With all the effort Cliff is putting in even before arriving on campus... he seems to already be working on his status of becoming a legendary Jayhawk!
Rock Chalk, Cliff!
drgnslayr
11251 posts
Jayhawks to Badgers... calling all Badgers for an important message:
Normally, we'd say "Beak'em, Jayhawks!"
But this time, we are all in up north -
"Claw'em, Badgers!"
...and if you want to chew off their faces to the point of being unidentifiable... please feel free to do it!
Can we get a group rally together for this one?
Hmmmm.... what do you think?!
Amazing how little time it took Danny at Tulsa to raise his stock!
I think the right decision will be whatever he chooses, because Danny thinks out his decisions carefully.
Whatever he does.... good luck, Danny!
"Yeah, but they work because Ellis is screening post defenders and pushing them up court. Is Ellis going to screen for himself?"
Of course not. But a big reason why the play works in the first place is that is starts near the rim and is on the edge of the defense, so the opportunity for weak side help isn't there. These are the factors that make base line attacks original. The stuff I was talking about didn't involve screens (for the most part). It is about players that know how to score from the baseline. They create their own screens by running through the pile. They find openings by cutting down the baseline. They take advantage of using their big men to draw low post defenders up higher in the lane.
Baseline basketball is like being a magician using a sleight of hand. Defense, for the most part, faces their goal at the other end. There is a reason we call it "back door."
Actually, I have to hand it to Self for being one of the few coaches in college basketball to run ANYTHING on the baseline! I wish he would do a little more, like teach one guy (like Perry) how to capitalize on the baseline more, then it opens up plenty of derivatives. Suddenly, it opens up alley-oops to our guards when the player like Perry comes up in mid range to set a screen. We have done it before. We used to do it some with EJ when he had hops. It becomes more effective when you have a real baseline player that establishes himself along the baseline. So when he goes up to screen, the defender behind falls asleep because he relaxes from the threat of a baseline attack and especially doesn't see it coming from a PG or a 2-guard.
@dylans - I agree with your post. There will be openings along the baseline. And imagine someone coming at us with a 1-3-1? Baseline attack helps guard against these teams that play high perimeter ball pressure... because then we feed into the mid range and pull their lower post players away from the line.
Funny you mention Niang.... that guy is sneaky and physical enough to become one heck of a baseline player. He's a guy who should start studying the art and bring it to the league with him. I hope he heals up well. He is a guy I respect.
What made it work really well for Wilkes was his ability to bomb the 3. Wilkes first had to do it without the extra point, because his game precedes the 3-pt goal in the NBA. Then in 1979, the NBA brought the 3, and it did nothing but solidify his game. He was deadly from the corner or out front, so when he positioned himself up there it was a legitimate threat. Half the time he was lulling low post defenders asleep. I'm talking about weak side help... the league may technically be about M2M defense... but let's get real... teams run hybrid defenses. Imagine what Wilkes could do on a college zone defense?!
Wilkes was a true magician. It was hard to find the ball under the cocoanut shell!
Larry can do no wrong in my book. I felt fortunate to have had the opportunity to meet him and he was nothing but class. Everyone went nuts for Larry when he was our coach.
I loved the big glasses. They made jokes about those glasses. The glasses helped him see every tiny detail... every tiny flaw! Players couldn't get away with anything when those glasses were near the court!
I felt if Embiid was over emphasizing his injury to skip March games it was because he was afraid to turn pro soon. By sitting out it helped pull the light off of him for a bit and perhaps eased pressure to go pro. I still highly doubt that happened. But that was what my gut felt concerning even the possibility of such a thing.
Tripucka was very capable of playing physical when need be. He definitely wasn't a wimp, and both him and Wilkes were great on the baseline. I studied those guys because much of my own game came off the baseline. I loved playing the line, and no one knows how to do it today. It is a pity, because it was such a dynamic part of basketball that gave way to poor officiating that allowed defenders to heavy arm players right out of bounds without a foul call. I never understood why refs did that except under instructions. I guess the league office didn't want the game played near under the basket. Probably because at that time, the camera angles were limited. Tripucka and Hansbrough have similarities in their game and personalities. Both liked to play rough, but also liked to finesse flop calls. I bet Tyler has given up on most of that in the league now.
The best match for Perry is Wilke's game. He was only 6'6" but developed a plethora of moves in the low post, including some back-to-the-basket moves, like a baby hook and full blown Kareem-style hook. That guy was one of the best low post players who could finesse off a pivot. He could come in hard to the middle, like he was a 7-footer, or he could spin away on the baseline with a dead-eye fade away jumper. No one ever learned to shut down Wilkes. And he could dribble and was lethal in the open court. I adored his game going back to UCLA, when he played for Wooden.
If Perry could study and become the next Wilkes, he would leave Kansas with a NC trophy under his belt because college coaches today don't have an ounce of experience dealing with baseline scorers. He would go undefended and would rack up some outrageous stats.
Our alley-oop plays often come off the line, giving us just a taste of what is possible from that area of the court.
I think if Self has a real option at the 4 (and 5) he'll use minutes to leverage motivation out of Ellis. Self can't be happy with Perry's inconsistency at the 4. Against big post players, he actually shows consistency by consistently not showing up for those games.
I'm pretty sure, no matter who stays and who we get... since signing Alexander, Perry will be pushed into lifting his game. It all helps Perry in the end because this year was not a positive development year for Perry.
I heavily consider the words from Hudy when making that statement. This should have been Perry's year to make a huge impact.
I need to look back but I thought we were in on another forward who had finished his degree and wanted to play his final year somewhere else... like Tarik did. He is eligible this coming year.
Oh... I was thinking about Anthony Lee (from Temple). Guess he is on his way to Ohio State. But you never know with Self. That could change. He isn't signing an LOI, so he is fair game until receiving aid from OSU.
Interesting.... I only see Tharpe as a possible transfer if Self basically levels the boom on him. Otherwise... he'd be taking his negative baggage with him to another school that can only accept him with a defensive attitude.
AW3... he should transfer. He's a player, and for whatever reason, he won't be getting real minutes next year. I felt he should have shared minutes with Wayne this year. He would have been another nice option in March... especially since we know freshmen have a tendency to disappear in March (which happened with Wayne).
Maybe Ellis should study Tripucka and Wilkes game. Especially Wilkes.
Wilkes was only 6'6" and was a prolific scorer in the league, and he did it with finesse, not force.
Ellis has height over both of these players.
I'm saying I can't see a situation where we don't have Embiid, Turner or someone else we quickly find as a backup. It appears we are staying in the mix for other bigs if we don't have Embiid or Turner.
You are right... if we don't have anyone else... Ellis and Alexander will be left and right in the post.
You mentioned Tyler Hansbrough.... I sort of lost track of him. Just did a look up on how Tyler was doing in the pros. Looks like he is a free agent.
He needs to study Kelly Tripucka's game. That guy was amazing. Hansbrough should be the next Tripucka.
I miss players like Tripucka. Guys that know how to score off the base line. Jamaal Wilkes was another one.
That's right. Cole did have a few minutes in the season, but that was his coming out party on the national stage.
Cole already had a rep as a shot blocker in practice. Within our team, no one was shocked by his performance against UNC.
Gosh... what a pleasant thought to have now. A flashback to that game and how jacked up we were to get after it with UNC. I'd give my right leg to see us get after basketball like that again!
Excellent point. We had 3 solid perimeter defenders.
And let's not forget this year's rule changes. Maybe we never get a good perimeter lock down team again (against the drive).
With the game being called tighter.... It is imperative that we have a shot blocker!
I will be shocked if we lose Embiid this year and we don't sign Myles. It already seems we are shopping around to make sure if this scenario does happen, we will have a backup.
And let's not forget... we did have a true 5 off the bench.... Sasha Kaun! And down the stretch... we had Cole, too!
Didn't Sasha start sometimes, too?
Making big changes... like going from a back-to-the-basket 4 to a swing 3 is almost impossible without having the natural talent. Perry isn't huge on natural talent. But... seriously... I doubt Kansas has ever had a player who is willing to work harder on his game.
Maybe that will be the difference and maybe Perry can make the change. His hard work has brought him to this level in his life, and he really wouldn't be playing any college basketball if he had only counted on his natural talent. Everything we see in Perry has come through major practice reps.
If he wants to stay at the 4, he should spend his entire summer playing competitive ball somewhere. Get away from all those lone reps of theoretical basketball. He needs more physical play against someone. Maybe on some inner-city street courts in what is considered "unorganized basketball." That could toughen him up. In those games, players have to earn everything, and weakness is like throwing raw meat to lions.
I think Perry may win the "war of wills" with Self.
Self has wanted Perry to be more "Julius Randle-esque" since day 1 at Kansas. Self seemed to make headway with Perry at the end of his freshman year. But this year, Perry clearly showed himself as a finesse 4. There is no more doubt about that. Well.... finesse 4s are not the best fit in Self's hi/lo. If Perry had done nothing but pump iron last summer and ate tons of hormone red meat, he might have come closer to becoming a real power forward. He did get stronger... but it didn't seem to get him to the next level.
Hudy discussed player development. The big gains typically come between freshman and sophomore years through the summer.
Perry may be the most-disciplined workhorse in the off-season. They guy lives to train. If his mind was only fixed on being "Randle-esque" he would develop the body to fit. But he hasn't. And his personality and focus appears to have stayed around finesse.
Maybe it is too much to turn and square peg into a round peg.
And now we have Alexander coming in. I just don't see Perry spending his summer slamming down beef steak and smacking major bench presses so he can, at best, try to compete for power minutes against Alexander. Maybe I am wrong.
I see Perry going to the video room and watching tape on the twins. Marcus, the definitive new cut 3 at the next level... or Kieff... the definitive pro tweener at the 4, that creates match-up problems by accentuating the positives of being a tweener. Perry could work hard and find himself going for either one of these roles. Neither is a power 4.
Good points. And you are right... history doesn't look good for Ellis moving to the 3. But if he doesn't make major changes in his game, he'll be the kind of tweener that doesn't stand a chance at the next level.
I don't think it bodes well for Self to have Perry flop at the next level. I know Self's history doesn't point to Perry moving to the 3... but if he doesn't and he flops, won't that reflect bad on Self's reputation with top shelf talent? Perry was a big recruit coming out of HS.
We definitely caught a taste of Perry bombing 3s. I'm 100% certain that a big part of Perry's workout this summer will be structured around perimeter shooting. That doesn't help him most if he is trapped as a 4 in Self's hi/lo.
BTW: we all know Alexander is expecting big time minutes. Won't he, most likely, be stealing most of his minutes from Perry at the 4?
Everything I've read on Myles is he definitely won't be an OAD... TAD at best. Myles appears to be a smart kid who isn't making immature ego decisions like most of these top shelf players. He doesn't seem to overvalue his current level of play.
If he knows (or thinks) he will be in college for at least 2 years, wouldn't it be best if he played his first year with Embiid? I'm starting to think he may WANT Embiid to stay and play a year with him.
It feels like Self assumes all these top shelf players want to be OAD... or if they don't think that way, they should.
BMac wasn't given a choice on coming back. Self insisted he turn pro. I know BMac's situation of poverty, but would his family have starved to death if he waited one more year?
I think Self is building his OAD reputation. Trying to be viewed as fair, but also trying hard to get top shelf players to the league ASAP. I think Bill fears a situation like Marcus Smart.. a player coming back and losing draft stock.
Thanks, so much, for your kind and assuring words!
Today I will spend a big part of my day taking care of my elder aunt and uncle, who have largely been neglected by their own child and grand children. I've respectfully tried to explain to my cousin how important it is to be there for his parents, and how it also sets the example to his kids... but I couldn't make an impact.
It all starts with respecting elders. Sometimes it isn't easy because there can be plenty of tough history surrounding the situation. But you have to see the broader picture.
Anyone who has changed my diaper has earned my respect and attention to changing their diapers when the day comes.
It all starts with family. Then... it is very easy to look out the window and see other areas in the world that deserve your respect, too. Like Naismith Drive.... I always felt like I was in a dream riding my bike! I wouldn't trade those moments for all the tea in China!
Great read! Thanks! I feel like such an old boot in here sometimes.... And when I mention the good old days around my wife (who is a generation younger) I'm met with some major eye rolling.
I hope you are right... and I hope one of the three experienced teams wins this year. My skeptical opinion keeps telling me (however) that it doesn't matter. In a ways, it may even benefit Kentucky more to lose this year. Keep the focus off of what they are building in Lexington. They will continue their march to separate themselves from the pack by offering athletes more. The drive is to recruit not only the very top 5 players for starters, but to go at least 8 deep with that top shelf. I think that is what the difference is from where Kentucky has been the past few years. Having more depth and that depth improving the entire team through more competitive practices as well as having more depth for games. It also takes 2 or 3 more top tier players out of the hands of their competition... like Kansas.
In their best case scenario, I still don't see them winning more than half the NCs. But I think that is enough to control the game. Wooden's run will never repeat.
I'd like to see the pros let kids go straight from HS. Then I'd like to see the NCAA put tough restrictions on scholarship athletes, making them show high attendance and good grades even in their first semester. Then... you clean up a lot of this stuff. And then why let them stay in luxury apartments? For top athletes, let schools pay them something beyond their scholarship and stipend and put it in a trust for them and release it when they are 21. And give them extended insurance that covers permanent treatment for any injuries caused during college play.
College sports is one big mess because the NCAA is nothing but a fascist regime.
So... instead of something fair and smart coming out for college athletes... it will take a total transformation into unionization... which, in the end, just makes everything a bigger mess.
No one in here is talking about Northwestern football winning the right to unionize...
It is the start of the end...
Thanks for your post... makes sense!
Go Larry!
You are right...
I just took the Calipari mentality... "you can never sign enough talent!"
Maybe Self will remain different from Cal.
I'm not sure why Self has basically told Myles to go elsewhere if Embiid stays.
Why wouldn't he want 3 stud post players in a constant rotation for 2 spots on the floor. With his hi/lo the 4 and 5 can be interchangeable... more like left post and right post.
Ellis should start working his game out to the 3 because he isn't aggressive enough to play 4 at the next level.
The best development for Myles would be to spend a year playing scrimmage ball against Embiid. That should help him more than game time anyways.
Sure seemed to work for Marcus Lee...
"Point Guard is a difficult position to play. It's hard to find a point guard at the high school level that is a true PG moving to the next level."
I believe you nailed it.
And I don't think most D1 coaches know what to look for. It sounds silly... but most have never experienced the depths of what a true leader PG will bring to a team. Self fits in there. We've never had a PG who is also babysitter for the rest of the team. Someone who leads his team on and OFF the court.
Self goes for athletic combo guards, especially if he can find one with height. That's the same approach many D1 coaches have. Get some height out on the perimeter to defend the 3, and that same height will be able to shoot over defenses and nail the 3.
Self doesn't attempt to run dribble-drive offense. His big motto on offense is not letting the ball stick. His offense is about quick passing with well-spaced perimeter players, then look for hi/lo into the post.
Self's offense works very well throughout the main part of the season, like through league play. We can credit his offense for doing it's part to win 10 conference championships. But there are problems with his offense in March.
What beats Self's offense is hustle. Defenses hustling throughout the entire shot clock. Defenses that know how to flex and not break. Teams get better at this as the season progresses, and March is a high motivator for teams to hustle on defense all game. (see Stanford)
What wins in March is dribble-drive. There is no way to stop a super speed, quality guard from penetrating. Then the best defenses can do is offer good weak side help. That's why teams like UCONN continue to win National Championships with less overall team talent. UCONN is a guard school, especially PG school. 6'1" Napier dismantled the best team in March last weekend. The PG position is not about height. Height will get you beat most of the time by a quality, little PG who can thrash through your defense like momma whips potatoes. Once Napier penetrates, the remaining 4 players for UCONN look to get open, or look to hit the glass for a rebound as the defense shifts to offer weak side help.
That's why UCONN has been a lot more successful than Kansas during the Bill Self era.
Can we say... "Kembo Walker?" Does that name ring a bell?
UCONN is the last team to beat Florida this year. It should be some pretty good basketball this coming weekend. And Wilbekin is no slouch!
UCONN has doubled the success of Kansas over the Bill Self era, winning 2 NCs, and 4 FFs.... we can now change that to 5 FFs, and we'll know on Monday if it is 3 NCs.
Might we have our heads shoved a bit too high up our backside and should remove it to take a look at why UCONN is kicking our arse in March?!
Mason has some potential. Not sure he can be a premiere PG... but he at least has some serious dribble-drive potential. As the season progressed, he was throttled down off the drive. His drive seemed to be a bit more reserved for late in games when we sort of give up on anything else working. Tharpe just flat out stopped penetrating all together. That was our demise. But then... the other 4 players simply watched when Mason drove the ball. They weren't coached into making something good happen. Mason was alone on his drive and it would often end without a score. We just didn't work on dribble-drive offense... period!
What I really, really hated with this team is we finally get into an open court possession, and Tharpe would drive into the lane, and then not finish. He would pull the ball out and start a half court possession. Very basic basketball here. When you have a 1-on-1 or 2-on-2 in the open court you finish at the rim or with a small pull up (especially when the ball is in the hands of your PG). It's a situation where you have the advantage and must finish the play. You either get fouled, score the basket, or both (most of the time).
Those open court bobbles we had not only cost us a few points, it gave a message to our opponents that we really weren't a threat in the open court. Opponent guards could focus on scoring 100% of the time on their possessions, instead of worrying about us in a fast break opportunity.
That was a major screw up we did all year. Self never reacted, and I guess he thought it might save us another costly TO.
Come on, Jayhawks.... adopt the Badge!
Go Badgers!
Good post!
I guess my post voids out potential for character stories coming out of Kentucky and the franchise mill. I have watched most of their games and taken a liking to all their players, similar (but not quite) to how I favor our guys. I'm sure many or all of their guys are of decent character and made sacrifices to get where they are at. But it seems like they have quite an advantage once arriving at college. I would like to be a coach with the problem of getting 6 McDs AAs to play well together in one year. I'm sure it is a challenge... but they all have miles and miles of upside. Compare that to a players with a lot less height and natural athleticism... how do you make those players competitive with the top athletes? It is a much harder climb. But it is possible. That is the story that needs to continue throughout college sports.
My entire premise is built on the hypothesis that Calipari will pull this monopoly off. There is no guarantee Kentucky wins 5 of the next 10... or even another championship in the next 10 years.
I'm with you in that character is built everywhere and isn't determined by one team doing whatever. I just think as a society, we seem to only cling on to those who win it all, and the big risk is we undervalue great character stories that get plowed under by a franchise team (or teams).
I was impressed this year by WSU.. much more than what I saw at KU. The Shocks margin of error was like zero, but they put together a heck of a run and I can't imagine any team besides this Kentucky squad playing about perfect could have stopped them. To this point, they were clearly the toughest win for Kentucky in March. Their story was about team work and team attitude, and leadership. I don't think anyone is talking about the Shocks now. Their season has already been marginalized. I have a hard time thinking I can find a story within this Kentucky team that will match theirs. These were juco boys squaring off equal to a team full of 1st round lottery picks that had a huge size advantage, too... along with years of top notch coaching camps, tournaments and AAU ball.
The old adage, "it isn't the size of the dog in the fight, but more the size of the fight in the dog" can be put back in the book and hidden to the back of the book case again. In this case, it was the size of the dog.
My fear (or fearmongering) wouldn't differ had WSU won that game. It would have just prolonged (slightly) the development of the super franchise of Kentucky basketball. That is real... and we are experiencing Kansas react in fear by trying to keep up with Kentucky and at least develop modernized dorms with copycat features to entice recruits.
Next, will we be able to add 100k sq ft of perimeter space to AFH to compete with the new Rupp Arena?
Will we be able to build a media outlet to match what Kentucky will be producing over the next 10 years?
Okay... let's say we match Kentucky, tit for tat... what about the 400 or so other D1 institutions? How many schools will be keeping up with this race for talent?
The money and power is colossal.
I'm not sure Calipari is the problem. He may just be the messenger with faster feet that got the message out before anyone else.
I don't think we are that far off where basketball fandom becomes too centralized. Where the chances for small schools finishing at the top of the heap in March goes from slim to none. This year was a great year for little schools stinging blue bloods. I think many fans from across the country loved the experience that lead up to the Final Four, mostly because the little guys were standing a chance. That single ray of hope is about all it takes to create magic everywhere. That small ray is all it takes to light up our entire country for a few weeks!
I hope we don't lose that. Big college entities developing into huge business franchise models will make it a smaller and dimmer light for most college teams. I mention Kentucky because they are ahead of everyone on this. But we are involved, too. It is a race to the top... a competition... a capitalistic approach of devouring competition to gobble up market share.
I am a capitalist. I grew up in this country and appreciate everything it has offered me. But I also see the eventual end result of where it goes... one entity monopolizing and eating the rest. Because the money has become so huge in college sports, I don't see how we slow it down now. Kentucky will build gold and ivory sleeping vessels for it's basketball players similar to the great pharaoh tombs in Egypt, because these players will be treated like Gods. That is where we are headed.
Back in my KU days, I lived a distance from campus and rode a bicycle up the hill of Naismith Drive every day to class, regardless of the weather conditions. That was a different time. I didn't have my own chef and specialized, customized accommodations. I had a dump apartment. But those long, freezing bike rides up hill is part of what built me to what I am today. It was an honor and privilege to freeze my testicles every day on Naismith Drive. I was kept warm by realizing how special that was. How do I tell my son a story like that and have it count, after he reads about the luxury apartments we are building to adorn our athletes?
That is my dilemma. Watching our society crumble further into decay because the focus on character is marginalized and sold out for a big pile of cash and a false dream. Sure... anyone can win the lottery. That is what society is focused on... the big winner. But the big winners are everywhere, often in tiny dwellings with limited resources. People who fight hard every day to better their lives and their family's lives. This is where the stories are. And historically, these stories have passed on through basketball, too. That is where my connection is to basketball. Otherwise, it is a dumb game just tossing a silly ball into a cylinder in a loop of redundancy. I believe I will have a harder battle on my hands to parent through the future of basketball when the public focus is only on big bucks and NBA draft choices. I want me kid focused on the stories like WSU had this year. That is where the realism is that will help my son throughout his life. He WILL be peddling through snow up hill on Naismith Drive to AFH every day. Some things you can't learn any other way.
No one in here knows the Badgers like you do. Between now and Final Four tip off, can you post a thread on how you see their game with Kentucky panning out?
I think most of us would like to read more of your opinions on Badger ball!
I give Andrew a solid 10 mark.
He could have done like most all-star players and just worked on his offensive stat sheet, but he gave more by getting after it on the defensive end. A real sign of character in a time when the word is lacking from college basketball.
I'm not sold on the idea that much of the season Andrew was "unplugged" on the offensive side of the ball. When he faded into games it was because we didn't execute enough strategy to involve him in the offense.
I can illustrate my point by looking back at games where he was "unplugged" and see he was still plugged in on defense.
He will be a great representative for Kansas moving forward. Doubtful you will see him in nude sexual selfies on twitter...
"drgn: I like your main idea thrust in this essay. Well said. One question though: What would you say about last year's "no chemistry" Kentucky team NOT making the Tournament and getting beat in 1st round NIT? "
That's why I built my premise around Kentucky winning 5 out of 10 championships. If they win this year, they will be 2 out of the last 3. Then they can crumble again next year, and be back the year after. It works out as good math for Kentucky, because their fan base has expectations far exceeding ours. Their fans do expect to be national champions every year, so a bad year in between builds plenty of chip for the following year. Who would think this year's Kentucky team is carrying a chip! To some degree it is there. That came out in the WSU game.
What really sticks out to me when reading my post over is how invisible Thomas Robinson has become and what a legend Danny Manning still remains. All over the outcome of one game.
Winning a National Championship does not make a story to tell your children and grand children. Kentucky has proven that in 2012... However, NOT winning a National Championship when you have a story ALSO does not make a story last through time.
These franchise Kentucky teams do nothing but erase great potential history from occurring. No one should be for that, including Kentucky fans.
I've always seen Calipari as a threat. He seems to only care about his own bank account. But I've never had anything against Kentucky, and I've always maintained a high level of respect for Kentucky basketball and their fan base, who has always stayed charged up even under some pretty tough extended years of bad basketball.
I don't know if I'm too much a fearmongerer or just ahead of the game in seeing what is to come. I've heard Calipari talk about his goals to have 8 or so 5-star top prospects as a goal. I think we could make quite a blog on Marcus Lee, and if he made the right choice by attending Kentucky. He had quite the "coming out" party last weekend... He could have played an entire year of 30+ PT mpg if he had gone to really any other program in the country, including KU. On the other hand... he had to battle all that UK post talent every day in practice.
I did leave out one gigantic part of Calipari and the UK future in basketball....
MEDIA EXPANSION!
Calipari's biggest goal is to make huge expansions for UK sports. This goes beyond the existing BBSN (Big Blue Sports Network), with goals to be a world syndicate sports media outlet. This is the final step for UK expansion, involving so much more than just Kentucky basketball games and a coach's program. The expansion will hide behind education as it will bring education into the fold by promoting most educational areas at UK.
I don't see how any other university will be able to stand up and compete with UK. We are the closest thing they have to a competitor because we own a big chunk of history (and the rules), and we have a far superior brand logo (the Jayhawk). Funny thing... our mythical bird is a big part of our power leverage moving forward...
Question is... did that (or she) "go down" just hours before we played Stanbuick... I mean Stanford?
Why would Kentucky fans ever cheer against their own team? Isn't the motivation behind fans all about their team dominating their sport?
Simply put, yes it is. But let's face it, our drive for supremacy isn't a realistic one. Does anyone in here really believe Kansas can win, say, 5 out of the next 10 National Championships? Don't be silly... of course not. But Kentucky can.
I know I don't want Kansas to win 5 of the next 10 National Championships. That would turn our fan base into the biggest bunch of ego-bloated maniacs on the planet. I'm not making a character slam on Kansas fans... but fans in general... because that is what happens to humans who win too much. Then fans like me walk away. I will not be a member of a group filled with sloths. Or in the case of Kentucky, being a member of the organisation that killed dreams for future generations of children.
At this point I need everyone to reach up with both hands, firmly grip the crimson/blue glasses you are wearing, and remove them from your eyes so you can see where I am about to go because we will be departing Jayhawk basketball land for just a minute.
Kentucky is on the edge of destroying college basketball. If they can win two more games this weekend, they will advance their future dominance on the game. There is so much more to this than the actual game being played... however... everything happening behind the scenes is a drive to win games being played in March. The goal is to dominate March. The goal is to monopolize March Madness trophies at any cost, including removing the magic of the game.
Over the last few weeks, even though our Jayhawks failed to advance past the first week, we've been blessed with true basketball euphoria; upsets all over the place; monumental programs falling to small ball and a record-breaking amount of games going down to the wire to decide a winner. We could hardly ask for more had our Jayhawks advanced beyond week one!
Once again, mainstream media is asleep to the real story of March this year. The story isn't WSU setting record wins, a record number of close games, Wisconsin advancing to the Final Four or Florida back in the spotlight. The story this year is a question: Will Kentucky advance their dominance agenda?
First. I want to explain what I see as the damage caused by Kentucky building complete dominance in basketball. If the future of basketball involved Kentucky owning every other National Championship the entirety of college basketball will suffer devastating consequences.
Kentucky has already become the quintessential broker of the OAD. This year's class of Kentucky freshmen not only own their starting five positions, one five-star recruit sat most of his year on the bench as a reserve. We only have to go back to yesterday's game with Michigan to realize that a bench player like Marcus Lee can step onto the court and totally dominate the game. Kentucky's one main contributor non-freshman is sophomore Alex Poythress. This IS the best group of freshmen ever to play on one team, hands down! Their shortest starter is 6'6" with excellent ball skills and they have (had) two legitimate 7-foot skilled players in the post. The only hope of beating Kentucky rests in the hope that Kentucky beats Kentucky.
Winning another National Championship from play of basically all freshmen is a step forward to the thinking that the future of college basketball dominance will not come from players who work hard through years of effort in a college program and by developing ultimate team cohesion. The future of college basketball dominance will be focused on 90% recruiting and 10% coaching ability (to basically get out of the ego-way of your all-stars so they can develop just enough team bonding to win a title). I've been sickened lately by hearing media people talk about all the trials and tribulations Kentucky has suffered over the past few months and how their sacrifices has earned them a real shot at another title. What about all the teams stocked with 4 and 5-year seniors? What about going through 5 years of trials and tribulations, effort and sacrifice, only to lose to a team of all-stars thrown together for a few months? This John Calipari formulation for winning, if successful now and in the future, will tear apart the very fiber of what makes college basketball great. The fiber of college basketball isn't just about winning (we have pro ball for that). It is the character stories it provides us to teach our children. That is what college basketball is truly about. Our society needs examples to show children what are the right and just paths to take with their lives, along with stories of loss and sacrifice and all things that build character and drive to become victorious.
I know some in here don't care too much for Wichita State University basketball... but we should all appreciate their hard work and determination that helped them accomplish the season they had. Their story is one to be told to children everywhere... how a team of juco players rose to the quality level of top D1 programs. They deserved better than to go down in a loss to an all-star team thrown together for a few months. Just like two years ago. We didn't have one of our most-talented teams, but we made it to the championship game largely because of the heart of a group of guys who came together because of the loss of Thomas Robinson's mom. That was the chip we needed to drive us to the promised land. They deserved winning that championship. Both of these stories are ones that build the character of college basketball itself, but we all were robbed of those stories becoming immortalized because those stories never went to completion due to a bunch of one-and-dones who will leave absolutely no mark on the game of basketball. The only mark they can leave is "best recruitment class ever." The Kentucky class of 2012 are long forgotten, even (for the most part) in Kentucky. I can only recall one word from that class... unibrow! Wow.. what a story to tell our children... success is created when you recruit a unibrow.
I have a son and I've been hopeful, from day one, that my little tike will grasp all the magic of basketball. I'm not sure I care anymore. I'm looking at him being thrown into a future where he either is in that very top elite recruit status and on his way to another cookie-cutter Kentucky Championship team, or he is nothing. His story, and efforts, will die on page-10 after falling into the shadows of another illustrious Kentucky recruiting class.
Many of you (and I put myself into this group), believed Calipari would be brought down eventually for cheating, like his past history infers. I don't believe that any longer. Calipari has too much to lose now to induce a player with a Rolex Presidential watch. And to be honest, he doesn't have to. Let's now look at Calipari's sales pitch moving forward.
Why the top talent in college basketball should attend the University of Kentucky:
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You will play for a coach (and a system) that is geared towards the maximizing of showing your talents for the next level. Look at how many successful Kentucky players have gone in the NBA first round over the past years.
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You will have the best chance of winning a National Championship in the one year you will give to the college game.
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You will be playing with a team full of the who's who in your class. You will improve your game most by practicing every day with players of the same caliber that will be headed off to the pros with you.
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You have the very finest dorm facility, custom-built to accommodate our basketball team. You'll even have your own trained chef to whip you up your favorite foods anytime you want.
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You'll soon play in the most-modernized, decked-out arena in all of college basketball. Imagine bringing your family to the NEW Rupp Arena!
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You'll train in the very best, new, state-of-the art training facilities specifically tailored for basketball.
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You'll play for a colossal basketball fan base that is huge, completely committed, and growing faster than any fan base in America!
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You'll be playing for one of the few elite blue-blood programs in America. Look at our history and compare. We lead the nation in most-wins of any program!
No program can compare with Kentucky's offer.
I'm not totally sure about #7 right now.. but give it a few more years. There are two types of fans; those that support underdogs and those who support proven winners. As Kentucky builds their new dominance, what percentage of new and fair-weather fans will jump on their bandwagon? I'd say... a HUGE number! I've experienced it right here in Kansas and have run across a lot of Kentucky fans right here in Kansas. These aren't Kentucky alumni... just fans drawn to the top talent shelf. Even I watched most of their games this season to see how the greats advance.
We need to wake up from our dream. Leave the Jayhawk glasses off our heads. This isn't about Kansas falling back a distant second or third behind Kentucky. This is about our game of basketball, brought into existence by one Doctor James Naismith, falling into demise after one entity becomes owner of the crown. Gone are the lost examples of character (which has always driven college basketball), replaced by a grouping of top talent playing together for only a few months.
We should change the University of Kentucky Wildcats to the Franchise of Kentucky Wildcats. Their future will be guaranteed an entire team full of McDonald's All-Americans... they might as well sell french fries from their huddle.
If this continues to go in the direction I lay out here... I'll advise my son to play baseball. Why would I direct him into a sport that is removed from the principles of building character? It's all about recruiting the most talent now and you can kiss all the character and character-building stories good-bye. Immortalized stories exist in our country only from winners, and we define college basketball winners as one team going all the way in March.
Calipari has had this plan ever since he landed on the Kentucky campus, probably sooner. He's slipper. Am I the only one who noticed how Calipari pulled off us in 2012 to make it a modest win for the National Championship? He has intentionally manipulated the game to not attract too much attention until they completely own college basketball. It has worked perfectly so far. If they win this year, and they dominate the championship game, you will see Calipari throttle down the finish once again, to stall media attention away from his dominance plan. Mainstream media isn't talking about the story I've posted here today. They will come around after it is too late.
I've removed my Jayhawk glasses. I have mixed feelings about recruiting OAD players to Kansas, but to this point, we do not possess the Calipari plan of recruiting 6 or 7 OAD players and having a revolving door policy every year. But I do believe Bill Self is convinced that the Calipari method is now the future, or maybe he is just trying to slow down the Wildcat surge to complete dominance. Just imagine now if Wiggins had chosen Kentucky? If Kentucky can win this year without Wiggins, Calipari will be glad Wiggins didn't pick Kentucky, because it helped keep the spotlight off of his plan for future complete dominance. I'm glad we are not Kentucky. We won't be the program that destroys college basketball. We built college basketball.
I'm not against OAD players. They represent a bunch of talented kids who are just looking for the right path for themselves and they operate in a system that forces them into playing a year of college basketball. I'm against any team (not just Kentucky) who want to send a different message to our kids; either suddenly grow to 7' and become dominant, or you can forget the big dream, because the future is owned by just a few recruited on one team, and once the recruiting period is over for a year, the game has been decided. This is different than what we did this past year. At the most we will lose 2 players as OADs in a year where we were forced to rebuild our entire starting five that was lost with only one player being a one-and-a-half and done. However... I'm not sure our future direction will differ from Calipari's. If we ever get to the point of replacing our starting five every year with OADs, I'm gone from KU! As we stand today, sprinkling in a couple of top talent players won't create total dominance of college basketball and, more importantly, won't eliminate dreams for those who aren't in that exclusive top shelf.
"Danny and the Miracles" wasn't just about winning a National Championship. What was special is the story of what earned them a National Championship. I said "is the story" because their story has been immortalized and will be told to Jayhawk kids and all kids who read their story for generations to come. We may have owned the #1 pick in the 1988 NBA draft, but we were not the most-talented team that year and it showed in our record leading up to March. Our story was about adversity, and what those kids had to do to win it all. And 4 years of adversity and fortitude went in to building our #1 draft pick. He didn't get there in a couple of months dribbling a ball. That is the magic behind "Danny and the Miracles." The magic is the story you can tell your kids to never give up, fight hard and you can beat the Goliaths of the world.
I am holding onto a thread of hope that my future view of college basketball is wrong, and my son will have the same opportunities the game offered before the Calipari-Kentucky marriage. But I'm doubtful. It will take a vast majority of our population of all college basketball to come together to defeat one common enemy. We want the game back the way it was, where a group of juco players from a city university could win it all, or a team without a single McDonald's All-American player could win it all because the players' hearts were driven for the love of one of their players who tragically lost his mother. Those are the stories that help build character in future generations... not the story of who can collect the most OADs. These character stories are the stories I want to tell my son. I guess for some of these stories I'll have to dig back to page-10 in the press to find them, or will I even be able to find good print stories about Thomas Robinson and his story that brought a team, fan base and nation together through his loss. Heck... do WE still remember Thomas Robinson and the tree dedicated to his mother that is planted on campus? I will take my son to that tree with plenty of time to tell the story.
Maybe I have to focus on another sport that will continue to offer those kinds of stories to my son.
Batter up!
Super congrats! Now kick the crap out of UK!
Brilliant! Imagine his draft stock then? The first 7' PG who also averages 3.8 BPG, 11.2 RPG!
Since Self is buried into the philosophy of running combo guards at point... why not go for it all? Since we seem to think we may need another 6'9" PF (Anthony Lee)... we'll just make him a combo guard and run him at point. Finally... enough height on the perimeter!
;)
@jaybate 1.0
Interesting thread.
I had the feeling that Wayne just needed to survive his first year so he could go through a complete summer with Hudy. Wayne is a strong guy, but he carries too much weight for a guy his size. Even dropping 5 lbs makes a huge difference when you talk about stress put on joints. He seemed a bit slow sometimes, too, but he was competing against thinner guards with more bounce in their step.
You definitely have a point, @jaybate !
I wonder if part of it could be that after players get a year or two into D1, they stop feeling invincible and so they play a bit more conservative...
I haven't blamed Andrew at all for our loss, and I thought he showed a big set of testicles by stepping up and taking responsibility for the loss when he shouldn't have.
He was being pinched out of drives all game and we didn't run anything to specifically attack their zone which would have created opportunities for Andrew.
He wasn't just going to make something happen in a situation like that. We had to switch up some structure on offense to help him out and we didn't.
Tough way for him to leave us...
My biggest mystery was Naadir. Why did he freak out so much? How often do you see that... a team's starting PG all year, playing 30+ mpg and then comes post season play and he disappears or makes huge blunders? What could have spooked him to that level? Why wasn't he worked with so he could have a decent March? Someone set him down for a talk.. some reassuring words... some ideas to help lift his confidence. Usually, players just need to hear that everyone around them has their back, even if they are the leader of the team.
Both of these situations I describe point more towards coaching issues rather than player issues. I don't easily let players out of their responsibilities... but in this case, it feels like they were just left to figure things out for themselves... either they get it or they don't. It felt like they were abandoned. It felt like a game where a team didn't have coaching there for them during the game.
I've complained a lot about Bill Self before and after this latest loss.
Still can't think of a replacement, nor would I want to replace him.
I just think he needs re-energizing and refocusing... that happens to people in all professions. We can all grow a bit stale in our current direction and then we need something to jolt us back on track or in a direction to become better.
Let's just send Bill off to summer camp! ;)
Maybe he is a little burned out and could use a 3-month trip to Thailand.
Well said!
My unhappiness wasn't over our loss. I was unhappy with our preparation and play. I was unhappy with the way we represented the University of Kansas. I was unhappy because the effort we needed to win ended up in our luggage going back to Lawrence.
I would have been unhappy had we won that game! We didn't deserve it!
I always hate to see us lose.
But... as long as we come ready to play and give it everything we got (coaches and players), then I have no problems with it! I may be grumpy for a few days, but I feel like we represented ourselves well and there was nothing more the coaches and players could do. Sometimes... we are going to lose!
But... when I feel we didn't come ready to play and anyone of the coaches our players slacked off, I'm going to point them out. I don't care if it is our beloved head coach, or the water boy. When we leave something on the table, we all have to go through our summer wondering... and feeling anxiety... and the lack of fulfillment.
Sports is about competing. It is about giving it your all. Anything short of it and you are selling yourself short, along with your teammates and fans.
Fans expect players to leave it all on the court. I can't think of one KU fan that didn't praise our 2012 team after losing in the Finals. We were completely over-matched... but we brought everything we had. I believe, deep down, all fans were satisfied that year. We had overachieved!
You are right... I don't know what goes behind close doors... but we all see what we see on the court.
If I wasn't a big Self fan I'd want him fired.
This sort of feels like when someone in your own family does something bad and family members have to step up and address it.
No doubt, my comments were harsh on Self. I know my standards are probably different from many in here. I have already read a lot worse comments than mine concerning Self. Many I found to be over the top. I'm just giving him a good kick in the nutsack. I think he has earned it.
No one is above scrutiny. Just because I'm a big Self fan it doesn't mean I'll cut him more slack than he deserves. Like I said... I want him to stay at Kansas.
In so many areas he has been a great coach... and when I say that I mean great the entire time he has been in Lawrence. I consider calling him the greatest to ever be at Kansas... then on second thought, I don't think that is good energy for people to lay on him. I'm starting to wonder if he lacks enough humility. Humility is a big part of motivation to improve... something I haven't been sold on for a few years.
But this one area... I feel like it should be addressed and I wouldn't go on just any website and post this. I post it on OUR website because we all are inside the Jayhawk Nation, and I think I've earned my straight say on about anything concerning this team.
This is only my opinion... I'm not trying to say it is fact or facts.
I think it does us all good to express what we feel. If we hold it in, we'll all be the worse for it, including our personal health.
I'd like nothing more than to experience Bill Self addressing the issue I threw out there. If he doesn't think he can improve as a coach, he's already lost the battle of being one of the best. Wooden, Izzo, Coach K... they all can improve. I bet if I was a Duke fan I would have some words for Coach K... mostly, that it is time for him to retire! He looks 3/4s dead sitting on the sidelines.
This isn't the first time I've posted this material. I think I did it last year and several years (not including 2012).
It is hard to be critical on this. I wish I could sweep it under the rug. But that wouldn't be fair to myself... or to people in here that expect me to say exactly what is on my mind (regardless if it is unpopular)... or to Coach Self. We shouldn't allow him to be the Emperor without clothes.
Self has already mentioned he was expecting criticism.
Doesn't he deserve for people to say what they really feel? I think he deserves that respect, even if some of it is unpleasant!
BTW: I appreciate it, but you are not rude! You should challenge me just like I should challenge Coach Self! I'm glad we are all respectful enough to not use name calling... but challenge me all you want! I'd rather hear what you really feel. It actually shows respect to say it straight! Don't leave me without clothes! I still miss iowajayhawk... he used to kick me in the rump and I respected him for it!
I agree... that article was a joke.
They took things out of context. Like...
"Bill Self's biggest frustration w Wiggins is lack of aggressiveness. Says he always leaves you wanting more, even when playing well."
Self went into detail about his comment here. He explained in detail that it wasn't about Andrew not putting out effort or aggressiveness... it was about Andrew showing incredible talent on certain plays and it just makes us want to see it more and what else he can do.
Stanford's zone did smoother him... but that wasn't the first zone we faced all year and they were not talented, period.
Self took the day off. He didn't prepare his troops for battle. He threw them out there and made them fight for themselves. And when we were clearly failing (from the tip off), he didn't use a time out to shift offense to attack the zone. He just sat back and watched.
This is his loss alone. He owes this team an apology... along with the thousands of fans.
He didn't want another NC... at least, not bad enough to put up a fight.
His coaching was down right pathetic!
I don't know if he will ever get hungry again. He's never been as hungry since '08. '12 was shear heart of a team that was there for TRob and his loss.
I still am a big Bill Self fan... but he needs to get his s#it together. He isn't doing Kansas right by his efforts at this moment. He has the B12 figured out, and he should be able to continue to win it and extend his record... but on the national stage it takes a tougher fight in March. I don't think he has it in him to make the right sacrifices.
I wish he would get his own swagger back. His teams don't have swagger because he doesn't have swagger. A team full of juco players 180 miles south of him had plenty of swagger, but our all-americans didn't. That's pathetic, and it points to the head.
I don't like to be a nagger... and I'm not a bad sport or just having an anger moment. I've already moved on from this loss... but I'm looking back at what I saw with clear eyes.
I want us to keep Bill at Kansas, but I want his batteries and focus re-energized. This has nothing to do with starting a bunch of freshmen. We started a a bunch of 5-yr seniors the year before and we flopped, too. That was the year we should have won.
It is hard to get to this level and then not come ready to play the game. This dysfunction is killing all of us!
It isn't about winning or losing... though there will be less losses if we come ready. I just can't handle watching us fight all year and come down to a March game where our guys weren't ready for the big stage. It discredits our entire program and it is flat out embarrassing. Even the Shockers make us look bad and downright stupid. Putting those two games side-by-side clearly illustrates the dysfunction we have!
How many times do we have to go through this in March? No problem if we lose, as long as we fight our hardest, and shift our game as needed... Teams are going to show up and make miracle shots and we will lose some. That's okay. But dropping a big dump in front of the entire world, not adjusting to the game, players all holding their knees on stops after just 11 minutes of basketball... what is going on?
We are better than this...
I really think Marshall is hungrier than Self. I don't know that I would say that before '08.
It just seems that Bill is too busy with many things, and the hunger that got him the trophy in '08 isn't quite there anymore. I think he has more hunger for B12 titles, and seeing how long his streak can stay alive.
It can drive you crazy... going for the gold in March. Because no matter what you do it is still a tough thing to win, because you need more than skill and determination... you need plenty of luck. Just ask Iowa State right now. Let's see how they go without Niang next weekend.
B12 titles play out over a couple of months and involve consistency and strategy (and luck, too).
That guy down in Wichita is one hungry dude, and it shows with his teams. He has a chip on his shoulder and he recruits kids with chips. The university has a chip, too. We haven't heard the last of them. They will be back next year in the tourney... and the year after...
Players play to the attitudes and drives of their coaches.
Not much of a drinker anymore... back a few I would have downed a few.
Sometimes you gotta drown your sorrows... and when they float to the surface... drown them again!
I've completed lots of garden and yard work since our loss. I try to work out my frustrations. It works and I get a lot done in the process!
I'll try to this afternoon! Thanks!
After a hard ending like we had, fans are showing how upset they are. That is a good thing.
Is the frustration driven by selfish reasons?
I'm sure some of it is. This is our school, our team, and we want them to win. And we want them to win to advance for another game for us to enjoy. I'm sure we have some ego involved, too.
I get all of that, and I'm one of those people.
But I also believe, deep down, our frustration is owned by the fact that we care about all the players and coaches. We don't want to see them fail anymore than we would want to experience our own children failing. There is a sadness we share now because we won't see many of these guys play again in a Kansas uniform. Some we may never see play again. That is a tough loss. That is the biggest reason college basketball is so magnetic. You have to appreciate every minute you have with your guys because the time is very limited.
Another part of caring about our players and coaches... we know there aren't many shots at something like this (for anyone) and all our guys will carry these results with them throughout their lives. Yes... many of them will have other big games in their future. But college is where the magic is and you only get to be a kid once.
I am going to miss the players that will leave us this year. The one player I know is gone, Tarik... man... I wish we had your other 3 years at Kansas! And to our guys who may leave early... we all wish you the best!
We'll keep an eye out for all you Jayhawks that leave. Just remember where you came from... once a Jayhawk, always a Jayhawk!
Rock Chalk!
Right after the loss I felt anger towards our coaching staff. I wanted to blame someone, and I always go to the top when assigning blame.
But after a long afternoon of yard work.... what came into my head is one question:
How bad does Coach Self want to win another National Championship?
My answer kept me laughing and crying all evening.
I'm not sure if he really or really, really wants to win another National Championship!
I do believe players mimic the attitudes of their coaches in their play.
We didn't really, really want this victory today. There was nothing stopping us from taking it. Stanford is not an exceptionally talented team and they didn't have an exceptional game.
I know I'm not using JoJo's absence as a crutch.
Let me put it to you all this way....
If this game had been played on the Mayan courts at Chichen Itza 1300 years ago and the losing team would be sacrificed to the sun God... I'm pretty sure we would have won. This meta synopsis should be saved for future reference and used as the gold standard for where the bar should stand. Sports today is not like it was in past history from Chichen Itza or the forum in Rome. Losses are not wagered in lives. But no sport can be played to it's high spirit and essence without desire fighting to reach that parallel.
Either bring every ounce of blood, sweat and spirit to the game, or leave it for those who will.