@RockChalkinTexas I like Cliff Alexander too. You know when looking at the KU roster in what they having coming back and coming in. It's really hard to just focus in on one player and say yep he's the one. I can see Cliff the thunder being the most improved player, yet I'm sticking with Greene. There is just something about this kid I can't shake. I can tell you one thing I wouldn't want to be standing between Cliff and the rim.
DoubleDD
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So far it seems Oubre and Conner F followed by Mason are getting the most love (no not Kevin love)(just kidding). After starting this thread for the most improved KU player I began to think (Look out)(LOL). I'm starting to think Hunter Mickelson has the best chance to be the most improved player, not saying he will. I still think Brannen Greene will be the most improved player. Yet Hunter really has no expectations. So if he comes out and scores 10 to 15 points a game, rebounds 8 to 10 and blocks 3 or 4 shots a game who could really do better than that? Yet again the kid might not even be the first option of the bench.
I have to admit I was intrigued with all the love for Oubre (and not the Kevin love type as Oubre can actually play defense) So after doing some more research on the kid. I can see why so many of you think he could make that impact as a freshman.
I'm sorry KU nation if I'm a little overbearing on this whole Wiggins and Love thing. Well you know how I feel about it. Just give me 30 days after Wiggins signs his contract and I'll be fine. Hell I'm planning on heading up to watch our boy Wiggins play in Minnesota. Hey you know the code once a Jayhawk always a Jayhawk. Nothing made me prouder being a KU fan when the great Wilt found out this truth later on in life. So sad he spent most of his life thinking we didn't love or respect him.
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God I love being a Jayhawk fan.
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@jaybate 1.0 I am a broad rat. I love eating cheese and talking KU basketball. I spend many nights searching the web on all things KU basketball. I even track former KU basketball players in the NBA and overseas, even though I hate the professional game. I believe that KU is the birth place and the protector of the game we call basketball. OH wait this isn't a thread about addictions on KU basketball? Never mind.
Ok so Wiggins will be traded 30 days after he signs his first NBA contract. Sorry nobody (not even HEM) can convince me to trade Wiggins before you see what you have. However we are getting closer to another college basketball season (I know it's still a little ways off). Yet I have to ask the question?
Who do you think will be the most improved player for KU. So here are the rules. You can pick a freshman if you think they will make a huge statement from playing high school ball to college ball. However just for conversation sake tell us why.
At first I wanted to pick Ellis as he has been receiving a lot of praise from anybody that is watching (yet it doesn't matter he'll will be traded for a proven player)(sorry this Wiggins thing kind of pisses me off). Yet for some reason I can't shake Brannen Greene from my head. I wish I could explain it, but I can't . The only thing I can come up with is that he's a fighter. Something about this kid being on the court makes my heart feel good. He has size and skills to boot, but that's not it. He just seems to me like he has that it factor. That kind of guy that can turn the tide when the game isn't going well. He's not timid even in limited minutes. It's like he knows he was born to be a Jayhawk.
There are no wrong answers. So tell me Jayhawk nation. What do you think?
@JayHawkFanToo you my friend are on fire. That post is one of best I've read. I wish I could Fav 10 times. Also the elephant in the room everybody seems to forget even the great Coach K is LOVE doesn't play defense. What good does it do to score 20 or 25 points when you give up 30? Just saying.
@jaybate 1.0 Phil Jackson isn't coaching the Knicks he's the president. I totally agree on Wigs to a Texas team, however he is from Canada?
@jaybate 1.0 as usually you're the voice of reason. It's just Minnesota? How can I root for Minnesota? I read a rumor though. The person predicted Lebron would go back to the Cavs, and Carmello would resign with the Knicks. So far so good. His last prediction Phil Jackson would trade Carmello for Wiggins? Is it possible? Can I dream? OH wait tell me the Knicks aren't a Nike team? Please? Please?
@Crimsonorblue22 And JayhawkFanToo very valid points. If I had to think of a recent KU player that had a killer instinct? Man that is a tough question. We could almost start a new tread on that one. If had to pick one I guess I would say S. Collins. Dude was never afraid to take it to the hoop, and always wanted the ball in is hands. I will say this I think maybe Selden might have that killer instinct too. Good question.
Crimsonorblue22 and JayHawkFanToo I'm not sure being aggressive and having a killer instinct are two in the same. Having a killer instinct is not something you acquire. It's kind of like running faster or jumping higher than anyone. It's like a gift. There are many players that have had the killer instinct but not the tools. It can go both ways.
A player with a killer instinct is never afraid to take the winning shot. In fact they demand to. They have the ability to sense that very moment when the opposing team is about to quiver and give up, and in that moment deliver the final blow.
A player with a killer instinct doesn't just want to dunk on you, they want to attend your family reunion and dunk on your whole family. Sadly this could be the very thing that's keeps Wiggins from attaining his ceiling. Yet who knows maybe he has it, just hasn't had a reason to show it yet?
Without doing any real research I would assume that those who bet on NBA games bet on star power. So if championships were a non issue, and the goal was to get bettors to bet on your team without paying out. Then you get a star player with no sidekicks.
If championships are important also. Then I would say build a team like the Spurs. Then bettors would bet against your team. Then you would just plug along quietly picking up championships and money while becoming the best franchise since those Jordan Bulls.
@jaybate 1.0 you know in all the if's and but's, proven vs potential, what could be, what couldn't be and what will never be. You my friend may have hit the nail on head. Here I am making a mountain out of a mole hill. When really it's about shoe companies duking it out. LMAO.
@icthawkfan316 I understand what your saying, in that if you can win a championship by picking up a piece here or there. You do it. However Kevin Love is not just a piece he is a chunk, that demands minutes and the ball in hand. Yes it's easy (HEM) to look up Kevin Loves numbers and say oh yea this guy is the real deal. Trade half your team for him. However if you watched the guy play. He can't play defense and a lot of his scoring happens when the game has already been decided.
Icthawkfan316 I guess the thing for me is how do you trade a player like Wiggins without even seeing what the kid can do? I understand the odds of Wiggins becoming the next Jordan, Bird, Magic and so on are slim, but there is a chance. And that is what baffles me. Why you would you just trade the kid without even seeing what he could do with the pieces you already have.
Icthawkfan316 do you really think if the Bulls would've traded Jordan and won one championship because of that trade, while Jordan went some where else and won 6 championship and became the greatest player to play the game is a good trade? I know comparing Wiggins to Jordan is kind of funny, but that's what I'm saying we just don't know.
I think you're a lot like me on this, just a little more leveled headed about it. You want to see what Wiggins can do before you pull the trigger on such a trade. (I have checked out that Grantland article) I too understand that if there are pieces out there to make your team better you have to at least entertain such thoughts. I guess what bothers me the most about all this is. I feel that Lebron had his mind made up to move Wiggins before he signed on the dotted line. Whether it's Kevin Love or not, Wiggins will be traded, and that kind of bothers me. Also the idea of trading Kevin Love for Wiggins is a no brainer. Well that's just dumb. If it's such a no brainer then the Cavs should have never drafted Wiggins yet instead just traded the first pick for Love. As it seems by some no matter who is drafted you make that trade?
Look guys it doesn't matter what Minnesota wants. Of course they want to trade a Kevin Love for a Wiggins. That my friend is a no brainer. There probably isn't a team in the league that wouldn't make that trade.
This is about the Cavs bending over backwards to appease the great Lebron. Even if it means pissing away the future in a player like Wiggins. Here you have a player like Lebron who dissed is home town and yet now that same team is willing to piss away the future of the organization so Lebron can run around and say Hey I won a championship for you guys.
I laugh at you that say the Cavs have to make this trade. Let me ask you a question would you trade Jordan for Love? How about Bird, Magic or even Duncan? Yea of course not because you know how these player turned out. Yet you think trading Wiggins is a no brainer. Really so what if the Cavs trade Wiggins for Love, and the Cavs do indeed win that one championship? Yet Wiggins goes on to win 6 or even 7 championships? Still think that was a good trade?
It's mind boggling to me that these kids are drafted on potential yet it's a no brainer to trade them for a proven player. Why even draft at all? Just trade the First round pick every year on proven players? Bottom line you know what Love is, he's hit his peak. You have no ideal what Wiggins can be. No ideal.
@icthawkfan316 to me the issue isn't whether Kevin Love is a poor, good, or great player. However if we must explore this avenue. Then here's my point you never trade a #1 pick of Wiggins elk for a Kevin love type player. Never.
I understand a team makes free agent moves and flat out trades to make a run at a championship. However you don't trade away the future to do so. Well unless you want to be a one hit wander.
Wiggins will be traded, the wheels are already in motion. Even if the Cavs don't trade Wiggins and half their team for Love because as you said he's a proven player. The damage is done. You have the King out peddling Wiggins like a used car. Which is fine with me, yet how could it be any good for Wiggins to stay a Cav when the leader, the King of your team is trying to trade you like a dirty rag?
I hope His highness gets his Love. Then I'm going to sit back and watch Tim Duncan and the Spurs just eat Kevin Love alive. You're right about one thing Kevin Love is proven. Proven to play no defense.
@icthawkfan316 I brought up this theory and Dennis Rodman for a couple reasons.
First Chicago went out and found a role player to fill a need. Some body that didn't have to carry the team. Somebody that could play defense, rebound, you know a solid player. Kevin Love is not this kind of Player. You don't trade the future of your franchise for a Love kind of player. Notice nobody is jumping or begging for Love? Just Saying.
In the end the Cavs make this trade at the behest of the King. Why is the concept that James could demand who he plays with seem so farfetched? He did it at Miami, yet he couldn't do that at Cleveland? No the Cavs wanted to keep Wiggins, they even came out publicly and said so. No something changed and the something was Lebron.
Like I said I don't have any proof. I just really believe that Lebron came back to the Cavs because of his ego. So every thing I say from here on out take with a grain of salt. Whether some KU fans and NBA experts want to admit or not. Wiggins has some mad athletic ability and skills. Yes I know it's all potential, but everything about the about NBA is predicated on potential. If Wiggins becomes every thing people projected him to be. Who needs the old Lebron when you have the younger version? You see to me Lebron came back to Cleveland because of his ego. He was afraid of a player like Wiggins doing something he never could or will, and that's win a championship at Cleveland.
I hope the trade happens. So when Lebron packs his bags in two years, Cleveland will be stuck with the proven interior commodity you seem to think Love is. Yet nobody seems willing to trade the future of their franchise for. I'm sorry but I totally disagree with you this. You maybe right that Wiggins is an unproven perimeter commodity, but you don't trade the #1 draft pick of a star-studded class before he even steps on the floor. You especially don't trade the #1 pick for Kevin Love before you watch the kid play. The more I think about this no wander Cleveland hasn't had a championship in 50 years. You know second thought Cleveland has to do this trade. They must trade Wiggins, and even Irving if neccessary to get Love. Like you said he is proven.
@icthawkfan316 here is the thing that sticks in my mind. Lebron never once mentions Wiggins when deciding to come back to Cleveland. I'm serious has a heart attack when I say this. If the Cavs don't select Wiggins, King James resigns with the Heat. No I have no evidence, but for some reason I feel it in my gut.
I'm sorry Kevin Love has proved nothing to me. I would take Dennis Rodman over him any day. Just because you can fill up the rim doesn't mean you're a proven all star or champion. Don't believe watch the Spurs just eat him alive. The NBA is no different than any sport when it comes to their star players. However as history has shown year after year teams win championships. Yes there are exceptions to the rule, but I think you understand my point.
I'm like you I'm leaning for the trade now so Wiggins can escape the big Lebron failure. The big three and the Heat where able to do what they did because the East was so weak. Yet we've
seen first hand what a TEAM like the Spurs could do against the so called Big 3. In fact the Spurs should've won last year.
Lebron is making a big mistake. Wiggins may be a unknown has you said, but I'm willing to bet my house that he's at the very least a solid NBA Player. To often people think if a player doesn't meet expectations they're a failure. Wiggins was tabbed the next Lebron James. Who could live up to that? Yet what if he averaged a double double, 20 points, and 10 rebounds and is one of the best defense players in the game? Now is he a failure? Just my two cents.
As most of you know Wiggins is back on the trading block for Kevin Love. Why I don't know? For the life of me I don't get it. Here you have a player in Wiggins who may or may not be the next big sensation in the NBA. He may not ever reach his full potential but maybe he will. Either way he has the athletic ability to be a solid player and to wow us at times even if he doesn't reach the realm of the greats. Then you have a player in Kevin Love that can score and rebound but doesn't play a lick of defense. Bottom line you know what your getting with Love. Yet with Wiggins just don't know other than he will be a solid player and someone that can play defense. I've seen enough basketball in my life to know that Love doesn't make you a championship team.
So now I ask where is all this coming from? Just a week ago the Cavs were adamant that Wiggins was untradeable. Now all of sudden they're willing to make that trade and they haven't even signed Wiggins. Which means that they have to sign Wiggins and then wait 30 days to make the trade. No this isn't the Cavs this is Lebron. Lebron wants this trade to happen, especial after seeing his tweets to woo Love to the Cavs. Bottom line Lebron is calling the shots on this one. Which amazes me that a player of his elk could ditch his hometown team, a place he grew up. Could come back and start calling the shots. Just F**king amazing.
So why is Lebron so eager to move Wiggins? Did Wiggins say something to piss Lebron off? Notice that Lebron never mentioned Wiggins the # 1 draft pick when he decided to come back to the Cavs? I'm starting to think the only reason Lebron decided to come back to Cleveland is because they drafted Wiggins. What is he afraid of?
Lebron the so called king my ass. He could do right by his organization, his home team, by allowing them to plan for the future, but no he wants no playing defense Kevin Love. Well good luck with that your majesty. Can't wait to see you get rolled again next year by the Spurs if you make it that far, because you have no concept of a team or potential. No you want your big 3.
That's ok your highness you will never be remembered as Jordan, Bird, Magic or even Mister Tim Duncan. You could've had your Pippen but no. I bet if you asked the great Jordan? Which would you rather have Kevin Love or Dennis Rodman? He would say I'd rather have a inside man that can play defense and rebound than one that can't. Let me let you on a little secret you highness the greats didn't care about their legacy. They cared about winning for the teams that drafted them.
Sorry KU fans I needed to vent, and this is like the only place I know I can.
I'm cool with whatever we need to do. I'll be here either way. I will say this though sometimes delaying the inevitable can be worse than just staying the course. All I ask for is if the change is going to happen let us know when.
@ralster you are so warping my mind. I totally get what your saying about the it factor. The kid that doesn't care about being good enough he just does it. My thing is to me EJ had it, he just played out of position. He was no point guard. To often I think as fans we say combo guard and think every thing is good. However you know as well as I do a true point guard makes a world of difference. If UK doesn't have J. Wall they don't win that championship. That is why I think this Graham kid is going to be the answer. He just seems to have that it factor for me. I love Mason and CF but Mason is like a missile when fired you don't know where the kid is going to land. I think we both agree on CF? Has a chance to be a great college player and then off to the Euro league.
As far as Svee I just don't know? He's so young, but has been playing the man's game in Europe. I just don't know. To me if he can play the physical style of ball we play here in the US then I think he's the wow factor that's puts us over the top. If not I still think we are solid but a NCAA championship is going to be pretty hard without some breaks.
@ralster and Hem love the insights and conversation you guys are having. If you would allow me to jump in I would be honored. If not just tell me to get lost and I just keep reading. LOL
I don't know why but I see Graham winning the point guard position. I know he's just a freshman but I got this feeling the kid can play. Mason would be the logical choice but man he doesn't seem to shoot the ball with any regularity. CF would also be a good choice, but I see him more as a T Reed. Somebody that will give his all and can could get on a roll from the outside.
Inside I couldn't agree more on Traylor. If he's not starting he will be one of the first of the bench. Crazy thing the kid is really just learning the game. Like Embiid he hasn't really been playing the game very long. I love the upside on this kid. Hunter is starting to sour my stomach a little. I know no real games have been played yet, however for some reason I just expected more. Hope I'm wrong. I'm not sure the kid makes it off the bench in the second wave of big men.
To me the ace in the hole is Svee. I'm not sure what to think yet? The kid can post up and hit the turnaround jump shot and can pull up from 3 land. However can he be physical enough to get some minutes. If he can then I think this upcoming KU team is solid. They have depth and the ability to shoot the three as Hem said. Just my two cents.
@drgnslayr Dude he didn't sign with Adidas? Or are just trying to get Jaybate's goat?
@nuleafjhawk I don't like rap either, but I like this one.
@drgnslayr you my friend said it better than I could ever do. I'm not NBA fan by any means. Yea I'll keep an eye KU players in the league. However if the Cavs keep Wiggins, with this Lebron decision. I will be buying a CAVS Jersey.
Don't act like you don't know? You know what I do. LOL
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@drgnslayr That was a little deep. LOL
@nuleafjhawk you're getting me pumped about this kid.
I'll tell you one thing I wouldn't want to be anywhere around the rim when Cliff gets the ball down low. He dunks like he is mad at the rim or something.
@Crimsonorblue22 -- Thank you. My memory gets a little foggy sometimes.
@nuleafjhawk -- Don't get me wrong I liked Tharpe, but man the guy lacked focus or something. Also for some reason he thought he was a great shooter. I don't know how many times he come down the court and jacked up a shot without even letting the offense run a set play. Sorry KU nation (go easy on me) but he couldn't defend a soda in a coffee shop. I still can't get this out of mind. I can't remember the game but Tharpe handed the ball of to Embiid I think at the top of the key ( a big man mind you). Embiid gets swarmed and tries to pass the ball back to Tharpe who isn't paying attention. It hits him in the face/head. What point guard does that? Just saying.
For you old KU fans that remember, and for you younger fans that never seen it. It's poor quality, but he I know your going to watch it. Note watch them in order.
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I don't remember the 80's having such bad video?
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How was this game ever a blow out?
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Is the time clock moving really slow or is just me?
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UK has no inside game.
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Think about this UK was 10 of 14 from 3 land and was shooting around 60% from the field at this point, and was still down in the game? (Beware of the Phog)
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Did you see that Mark R dunk? Downtown Terry Brown heating up.
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Pitino-- Hey Refs were Kentucky
Refs-- Hey your in the Phog Baby.
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How in the hell did KU score 150 in this game? We shall see.
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Roy ball at it's best. I wander if Roy would trade his two Championships to have never left KU. I bet it's crossed his mind.
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It's a beat down.
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Pitino--Roy we are Kentucky.
Roy--I know you are but I can't explain it other than to say your in Phog baby.
I hoped you enjoyed my KU brethren. Comment if you watched.
Ok here's the rules. NO Google, and no handy dandy all facts about KU basketball. Off the top of your mind.
Name the team KU scored the highest amount of points against. Do you know the amount of points KU scored against that team?
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Some things you just can't put into words. Enjoy my KU brethren.
@drgnslayr you know I was kind of hoping for a name change. This whole Big 12 and only 10 teams is kind of mind boggling. I don't know why they just don't change it? They have no desire, willingness, or potential to expand. So why not just change the name?
Let me start off by saying nice topic HEM. In some ways I could and do agree with you in some ways. Yet in some ways I can't. The concept that a team wins championships is going by the way side very quickly. See KU vs Syracuse or KU vs UK in the championship games. Both times KU had the team and yet both times we walked away with heartache and pain. That's not to say that talent always wins, because it doesn't. In fact the most talented teams sometimes can't even make the tournament. Yet you can't dismiss talent.
After watching the Memphis and KU game again, it was easy to see who had the team and who didn't. KU played to their strengths, which is what a team does. Even when down and the outcome looked bleak they played their system. Yet if the great Coach Cal wouldn't have made the biggest boneheaded non move for a head coach. Mario never hits that game tying shot, and KU never wins that championship.
I guess the bigger question is what does HCBS know? That being a system coach as he is in this day age of the one and done won't cut it. Coach Cal is no great coach. Yet he has a free for all system that allows the talent to excel, and Espn is about to rank him the best head coach in all of college basketball.
A system team is nice. They run the offense the way it's supposed to be run. They even play defense. Yet when somebody can out jump you, run past you there is not system that can stop that. Just my two cents.
@JayHawkFanToo -- I'm starting to get this feeling LeBron is moving on. The question is where? Some of the stuff I've been reading has said that Carmelo and LeBron are really good friends and want to play together. Looking at the tea leaves here, last time I checked they are both FA.
There are some rumors flying around that they'll all play for the Heat. Fat chance. No way Wade picks up his option and goes FA. He would lose millions that he would never get back. I don't see Bosh doing it either, and if they don't then the Heat just won't have the money to bring in an Carmelo. I'm not going to say that LeBron and Carmelo will go to Cleveland, but it is an interesting thought.
I think this is a very interesting topic. It just drips with sarcasm and drama. Cleveland loses the great King James. Quite rudely if you ask me. Fast forward and now Cleveland drafts the so called next Lebron.
I wander what King James is thinking right now? Doesn't he now have to at least consider going back to Cleveland? Chew on this for a second. What if Wiggins does something at Cleveland that Lebron never could do? Oh I don't know win a championship. Could you imagine the disdain that would attack King James's Imagine. Grab a seat boys this one could get interesting.
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Thank you Mister Wiggins for your one year at KU. You dazzled us.
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You might need a little time and a six pack but you'll love it.
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Don't for forget to delete the name of the link area
Example
[you would paste you link here] (link url) and then submit.
In the reply box there is a command button that looks like a chain link. Click on it and you get
[link text] (link url)
Put your links in the [link text] area
Put your youtude and such in the (LInk url) area
It might take a few times to figure it out. I know it did me.
[link text] (link url)
Example:
[put your link] (link url)
or [link text] (put your you tube video and such)
Notice how you keep the formula?
(note) I had to put a space between the two links area so I could show the example. In order for the formula to work there can be no space between the two link areas.
LIke I said practice makes perfect :D
@drgnslayr Well make it just a little easier. :)
<a href="http://members.shaw.ca/jazzace/ace/hoop/rulediff.html)
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Yea baby that's what I'm talking about.
Ok you guys are starting piss me off.
Stop with the doom and gloom. Embiid is a very young man with plenty of time to heal and grow. Embiid is a product of the US system. I believe 100% in my heart and mind the kid wanted to stay at least another year in College. Yet how could he? When you the fans, agents, the NBA saying it's time to come out. After all it's about the money right? Education and the experience means nothing in the College game anymore.
Embiid is a kid and is still growing. Who knows what his career or health is going to turn out to be? I know this if he drops any in the draft somebody is going to get the steal of the draft. The kid has a heart of a lion. Pun intended.
@jaybate 1.0 Sometimes you just kill me. :D However as usual even in your insane rants you have a point of truth.
Perry and CF are already on record as saying that they can't wait to compete in this tournament. Other comments also say that Oubre and CliffA are more than happy to stay a few years in Jayhawk land.
However the reality is the USA voting board realizes that Coach Cal can't really coach. (meaning you don't know what your going to get from his teams) KU had to be the choice to represent the USA.
@justanotherfan -- I get what your saying but if you're the super conference that can control the east coast, Midwest and the South couldn't you kind of call your shots? I'm just thinking outside the box here. Everybody thinks the Big 12 and the ACC are the weakest of the Power 5. Yet if they combined they would become the power. Not only would the alliance put the BG1 and the SEC in their place put it would take power from the networks. Think about it? A conference network of this size would be a must have. They wouldn't have to force their conference network on anybody. The people, the fan bases would be screaming to have it.
Not to mention instead of a football conference championship you could have a conference 4 team playoff in football for a conference Champion. :D. Also the basketball tournament would just be crazy. What do you think?
One problem ND has to be all in and that means one school has to be out. :(