🏀 KuBuckets Archive

Your time to shine @jaybate-1-0

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20824193/ncaa-basketball-coaches-10-charged-fraud-corruption ↗

@BShark Besides the coaches, it appears like it was Adidas who got popped. https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/four-college-basketball-assistant-coaches-hit-with-federal-fraud-corruption-charges/ ↗

At least they are trying :joy:

I'll be honest as long as KU isn't popped, I don't care too much about this. I have no doubt KU paid players though.

@BShark I don't believe for a second that KU paid players.

I do 100% believe that players were paid to come to KU though. And as long as there is a deniability between Self and the other coaches I'm ok with it. Nothing different than any other program. Anyone who thinks WWW and Cal don't have something crazy going is an insane person. No other way would a team be able to out recruit everyone so drastically. Any other time in history a team has dominated recruiting, violations were found. No reason to believe this is any different.

THE Article I read about the Corruption said that there were four Coaches - - -Managers, - - financial advisors - - and a major international sportswear company.

Two of the coaches listed were: - - Chuck Person of Auburn - -you remember Chuckie don't you? - -and then Lamont Evans of Oklahoma State - hey there is a star for the Big 12 - this is going to get ugly. having a press conference at 12:00. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

boy this is interesting. I thought this type of stuff would stay hush hush forever. Guess not

Just found out the other Coaches. - There are four: - - Lamont Evans of Oklahoma State - - - -Chuck Person of Auburn - - -Emanuel Richardson from good ol Stinky's crew Arizona - - -& then Tony Bland from USC -suppose to be in Federal Court later today.

They were steering these guys to Agents and financial advisors once leaving school and getting paid thousands to do so.

The International Sportswear Company? - - -yep you got it - - Adidas . Arrested was the director of global sports marketing - - James Gatto.

Evans said he feel the pressure to influence with so many one and dones that every kid he recruited was his " PERSONAL KID" - hell ya when you getting paid thousands of dollars. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Interesting the timing of this re: Adidas, considering they just leaped ahead of the Jordan Brand in sales in the U.S. as per an article last week. Surely, Nike is not clean in all of this. But, if this is the bombshell the media is suggesting, I'm sure the fit is about to hit the shan and more names/institutions will be exposed. Then again, I thought the same about the alleged (proven) impropriety at UNC. Whatever came of that? The golden goose always gets a reprieve.

I wonder just what the penalties could be. If someone goes to prison, this could legitimately change the recruiting landscape for both football and basketball.

I expect Cleveland State to get the death penalty soon!

Somehow, Somewhere, Someone will read that article and make a Dollar Bill reference

Justice department announcing charges on several live streams right now.

There will be more that comes out in the future. FBI is in DEEP in this. Have several FBI agents posing as financial advisers. Plea deals will be made for more names. This is far, far from over. College basketball recruiting just changed. Holy crap.

If you don't know exactly what happened, here is a summary of the Justice Department's press conference.

• Scheme #1: Coaches taking bribes from financial advisors, agents and managers to push players that they are recruiting towards them.

• Scheme #2: Sports brands paying players to attend schools sponsored by their brand. Some players over $100k. They passed the money through shell companies and committed fraud by putting those charges on the books as something else.

@jaybate-1-0 has been talking about this for over three years. You get to thinking it's just there, part of the background, never gonna change. Wow.

I think KU is clean in all of this or our recruiting classes would be much more like some of our peers (not naming names)! 3 stand out BIG TIME far and away from the others. KU has had to patch things together with transfers, lower rated players, and had to utilize a play book to win games and our peers have had the luxury of having players funneled into their programs. Just sayn

The Adidas reps getting caught was just embarrassing. The quotes they have from them on Wire Taps are just insane. If you're going to be committing felonies at least be smart enough to do it on a burner phone.

@Statmachine I would at least think that we have multiple levels of separation.

I would be shocked if this has any widespread impact unless there is more coming down the pipeline.

Singling out just 4 coaches among the 100's and advisors, agents etc among the thousands is not stopping business as usual tomm. Maybe it has a short-term effect but the AAU season is over, and doesn't start back up for a bit. Time will pass and unless Federal oversight keeps its foot down peeps will go back to doing what they always do

@BShark

Nothing to see here!

Howling!

Damn this is crazy, shocked to see this come out and not include Cal. We all know these guys are getting paid.

@BeddieKU23 In the press conference they made it sound like they will continue monitoring college basketball and that they are in pretty deep at this point. They got one guy to turn and that caused 10 people to get arrested. The Justice Department and FBI now have 2 options:

1. They can use this as a warning to other programs and brand reps. They don't offer plea deals and crush these 10 individuals with long prison sentences and harsh fines hoping that the scare tactic works. I think this would be effective to an extent.

2. They can take those 10 people and offer them pleas and get another 100 people. Then take the 100 people and get 1000. And actually clean up college basketball.

I think #2 seems more likely. They have already done the hard part by getting in the system and finding out what was going on. Now, you take these 10 people, you slam a 5-year prison sentence in front of the 4 coaches and offer up a deal if they will give you names. You slam a 20-year prison sentence and millions in fines in front of the brand reps and offer up a deal if they will give you every name you ever wanted. This lets these coaches continue their lives and puts a stop to the problem without legitimately ruining anyone's life. This is not something people need to do jail time for. But it is something that needs to be fixed.

I do suppose there is a 3rd option that is what usually happens:

1. No major penalties or jail time are enforced. Precedence is set. Business continues as usual.

@approxinfinity

The minute I saw KU get that big adidas contract, Self talk retirement, and heard KU had a $50 M stadium donor, coupled with rumors of KU leaving for B10, I suspected there would be blow back!!!!

But it's now way bigger than sports. Our Deep State appears to be at war with a major element in Germany and its allies in USA. Hoops and shoe wars are caught up in much higher stakes.

Artillery always fires short and long before targeting in between. Buckle helmets and fill sand bags. I sense incoming!

@jaybate-1-0 I thought you'd appreciate the thread title.

And yes, how great that the FBI is tackling THE REAL ISSUES in the world today.

No way Pitino and Pearl survive this right? LOL

@BeddieKU23 Rick Pitino gets fired over this, period.

Jim Gatto, director of global sports marketing at Adidas, was among those arrested. He's accused of helping funnel approximately $100,000 to the family of an "All-American high school basketball player" to secure the prospect's commitment to a school Adidas sponsors. According to documents, the prospect committed in June. The only "All-American high school basketball player" who committed to a school Adidas sponsors in June is Brian Bowen. He's now enrolled at Louisville.

Louisville coach Rick Pitino was asked about Bowen's commitment in June.
"We got lucky on this one," Pitino said. "I had an AAU director call me and say, 'Would you be interested in a basketball player?' I said ... 'Yeah, I'd be really interested.' But [Bowen and his people] had to come in unofficially, pay for their hotels, pay for their meals. So we spent zero dollars recruiting a five-star athlete who I loved when I saw him play. In my 40-some-odd years of coaching, this is the luckiest I've been."

@jaybate-1.0 You called it. The big shoe money, the buying off players, the embargo ... the whole enchilada. Your scoffers probably won't be heard from, I'm guessing.

KUSTEVE said:

@jaybate-1.0 You called it. The big shoe money, the buying off players, the embargo ... the whole enchilada. Your scoffers probably won't be heard from, I'm guessing.

I mean, it was the worst kept secret in the world. Not sure I believe the embargo though. Do I believe Self burned some bridges? Seems likely, but embargo? Meh.

@BShark Mo Kan Elite.

🐦 View Tweet/photo/1

KUSTEVE said:

@BShark Mo Kan Elite.

Also: PSA Cardinals.

🐦 View Tweet

@KUSTEVE

Cracking down on adidas appears like cracking down on hub cap thieves in a 'hood, while heroin, crack and meth are reputedly being sold openly on Wall Street. 😀

Is this a serious attack on adidas market share for challenging TPTB?

adidas appears practically marginalized already in its apparent ability to supply top talent in competitive quantities!

What must TPTB be doing?

Holy cow! Whatta world!

@KUSTEVE DEAD! :joy:

🐦 View Tweet/photo/1

jaybate 1.0 said:

@KUSTEVE

Cracking down on adidas appears like cracking down on hub cap thieves in a 'hood, while heroin, crack and meth are reputedly being sold openly on Wall Street. 😀

Is this a serious attack on adidas market share for challenging TPTB?

adidas appears practically marginalized already in its apparent ability to supply top talent in competitive quantities!

What must TPTB be doing?

Holy cow! Whatta world!

They are getting anyone they can. Multiple Nike and UA guys too. One of the Adidas execs just recently left Nike for Adidas, so the transgressions probably took place while at Nike.

What's weird to me is none of the four coaches charged so far are even at Adidas schools. ??

OSU, USC, Arizona are Nike schools. Auburn is Under Armour.

DanR said:

What's weird to me is none of the four coaches charged so far are even at Adidas schools. ??

OSU, USC, Arizona are Nike schools. Auburn is Under Armour.

Yep. This is what I was saying earlier. They are nabbing ANYONE they can catch.

Arizona: Nike school Auburn: Under Armour school Oklahoma State: Nike school USC: Nike school Charged with federal crime: adidas exec

@BShark

Hope you're right, but it appears we are in for a very, very long and hard fought economic war for the soul/sole of the game. And I believe we are still quite early in the asymmetric strategic-tactical exploitation of the legal-political constraint.

@Kcmatt7

Option 3 sounds likely to happen but the FBI definitely just opened a bunch of eyes (millions) to this so hopefully if they actually plan to do something here they will keep the pedal down and push through.

jaybate 1.0 said:

@BShark

Hope you're right, but it appears we are in for a very, very long and hard fought economic war for the soul/sole of the game. And I believe we are still quite early in the asymmetric strategic-tactical exploitation of the legal-political constraint.

If you are saying more will come of this I agree. Still very early in the process.

/revision/latest?cb=20160415175201

@BShark

I'm saying you have to make it look like you are going after "everyone", when you are going after "someone."

I'm saying leopards don't change spots until AFTER they have been hopelessly crushed.

Self talking retirement very recently (ie, appearing to make himself a lameduck) and appearing to tie it to "the way recruiting is", which was already anomalous, grows increasingly conspicuous.

@BeddieKU23

I could be wrong, but I just don't see the FBI leaving it all on the floor for Cal in Lexington, while Mitch McConnell has enough clout to appear to stop repeal of Obamacare for the Deep State. 😀

It's easy to read that as Self jumping out in front of it.

One other interesting thing about this is that only Adidas is mentioned but 3 of the 4 schools are Nike andd the other is under armor.

@kjayhawks

It is thought-provoking.

To et al,

I have only been posing a hypothesis for the last few years, one of many possible explanations of puzzling phenomena in college basketball recruiting. And at the end of the day today, this is just a piece of evidence at the arrest and allegation stage. Nothing definitive .

Are we pristine?

Is this the death of college basketball?

HighEliteMajor said:

Are we pristine?

Is this the death of college basketball?

No.

I doubt it but maybe.

FBI raided ASM and seized Andy Miller's computer. Calipari might be developing some back issues soon. Heard K gave him tips on that.

Self has been talking about retiring around 60 for a long time, his recent comments are in line with what he's said for the past decade or so about he long he wants to coach.

ESPN's version of the story says Adidas funneled 3 players, but we only know of Brian Bowen to Louisville.

What's the time period for Adidas to funnel players to schools? Does is impact any 2016 players or is it all 2017 and 2018 players?

@Texas-Hawk-10 CBS version
https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/explaining-the-fbi-probe-and-the-corruption-scandal-rocking-college-basketball/ ↗

Well went to the Kentucky boards, of Course Kentucky people saying Coach Self is probably sweating like the Niagra Falls under his toupee - -typical on top of the fact they think Louisville may get the death penalty or at least some but you know how they are.

Louisville Board saying big news announcement tomorrow morning and that Rick P is going to be fired. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@HighEliteMajor

One possibility is this is only expediently about basketball. Two axes of private oligarchy appear to be struggling over who gets to wage the wars and get the contracts and resources necessary to extend the private central bank hegemony into Syria, Iran, NorKor, and Russia. This struggle exposes fissures in the new world order. Players like Germany in the past allowed to have action in many of the producer oligopolies bridle at some of the risks and costs they are being asked to bear. When they don't play ball, they have to be sanctioned, right? Sanctions are the Tao of Empire that precede subjugation, right? Sanctions take many forms. Lesser players down the food chain recognize they can ply political and economic pressures to serve short sighted seemingly unrelated agendas and get help In doing things, under the rubric of the unofficial sanctioning process. Seemingly unconnected anomalous events, perhaps like this one, appear sometimes as fallout. Time will tell how serious TPTB are about global petroshoe and petroapparel market domination, and whether it is significant to, insignificant to pursuit of grand strategy. Too soon to say much right now IMHO. But I'll ask you this. Do you think the times favor a German shoe company IN American sports against two American shoecos with Nike's and Under Armour's varying origins of political and financial backing, when the USA is apparently frustrated about GERMANY feasting on Russian gas and refusing nukes, er, ABMs, to ring and villify Russia for take down? I half wonder if we won't soon be seeing a Polish tennis shoe company created!!!

Et al,

In strategy, you encircle before attacking the real target.

The more I read about this, the weirder it is.

Shoe Co.'s shovel hundreds of millions to universities, and that's cool.

Adidas sliding $20K to some assistant coaches at Nike/UA schools to basically recruit nike players for adidas sponsorship post-college is, like... Whoah. Call the FBI someone!

@DanR

When a problem is not solvable at one locus, enlarge the locus?

jayballer54 said:

Well went to the Kentucky boards, of Course Kentucky people saying Coach Self is probably sweating like the Niagra Falls under his toupee - -typical on top of the fact they think Louisville may get the death penalty or at least some but you know how they are.

Louisville Board saying big news announcement tomorrow morning and that Rick P is going to be fired. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

They might want to be more concerned with the fact that the FBI just seized the computer of one of Cal's boys, Andy Miller.

DanR said:

The more I read about this, the weirder it is.

Shoe Co.'s shovel hundreds of millions to universities, and that's cool.

Adidas sliding $20K to some assistant coaches at Nike/UA schools to basically recruit nike players for adidas sponsorship post-college is, like... Whoah. Call the FBI someone!

"A fin. advisor was cooperating with gov't. SEC had brought securities fraud against him last year for misusing the athletes money." - DOJ

This all started because they got something on one guy, and he very quickly started helping them uncover more.

@jaybate-1-0 Interesting question ... the answer of course is the one you expect. "America first."

Read off the LJW a few moments ago. KU was not referenced by the US Attorney Joon H Kim in New York City.

Gatto had touted the deal Adidas reached with KU on his social media pages recently, Marchiony though said Gatto" had nothing to do " with the recent negotiations between Ku and Adidas.

As of 3:00 pm KU had had no contact from the Federal government about the probe and added KU had been pro active to find out more information about the situation.

Kim said the investigation was on going and many basketball analysts across the country described that Tuesday was merely the tip of the ice berg. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Anyone ever catch the 30 for 30 film playing for the mob? I feel like we are right in the middle of that and wonder how far it goes. Here's your rat:

In U.S. Department of Justice documents obtained by ESPN, Louis Martin "Marty" Blazer III is the witness who cooperated with the FBI in its investigation of the coaches and other defendants.

Blazer, a former Pittsburgh financial adviser who was accused of swindling $2.35 million from five clients by the Securities and Exchange Commission and founded Blazer Capital Management, was accused of investing money into movies and entertainment ventures without his clients' knowledge between 2010 and 2012. As part of his plea agreement with the U.S. Attorney's office, Blazer agreed to plead guilty to securities fraud, aggravated identity theft, false statements and documents, and two counts of wire fraud, according to the Sept. 19 cooperation agreement.

I think we are entering a new era of political and social activism, strong watchdogs and legal oversight. Everyone wants to drain swamps these days. I wonder if NCAA basketball was Obama's targeted swamp, and this investigation a parting gift to the integrity of the game he loves. Unfortunately, Nike's admirals are yesterday's pirates.

Good news is we have an open scholarship for lets say a big. Maybe Malik Williams?

Guys I'm telling ya look out. - -this thing is really going to steam roll. Like others are saying these guys are going to flip on one another, you could see multiple , multiple schools in a world of shi - - - before this is said and done.

I don't think any school is safe hell we can't say for sure , that we are even safe in this mess from what I'm reading. True we haven't been mentioned - -YET , it could get like many others have said really ugly and really ugly fast before this is all over.

One of the big things is I guess is that Louisville recruit Brian Bowen and/or family took 100 k says one of the last top players to take a bribe. - -FBI states that a top recruit made a surprise commitment to a school 6 - -a lot of their fans are expecting the death penalty. - Talk is that David Padgett will become the interim coach. Lot more gonna happen from this. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

http://247sports.com/Article/FBI-Probe-Indicates-Miami-in-Bidding-War-For-5-Star-Prospect-Nas-108034170 ↗

Crazy stuff, just crazy. Recommend reading this entire article.

@BShark One of Yahoo's reporters is saying South Carolina is involved as well in this. https://www.yahoo.com/sports/fbi-brings-armageddon-college-basketball-just-tip-iceberg-184524346.html ↗

Based on everything out there so far, this is clearly not limited to Adidas, but includes Nike and Under Armour as well.

This also might finally be what allows schools to break away from the NCAA and create a new governing body for college athletics.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

@BShark One of Yahoo's reporters is saying South Carolina is involved as well in this. https://www.yahoo.com/sports/fbi-brings-armageddon-college-basketball-just-tip-iceberg-184524346.html ↗

Yeah from the guy that is now at Okie State I believe. So much to go through.

@Texas-Hawk-10 highly doubtful this changes the govern body. From what I read this would be illegal regardless of what the NCAA says. It will be interesting to see if the UNC, Duke, UK and KUs of the world have hidden their stuff enough. From my sources the NCAA pretty gives a pass to the big name schools as long as they stay in check.

@jayballer54 always liked Padgett. Good for him!

@BShark

This all started because they got something on one guy, and he very quickly started helping them uncover more.

Sometimes I wonder if the FBI might have known of this sort of thing for some time and were PERHAPS encouraged to pursue a potential set of prospective state's witnesses at this time in order to move them up an investigative food chain yielding some prospective benefit to one political interest, or another.

@kjayhawks

Ah, Pittsburg! Home base of the Mellons and the Dapper Dan and Sonny Vacarro!

Have any Jayhawk OADers signed pro commercial contracts with Adidas after leaving KU?

@HighEliteMajor

You ask: is this the end of college basketball? That prompted the following: What if amateur college basketball died quite some time ago and what we have been watching for some time has been entertainment-value driven 🏀 ?

@REHawk after 2015, diallo.

@REHawk

McLemore, Wiggins and Embiid come to mind.

@JayHawkFanToo @REHawk

There were three schemes outlined and the third one was described as a goal to have the athlete agree to sign a contract with Adidas after turning pro. That immediately reminded me of Wiggins who was seen uncharacteristically wearing Adidas shoes the morning of his announcement to come to KU.

@bskeet Don't recruits get things like shoes on visits?

NCAA must be having parties galore. For years they have been hampered by not having subpoena power. Riding on FBI's back must be quite exciting. Like 2001's Star Baby, they are watching all the bombs explode and thinking, "Where to begin?"

Some players either confirmed or speculated to be involved in this whole thing.

Brian "Tugs" Bowen- recieved 100k from Adidas to land at Louisville. Louisville coaches involved. Jordan Fair the assistant in question is also responsible for UL's top recruit in 2018 to date Anfernee Simons. hmmm

Nasir Little - Top 25 2018 recruit. Had KU on his list, long rumored to be going to Arizona.. His AAU coach was arrested. Might have been paid 150k to land at Miami which didn't happen? The last part of that involving Miami's involvement. Little, after hearing of the report reportedly re-opened his recruitment (having not been officially committed anywhere to begin with) then deleted the post. Little was supposed to visit Miami this weekend. Can't imagine he'll be playing College Ball.

DeAndre Ayton. Rumored ASM which was also listed in this whole ordeal funneled 500k to the Ayton family to land at Zona. That would explain the last second ditching of KU...The big CHECK cleared. We'll see how this progresses.

Two other Arizona players are listed but haven't seen which one's yet. Rawle Alkins and Trier would be 2 guesses but we'll see. Maybe Kobe Simmons as well. I'm pretty sure the assistant fired "book" Richardson was directly involved in their recruitments.

Balsa Koprivica- Top 10 2019 recruit KU has been after.

Jahvon Quinerly- Top 30 2018 recruit signed to Arizona.. allegedly paid at least 15k? Was supposed to visit KU before canceling and committing to Miller.

http://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-basketball-men/article175583296.html ↗

DeAthony Melton & Charles O'Bannon of USC. Melton a Soph and O'Bannon the son of Charles O'Bannon. KU was after O'Bannon for a bit.

Hearing the South Carolina players in question could be PJ Dozier & Thornwell, 2 kids largely responsible for their Final 4 run.

As for Auburn, well we already know Pearl was tainted but his assistant is probably tied to them getting any recruit that was highly rated. Wouldn't be surprised to see Heron, Purifoy, Wiley, and incoming freshman Mitchell, Okeke involved in some way.. No way that many Top 100 kids land at Auburn "freely".

@BeddieKU23 KU backed off Simmons and O'Bannon... Gives me a slight pulse of hope.

Several that worry me though, and it's going to be awhile before all the dust settles.

https://sports.yahoo.com/former-aau-basketball-coach-says-wrapped-college-basketball-scandal-will-flip-feds-034806204.html ↗

Highly recommend reading that article fully. Puts stuff in perspective.

I don't know if this article has been posted, but some have mentioned that indicted Lamont Evans from OkState
was an ass't coach at S Carolina previously. He left in April 2016. Here is the local paper's discussion of Evans and more specifics regarding the allegations against him:

http://www.thestate.com/sports/college/university-of-south-carolina/usc-mens-basketball/article175472571.html ↗

Interestingly, he is quoted as leaving SC for OSt because of more lucrative corruption opportunities. Does ESPN or US News rate colleges on a scale for that?

@jaybate-1.0 more likely than not, this one guy was caught committing fraud and that was what opened the investigation. It wasn't a probe into CBB, but a probe into this mans finances that lead to them seeing a much larger illegal activity going on in CBB.

@BShark

I only mentioned that KU was involved in recruiting them. It's reassuring that we didn't wave the biggest check around for any of these guys as we cast a wide net in recruiting and so far nothing that is known that implicates KU doing anything wrong.

But if your Delusional Jeff at Maryland's board all you care about is KU getting tied to this so that he can run some more articles to his subscribers. We might as well make him a We Hate Kansas t-shirt, sweatshirt, coffee mug as a nice starter kit. Sad.

I'm sure Kansas along with every single major Power 5 program is in some sort of damage control. At the least they are holding meetings to discuss if there is anything they need to get ahead of. The big bad wolf is here, not the teacher's pet (NCAA) who might scold and slap you on the wrist. The fallout of this could be catostrophic accross the board or this is the warning shot and things slowly go back to normal. You'd hope if the FBI has more to provide that they continue to drop the hammers because otherwise people will still continue to do business.

Kcmatt7 said:

@jaybate-1.0 more likely than not, this one guy was caught committing fraud and that was what opened the investigation. It wasn't a probe into CBB, but a probe into this mans finances that lead to them seeing a much larger illegal activity going on in CBB.

Correct. More info came out on it. He invested some funds without permission. Of course 2.35 million is a lot of money to appear out of nowhere so it was looked into which lead to the current cases.

BeddieKU23 said:

@BShark

I only mentioned that KU was involved in recruiting them. It's reassuring that we didn't wave the biggest check around for any of these guys as we cast a wide net in recruiting and so far nothing that is known that implicates KU doing anything wrong.

But if your Delusional Jeff at Maryland's board all you care about is KU getting tied to this so that he can run some more articles to his subscribers. We might as well make him a We Hate Kansas t-shirt, sweatshirt, coffee mug as a nice starter kit. Sad.

I'm sure Kansas along with every single major Power 5 program is in some sort of damage control. At the least they are holding meetings to discuss if there is anything they need to get ahead of. The big bad wolf is here, not the teacher's pet (NCAA) who might scold and slap you on the wrist. The fallout of this could be catostrophic accross the board or this is the warning shot and things slowly go back to normal. You'd hope if the FBI has more to provide that they continue to drop the hammers because otherwise people will still continue to do business.

It's on a knife edge with the people currently charged. It sounds like if everyone lawyers up well (duhhh) then at most people are looking at just under 3 years in jail but much more likely significantly less, even if fully convicted. Of course, all it takes is them flipping one more of these guys so that he gives out more names. Then more people get arrested, more schools are implicated and the FBI has more people to try and flip if need be.

@BeddieKU23 Good idea! But a thought here.... Did the CIA ever consider an exploding coffee cup with "Numero Uno Dictator" or "I hate USA" on it for Fidel? Seems like it could have been an entire product line and made it easier to deal with Gaddafi, Khomeini, Saddaam, and so many others. The T-shirts could have itch powder.

Heck, forget the exploding version. How about a certain Leader drinking from a "Make America Glow Again" cup (delivered by Rodman to Rocket Man) with a handle that conveniently breaks to dump hot tea all over his lap?

@BShark

I'm sure there is more that will come out from this.

Merl Code the EYBL guy I'm sure is a brain full of coaches, names, handlers, advisors, runners etc that could be a mile long list.

Will be interesting to see what other information leaks out. Now is the best time if they want the biggest audience.

I'm curious to see what serial handlers will go to jail.

@BeddieKU23 I'M really just kind of shell shockd. - I feel pretty comfortable saying as if I usually stay pretty much in thins but DAM, this is some crazy s- - -. - -Here is something I'll ask maybe possibly others thinking it , but I'll go ahead and ask it.

How many of us on this site and please be honest, how many fear that in some way we ( KU ) doesn't get hit no matter how minor in this whole escapade one way or another? - -Even in the slightest bit. This just seems to large scale, and with us being such a huge partner with Adidas I just worry in some shape or form , and I know I can't be the ONLY one that feels this way at least to some kind of degree. This thing is really going to snowball

Will this whole thing in turn have huge implications with shoe contracts now? - I mean Nike , Armour All, Adidas, - how will this effect the AAU circuit? Lots of questions. - AAU coaches involved, spots agents, shoe companies, Financial Advisors. - -This thing could go for awhile. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Alexander, Diallo, Wiggins, Jackson, Selby. You tell me if KU is clean... Quite ironically, KU could have mostly done fine w/o those players. Jackson I'd argue was vital though.

And I mean, presumably, KU was in a bidding war with Arizona on those recruits they lost out on. That stuff could come out. Likely not very actionable by the FBI since they didn't pay but stuff you could be sanctioned for. Now, if most of the NCAA is guilty, what happens then?

Too many scenarios here to guess at which one plays out.

@jayballer54

KU has nothing to worry about right now. Everyone lawyered up, nobody is going to jail for an eternity here. If some of these people talk to plea down then we'll see what happens.

The 2 most important factors to KU's future I believe are the director of Adidas, what does he say when he's being charged? The other being the EYBL guy Code. Obviously those guys have the opportunity to open another can of worms about a lot of programs.

BeddieKU23 said:

@jayballer54

KU has nothing to worry about right now. Everyone lawyered up, nobody is going to jail for an eternity here. If some of these people talk to plea down then we'll see what happens.

The 2 most important factors to KU's future I believe are the director of Adidas, what does he say when he's being charged? The other being the EYBL guy Code. Obviously those guys have the opportunity to open another can of worms about a lot of programs.

100% agree.

Hold hands and hope, lol.

If Cliff Alexander had been involved, his mom wouldn't have had to get a loan.

@DanR Literally my same thoughts. Not overly worried about him.

PAGE 37 of a maryland thread about this and Bill Self is still dirty and they are snap-shotting what should be a live look at Self's home when the FBI comes calling. sad world

@BeddieKU23 Maryland fans should be more worried about how they came up with this so called fab 5 recruiting class

@BeddieKU23 Everyone thinks because Adidas reps we're involved... Funny because the only school popped so far that was Adidas was Louisville (who everyone had to know was paying players after they never missed a beat even after having a massive scandal).

They might find information someone got paid, but it won't be because we knew about it. I don't even think that they would make us vacate wins.

The funniest thing, is that UK fans keep saying we are dirty. When Camby got caught taking money and CLEARLY was paid to go to UMass. The number 1 recruit in the country picks UMass.... Give me a break. But, really good stuff over on the rafters today. Entertaining.

3genhawk said:

@BeddieKU23 Maryland fans should be more worried about how they came up with this so called fab 5 recruiting class

Don't worry their long standing history of landing top recruits sets them apart from any of the mess. They are completely clean, free to roam about the landscape.

@Kcmatt7

There is a lot of good stuff going on everywhere. Louisville fans are pissed at their mod for wanting the program to start over fresh. Some of them want their AD to keep his job, you know the same one that's been there for now a 3rd scandal involving the basketball program alone. So even the schools directly in the mud have the delusional types coming out of the woodworks to say otherwise.

I couldn't make my way to UK's board if I was given a bribe. Funny, I know.

Presently it doesn't seem like Kentucky has much to worry about, which is the same boat I put KU in. Them pointing fingers at us is just a childish mental decision.

The FBI caught who they caught for now, if they uncover more as the fallout continues then maybe some of the bigger programs such as KU, UK, Duke etc will have something to worry about. Then the little guys can have something to cry about.

Of the Elite's, Arizona is definitely going to see some fallout. Sean Miller was interviewed by the FBI this week. Pitino is going to be fired and from everything he's put Louisville through, its long overdue.

I'll be interested in seeing what people have to say in a few weeks when this starts to fade from people's thoughts. This will be a very slow process I think

ESPN reporting Both Pitino and AD have been fired

I'll be interested in seeing what the NCAA does to the current players. They should have the ability to find a new future without restriction. I can't imagine any of their 2018 class will stick. They were loading up on talent once again.

:door: :wave:

Feels like a Christmas game of Russian Roulette.. festive, yet...

@BeddieKU23 Good point. We still have an open scholarship and PT in the front court... Malik Williams wouldn't hurt my feelings.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 Good point. We still have an open scholarship and PT in the front court... Malik Williams wouldn't hurt my feelings.

If he would still be eiligible and could freely transfer, then he should definitely be considered.

@BShark I think so for sure. Not to mention, he wouldn't be like a normal commit. He's been weightlifting and practicing all summer so he still shouldn't be too far behind besides learning the offense/plays. Another 7-footer added to this team is just terrifying.

Or we could add PG depth if Pearl gets the boot. Davion Mitchell could be Dotson insurance.

The more I look, the programs in trouble were able to sign guys super early. Almost like they were able to figure out who was for sale early and then take that approach with them and get them signed as soon as the early signing period opened up.

Kcmatt7 said:

The more I look, the programs in trouble were able to sign guys super early. Almost like they were able to figure out who was for sale early and then take that approach with them and get them signed as soon as the early signing period opened up.

I'm cautiously optimistic with KU. It never made sense to me how AZ and others were able to have crazy depth while KU struggled to get non-wing players. I mean KU has been filling the cracks with transfers and has 9 eligible players this year. Now I considered that a problem, but if it means KU wasn't directly and profusely cheating well that's pretty great.

@mayjay It wasn't that he was given shoes...

The story goes something like this... I think it was Kurtis Townsend that was recruiting Wiggins. If you recall, there wasn't a strong indication to know which way he was going. On the day of the announcement, KT called Wiggins' coach to see if he had any news..

The coach said something like, I don't know but, today he's wearing adidas shoes if that's any indication.

The way I read it was that he had traditionally been wearing Nikes prior to that.. I think he had been in Nike camps and such, so folks thought it was a foregone conclusion he would go to a Nike school.

@bskeet Yea I think Adidas did strike a deal with Wiggins. Doesn't mean money exchanged hands until after he graduated. But I would bet that they guaranteed to beat Nike's offer for him no matter what. His parents were both pro athletes and everyone involved seemed to have a good head on their shoulders. I doubt they took money, knowing it could cost them millions in the long run.

Adidas can still help to persuade kids to come to KU. But it is going to take lucrative endorsement deals, and following through on promises made. They will have to build a reputation that the offer they make you before college is the one you get when you leave college.

bskeet said:

The way I read it was that he had traditionally been wearing Nikes prior to that.. I think he had been in Nike camps and such, so folks thought it was a foregone conclusion he would go to a Nike school.

But he is wearing Adidas in the pros...

I'd bet he had a deal in place prior to picking KU.

The whole thing is corrupt and I am tired of it. Id be fine with all minor leagues at this point. None of these kids want to go to school. I cringe listening to these "college educated" guys barely speak English any time a microphone is in their face.

I just cancelled NFL Sunday Ticket and honestly college basketball is next. I have better things to do with my time.

Time to quote the good book. The love of money is the root of all evil, or in the NCAA version, the love of winning lots of basketball games is the root of all evil.

🐦 View Tweet

Buckle up.

@BShark I have never wished more on them finding things on UK in my life. I would love to see Cal go down in the worst way...

@Kcmatt7 Wow you are right about a lot of the $$ commitments, they happened early in the cycle. Simons probably got paid by Louisville and he committed in his JR year.

Alexander still concerns me. I know his mom took a loan. It was pretty well known that his recruitment was shady and that he wanted money. My main hope is just that KU wasn't involved directly.

Of course Self benched Alexander when he found out about the loan at least...

@BeddieKU23 wichita state fans also have a pic of a dump truck

@BShark I still don't buy that Cliff's mom, on her own, got a loan. I think Cliff was behind it all. The important issue was did Coach Self immediately suspend Cliff when the news broke. I'm of the opinion that this recruitment fiasco vindicates Coach Self. How many players have we lost to AZ over the past 5 or so years?

DanR said:

If Cliff Alexander had been involved, his mom wouldn't have had to get a loan.

That's a real knee slapper. Thanks for the laugh.

If the FBI is looking at the kind of guys shoe companies want to pay they should start looking at the 2 schools that sign 1/3 of the 5 star guys annually! Arizona and Louisville were just starting to reach their true potential with funneling recruits to their schools BUT 2 other schools have already perfected it.

@BShark niiiiice!

This is dangerous for Kansas. I am very concerned. The web will expand. We should hold our collective breath.

@BShark I know. They aren't even smart about it. If I can take 15 minutes and figure it out, the FBI sure as hell can.

What is funny, think about the Bamba story that happened earlier in the summer. Doesn't look so far fetched anymore.

I really don't worry about Cliff. It seems like he wanted money, and as soon as that happened, UK and MSU dropped him like it was nothing. KU stayed in, but we had the leverage at that point. Who were we going to get in a bidding war with? Depaul? Illinois? Doesn't seem logical. Nobody paid for Cliff so his mom found another way to get paid.

HighEliteMajor said:

This is dangerous for Kansas. I am very concerned. The web will expand. We should hold our collective breath.

If its dangerous for KU then just about every team in the country is going to get the death penalty! The NCAA would lose hundreds of millions if they were to issue Death Penalty's to the masses! I think HCBS has kept his nose clean ONLY because KU's recruiting classes would look much better or more like our peers if he was dirty! Only my opinion and you have every reason to be concerned!

@Statmachine If our program was "dirty", then how did we lose Ayton in 1 weekend? After being the clear front runner for 2 years? I already eviscerated an Indiana fan who decided to post "Seeing that Kansas may be involved now..."I asked for proof, and his proof was we're an Adidas school. Of course, when I pointed out that IU was an Adidas school as well, he back pedaled in a big way. You can't miss as many recruits as we've missed, if we were "cheating".

I'm trying to figure out which players are in the DoJ report.

• Player 10 - Bowen
• Player 11 - Afernee Simmons? It is a Louisville recruit. Just can't figure out who.
• Player 12 - Little
• Player 9 - ? Currently plays for USC.

@DanR

DanR said:

If Cliff Alexander had been involved, his mom wouldn't have had to get a loan.

Maybe his mom spent the money too fast?

@JayHawkFanToo Cliff drove around in a brand new car at KU. Yeah, he knew nothing about the loan ( wink wink nudge ).

[

BeddieKU23 said:

ESPN reporting Both Pitino and AD have been fired

Pitino has been placed on un paid administrative leave, - Jurich has been placed on paid administrative leave. - -The interim Coach will have the say about other coaching staff - -interim Coach will or should be named within 48 hours.

Both the Simmons kid right? and their other top notch recruit de-committed within the hour of Pitino being put on un-paid leave. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jaybate-1.0 yah. I didn't connect Self's comments on retiring n 5 yrs to this. but it cant be coincidence. I seriously doubt any wrong doing by Self. Hes a boyscout. But could easily be tired of the recruiting asymmetry which will worsen with the hammer dropping on Adidas.

@Lulufulu Nike looks like they are getting smashed too. The entire Nike EYBL league just got subpoenas. Guarantee that there was money illegally funneled through there. Nike is about to be in way more trouble than Adidas I think.

Adidas stock, down .1%

Nike stock, down 2%.

That is a very significant drop for Nike in comparison.

I think everyone is sensing that if Nike is involved at the same level Adidas is, and there are 3 times as many Nike schools, shit is about to go down. Especially with people turning on each other now, expect news to just continually leak over the next several months. All of this should eventually be made public record as well so the NCAA will have all the evidence they need in order to have a field day. The fact that the Nike EYBL just got raided means Nike schools should be freaking out right now.

Kcmatt7 said:

I'm trying to figure out which players are in the DoJ report.

• Player 10 - Bowen
• Player 11 - Afernee Simmons? It is a Louisville recruit. Just can't figure out who.
• Player 12 - Little
• Player 9 - ? Currently plays for USC.

Player 11 is almost certainly Balsa.

@BShark Didn't they say that Quinerly got 20k a week or so ago when he committed to AZ?

KUSTEVE said:

@BShark Didn't they say that Quinerly got 20k a week or so ago when he committed to AZ?

Yeah, seems cheap tbh, lol.

@Kcmatt7 Could I borrow your post?

@BShark All those people that were slamming Bill for not recruiting well.....OMG. They meet with KU, find out there's no money coming from us, and they sign with the money train ( AZ ).

@KUSTEVE I'm not as much of a true believer as you. I sure hope you are right though. Rumours abound right now that people are already flipping others.

Maybe they bring in Larry Brown as interim coach to ensure a squeaky clean probationary period for UL. After all he has lots of experience.

At being interim, I mean. Squeaky clean? Well, not so much.

@BShark Yep makes sense

@KUSTEVE Borrow whatever you like. I do expect a cut from any money you make though.

BShark said:

@KUSTEVE I'm not as much of a true believer as you. I sure hope you are right though. Rumours abound right now that people are already flipping others.

I'm just worried myself , with this as being as big as it is , and we have a LONG way to go on this, your going to see ALOT of recruits re-open their process Simmons & Ramey already de-committed from Louisville. I'm just afraid with KU being such a big part of Adidas, for us to come out in touched in some form shape or another, hopefully IF anything would be minor, like I was hearing off a podcast this is certainly going to put a cloud over College basketball for some time of course old Fran was talking about how happy he was this had happened , saying he had talked to a lot of College Coaches and for the most part these Coaches were trying to do it the right way.

Could really put a halt to any early commits to see how this plays out and what Schools are going to get what. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

There was actually a pretty good post about this on the phog that I tend to agree with.

It's extremely likely that the vast majority of schools have had player(s) that were paid by the shoecos. That, quite frankly, isn't even controllable. They were bidding on kids to go to Adidas, Nike, UA schools. The difference is if there was direct involvement with assistant coaches or not. So, say Adidas wins out for Wiggins, promises him a big contract after school. He just has to pick an Adidas school. Well okay let's call up Kansas and commit, only Adidas school on his list. This does line-up with the KU coaches being somewhat surprised with his commitment IF you believe that.

Well, I think how KU recruits in the next month or two will tell us how our staff feels about being involved. I'm sure Bill had a heart to heart with each coach to make sure we are or are not involved in anything.

Either we will be aggressive and take advantage of the upcoming chaos with a monster class (and possibly an eligible big man to bolster our front line this year, but that would just be crazy lucky), or we will be in damage control. I think the staff's actions over the next few weeks will speak a lot towards their innocence.

Let me tell you about a mystery recruit. Name rhymes with Mason Baitem. Mason grew up watching KU on tv. His family had multiple KU fans in fact, I believe a grad as well. But, Mason was a Nike kid. So when it came time for his final cut, his childhood team did not make the list. This came as a shock to some, but SWOOSH there it is. Ultimately Mason ends up at a school that rhymes with Puke.

Names changed to protect the "innocent".

Do I believe Duke directly cheated there? Probably not. I would imagine Duke just takes advantage of being a premier brand and Nike.

KUSTEVE said:

@BShark All those people that were slamming Bill for not recruiting well.....OMG. They meet with KU, find out there's no money coming from us, and they sign with the money train ( AZ ).

PHOF!

@BShark Not even a glance from him. Never understood. Worked out fine in the end. But then there is always the, what if scenario if we got both him and JJ. What a trio we could have had. Or even, imagine the 5 guard lineup with JJ at the 4 and JT at the 5...

I'm hoping this all works in our favor. This bomb being dropped could be just what Bill needed to land those National Championship pieces we keep losing out to schools at the last second for apparently unknown reasons.

Ok, how about this one? Louie-ville turns around, and hires Little Pitino ...wouldn't that be hilarious???? I don't think that would ever happen, but wouldn't that be funny as hell?

@mayjay lololol. how about bringing in Pitino's son? make it an "all in the family" job.

@Kcmatt7 The fact they set up a recruiting visit for Langford ( if he is half the player Keith was, I want him ) speaks volumes, in my books.

It kind of blows me away that Louisville is going to get the death penalty (potentially anyways) after this but they didn't get it after using hookers to recruit players.

I saw the shoe crap coming a mile away.

Another cheating that HAS to be going on as well is freshman eligibility. If you are under 35 years old you probably don't remember when the SAT was actually hard for these academic genius basketball players. Prop 48 came around in 1986 and back then players actually couldn't get the necessary scores on the SAT or ACT. Studs like Larry Johnson(Jr college route), Glenn "Big Dog" Robinson(out his freshman year), etc, etc couldn't get the grades.

So of course after being barraged with calls of racism the NCAA changed the requirements a bit. Instead of just the SAT and ACT having a score you absolutely must get, they introduced a sliding scale. They now use a combination of high school gpa and a sliding scale test score needed. So if you get a 3.0 in high school you only need a 620 SAT. Of course if you actually earned an HONEST 3.0 then scoring a freaking 800 should be easy. So you can see where this would lead. Fixing high school grades. That way if that is ever caught the colleges have nothing to do with it. See Darrell Arthur.

People at all levels are using these kids and could care less if they actually get an education.

@wissox It's the cumulative effect of having so many major violations in such a short timeframe that'll get them a potential death penalty.

Arizona is also likely to get a pretty steep punishment as well based on the number of players they have involved as well as an assistant coach involved as well.

@BigBad As a veteran inner city school teacher, all you have to do to earn a 3.0 is come to school and work hard. We have so many low performing students that we reward kids for their hard work. There often is a huge disconnect between ACT scores and GPA in our schools.

BShark said:

Do I believe Duke directly cheated there? Probably not. I would imagine Duke just takes advantage of being a premier brand and Nike.

And now Nike is being pulled in - - seen this off the Louisville board - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@wissox Exactly. This is why you hardly ever see any ineligible freshman. Not that the kids are smarter now. They have such low expectations to meet.

@mayjay According to a KC Star article ↗ a couple weeks ago, Larry Brown is available.

Actually, in this story, Brown mentions being best buddies with Silvio De Sousa's 32-year-old "guardian," Fenny Palmagne. Also the guardian of Bruno Fernando who is going to play for Turg at Maryland this year.

Not that any of that makes me nervous or anything about De Sousa's sudden surprise decision to go to KU or anything.

Nike handlers had dirt on the FBI handlers who.....and so on and so forth.

And add Bama to the list of programs that are taking a hit. No surprise. Ferguson and Sexton come to mind. Starting to make more sense.

@Kcmatt7 Hmmmm, and Bama ends up at Kentucky. - - well now wonder how that happened? - - -Did Kentucky send some money his way or some kind of way. - -Something about Kentucky smells in this whole thing too. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Kcmatt7 said:

And add Bama to the list of programs that are taking a hit. No surprise. Ferguson and Sexton come to mind. Starting to make more sense.

Looks like this came from an internal investigation too. Makes sense, sacrifice basketball people because lawd forbid anyone sniffs around their football program too long!

jayballer54 said:

@Kcmatt7 Hmmmm, and Bama ends up at Kentucky. - - well now wonder how that happened? - - -Did Kentucky send some money his way or some kind of way. - -Something about Kentucky smells in this whole thing too. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

World Wide Wes.

We will find out quickly just how bulletproof Cal is.

Rumours are flying about UK right now. Might be nailed for Quickley. Might be someone at Miami turning. Miami supposedly offered 150k but UK went to 250k to close.

@wissox

Louisville is already on schedule to forfeit well over 100 games, its national title and final four appearances; it is now under appeal and based on the new events likely will not prevail.

I never minded Louisville during the Denny Crum years, but Pitino is such an arrogant jerk I've despised them. IMHO they stole the title from Michigan, or if you will, were handed the title by some pretty bad officiating. The block by Trey Burke on the fast break was a spectacular block and the refs called it a foul. I turned the game off at that point. Pitino's sordid affair in the bar bathroom and subsequent abortion was awful, the prostitutes. Man this school made Tarkanian look like St. Paul.

@BShark links?

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark links?

Phog, twitter. NOTHING SUBSTANTIAL YET IMO.

@BShark I want that to be true.

@BeddieKU23

Until an agent with ties to Nike lean power players and Nike contracted schools, and a Nike official both fall in this case, i can't yet take the stand that this involves the cavalry coming.

It has to be Quickly. The report states that Miami had offered a player 150k, and was outbid. Oh my goodness. Is the Squid's day of judgement finally on us?

For these implicated programs, hopefully this opportunity to clean house thoroughly is not wasted. Also, I think this is an opportunity for the NCAA to reassert itself and find a new identity amidst the ashes of moral bankruptcy. Maybe they could start by banning Nike, Adidas and Under Armour from sponsoring any college teams. Can they do that?

KUSTEVE said:

It has to be Quickly. The report states that Miami had offered a player 150k, and was outbid. Oh my goodness. Is the Squid's day of judgement finally on us?

The player in the report is Nas Little. Quickley is new speculation.

@approxinfinity I doubt the NCAA can regulate that. Somebody has to make the uniforms for programs.

@Texas-Hawk-10 I'm pretty sure there are a few other sports apparel companies that would gladly take on ncaam contracts?

@jaybate-1.0 Gatto has ties to Nike. I highly doubt he just started buying players at Adidas so if he starts squealing about what he did at Nike and who was involved there, then there could be some major implications at Nike as well.

@Texas-Hawk-10 I didn't mean football. That's a lot more equipment... I mean, until the other (football) shoe falls.

@approxinfinity

The NCAA's likely job appears to be to blame this on those without deep enough legal pockets to fight back (I.e., assistant coaches), and save the big petroshoeco checks for the "member institutions."

College basketball would not even be in this nightmare had the NCAA ever adequately done its nominal job.

Hoping for the NCAA to clean up college basketball is like hoping for a metadrug cartel to clean up the drug business.

@jaybate-1.0 so the first step is determining what we would like the NCAA to be and do, and step two is to hit social media hard and demand justice right? Isn't this how it works in today's America? Should we start tweeting the hell out of #ncaa #shoeco #corruption #basketball ?

@Texas-Hawk-10

If Gatto left Nike for adidas, then I would think it likely this story comes to a screeching halt. Gatto takes his medice, a couple assistants take the fall, and its play ball and resume wall of silence on not just a swamp, but a tar pit.

@jaybate-1.0 I would say it largely depends on how much prison time Gatto is looking at. We know he's not of high character so I wouldn't be at all surprised if he starts throwing everyone under the bus to avoid as much prison time as possible without regard for Nike or Adidas affiliation.

@Texas-Hawk-10 Jim Gatto's new shoe affiliation: https://www.bobbarker.com/products.html ↗

@Texas-Hawk-10 gatto has been w/adidas a long time. It was another guy that recently switched from Nike to adidas. http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2017/09/adidas_nike_officials_charged.html ↗

@approxinfinity

I'm not yet knowledgeable enough to suggest specific reform, but yes, that's partly how it works. The Drake Group awhile back proposed abolishing the NCAA and replacing it with a federally chartered corporation with a Presidentially appointed commissioner that runs the game, if I recall correctly. I've been expecting them to surface shortly and argue racism with all the assistants being AfAm and abolish the NCAA.

Many want control of this D1 cash cow . I wonder if the FBI were tipped off by some that wish to become the new head honchos of D1. No evidence yet.

Advocating reform paths first requires identifying both the axis of private oligarchy that controls it now, AND the one that is willing to tip the FBI to start the destabilization of the NCAA to acquire control of it. We want both those groups kept as far from the game as possible.

Gaming, media, shoes and agents have to fenced completely out of control; this much is obvious. But at this scale of global gaming, media, shoes and agencies, we are dealing as much with the biggest of the big private oligarchies, and that in turn means their intelligence and mil-int Deep Staters. I truly believe it goes this deep. Global sports is too big for the Big Dogs to leave alone. It represents propaganda power, black money laundering through gaming, oil demand for migrating from natural to synthetic fibers, mind control through marketing, and so on. Any one of these are too big and important to leave to chance, or appropriation by an enemy.

So: Our only chance to save basketball from total engineered subordination (Rollerball-ization) to the NWO (which is already here and established in most sectors) is to come up with a reform framework that either enlists TPTB in sports legitimacy, or pits them all against each other as checks and balances.

I'm just not smart enough to know what would be feasible and for the best. I am sorry.

But there does appear a possible window.

Rock Chalk!

Save the Greatest Game Ever Invented!

@jaybate-1.0 I would love to see a group controlling CBB that opens up broadcast rights to local channels and a la carte offerings.

It seems much stronger consumer advocacy groups could keep people perpetually vigilant and rejecting the major shoecos, affiliated AAU programs, and college programs, and would be able to encourage people to reject big media if they didn't have a coverage Monopoly. There is a need.

Anyone have a Nike flag they can film, burn, and post on Twitter?

@Crimsonorblue22 Thanks for posting what I didn't want to take the time to. I'm so tired sometimes I just let people believe whatever they want to post. I miss having Mike in da mix. Just ain't the same without his take. Didja see Paulo kick ass & take names tonight? Just like old times girl !! Is the last hurrah 😁 for Daytons guys now so bittersweet just makes me grab the brandy & ice water 💦.

I did! Not missing Sunday. Heading to late pm sat.

@Crimsonorblue22 Enjoy 😊 & drive safe. Gotta have savvy in this day & age, good intentions ain't enough. A little.32 cal in that Coach bag would help too.Woman in OP yesterday KO'ed a thuggery with a groin kick on Indianan Creek jogging trail. Dumped a can of whoopass on him, yeeeaaaah!! Now he can sing soprano .

@Kcmatt7 @KUSTEVE @BeddieKU23 Ok so Collin Sexton took 25k from Bama. I'm feeling better about KU slowly here. If KU was dirty, no way Sexton gets away that cheap right?

@BShark should our recent re- up with Adidas for $191 mill over 14 years worry us?

Can we "decommit" from Adidas; how about Puma? LaGerald doesn't mind rocking soccer shorts I'm sure. Their shoes run narrow but surely they have a wide model.

approxinfinity said:

@BShark should our recent re- up with Adidas for $191 mill over 14 years worry us?

Can we "decommit" from Adidas; how about Puma? LaGerald doesn't mind rocking soccer shorts I'm sure. Their shoes run narrow but surely they have a wide model.

I'd be more worried about a "recruit from 2010".

BShark said:

@Kcmatt7 @KUSTEVE @BeddieKU23 Ok so Collin Sexton took 25k from Bama. I'm feeling better about KU slowly here. If KU was dirty, no way Sexton gets away that cheap right?

Is it confirmed he got the money..

What I was reading is his father met with Michel who wanted to steer him to someone for the NBA? They facilitated money for that. But you have to think there had to be $ involved before hand too.

But yes so far nothing that points to KU doing anything dirty.. Maryland fans on page 60 something still claiming KU is

The NCAA must be really pissed, they have a lot more work to do now lol

The funny thing is the state of Alabama probably just found out yesterday they have a basketball program.

@mayjay Bob Barker products.... Come on down Jim, you're the next contestant on The Price is Right! ;)

Does anyone remember who the lead assistant was on the 2010 recruit that wasn't Woolridge?

approxinfinity said:

@Texas-Hawk-10 Jim Gatto's new shoe affiliation: https://www.bobbarker.com/products.html ↗

PHOF times 10!

If Sexton's dad accepted money he has to be ineligible right? How is this any different then Cliff Alexander.

@BShark

Where are you going with in regards to that?

@BShark Yep. And it's ironic how it is always guys that the staff recruited their asses off for. We watched Sexton how many times? Visited him over and over. Put in the work. And then it slips away "because Avery Johnson played in the NBA and he knows what he's doing." I always knew that was bullshit. Makes a ton more sense now.

BeddieKU23 said:

@BShark

Where are you going with in regards to that?

Rumours flying that FBI is digging particularly deep into the Baltimore area. Not sure what the statute of limitations is, but that was one that definitely didn't smell right. Hopefully KU is clean that far back.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark Yep. And it's ironic how it is always guys that the staff recruited their asses off for. We watched Sexton how many times? Visited him over and over. Put in the work. And then it slips away "because Avery Johnson played in the NBA and he knows what he's doing." I always knew that was bullshit. Makes a ton more sense now.

Yeah I'd buy staying close to home over Avery Johnson knows what he is doing. Ha.

KU was def on Sexton early. Tried real hard on that one.

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

@BShark

Where are you going with in regards to that?

Rumours flying that FBI is digging particularly deep into the Baltimore area. Not sure what the statute of limitations is, but that was one that definitely didn't smell right. Hopefully KU is clean that far back.

So are you talking about Selby?

Yes. It's all crazy rumours until something is official. Great time for trolls and fake twitter accounts though I guess.

Most of the the bromides about recruiting became BS in the petroshoeco era.

He's great closing with parents.

They had the PT to offer.

His girl friend is there.

He wants to play for the best.

He wants a coach that will challenge him.

He loves the tradition.

It's the housing.

He is tight with the assistant.

His dad went there.

He wants to play with his friend.

He grew up watching them.

He loves the weather there.

They've won a ring recently.

That coach can really relate to the new generation.

It's the way they stage their late night.

ALL COMPLETE AND UTTER BULLSHIT.

It appears to be the money.

P...S.: I have long hoped that players would be paid legally. as one is for most any kind of job, so that the greatest game ever invented did not get caught up in this kind of issue.

@BShark Appears that the SOL is 5 years.

Under federal statute 18 USC 3282, individuals are protected from prosecution for any noncapital offense in which an indictment is not found within five years of the criminal act. In most cases, noncapital federal offenses that do not meet these guidelines cannot be prosecuted. However, the repercussions of federal criminal corruption are so far-reaching that, in practice, a revelation about corruption can result in probable cause for a thorough investigation that may uncover current corruption, whether intentional or not.

@Kcmatt7 Interesting. Really hope KU gets through this clean.

@BShark Any major program that gets through this cleanly will automatically have a leg up in recruiting I think. If we do get through this clean, Bill really will be looked at as a boy scout nationally. And I really do think that will go a long way.

@Kcmatt7 Rumours flying that KU will be named today. Not from anywhere substantial yet though. So maybe just jealousy and trolls.

BShark said:

@Kcmatt7 Rumours flying that KU will be named today. Not from anywhere substantial yet though. So maybe just jealousy and trolls.

Definitely trolling. Crazy times we are in

@BShark I did find that Townsend was lead on Selby. And Wiggins. And Jackson. And Ayton. If we have a coach who is a problem, it is him.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark I did find that Townsend was lead on Selby. And Wiggins. And Jackson. And Ayton. If we have a coach who is a problem, it is him.

Welp.

!alt text ↗

@BShark Was that from the AAU team?

@BShark Who was that from?

@BShark But, we lost Ayton. Jackson signed with UA. And Wiggins didn't need money. Selby also probably took money from Adidas and so he picked Tennessee. UT ended up getting investigated for the Aaron Craft debacle and he decomitted and ended up at KU. So far, nothing to worry about other than the coincedence that KU landed 3 guys in late spring that were recruited by Towns who is known as a phenomenal recruiter. We lost out to Ayton early, and we know he was paid.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark Was that from the AAU team?

Yes.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark But, we lost Ayton. Jackson signed with UA. And Wiggins didn't need money. Selby also probably took money from Adidas and so he picked Tennessee. UT ended up getting investigated for the Aaron Craft debacle and he decomitted and ended up at KU. So far, nothing to worry about other than the coincedence that KU landed 3 guys in late spring that were recruited by Towns who is known as a phenomenal recruiter. We lost out to Ayton early, and we know he was paid.

Fair enough. I'm still on the cautiously optimistic plan.

@Kcmatt7 just imagine how ESPN will be forced to parade KU around as a poster boy for college basketball, as if by acknowledging the program's cleaniness, they somehow cohabitate the same moral high ground! I can hear all the backhanded compliments now!

@BShark If true, makes the Quickley thing seem more legit. Especially combined with the Baltimore area thing. If the name Jide Sodipo gets mixed in with anything, expect a lot of teams to start freaking out.

@BShark I am too. I'll continue to do research and try to find weak spots.

At this point, Towns is the guy too look into. Howard scared me because he is young and could be trying to make a name for himself. But I haven't found anything yet from him that scares me.

@BShark

So if its not Little then its Quickley right?

what is going on here..

BeddieKU23 said:

@BShark

So if its not Little then its Quickley right?

what is going on here..

The player in the report was always Little. Quickley is just speculation at the moment. I think I mentioned that at the time but this is all becoming a blur.

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

@BShark

So if its not Little then its Quickley right?

what is going on here..

The player in the report was always Little. Quickley is just speculation at the moment. I think I mentioned that at the time but this is all becoming a blur.

So then I don't understand why they are trying to say it's not them. Its the frickin FBI, they are not trolling people.

I just saw on ESPN that Nike's EYBL division has just been served a subpoena related to this.

@BShark I think the outbidding scheme involved Little instead of Quickley. I mean, everybody knows Kentucky pays their players, but it still has to be proven. So, i was giddy, hoping it was quickley, but it looks like we'll have to wait to hear the kentucky sordid details. It shouldn't take very long.

KUSTEVE said:

@BShark I think the outbidding scheme involved Little instead of Quickley. I mean, everybody knows Kentucky pays their players, but it still has to be proven. So, i was giddy, hoping it was quickley, but it looks like we'll have to wait to hear the kentucky sordid details. It shouldn't take very long.

See my earlier post. 100% the one named in the report was Little and it was between Zona and Miami. The Quickley with Miami thing is a currently unsupported claim.

So two years into an investigation and now a couple days later with much more being exposed and the only maybe with Kansas is Selby? The same Selby that was first committed elsewhere and we already know had some impermissible benefits issues. This seems pretty good so far.

Minor concern with Newman and Miss St but there wouldn't be any wrong doing by Kansas in that situation. It would just pretty much derail the current season if Malik can't play of course.

@BShark

Is there anything they are looking into as far as Miss St?

Seems like fans just throwing darts at the board and picking any kid. Malik's father was an alum at Miss St..

I know that is a roster chalk full of "how the heck did these Top 100 kids land here" So it certainly fits the bill, like Auburn did in that regard

Not concerned about Selby seems how the NCAA already derailed him 7 years ago.

"For those wondering about the FBI report's coding...Courtesy of the Phog

Universities:
1 - Auburn
2 - South Carolina
3 - Oklahoma State
4 - Arizona
5 - USC
6 - Louisville
7 - Miami (FL)

Players
1 - Likely Mustapha Heron, Auburn
2 - Likely Austin Wiley OR Danjel Purifoy, Auburn
3 - P.J. Dozier, NBA via South Carolina
4 - Jeffrey Carroll, NBA via Oklahoma State
5 - Jahvon Quinerly, Arizona commit
6 - unspecified Arizona player
7 - unspecified Arizona player
8 - Charles O'Bannon Jr., USC
9 - De'Anthony Melton, USC
10 - Brian Bowen, Louisville
11 - Balsa Koprivica, Louisville target
12 - Nassir Little, Miami target"

I'd like to thank Bama and Zona and the Ville for giving us something interesting to talk about leading up to late night. First time in months this board has come alive!

Surprised the Arizona players haven't been confirmed yet. Seems how Book recruited the east Rawle Alkins, Brandon Randolph would fit that description. Randolph landing at Arizona always seemed to be out of place to me

Alkins is out 3-4 months with a broken foot now too. I'll be surprised if Ayton isn't linked to something like the ASM thing.

Looks like the news trail is slowing downnn. Now we wait for the random news report..

@BeddieKU23 more subpoenas will come. Have to sort through all the fraud after that though. And figure out who knew. What invoices were fake. All that forensic accounting takes a lot of time and effort.

Curious that Ben Simmons and LSU is not in the mix. That was a head scratcher.

@bskeet There were some family ties. Not sure if Nike schools are a part of this whole fiasco, but LSU is Nike.

@bskeet Ben Simmons godfather was on staff at LSU.

Well, Well , Well. here we go guys. - 1st and foremost let me preface this by saying this is coming off the Rupp Rafters Kentucky Board

A story linked between KU & Zion Williamson, Reportingly a story coming from some place called Chat sports.com

It reads that the Adidas Rep that is facing fraud charges that steered the 2017 recruit to Louisville ( Brian Bowen ) was also trying to influence 2018 Super Recruit to commit to Kansas. We know who that is ( Zion ) . multiple sources told chat sports this afternoon.

The sources have been independently sourced. ( One inside the big 12 with Coaching ties to the SEC - - I think we all should know if this is truly the case who that would be -the Oklahoma State asst right? and another recruiting expert close to South Carolina AAU basketball. - -- and both provided nearly identical information.

Story says the Adidas employee that was arrested on Tuesday had been taking a similar approach with the prospect on behalf of Kansas. The sources both of them say it was un clear if anyone on the Kansas Coaching Staff knew about Adidas interfering in the recruitment of Williamson.

The story talk about how Williamson was supposed to visit Kentucky but Cancelled, and waiting to see, Williamson has a scheduled visit to KU this weekend but waiting to see if he ends up going to KU opening event.

Earlier today Williamson shared the following message
on his Instagram ( Today ain't the day man , sad day for the family ,
no drama today please )

I'm holding judgement on this whole thing. - -Like one poster said all these big time news sources digging for information but yet some place call chat sports has got this? - - hmmm, but IF - -and a big IF if this turns out to be true but yet the Coaching Staff didn't know anything then I would strongly suggest we put the skids on the recruitment of Zion way to risky. - - -what ya all think. - -you can read the entire story off the Uk Boards under KU and Zion Story of course Uk fans eating this up. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

They're probably giddy just like we'd be giddy for hearing crap about Kentuck. I guess we'll see how it plays out. Doesn't sound real substantial right now.

@jayballer54 posted by matt scott

I'm totally shocked that a South Carolina, Frank Martin fan and Duke lover would write this. #NOTATALL
https://t.co/XZfABzNZCL ↗ https://t.co/GVpDo9wgKT ↗

@3genhawk Is that who wrote this? - I never heard of this site. Like I said I'm not putting a lot of worth in it - -& Kentucky idiots just thriving on it lol. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Considering how late KU entered the picture with Zion, I wouldn't be at all shocked if there's some truth to Adidas trying to push Zion to KU.

@jayballer54 1st link is the story, 2nd is the guy who wrote it.

@jayballer54 I've never heard of the author, the website, or the new poster who used one of their first posts to share this with us.

@KUSTEVE I shared it you goof lol. I know you know me lol, but the site that put this out - - ummm no. - -ROCK CHALK ALL ADY LONG BABY

@KUSTEVE That is because It's fake news.

@BShark Well we can always hope. I don't really believe there is much substance to it. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

jayballer54 said:

@BShark Well we can always hope. I don't really believe there is much substance to it. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

No real sources. Hack writer that is a Duke fan. Lol.

I asked this before. - -Let me ask again , if it came down to it and you had to choose , which one would you rather have - -Romeo Langford - OR Quinten Grimes. - -Me myself?- -I think I would go with Grimes more of a complete player. - It has been stated that some things come to easy for Langford and has a tendency to try and slide - take some plays off - -Grimes bust his ass so is it? - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

I mean would it be surprising if Adidas was trying to make sure Zion went to an Adidas school? Not really. As long as KU wasn't directly involved I do not care.

@BShark Oh ya? - - for real? - -ok Then I can sleep tonight lmao. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer54 Yeah, click the profile of the writer for lols.

Random thought

Notice how Self and co would cast a wide net with offers? Perhaps Self knew how the system worked, wasn't directly involved but by casting a wide net you don't close any doors. So if a kid is shifted to Adidas, KU is in it.

Just some more hopeful thinking.

@jayballer54

Langford is a likely OAD while Grimes is not. KU might get more from Langford in his one year but Grimes might be the overall better choice since will stay for 3-4 years.

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer54

Langford is a likely OAD while Grimes is not. KU might get more from Langford in his one year but Grimes might be the overall better choice since will stay for 3-4 years.

Don't sleep on Grimes' NBA potential though. If he showed out better PG skills I could see him being only a 2 year guy.

I'd take Grimes for sure though, if it's one or the other.

@BShark makes more sense. Not zeroing in on kids. Just offering based on basketball skill. If you wanna come here or adidas does their thing in the dark without him knowing he's not in any trouble.

Thing is they are clearly targeting assistant coaches and head coaches are either in the dark or aware and it is an agreement that the assistant coach will just be the fall guy.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark makes more sense. Not zeroing in on kids. Just offering based on basketball skill. If you wanna come here or adidas does their thing in the dark without him knowing he's not in any trouble.

Thing is they are clearly targeting assistant coaches and head coaches are either in the dark or aware and it is an agreement that the assistant coach will just be the fall guy.

Yep yep yep. If KU coaches are not involved we should be fine. That's what I'm hoping for and I've actually heard some good things in that regard.

BShark said:

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark makes more sense. Not zeroing in on kids. Just offering based on basketball skill. If you wanna come here or adidas does their thing in the dark without him knowing he's not in any trouble.

Thing is they are clearly targeting assistant coaches and head coaches are either in the dark or aware and it is an agreement that the assistant coach will just be the fall guy.

Yep yep yep. If KU coaches are not involved we should be fine. That's what I'm hoping for and I've actually heard some good things in that regard.

Same unless you are a Terrapin fan. They have no 80+ pages going and an absolute obsession that we are paying everyone

BeddieKU23 said:

BShark said:

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark makes more sense. Not zeroing in on kids. Just offering based on basketball skill. If you wanna come here or adidas does their thing in the dark without him knowing he's not in any trouble.

Thing is they are clearly targeting assistant coaches and head coaches are either in the dark or aware and it is an agreement that the assistant coach will just be the fall guy.

Yep yep yep. If KU coaches are not involved we should be fine. That's what I'm hoping for and I've actually heard some good things in that regard.

Same unless you are a Terrapin fan. They have no 80+ pages going and an absolute obsession that we are paying everyone

Lol Maryland fans. I have no doubt KU has landed some guys that got paid by Adidas. Seems like a lot of players get paid. If it's just pick an Adidas school and KU wins out, I don't think KU or the coaches can be faulted, by the FBI or the NCAA for that matter. What is the NCAA gonna do? Ban every school?

You know one thing that is really nice? Having walk-ons on the team with rich parents. :money_with_wings:

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

BShark said:

Kcmatt7 said:

@BShark makes more sense. Not zeroing in on kids. Just offering based on basketball skill. If you wanna come here or adidas does their thing in the dark without him knowing he's not in any trouble.

Thing is they are clearly targeting assistant coaches and head coaches are either in the dark or aware and it is an agreement that the assistant coach will just be the fall guy.

Yep yep yep. If KU coaches are not involved we should be fine. That's what I'm hoping for and I've actually heard some good things in that regard.

Same unless you are a Terrapin fan. They have no 80+ pages going and an absolute obsession that we are paying everyone

Lol Maryland fans. I have no doubt KU has landed some guys that got paid by Adidas. Seems like a lot of players get paid. If it's just pick an Adidas school and KU wins out, I don't think KU or the coaches can be faulted, by the FBI or the NCAA for that matter. What is the NCAA gonna do? Ban every school?

You know one thing that is really nice? Having walk-ons on the team with rich parents. :money_with_wings:

I'm sure money has changed hands, it just seems naive to believe otherwise at this point. I do however believe Self is a good person and I don't believe he has the personality to go that direction by his own doing. I could find out later I'm completely wrong but I do believe he's one of the few that keeps it clean on his end. If Adidas has helped us in the past I'm sure Nike and Under Armour have the same guilt in their closet.

This situation reminds me of the steroid era in Baseball. Everyone knew it was happening for years upon years and nobody cared until it blew up and some really good baseball players went down for it. Baseball let it happen but then cried out loud when they had to do something about it. This to me is the same in College Basketball. NCAA didn't have the authority to crack open the cheating/bribes/money funneling in and out for players, families etc but they knew it was there. As long as it didn't interrupt the cash cow they were never going to do anything and with their limited power they had some deniability to ever do so. The FBI gets involved and the NCAA has its pants down. Now they have to clean up the mess that is left in its wake.

Read that Self and Norm both play it super straight according to an AAU coach. Not even a whiff of bringing up $.

Edit: Norm was the only KU asst that this AAU coach had dealings with.

Also said KU DOES NOT BASH OTHER SCHOOLS in recruiting, merely does their own pitch.

@BShark

Saw that too. I just can't imagine Self, Norm & Kurtis doing anything outside the lines intentionally. I think Howard is a good guy as well but he certainly hasn't earned that trust yet that the older guys have.

https://scout.com/college/michigan-state/Article/As-the-FBI-investigates-corruption-in-NCAA-college-hoops-Michiga-108140978 ↗

Lol.

Not hard to figure out who player 2 allegedly is.

@Kcmatt7 Did you reply then delete it?

@BShark I did. Changed what I wanted to say. That was really funny.

Also, MSU just started getting involved in tons of top 10 kids lately... Kind of out of the blue... If anything, that seems more shady than someone whose been ivolved with stud recruits for 15 straight years.

@Kcmatt7 Dude just had to get his shots in about Jackson and Cliff.

Btw even MSU fans think this guy is a bit nuts. Player 1 is Jabari Parker who Izzo still talks glowingly about.

Edit: Lol, this is a quote from an MSU person...

"f that guy is supposed to represent MSU as a writer it's completely embarrassing. It's fanboy fantasy combined with poor writing."

COPYPASTE FROM PHOG POSTER.

"So I was fortunate enough to be able to discuss this topic with two very interesting sources yesterday. One was a former Conference Commissioner, the other was a former AD (both at the P5 level). They are very plugged in to this situation. I asked them point blank how worried KU should be- and they both didn't think we have anything to worry about. They told me that the rules are basically set up to benefit a very select few schools (with KU being one) where they can LEGALLY, and without violating any NCAA rules, 'hook a kid up'. It's all a little above my head, but it has to do with AAU tournaments, summer camps, job funneling (helping out a parent/guardian with a job), legal support/financial advisors, and other various things that seem to be dirty (to me) but are all above ground. They basically told me that we don't have to cheat because the rules are set up to favor us. They figured that Duke and UNC would be fine in all of this as well.. "

@Kcmatt7 Player 2 is actually Bowen according to MSU people. That relieves me.

Also how FUDGING INSANE is that if true?

@BShark That would be pretty outrageous.