IT - - -WAIT - - OK - -WAIT - -zion would rather play a style of ball that allows you to - here we go - - GET UP AND DOWN THE FLOOR. - - -- OMFG - - really ? - -seriously? - -somebody PLEASE help me , lol - -place clear this up for me - -Am I that dis-connected? I guess I've been hitting the pipe to long - -I could of swore KU like to umm GET UP AND DOWN THE FLOOR - -I could of swore we like to get out and run when we can. - -HELP explain this statement. - -My damn ribs hurt - -statement of the century lmao.
Then another poster way more logical - makes sense to me. - doesn't necessarily mea Zion landing here but he brings out very good points about UK landing Zion. - He said: -- -Zion is going into the spring on his recruitment. Poster said he didn't love UK position anymore. - -His reason as to why? - Was UK'S recent push for O'Neal and Bol despite getting 1-2 big wings plus 1-2 bigs back next year, should tell you something. - -Makes sense to me - valid point. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Whaaaaa? - -No Zion comit to KU yet today? - - -that can't be right. - he secretly committed last Saturday - -rumor mill SAID so - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 why would Zion commit today?
This is Rivals prediction.
Schools involved: Clemson, Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, North Carolina, South Carolina, UCLA
The latest: After postponing his Kentucky visit, Williamson took his first official to Kansas last weekend. He’s been to Clemson and South Carolina unofficially this fall and still has set visits for Duke and UCLA.
Predictions: Eric Bossi- Kentucky; Corey Evans- Kentucky; Dan McDonald- Duke; Krysten Peek- Kentucky
3genhawk said:
@jayballer54 why would Zion commit today?
This is Rivals prediction.
Schools involved: Clemson, Duke, Kansas, Kentucky, North Carolina, South Carolina, UCLA
The latest: After postponing his Kentucky visit, Williamson took his first official to Kansas last weekend. He’s been to Clemson and South Carolina unofficially this fall and still has set visits for Duke and UCLA.
Predictions: Eric Bossi- Kentucky; Corey Evans- Kentucky; Dan McDonald- Duke; Krysten Peek- Kentucky
No wasn't being serious at all here. - -I/we fully knew that he wasn't committing today. I was poking fun of a rumorthat had came out saying that Zion had secretly verbally Committed to Coach Self last Saturday when he was on his official visit to KU, and that he was going to announce his commit today that's all just messin that's all.
He has not re-scheduled any visit with Kentucky at this point, In reality I don't feel we end up with Zion- -but again was just killing time as these rumor mills get wild lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Feel we will have our answer on Devon this coming week one way or another - -good or bad. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
I'm betting on Maryland being the pick.
BShark said:
I'm betting on Maryland being the pick.
Ya? - -and you know me -I'm riding my horse till the end of the race - -from day one. The fat lady is not even close to being in the building yet. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
BShark said:
I'm betting on Maryland being the pick.
I am not. Sticking with KU until I hear differently.
BShark said:
I'm betting on Maryland being the pick.
I think he is smarter than that.
BShark said:
I'm betting on Maryland being the pick.
I hate to agree but it just seems that's the way this will end up. Maybe its just the pessimist in me with regards to recruiting. They have certainly thrown everyone off guard with how this recruitment has gone since the summer.
@BeddieKU23 I mean, someone in his camp has to be anti-KU right? This recruitment was too weird for that not to be the case.
I will add whatever Ayala decides to do this week has some possibly important implications. Ayala visited Maryland the same weekend as Dotson and Keldon Johnson and reportedly will decide this week as well. Ayala has been viewed as a strong Maryland lean but obviously they want the bigger fish in Dotson so he's been viewed as more of the backup plan. Ayala went and visited Oregon over the weekend. Whoever his pick is would likely tell us where Dotson is going.
Ayala announcing for MD before Dotson announces would be kind of hilarious.
BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 I mean, someone in his camp has to be anti-KU right? This recruitment was too weird for that not to be the case.
Probably his mother. Of course I'm assuming but what mother wants her child so far from home in an unfamiliar area. I doubt it was the father seems how he has been pretty high on KU with each visit. I could be wrong though.
There's a lot of ways to look at this.
He visited Maryland out of respect to the coaches and his friend Aaron Wiggins. Take advantage of the visits, see what they had to offer with fit etc. It's closer to home and his friend is obviously holding some sway here.
How could he look at their depth chart and be excited about competing for PG minutes with Cowan. Keldon Johnson looks like he's a Terp as well which puts even more doubt in where his minutes are. Huerter will be Jr as well who handles some PG responsibilities. They also have Morsell who will play this year and most likely split some time at both guard positions.
At this point each school has competition. If he doesn't feel Vick is leaving and Grimes is a lock for KU then we really can't convince him otherwise that he'd beat out Charlie Moore. As a blueblood school this is on Self to close the deal.
The one thing that keeps me confident at all is KU is locked in on Dotson and Grimes only. There is no one else. That is unlike most years where Self likes someone more then others but keeps recruiting that position with other targets. We are not seeing that this year. We've mentioned Ayo and Carey as examples of that & others.
Just as Maryland was asked to provide a realistic depth chart I'm sure KU was asked to do the same.
Known returners - Moore, Garrett
High probability of entering the draft- Newman
Probably will test the draft process- Vick
Leaving due to graduation- Graham
Best Case Scenario KU returns 4 of its 5 rotation guards.
Worst Case Scenario KU returns 2 of its 5 rotation guards.
Middle of the Road Scenario KU returns 3 of its 5 rotation guards.
I'm sure this is a big debate among the Dotson's..
Looks like Jules Bernard is all UCLA..
Bol Bol down to Oregon and Kentucky.
Would be funny if he goes to Kentucky after Cal cut him this summer. Oregon could get the 2nd player Cal cut (King).. Some great leftovers. I think Bol Bol wants the attention he'd get at Kentucky
Is Vandy a legit concern for Langford? They are likely going to land Garland and all the recent smoke is they will get Shittu as well. Hmm Vandy goes from landing the occasional Top 100 player to possibly 3 5 stars, hmmm okay
Emmitt Williams has visisted Oregon. Has LSU and Florida also coming up. Wants to see Duke. Looks like KU lost out there with getting others. With all the rumors of his handler running things I don't think he was in control of where he went anyway (all Nike)
Ayo down to Illinois and Wake Forest.. Manning could real in another big one
@BeddieKU23 Self could realistically tell Dotson that he's the starter at PG, correct? Do you see any impediment there? Charlie Moore isn't much of a roadblock it would appear/I would hope.
@BeddieKU23 Bryce Drew. Will he be a better coach with talent than his brother?
I said it before and I will say it again...if an elite PG is afraid of competition from a player like Moore (no disrespect intended), do you really want that player?
Moore is a good or even a very good player but I am not sure anyone would call him elite.
BeddieKU23 said:
The one thing that keeps me confident at all is KU is locked in on Dotson and Grimes only. There is no one else. That is unlike most years where Self likes someone more then others but keeps recruiting that position with other targets. We are not seeing that this year. We've mentioned Ayo and Carey as examples of that & others.
Great point. If Grimes goes to Kentucky and Dotson to Maryland, who does KU focus their attention on for a point capable guard? Langford would be a terrific score but doesn't fit that description of being a PG and he is the only other true guard I'm hearing that KU is after.
I really hope Dotson picks KU, he is a perfect fit and i could just see him blowing up here. Would hate to see that kind of talent end up at MD and be wasted. Turgeon has been coaching there for 7 seasons, has only made the tourny three of those 7 seasons and has a winning percentage of 67%. His seeds those three seasons he made the tourny were #4, #5, & #6. During that same time period under Self, KU has made the tourny all seven years and obviously won the conference championship all seven of those years. Self's winning percentage is 83% and his worst seed in the tourny in the past 7 years was a 2! Four of the last seven seasons KU was a 1 seed and the other three KU was a 2 seed. If Dotson wants to win, and with winning comes the spotlight and publicity, there is a clear and obvious choice here.
Melo Trimble was similarly ranked to Dotson. He ended up playing at MD for three years and then went undrafted. Kansas' PG the last three years was a guy that was undersized, unranked, and ended up being player of the year. Just sayin..
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 Self could realistically tell Dotson that he's the starter at PG, correct? Do you see any impediment there? Charlie Moore isn't much of a roadblock it would appear/I would hope.
He reportedly did tell Dotson he would be starter from day 1. He also said the same to Grimes. That's what both have said in regard to what Self's main message was to them.
I don't see any impediment with Moore from viewing Charlie's film and statistics. Plus we give up a good bit of size if we are relying on Moore as a starter next year. He's smaller then Mason and not even in the same ballpark athletically. I think Moore's best years are as Jr & Sr, a full 2 years after being in the system. At least that's where I see his game going at this point.
But that doesn't mean Dotson and his family are looking at it that way. And who knows what way they are looking at it from. The situation with Grimes makes it harder to convince 5 stars they can co-exist (unless your Cal and Coach K)
"If Grimes goes to Kentucky and Dotson to Maryland, who does KU focus their attention on for a point capable guard? Langford would be a terrific score but doesn’t fit that description of being a PG and he is the only other true guard I’m hearing that KU is after."
I don't know, we've been in this position before like last year when we put all our eggs into Trae Young and Colin Sexton baskets. We tried to land Sexton first then whiffed, then Young gave us the slip as well after. There were others as well but we ended up with Charlie Moore which was a disappointment IMO. Maybe Charlie pans out, he definitely was a "safe option" that will be here for the next 3 seasons. At minimum we have a guy with PG experience on the D-1 level who produced in a Power 5 conference. CM might not be the "sexy" option but at least he's here battling now with Devonte to learn the ropes. Usually those guys end up doing good things under Self. But CM has his limitations height wise, athletically, and questions about his efficiency and production. Obviously KU provides him the opportunity to improve tremendously on everything.
It's certainly possible we don't land either target again and at that point we'd be stuck looking at the spring for whatever leftovers pop up. We shouldn't be in that position hopefully. At some point though despite the two bigs he's landed so far we'd have to start questioning our recruiting approach with these top ranked guards. We just need one to change the narrative.
I agree Dotson could have a really good career here. I don't know what approach they took with him but if they weren't showing him what Frank did last season then I don't know. Dotson has a lot of qualities that mix and match with not only Frank but fellow North Carolina native Devonte. He absolutely fits the type of guard that would thrive here.
The one thing that should be important in Dotson's mind in regards to his future after College is what school benefits him the most for the NBA. If we take Frank and Melo for example.
Melo- big freshman year, inconsistent soph year, big junior year- goes pro- undrafted
Frank- backup role as a freshman, starter as a Soph, starter as a Jr (inconsistent year overall), POY as a Sr - 2nd round pick.
Neither came to College with the ideal measurable's the NBA salivates over. Neither went 1st round although Frank's play got him drafted despite his frame. Playing at KU was a huge advantage over playing at Maryland.
If we have to go to battle with Charlie Moore at point guard, I'm fine with that. He might be short, but the biggest front line in like ....ever will mitigate some of my concerns about his height. Self will have him driving to the basket and dumping off to our enormous front line all game long. Charlie has a shot at being a pretty decent college player, imo. That's the beauty of having an entire year for Charlie to get better going against Devonte and Newman. I like the way he plays. He can't drive the ball like Frank, so he pulls up on his way to the basket, and shoots a funky little mini shot, which keeps him from being eaten alive in the paint. It kind of reminds me of the Selden sideway shot, where Wayne would drive sideways across the middle of the lane, and miss a 4 foot shot by 2 feet. Only Charlie, unlike Wayne, makes that funky shot. Love Wayne, though. Just not that shot.
BeddieKU23 said:
Looks like Jules Bernard is all UCLA..
KU never had a chance here.
BeddieKU23 said:
Bol Bol down to Oregon and Kentucky.
Would be funny if he goes to Kentucky after Cal cut him this summer. Oregon could get the 2nd player Cal cut (King).. Some great leftovers. I think Bol Bol wants the attention he'd get at Kentucky
I have no doubt Bol Bol wants Kentucky. This class sucks for bigs, so I would bet Cal takes him.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Looks like Jules Bernard is all UCLA..
KU never had a chance here.
I agree was just posting for those that may try and bring his name up again
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Bol Bol down to Oregon and Kentucky.
Would be funny if he goes to Kentucky after Cal cut him this summer. Oregon could get the 2nd player Cal cut (King).. Some great leftovers. I think Bol Bol wants the attention he'd get at Kentucky
I have no doubt Bol Bol wants Kentucky. This class sucks for bigs, so I would bet Cal takes him.
He has the most boom or bust potential I've seen a long time.
BeddieKU23 said:
Is Vandy a legit concern for Langford? They are likely going to land Garland and all the recent smoke is they will get Shittu as well. Hmm Vandy goes from landing the occasional Top 100 player to possibly 3 5 stars, hmmm okay
Shittu, what a bizarre recruitment. Looks like he wants to be the guy? Also he'd probably be at UK but UK didn't take him due to Barrett.
For those that don't know Barrett and Shittu had some kind of rift, iirc it involved Barrett's dad. Mutually exclusive recruits.
BeddieKU23 said:
Emmitt Williams has visisted Oregon. Has LSU and Florida also coming up. Wants to see Duke. Looks like KU lost out there with getting others. With all the rumors of his handler running things I don't think he was in control of where he went anyway (all Nike)
KU absolutely made the right decision imo. Williams is a nice player, very tough and intense motor so Self would have loved him but when you can lock up a couple top 40 guys early you do it. Esp considering the Nike risk here.
BeddieKU23 said:
Ayo down to Illinois and Wake Forest.. Manning could real in another big one
Yeah, KU didn't even try here. Unfortunate because I think he is a good player but if KU lands Dotson and Grimes, no complaints.
Supposedly there is a rift between Dosunmu and THT but I've also seen that refuted...
Hope he ends up at Wake.
JayHawkFanToo said:
I said it before and I will say it again...if an elite PG is afraid of competition from a player like Moore (no disrespect intended), do you really want that player?
Moore is a good or even a very good player but I am not sure anyone would call him elite.
Like Frank, I think Moore is more of a scoring guard that would have to grow into being a PG. Kid can fill it up but it would be nice if he was one of the first guards off the bench next year.
@KUSTEVE I don't know. Moore just seems marginal to me. @BeddieKU23 said, "But CM has his limitations height wise, athletically, and questions about his efficiency and production." True. And I don't like that truth. CM seems like a guy that is a capable back up, and a guy that we can easily (and should) recruit over. But that judgment is made off his freshman season, and seeing him from the Italy trip. I just don't want to go to battle with him starting.
This will be a backtrack from my previous assertions (as @Texas-Hawk-10 knows...) but if KU misses on Dotson and Grimes but lands say, Langford, I could see Garrett starting at PG. I'm really coming around on Garrett.
@BShark So what do you think of Garrett's ballhandling? Seems a little 2-guardish. I used to be ok with that to a degree, but after the EJ experience, I'm a pure point guard guy. No combo guards please -- combo guard is code for, "can't dribble like a point guard." I want the bad a** ball handler.
So Keldon Johnson is pushing back his decision 3-4 more weeks. The Maryland board is melting down. If we believe that UK is the main comp for Grimes (honestly Marquette COULD be) then we would hope Johnson changes to UK (recent momentum was all MD but it appears he is changing his mind).
HighEliteMajor said:
@BShark So what do you think of Garrett's ballhandling? Seems a little 2-guardish. I used to be ok with that to a degree, but after the EJ experience, I'm a pure point guard guy. No combo guards please -- combo guard is code for, "can't dribble like a point guard." I want the bad a** ball handler.
Oh 100% I want to see Dotson a Jayhawk and running the point next year.
I think Garrett could handle himself at PG. I do worry about his quickness against smaller guards. But if his reputation for defense translates we'll see. He's definitely an advantage to have at the position if he is as good as advertised
@HighEliteMajor Garrett was point guard on a state championship team. His defense has already assured him of playing time in the rotation. EJ was never a point guard, although he tried it for us for a while. If we're down to Garrett as the point guard, I don't think he makes us forget Frank, or remember EJ.
KUSTEVE said:
@HighEliteMajor Garrett was point guard on a state championship team. His defense has already assured him of playing time in the rotation. EJ was never a point guard, although he tried it for us for a while. If we're down to Garrett as the point guard, I don't think he makes us forget Frank, or remember EJ.
From what I've seen so far, Garrett sees passing lanes quite well. I definitely agree we need to see how he handles ball pressure at the D1 level. That will be a big part of if he can play PG for KU or just be a utility guard that is a solid handler for his size, a really good passer and a guy that sometimes starts the offense in the half court.
The system he played in during HS is probably not known by some KU fans. He was coached hard in HS. Coached to play team ball. His HS coach is Paul Graham, who coached with Self for 2 years at OSU under Sutton (7 years). Nuff said.
BShark said:
So Keldon Johnson is pushing back his decision 3-4 more weeks. The Maryland board is melting down. If we believe that UK is the main comp for Grimes (honestly Marquette COULD be) then we would hope Johnson changes to UK (recent momentum was all MD but it appears he is changing his mind).
HighEliteMajor said:
@BShark So what do you think of Garrett's ballhandling? Seems a little 2-guardish. I used to be ok with that to a degree, but after the EJ experience, I'm a pure point guard guy. No combo guards please -- combo guard is code for, "can't dribble like a point guard." I want the bad a** ball handler.
Oh 100% I want to see Dotson a Jayhawk and running the point next year.
Confirmation of a completely lunatic fanbase
Ok had to share this particular post. They are already prepared.
"Yup...first comes the meltdown. Then "credit to staff for putting in a lot of work"... then "Ayala is really like a top 40 player, he's just rated too low"... then we'll pick up a transfer who has to sit out and some average euro big that everyone will overhype...we will win some games on a soft schedule but continue to underperform in March...Maybe we'll be a 5 seed and luck into a sweet 16 or maybe we'll just lose on the first weekend. Sigh. TURGATORY"
@KUSTEVE EJ actually was point guard in high school, in Vegas. He was recruited as a point guard. I spent some time researching him and all of that, trying to convince @jaybate-1-0 that he should start over Tyshawn at the PG spot. Anyway, as you know, handling the ball against some guys that will be lacing them up for intramurals the next year isn't near D-I stuff. I like your projection there .. between Mason and EJ. That's tolerable. And that's all we might need.
@BeddieKU23 Same poster that called Grimes a PG target and competition for Dotson just called Grimes a UK wing target and competition for KJ. I'm dying. Dead.
@HighEliteMajor I didn't know that about EJ. In a word, Michigan. Remember that one?
That L was on Self.
JayHawkFanToo said:
I said it before and I will say it again...if an elite PG is afraid of competition from a player like Moore (no disrespect intended), do you really want that player?
Moore is a good or even a very good player but I am not sure anyone would call him elite.
This is what I'm saying also. - -If indeed Devon is a really good talent , then why shy away from competition? - -A talented player isn't golng to back away from a challenge - -any challenge. This is how you improve anyways to go against other good competition. - -Again if they feel he should just be handed the starting position? - -Then why do we want him? - -Nothing is a given - you earn it. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LPONG BABY
@RockkChalkk The stats you bring up to compare pretty well speak for themselves between the Schools & Coaches, there is NO COMPARISON. - - Again if it turns out they want him to be handed the starting position then I say - -Maryland - -your welcome to him. - -I want a player who is a competitor and not afraid of a challenge.
In the end if it comes down to it , and we lose on Devon for next year - - -well then so be it. - It's not the best option we would like BUT I think we have enough that we can manage just fine. - -Moore will be here, maybe Garrett might be able to help out some. - -I think we would live. - Would love to have Devon but the world is not going to come to an end if he signs with Maryland. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@BeddieKU23 I for sure understand what your saying. - -I still don't see why Grimes coming would be or has to be such a big issue with Dotson. - Again Grimes has said he would have no problem sliding over to the two. - There is no reason in hell why these two couldn't co- exhist and be on the floor at the same time. - When Dotson on the bench , then slide Grimes to the one. - The more I hear and read , it's sounds like to me that this family just wants a starting spot hand wrapped for him.
I think what really comes into play is where does DEVON want to go to school? - -Not Mommy -- Not daddy - -but Devon , ya ya I know he wants to keep them happy - -I get that but in the end it should be Devon's decision , he should be the one with the final say - he is starting his own life now. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
@RockkChalkk The stats you bring up to compare pretty well speak for themselves between the Schools & Coaches, there is NO COMPARISON. - - Again if it turns out they want him to be handed the starting position then I say - -Maryland - -your welcome to him. - -I want a player who is a competitor and not afraid of a challenge.
In the end if it comes down to it , and we lose on Devon for next year - - -well then so be it. - It's not the best option we would like BUT I think we have enough that we can manage just fine. - -Moore will be here, maybe Garrett might be able to help out some. - -I think we would live. - Would love to have Devon but the world is not going to come to an end if he signs with Maryland. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
But MD actually has TOUGHER competition for the PG spot than KU does, thats the funny thing about it. I really don't understand what the hangup is, i don't see any reason other than his buddy Wiggins is going to play there as a legit reason to go to MD over KU.
@BeddieKU23 We mention his size and that's very true. - I'm just kind of interested to see -how does he compare to the what 5'10 pg we had play for us when we won the Gold that played at SMU but he went with us - -what was his name? - -Nick Moore - is that right - -aren't they about the same , and didn't he do ok with our KU boys? - - Just curious , not saying I'm right or wrong on this - -just curious. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@RockkChalkk Me neither. - just when you figure you got these 18-19 yr old kids heads figured out - -I just don't get it. - -But again like yo said - is he afraid to compete? - - - If what your saying about tougher at Maryland - -maybe HE see the competition of who we have it's tougher I sure the hell don't know anymore lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
@BeddieKU23 I for sure understand what your saying. - -I still don't see why Grimes coming would be or has to be such a big issue with Dotson. - Again Grimes has said he would have no problem sliding over to the two. - There is no reason in hell why these two couldn't co- exhist and be on the floor at the same time. - When Dotson on the bench , then slide Grimes to the one. - The more I hear and read , it's sounds like to me that this family just wants a starting spot hand wrapped for him.
I think what really comes into play is where does DEVON want to go to school? - -Not Mommy -- Not daddy - -but Devon , ya ya I know he wants to keep them happy - -I get that but in the end it should be Devon's decision , he should be the one with the final say - he is starting his own life now. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Kids say things they don't really mean all the time. If Dotson picks KU and Grimes goes to Marquette (where he would start at PG) then we know that line was bunk...
Ok, so here is a pretty simple question. - When all the fire and smoke clears - -Bottom line , Does Romeo Langford end up here at Kansas? - - -Yes OR No? - -what is the odds ?
I think we are looking at like a 50/50 chance right now - -I think it will come down to KU & Indiana - -I think about the ONLY reason for this is - -the closeness of home for him , that's why Indiana is a serious contender here. - So let's hear ya fella's - Yes - -or No. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 I say yes, Langford comes to KU. Grimes goes elsewhere and Dotson i'm not sure on. The longer Dotson takes to decide the better i think the chances of him picking KU are. Dotson and Langford to go along with the two Bigs would be an amazing class.
@HighEliteMajor Yeah, that one.
RockkChalkk said:
@jayballer54 I say yes, Langford comes to KU. Grimes goes elsewhere and Dotson i'm not sure on. The longer Dotson takes to decide the better i think the chances of him picking KU are. Dotson and Langford to go along with the two Bigs would be an amazing class.
KU would have to really eff up the visit for Grimes to not be a Hawk imo. UK lingering is never good but KU can win this one.
Tifwiw but it seems like UK can get Keldon Johnson if they want but are hoping for Grimes. Looks like this is why Johnson pushed his decision back. Bodes well for KU imo.
RockkChalkk said:
@jayballer54 I say yes, Langford comes to KU. Grimes goes elsewhere and Dotson i'm not sure on. The longer Dotson takes to decide the better i think the chances of him picking KU are. Dotson and Langford to go along with the two Bigs would be an amazing class.
Langford cutting his list to 3 in November. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
We have a good shot at Romeo, especially if Zion goes elsewhere. He did say this weekend he really likes Grimes and would be a fun guy to play with. I think we close on Grimes this weekend, but he’ll take the Marquette visit. Dotson could pop this week too. Still think KU.
I'd rather have Romeo than Zion. Don't @ me.
Dotson made a cryptic post on twitter saying "Big Week ahead" and the hourglass symbol. Most are interpreting that to mean his decision will be announced this week. This would be an enormous get for KU if he commits here, with the talent that will be around him he will be a stud stud stud. He is the most important piece to the class in my opinion, keeping my fingers crossed.
FarmerJayhawk said:
We have a good shot at Romeo, especially if Zion goes elsewhere. He did say this weekend he really likes Grimes and would be a fun guy to play with. I think we close on Grimes this weekend, but he’ll take the Marquette visit. Dotson could pop this week too. Still think KU.
Doesn't sound like Grimes' decision will be until late this year maybe even spring.
RockkChalkk said:
FarmerJayhawk said:
We have a good shot at Romeo, especially if Zion goes elsewhere. He did say this weekend he really likes Grimes and would be a fun guy to play with. I think we close on Grimes this weekend, but he’ll take the Marquette visit. Dotson could pop this week too. Still think KU.
Doesn't sound like Grimes' decision will be until late this year maybe even spring.
He mentioned recently that he would like to sign early but also that he will commit when it feels right. So he could drag it out, or KU could close this weekend. :shrug:
RockkChalkk said:
Dotson made a cryptic post on twitter saying "Big Week ahead" and the hourglass symbol. Most are interpreting that to mean his decision will be announced this week. This would be an enormous get for KU if he commits here, with the talent that will be around him he will be a stud stud stud. He is the most important piece to the class in my opinion, keeping my fingers crossed.
Rumours swirling for MD. I'm clinching my butt for the MD crystal ball run.
BShark said:
He mentioned recently that he would like to sign early but also that he will commit when it feels right. So he could drag it out, or KU could close this weekend. :shrug:
He just did an interview with rivals where he said he wants to see what the rosters look like and specifically said maybe December or spring. Like you said though, he did throw out the caveat that if it feels right he may just declare on the spot.
Rumours swirling for MD. I'm clinching my butt for the MD crystal ball run.
Oh no. What are you hearing? Anything with credible sources?
@RockkChalkk Rumours on both sides. I'm not sure anyone really knows, but I'm nervous. Wake me up Friday, lol.
I have news for everyone.
Its going to be a big adjustment getting used to life without Frank Mason.
He had the greatest final season of any KU point guard I can recall and my mental cobwebs stretch all the way back to 1962.
Devonte will be a way better than average point guard for KU. He might even have a great season and do some things better than Frank.
Devonte historically has been a player that spiked much higher than Frank for stretches, but Frank was like having Joe Montana at quarterback for the SF 49ers. The guy was just insanely reliable. Every time one got even a little nervous things weren't going right he did something that was just about the exact thing that needed to happen. And he seemed never to get hurt, or to play through things that would have other players begging to go to the Mayo Clinic.
We can win big with Devonte. Devonte can make us like him as much or more than Frank. We can probably have stretches sky high excellence with Devonte that we could not have with Frank. But unless Devonte gets some kind of blood transfusion from Frank that migrates his steely genetic consistency, there just are going to be times this season when we are all needing something good to happen and Frank won't be there.
Not a knock on Devonte. But I've never seen a point guard that consistent in so many ways before.
matt sure isn't confident anymore on DD. that always spells the worst. good grief kid
@BeddieKU23 But this random poster making their first post sure is confident!
BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 But this random poster making their first post sure is confident!
just like maryland's random posters with their sources
In the end this is trending exactly the way it goes when we lose out
Yeah. Lots of random "insiders" popping up for this one. And I agree, I don't like the way this is going.
BShark said:
Yeah. Lots of random "insiders" popping up for this one. And I agree, I don't like the way this is going.
It is very weird there is no leaking information to the recruiting sites..We'll see a CB run as soon as the recruiting site get word of how he's doing the announcement. If he does twitter then maybe nobody knows for sure. But I would bet its some kind of planned announcement which will almost assuredly give out something that Slater/Meyer will hear
@BeddieKU23 Well this is from the Maryland turd Ermann
"The Dotsons have kept both coaching staffs, media and fans guessing about where he's leaning. Neither outcome would be a surprise. This could change later in the week, but if I had to make a prediction right now, it would be Kansas."
BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 Well this is from the Maryland turd Ermann
"The Dotsons have kept both coaching staffs, media and fans guessing about where he's leaning. Neither outcome would be a surprise. This could change later in the week, but if I had to make a prediction right now, it would be Kansas."
Interesting comments from him. That's the complete opposite I expected from Jeff. I still think he puts his CB into Maryland to keep his subscribers from jumping off the cliff.. We'll see I do agree nobody knows because they haven't decided how they are announcing it. If they don't do a live announcement we likely will know before hand
further commenting to his fans
Ozziec said... (original post)
Well damn... Looks like it is Dotson to KU.
That's the gun to my head pick. Not the "I'm hearing Kansas" pick.
They're not giving up any info.
My tweet was simply referring to the new Will & Grace episode set for Thursday night...
I heard the Grimes interview. - -Came away with a little different feel now , I was kind of worried possibly about Kentucky , now - - -not so much. - -I got more of a feel if anything Texas may be more of a concern. - -He talked pretty highly of his visit there and the players on the team , knows a lot of them Bama and such.
When he was breaking down the four schools again spoke pretty favorable of Texas & really didn't have a whole hell of a lot of over whelming about Kentucky as to give a person a feel that he is a lock for there or even really that serious.
When it came to KU , he did say that Coach had told him they thought he could come in and be our starting PG - but also he said he could play on the ball - -of the ball whatever - -still feel him and Devon could be on the floor at the same time no problem. Talked about how him and Romeo had talk some about possible package and KU being a school was one of those schools but wanted to make their best decisions. Talked about possibly announcing in December but then to maybe Jan - - or spring - -said he didn't want to rush - -I think it will be spring. For no other reason to see who is coming back - -who committed, which I a way might be good if he waits till spring and we can get Romeo on Board. - -He also said Marquette might be a little more serious contender the what we think, - -the 1st to offer always been there - always coming 4 deep when they inner act with him - -He is the only PG they recruiting - -gonna be interesting - would really suck we lose out on both Grimes & Dotson. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY ONG BABY
jayballer54 said:
|>would really suck we lose out on both Grimes & Dotson. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY ONG BABY
Don't think this happens. I think if Dotson pops for MD, Grimes picks KU in short order. I feel that Grimes just wants to make sure Newman is going pro, but if Dotson picks MD then that doesn't even matter. Jmo.
FWIW, Garret played PG in HS and was selected the Gatorade POY in Texas ↗, a State that has pretty decent HS basketball; he led his team to the State semi-finals. He had one really good game in Italy and HC Self called him the best player on the court ↗ and indicated that he can play 1-4.
I believe he would be an adequate PG if needed.
justanotherfan said:
Newman is an NBA PG. He doesn't really have a future in the NBA
These are very contradictory statements. Which one is it?
jhawk7782 said:
justanotherfan said:
Newman is an NBA PG. He doesn't really have a future in the NBA
These are very contradictory statements. Which one is it?
Actually it makes sense. He is saying that his NBA position is PG, but also that he isn't good enough to make it in the NBA as a PG. So likely, Newman will have a long overseas career if he wants it. I tend to agree. Though obviously I root for former Jayhawks, and I hope he makes it.
This isn't intended as an insult to Newman at all, he should have a great year for KU this year. Kid can fill it up. NBA is a freak show.
Grimes & Langford both competed at the USA mini-camp. Zion as well
Grimes NBA comp is Gary Harris. Romeo, Danny Green. Romeo has a 6'10 Wingspan for a guard/wing.. Zion measured 6'5 without shoes and 272 pounds currently. I'm sure he'll tone up this year but its crazy to think he can do the things he can do at that weight
Here's Grimes report-
Grimes' skills don't pop but the gritty combo guard impacts the game in a variety of ways with his physicality, defensive toughness and instinctual passing. Physically, Grimes compares favorably to Gary Harris at the same age. Grimes, now 17 years old, measured 6-3 barefoot with a 204-pound frame and a 6-7 wingspan in Colorado Springs. A 17-year-old Harris, a superior athlete and shooter, measured 6-3 barefoot with a 210-pound frame and a 6-6& #189; wingspan.
Grimes is comfortable as a transition and half-court playmaker, showing excellent timing and vision while on the move. He can play out of ball screens and get into the paint with his strong frame and creative footwork. He plays unselfish basketball and makes winning plays on both ends. Although not overly rangy defensively, Grimes is strong and willing to sit down in a stance and slide with both point guards and shooting guards, which should be his calling card early in his NCAA and NBA careers.
Grimes is a high-intangible, tough-minded guard who can pass, straight-line slash and make a shot with time and space. Becoming a more consistent shot-maker and finisher versus length are his top priorities, since he can be a bit limited as a scorer in the half court. He doesn't have a ton of wiggle with the ball and won't be able to rely as much on his physical nature against long athletes in the NBA. He's far from a non-shooter, having made 31.8 percent of his lifetime 3-pointers with fairly sound mechanics and solid rotation, but his overall touch in the half court leaves much to be desired. His ability to make his teammates better and bring toughness on the defensive end should help him get looks in the lottery of the 2019 NBA draft. -- MS
Player he most resembles physically in the DraftExpress measurement database: Gary Harris (age 17.5)
Here's Langford's-
Langford had a strong camp, confirming his status as one of the most talented prospects in the 2018 class. He has prototypical measurements for a wing at 6-6 in shoes with a 6-10 wingspan and a strong 201-pound frame. He is an outstanding athlete on top of that, blessed with excellent fluidity, body control and explosiveness. Langford is the type of player for whom everything comes easily, especially putting the ball in the basket. He has good footwork, the ability to get to the rim smoothly without a ball screen, and plays the game low to the ground. He shows some potential with his ability to knock down jumpers from beyond the arc, particularly when he can step into them in rhythm on the hop. He doesn't always shoot the ball the same way, though, especially off the dribble, and is still figuring out how to play with the same level of aggressiveness and intensity on every possession.
Naturally quiet and somewhat introverted, Langford said he's aware of the fact that he's often too passive on the floor and is looking to improve that part of his game, something we saw more of in the second day of the camp. When he's at his best, he's making his presence felt defensively, crashing the glass and scoring at will from all over the floor. Still not having turned 18 years old, Langford's best days are clearly ahead of him and his talent makes him someone NBA scouts will be monitoring closely. -- JG
Player he most resembles physically in the DraftExpress measurement database: Danny Green (age 22)
@BeddieKU23 Makes me like Langford even more.
@BeddieKU23 Grimes reads like a Bill Self wish list.
@BeddieKU23 Well I really like Grimes AND as you know all to well by now my Boy Devon. - -IF it comes down to it where it has to be one or the other if they both can't or don't want to play on the floor together at the same time - - -if it comes to it then after reading this I would just have to increase my desire for Devon even that much more.
Like Grimes Devon for sure can take hew ball aggressively to the rim - not afraid of contact - -definitely aggressive - -loves to attack the rim, contact - -super quick , a true point guard - not saying Quentin isn't but still and from the sounds of it a lot better scorer.
The more I hear and think about it too, Zion is a beast - -BUT overall I think between the two if I had to choose - -again I think I would rather have Romeo - - big time wing span - - so smooth - -more overall complete, probably a better defender. He would have to be my pick. - On top of that I just feel we have a better chance in the end for Romeo than Zion. -- as I just feel Zion more likely then not is Kentucky bound. LOL as a little side note that I thought was kind of funny with the whole Zion recruitment. - -of course he is going to be at the BBM at Kentucky this weekend but a poster said ( We better be chanting Zion's name really loud and clear - -They di that at late night at KU he said and Zion loved it - - lmao. - Another poster says - -well I thought it was illegal for people to do that with a recruit - - ROFLMAO - -Kentucky people kill me lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
@jayballer54 I've heard/read a few times now that Dotson and Grimes can co-exist as long as Grimes is sure that Newman is going pro. Grimes is okay with a 4 guard rotation, but not 5.
@Bshark So what would be better Grimes in year one or Newman in his 3rd year in the system? I have a hard time believing Newman will be back, but I can understand Grimes' hesitation. From my viewpoint I'd like to see Newman come back for a second year on the court over Grimes or Dotson any day of the week. ...Unless that means he came back to avenge a season ending loss.
You have to remember this was one man's opinion of each player. I'm not questioning the guys thoughts on Grimes/Langford/Zion as I'm sure there's a lot of truths and realities about each players game. The main thing with these 3 is they are all studs and all will be in the NBA most likely after next season.
Zion was the best player/prospect at the camp. If we talk what player would change/help KU the most next year it would be him. Especially if he could handle playing the wing. There is no comparison to Zion in College and the Pro's. There's 5 or 6 Dotson's, 5 or 6 Grimes, 5 or 6 Langford's in this class.
As far as guards its splitting hairs. Devon has really narrowed the gap because he does a lot of things really well. I think he'd be a more natural PG/leader compared to Charlie Moore who's really in the mold of Mason as far as scoring mentality. I think Moore has a lot to work on as far as becoming the starting point guard here and I get the feeling I'm not the only who thinks that way.
Langford has all the measurables and talent. Kind of reminds me of Wiggins, he knows he's good and the HS game just isn't challenging to him. He'd start over Lawson and Cunliffe so he's definitely someone that could help this team next year. If Self doesn't land Grimes I think Langford will look at KU's situation more favorably in the spring (which is his likely time period for deciding).
BShark said:
@jayballer54 I've heard/read a few times now that Dotson and Grimes can co-exist as long as Grimes is sure that Newman is going pro. Grimes is okay with a 4 guard rotation, but not 5.
Ya, see that's what I've been saying also. - -I just don't see why they can't play together. - -Don't know how many times where I have seen Grimes say just that. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY