"There is no way Oklahoma fires Scott Brooks; he is one the better younger coaches in the NBA and has done a great job with the Thunder."
I totally agree! Brooks is solid and has a bright future in the league. He is also becoming a "known entity" whereas Self is a completely "unknown entity" in the NBA. There is no evidence that he can translate his philosophy and be successful in the league.
Solid post!
I agree with it all, and especially:
"With an open mind, all things are possible."
Basketball does not stand still. Strategies have to mold to the times and situations. Forcing the wrong strategy on a team because it worked in the past is not the best way to coach.
The rules change (or how they are enforced). Players change (7-footer who can handle the ball and pump the trey). Perceptions, ambitions and dreams of young players change (molded mostly by NBA players who constantly show something different).
The game of basketball is more like a fast-moving stream than a still lake.
Coaches have to stay hungry. That means they have to continue to develop just like the players they coach. The very best strategies eventually become stagnant because with time and repetition, the competition figures out the best way to defend or attack it. And every team is unique and strategy has to fit their uniqueness so they can become most effective.
I have to admit that I don't always see this philosophy practiced at KU. Sometimes it feels like there isn't enough bending... adapting to what will better serve the team. And sometimes we get predictable. And sometimes we don't adjust quickly when something isn't working. I've never felt we take advantage of our depth (when we have it). And because of that, depth can be a curse. Our last time to the championship game was with a team where we did not have our best depth, so we played less guys and they developed more of a rhythm together. If we are going to recruit all the depth, we have to use it wisely, invest in enough development so those players are useful (especially in March), and execute a game plan that takes advantage of all the energy available from having an abundance of capable players. When we don't do that, giving all our depth PT becomes a waste and takes away from our key core that could develop more harmony by having more PT together... especially with a young team (like we had this year).
Just look at AW3 this year. Every minute of PT he got only took away from developing more with other players, because down the stretch (March) he was too rusty to use in key situations. We lost too much ground if we substituted AW3 for a hobbled Selden. Therefore, AW3's net impact for the year was negative. Only because he didn't get enough PT to keep the rust off so we could use him down the stretch. I found that to be a major strategical blunder by our coaches. We could have really used a healthy, rust-free AW3 (and his experience) in March this year to take the heat off of Selden and his injured body. Selden did not produce for us in March, but that wasn't really his fault. He was hobbled and a rookie. We were stuck because we didn't have another 2 with size to defend. A rusty AW3 couldn't get the job done.
I believe we did AW3 a real disservice this year. He worked his butt off probably more than anyone else in the off-season. He hustled in fall camp. And he was rewarded with nothing. Like I said above, if he had an impact it was negative, because he didn't produce anything because his PT wasn't enough to develop anything and then what few minutes of PT he got only took away from Selden where he could develop further with more time. AW3 got the raw deal this year. Even Selden got a raw deal, too, because he was forced to play through his injury.
" but don't think he'll do that stuff in D1 B12 bball."
He'll do it. He'll do it because he can handle the ball... Executing in D1 is about adjusting to the speed and being able to take the rock with you at a quicker speed. That's something players like Wiggins couldn't do.
This kid can do it, and he will!
"One of the biggest problems we had this year (and last for that matter) was that the team was too quiet. Na doesn't take control and huddle the guys up (heck, Selden was yelling at him by the end of the season), Perry's quiet (and not a great teammate in a lot of ways *), Wigs was quiet, Joel's English can be difficult to understand... With our incoming crop, though, I'm expecting that to change. Big Cliff and Oubre have intensity to match Selden's, and I think that can draw something out of Mason. Graham also fits into that scheme nicely."
That's the best perspective I've read on this! And it makes the ultimate argument for why Graham is important.
I can't stress this enough. We simply have to have Myles Turner.
We need Myles to fill a hole in the middle of our game. We need a shot blocker to make up for all the poor perimeter defense we play.
And we need to continue to be "Big Man U" more than ever. Myles gives us the continuation as the school with the big man rep.
That right there says enough about how desperate we need Myles Turner.
But it goes way beyond those needs. We need Myles to be the big man that transforms Bill Self's coaching philosophy. Because the future of basketball is almost here (2 more years) and the winner of the biggest prize will have to prove themselves. And the proof will be about handling the most-talented big man of all times. Yes, I said that. Wilt Chamberlain's status on top of the clouds may finally be reached by the next great phenom.
Before going further, imagine what is possible because what I am about to share with you has never been done before. You are about to meet a 7-foot player that is more capable of running point that owning the post. Actually, he is quite capable of doing both.
The good news is that Bill Self has him circled and targeted on his radar screen. But then, so does Kentucky, Duke, Arizona and literally every D1 basketball school in America.
This new phenom, who may not threaten Chamberlain in the record book, will make a statement of what big men of the future can do. He is a sophomore in high school and already possesses far more skills than Chamberlain ever had as a pro. He matches everything Chamberlain had except strength. Just give him time to grow into his 7-foot body and to adapt to modern strength training. He'll get there.
Now we can best understand why Myles Turner is so important to Kansas basketball. Myles isn't the typical 7-footer himself, and tends to like the outside game similar to the player he admires most, Kevin Durant. So we can't guarantee he'll wear a Kansas uniform based on Self's hi/lo offense. Self's offense is the perfect offense for a post player who likes to stay in the post. Myles wants to work in the post, but he is definitely an "out of the box" type player. Instead of practicing heavy body battles in the post, he would rather work on his pick-and-pop. If Self wants to stand a chance at landing him, he will have to convince Myles that he has the best strategy for using Myle's skills, both in the post and out on the perimeter. This will be a test for Self. And if he can land Myles, he gets to prove that he can coach post players beyond the hi/lo perspective. In fact, perhaps Self's best recruiting tool would be to visit with Myles and show him this new phenom and let Myles now that he will invest whatever is necessary for Myles to develop a game of the future... the game matching this high school sophomore.
The future arrives in two years. Here is a glimpse of what we can expect:
Bravo.... at least we beat Haskell twice that year!
We went 3-4 in 1900. Naismith was a better innovator than coach.
Oh man... you shouldn't mention a song stuck in your head. Every time I hear that it triggers, "Dude looks like a lady" by Aerosmith. What is it about that song? If the CIA ever figures it out they will stop waterboarding and just play that song 24/7 until they talk. They don't even have to know English for it to work.
I can't believe Myles would consider UK. He would make it (potentially) their 3rd or 4th 7-footer. Unless he can suddenly develop guard skills.
Great philosophy... keeping looking forward and there is no time to look back and be disappointed!
I'm going to keep that one... Thanks!
I think I have to go back to 1957 and our triple-overtime loss in the championship game to North Carolina, 54 - 53. This was a match up of the AP #1 versus the AP #2. We had that game won and blew it in the last 2 minutes of regulation. Couldn't buy a FT, and it was a missed FT in the 3rd OT that opened the door for UNC to nail two FTs and win the game.
Chamberlain went for 23 points and 14 rebounds. Curious how many blocked shots he had, but they didn't keep that statistic. Maybe 10?
The win for UNC sealed a perfect season, 32-0.
I think if I could go back and change one score, this one would be it.
I got that...
I was just venting my rant on several things and thought if I targeted it to you then at least one person will read it and maybe comment!
Okay. I'm guilty. My clinical diagnosis is JOCD (Jayhawk Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder).
I grew up a JOCK... and I transformed into a JOCD!
On this bright, sunny, beautiful spring day, I should be outside, fondling cherry blossoms. But instead, I'm in my dark, gloomy inside office, hacking away on a computer screen, same as I did a few months ago when we were interior-bound due to arctic cold and ice.
I can't seem to wash this season off my hands enough. I keep washing and washing, but I'm not getting clean from it!
I feel like I can let this out to all of you... since I'm guessing many of you fall into the same category as me. Let's just call this thread "therapy."
I've been looking back at our recent loss... and then the reactions we had in here. Some of us were downright brutal, making almost everyone associated with this team a target. Self... of course it was his fault! Tharpe... boot his rear off the team! Ellis... can't hold his own when it counts! Wiggins... didn't care because Lawrence was just a rest stop on the way to the league! Embiid... was he really hurt so bad he couldn't play?!
I wonder if there is a relationship between having JOCD and axe-grinding after a sour March Madness?
This year's sour ending can not compare to some of our past sour endings. But I think I had more rotten fruit to throw than in previous years. Why is that? Could it be that I fell deeper into the pit of JOCD'ingdom?!
I am starting to come back as a human again. Gardening is my therapy out from a bad March. It is working. Watching my little buddies grow into monstrous veggie producers is quite something to experience. They count on me to help them grow to maturity.
I know my plants are all about having healthy roots. So what is at the root of my anger after we flubbed up against Stanford?
I thought about this in depth yesterday, as I watered my eggplants. And I asked them for guidance, and strangely enough, they gave me some answers.
The more I get involved with Jayhawk basketball, the more I have invested... body, mind and soul. So I expect everyone associated with Jayhawk basketball to at least have as much of a level of commitment as I have. That doesn't seem too much to ask, especially since I'm not drawing a fat check or getting my room/board/education paid for by the university. I'm not out there executing on behalf of the university (although I wear university gear out in public all the time.. so maybe I am).
I'm pretty sure the problem exists in perception. I see things on the tube, or read things online, and then I judge if the accused is being committed enough to Jayhawk basketball. I feel like if it was I who wore the Kansas jersey on the court, I'd spend every breathing second practicing FTs and studying videotape of my next opponent. Yes... that would be me. At least... that would be me TODAY! Because TODAY I am an old man who if I suddenly was wearing that jersey on the court, would only get there through some act from God. My eligibility is all used up and my knees wouldn't hold up one time at full speed. My skills would do more to help our opponents than add to a Jayhawk victory. So, naturally, an honor of representing my alma mater TODAY would keep me motivated to work 24/7 on doing the best job I can. Us old timers know what "working around the clock" is all about.
So I get all bent out of shape because I don't feel like everyone connected to Jayhawk basketball is matching my level of commitment. But am I being realistic? No. No, I'm not!
First, let's discuss the players. 18, 19 and 20 year-olds are not famously known for working around the clock. And why should they be? This isn't the days of slavery in our country. One thing that makes America great is our ability to work and then be rewarded with leisure time. Why should it be different for these kids? And I remember being that age.... I didn't work around the clock.
Second... what about our coaches? They are adults. Why aren't they working around the clock? Well... I'm pretty sure they put in more than a 40-hour work week. When Bill Self says that he has the best job in America, do you think he is saying that because he never stops working? Do you think he worked so hard to get to the top only so he could work 24/7? Still, I'm betting he puts in a truckload of hours.
It is my theory that the people in here that complained the most about the Stanford game also has committed the most to KU basketball. It seems to be what happened to me. If I hadn't posted 1,350 times (just on this site) over the past season, chances are I would have let it go much sooner after the loss.
Take my advice, all you JOCD fans... eggplants never lie!
i understand... but they are playing in the "Me Me Me" league. Giving a guy a break because you played at the same university classifies you as a sucker.
Just part of the reason most people don't give a flying fudge about these games which have the best players in the world.
Who cares what team wins it all? It's just big business fighting it out for bragging rights and extra money.
If you want to discuss this further, you can come find me. I'm sitting at the great ball court at Chichen Itza... imagining a real sport. Let's face it... it isn't a real sport unless you can die playing it. When the NBA changes the rules so the losing team in the finals gets sacrificed to the sun Gods... then.. then... I'll start paying closer attention!
"Playing in Finland? And here I thought he was, upon graduation, on the cusp of an NBA career. Glue is really valuable in the League, don't ya know ...."
The only thing that counts in the league is offense. If a guy can shoot, he's got a chance of making a team.
Offense glosses over the entire league.
And there are players that can flat out score on anyone. "Lock down" in the league? More like "lock up" in the infirmary for mental evaluation... because that's what people think of players who put more energy into their defense than their offense.
That is why I have a problem with Kentucky packed with Top 10 talent.
The focus on the game is away from fundamentals that made it great and are focused on brute forcing victories. Giving up on one side of the ball or on team play or fundamentals and just going with super star athletes who can score on anyone.
I think the best basketball today is at the junior high level. Guys aren't good enough to dictate offense, so they are forced to play team ball and work hard on defense. And if someone does try to go Jordan then they get called out for being a ball hog. My kind of ball.
Once the boys start sprouting hair in patchy spots all over their bodies... the focus goes towards all out aggression. Then they want to look good (especially on the stat sheet) so they can also score with the ladies.
Brute force offense. Everyone clear the hell out and let "Big Boy Barrel Hughes" take it to the hole!
Yippee keye yeah...
And it all gets dictated by the all-mighty dollar. Fans just want to see high-flying dunks and parking lot treys. It's like watching the Harlem Globetrotters but no one is wearing those fancy red, white and blue uniforms.
*We need to change our uniforms next year. We've had blue and we've had red, and there is always some white. Why can't we do red, white and blue? Let's call ourselves "America's team" and do a version of Globetrotter uniforms. We already do the weave (that we stole from them). Gosh... wouldn't that piss off Kentucky! "America's team!"
That's my rant for the day. Just came in from an evening in the garden. I get lots of thinking done out there... usually between the kale and eggplants.
"I don't understand the sudden disgust with OADS or with freshman getting so much playing time--as if this were something new. As far back as 1994-95, Raef LaFrentz averaged 23.6 mpg. Later averages were: Paul Pierce--25.4 mpg; Kirk Hinrich --21.3; Nick Collison--22.8; Drew Gooden--20.8; Brandon Rush--31.7; Mario Chalmers--26.3; Sherron Collins--22.3. There were other freshmen who had substantial playing time who I have forgotten or not mentioned.
Neither Coach Williams nor Coach Self refused to play freshmen because they were looking at a "big picture." They were not playing because neither coach felt they contribute enough at that time to help win more games.
I don't recall so many complaints about the way those freshmen were used. But now that a season in which some expected better results in the tournament came to a disappointing close--there are a number who jump on the bandwagon and essentially declare it to be a problem with the way Self is using freshmen. Just doesn't make sense."
Right on the mark!
And how many of those guys you listed average the stats Wiggins did this year?
"Depth is like insurance, you hope you never have to use it but it is comforting to know that if you ever need it...it is there."
However... you can't just think you have depth available when you need it if you don't nurture it. We saw that in AW3. He couldn't be counted on in this past March because he was as rusty as an old sea anchor.
I'm anxious to see where Texas football goes. I never understood how Mack held that job for so long.
Just reaching for straws... but there is more inner-state chatter in Texas than in Kansas.
I thought the story was funny, and worth earmarking... especially if Baylor sticks it to Texas again.
I think Self takes a gigantic risk dedicating the PG spot to Tharpe next year. He can't risk Tharpe collapsing like EJ did in March, 2013. It isn't easy for me to repeat that sentence because I still have a high level of respect for EJ and I don't mean to demean him in any way.
But too many people see this coming year as a possible repeat of 2013. Lots of hopes and dreams shattered by a loss that shouldn't have happened because we couldn't execute from the PG position.
I think Self's recent action to jump all over Devonte says plenty about his feeling of desperation at the PG position next year. That doesn't mean I think anything less of Conner or Frank. But if Self thought we were set at PG, why is he going so hard after Devonte?
I believe he is trying to recruit for next year (and beyond) to go from having a good year (next year) to having a great year!
BTW: anyone watching the nest over there in Lexington? Cal may have quite a class returning. Appears he may not have all the early exits. Read somewhere they could end up with 3 7-footers. Good chance they will be bigger than any NBA team.
Funny.. for me it is easier outlining bogus bball strategies than to write something witty.
We can use more wit in here. I've got the dimwit area covered!
Lame on, my friend!
Total gut-buster! Great job, wissox!
Hope you continue posting humor... maybe consider putting this into a regular format under a catchy heading.
"Wissox Lite"
It is all your fault that I will now continue to follow Badger ball!
Hope they can make it back to the FF next year!
@truehawk93 , @HighEliteMajor , @JayHawkFanToo ...
Thanks for addressing my post.
My gut is on Self trying to sign both of these guys.. and if that be the case, someone is transferring or going off scholarship. If it comes down to that... I don't see us losing Greene. I thought Self put quite a bit of public words out there on how he sees a bright future for Greene. Almost felt like he was making sure Greene got the message, that PT would be in his future at KU.
My guess is if we land both of these guys, we will be listed in the Top 5 next fall. I hope not... but with the hype building around Myles recently, and after doing the math, it will be hard to keep the spotlight from shining (early) on Lawrence.
So Self dressed up as the Easter bunny on Sunday, with assistant bunny, Norm Roberts, and visited Myles. Meanwhile... who was visiting with Devonte in Lawrence? I'm guessing Snacks was around.
In theory, we have one slot to fill. But who in here thinks we are heavily recruiting two players to fill one spot?
This isn't an either/or situation.
Hard to imagine where this puts us in a pre-season ranking if we land both? I hope not too high... that always stymies growth with all the added attention.
Here is yet another reason Myles Turner should consider playing basketball in another State:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2014/04/19/texas-lb-edmond-calls-baylor-trash/7918453/ ↗
... so he can focus on basketball and get away from all the negative chaos.
Oklahoma is still too close... it is more like the needed buffer zone away from all the negative chatter.
Happy Easter to all!
This is the best thing going on anywhere, and you guys all make it happen!
My hats off to the entire Jayhawk Nation, and especially the crew in here!
BTW: Who says Self can't run a full-court press? He's running one now, today, in Texas!
Sorry... my post was vague. I didn't mean universities would be paying athletes (more).
I'm talking about all the people @jaybate is talking about... from shoe contracts to whatever. The student-athlete could still be deemed an "amateur" under preset guidelines.
I like that idea. There are plenty of big corps and basketball entities that would like to pay these players, so why can't they accept and still be a college athlete? Set the money away in a trust... and maybe let bits of it be used while in school (and bits to family members).
I don't like the situation BMac was in... where he should have come back for another year but the financial pressure to help his family was just too much to keep him in school.
The goal is not only to have these guys develop more of their game in college, and help college basketball lift to higher levels... it is also to keep these guys in school longer. The longer they stay in school, the better chance they have of finishing.
I think it is tragic when any of these kids don't finish school, regardless of the millions they rush off to earn.
@jaybate 1.0
"Just kidding around, Commish."
Be careful. Look outside your window. See that white van parked across the street?
But seriously... you raise good points about these kids delaying payments for another year.
What I think stinks is the NBA's snubbing attitude against euro ball. There should be a mechanism in place to better bring players from abroad into the NBA draft. So for adventurous kids that don't feel like going 1 or 2 years without pay they can go abroad and make good money while they wait to turn 19 or 20 and do it without killing their draft potential.
That would be good for the game. Broaden it out again. It is a game that can be widely accepted the world over... There could be other markets developed beyond honey-hole America.
Imagine that... HS players getting approached by both college coaches and euro pro teams.
There just isn't anything else in this country that matches this level of crime on a labor force. Even fruit pickers were recently given the decency from legislation forcing management to put porta-pots out in the fields. Of course, it was done not to legislate decency, it was done to protect the food supply from bacteria. And now, after Shabazz let the world know how often he went to bed hungry... the all-mighty Emmert waved his hand and increased the food allotment for student-athletes. He doesn't want them to starve (and under-perform) while big business lavishes in the financial awards.
Many are now pushing for the "Olympic rule." And if that passes... I'm not sure, but it seems like college athletes could negotiate paid contracts and either have that money stored away untouchable in a trust until leaving school... or maybe just borrow a predetermined amount against potential future earnings.
I'm staying glued to Northwestern football... will they decide to unionize?
Pity it has to come down to this. We (fans) will take a big hit from all this, you can count on that.
@HighEliteMajor - Your words of wisdom are finally making it up the long vine of basketball's social network... all the way up to the new NBA commissioner, Adam Silver.
Silver, and the entire league, doesn't seem to like the OAD rule. One of Silver's main priorities is to raise the entry age of players from 19 to 20. That may not be a gigantic leap forward in progress, but eliminating OADs in exchange for TADs (Two-And-Dones) is somewhat monumental (when you consider how much players improve between their freshman and sophomore years).
So now that we've recently all brushed up on our conversation concerning OADs (thanks to @HighEliteMajor 's enlightening thread)... let's move into what may come as soon as 2016... the TAD rule!
How do we feel about TADs and the potential rule change that will end the OAD in favor of a TAD?
"I'm not calling Traylor the next TRob just yet...as I dont know if he is a double/double guy yet (I'm projecting 10 & 8..)...but if that EKY game was any glimpse, his development needs to continue. Traylor was big against Duke. Hardly gets stripped on his dribble-drives. Enough about Traylor, still has work to do."
I've got the proverbial man-crush on Bam-Bam. When he arrived at Kansas he couldn't do anything on the court except look menacing. Now he is starting to match the look.
What if he improves as much over this summer as he did last summer? I believe he is going to be working on his perimeter game quite a bit this summer, too.
Lucas is here for the long haul, and he'll continue to improve and build strength. He needs muscle for the type of post skill he is trying to execute. He'll get there...
I believe Alexander may end up being Self's best ever 4. Especially if he hangs at least 2 years.
Self loves this time of year.... it never surprises me when out of the blue we pick up a transfer who can help.
"OK OK I get it I was a little rough on Tharpe..."
Let's face facts... Tharpe was a little rough on us!
I wonder if he ever lightened up and bought a tank of gas over the border in Kansas?
Isn't Norm still ticking?
Wow... that sure makes the SEC look good... having one of their basketball program's coach "move up" to a C-USA school?
@Virgil_Caine - tempting story. You can top it by going all-out college prank. Self lights it on fire on the ground and yells "fire!" Best time to do it is right after the Mizzou AD finishes taking his free gym shower once a week.
@KUSTEVE - When you think wannabees that never were... it undoubtedly points to some kind of mental toxicity consumed over time. Crystal meth is for rich men in that area. I'm thinking wood alcohol... known by us "scientific folks" as methanol... liquid sister to crystal meth (at least, that's what they think around Columbia). Best not argue with them... you'll never win an argument with a single-cell creature!
"Asked about KU by Zagsblog.com, Turner said: “I like the high-low system that coach (Bill) Self runs, due to the fact that I can play both the high and the low in that system with Cliff (Alexander) and a couple of other bigs over there. That would be really cool to be a part of.”"
That tells me a lot more than the junk we heard yesterday where that Texas article parsed every word from one of Myle's statements to suggest he showed his hand for going to Austin.
The above statement tells me there has been an in-depth conversation of how he would be utilized at Kansas.... and it sounds more like a negotiation. Myles would like to be used more outside...
It sounds like Self is just trying to make sure he knows that at times he will have to be in the low post... like when we have a huge size advantage over our opponent. And in that case, it would raise Myle's stock more... proving he can play low post ball or play with his face to the basket, including nailing the long ball. If we can sell that style of play to him, we stand to take back some of the advantage we may have lost by just selling him on straight hi/lo with him in the low post.
With Myles focused on Durant's game, it sort of neutralizes our biggest weapon, Hudy. Durant is proof someone can be a star in the league without having girth.
If I was Self I would still sell Hudy. Sell the idea of strength helping him wherever his game is. What player turns down building strength in his short time in college before going pro?
I keep thinking about Myles.. everything he has said until now... the type of player he can be... the type of player he wants to be.
His idol is Kevin Durant. I can't blame him for that. Durant is one of my idol's, too. But think about what Kevin's game is. It isn't the Bill Self hi/lo.
Reading that article, you can take from it the sales pitch used by Kansas. The sales pitch is that they wouldn't always (or ever) use Myles in the low post on the hi/lo. They will use Alexander for that, and use Myles all over the court, often the perimeter, to nail 3s and whatever else is available.
Notice what Myles DIDN'T say! He didn't say how he was looking forward to getting in the low post and working the hi/lo. And why should he? He isn't built for that (yet) and, realistically, he never will be. His future pro game should mimic his idol, Durant!
So now, when you look at it that way... does Kansas have the advantage on recruiting Myles? I think we lose many of the advantages we hold with most 7-footers. Most footers are looking to be a star in the post. Self's hi/lo is built for those players. Just don't expect us to put Cliff on the left side and Myles on the right side of a hi/lo set if he does pick Kansas. Ain't gonna happen!
I'm psyched to think of the possibilities if he does pick us... and if Self can think outside of the box and not try to force the square peg in the round hole (thin footer to become a post monster).
Myles can shoot, and I admire him for going after Durant's game! Smart kid!
Don't know that we land him, but I hope he stays in the B12 so we can watch his game closer!
Why is it taking so long for Myles to pick a school?
Perhaps it takes that long to negotiate a deal. I think the longer it goes on, the higher chance we have of landing him. This is like an extended poker hand... and Self is pretty good at playing that game. I'll say this again... Self is the best recruiter in the country after March Madness. When the pressure is on, he gets what he wants. And in this case, getting Myles requires negotiating how he will be used while at Kansas.
In this case, I agree with Myles. He should be cut lose, outside of the post, to create his offense. We should force a square peg in a round hole!
Gosh... I somehow missed your post until now.
Right on!
In this way I think Self needs to modernize. He's still treating basketball like it is the same game he played at OSU in 1982. Back then it was the mentality to play through injuries and "man up." The game has totally evolved since 1982. Players are trained and coached up to a much higher standard, and with the addition of all those heavily trained fast-twitch muscles comes a different level of injury, because the joints haven't evolved past 1982, but the tendons and muscles have. That translates into players running faster and jumping higher (evolution of the player), but it also means they take a heck of a lot more battering on their joints not even from contact with other players, only their own contact springing off the floor.
I've had to adjust my own thoughts on the game in recent years. Because I'm near the same generation as Self, and I played for decades, usually 7 days a week. So, naturally, I did play through most of my injuries. But I didn't have the athleticism of today's players. I wasn't springing 45" off the court for a rebound. I couldn't make all those hard cuts they make today. A modern player against me in my day would run circles around my game... just like they would of Self's game.
I'm positive today we are dealing with more hair-line fractures, partial ligament tears, spurs, and what not because these kids are putting their joints through so much more stress than us old timers did with our joints.
No way most modern, competitive players can play all those decades of basketball like we did. I came out of the game with a major injury, but that came after 30 years of full contact basketball played almost 365 days a year. It appears a certain amount of reduced athleticism helps longevity!
Self should play more players and distribute minutes a big broader. That will create better depth for us in March, but will also help reduce injuries for our starters. We can be competitive using more players, and then run them harder with presses and aggressive play. That should counteract any decline in play because we are playing more minutes with lesser talent.
"Maybe Wiggins got advice from his dad to cruise most of the time, but make enough effort and still be the top performer on any given night. Had he put out the maximum effort every game, he'd have burned out by January. I think most of the college players don't have the luxury of having professional advisers like Wiggins or Embiid. So they must rely on the coaching staff. And ultimately the coaches should be like the mom and dad at school. The kids may be 18, but they are no adults, or most of them."
I think you are right on the button!
If we could get Self to use more of his bench, we could give players more rest in every game and then they can play harder in spurts.
Funny how through many games and parts of the season it seemed that our team lacked hustle... but our guys definitely took on their fair share of bumps and bruises. Even Self talked about the guys needing some healing time now and then.
I wonder if many of our slow parts of the season were more about the guys being banged up?
I've never understood why we work so hard to recruit depth, then we don't use it unless we have a dire emergency. We could be running presses all game and forcing teams into our tempo and then tire them out only because we have depth and we use it every game.
I know... I was being half sarcastic.
Yeah... how about he flips a coin and says... "heads to KU, tails to Texas."
Or cut the deck and play hi/lo.... hey, that's the offense we run!
We are 1-for-1 in recent hat ceremonies.
The article says, "All signs..."
Maybe Moore should get real and say, "A sign..."
Big difference.
We've learned our lessons on recruiting. It can backfire to call a player out before he announces.
Something that bothered me all year was the lack of minutes given to AW3. His minutes, basically, completely vanished to the point that he became rusty and out of being a real option down the stretch.
So to find out now that Selden had a knee problem... it stresses the AW3 situation even more.
I don't think it is good to give all these freshmen 30+ mpg in their first year of D1. It is such a big jump from HS in physicality... even big football stock players like Selden get banged up too much.
I know coaches want to get these young players playing their best ball by March, but I'm not sure the best option is to stuff them with all the PT they can handle. We see what it did to Embiid, too.
Selden is an awesome player and I'm glad we have him. But he didn't contribute much in March. Maybe he was having knee issues. We have to do whatever it takes to up our chances of winning in March. And in this case, we should have had AW3 with enough quality PT minutes in the year to give him some in March. It could have meant a huge difference. It could have been the difference in the Stanford game, which then gets us JoJo back for future games.
Hindsight chatter gets old because it is easy to look back and criticize or say how you would do better. But in this case, I made it clear a long time ago that AW3 should be getting minutes and we would need him down the stretch.
If Turner wants to play in the B12, the only real choice he has is Kansas. I believe this is the big question to answer. Does Turner want to play B12 basketball?
Kansas owns the B12 for the last 10 years. It may take a while, but go back through those 10 years and look at all the extreme talent that didn't play for Kansas and left the B12 without ever winning it.
One quick browse of those players and who comes up first on my list? That would be Kevin Durant, Turner's hero.
Does Turner think he can do what Durant couldn't? Why would he think that?
Here is what Durant did at Texas:
25.8 PPG, 1.9 BPG, 1.9 SPG, 1.3 APG, 11.1 RPG. He shot 47.3% from the field, including 40.4% from trey, and he was 81.6% from the FT line.
Those insane numbers weren't good enough to win the B12.
Picking Texas would be settling for a second, third, fourth or lower finish in the B12. And if he stays more than a year in D1... more of the same.
And how about looking down the road to March... Texas has never won the big prize. The last time they made the FF was 2003, and before that you have to go back to 1947! Texas, simply put, is just not a March team!
Gosh... I think you are right!
Loved your post. I thought the same.
And if he knew all along he would stay in Texas, he would have helped out his team by declaring sooner so they could use that momentum to land more talent.
It seems obvious that he waited to see what players were going or staying in other programs. We know he likes Kansas already. I guess soon we will find out if he loves Kansas!
Amazing... how many players pick a school because they DON'T want PT! I can make a huge list of potential star players who didn't want PT in their first year... no wait... I can't name a single player!
If I had 10 cents for every time these guys guessed wrong, I'd buy me a luxury condo in Monte Carlo.
I'm totally on board with that... It would take some kind of superman to be a freshman PG who could master Self ball and win us a NC!
I think the same for the next level... It is tough for a young college PG to jump right into the pros. There is so much skill required to be great (not just good) along with basketball IQ that most never seem to learn.
@Wigs2 - of course it matters who you plan to recruit.. we are counting on you to resolve this matter! ;)
@jaybate - Self better watch those Carnival Line SS cruises... the norovirus plague on board is a real bear!
I doubt UCONN would have been invited to the big dance this year if they didn't have Shabazz. Compare the team that surrounds him, then look back at what we had at the 2-5 last year (senior stocked 2013 team)! There is no comparison... but we didn't have a PG who could execute in March. You can say a PG won't carry a team... but good luck winning the NC without a solid PG. You can have holes somewhere else... but not at point!
The one thing I am sure... Self is going to recruit the best players he can find that will fill his spots and roles. He's already said that is his goal.
I can think of two monumental events that have happened to Self in the past few years that has had a huge impact on him.
Losing the recruiting battle for Tarc. That crushed Self, and he has picked up his recruiting ever since that happened and we were left dry for a big name footer. We seemed to later do okay with Sir Withey!
Losing the NC in 2012 to a bunch of freshmen players. They weren't all freshmen, but that is what it felt like, and the unibrow helped deliver UK to the promised land. That changed Self's views on OADs. And it is possible to win it all with a bunch of them. This year came down to the wire with maybe the youngest team ever.
This thread has been entirely worthwhile!
Can we come in the middle and find a happy spot that works for everyone and in the same time design the best recruiting plan of Kansas now and in the future?
Let's say we target recruiting all the way to the top, but we make it conditional on fulfilling our requirements. What are those requirements?
Nothing wrong with a player desiring to be an OAD, as long as that player has an open-minded conversation with Coach Self before deciding. (I believe, in most cases we do this now)
Team basketball comes before individual basketball. Players should not be selfish, but should also be more selfish if our coaches ask them to be (like try to be more alpha dog).
All players.... presumed OADs and not... will be treated the same. No one gets automatic PT just for signing with Kansas. PT is earned by everyone, and everyone is disciplined in an appropriate, and equalizing manner.
On the other end... seniority does not buy PT. PT must be earned by every player, regardless of age.
I think we could build on some of this. I think we already do some of it....
Comments?
I think both Henry and Wiggins were positive catches for us. Both stayed just one year, but were productive, didn't cause drama issues, and were always respectful (and will be towards KU in the future). The only negative (and it is one) is we only got them for a season, and couldn't benefit for a longer period of time and experience further improvements.
I illustrated that in both a "glass half empty" and glass half full" paragraph. It really is how we all choose to look at it.
I'm very much "glass half full" kind of guy on this year's two OADs. And had Embiid been healthy, I'm positive we would have won that Stanford game and then the tournament results were better, and to who knows what level.
I'm really happy we secured B12 conference #10. That is a streak giving us unbelievable stature today! Unlikely we win that without Wiggins or Embiid.
I can't believe we continue to make great conversation on this topic...
But we do!
I continue to be impressed with the level of thought-provoking conversation offered up by all you great Jayhawk fans! Bravo!
One other point on this subject....
It refers to how can we move carefully around the recruit world and avoid presumed OADs. The talent of these HS players shift like a flooding river. The waters are choppy, at best. One player will seem to fit into that middle group, and he won't be talking about a desire to become an OAD... then that same player has a phenomenal tournament game and becomes the buzz of the recruiting world and is projected upwards in stock. Now he talks about being an OAD. Meanwhile... we've been recruiting him for 2 years and he wants to be a Jayhawk. Do we suddenly pull our offer? I don't think so.
It makes it too difficult to set this as a goal, avoiding OADs.
No... this is not a thread about Marcus Smart and a bout of floparrhea.
It's April, and D1 schools across this nation are lined up for another round of the ultimate Texas Hold'em Poker Tournament, being staged from coast-to-coast.
Schools have been holding their hole cards for a while now and we are finally witnessing the flop.
Here is one of the flop cards in this year's magnificent recruiting tournament: 6'11" Trevor Thompson, a transfer from VTech. On Sunday, he announced he will become a Buckeye next year (or at least, become a red shirt transfer).
So how does this flop card impact Kansas? Or does it?
Let's look at our current hole cards. What we learned last week was that we developed a hole in our hole hand... 7' Joel Embiid was leaving for the NBA.
Schools (and media) from around the table have been wondering what cards Kansas would have in the hole when the flop came. Now the flop is turning and Kansas has a void in the post to fill. Many have speculated that top tier recruit Myles Turner was waiting in the wings and would decide after all schools' hole cards were known (including Kansas).
Kansas had shown interest in Thompson. But Thompson went for the lesser pick of OSU over KU. Why? Could this play be exposing what the Jayhawks card will be down the river? Could it mean that Thompson was tipped off that he would be fighting for minutes against Turner this fall (if he is granted his transfer waiver) or the following year if Turner was still around?
Inquiring minds want to know. Schools are still holding their chips close to the vest.
Turner has offers from Ohio State, Kansas, Kentucky, Arizona, Oklahoma State and Texas.
I guess we can scratch OSU off the list with the signing of Thompson. And Kentucky appears to have little chance, too, because they'll have at least one top 7'-footer returning. Arizona will have a blossoming Tarc back for another year... Tarc... the footer who burned KU and has done more for Kansas basketball than any player ever who actually didn't come to Kansas! Thanks again, Tarc, for becoming a Wildcat! Texas already has Ibeh and Ridley... two quality players that will surely own plenty of PT next year. While all these teams hold the wrong cards for recruiting Turner, Oklahoma State doesn't seem to have enough supporting cards to be considered. Smart and Brown will be gone, and the Okies will not be a certain to finish near the top of the B12 next year, with or without Turner.
Kansas, on the other hand, has a colossal hole to fill with the exit of Joel Embiid, and Kansas will have a mixture of quality returning players and quality incoming recruits that point to a probably #11 B12 conference finish! Kansas has just the right cards in the hole that can inspire Myles to look their way.
And last, Kansas owns the chip count in this tournament. Andrea Hudy is one, big developmental chip in Kansas' stack. Myles has a long ways to go to be NBA ready, and he doesn't have a second to waste going anywhere that doesn't build strength on his light frame. He should be looking in the Kansas video library at one Jeff Withey, to become inspired about being a Jayhawk. Another big chip in the Kansas Stack is their infamous Bill Self hi/lo offense, which makes players like Myles the center of their offensive sets. Another valuable chip owned by Kansas is their reputation for developing big men. It is doubtful any other college team has sent more post players to the league than Kansas since the Bill Self era! Their record on big man development stands alone in college basketball!
The betting has begun, and I know my chips will be on Kansas to land their next big man superstar, Myles Turner!
We should adopt part of your spirit in recruiting one position... PG.
And what is really excellent is we can go after the most freakish PG athletes with unbelievable talent, and if their height isn't above about 6'2" they are almost assured to not be a first round pick as a freshman.... maybe even when they are a senior, unless they are the next Derrick Rose.
We should always be on the look out for a PG who fits that description. Forget the Harrison brothers type of players... they are too big and in high demand in the league.
Imagine finding a super star HS PG recruit who is 6'1" and can come right in and start leading maybe even as a freshman? Definitely as a sophomore! OMG... I just described Shabazz Napier!
Let's find a PG like Shabazz.... and with our ability to recruit an awesome post around a player like Shabazz, we will up our chances of having a good March for 3 years! We just have to keep searching for a player like that.
It won't matter if our Shabazz PG is surrounded by 4-star 4-year players or with a few 5-star potential OAD players. The leadership comes from the point.
Shabazz made Daniels look like a star, and Daniels is not star. I'd rather have a freshman Embiid or Wiggins than a junior Daniels any day of the week!
"As a coach, Self has all the info on recruits. He knows what they want. What they expect. What they're looking for. I would simply say that he should pass on guys that say, "I'm want to turn pro after one season", or if he believes that is very likely."
How do we know that he isn't already doing that? I'm pretty sure he does that now. Some guy that will mostly be a project his first year and then wanting to leave does nothing but trash KU's reputation, and offered up nothing in return. A guy who isn't even real OAD level talent but wanting to be one already shows he has an attitude issue.
I do think we can win WITHOUT landing any OAD recruits... but I'm not sure we can win without at least trying to recruit OAD level talent. Big difference. I think if we bring our sights into just the middle, it hurts our recruiting in it's entirety.
Those middle players we want so desperately... if they know we don't recruit top players why would they consider us? You can bet they consider themselves at the top, regardless what the media says. I don't think it is realistic to let the world know we don't recruit the top.
Maybe we can refine your idea to just saying we have to be extremely selective at recruiting top talent. That seems more realistic... and I'm on board for being selective of top recruits. One bad apple spoils the entire cart.