@HighEliteMajor Otto Porter is on my short list of like-to-have-had players that we recruited. Along with Chris Douglas-Roberts (though we won without him), Greg Monroe, Trevor Lacey, Kaleb Tarczewski, Michael Snaer, and Julius Randle.
approxinfinity
17303 posts
@dylans I like this idea a lot. so first example seems about right for relative value between those two. I like doing year by year, then you can add the total value of all on team each year to see how the OAD carousel stacks up to 3 or 4 year equivalents by adding the early departures' seasons together.
I do wonder though, how someone like Releford or EJ would stack up. This system still seems to only favor those who are receiving media accolades more than points for the actual production.
@dylans said:
Or something much simpler.
ha :) I like the formula. we should come up with some recent people and see how they shake out. Also, if you get multiple years out of a guy, do you add those years together? so a 4 year guy putting up good production almost certainly will beat all OADs right?
@wissoxfan83 Bulls #1 was Rose, Heat #2 was Beasley. I thought the same thing. Wanted the Bulls to draft Beasley. But that was as much due to the fact that I didn't want to like Rose. I just looked and was surprised to see he had 6 rebounds and 8 assists in that finals game ↗. I remember a prayer banked 3, and thinking that Mario outplayed him.
I always liked CDR, and came to appreciate Rose after the fact. Dorsey and a couple other of the kids on Memphis, not so much.
@dylans I think we have to come up with something other than draft position, as the NBA drafts on potential too much. But... I'm not sure how you quantify it either.
@dylans What do you think fair criteria are... Contributions to the success of their college program during the season and post season, and subsequent success in the NBA only in so much as it helps the college team succeed in the future?
@HighEliteMajor Hey HEM, you know, when you were floating the idea that maybe a project like Karviar Shephard would have been a better recruit than some of the OAD recruits 2 years ago, I think I was not in your camp. I wanted to agree with you now, but I looked at his stats and saw that he seems to have regressed a bit, instead of improving year over year. So a few questions... Is Trent Johnson doing it wrong with Karviar? Did something else happen that derailed his development? Do you still feel that way about Karviar in particular with 20/20 hindsight?
Again, I really came around on the idea of focusing more on project players after this year. Liked Oubre, but tired of our simplistic offense, blown defense, early outs, and the timebomb that is the massive rebuilding effort after next season, when we likely lose our whole roster yet again, so I'm not criticizing the idea.
Also, would it be fun in the off season for us to do a long standing game where we all get to choose 5 recruits from other universities, maybe one from each tier of 1-10, 11-20, 20-30, 30-50, and 51-100 or something like that, and then see how they pan out over the course of several seasons?
@nuleafjhawk I'm just having some fun. You're absolutely right, Beasley was the #2 pick of the 2007 draft. Durant was the #2 pick of the 2008 draft. So I was saying that Durant was the #2 pick I would have liked to have recruited. The two were friends as kids and played on the same AAU team.
@nuleafjhawk you mean Kevin Durant, Beasleys AAU teammate? :) I agree Beasley was a terrific talent but he also seemed like a headcase. That's with 20/20 hindsight. Maybe Mario would have gotten busted for pot with Beasley at KU instead of rookie orientation if Beasley came to KU eh?
@nuleafjhawk I would be surprised if we recruited Michael Beasley heavily or at all. I think that he, Bill Walker and OJ Mayo were all supposed to go to Cincinnati when huggy was there and that is the only reason that K State got Beasley.
@nuleafjhawk don't forget durham nc, !Durham_dukechapel_satan1.jpg ↗
hmm. just noticed this version of the board you dont need to use the markdown syntax around a hyperlink. just pasting it, it's recognized and handled as a link. convenient. although I kind of always enjoyed the communal aspect of people fixing each others' links.
Dang...I am out of a job... ")
@jaybate-1.0 So you threw the question out there... Interested to hear what your opinion is. must... stop... watching.. jaybate's flashing keyboard....
@JayHawkFanToo I agree that the highlight clip I saw for Mudiay in China makes the Chinese league look pretty weak. I don't understand how his stock is so high. He seems less of a known commodity having played there than a player coming from a year of D-I. But I think the Euro leagues have a stronger talent pool And who knows, if someone with more money than God wants to field a legit NBA roster in China, I'd guess enough money could change things pretty quickly.
@jaybate-1.0 And I'd guess Silver sees this as a possibility. If he wants to expand the NBA internationally ↗ doesn't it seem a little odd to still have 1 and done rules when other international leagues would not? Should it be assumed that the NBA could forever use those other leagues as their farm systems?
@jaybate-1.0 I'm saying match or outbid for some of the kids who they already have had playing for them for a year, yes.
@jaybate-1.0 It isn't mutually exclusive. Even if the NBA changes the rules to allow declaring straight from high school, we'll still see kids going overseas. In fact, I wonder if the NBA will see attrition of talent because kids will stay overseas, and if that will force their hand to revoke the 1-and-done rule.
@dylans Thats incredible! Thanks for sharing.
@JayHawkFanToo I believe I put a link to the outstanding requests with nodebb regarding ignoring other users the last time this came up. And I will shamelessly pass the buck yet again. I am not the final authority. Until someone writes the feature it won't be available. Anyone with the time and the energy can write the feature and submit a pull request in github. Unfortunately I am not such a man at present.
↗
@drgnslayr . point planking, yo?
I don't think the spambots go to specific threads so counts to threads should be real traffic.
@approxinfinity :santa: :eyes:
@julian We're still on v0.5.x, I cloned the site on another server but couldn't upgrade it to v0.6.x, had problems starting it after upgrade, so I've held off upgrading it. Not sure about redis usage, I haven't watched it terribly closely since upgrade, but will since you mention it. Looking forward to the v0.7.0. The only big ticket item that I'm struggling with is the 25k spambots that @JayHawkFanToo mentioned. Being able to delete all users using a particular IP and ban IP from within the site would be very helpful in that regard. Thanks again for all you've done to continue to develop the platform. It really is outstanding.
@VailHawk Quiet down a--h---!
@jaybate-1.0 I wonder if they expanded their burger selection when the Big 10 expanded. Maybe some vegetarian alternatives. The Terrapin could be some sort of bean sprouts, hummus, seaweed and tofu thing and the Cornhusker a black bean and corn patty smothered with sweet and spicy corn salsa served on corn bread.
@VailHawk Maybe since he built WSU into a real program he can have fun ducking the question of why KSU won't play WSU when he's the KSU coach.
@drgnslayr I realize the links I provided earlier weren't the official duke site. I rushed it. Here's a link to the real site regarding holistic admission standards:
http://admissions.duke.edu/application/instructions#frequently_asked_questions ↗ ↗
"First, please understand that we do not have a minimum required score for either the SAT or ACT, nor do we have a minimum required GPA or class rank."
I agree K chooses recruits he can reach, as you said. But again, that's completely subjective. We'll never know what the Duke basketball team's SATs and GPAs are because Duke is, as a private university, "not subject to the state open-records laws [that public universities are subject to].".
https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2008/12/29/admit ↗ ↗
Agreed that the way Cal talks about/to his players is grating. After their loss, his comment about telling his team that what they did was still historic, and that next year they'd do something even more historic kind of cracked me up. Selling a used car on blocks. His words are an endless supply of carrots.
I don't know if that is reflective of the kids being dumb. I'm throwing out random stuff here and if someone can refute it with something substantial, by all means please do, but here's a link to the Kentucky basketball team having a 3.124 GPA for Fall 2014. ↗ Well, at least their tutors are capable of getting Bs. Who knows.
@DCHawker I do think that Coach K is capable of being a great coach without angling for technicalities and loopholes that give him a competitive edge.
I also think that Barry Bonds and ARod were capable of being great baseball players without steroids.
When has Bill Self ever had a team that flops on offense and/or defense? When have we poked people in the eyes, deliberately dropped elbows in players faces on rebounds, or relentlessly fouled people because the refs aren't calling it? When have we had fabricated seconds added to the clock for our last possession? When have we gotten a disproportionate number of calls go our way in a tournament game we were otherwise going to lose? How often do we get the cakewalk draw in the tournament bracket? Coach K and the Dukey machine are defining the context in which they play, and then succeeding in that context.
I'm tired of it. The least we can do is not give them undo credit for whatever gonzo brand of basketball they're peddling.
@DCHawker I'd make the distinction between smart and successful/famous. The list of people to whom you refer are successful/famous individuals. They are media darlings. Just like Duke is a media darling. Are they good at business? Well Christian Laettner wasn't ↗. He ended up owing people millions of dollars when his real estate business didn't pan out. Not successful like Chris Piper ↗, who cofounded Grandstand Sportswear and Glassware, a company that has grown 45 percent year over year for the last 4 years.
If you want to extend your list to coaches, I'd say that the players turned coaches that KU has put out over the last 2 decades are every bit as intelligent and successful as those of Coach K's tree.
I'm not saying there aren't smart guys that go to Duke. I'm just saying let's take them off the pedestal already. It's the Dukey bias, and we're spoon fed it year after year after year after year.. I can already see those questionable calls from last night walking into the sunset as the here and now fact that we will be reminded of over and over is that Coach K now has a 5th ring.
It's just garbage. It's all smoke and mirrors garbage.
@drgnslayr said:
I guess if you can get into Duke you probably have at least a reasonable mindset and wouldn't risk your future over what.. a few bucks?
Actually, Duke has what they call a "holistic" admissions policy:
"At the same time, keep in mind that Duke has holistic admissions -- Duke's admissions folks are looking for students who will bring more than good grades and standardized test scores to their campus. tudents who show some kind of remarkable talent or have a compelling story to tell will often get a close look even if grades and test scores aren't quite up to the ideal."
"Under a holistic admissions policy, a student with a 3.8 GPA might be turned down while an award-winning trumpet player with a 3.0 GPA might get accepted"
http://collegeapps.about.com/od/GPA-SAT-ACT-Graphs/ss/duke-admission-gpa-sat-act.htm ↗ ↗
And the minimum requirement for a 1-and-done student is 6 passing credit hours per semester, while enrolled in 12 credit hours per semester.... http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=205076744 ↗ ↗
So I guess conceivably you could be dumb as a brick but good at basketball and get 2 F's and 2 D's per semester, assuming D's are passing... maybe it's C's... So even if it's C's, you're talking about a minimum of a 1.0 GPA.
I doubt that's really any different than any other school, right?
Nice work Lu! How the heck did you get 97th percentile?
Kelly seems a lottery lock to me. How many kids are coming out with Kelly's potential? Go go gadget arms!
@Kip_McSmithers I plan to be out of here in 14 seconds guys. It was fun. But I can't watch this blue vomit.
@wissoxfan83 Did somehow hand Raftery Dickie V's lines?
@VailHawk Win or lose, I think we should all write to the NCAA and threaten to boycott.
OK. F This.
@Kip_McSmithers Well yes its off Winslow, but see Koenig hit Winslow in the head, so actually we're gonna call it a Flagrant 2.
Raftery, you're dead to me.
How is that Duke ball? Give me a break.
Out beyond Ratface and his floppy McD's, beyond the whistle-swallowing refs and the insideous bias of the talking heads, there is a 2015 Championship trophy. I will meet you there.
Easy Bucket. Let's go.
WHAT CHARGE??
Jackson needs to protect the ball.
@Bwag Thats total BS. Offensive foul.
Raftery stop coddling Okafor. Making me a little nauseuous. :boom: BOOM:boom:
@tundrahok Makes sense... After it accidentally fell out the window, you panicked and had to get rid of the evidence...?
@VailHawk I've been holding my bladder for 2 days! Road trip to Cameron!