I was hearing can't remember where that KU wasn't chosen to represent the USA in the WUG's. That is was HCBS that was chosen to be the coach and HCBS chose to take his own team. Any thoughts on this? I'm not sure. Thought I would ask.
DoubleDD
3749 posts
HCBW and Kstate's basketball is a train wreck. I will give HCBW some credit in that I do believe the guy can X and O it. Yet that's only have the battle when it's comes to college basketball. Recruiting is just as important.
If you really break down HCBW's career as a HC. His only claim to fame is his final 4 run at Illinois with HCBS's players. Not to be out done he did quite good at Kstate with HCFM's players.
HCBW maybe a fine person and a good HC, but rebuilding a program isn't something I think he's adapt to doing. As his history has shown, his best years have been with another coaches players.
I think you putting a little to much stock in the WUG's. What HCBS rolled out there as a starting five and a rotation is subject to change. There is still a lot of time before College Ball starts. The bright side is Bragg and Vick have already got a taste of what it's like to play under the lights. Their not going to have that deer in the headlights look when they step out on the floor. I do see Vick sitting much of this year. He needs time with Hudy. Yet come next year now way this kid isn't in the mix.
As for Bragg? I know you can't understand why I think Bragg could wind up going OAD. However look at last years rotation of big men. What has really changed? Now keep in mind our bigs and paint play was the Achilles heel of KU team last year.
Ellis is still Ellis pretty much hit his ceiling. He could expand his outside shot. Either way he's a lock
Traylor is a great guy and HCBS loves the kid, but lets face it he's just an energy guy that lacks the talent of any of the Bigs KU has.
Hunter is interesting. I thought he showed flashes last year but for some reason HCBS just wouldn't give him the playing time. I believe Hunter will start at first, he is a lock to be in the mix either way.
Lucas sadly is what he is. Sometimes he looks like the perfect big man and others it's like what? He's out of the mix.
Diallo and his talent alone land him the starting spot be for this years over. Not to mention the high ceiling he has. He's a lock
Bragg not sure why everybody wants to compare him Trob? I think their games are totally different. I can see the motor and toughness, but that's as far as it goes. TRob would try to dunk on anything and every thing. I don't see that in Bragg. Bragg can actually shoot and handle the ball. Not to mention if one can handle the ball there is an ability to pass the ball.
I see Ellis, Hunter, Diallo, and Bragg as the minutes eaters. However with the short play clock. HCBS may change his approach to how many guys are in the mix.
Bottom line it doesn't make sense to keep a talent like Bragg on the bench. It does you no good. One Bragg is a better talent than all but maybe Ellis and Diallo. Two you sit a talent like Bragg and you may wind hurting not only your team come tournament time but also your ability to recruit players in the future. This isn't the 70's and 80's where the upperclassmen always get the nod. (maybe it should be). Bragg will get his minutes. Then it's all up to him after that. To tell you truth I'm hoping your right that he sticks around for a couple years. However anymore I just assume most of these kids are gone after one year.
Disagree on both ends. Now way Vick rides the bench for two years only seeing spot minutes. One Selden is gone and I would say Svi is too. Not even sure he rides the bench if these two come back. I'll give you year one but come year two, everybody in the country is going to know who this kid is.
I think you're underestimating Bragg too. He very well could be a TAD player. All I'm saying and you can't disagree either. Is I've seen kids not only go into the draft but get drafted that had no rhyme or reason for being there. All it takes is an NBA team or two showing some interest and Bragg could very well be gone too. Personally I would rather have Bragg for 3 years. However I'm not going out on a limb like you and declare that no way Bragg goes OAD. Remember a kid by the name of Embiid who was considered a project player with a high ceiling. Season started and he wasn't starting. Yet by the end of the season he was being considered the next great big man.
I can see Vick getting some spot minutes this year but I don't see how this kid rides the bench for 2 years. No way, No how. The kid runs like a gazelle. I can't remember a kid that glides like he does. If he can learn to stay in front of his man I could see the kid getting some playing time this year. Highly unlikely as he does need some time with Hudy.
As for Bragg I believe it is still to early to say no way he doesn't leave after one year. The NBA draft is after more about potential than it is the reality of the player.
Holy Cow. Talk about to close for comfort.
Congrats to our beloved Jayhawks for not only bringing home the gold. Yet also playing together playing tough and becoming the team in such a short time. :+1: The sad part is now you've stroked my addiction (as I am a KU junkie) and will be sitting around with the shakes and my mind and heart swirling waiting for the season to start. Maybe I should seek help? ;)
The WUG's was quite the experience for not only the players but it's fans too. Getting up in the middle of the night or the crack of dawn to watch a game was new one on me. I'm kind of glad that stuff is over. I was quite disappointed in the media coverage of the WUG's. Now I wasn't expecting full blown coverage or anything, but come on a fan should be able to find out when the game starts and what the finally score was. Not to mention a little analysis could've added to the experience. After all it was USA basketball. No wonder Espn is losing money. Their east coast basis may in the end cost them everything they accomplished. As technology advances and makes it easier and cheaper for fans to connect to their teams, the old tried and true broadcasting methods become obsolete. No Espn not everybody wants to watch the Red Soxs and Yankees play. NO REALLY.
It seems even HCBS has learned a thing or two in this WUG's. He was able to see all his players get playing time against decent to pretty good teams. Bragg and Vick got much needed practice and playing time to help further their development for the college game. In fact these WUG's may have helped Bragg and Vick the most. When the college season starts they should be able to hit the ground running. Wish Diallo could've been there.
However the most intriguing lesson I believe HCBS learned was letting his players play. HCBS is a system guy to the very core of who he is. We've all seen him call a timeout when play seemed to get wild and loose? When every KU fan hears the term high/low visions of HCBS fill the head. Though HCBS is the best at in game adjustments there is. He never really varies from the system. He just makes you think he has. However the WUG's was just as much an experince for the coaches at KU as it was the players and fans. With the shortened play clock all the way around, and the different substitution format. HCBS had to adjust, he had to adjust his game plan, he had to trust in his players and let them play. Sure HCBS still looked and wanted to go inside, but there wasn't enough time to really just pound the ball inside. HCBS was forced to let his players play. Now KU and HCBS will gain a few more seconds on the play clock as the college game starts, but I'm not sure the lesson that HCBS and the KU players learned about themselves and as a team in a faraway land will be forgotten as some passing memory. I believe that KU fans though not aware at first began to sense the change in how KU was handling business too, and you know what you liked it.
HCBS is a system guy and will always be, but the game is changing and he knows it. HCBS was always good about finding talent and forming, molding that talent. Yet the WUG's taught him when you have the best talent, sometimes you just let them play.
Is this the beginning of the End? I don't know, but something happened over there in the WUG's that could change everything.
I hate rain. :(
Once a Jayhawk always a Jayhawk. I wonder how many KU fans that don't care a lick about the NBA take a peek to see how former Jayhawks are doing? :+1:
I was referring to the international court. The paint is wider over there. That's interesting though I had no idea the NCAA was making a change. I mean heard there was talk of it but didn't know they decided to go through on it.
I'm not a fan of the OAD either. I more in favor go to college you have to stay for 3 years. That's just me. However sadly Diallo will be gone after his lone season with KU. On the bright side I see a championship in the future, and I'm not talking conference either. :)
I"m hanging my hat on it. Diallo will be good as advertised. Of course he'll have to learn how not to foul as all freshman do. ;)
Actually the paint is wider.
Also maybe a motor isn't enough but when a player walks away twice with the MVP playing against the best upcoming talent in the world should count for something. One time could be a fluke but twice and I believe three? No I'll take the motor of Diallo. Trob and KYoung could only dream of having the talent Diallo has. Just my thoughts.
Ok so I know the kid isn't getting much play, and that he looks quite skinning. Yet man this kid looks like liquid gold to me. I don't know if he'll get the playing time this year? Yet man this kid looks good. I have to believe with a little time with the great Hudy to bulk up for the physical style of college ball. I think this kid will be the biggest diamond in the rough that we have never seen.
Am I wrong?
I just can't see how Diallo doesn't fill the bill. I know a lot of OAD's don't fulfill what they are supposed to be. Yet this kid just doesn't rely on talent to prove his game. He has a motor that runs on high octane fuel. See when he played against the best OAD's in the country and walked away MVP twice. That has to count for something.
In fact I would say Diallo doesn't get enough love. Sadly and I hate to say it, but if this kid was at UK, Duke, or UNC OMG Espn would be creaming all over themselves to promote this kid.
Diallo will be starting for this season is over. I don't see any of KU's big men matching or just doing what he can do, even the designer.
I love where you're going with this. KU is going to have not only a jump on other D1 teams, but they'll have been playing at an even faster pace than the NCAA deems needed.
It was one thing to practice playing with a shorter clock, but it's another until you've played some games when they count. KU will be way ahead of the curve on this shorter clock.
I too was kind of wondering about the coverage. You can't even find the start times, or scores of completed games on the big sports websites. Kind of eerie. I never really paid attention the WUG's until now. I guess this could be just standard media coverage.
Even with that I have to agree with @Crimsonorblue22 in that the experience alone is priceless. The WUG's could be the very thing that puts KU over the top this year. We shall see.
I have no doubt before this season is over Diallo is the starter beside Ellis. I love what Hunter is doing in the WUG's but I'm afraid he is benefiting from the international style of play. Not sure that will carry over to D1. Lucas looks the same and even frustrated at times. Not good. Traylor is well Traylor. He'll get is playing time.
If Hunter, Lucas, and Traylor were all that then last year wouldn't have been such a dude. Now players can improve. Yet other than Hunter do you see a big improvement? I see Diallo getting the nod just because he's going to have the most talent and highest upside. The ??? for me is Bragg.
I've wondered on this thought for some time. It seemed to me KU wasted no time in resigning with adidas. I wasn't sure why? I felt with the lay of the land and Nike schools cobbling up all the talent that at least a school like KU would consider switching. It seems it was never an option.
KU seems to be getting some of the top talent from over seas. Which is quite confusing when these kids can just turn pro. I wouldn't be surprised if Adidas has something do with KU getting the nod for the WUG's. It seems with each passing year that KU is becoming an Adidas favorite horse.
I'm not sure what it all means just noticed that KU and Adidas are becoming one in the same.
I don't blame the twins. You mess with the woman that brought me into this world, and I'll end yours. Just Saying.
Come on the NBA draft is all about potential. None of those kids drafted in the lotto have proved nothing. Basing your case or argument on that is just crazy talk. The amount kids drafted in the top 10 and failed far out weighs those that did. It's not even close.
Well you don't have to respond? You could just respond to the plethora of KU topics?
No seriously I'm a huge Royals fan and so is @globaljaybird, as he does like to do the play by play when he isn't busy. Thought I would start the topic for him this time.
Hopefully Young can hang in there. I'm afraid he's one bad inning away
I'm afraid if Love hasn't learned to play defense by now? He never will. Not sure good/great coaching can change that. Best option is to trade him for 3 #1 picks in the NBA Draft.
I'm just howling. ;)
I little Royal revenge.
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No wonder Oakland sucks and is sucking hind tit to SanFran. With fans like that?
What the hell did Escobar do? What make an out? Lawrie was the one trying to hurt some one.
[Oakland fan's hero? No wonder Oakland sucks](
I would hate to be HCBS right now. With the plethora of talent he has finally coming to fruition. A lot of hard decision will need to be made.
Just want to add one thing. If Svi steps up his game like most of us think is coming. There is no way you don't start him.
Sadly I think the injuries of Devonte and Greene may have cost them shots at starting. On the Brightside being a selfish fan it's pretty nice to know that a Devonte and Greene type player will be coming of the bench. Hell and there is still the Vic the big unknown.
Golly Gees Rock Chalk.
I hope Love goes to the Lakers. They deserve each other. Not saying Love is a bad guy. Just saying it's like destiny. ;)
So let me get this straight the Cavs trade away everything to win one championship. In the process they may have made the Wolves a dynasty? Is this what you're saying? Got to love those can't miss trades.
Not sure anybody is saying OAD's are lazy? They just have more to lose than a Travis Releford, and Tyrell Reed type player. When you've got nothing to lose then you can lay it all on the line. However when you can lose it before you even get it? Well that changes everything.
I think you miss the mark on OAD's taking plays or games off. I see your point but none of these OAD's wants to be the one that loses it all because they got hurt in their lone season in college ball. So much of their draft potential is indeed based off potential anyways. Get hurt and you fall like a boulder off the side of a cliff.
I have no doubt LeBron would have taken plays and games off. He would have no choice. With agents, financial backers, sponsors, and shoe companies. You do what you your told to do. And who could blame them? Why gamble millions and a secure, set life for the off chance of winning a Championship in College.
I know we love the story about the competitor that does it for the love of the game, for his pride. However this isn't the yesteryears. Where kids went to college because they always wanted to be a Jayhawk, Wildcat, and so on. It's all business.
So it seems Love has decided to opt out of the last year of his contract? So what did The Cavs give to get the no-brainer trade? I believe Two players one named Wiggins and another 1st round pick? I wonder if the Cavs had it all over again would they make that trade again? Something tells me?? Hell no.
I would think even those in that back cigar smoke filled room are frowning on this one. I don't want him. and if don't want him then neither does KU. :)
Yea I know, but is that really a good thing? I don't know? Wouldn't the overall victories in inter league play be a better way to decide home field in the World Series?
Like I said I get the fans and the MLB like it. I'm just not sure it's really that big of a deal to the Pros. I could be wrong though.
I guess what turns me off to it. Is that the best players don't always play. To many guys get invites just because of name power.
When I was a kid I was gifted enough to make a few all star games. It was a pretty cool honor. However I'm not sure the pros really care. In fact if they had their gathers they would rather just have the time off.
I know the MLB and the fans like it, but really it's kind of pointless. In fact it's really more of a popularity contest more than anything else. I say be gone with it.
It's ok I'll have the last word I usually save the best for last anyways.
No problem with semantics here you just feel that if you're in the majority that your right and it is reality. Sorry friend reality changes all the time and so does the majority. The majority of Germans thought it was right to declare war against the Jews and the world. Were they right? The majority believed in 2008 that Memphis was far and away the best CB team to lase them up, and that KU really had no shot of winning a championship in the star studded all number 1 seeds final four. Were they right? Perception is really neither right or wrong. History has shown us that the majority isn't always right. Well just look at the Cavs deal of trading Love for Wiggins. Need I say more?
I believe it's pretty well documented that Love plays weak defense.
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Who's trying to prove you wrong? And who says the majority is always right? As it seems the Wiggins for Love the no brainer and can't miss deal has indeed turned out to be a bad one for the Cavs. Though there is still time. If only the Cavs can get Love and his can't miss skills to sign on the dotted line?
I just don't get how you or anybody can say Love is this great and complete player. When the guy plays some of the worst defense I've ever seen. I guess I'm just getting old when a person can be a top 10 player in the NBA yet play no defense.
I think you miss the point about perception? It is never really wrong or right. It's just how someone perceives something. You precieve Love as this great player and I don't.
Really the concept of a "no brainer" especially when dealing with the elite athletes is nothing more than perception. For example you seem to have certain respect for Love and the numbers he has put up. Even claiming him as one of the 10 players in the NBA altogether. You see that is perception.
My perception I see a guy that likes to score, but plays no defense what's so over. His defense is like a paper towel under running water at best. In fact I remember reading numerous articles where the notion was that the Cavs actually started playing better team ball after Love went down hurt.
The term no brainer was being touted around here on KU Buckets when all this went down. Not pointing fingers. It just was, and there is a good chance Love doesn't resign with the Cavs. So what did the Cavs really get for a future like Wigs?
Nothing.
Hey we never know? Interesting point though. Ellis did come back to work on his outside game.
If Diallo and Lucas step up, this team becomes dangerous. It was the missing link and is the big ??? mark for this upcoming season.
@Texas-Hawk-10 I think Mister Bragg is going to have us KU fans Bragging before this season is over. Don't look for him just to be some decoration on the KU bench. The kid has star power. As for being a OAD done does anybody really know? The NBA has taking and declared kids that have done nothing in the college game as lottery picks.
No way does Bragg ride the bench and get just spot minutes here and there. NOWAY. You never know you just might seem him at the 3 with Diallo and Ellis manning the paint. Hey the kid has outside game.
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I know I sound like Mary Poppins right now, but I love this team this year. Is it the best team ever? Hell no. Yet with UK and Duke in a totally rebuild mode. UNC wandering will they play in the tournament or not. KU has a perfect storm. With the down year of the elite, WUG games, a solid returning team, and a solid recruiting class has me singing a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down. ;)
Do not worry My KU friends. Selden will surprise this year.
This will be HCBS toughest season. As he will have talent that delivers all over the place. His biggest decision will be should we beat this team by 25 or 50 points? I kind of feel sorry for him.
This is a bit of sore subject with me.
Ok so the NBA whispers into the college world about how this kid will be great and this kid will be ok. Forcing these kids no choice to except it what the NBA says as the holy truth. So they declare and then they are traded like casino chips?
I don't care what the hell you have going on in trade rumors. YOU don't trade a top prospect like Wiggins until you see what you got.
Like you said to many unknowns when it comes to trades. Yet just do me this favor tell me there is no such thing as a no brainer.
He agreed with those who have compared newcomer Bragg, 6-9 from Cleveland, to Ellis.
“Definitely. He is a real skilled player, strong, pretty quick, quick on his feet also,” Ellis said. “I definitely see some similarities. He is learning real fast. He’s starting to get more comfortable. I can see it as time’s going on. I’m excited to see what he does.”
You know with all the talk about comparing Diallo to Jo Jo, some of us KU fans just wrote off Bragg. A diamond in the rough? Or is this kid hungry and is going to stake his claim? I know, I know every KU recruit needs at least 3 years to be good (just appeasing KU nation). Yet we see kids all over college basketball do wonders in their first year of College ball. Why not at KU?
What I love best about Bragg is he doesn't have to be the man. It seems Lucas is making big strides, and Diallo is going to be nasty (yes I'm calling it). Not to mention the great Ellis.
OH yea Bragg is going to see minutes. Yea it'll be off the bench, but he's going to see minutes.
Does it make me a bad KU fan if I hope he's not too good? As I would like him to come back for at least a second year.
To be honest I was more confused than anything. Alas all is good. Maybe our wires just got crossed. That will happen sometimes in this technological age.
Let me first say I've always loved your posts and believe your one of the best on KUBuckets
Yet You said,
“Maybe you’re the one getting less credit than you want.”
Calling me out.
and now you say
"Sometimes I don’t understand the lack of objectivity of memory"
Calling out another poster.
What gives? If somebody doesn't agree with you then they are just nothing and worthy of your wrath?
I'm more than willing to let things go and move on but man you seem a little on unfair in how you post.
I still don't know what you mean when you called me out. I tried for a reply but no response.
I wanted to start a topic on this subject, yet as usually @jaybate-1.0 was way ahead of the game. ;)
Bottom line for me is this. We all know recruiting is a shady gig. To many times has CB fans we just sat there and shook our head. We all know there is that back room filled with heavy Cigar smoke. Yet that's not what bothers me.
When College's start cheating kids grades to keep them eligible then that's the last straw. I don't really get the whole playing players but I understand. I don't really understand giving college athletes specially treatment, but I understand. I don't really get going after nothing but OAD's but I understand. Yet when you start cooking the grade books, then I say come on.
If there was ever a line in the sand where the NCAA should make it's stand. Then this it. If the work in the classroom won't be protected and honored by the power 5 and the NCAA. Then f**K it. Then don't even be a college just be a minor league for the pros.
Poor Selden. Where's the love?
Geez guys. So he didn't quite live up to the OAD expectations? It happens. He still wasn't bad. He played pretty good defense, and his freshman numbers weren't that bad. Yes his sophomore season was far from stellar. But maybe it was the Sophomore Jinx. Or maybe he was trying to hard. I know some mocked and commented on some of his missed dunks. Yet I remember him trying to make some dunks that most guys could only dream about. Not making accuses but I think he was trying to hard. Also last year he was really bulked up. Hudy really worked him over. Maybe just maybe he needed an adjustment period?
Either way I think Selden will be Golden this year.
SVI is the mystery card as @jaybate-1.0 pointed out. I would love to say he'll be the man and I do believe he will be the man. Yet there are ??? marks that not even I can ignore. However I'm rolling the dice here. I'm all in. This KU team is going to be tough, and with a little luck they'll be knocking on the door of greatness. And I'm not just talking about a NC. Yes dare I say undefeated? I know crazy talk but you know what I looked in the mirror today and said to myself your crazy. My daughter confirmed my assumptions at the breakfast table. ;)
No all kidding aside. I feel with the WUG and all those extra practice giving KU a head start over everybody else will give the two pieces KU really needs extra time to develop. Bragg and Diallo. Last year's team less than stellar performance (us KU fans are so spoiled) wasn't because of guard play. If you know what I mean? If my assumptions and dreams are to be correct. Not only does Diallo need to step in a hurry, but so does Bragg.