@Oldmanhawk whether by design or whatever, not a big fan of Wilson just hanging around the perimeter.
Marco
3146 posts
@jayballer67 ofcourse it was.
@jayballer67 I want him to average 25/15.
Nice shot!
Like @jayballer67 said, Dave could average 20 and 10 but still look bad.
@jayballer67 no question about it, I'll find something - he'll be lucky to start, let alone average 20/10. And with the makeup of this team, he'll more than make it easy for me and damn near everyone else to find something.
@justanotherfan said in More conversation about Dave feel free:
I don't think Big Dave costs this team games. I don't even have a problem with him as a player. He's a good player with a defined skill set that can be effective at the D1 level.
My issue is the way he fits with this team, and the way that Bill Self wants to use him.
Dave McCormack is not Udoka Azubuike. He is not Wayne Simien. He is not Markieff Morris. He is not Thomas Robinson. He is not Perry Ellis. He is probably most similar to Cole Aldrich, with less defensive acumen.
So let's think about Cole Aldrich. He was most successful on the 2008-09 team, which revolved primarily around him and Sherron Collins, with Collins averaging about 19 a game and Cole about 15. In his junior season, Aldrich's numbers fell back down to under 12 points a game. The big difference was that as a sophomore, Aldrich needed to be the focus inside because the freshman scorers (Taylor, Morris Twins) were not ready to step forward just yet, so Aldrich was a focal point. The team had very little wing scoring (Reed and Morningstar averaged under 7 ppg).
That is not this team. Two of the best players on this team are wing scorers (Braun, Agbaji). The best players are slashing guards (add Martin, Yesufu, Harris to the prior list). McCormack is not the second best player on this team. He's probably the 5th best behind Agbaji, Martin, Braun, and Wilson.
This team was also built to run. Every guy in the rotation except McCormack and Lightfoot is a guy that is better in an uptempo transition game. That doesn't fit McCormack's style as well.
So we have a guy that is talented. I just compared him to a player that was an NBA lottery pick. But we have a team that doesn't fit his style, and in fact goes against his style.
So Dave is in a bit of a bind. He's a fish out of water trying to run with thoroughbreds. He can still be effective, but he's a guy that really can't play with Harris because Dave needs to be on the floor with other shooters, so if Harris plays a lot (and he has so far) Dave has to play less. He isn't a great post up guy, so he needs to be out away from the basket screening, but that goes against Self's tendency to run almost exclusively PnR with a four out set.
Dave can be effective. We just have to find a fit for his skills within the construct of the rest of the team.
I concur. Would only add that Wilson has been back for three games and has played for one season. Dave is in his 4th year of inconsistency.
@approxinfinity said in Post Tournament Thoughts:
@Marco especially when the other team is young and in shambles. Something to rally around.
I am not saying no.... Yeah, it rallied their team, really did. They won the tournament. When they make the NCAA's I hope that they atleast acknowledge CB lol.
I thought when it happened, "damn Christian, What are you doing!?" Then thought 'oh well, we're good.' But we weren't.
Standing by my previous analysis though, Dave was just horrible.
P.S. - Anthony Grant can coach.
@mayjay said in Non-KU Games:
@BeddieKU23 said in Non-KU Games:
They scored 10 in the first half, 19 in the 2nd.
Best spin for their coach going forward: Hey, we almost tripled our score in the second half!
You got it!
@nwhawkfan said in Non-KU Games:
@FarmerJayhawk said in Non-KU Games:
Lol ASU lost to Wazzu 51-29 in what I first thought was a makeup football game
Wonder what Remy's thinking 'bout that
This is a joke, right? 29 points? If so, goodbye Bobby very soon.
@approxinfinity I'm not a big fan of grandstanding and or taunting, usually counter-productive.
@jayballer67 that's what I said, for real. He hustles more with decreased minutes, has his head in the game.
Like I said before, 13 to 14 mpg. Perfect. Decrease his playing time and he'll produce, otherwise?
@wissox said in Pastries for Thought:
@wissox Looked into it and realized it's now called the Jayhawk Club.
Really? Cool.
Hell, an argument could be made - and he played great! - that CB cost us the game when he flushed it, then taunted drawing the T. We were up by 15, then came the free throws and possession and they just chipped away. It changed the flow of the entire game, no doubt.
@jayballer67 lol okay, maybe a bit much. My point being, he is soft. Wilson and Braun and Och would rebound. Even Yesufu and Clemence and Adams, Mitch too, and they wouldn't miss chippies while being able to pass the ball and run.
@jayballer67 that's what he did. Just bailed in the middle of the night, ditched the program and sent all his players a forwarded text.
@jayballer67 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Marco said in Coaching Carousel:
@jayballer67 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Marco said in Coaching Carousel:
@BeddieKU23 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Kcmatt7 said in Coaching Carousel:
@FarmerJayhawk makes too much sense right? Lots of Urban Meyer talk but I don't see it.
Can't see Urban being a hit with the ND folks, bad fit especially in light of his off-the-field issues. Seems like its Freeman & Fickell
Has Venables been hired as the OU coach? All that I've heard is Stoops as interim. Cincinnati had better step up to the plate, or they're going to lose their coach. Can they compete moneywise with Notre Dame? Not a chance. But they can make it easier for him to stay. He's built a program, and going to the Big12 can only help in recruiting.
Nobody has been hirred just yt. I posted yesterday that Veneables had verbally agreed to be OU'S next Coach.- - - NOT TRUE , not yet anyways , got the information from a fake Bleacher report.. His name is being thrown out along with Kingsbury and some others but no one yet. - The fans want a quick selection because of them losing r ecruits - nothing yet
Do you blame the fans? Lol. Not a good look for Riley imo, not even coaching his team in whatever bowl game and even taking Grinch and looting their recruits. I'd be extremely pissed if were an OU alum and or bigtime OU fan.
When Roy left the program he did it with class. He didn't poach the players that he had recruited to play at KU.
True , what I read & heard Riley and staff that went with him kinda did like the NFL team did that packed up in the middle of the night and kicked rocks snuck off kinda slithered. - A lot think Williams is going to the portal also - -No Rattler , No Williams - -No 5 * 2023 QB - I love it lol , - the bank is open - -the flood gates WIDE OPEN
That they are. Bad look for Riley. Sent his players a text... Wouldn't want that to happen at KU.
@jayballer67 said in Post Tournament Thoughts:
@Marco said in Post Tournament Thoughts:
Post tournament thoughts? We're not horrible, we just expect perfection because we've been spoiled. I mean, look at our coaching tree and the coaches that our program has spun out, my god.... That being said, here goes.
Dave doesn't fit with the players on this team. He is mechanical, not fluid and slows them down. He cost us the Dayton game.
Ochai is a star and MVP of our team. Love me some Och, glad he came back.
Braun is a player. Been a Christian fan from the get go, he just knows the game and knows how to play. When we need a play whatever the type might be, he's always there it seems.
Remy needs to play, period.
Wilson is struggle city, so far. All due to him sitting out four games? We shall see.
Bench - Clemence and Adams deserve to have some playing time, ditto Yesufu and JCL. Harris isn't impressive thus far and I like him as a player, but the makeup of our team isn't the same as last.
Mitch has had some good moments and Pettiford.
Now, break out the firing squad, but as I see it Dave's minutes need to drastically decrease, Harris' too as well as those of Wilson.
I would not start Dave. For now, I'd go with Wilson, Braun, Agbaji, Remy and Yesufu. Bench - Clemence and Adams, JCL, Mitch and Pettiford. Dave mixed in here and there, if and or when needed.
Man just seems you got a hard on for Dave. - -To save he cost us the Dayton game is probably the furtherst thing from being right that can be. THE WHOLE FRICKEN TEAM COST US THE DAYTON GAME not just McCormack. Very True Dave is off to a slow start agree , BUT WISLON right now holy crap he is crap at this point - -exactly what the hell has he done? - - go ahead I'll wait. - - Ya I'll agree wo know's Dave might do better coming off the Bench for now , BUT inserting Wilson at the 5 which has been tossed about - - is not the answer - I'm not sure what it is - - -Zach is pretty Mobile can stretch but on the defensive side he is at this point a huge liability - -maybe we play KJ he is athletic but his offensive skills right now are zelch, might be able to cover and others score let him rebound - I dunno , think ya need to back off Dave a bit. We have many many other problems then just Dave at this point
That's just my opinion. I don't think that Dave's abilities match the skilksets and makeup of our team. I think in many ways he hurts the team when he is in the lineup. It is not the same team as last year. You cannot ask four players to change the way that they play to benefit one player while at the same time hurting the team. If Dave had played much against Iona we probably would have lost.
I don't have a hard on for Dave, his tits aren't near big enough.
@jayballer67 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Marco said in Coaching Carousel:
@BeddieKU23 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Kcmatt7 said in Coaching Carousel:
@FarmerJayhawk makes too much sense right? Lots of Urban Meyer talk but I don't see it.
Can't see Urban being a hit with the ND folks, bad fit especially in light of his off-the-field issues. Seems like its Freeman & Fickell
Has Venables been hired as the OU coach? All that I've heard is Stoops as interim. Cincinnati had better step up to the plate, or they're going to lose their coach. Can they compete moneywise with Notre Dame? Not a chance. But they can make it easier for him to stay. He's built a program, and going to the Big12 can only help in recruiting.
Nobody has been hirred just yt. I posted yesterday that Veneables had verbally agreed to be OU'S next Coach.- - - NOT TRUE , not yet anyways , got the information from a fake Bleacher report.. His name is being thrown out along with Kingsbury and some others but no one yet. - The fans want a quick selection because of them losing r ecruits - nothing yet
Do you blame the fans? Lol. Not a good look for Riley imo, not even coaching his team in whatever bowl game and even taking Grinch and looting their recruits. I'd be extremely pissed if were an OU alum and or bigtime OU fan.
When Roy left the program he did it with class. He didn't poach the players that he had recruited to play at KU.
Post tournament thoughts? We're not horrible, we just expect perfection because we've been spoiled. I mean, look at our coaching tree and the coaches that we have spun out - Adolf Rupp, Dean Smith, even Coach Self who was a grad assistant under Larry Brown.... That being said, here goes.
Dave doesn't fit with the players on this team. He is mechanical, not fluid and slows them down. He cost us the Dayton game.
Ochai is a star and MVP of our team. Love me some Och, glad he came back.
Braun is a player. Been a Christian fan from the get go, he just knows the game and knows how to play. When we need a play whatever the type might be, he's always there it seems.
Remy needs to play, period.
Wilson is struggle city, so far. All due to him sitting out four games? We shall see.
Bench - Clemence and Adams deserve to have some playing time, ditto Yesufu and JCL. Harris isn't impressive thus far and I like him as a player, but the makeup of our team isn't the same as last.
Mitch has had some good moments and Pettiford.
Now, break out the firing squad, but as I see it Dave's minutes need to drastically decrease, Harris' too as well as those of Wilson.
I would not start Dave. For now, I'd go with Wilson, Braun, Agbaji, Remy and Yesufu. Bench - Clemence and Adams, JCL, Mitch and Pettiford. Dave mixed in here and there, if and or when needed.
@BeddieKU23 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Kcmatt7 said in Coaching Carousel:
@FarmerJayhawk makes too much sense right? Lots of Urban Meyer talk but I don't see it.
Can't see Urban being a hit with the ND folks, bad fit especially in light of his off-the-field issues. Seems like its Freeman & Fickell
Has Venables been hired as the OU coach? All that I've heard is Stoops as interim. Cincinnati had better step up to the plate, or they're going to lose their coach. Can they compete moneywise with Notre Dame? Not a chance. But they can make it easier for him to stay. He's built a program, and going to the Big12 can only help in recruiting.
Clemence, Adams and Yesufu will all see increased minutes. Newsflash 😂 - Coach is not all that happy with Dave, having Agbaji go opening tip? I loved the move, but that's how disgusted coach is with Dave.
@nwhawkfan like us, they have major chinks in their armor. They are not a Final Four team imo.
Venables to OU is a homerun, all things considered. Oh well, to the SEC they soon go. Major coaching moves. Riley was a surprise, but Kelly even more.
Brian Kelly to LSU.
@FarmerJayhawk I think Yesufu should too. If he gets more time, he'll be able to knock down some 3s.
No doubt, Yesufu and Clemence need to see the court more.
@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Coaching Carousel:
@Texas-Hawk-10 said in Coaching Carousel:
@jayballer67 said in Coaching Carousel:
So Ok , guessing maybe I'm more Naive then what I thought. I just don't see why the move Anywhere. I mean he is already at a top notch program , awesome facilities, always top recruits , very winning program, probably gets anything he asks for - -don't see a step up improvement for sure - -to USC? - -not a better program at the very best lateral move great fan base - -I just can't see the advantage - -why? - - -I'm sure he makes a butt load of money from his Base Salary and then all the endorsements - -tell me how does USC be a better position then Oklahoma - the league he is moving to by far is no better - I 'll wait go ahead fill me in
The path to a playoff at USC and the P12 is much easier than the SEC, even if the playoffs expand. In the new SEC, Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Auburn, LSU, Florida, Texas, and Texas A&M are all teams that are or will consistently be threats to win the SEC. In the PAC 12, it's usually Oregon or Utah that's the biggest hurdle.
Also, recruiting to USC with the right coach can land a top 5 class every season because SoCal is one of the 3 most fertile recruiting areas after Texas and Florida.
Right both of you. It looks kind of soft, like he doesn't want to get beat in the SEC. It is USC,,, but the same can be said about Oklahoma. With the recruiting in Cali though, he's going to absolutely dominate the Pac12. Almost guaranteed to be playoff bound every year. It just smells like a soft move. Not even coaching his team in whatever bowl game!
@benshawks08 said in Dayton Game Thread:
@approxinfinity To be clear I agree the game should have never been that close. And the first fifteen minutes of the first half (and really the last 5-10 of the first) are much more significant. But many games are going to come down to crunch time and if Dave is the go to guy at the end of the game I’m just not sure what we are even doing.
I'm not sure that Dave even needs to be on the court at the end of games.
@approxinfinity Oh yeah, thin in the front courtcourt this year. If Dave keeps playing this bad we might see Martin before next season.
@rockchalkjayhawk Braun, Ochai and Remy
@rockchalkjayhawk like @BShark said, two of three players need to be on the floor for us at all times. I want Braun to play 40 mpg! Lol
@tis4tim said in Dayton Game Thread:
@KirkIsMyHinrich said in Dayton Game Thread:
As frustrated as everyone is right now, remember that these guys are college kids and no one is perfect.
I hear what you're saying, but we didn't have to be perfect. 9-21 from FT and 4-19 from 3-point line is not going to win you many games.
You're right. All that we needed was to play those who deserved to play period, and we would have won.
@approxinfinity said in Dayton Game Thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 I don’t think anyone was hoping Remy would play 25 min or that he and ochai would come out at the same time
@approxinfinity thank you. @Texas-Hawk-10 question. Do you think that Dave meshes well with the players and skillsets that we have on this team? Hell, unless it be a plodding, undeep and unathletic one would he mesh well with any team? The team that we have this year is not the same as last.
@BShark we shouldn't be forcing it inside period, let alone start Dave. He is not a match with the players and skillsets that we have.
@Kubie play our walk-on guard Teahan over him at this point, whoever.
Is Dave what any of us wanted? We were up by 15 and whooping ass, then Dave came in and stayed, killing the game flow.
@FarSideHawk said in Dayton Game Thread:
@BeddieKU23 absolutely. I’m afraid this will continue through the season. Self will continue to pound the ball inside knowing Dave is no Embiid or Udoka. He has such a fast athletic perimeter oriented team but he refuses to adjust. Crunch time, let’s throw it to Dave instead of Ochai or Remy driving it. His stubbornness may cost us again this year. Frustrating!
To the detriment of our team.
Dave cannot start.
@approxinfinity said in Dayton Game Thread:
@Texas-Hawk-10 he can put the right guys on the floor.
You got it. Bad substitutions, not sitting Dave and Wilson. Wilson hasn't played, but what is Dave's excuse (again)? Harris needed to be yanked too, give Yesufu a little pt. Clemence? Adams?
Once he came in and got big minutes, it was alk over.
I blame the loss - and I'll stand by it - on Dave. He just kills our offense.
Wiw. Just when Dave had a chance to be an asset... But that's Dave. Bad things - I am not joking around - happen when he is anywhere near the ball.
Fuck!
D!
@BShark he walked. If not a foul.
Enough of Dave. Period.
And he walks!