@KUSTEVE Exactly. Yeah that game was a big disappointment BUT we are still in first and I dont honestly believe Coach Self will let them lay down and give the title to the next best team. On the other hand, he better rip his players asses tomorrow and make them ALL run the stairs in AFH three times over. A public comment by him about how biased the officiating was in that game would be nice too.
Lulufulu
3094 posts
@icthawkfan316 couldnt have said it better myself. KU sucked bigtime in the second half and the officiating sucked even harder the whole freekin game.
@jaybate-1.0 Dude! That was brilliant. I am getting it, it makes sense. I like the concept of the four man weave being able to wear a Kentucky type team down, which we will absolutely need in late March! Coach Self must absolutely be first in consideration for Coach of the Year. What he is doing is nothing short of genius level legendary coaching. IMO of course.
@joeloveshawks Is it March yet? Im already pretty mad! ( crazy mad, not mad mad )
We gonna beat them Pokes by 20 today. Sharpie
@KUSTEVE @joeloveshawks I agree you guys. This season, I dont think they have reached their peak yet and I get the sense that once they do get there they should not have much drop off, if any.
Next year, our guys are gonna be scary. Legit final four contenders all year long.
@jaybate-1.0 I first took notice of the weave back with the 08 team. When it is used this season is it apart of the inside out attack or outside in? I guess by adding the 4th man to it, it kinda makes it outside in?
@Crimsonorblue22 Ah yah, you know your right, I would be disappointed if KU lost to Okie st today.
@jaybate-1.0 AND, Coach has 6 guys that can make it rain from deep this year! 6! Who has that? Ummm, like nobody.
@drgnslayr How about renaming that one street that you can't pronounce, that begins with an O i think? Rename that one to Larryville and then on the lawn outside AFH, some sort of statue or monument or something of that nature. Just a thought off the top of my head.
@Crimsonorblue22 Almost looks like he is a lock for ROY right now, considering the current competition. Its what Wigs does with his next 5 years that will make him one of the greats.
@BigManU Im excited for him, big time. But, when KU comes calling after Bill Self leaves, Danny better answer...if there isnt anyone of equal or greater value to KU in waiting before then.
@jaybate-1.0 Thats what Im sayin! Wigs is gonna be an effing stud! Making his Jayhawk nation proud.
@wrwlumpy Okie St. Am I concerned that this might be a trap game in the eyes and minds of our overachieving Jayhawks? Yeah, sure I am. The last 5,6 years Okie state has really given KU a test. It seems like we have split games with them during the season more often than not. If our young guys dont come to play it rough, theyre gonna lose. Theyre gonna get beat. Its as simple as that. I hope KU comes out for blood and comes away with the W but I wont be surprised or too disappointed to see Okie state steal one from us. It is very true that they need this one more than we do. Lets just hope that doesn't register in our guys heads.
@JayHawkFanToo No! I didnt see that one! Thanks! That was really cool.
@jaybate-1.0
Ford will pay the crew responsible for running the big screen to run intermittent clips of Dumb and Dumber throughout the game to try and distract and confuse KU.
@RockChalkinTexas Cool article, even cooler stats!
@drgnslayr Yeah!: I mean, when has he ever admitted to NOT having an inside out team? Not until just a couple days ago. It was a HUGE paradigm shift for him and for KU.
@truehawk93 Dude, I totally agree with you. I think next year will be a galactically stellar year for KU. I also only see Oubre as a definite possibility of declaring for the draft. I think there is a possibility he stays too but him going is higher. The kid is good. Somewhere between Ben and Wigs. He should go, but I think he may also need to take care of his Fam the way Ben did a couple years back. Cliff? He is like Trob in that another year or two will see him get much better and increase his draft stock.
This season, we arent at our peak yet. I dont feel we will be disappointed in the NCAAs this year at all. But next year with what we have potentially coming back and the new guy or two? I would imagine we would be one of the pre season favorites to win it all.
@JayHawkFanToo Sad to see a Jayhawk fired, its not cool. But, he was pretty much in a no win situation. Hope his next gig has a better upside to it! RCJH!
@HighEliteMajor Thanks! Im definitely going to watch that game again anyways and now I'll have a bit more to focus on.
@wissoxfan83 All right, after a couple days of pondering over what could happen for KU in March and after watching KU destroy ISU at their own game, I have decided to consult my magic 8 ball and look into my magic mirror. What I see is thusly; KU will win the conference championship, and win the conference tourney. How does the selection committee keep KU from a 1 seed if that happens? Either way, we should get the last 1 seed or the first 2 seed. KU is obviously tougher on both ends of the court this year and has more 40% trey gunners than at any time in Coach Self's whole career. Cliff turns into beast mode giving us a low post presence we havent had since TRob. Coach Self continues to baffle opposing coaches by switching offenses in game from hi lo to lo hi to inside out to outside in. They cant keep up with his genius scheming or KU's stifling defense. KU becomes very adept at press breaking, having rolled WVU both times. KU makes it to the Elite 8 and wins a squeaker nail biter like the 08 Davidson game to give Coach Self his 3rd final four appearance. Beyond that, the future is murky, my mirror clouded up and my magic 8 ball gave me a "dont count on it"
Serious question here. Regardless of what KU actually does this year, does Coach Self get awarded Coach of the Year for turning this KU team into a legit contender and winning his 11th straight conference championship?
@drgnslayr Beauty personified in a game invented by a genius.
I also like @jaybate-1.0 's T axis theory.
Outside Lawrence, Kansas, Bill Self is both overlooked and praised.
Consistency tends to breed that reaction.
Big 12 leader Kansas got an 89-76 victory over No. 11 Iowa State at Allen Fieldhouse on Monday that extended the No. 8 Jayhawks' winning streak to five games. Self is currently in a position to secure his 11th consecutive regular-season Big 12 title in the coming months.
The employee with the perfect attendance record after 20 years on the job usually gets a plaque and a round of applause. Maybe a few handshakes. Little more.
A man who climbs Mt. Everest for the first time attracts more recognition than the Sherpas who've scaled the peak for decades. There's just something about consistency that reduces fascination to near-apathy over time.
Oh, Kansas is in first place in the Big 12 again? The Jayhawks are chasing their 11th consecutive conference title? Well, the sun comes up and KU wins Big 12 championships, right?
Yes. That's been right for a decade.
That mantra persists 10 years after Self led Kansas to the first of 10 consecutive Big 12 championships in 2005. Do you remember 2005? We were two years away from the iPhone's debut. YouTube arrived in 2005. Many of Kansas' current players were in elementary school in 2005.
[+] EnlargeSelf
Denny Medley/USA TODAY Sports
Bill Self has Kansas in position to win its 11th consecutive Big 12 title.
And yet, Self is still leading the Jayhawks to first-place slots in the Big 12.
Remember when this was supposed to be the year that the streak ended?
When Rick Barnes signed Myles Turner. When Fred Hoiberg added Jameel McKay to his most talented roster at Iowa State. When Oklahoma brought back its nucleus from a year ago and added Houston transfer Tashawn Thomas. When Juwan Staten and West Virginia began to force more turnovers per possession than any team in America.
When Temple thrashed the Jayhawks by 25 points three days before Christmas.
Yet, they've returned to the throne.
Under Self, Kansas won a national championship in 2008. He also guided the Jayhawks to a national title game appearance in 2012 and coached the program to three Elite Eight berths (2004, 2007, 2011).
That's remarkable, but Self's reign over the Big 12 might be more impressive than his feats in the Big Dance.
No Big 12 team has swept Kansas in the regular season during Self's time there. Think about that. Iowa State topped Kansas in Ames a few weeks ago but couldn't match that effort in Lawrence on Monday.
Conference play meant everything to a former generation. In the past, you couldn't participate in the NCAA tournament without winning your league. Expansion relaxed the requirements and turned the conference season into a stage for regional bragging rights and week-to-week jostling for seeds in the Big Dance. Regular-season league titles are significant, but a chunk of the NCAA tourney's bids are granted to schools that win their conference tournaments, regardless of their performances throughout the regular season. So three weeks in March and April often minimize the significance of nearly three months of league play.
The conference season's limited value wanes with each expansion of the tournament field. If you don't have to finish at the top of your league to secure a berth, then how much does a conference championship really matter?
That's why Self's streak at Kansas can be both admired and suppressed. Still, 10 conference titles in a row is a ridiculous run. No. 11 would be crazy, too.
But it would also be expected.
That doesn't change its greatness, though.
Here Self is again. Leading the Jayhawks through this decade of dominance. It's the most marvelous feat in college basketball right now -- other than Mike Krzyzewski's 1,000-plus wins.
The latter mark is extraordinary and it's difficult to compare anything to it. Records involve numbers. Coach K's achievement has an aura.
In recent weeks, there have been conversations about who, if anyone, will ever catch Krzyzewski. Self would have to coach a long time to match Coach K. He has 551 career wins after Monday's victory over Iowa State. He could get to 1,000 simply by winning 30 games over the next 14 or 15 seasons.
That's how breathtaking Coach K's legacy has been for the past 30 years.
But if we're just talking about conference preeminence, no coach has equaled Self's mastery of a single league. Not even Coach K, whose best streak is five in a row.
That should take your breath away, too.
@jaybate-1.0 Ok Jaybate, no problem man.
@HighEliteMajor I was fooled the first 9 min of the game. It really looked like outside in to me cuz they had sets with 4out 1 in. I am still learning the multifacets of the game. It was great to watch though! I also noted in my post that the 16 turnovers didnt even register to me! 3 point shooting was killer and our drive and kickouts were making that happen. Great game. I dvrd it for future use
@jaybate-1.0 Ok. I see you referenced Phog Allen and Iba again now that I finally made it through your whole post ;) Did you put more thought into which influence Coach Self has taken from more? Or do you think he has taken from both equally?
I ask because coaching styles are a completely new train of thought for me.
@truehawk93 Even with KU doing so well in the conference and everybody on the team really finding their pace at the right time, I find it hard to believe that anyone will bounce early to the NBA. Of course anything is possible, but I just dont see it. Oubre IMO has the best shot at it right now out of everyone. He might also bail early cuz of the need to take care of his family like Ben did a couple years back. But everyone else, even Cliff, I just dont see it. Even if we make a deep run in the tourney this year. I also find it hard to believe that Coach Self will bring in more guys like Calipari did this season and have his bench overflowing. Thats not like him.
@jaybate-1.0 Dude, your philosophical quote about basketball " OFFENSE STARTS WITH DEFENSE.DEFENSE STARTS WITH OFFENSE.BASKETBALL IS THE MOST TIGHTLY CIRCULAR OF TEAM SPORTS.ITS CIRCULARITY IS ITS ELEGANCE."
I totally see that and it makes me think about the monologue Yoda had with Luke in Empire, about the force being around and apart of everything. Basketball IS the best sport. Shall we start calling you Jedi Master Jaybate?
@jaybate-1.0 You know what? When I looked at the box score I was surprised to learn that KU had 16 turnovers. It totally didnt even seem like it. Devonte' also could have asserted himself a bit better. Seemed like Self pulled him after two quick fouls.
@VailHawk I really believe that if KU finishes with a sweet 16 exit this year that most if not all of our guys return next season + Bragg and they get to the Final Four the NEXT season and possibly win it. Can they repeat a year or two later? I honestly dont know what our roster will look like so I have no clue.
@wissoxfan83 First, never give up on the Jayhawks. Your a KU fan, you should know better. But I have to take ownership of the fact I said that KU wasnt a sweet 16 team at one point. Now I believe a sweet 16 finish is very well within our grasp. And, I would be cool with that. I think thats respectable especially if KU wins the big 12 tourney on top of it.
Second, its outside in that is working so well for them right now, not inside out. ALthough I did see a couple sets played inside out during the ISU game, just to keep Freddy on his toes about what KU was going to run.
I just hope we can win the conference right now. Im not to worried about the big tourney yet.
Alright, just now watching the game on DVR. My take aways are thusly; Good defense early but not great defense. Kelly Oubre and Frank Mason are bringing it! So far KU seems to be getting back on defense and preventing the transition offense by ISu that killed us last time. 4 min into the game.
Mason picks up his man on the in bounds, in his jock the whole way.
both teams are 2-9 from the field right now, 15 min left.
KU is playing 4 out one in! KU is doing good at preventing transition points. But they cant score on the other end! Our guys are doing good at hitting the Defensive glass so far.
7 min into it.
Nice floater by Ellis brings it to 8-7 12 min left and Niang drains a 3 with Perry's hand in his face. Cliff goes beast mode and lays one in. That McKay dude is good, I dont like him.
ISU up by 6 at the 1020 min mark. Love that KU is still playing 4 out 1 in. KU has to step up the defensive effort. Still good but could be better.
Weave play by KU gets Ellis a jumper at 920, ISU answers. Greene is unconscious from trey, dude doesnt miss. Ellis drains one too, in transition! Nice going guys. 18-17. Clif was blocking out like a pro on that too.
Niang is keeping ISU on top at 8 min to go. KU runs a side out of bounds play for Brannen and he gets fouled on the shot. Nice play.
KU shooting almost 40% now, so is ISU. KU seems to be intensifying there Defense.
Brannen!
KU is still going hard on defense and preventing transition runs from ISU.
Nice unforced TO by ISU. 556 left.
Brannen get your hand up in the guys face when he shoots ok?
Nice drive by Devonte, KU by 3 with 44o left. Hogue answers.
then Oubre drains a 3 and KU runs back to prevent transition points once again. Good going fellas. KU is out for blood, they want the ball worse than ISU does right now. Oubre bam 3 pointer good! 3 min left. KU was seeming to run 5 out on that play! Traylor gets one to go with a lil shake n bake move. ISU answers. Time out KU.
I like KU's effort on both ends of the court so far.
KU runs the weave with 3 out 2 in. almost worked but not quite. 130 left Good D by KU gets a TO. and another TO gets Ellis a run out 2. Greene with a stolen pass! ISU's next one rims out and KU gets the last shot. Oubre misses a 3 to end the half. KU just beat ISU up the last 10 min. Beat them up. Half time -------------------------------------
Mason scores on a killer drive to open the 2nd half. Sherron like drive I might add.
Traylor picks up 3rd foul., bet he is gonna sit. Selden just tossed it to the wrong team, come on guys. We dont need traylor to be taking shots 15 ft from the basket either.
Ellis hit the ground hard! But he is ok. KU still playing 4 -1. Selden knocks down a trey off a screen. Perry saves Traylor from picking up his 4th foul by taking a charge. Way to go Perry!
KU's defense has sped ISU up...they arent making their shots and KU is.
44-32 KU 16 min left. Selden heating up. KU is still giving ISU some easy buckets but KU's over all Defense remains strong and Cliff denies ISU at the rim!
15 min left. Devonte tries to pick pocket and gets called for a reach in foul.
ISU is making a run though, KU couldnt switch quick enough on Defense to prevent ISU from getting an easy 2. 1330 left. Cliff picks up his 3rd foul and Traylor does too. Tells me those guys arent being quick enough on defensive rotations.
1230 left. 51-41 KU Selden drains another 3 with good perimeter passing.
KU is taking possessions off right now, they must be tired from all this running. ISU just out hustles KU for buckets and is down by 9.
Lucas is bringing some good hustle on both ends in his spot minutes. 1050 left.
Good D by KU forces Niang to travel and turn it over.
Selden is a beast from trey this game! Oubre made that happen with his drive and kick.9 min left.
8 min left, KU has 4 guys on that can drain 3s real good. Mason, Oubre, Selden, Ellis.
KU showing some good hustle. ISU just getting out classed right now. 720 left
For all Landen's short comings in the game. I like how he plays. Plus he gives us another big body down low.
Still 4 out one in for KU. Mason with the Sherron like drive again for 2. 6 min left
KU has done a great job of speeding up ISU's half court offense. Tough guys, just tough.
Collins, err Mason gets basically tackled at 530 left and the blind officials give the ball to ISU.
ISU now pressuring full court 515 left. Selden drains another 3! ISU comes back dunks it, and another. 4 min left
Mason gets fouled on a 3pt. ISU still trapping, trying to get back in it. MASON busts the trap defense all by himself. Sick., cant convert on the other end though.
Another press break by KU gives Ellis a dunk! KU is getting good at press breaking, trap breaking.
223 left. Perry at the line. drains them both. Hustle on Defense by KU, gets a steal and Selden for 2 in transition. Way to go guys.
130 left. KU up by 11. Niang seems hobbled a little bit. KU still fighting hard on defense.
Brannen doesnt miss from the free point line, doesnt miss from 3 either.
Niang is tired, misses the first free throw , makes the second. 1 min left.
Way to go KU!
Who said KU wasnt going to challenge for the conference title this year? One of those ESPN guys said it. He is wrong!
So, lets recap. KU took some plays off and ISU got some easy buckets but KU's offense was definitely > than ISU's offense this game. I was very impressed with Coach Self playing to this teams strengths and not just doggedly trying inside out. These guys can shoot and pass and it shows. They are getting better and have room to grow still. Defensively KU stopped ISU's transition runs and sped their half court up forcing TO's and missed shots.
Not all of our guys who saw the court played well but they didnt have to. Cliff and Jamari didnt have great games but everyone else did. ROCK CHALK, next.
@nuleafjhawk If KU wins # 11, that is approaching Coach Wooden type ish right there. Legendary.
ps. not trying to jinx it.
@JayHawkFanToo I did forget that some people on this site were saying Wigs would be just a journeyman. Id say that statement is pretty false right now. Barring any unforeseen circumstances Wigs will be an all star many times over.
@JayhawkRock78 Noooo, lol look closer, his left hand has the last 3 fingers up.
@JayHawkFanToo Nice! That was awesome!
@JayHawkFanToo KU can run and gun with ISU, especially in AFH. Plus, "we owe them one" Its revenge time.
@jaybate-1.0 Im a big fan of Sherron coming back to KU in some way shape or form. No pun intended. He seemed to look good the other night at the KSU game. I think he might still be trying to play ball somewhere? But if he wants to, I am sure Coach Self will let him come back to Lawrence.
Also a big fan of Danny coming back to Lawrence when Self retires.
@HighEliteMajor wink I bet everyone here including myself was thinking Coach just made HEM's day! It made my own day thats for sure.
You know, it is clear to us and apparently to Coach Self that KU is a trey gunning specialist team the likes of which he has never had. I mean we have 4 guys, FOUR with better than 40% from trey. Perry and Wayne are also shooting a respectable 37ish%.
SO, with that in mind. I begin to analyze Self's "not an inside out team" comment. Is it truth? Sure is.
Could it also be a subterfuge of some sort directed at ISU and Freddy? You betcha. He knows he only has a day and a half to prep for ISU coming to AFH. Many of you all on here with much better basketball knowledge and experience than I have, have alluded to the fact that Coach Self is a master strategian. ( is that the right word?)
Anyways, my point is now Freddy has to wonder to himself," Hey Mr Mayor, how will this next game play out, less than 36 hours before it happens? Will Coach go to his bread and butter inside out game to start off with? Will he put 5 shooters on the floor at one time? Will he use my game against me? Will he play outside in more than 2 min 30 seconds? I have prepped for this game for a few days and now I have to re think my strategy, again.
What The H#!! is going on here? Add to the fact that we have to spot them 5+ points just for playing in AFH because they are going to be super pissed from the last time we beat them.
How about if I just send the real Mayor of Iowa to coach this game and I stay behind to guard the city?
@drgnslayr Dude, when Weber had his mini melt down? Oh wow I thought that was so funny!
@truehawk93 HA!
@wrwlumpy HA! Great photo! Love how the bench is already celebrating BG's trey before he lets it fly! Awesome. And, now I see Sherron and Tyrel
@HighEliteMajor Did you hear Coach Self say "We are not an inside out team" in his post game interview? Gives me hope that they will play small quite a bit more against ISU tomorrow. However, we know Coach, and he is a stickler for consistency in his line ups. He will start his normal 5 guys. Should he? Probly not, but he will anyways.
One last question. Yesterday during the KSU game, did you or anyone see KU play a few half court sets of 4 out and Perry at the elbow, or almost being at the trey line? I thought I saw it and I wanted to see what everyone else thinks. One was a drive and score from Ellis and the other was a kick out to Wayne or Greene for an open 3.
@drgnslayr I am also more afraid of WVU. Although, it seems they are just as mercurial as KU is. Didnt they lose to Texas Tech or TCU? Anyways, KU plays them at AFH first and there is a pretty good chance our game with them at their house will decide the outcome of who will be the regular conference champ.
@approxinfinity Hey that was a good article, thanks for the link. Its a good feeling to see one of our KU boys rising up to be the next Paul Pierce, possibly.
It was my impression though, that Wigs played SG/SF, while Lebron plays SF/PF. Sooooo I guess they kind of play the same position but kind of not also. I mean it sounds like they took turns guarding each other. The highlights also show Lebron getting scored on by Wigs and vice versa. But truly, Wigs starts for Minnesota at the 2 guard spot and King James starts at SF.
Again, good article, I liked hearing Lebron and Kevin say such good things about Andrew. We all knew he would be an awesome player. RCJH!
@wrwlumpy Good stuff! Did you see that Sherron was at the game?
@DoubleDD Nah, I didnt think it was goal tending. looked to be out front to me. I said to myself," Mason! You need to dunk that S*** man!"
@bskeet Good win for our boys! 7-1 for the month in the conference. I had them coming out at 6-2. Solid effort! #Jayhawkdominance
@Kip_McSmithers IMPROV!