I'm not feeling sorry for MU in any way, but it drives me nuts that coaches can wreck havoc on a program and then move on like nothing happened.
Look how many times slimy Cal has left a program in trouble with the NCAA. I can't wait tell he leaves UK, because you know the hammer is coming.
I never could understand how another team losing justifies KU losing? Never made sense to me.
Is KU the standard or are they not?
So if UNC loses to an unranked team will it be ok if KU loses to an unranked team?
So if UK loses 10 games and misses the tournament and has to play in the NIT again, then that excuses KU if they do the same?
Like I said never made sense to me
So do you think Wiggins is trying to make a move before he really has the ball? Kind of like WR's in the NFL. Or does he have a serious problem?
I'm starting to wonder if KU can even handle the Longhorns pressure?
I think you've nailed this issue. The only real way to beat a team that wants to dog fight is to out talent them, or play their game. Like you said KU doesn't have the kind of muscle to play this type of game. So KU has to out talent them. A lot of posters want to blame KU players for this poor showing, and maybe there is some truth in this point of view. Yet the Coach deserves the loin share of the blame.
Huggy brought the X's and O's and Coach did not. It's the story/issue that has divided the sight. Some believe Coach can do no wrong, and the others question what the Coach is doing. Whether Coach intended to or not he has built a team that can run and shoot, yet his true desire is to pound the ball inside. I'm beginning to wonder if KU has an identity crisis? Coach demanding a ground and pound game, and the players better suited to a Coach Williams style of play?
When you have an unmovable object then you go around it. Yes Williams is a big bad boy but Diallo and Bragg seemed to do ok in there with Williams. In fact I remember one play where Williams went flying when Diallo was guarding him. Diallo and Bragg have something neither Lucas and Traylor have. Talent.
A lot of posts declaring that Diallo and Bragg couldn't and wouldn't hang with Williams. Yet we never really got to see that except in a few minutes of play, and in those few minutes Diallo and Bragg held their own.
It's time to take off the training wheels and give Bragg and Diallo some more minutes. We're never going to really know until they get some serious playing time.
Hey it happens. Even the great ones have bad nights. KU has really been living off their guard play, this season. It's was going to happen sooner or later. KU guards were going to have a bad game. You know what? They're going to even have more bad games if coach doesn't do something in his scheme.
Coach wants to run his offense through the paint and he wants to give the majority of the minutes to Traylor and Lucas. Lon exposed a truth about coach and KU. When Lucas is in, no need to guard him. Huggins picked up on the truth and ran with it.
Don't get me wrong the guards played a terrible game, but lets face it they are being ran to death and expected to cover up the short comings of an inside game.
As for Bragg and Diallo? I rather row the dice and see what I get with them. I already know what we'll get with Traylor and Lucas. A lot of close games, maybe a conference championship and then bow out in the second round of the tourney. I'll pass lets see what Bragg and Diallo can do. Besides when they where in the game Huggs actually guarded them.
I don't know what game you watched? Yet when Diallo and Bragg were in the game they played pretty good defense. Also when Diallo and Bragg where in the game WVU actually put a guy on them. When Lucas was in the game WVU didn't even bother to guard him. Meaning KU was playing 4 on five when Lucas was in the game.
This argument that Diallo and Bragg aren't ready is getting quite weak. Both played pretty good games against WVU in their limited minutes. It's time let them play or at the very least get more minutes.
Why is it when KU loses it's always the players didn't step up or they didn't practice hard enough?
Do we KU fans ever think maybe Coach failed us. That maybe Coach got outcoached by Huggy bear? It's become plain as day to any average fan. Put Lucas in and the other team doesn't even bother to guard him, then we wonder why our guards struggled?
I don't know? I think you put another big on the floor that WVU really does have to respect then the procedure of the game changes entirely. Besides it wasn't like WVU was lighting it up on the offense end.
I was afraid of this would happen. I'm not sure coach can turn the corner on this issue. It's to bad because I think this team can be really special. Yet I'm afraid coach is coaching nervously, and that means he sticking to what he trusts. Pounding the ball inside and playing certain players.
I would expect a big dose of the Lucas and Traylor show, from here on out. Even though it's obvious to the average fan that Lucas and Traylor hurt KU's offense flow.
You might be unto something there. KU has had played some stinkers on the east coast.
I mean they went West to Hawaii and didn't crumble like a flaky pie crust.
Oh I know they played pretty bad basketball. It was almost like they weren't even trying. I don't know what it is about KU playing at WVU, but man every time KU stinks up the joint. It's kind of eerie.
Well what can you really do? I believe in giving Svi and Greene more minutes, and resting Mason, Graham, Selden as much as you can. Tough I would think if Coach can get something going on in the paint with Bragg and Diallo it would help the guards and Ellis.
Something needs to give, because Ellis won't make it through the season playing the amount of double teams and even triple teams he's starting to see. He's not built to take that kind of punishment.
In light of everything and this season. I think it's time to see more of Diallo and Bragg. They are the key to any real sustained success for this season. This game against WVU reminded me so much of last years team, and that is not a good thing.
Say what you want about Bragg and Diallo, but they can do things other players can't. The time is now. I'm not going to sit here and bash on other KU players. I just feel the time is now. Bragg and Diallo can do things on the court that can't be taught in practice. Sure they'll make some mistakes, but they will also wow us too.
I know I'm reaching on this but I feel if Coach would have played more of Bragg and Diallo the outcome of this game would have been different.
Maybe? but why rub another fellow KU fan's face in a just happened KU loss, and then pound your chest and claim you're were right? I don't know, but that is kind of weird coming from another KU fan? I think you might be taking you're hatred for me a little to far?
But hey to each his own.
Why not just call me out?? You know you're were talking about me. Hey dude I'm a KU homer and will never predict KU losing a game.
Man you've got issues. You rather KU lose so you can be right? Wow Dude. Not me I'll gladly be wrong about anything as long as KU wins. Yet that is just the kind of fan I am.
Damn I need a Banjo and a jug.
Damn look at Vick get to the rim and actually put it in.
Man there must be something in the water in WV, cause KU always plays like crap up there.
Come on coach play Diallo, Play Diallo, Play Diallo.
You know I say lets play Bragg and Diallo. Lets just see what happens.
Need to make our freethrows.
Diallo standing tall in the paint. I guess he's not ready to play???
What do you call a bunch of WV fans storming the court?
A full set of teeth.
Announcers calling for Bragg and Diallo to play.
Or football. Pinkel left and so did MU football.
That's the way to do it. Run them over.
Everybody get on board the Ellis train is coming through.
Breaking news KU players drugged, hence why they can't pass, shoot, or dribble.
KU can't hit side of a barn tonight.
I didn't say the game was over. I just said KU didn't show up for that first half.
I say lets give WVU a taste of their own medicine.. Lets pressure the their offense. That way they can't rest offense.
KU didn't come ready to play.
It's not really about opinion. There's not a KU fan in here to a person that wouldn't rather have these kids stay in school for 4 years. Yet what are you going to do? Tell new recruits you come to KU you have to stay four years?
The real problem is the fans. I'm starting to get this feeling some KU fans don't won't Bragg and Diallo to play at all this year. Making it sound like Bragg and Diallo just picked up a ball just yesterday, or something. That they not even close to being ready to play at KU. When in reality they just want these kids back for next year. Sadly it will be these same friends that can't understand why KU isn't getting the same recruits as UK"s and Duke.
@Crimsonorblue22 is correct when she says, "so which one is it"? Do we sell our souls for the OAD or do we try to pick through the left overs and piece together greatness. We can put to rest the concept that you can't win with young talent. It's been done and will be done again.
Maybe so but you have to play potential or you can forget about recruiting top talent.
In so many ways KU is the Birthing place of the game Basketball. After all it's inventor was indeed KU's first basketball coach. KU is also the birthing place of coaching. As Mister Allen is dubbed the father of coaching. KU is also the home of many great players but also the home to the best player ever to lace-em up. The Wilt far exceeds the stories that are told. KU is not just college basketball but it is basketball.
In the 100 years or so of basketball the game has changed many times. Nobody understands these changes better than @jaybate-1.0. The game changed when players were able to dribble the ball. The game changed when a shot clock was introduced. The game changed when the three point line was introduced. Schemes and strategies on how to play the game have changed disappeared and evolved. Yes even the talent level has changed with times.
The OAD era of basketball has flipped college basketball upside down. I would make the argument that this new era has hurt the game, yet that is a discussion for another time. Defend it, loath it, and even twist it if you will. The OAD era is here to stay for now.
So what is a coach like Bill Self to do. He cut his teeth on the old and even classic ways of coaching and running a team. A way that rewarded experience and veteran play. A way that breathed pay your dues son, and your time will come. Yet overnight the world has changed. No longer is the system or the tried and true the formula to success. Over night teenagers are becoming millionaires, and loyal employees are being passed over for the flavor of the month. No longer are kids expected to stay 4 years at school get and education and pay their dues. No the top talent of today can demand playing time before they even step one foot on campus.
What is a coach in today's game supposed to do? Coaching is like any other job. Perform poorly and you'll be out of a job. When your job requires talent to win and keep your job. What is a coach supposed to do?
All KU fans love Coach, but even with that love, success is paramount. Look no further than after the MSU loss, how many fans (myself included) were chirping that maybe a change is needed. (Though in my defense I was drunk as hell and acts like a little pussy that can't handle his emotions when KU loses). So what is coach to do?
Understand something about Coach. He's loves the game of basketball and everything about it. He loves practices, and the teaching of the game. I believe Coach revels in making average players good to great players. He loves the history of the game, the tradition of the game. That is why I feel he'd never leave KU for another college program not even the school he went to and graduated from OSU. You see KU is Coach and Coach is KU. Yet what is Coach a man that loves the game like he does supposed to do? How does he stay successful yet remain true to the principles he cut his teeth on.?
Well the answer maybe the Inglorious Bastards. Coach is between in a rock an a hard place. He's has to play the top talent or fear losing any chance of recruiting future top talent. Yet as who he is as a person and coach. He has to reward those players that have paid their dues and stuck it out through the thick and thin. I believe Coach learned something in the WUG's. I believe something was reveled to him. A way to stay loyal to who he is as a coach yet stay successful in todays game. A game where every coach is all in, on playing their top talent no matter what.
@HighEliteMajor you're a brilliant student of the game, but this maybe the moment in history were Coach changes how the game is played. This maybe where Coach brings reality back to the game we all love. This maybe that moment where Coach brings back coaching to the game. Instead of just putting the best talent on the court, and sitting back like a fan and watching. (like Cal).
Coach is opened up the trey land for business, but his biggest change is going to the bench and using the depth he has. It's a win/win.
He's plays both is young talent and his older talent. Meaning star studded kids are getting playing time and he is rewarding those kids that paid their dues.
Not only having a deep bench but playing them makes KU hard to prepare for. As opposing teams never now what to expect.
Playing bench players gives much needed experience. They wont just be talented players but players with talent and experience which not only helps this year but next year as well.
Playing your deep bench gives the overall team more fouls to play with, which means KU can play a whole game with the pedal to the metal. They can maintain an aggressive style of play.
Playing to your depth means you can play many styles and schemes of the game. As of to date KU can play any style the opposing team wants to play. Really KU has no weakness right now.
Also the depth will allow KU's key players to be rested and not have to have herculean efforts every night. KU will also be able to avoid unnecessary injuries caused by fatigue. I also believe this will be the cure for KU"s recent woes in the tourney.
The most important is Coach will be able to be who he is as a coach, and be successful. He'll play his top talent, which will help recruiting, and still be loyal to his players that paid their dues. He can be the teacher of the game that he is.
I could be wrong, but I think coach is really onto something here.
Time will tale.
I can't believe it we agree upon something. Great post couldn't have typed it any better.
You hit the nail right on the head. Most KU fans want Coach to step outside the box yet apart of them wants to hang onto what he's always done.
Nice post.
I never can understand why persons want to shorten the bench? The excuse is always the same well it's always been done this way.
Well College Basketball is changing by leaps and bounds. What worked yesteryear may not work in today's game.
I mean why go with a short bench when you don't have too? Is the answer cohesion? Hogwash these kids play with and against each every day. You want to destroy cohesion and team chemistry then start sitting kids and tell them were not going to play you unless we just absolutely have too. Then we expect you to play like you could be starter. Huh?
KU just won a tough road game and coach went to the bench early and often. Could the margin of victory have been bigger sure. Just like Selden could've not started out shooting o for 5 or 6 from three land. Bottom line KU won and they didn't have to kill the starters to do it.
I don't know about you but I'm tired of heading into conference play with a worn out and injured team. I say Coach play the Inglorious Bastards and play Svi and Greene has much as you can. Besides I'm becoming a solid believer that KU plays best when you give coach many options pushing him to think outside the box.
@Texas-Hawk-10
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I'm not sure about that? Most schools want the new recruits to meat the knew coach. Yet they can demand they honor their commitment. Yet most schools give kids the option to deflect if they want. Yet I'm pretty sure there is nothing that says they have to.
Bill Self.
I found a few of the questions difficult to answer. As fans we sometimes have bloated ideas of who we are. Answer them correctly and you'll get the desired answer. :smiling_imp:
I know the recent win wasn't pretty, but I was so happy to see Coach go to the bench early and often.
The one thing I've always thought hurt KU in it's post season play, is Coach not using the bench enough through the regular season. The Big 12 is hard to win and you can burn up your starters trying to win the conference title.
It would seem Coach is even passing my own expectations. Playing Svi and Greene at the same time is just pure genius.
Get you tickets KU fans because I think Coach and KU are about to take us on a special ride.
However I will engage on why I think KU goes undefeated in conference play and you don't?
UM I promised @Crimsonorblue22 I would drop it, and I am a man of my word. Believe what you want to believe.
UM hell yea I watched the Chiefs game.
Come on he had it come in?? OK for you I'll drop it. :innocent:
Maybe if you had as much faith in KU as you do in Buddy being a superstar in the NBA you wouldn't be such a Debby Downer. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:
Check mate.
No seriously come on man. You know as well as I do every great team has to win ugly games. KU did and on the road. That my friend counts for something.
Come on @DinarHawk?? The time to believe is now. No more defeatist attitudes for us. We are Jayhawk fans and defeat is not an option.
Besides this current KU team it big, fast, bad, mean, and deep.
Claim it @DinarHawk ;)