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jaybate 1.0
10346 posts

I thought I would just take a moment and see the glass half full regarding this team with no credible front court yes--this half a team.

What other coach in the United States of D1 could possibly be 7-2 and ranked as high as 2 in the country with half a team?

Think about it.

This may, despite all our collective fears and disappointments, turn out to be Self's greatest coaching job yet!!!!

What would Roy's record be with this team right now? He would have lost to Washington and ASU for sure. But can you imagine Roy beating UK, or Syracuse, with one project big man recovering from a serious injury that is essentially playing his first season? And no other big men? I really think Roy would have have lost to the 4 majors and would have split with the mid majors. Roy just can't coach a lick without clear matchup advantage inside; that much we know for sure. Let's say 3-6,

How Cal? 0-9 almost certainly. Cal might no even show up for half the games hoping to get the season over quicker.

Coach K? Every time Coach K has had an off season, he has gone about .500. But Coach K's offseasons have always had a full roster of D1 grade players. He just lost one or two key players and didn't have a great player. Coach K always had at least two big men he could rotate. Self doesn't have that. So: if Coach K were coaching this team, he would really be comfortable with the great outside shooters we have, but he would shoot blanks because he too would not know what to do without at least two post men. Let's say Coach K would be 4-5 with this team.

When you look at the season through the lens of comparing where we would be with Cal, Roy and Coach K with this squad, your spirits just soar and you go, ah, so what if we're 7-2 and looking shaky. We're doing great compared to where we would be with those guys.

And as always, imagine where we would be this season without the apparent petroshoeco-agency complex recruiting embargo these past several years.

As Ed Ames used to sing in that mellifluous voice of his:

"My cup runneth over....".

Rock Chalk!

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JayHawkFanToo said:

@jaybate-1.0

How do you figure?

The top 5 players for ASU played 175 minutes or 87.5% of available minutes, the other 3 players combined for 25 minutes. KU top 5 players played 167 Minutes or 83.5% and the other two players combined for 33 minutes. ASU should have had more tired legs than KU.

Sky's blue.

How do you figure?

Earth's a sphere?

How do you figure?

Water is wet.

How do you figure?

Cat's have fur?

How do you figure?

Airplanes fly in air.

How do you figure?

Sugar is sweet.

How do you figure?

Best regards,

@KUFanjaybate 1.0Too and @HawkjaybateChamp1.0

HOWLING!!!!!

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@BeddieKU23

Tired legs, again, yup.

Remember ASU played an 8-man rotation probably specifically because Self only had five effective rotation players. And they regularly play 6 to seven man rotations against good competition, not just against dubs, which is two more than KU plays against good competition.

KU tends to play an effective 5 man rotation unless they are playing mid majors, or lousy majors when KU is having a hot shooting night. Self tries to give Lightfoot and Garrett 8 mpg each and up to 13 if the score permits more.

KU had tired legs and will always have tired legs against any major that can run an effective 7-8 man rotation at them and force KU into fast tripping most possessions...until Self gets two more bodies into the rotation regularly that can play 15-20 mpg against quality opponents, not just those playing small ball. Lightfoot and Garrett don't count unless he starts playing them 20 minutes per game against good teams.

Leg fatique will really become acute late January and early February, unless two guys--Cunliffe and either Preston, or DeSousa--show up and can play, rather than just watch.

Bill Self has been one of the most forceful personalities on the sidelines in college basketball during his KU tenure, without being a jerk about it.

Many coaches show rage. Many stay calm. Many crack wise and ride the refs.

But Bill Self has distinguished himself by doing all of these things, seemingly on demand, and more.

If college basketball coaching were acting, Bill Self would be Paul Newman. He would be a cool guy with incredible range, likability and longevity. He would be able to evince both artistic purpose and commercial savvy. He would have class, but also never forget where he came from, or the joys of popping the top on a tall cool one in the right circumstances. He would in short be most that is good about the best of we Americans, and not a phony, or a pretender to being a high brow, outside-in actor from London. He would be proud of the inside-out Method of Stanislavsky and Hank Iba and stick to it, while adapting it expediently, and maintaining a healthy skepticism about his own fame.

Self can fry eggs on his neck with the best of them. He can fill a sideline with his smile. He can in one game question man hood and tell players to believe. He can drive players to want to fight him in huddles. He can work the referees without making them hate him, or he can shame them for not calling cheap shots by having his players do absolutely absurd cheap shots in mid transition calculated not to hurt an opposing player to shame referees into calling a fair game. His cracks can sting like yellow jackets as players run by him in transition and he can jaw a player coming to the bench into the cracks in the floor, or praise them like he is in awe, and practically lay on hands on them like Oral Roberts. This guy has, as they say in Hollywood, when not defiling children and mind controlling divas, massive acting chops and incredible range. The guys should be interviewed on the Actor's Studio.

So: in this early winter of our discontent, after two nearly unprecedented consecutive losses--one at home and one in our home away from home--why is Self not putting on the holy terror make up and prowling the sidelines railing at missed defensive assignments, and poor shot selection, and pop tarts by the bakers dozen, and, well, not the usual hyper intensity of guarding that Self teams are known for?

Simple.

This team has serious shortcomings.

Those shortcomings limit what he can do in the way of strategic shortcomings.

These guys are trying hard, but they are young and some are shall we say idiosyncratic.

And finally and perhaps most importantly, IMHO, Self does not want to appear a cry baby himself.

Self appears a student of the history of the game. He apparently knows about most of the great coaches of the past. He apparently understands their successes and failures, as well as their trials and tribulations. Otherwise, I don't see how he could have side stepped so many of their mistakes.

Self just has to understand he has been on an incredible run for 13 years second only to John Wooden.

Self must understand that he has had a run of fine players, depth, and good fortune to go along with his incredible brilliance as a coach.

If Self were to begin storming up and down the sidelines just because he finally has deal with the kinds of slings and arrows of outrageous basketball fortune that even Coach K, Calipari and Roy have had to deal with and that have caused them to fall to .500 a few times each, well, Self would seem like a spoiled, petty tyrant, or to use one of his marvelous phrases, he would seem to be coaching "like a baby."

While I can hand wring and worry about what may be going on behind the information black out that currently envelopes Billy Preston, his car, and the KU basketball program, Self really is approaching this situation the right way right now. The team is in an incredibly difficult situation both because of being short handed and because of the uncertainties regarding Preston, and which other players might, or might not show up next semester. And on top of all that, fans should not forget that in college ball there is always the chance that someone that is playing right now, might blow a test, or two, and wind up academically ineligible for second semester, or someone might get go all teenager and decide the grass is greener somewhere else.

Self appears to be trying to keep this unusual situation in perspective, IMHO.

Go, Bill, go!!!

@nuleafjhawk

Good question. It does seem like many board rats find this a sudden sea change.

But even before Preston went out, I thought fans and media were underestimating how thin we were. When Preston went out, the team rallied a few games as is typical. And that was the team the minor major coach you mentioned saw and praised so highly. That coach was also probably using some coach speak. He wants to schedule elites for the gate receipts to finance his small program. PRAISING AN ELITE ENSURES SCHEDULING MORE ELITES NEXT YEAR. So: that may not have been entirely reliable feedback.

Next, after a short rally from losing Preston, fans were further seduced and probably some denial set in about KU’s missing pieces and the inevitable attrition each season brings.

Our starting five is very talented at trifectation and can score, when it is rested, not fouled up, and no one is ā€œnicked upā€ or sick. It’s already done it.

On a good shooting night, we can blister a minor major and beat many majors and even a green, short handed elite, or two.

But combine shorthandedness with the need to work in effectively new, developing faces like Doke, Vick and Newman (3/5ths of our starting team) and we appear to have a Mylar thin margin for error.

Handling adversity is something every team has to master each season. 3/5ths being newbies makes that more challenging. Having no flexibility to strategize and motivate with substitution makes this team rather easy to scheme against, as opposing coaches accrue more and more film of us to study before games.

There are two obvious ways to beat us: outshoot us and out rebound us on one of our off shooting nights (Husky loss), or run on us for a full 40 minutes with 8 guys (ASU loss). Both these approaches are how KU has beaten so many teams with longer stacks, or a Durant. Now KU is getting a dose of its own medicine.

There is one more obvious way, if you have a good center and some guards that can drive it. Foul up Doke the first 5 minutes, then just keep pounding it down our throats for 35 minutes.

Next, our outside shooting is VERY susceptible to wear and tear. Every piece of new lingerie each game indicates a risk of our trifectation falling beneath the collective 40% 3pt shooting needed to be an winning 4-1 Team that game. Few trifectates are as impervious to joint pain and leg fatigue, as Frank Mason was. This year’s players are not babies. They are ā€œnormal.ā€

Also this 4-1 scheme is vulnerable to an ā€œ0’ferā€ by one of our first three options: Devonte, Vick and Svi, because Malik, our fourth, has so far not been the BenMac grade addition this 4-1 Team needed. Note: if Malik were to get untracked, this team could much more likely weather recent flameouts by Devonte versus Huskies and Svi versus Sun Devils.

Worse still, this shorthand KU Team IS very vulnerable in the near future to:

a.) a series of 2 in 3 sets that will come during conference, unless Cunliffe, Preston and DeRousa show up; and

b.) to inevitable extended shooting slumps by our first three options, unless Malik comes around as a viable fourth option.

Penultimately, and I have saved the worst for next to last, we are one big shy of the minimum two needed, just to sustain a 4-1 set for a season. And we are 2 bigs shy of being able to matchup with the occasional double post teams we will face. And I’m not even accounting for possible injury to Doke.

Ultimately, this team lacks back ups, a problem it presently seems unlikely to escape. And this leaves it avoiding fouling and so being unable to play aggressive Self defense, or rebound much, for extended stretches. Self has gone small and schemed a scoring team, but a defense first coach only able to have his team guard 10 mpg a game, and even then not really having any lock down defenders, well, that is a sad 😢 sight.

So: what happened?

Reality and an apparent recruiting embargo happened.

Fans denial met reality.

Why did the media suffer denial, too?

Maybe they have been burned so many times (much of 13 seasons) by Self producing hat rabbit driven miracles, they just decided to go along.

Or maybe overhyping KU early has helped with bet balancing?

I don’t know.

But KU just does have 5 very potentially and intermittently VERY good players.

But it’s kind of like bridge with five good face cards in Trump, no other face cards and even distribution of suits in your hand. Five good Trump cards is five tricks, but ten points is still only ten points and you need at least 13 to open unless you can bluff like hell and cross ruff unexpectedly.

Self needs just a few more face cards on the bench in a big man suit and with the right distribution on some other teams he could once again go to game.

But presently, it looks like Hopkins and Hurley found two ways to exploit his lack of those cards on the bench, and now others will likely emulate. On our hot nights, we will still prevail. It’s the warm and cold nights that will grow increasingly fitful, if no more bench cards are dealt.

Don’t grab at straws.

Work the problem.

Devonte has to learn to lead.

He has to adapt to adversity.

He started with one kind of team, now he has another.

Devonte has to lead.

He has to rally the troops.

He has to find the door that is not yet visible for how this team can win.

Steal wins. This is who we are now until reinforcements arrive.

Devonte has to take control and work with what he has.

DeSousa • Dec 11, 2017 02:25 PM

Holy cow!

We live in an age of fake MSM news, NEAR DAILY MSM scoops against the President retracted in hours, UNVERIFIABLE leaks, EMAIL dumps, bizarrely worded tweets, and ANONYMOUS internet tips about politics in the swamp.

Now an anonymous tip KU basketball might get a desperately needed big sooner than expected?

OMG!

ā€œI want to believe, Sculley!!ā€

But...

All SIGINT suspect right now. Stop.

Steady as she goes. Stop. Continue all possible repairs en route to Pearl for emergency refit during Holiday break. Stop.

William Allen White, the Emporia newspaper man the KU journalism school is named for, had a son Bill, Jr. that was a pretty fair writer in his own right. He covered the early stages of WWII and he wrote a book about a PT Boat fleet that got caught in the American military defeat in the Philippines on the immediately on the heels of Pearl Harbor. The PT Boat fleet was pressed into the task of helping first supply beleaguered and then besieged American forces being sacrificed by American leadership that had lacked the foresight and resources to reinforce them sooner. A few hopelessly out gunned PT boats eventually were ordered to help evacuate certain elements of American leadership in the Philippines to safety from the onrushing Japanese juggernaut, eventually helping this American leadership (including commander of US forces in the Philippines--Douglas MacArthur) retreat to hopefully more defensible strategic positions in Australia, where they hoped to reorganize and prepare for a later campaign to retake the southwest Pacific from the Japanese.

In the story, the hopelessly out numbered and out gunned American PT Boats were eventually sacrificed to enable escape of American leaders. The tragedy of young men dutifully sacrificing everything for a retreat from effectively total defeat was bitter. Bill White, Jr.'s book and the John Ford-directed movie based on it, were titled "They Were Expendable." It was one of the greatest, and most harshly truthful, titles in all of war literature and movies. The last memories of young US PT Boat sailors would not be repelling the Japanese, or sinking the Japanese fleet, or taking the high ground, or paying the last full measure for the final conquest. They were instead to die bravely, not to win, but to kee some brass from perishing along with the bulk of American forces in the Philippines. They were to temporarily make up for an inadequate commitment to defend the realm that should never have been under-defended in the first place, or should have been retreated from immediately so as not to be overwhelmed, and so as to save the entire American force for winnable battles. Alas they were likely left in position in such small force to precisely to tempt the Japanese to invade them, rather than turn full force on the vastly better defended Hawaii immediately. Regardless, a decision was made in Washington that most all in the Philippines were expendable.

I am fairly convinced one cannot fully understand America's overwhelming, at times seemingly quixotic, commitment to global military force structure at a scale unprecedented in human history for the last 75 years without seeing this movie, or reading this book. Those that reduce and attribute Washington's and the Federal Reserve's seemingly endless expansion of military force to the greed and selfish interests of the military-industrial complex, politicians and central bankers overlook that the spending of a reputed 30 Trillions of dollars in just the last 16 years, and the reputed outright untraceable loss of at least $3 trillions more (maybe much, MUCH more) could likely have been accomplished more easily than by actually building the epic military-industrial complex that straddles the earth like a weapon bristling Gulliver seemingly hopelessly entangled with Lilliputions and Brobdinagians at every turn and scale of strategy.

With the REAL power the military-industrial complex (probably better called the National Security State) has possessed since 1945, the military-industrial complex, which now appears the true Leviathan of America, and not the US civilian government, as scoundrels like Grover Norquist and Karl "Turd Blossom" Rove have apparently disingenuously rationalized, could easily have stolen all that was actually spent without spending more than a tiny portion of it on actual bang-bang and controlling epic lines of communication from the upper mantle to deep space. 100 high yield hydrogen bombs was likely all it took for them to stick us all up in bal masques, give us the one-eye sign, and say give us your $30 Trillion, or we'll fill ya full of radiation, pardners.

No, it appears there was a deeper trigger for this seemingly boundless game of national security state preservation that has triggered this grandiose strategic endeavor the MSM attributes in part to something ill-defined that they call a Deep State. It appears to have been rooted in how close our beloved American surface state and military let the country come to total defeat and conquest in 1941. Most legitimate military strategists and serious war historians I have read, that aren't writing overtly historical revisions for the latest private oligarchy judo flop, and that understand the difference between a line of communication and line of cocaine, understand that USA came within a whisker of being surrounded and cut off from much of what it would eventually have required to wage total war successfully. In short, we lucked out at Midway. Period. LUCK made huge percentage of the difference, not just some of it. It wasn't enough to know the Japanese codes and keep the three US aircraft carriers out of Peal on December 7th, which apparently happened. It wasn't enough to know the Japanese codes and send those three aircraft carriers searching for a 200 ship Japanese flotilla. Code advantages alone did not get her done. Americans with the right stuff were necessary, but not enough on their own, either. It wasn't all Nimitz being a great card player. It wasn't the great industrial capacity soon to be brought into play. Had we not had a huge stroke of luck finding them first, and then catching their carriers between launches and recoveries, they would have handed our asses to us in Davey Jones Locker. Period. And then the USA and the Greatest Generation ever would have become cut off from crucial lines of communication (the stuff that decides who wins), and our industrial capacity could easily have been outstripped in five years by the German and Japanese industrial economies had they had unfettered, unbombed access to necessary raw materials and their processing, while the USA was shut off and denied from same. The PT Boat crews were expendable to stop that eventuality, since the bungling of their being there without sufficient fleet and land force in the first place gave a wake up call to the guys with the yachts between Boston and Washington DC. The sacrifice of those crews and PT Boats, though heroic, as it has been portrayed, only contributed to enabling a delayed engagement at Coral Sea and Midway that divided the Japanese forces again, and that came down finally to America winning at Midway with pure luck. And ever since, no budget deficit has been too great to bear, no loan too risky, no deception of the American people too loathsome, no presidential assassination/overthrow too onerous, no war crime, or crime against humanity too evil to perpetrate, no nation-state not worth knocking over, in pursuit of overwhelming strategic military advantage in lines of communication and raw materials and force structure.

What has all this to do with KU basketball on the afternoon after KU had its head handed to it the second time in 4-5 days? Not much in some ways, but quite a lot in others.

I reckon there are only two ways to look at the ASU debacle today:

a.) Self knows Preston, Cunliffe, and DeSousa are joining the team shortly, probably during the semester break, and so there is no reason to stress and upbraid a hopelessly outmanned team of five D1 grade players and two Tulsa types for losing some games; or

b.)Self knows only Cunliffe is joining the team shortly, and so the team is going to be hopelessly out manned the rest of the season and there is no reason to upbraid the team for losing a lot of games for the rest of the season.

Either way, someone high up, either Bill Self, or someone above him, appears to have made a decision that they were expendable today; that there was little way to win at this time; that the thing to do was do their duty in the face of overwhelming odds, accept that they were only capable of what were seeing, take their medicine and wait for a better strategic situation from which to mount a credible attack.

The A and B scenarios are, however, quite different in implications for the team and fans this season.

Scenario A implies that what happened to Billy Preston is just a bump in the road. It implies Self is having the team run offenses and play defenses exactly as if Bill Preston will be back. It implies Self is doing what he did in 2008, albeit with less depth to bridge with. Self schemed the 2008 team so that it had a slot that Brandon Rush could be plugged smoothly into when his knee rehabbed sufficiently to resume playing.This implies what we are watching is a team practicing its routines with a hole in it that will be filled sometime soon. It implies KU will be playing for a conference title and trying to make a run in March, when Preston returns. What a nice scenario, eh? We take some losses, but we don't fly into motivational rages, or try at all costs to win. We just work on the nuts and bolts and get them polished up and ready for combination and assembly with Preston. Until then, these games
are expendable.

Scenario B is, alas something quite different and frankly tragic. In Scenario B CINCPAC will not save them. The PT Boats have to do their futile duties making the best of things under conditions of total defeat, and then sacrifice themselves for the good of next year's team. In Scenario B they really ARE expendable. In Scenario B, Self and the brass above him have agreed that it is unfortunate what has happened with the petroshoeco contract and the adverse effect it has appeared to some to have had on KU recruiting this and recent seasons (apparently leaving it massively undermanned and essentially unable to compete very effectively this season as wear and tear and issues accumulate), BUT KU has all the money it needs without burning IOUs in the legislature for funding for minor sports, and , well, this team and these players, well, we regret it but they were expendable. Self will have to build for next year under this scenario and he should not expend further resources and reinforcements, and should not try to drive the current roster to accomplish something--win a 14th conference title--that strategic recruiting realities have made appear unfeasible. Encourage them to give it their best, but do not impose unrealistic expectations on them either.

Alas, Scenario B might (and by might I mean I am still hoping it is a very remote, whisker slim possibility), even have one much more unsettling dimension to it and a still more tragic implication, however. The added dimension is a strictly at this point hypothetical worst case possibility that Billy Preston's issues might implicate some, or all of KU basketball's coaching staff in improprieties related to signing recruits with cars as incentives. This could, under this hypothetical, mean that "they were expendable" extends not just to the team, but, god forbid, to one, some, or all of the coaching staff, too. OMG! I hope not. So far, we have no evidence whatsoever of such an eventuality. All we have is the appearance of a near vacuum of official commenting lately. Let's keep our fingers crossed that it is just bureacracy's slow wheels turning on a trivial issue. But, when one recalls some other school's problems with recruiting improprieties involving things like cars, etc., something of a pattern appears to emerge. Sometimes only an alumnus gets the blame. Other times an assistant coach gets it, while the head coach is found not to have known about the impropriety. But still other times, both the assistants AND the head coach had knowledge of, and get implicated in, the impropriety. Call this the worst case possibility of Scenario B.

Whatever Scenario may, or may not be unfolding (and yes there could be others, too), the KU team that played ASU today, like the KU team that played University of Washington, did not appear to look like and play like any Bill Self team I can recall. These weren't just two bad games. It was the way the team and Self appeared to approach and conduct the games. Appearances can be deceiving. But until TPTB resume commenting on the actual circumstances, all we have before us are appearances, for the most part.

Back to the appearances...

There appeared less displays of affection among the starters (no joy in Mudville, if you will), than recalled about prior KU teams.

There appeared fewer displays of exultation at plays made by Kansas players, than recalled about prior KU teams.

There appeared less sign of a team leader trying to rally the team, as recalled as common in many years of Bill Self's tenure.

There appeared fewer serial stretches of high pressure Self defense than recalled with prior Self teams.

There appeared less successful apparent wrinkles being put in by the coach to get high percentage shots after time outs, .

There appeared fewer apparent resorts to junk zones when KU was having trouble with the opponent's driving penetration, than recalled from prior teams.

There appeared much less squirting up the court with KU's noted athleticism and speed, when the starters were playing, than recalled from prior teams.

There appeared to be less putting a body on anyone and locking down the last ten minutes of the game, than recalled as typical of other Self teams that were not very deep and so shortened games till ten to go, before lighting the candle with aggressive play.

There appeared to be fewer stretches of KU playing sharply harder than the other team than recalled from prior Self teams.

There appeared less out-stripping opponents and exploding out of positions for blocks in excess of opponents similar efforts than recalled from prior Self teams.

What there was was 16 pop tarts, or perhaps 2 or 3 times what this team can probably afford to make to win, and roughly three times what this team should probably make, considering the slow tempo it played at.

KU has appeared to be playing like a bunch of mortals recently.

Self has appeared to be coaching like a mortal recently.

Amazing things appeared not to be happening in that building today.

Coach Self appeared to be waiting for something.

The question was: was it for later this season?

Or next season?

Either way...

Today...

They appeared expendable.

They did do their duties, except for Svi, who stunk up the floor to an astonishing degree, and the onrushing Guard U Sun Devils of Bobby "don't talk about my real estate career" Hurley overwhelmed them.

It did not turn into a death march.

But it easily could have, if Vick had not been able to play with what ever phase of a tooth absess that reputedly afflicted him.

After two straight home, or near home, losses, the Jayhawks now appear to be held up on their own private Bataan peninsula.

Reports from Washington as to whether we fans, or the team, should expect reinforcements, or just a bloody fight and then a death march the rest of the season, have not yet been decoded and distributed, at least to fans.

Thus, we fans await further orders CINCPAC Lawrence, whether we stand and fight, or melt into the jungle for a season of guerrilla warfare aimed not at winning this season, but holding out for next.

Beyond The Streak • Dec 10, 2017 07:16 AM

@Blown

Thx. I will look for the book earnestly because of the importance of its being. I am wilde about King. And I hope it is made into a film that wins a best picture Oscar for director Dorian Gray.

Does Gary Parrish have something against KU? • Dec 10, 2017 02:03 AM

@mayjay

This is what I call truthiness

Does Gary Parrish have something against KU? • Dec 10, 2017 02:02 AM

He has something against our time zone!!!

Frank Mason vs Lebron 12/6/17 • Dec 10, 2017 01:53 AM

Wait til Frank clears 10 caroms in the NBA. They haven’t seen anything yet!!!

Frank Mason vs Lebron 12/6/17 • Dec 10, 2017 01:50 AM

If LeBron were the biggest athletic freak on the planet, then Frank Mason would be the smallest athletic freak on the planet.

Biggest, or smallest, both their freakish abilities are AMAZING!!!!

Frank Mason! Hang his jersey! Hang it HIGH!!!!

SAYS COACH, of his 260 lb. newest walk-on: • Dec 09, 2017 10:06 PM

Sandwich buffer 2

SAYS COACH, of his 260 lb. newest walk-on: • Dec 09, 2017 10:06 PM

Sandwich buffer 1

SAYS COACH, of his 260 lb. newest walk-on: • Dec 09, 2017 06:24 PM

HighEliteMajor said:

(and I bet Sosinski is better at basketball than Wesley).

Howling!!!

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Vick • Dec 09, 2017 06:11 PM

Crimsonorblue22 said:

@jaybate-1.0 bet he was feeling it wed pm!

Great dot connect!

Thanks.

Vick • Dec 09, 2017 12:42 PM

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Vick • Dec 09, 2017 12:41 PM

Ahhh oooooh gah, Ahhh oooooh gah!

NOW HEAR THIS: SECURE BATTLE STATIONS!

DIRECT HIT AT 2 POSITION. MORE INCOMING FISH RANGE OH-FIVE-DOUBLE-OH

Seaman Teahan, u r starting 4 Cobra Sunday!!!

Seaman Young, prepare for 8 minutes at high post and 20 behind Teahan.

Sosinski, 10 at 5. And 10 at 2

Azuibuke, u will backup Teahan and Sosinski at 2.

Chief Quartlebaum, don a wig and pretend to be a walk-on!

Lightfoot, 5 minutes at every position.

ENGINE ROOM, GIVE US ALL YOU’VE GOT!

Captain Graham, from now on u r FULL MONTE DEVONTE!

Get Ensign Cobra to sick bay!!!

What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 09, 2017 03:48 AM

@wrwlumpy

Correct!

I gave the Huskies credit before the game and practically got hooted out of the cloud. Usually level headed board rats insisted the Huskies were terrible based on early season stat rankings (beware the smallā€nā€!) even though they were 7-2 and were coached by a new guy coaching a brand of Boeheim zone ball that requires a team to shoot significantly above 25% outside to win. Alas, we had not yet had a really bad shooting night and Devonte was coming off two 30-point games. This seemed a recipe for potential problems, if we shot poorly and Boeheim gave Hopkins a good scout, which seemed likely. I thought I was simply being prudent in my warning, but I was viewed as very unrealistically concerned.

But this is what is great about sports: chaff gets separated from wheat...if the whistles and seeding are symmetric.

What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 08, 2017 10:46 PM

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What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 08, 2017 10:45 PM

What is wrong with some of you posters that accuse other posters of quitting on the team, when no posters have done so? What makes some posters misrepresent other posters, thus creating a false issue, and then pretend like insouciant phonies to advocate what everyone already appears to think in the first place? What-what-what-what-what is wrong? What!

šŸ˜‚

What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 08, 2017 09:30 PM

@Big-Clyde52

Yep, just the regular wear and tear could be enough to sink the team without Preston and DeSousa and with an unproductive Cunliffe. Self needs a hat rabbit. Heck, at this point, he needs a hat, too.

But I just watched Jimmy Cagney, as Halsey, again in THE GALLANT HOURS to fortify myself for what looms for KU and America.

I already have seen Devonte rise to two 30-point games twice and Clay Young impossibly bridge us through Syracuse.

We are down to a situation where ordinary men are being routinely confronted by extraordinary challenges.

This team is, regrettably, in synch with our nation.

The team is a fast ship sailing into harm’s way.

I only hope our country is still fast, too.

Rock Chalk!

And god bless America!

Proposed Solution to Play/Not Play WSU DEBATE • Dec 08, 2017 09:23 PM

I would agree to a 4 year trial series of KU and Wichita State in basketball, if the non adidas portion of the apparent Petroshoeco-Agency Complex allows each school their choices of any two non adidas players in the apparent complex’s talent pool BEFORE other programs get theirs.

This would be a win-win for KU and WSU.

Four high priority dump truck players (first or second highest ranked at their positions) assigned two to each KU and WSU, BEFORE Duke, UK, UNC, etc. get to pick their dump truck players.

That ought to make everyone happy 😃.

Well, maybe not Duke, UK and UNC.

But it would create a helluva rivalry. šŸ˜

Things not looking good • Dec 08, 2017 08:58 PM

@jayballer54

PHOF

What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 08, 2017 08:49 PM

@RockkChalkk

Copy and paste

Marsha fan club • Dec 08, 2017 08:46 PM

@HighEliteMajor

I very much respect your POV. I like your spirit, believe it would be a great rivalry that would get televised, and lord knows I loath Marsha and want payback for Perry using his nose to attack the WSU player’s elbow!

But it probably wouldn’t help us recruit, and it probably would incentivize Nike to encourage Nike leans to Marsha, and it probably would trigger the Koch machine into high gear to help enable WSU’s success over KU for a variety of reasons.

I trust you find me a coward for this line of reasoning, for I do confess it tastes bad to write this point of view, and do feel a bit of one, but...

The best strategic interests of KU Basketball trumps both my burning desire to smash sign-board forehead on the wood, my desire to enjoy facilitating a potentially great rivalry, and to help a Kansas school —WSU—I’ve always been fond of.

Until the Nike issue can break in our favor, or do no harm, and until I can believe KU’s alumni can stand up to the Koch’s as peaceful countervailing forces in state and inter university politics, I vote no to playing them annually.

But damn I like to read you make the case!

What's wrong with Coach Self? • Dec 08, 2017 08:21 PM

@RockkChalkk

Behind the former #2 ranking, Bill had BIG problems. He apparently knew it, even if the fans were too euphoric to notice.

Car investigation? HUGE. Could easily wreck his great career.

One inexperienced, project type, D1-grade 5; then 1 210-pound Tulsa type backup, then nothing but a football walk on. This alone would guaranty any coach at an elite program insomnia!

No back up point guard. Insomnia.

No backup 2 guard. Insomnia.

A starting 3 combo guard transfer that isn’t scoring and won’t dish. Insomnia.

No backup 3. Insomnia.

No big 4. Insomnia.

A 3 trying to play 4 with no back up. Double Insomnia.

The above are what are wrong with Self.

If he put the spurs to this team now, one or two might just quit and he would be looking at a 10 win season at best.

It appears Self doubts this team is capable of much more than its giving him right now. Hence no spurs.

He also had to not let the no amp, 25% shooting might interfere with the planned amp for the second game of the 2 in 4 set. Getting a split was what mattered most. He may chew on them during the next game.

But my hunch is he will not get fiery with the team til after January 1, when he knows who will be on the roster.

Marsha fan club • Dec 08, 2017 07:34 PM

(SEE COMMENTS BRACKETED IN CAPS)

kjayhawks said:

@drgnslayr Highly unlikely it would be that big of a deal nationally for us to play WSU. Their media market is microscopic compared to most. I seldom see WSU gear outside of Wichita, I’ve seen KU fans in several different states. KU is in the top 25 most years of merchandise sales, never seen WSU in the top 50. The god honest truth is WSU just plays harder than we do night in and out. We don’t play with a chip on our shoulders, we are already a big deal. Look as Wednesday as a prime example, Self even said himself they played harder and out hustled us. When we lose in Manhattan it’s because they play harder, they ain’t as talented as us they just care more. To be honest it drives me nuts when I see our guys lazily play. The trouble is that they are good enough to play shitty and win half of their games. @jaybate-1-0 If Nike was that important to be successful im CBB we would be Nike still, trust me. [ALAS, YOUR REASONING APPEARS TOO SPECIOUS FOR CREDULOUS TRUST. FORGIVE ME. NOW, TO MASTER THE OBVIOUS, NIKE’S SUMMER GAME PROGRAM APPEARS A SHARPLY MORE INFLUENTIAL DRIVER OF WHO GETS TOP TALENT THAN ADIDAS’. IF YOU ARE STILL LABORING UNDER THE QUAINT NOTION THE APPARENT PETROSHOECO-AGENCY HAS NOT APPEARED TO ASYMMETRICALLY IMPACT RECRUIT DISTRIBUTION, THEN I HAVE A FLOOD DAMAGED BERTRAM 28 TO SELL YOU FOR BLUE BOOK!!! I AM FRANKLY ASTONISHED AT YOUR OPINION GIVEN RECENT KU ROSTERS IN COMPARISON TO OTHER ELITE PROGRAMS. IT SEEMS ONE OF THE MORE STARK LOGICAL DISCONNECTS I HAVE READ RECENTLY.] We were NIke for Roy’s time and didn’t have the success we’ve had under Adidas and Self. [THAT APPEARS TO BE SOME TOWERINGLY MISLEADING OVERSIMPLIFICATION THERE. DIDNT ROY REPUTEDLY ADMIT TO SPLITTING THE COUNTRY WITH DEAN AT THE MISSISSIPPI, WHICH BY THE WAY APPARENTLY GAVE DEAN THE BIGGER POPULATION HALF (THX JERRY REED). WHY SHOULD ONE EXPECT ROY RECRUITING THE LESSER HALF TO HAVE BEEN MORE SUCCESSFUL THE BILL RECRUITING ALL BEFORE THE APPARENT ASYMMETRY IN THE PETROSHOECO-AGENCY COMPLEX APPEARED TO GROW MORE ACUTE? NEXT: NOTE THE OFT OVERLOOKED IMPLICATION FROM BACK IN THE 20TH CENTURY-THAT THEY HAD SOMETHING TO SPLIT! WHAT WAS IT? YOUR COMMENT PERHAPS UNWITTINGLY REVEALS WHAT IT MIGHT HAVE BEEN. NIKE SPONSORED SUMMER GAME PLAYERS MAYBE? MAYBE A FEEDER SYSTEM SONNY, DEAN, LARRY AND ROY WERE INVOLVED IN THE EARLY DEVELOPMENT OF? MAYBE? BUT WHO KNOWS? I DONT KNOW. WHAT DO YOU THINK? NUDGE, NUDGE, WINK, WINK. REGARDLESS, KU APPARENTLY ALIGNING BACK IN THE 20TH CENTURY WITH NIKE, SONNY, DEAN, LARRY/WWW, AND ROY SEEMED TO COINCIDE WITH KU BEING PUT BACK ON THE NATIONAL MAP, DIDNT IT? AND THE JUMP TO ADIDAS SURE UPPED THE CASH TAKE-IN AND REPUTEDLY ALLOWED BILL TO RECRUIT THE WHOLE COUNTRY, AFTER THE REPUTED 50/50 YEARS OF NIKE-ROY. BUT THEN AFTER AN EARLY RUSH OF SOME GLOSSY ADIDAS LEAN OADS, THE ADIDAS YIELD HAS PLATEAUED, SEEMINGLY DECLINED AND THE NON-ADIDAS LEANS SELF USED TO SIGN SO MANY OF HAS CONSPICUOUSLY DWINDLED TO THE POINT THAT THIS SEASON’S ROSTER CAN BEST BE CALLED A FIVE MAN SQUAD OF MAJOR GRADE RECRUITS PLUS TWO GUYS LIKE SELF USED TO RECRUIT AT TULSA (TO BORROW BILL’S WORDS). 5 GUYS? PLUS SOME MARGINALIA? HEY! NOTHING TO SEE HERE! AND THE PETROSHOECO-AGENCY COMPLEX DENIERS SAY SOMETHING LIKE: LOOK AT HOW MANY TRANSFERS WE HAVE LINED UP FOR NEXT YEAR! AND FURTHER THEY SAY LOOK AT THE TWO 5 STAR POINT GUARDS SIGNED TOO. YOO-HOOO! TO WHICH I ASK QUITE REASONABLY HOW MANY MALIK NEWMANS AND BILLY PRESTONS AND DIALLOS AND ALEXANDERS WILL THERE BE NEXT SEASON? AND WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME UK, DUKE, UNC, MSU, OR EVEN FLIPPING IOWA STATE HAD TO GIVE WALK-ONS ROTATION MINUTES AND ADD FOOTBALL PLAYERS TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A THREE-BIG ROTATION? NOTHING TO SEE HERE! NEXT! ] Doubt Nike cares about the Midwest as much as you think they do. [BET NIKE CARES MORE ABOUT THE MIDWEST THAN YOU AND I THINK THEY DO. WHY ELSE WOULD THEY SPONSOR TEXAS AND OU AND OSU AND KSU? ARE YOU SPONSORING THOSE SCHOOLS FOR ANYTHING? IM NOT! BUT NIKE IS. THEY APPEAR TO THINK ABOUT THEM APPROXIMATELY THE AMOUNT IT APPEARS TO ME THEY THINK ABOUT THEM, RATHER THAN THE AMOUNT IT APPEARS TO YOU THEY THINK ABOUT THEM! HOWLING!!! AND WOULD YOU BET NIKE WOULD RATHER HAVE KU UNDER CONTRACT IN BASKETBALL THAN KSU, OU AND OSU? I WOULD?] The rest of the nation really doesn’t care about Kansas in anything. [BUT ADIDAS SURE CARES ABOUT KANSAS, DONT THEY? I WONDER WHY?] WSU is a tiny tiny media market team [AGREED] highly doubt Nike puts all their resources to work for WSU. [FIRST, NO LARGE CORPORATION EVER PUTS ALL THEIR RESOURCES TO WORK ON ANYTHING. SECOND, THERE WOULD BE LITTLE INCENTIVE TO PUT MORE RESOURCES INTO WSU, UNLESS KU WERE TO AGREE TO START PLAYING THEM ANNUALLY, RIGHT? THEN IT WOULD PROBABLY BE STUPID NOT TO ROUTE A FEW MORE DUMP TRUCKS TO WSU, AND BEAT KU AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE. AN INTERESTING STRATEGY BUILD WOULD BE TO BUILD UP TEXAS, OU AND WSU, SO THEY CAN ROUTINELY BEAT KU, AND THEN THEY COULD BE RID OF ADIDAS-KU AND OPEN UP MORE REGULAR AND POST SEASON TELEVISION SLOTS FOR TEAMS BEARING THEIR BRAND. THAT WAS EASY.]Not to mention they don’t have the big money maker in football. [GEE, I CANT IMAGINE WHY KU IS HAVING SO MUCH TROUBLE RECRUITING FOOTBALL PLAYERS THESE DAYS, CAN YOU? HOWLING! KU HAS OVER ITS LONG FOOTBALL HISTORY BEEN ABLE TO AVOID BEING THIS ROTTEN FOR OVER A CENTURY IMHO. EVEN IN THE BAD OLD DAYS PRE-MANGINO, KU COULD SIGN A GALE SAYERS OR JOHN HADL, OR A JOHN RIGGINS, OR A DAVID JAYNES. NOW LOOK AT KU
RECENTLY. UGH! DONT YOU EVER MASTER THE OBVIOUS AND NOTICE THE CONSPICUOUS CORRELATION BETWEEN KU BASKETBALL’S DWINDLING ABILITY TO SIGN ENOUGH D1 GRADE PLAYERS AND KU FOOTBALL’S NEAR COMPLETE FAILURE TO RECRUIT ENOUGH D1 GRADE FOOTBALL PLAYERS? DO YOU REALLY JUST VIEW IT AS A FANTASTIC STATISTICALLY IMPROBABLE COINCIDENCE? I AT LEAST WONDER ABOUT THIS STRIKING ANOMALY. ]

Marsha fan club • Dec 08, 2017 04:08 AM

HighEliteMajor said:

I still cannot imagine anyone who would suggest we shouldn't play WSU each season. All of the financial stuff is baloney. We know that. They have a better program that all of our non-con opponents except for UK and Syracuse.

Are we scared?

Alright. When you put it that way—PLAY’EM!

No, wait!

Let me hypothesize why I believe Self and KU wisely opt not to play WSU.

  1. They are not adidas contracted. They are Nike.

  2. The Koch’s have epically deep pockets and can and probably would afford any amount of money to win such a series consistently.

  3. Nike probably would encourage and enable the Koch’s to spend the money necessary to beat KU.

Once KU agrees to an extended series, WSU will eventually consistently beat KU, until KU rolls over and becomes Koch U itself.

Nike and the Koch’s are too powerful of opponents for KU right now. TOO POWERFUL!

Sad, but true.

This would never be about basketball. It would be about expanding control of the North American center point that is the state of Kansas.

The Koch’s are sometimes even too powerful for the Bush-Clinton syndicate. They only back down to the Rockefellers these days and even then not deferentially. They can make one of their guys D-CIA, maybe bump Tillerson aside and he is flipping EXXON. The Koch’s are not for KU to get in a competition with. The Koch’s are connected to Thyssien Krupp. Don’t even peek down that rabbit hole.

You don’t run your Bentley headlong into an on coming diesel electric locomotive with 200 cars behind it full of coal from Wyoming and bitumen slurry from Canada just because the engineer taunts you to do it.

Trust me guys. Let sleeping dogs lie on this one.

The Koch’s appear happily busy and engaged with trying to simultaneously ramp up energy production in North America and making a play for the Traneurasian super corridors.

What Earthscope is learning right now about the crust and upper mantle of North America is likely going to completely change the energy game and power balance in the world for another century again. Mega stakes.

Wish them well and keep KU on its present course, while angling for a better recruiting situation.

Rock Chalk!

Frank Mason vs Lebron 12/6/17 • Dec 08, 2017 03:31 AM

@Lulufulu

I just knew he could do the NBA!!!!!

But I’ve been wrong about some other KU guys being able to make it.

Thx for relaying this. You made my day!!

I am so excited for Frank!

@drgnslayr

For anyone new to the community, the above is absolutely USDA PRIME CUT SLAYR!!!!!

PHOF!

ā€œSoft - We played like a roll of Charmin.ā€

OMG! Best line of the season so far!!!!

And you WOKE me with that insight about Svi vs zones. I hadn’t seen it tell you said it straight! I’ve never seen an outside shooter with more trouble against zones than man2man, but this is him to a T!!!!!

So what is this about with Svi?

School me. This is something I haven’t seen before. But u r absolutely right on.

@HawkChamp

I consider my game observations as reliable primary, if anecdotally collected evidence. I am old school. I am sceptical of QA, because I was trained in QA and learned how few persons know their butts from first base regarding assumptions, methodologies, sampling techniques, and so on. I am also skeptical of coaches and public figures being truthful, when being so does not serve their purposes to be truthful.

You are an odd duck. You ā€œbelieveā€ in tightness, but not in primary observation. I prefer primary observation and inference to belief, for analytics.

You also over-use the sarcasm font a little, but that’s ok.

One more thing: I’m just trying to understand KU basketball through interactive discourse and shared insights. You are wasting your time and mine trying to win this discussion. You can’t beat me, or win, because I’m not playing a competitive game with you.

Relax and enjoy the medium.

If I’m not helping you understand more, don’t waste your time with me. Find someone else that you can learn something from.

Rest assured that I will tend to be relying heavily on my primary observations and those of others in exploring issues of KU hoops and seeking to square them with QA when possible. I will waste little time worrying about beliefs and depending on coaches press quotes (or lack the rod) about issues they would be foolish to be candid about.

Rock Chalk!

@HawkChamp

No, and that’s normal, since Self has a long history of non reporting and under reporting injuries.

You recall the term ā€œnicked upā€ right? šŸ˜€

HighEliteMajor said:

@jaybate-1-0 What were our injuries vs. Oregon?

By the way, I love the Newman/Svi stuff. It is this little thread in the sweater that is getting pulled, but we don't really know what if anything will happen, or if it is nothing at all.

I recall Frank was injured against Oregon, or was it Devonte?

And when KU lost to WSU Perry was flat out koo-koo for half the game or more.

And against Stanford Embiid was just out.

And so on.

Re: Newman/Svi it will be interesting to watch for sure. Those Marcus Garrett minutes add to the drama. Self wanted more production from Malik, but he may also have beeen watching to see if Svi were being rejected more broadly than just what appeared to be Malik’s tude.

@HawkChamp

You imply you read my mind, but you are wrong so often about what I think it appears you can’t. You have to be right more often than randomly for me to take u seriously. Don’t you want me to take you even a little seriously?

Of course we appeared to have injuries against Oregon that hampered our ability to win the game. Do you seriously doubt that? Incredible.

Injuries are part of the game. You have to play through them, but they significantly influence outcomes of any game I’ve ever played in or watched.

You believe in some kind of decisive voodoo of tightness, but not in sprained ankles, or blisters, or stress reactions, or shin splints, broken fingers, or hyper extensions, or flu, etc. INCREDIBLE.

Hey, excuses aren’t real. Tightness might be an excuse. A bone spur really limits one’s ability to jump shoot accurately.

Before my twisted ankle, I could jump high enough to avoid getting blocked, but after I’ve not been able to get my shots off for 10 games in a row against defenders that were shorter and less springy than those I faced when I didn’t have a sprain. Your inference? I’m tight!!!

Howling!

@HawkChamp

A guy scores 30 points twice in a row and barely shows up offensively against an unranked major and you don't suspect injury? Incredible.

Malik can't jump two inches off the floor and you don't suspect injury? Incredible.

Good lord!

Any guy out there that suddenly dons lingerie on the legs, or the elbow, likely is hurting like a sonnuvabitch and isn't going to shoot the ball nearly as well. Shooting requires follow through. Have you tried to follow through with a hyper extended elbow? Shooting requires being able to set your feet from a dead run and explode up 30 to 40 inches. A guy comes out so gimpy he has to wear more lingerie than he's been wearing for awhile, and you doubt this sort of injury could cramp his performance? Incredible.

Injury is a part of the game. All of these guys are getting injured all the time. Self expects them all to play through. But he apparently grasps that guys playing through don't maintain optimal effectiveness.

Holy cow, were you one of those persons that thought players shouldn't be given water, because it toughened them up to play without it? Incredible.

Sports is about making human bodies and minds perform skilled activities at high levels of effectiveness. Even minor injuries dampen effectiveness. And athletes learn quickly to mask injury as much as possible to keep the opponent from trying to exploit it. But while you can try not to limp, you can't pretend to be able to plant your feet and be explosive as one is when uninjured.

Next.

et al,

I have been doing a lot of analysis above. It probably gives the impression that I am in grave doubt about the future of the team. I am NOT yet in grave doubt.

  1. I think Malik can find his way, but it may take till February.

  2. I think Malik and Svi can come together.

  3. I do not think Devonte's injury is likely to last long.

  4. I think Udoka is developing and by February could be a very good center.

  5. Svi will get untracked.

  6. Lightfoot made some progress last night that did not show up in his line score.

  7. Marcus Garrett made some progress that showed up in his line score even though it did not look impressive.

  8. Vick is still doing a lot of marvelous things, and it is no knock on him that he has more to learn. Many talk about wanting to give guys PT to develop them. Well, that sure as hell is going on with Vick. If he keeps learning a piece of the game each game or two, by February, he is going to be a monster. And we really haven't seen him open up form outside the way I believe he can.

  9. Sosinski's appeared to have suited up for the game, and that is a big step. I was dreaming to hope Self would put him in. We may not even see Sosinski until after "the week of getting" better at semester break. Sosinski's role, if any, will be during the 2 in 3 sets during conference season. The important thing is that he is another piece in position.

  10. Preston is the big "IF" that has to be resolved for this team to really move ahead. The coaches cannot really commit to any strategic direction until they know when and how much, if any, Preston will play.

11.De Sousa improving on entrance exams appears a long shot, but it all depends on whether he has taken prep courses for the exams or not. If he can take a prep course for the exam, it could bump his score. But if he has already taken a prep course, and it didn't bump his exam score enough, well, it will likely take a year of school filling holes in his academic abilities to improve it.

The team was very highly rated. It lost a game to a major on an off shooting night. That has happened quite a few times during Self's tenure. The only thing I'm really worried about is the way the team seemed to give up late in the game. Everything else can be fixed with work and a little luck. But teams either have heart, or they don't. Hope we don't see any more of that demoralization, even if we lose several straight.

Get after them, team. You guys are still very talented and just have to find out how to play together more effectively. Rock Chalk!

@approxinfinity

Yours and HEM's were the most informative posts for me to read today, so far. Thx.

I don't think Self viewed this as a game he was willing to lose going in. I think the way the game unfolded with KU shooting 25%, Self just did not appear to have a lot of moves up his sleeve he could make, since he had probably focused most preparation on the opponent after Washington. Let me clarify. He could have made the moves, but I don't think his team would have been able to execute them. He always knows the 1000 page play book.The question always is how many pages of it has a team mastered. This team is pretty raw and its usually good shooting makes us tend to overlook that.

Self appeared to make a choice at a certain point. He decided that there were too many things wrong to fix them all and get a win, so he decided to try to snap Malik out of whatever kind of issues he is dealing with in hopes of getting him clicking for the next game. So: he sat him and gave his minutes at shooting forward to a guy that can't shoot. Subtle message to Malik. :-)

Self's expressions and body language appeared to indicate he is truly concerned both about where the team is and where it can reasonably go. A long season exposes all the flaws of any team. This team totally lacks a big 4 man. It lacks a credible back up at the 5. With Svi having to play the short 4, it frankly has little depth on the perimeter. With Malik unable to perform efficiently so far, it has insufficient depth on the perimeter. With Marcus Garrett unable to drain the trey, he is not an effective substitute to a team that is trying to be a perimeter scoring team and that has so little depth inside that it cannot really seriously try to score inside until the last ten minutes of the game, because it has to protect Azuibuke, its only credible big, from fouls.

Self is in the worst position he has ever been in at KU, regardless of the rankings, and regardless of the good outside shooting.

And on top of everything else, there is a big cloud hanging over the team, and perhaps the coaching staff, because of an investigation in to Preston for a car that seemingly would be over one way, or the other, by now, if the investigation were not leading into more problems.

Self did not look like himself last night. I am not talking about how he coached. He just did not look as healthy as usual, and yet I saw no signs of sickness. He looked uneasy and like he was not sure what the heck to do next--not because he didn't know his stuff, but because he didn't have enough options. This is strange for the man who has always seen the next doorway that no one else did. Last night, Self looked like a man who had looked for the next doorway and didn't find it and frankly doubted that he would. Most unlike him.

Something seems to be weighing heavily on him. His best post recruit in some times is under investigation for a car. I reckon they weigh down a coach's mood after it had dragged on awhile.

Hope I'm wrong.

But that's how it looked to lil ole me.

SEE COMMENTS IN CAPS BRACKETED.

HighEliteMajor said:

@jaybate-1-0 Nice post.[BACK AT YOU.] I'll fixate on one item. Wouldn't we always win if we shot better? [IT HELPS FOR SURE, BUT SOME NIGHTS WE SHOOT WELL AND STILL GET BEATEN BY SOMEONE THAT SHOOTS BETTER, AND SOME NIGHTS WE SHOOT SO-S0 AND STILL GET A WIN BY DOING OTHER THINGS MUCH BETTER THAN THE OPPONENT. SO: I AGREE THAT ONE SHOULD NEVER BE REDUCTIVE AND IGNORE WHEN THERE ARE MORE DECISIVE FACTORS, BUT AT THE SAME TIME ONE SHOULD NOT BE DOCTRINAIRE AND SAY SHOOTING IS NEVER A VARIABLE TO ISOLATE AS THE PRIMARY CAUSE, OR NOT THE PRIMARY CAUSE.]I'm not a big believer in analyzing wins based largely on shooting, because there are many variables, including the defense played by the opponent. Blaming shooting is the easy way out. It removes any accountability. Good teams overcome aspects of the game that are not optimal by adjusting and overwhelming. Particularly against average opponents. Good teams, as Self has preached, can fall back on their defense, as well.

Lots of things last night.

The item that stuck out to me most was the disappearance of Devonte Graham. This was a game crying for those 12 assists. [YES, AND THERE ARE MANY WAYS TO TRY TO EXPLAIN GRAHAM'S DISAPPEARANCE. I AM ALWAYS PRONE TO CONSIDERING INJURY WHEN I SEE GUYS TWEAK SOMETHING SUBSTANTIALLY IN A PRIOR GAME AND THEN SEE THEM DISAPPEAR. INJURY IS NOT THE ONLY REASON. IT IS IN THIS CASE ONE OF THEM. ANOTHER REASON IS DEVONTE WAS FIGHTING THE LAW OF AVERAGES AND AFTER TWO 30 POINT, NEAR FULL MONTY 40 MINUTE PERFORMANCES WHERE HE DID EVERYTHING BUT REFINISH THE WOOD FLOOR, HE HAD A LET DOWN. DEVONTE HAS ALWAYS BEEN A MORE EMOTIONAL PLAYER WITH PEAKS AND VALLEYS THAN SAY SOMEONE LIKE FRANK MASON. THE PEAKS ARE PART OF WHAT MAKE HIM SO SPECIAL. THE VALLEYS ARE WHAT MAKE HIM THE KIND OF PLAYER YOU HAVE TO HAVE PLAN B PLAYERS TO TAKE UP THE SLACK FOR HIM. BUT THERE IS ANOTHER POSSIBLE DRIVE THAT I HAD NOT CONSIDERED. I AGREE THAT A TOP PG SHOULD DISH ASSISTS, WHEN HE CANNOT MAKE BUCKETS AND DEVONTE DIDN'T COMPENSATE A LOT THAT WAY. BUT WHAT IF IT WAS KIND OF AN ACCOUNTING PROBLEM? WHAT IF DEVONTE WAS MAKING THE RIGHT PASSES THAT JUST WEREN'T GETTING CREDITED WITH ASSISTS, AS PERHAPS THEY DESERVED TO BE. WHEN DEVONTE PASSED IT TO VICK, AND VICK TURNED AND DROVE IT FOR A FLOATER FROM 8 FEET, DID DEVONTE GET THE ASSIST HE EFFECTIVELY DESERVED? MAYBE HE WASN'T BEING CREDITED WITH THOSE DRIVES BY VICK, BUT I FELT THAT HE WAS GETTING THE BALL TO VICK AT THE RIGHT PLACE AND GETTING AN "EFFECTIVE ASSIST" JUST THE SAME.]

Second most on the "stick out" scale was, again, the utter lack of production from Malik Newman. I'm struggling with even saying he's a good player. Newman's PER is now at 16.4, lowest of the 7 regulars. Last night was just really concerning to me watching Newman. It's too early to panic. But it's a negative trend worth watching. [SEE ANOTHER POST OF MINE TODAY ABOUT MALIK AND SVI. I AM VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THEM BOTH. I MAY BE COMPLETELY MISPERCEIVING THINGS, BUT FROM A FAN'S REMOTE PERSPECTIVE, IT JUST LOOKS LIKE THEY ARE NOT PLAYING WELL TOGETHER. I HAVE NOT FOCUSED AS MUCH ON MALIK'S INTERPLAY WITH DEVONTE AND VICK, SO I CANNOT SAY MALIK IS STRUGGLING WITH EVERYONE, BUT SOMETHING JUST DOES NOT FEEL RIGHT BETWEEN MALIK AND SVI. I ALSO NOTICED THAT MALIK WAS JUST NOT CLEARING THE FLOOR MUCH AT ALL VERSUS WASHINGTON. I HAVEN'T NOTICED HIM TAKING ON SO LITTLE AIR PREVIOUSLY, SO MAY BE HE HAD A LITTLE LEG INJURY, OR SOMETHING VS. THE HUSKIES. WHATEVER, I AM GLAD YOU POSTED THAT P.E.R., SO THAT HIS PROBLEMS HAVE SOME QUANTIFICATION OF THEIR DEGREE. IF NEWMAN TURNS INTO A FAILED TRANSFER, THIS KU TEAM IS FACING A PERFECT STORM. IF NEWMAN IS JUST ANOTHER D1 PLAYER AND NOT SOMETHING SPECIAL, THEN THE APPARENT EMBARGO HAS FINALLY WON THIS SEASON. I AM STILL HOLDING OUT HOPE FOR MALIK. I BELIEVE HE IS STILL TRYING TO FIND A WAY TO FIT IN TO THIS TEAM THAT IS NOT CONSTRAINED BY THE IDEA THAT HE HAS TO BE THE NUMBER TWO OR THREE SCORER EACH NIGHT TO BE HAPPY. HE HAS TO PLAY WELL, REGARDLESS OF HOW MUCH HE SCORES. HE HAS TO BE EFFICIENT OFFENSIVELY AND GUARD AND STRIP AND REBOUND AS WELL AS SCORE. I BELIEVE HE WILL DO ALL OF THESE THINGS EVENTUALLY, BUT HE FIRST HAS TO FIND HAPPINESS IN BEING A GREAT TEAMMATE, BECAUSE THAT IS THE ONLY WAY TO SURVIVE UNDER SELF.

Games Tonight (Dec 5) • Dec 07, 2017 08:05 PM

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Games Tonight (Dec 5) • Dec 07, 2017 08:03 PM

@HawkChamp

Nope. You get on it. You will grow by doing so.

Buffer 1

@Lulufulu

(Note: later in this post I go into speculative psychology and team chemistry mode. If you don't like that sort of speculation, don't even bother to read and respond to this post, because you will just be making it more likely to be found in a search. This is all about the touchy feely, alchemical side of sport, about fitting round pegs with square pegs and not driving either of them into holes that don't fit them, but some how gluing them together into components of a team that work well together. It is about art, not science, or engineering. It is about finding what makes teams come together and about stopping what blows them apart.)

Let's put it this way. This game against the Huskies was the front end of a 2 in 4 and going in appeared to be much the weaker opponent to many board rats here (excluding me). Assuming Self viewed it the same way several board rats here did, then given Self's historical tendency to send the team out flat for the lesser opponent and save the amp and the most strategic preparation for the better opponent in such two game sets, it would appear almost a certainty that he sent them out flat, but not necessarily unprepared, for Washington.

My guess is that his thinking went like this: we prepared extensively for Syracuse and what we did worked exceptionally well against Syracuse. Washington is coached by Boeheim's long time assistant, Hopkins, and in his first season as Washington Husky HC, our game tapes indicate he is running essentially the same defense and offense this season at Washington that Syracuse has run that we prepared extensively for. Therefore, Self apparently reasoned, Washington is so-so on talent, and so we can focus our preparations for the second opponent of the two game series and rely on our Syracuse preparation for Washington. We will just supply the players scouts on player tendencies and not waste a lot of practice time on new strategy and wrinkles for the Husky's.

Self probably guessed that Boeheim would provide Hopkins a detailed scout of KU, but figured that given the Husky's so-so talent, KU could probably make half time adjustments to whatever new and effective wrinkles the Husky's showed on their offense the first half, and that they would likely stick to their 2-3 regardless. Further, Self probably figured that the Husky's best scorer, David Crisp, was someone that Devonte was ideally suited to defend effectively. In turn, Self was also likely anticipating Devonte to have an off-shooting game after 2 30 point outings. Self probably also had insider knowledge of Devonte's progress on the injury tweak of Devonte during the Syracuse game. As a result, Self apparently decided to route the scoring through LaCobra to the tune of 20+FGAs, so Devonte could focus himself on guarding Crisp and not have to try to score much with whatever kind of injury he may have had. So: Self reasoned, if Devonte focuses on guarding Crisp, and LaCobra just wears them out inside, either Malik, or Svi, surely will be ready for a break out game, and KU would be able to handle whatever problems the Husky's posed because of Boeheim's scout passed to Hopkins.

But the best laid plans of mice and Hall of Famers can go astray. Some of what Self anticipated, went pretty much as anticipated. Devonte was 1 of 8 from the field, so holding his FGAs down was smart. Devonte could not lock down Crisp, but he did contain him pretty well. And LaCobra was just endlessly able to get open and make 2 pointers about 50% of the time, which is really pretty darned good considering he was 6-4 and having to shoot 8-10 footers over and around true bigs. LaCobra really did his job superbly the first half, and even the first 5 minutes or so of the second half. But then his legs got a little wobbly and he was missing a few of those 8-10 footers. Of course he would not still have been having to try to take and make those shots, if either Malik had had his head in the game, or Svi had not been cold as ice. Malik and Svi frankly stunk up the floor against the Husky's. Had either guy produced decently, LaCobra either would have been getting wide open looks he could take all the way to the iron, or he would not have had to be shootings as much as he did. But Malik and Svi just stank.

Worst of all, though, was that Malik's and Svi's barely betrayed chemistry problems in the Syracuse game emerged as stark lack of being able to collaborate with each other. It was embarrassing to watch. What I noted as a hunch vs. Syracuse appeared actually worse than I thought vs. Washington. For the head in the sand types, let me try to put this into phrasing that will let them deal with this constructively, rather than in reactionary mode. Let's forget about whether Malik and Svi like each other, hate each other, or are indifferent to each other. Whatever their feelings about each other, they play like shit together. They don't appear to communicate well with each other. They don't appear to help each other. Svi feeds Malik, but Malik doesn't say thank you. Malik would apparently rather make one of the stupidest charges on a drive I have ever seen, rather than make an obvious short dish to a WIDE OPEN Svi ready for an easy layup.

Now, again, let us leave aside entirely whether these guys like each other, or not, because some dry-washers here are worried about what some one else might find in an internet search. What is indisputable at this point of the season is that these guys do NOT play well together, do not do most of the things that teammates do for each other, and the team's effectiveness is significantly diminished by it. On a night like the Syracuse game, where everyone but Malik is playing pretty well and Devonte is having a career night, and Syracuse was shooting and playing poorly, this poor interplay between Malik and Svi did not trigger an L. But on a night where KU is not amped up, Devonte is sputtering offensively, KU is shooting poorly, and the opponent is having a good night, well, then because these two guys cannot play together worth a shit (regardless of how they "feel" about each other), then KU basically gets humiliated and, worst of all, basically rolls over and quits the last 3-5 minutes of a loss.

I am harping on Malik and Svi, because it is OBVIOUS (to me at least) that their inability to play effectively TOGETHER is undermining the hell out of team effectiveness against decent competition. Neither guy is really dogging it individually. They are both working up a sweat. They are both doing a few good things individually, and making a few good plays with other teammates, but there are only 5 KU players on the floor at a time and they tend to be two of them. That is 2/5s of the team!!!! And Malik was supposed to be this terrific talent that was going to be a key impact player, while Svi was supposed to finally become the impact player he seemed on the verge of being last season. This is one of those times, when someone like Tyshawn, or TRob, or Marcus Morris, or Sherron Collins, or Frank Mason, or Mario Chalmers, or Wayne Simien, or Cole Aldrich--SOME really strong personality on the team would take these two guys somewhere for beers and burgers, and lay down the law to them--shake them the hell awake and, if that did not work, would call a team meeting and make clear that KU basketball players play like Boot Camp graduates that walk the talk of Sempre Fi, when the going gets tough, or they are gone.

Right now Malik and Svi appear to me to be standing between this team even having a chance to solve its truly long term critical problem of what to do about the power outage in the paint.

If Malik and Svi cannot square this away and quick, then it is not going to matter if Preston comes back, or Sosinski gets comfortable and fits in, or that DeSousa figures out how to raise his entrance exam scores and brings a big body for backing up Azuibuke. At this point it won't even matter if Mitch Lightfoot continues to develop some and were to become an adequate post back up, which there remains a slim chance of him doing. The guy showed some positives in this game, against some decent, not good, competition, despite not really being productive still.

Marcus Garrett? I have never seen a guy look so hapless and still produce some line score impact. So: looks can be deceiving. Garrett replaced the sulking Malik the second half, who clearly wanted to be chosen to play the role Vick played and get the FGAs that were assigned to Vick. Let's put it this way. Not only can Malik not play effectively with Svi, but he went into a childlike funk about not getting the role that LaCobra got. He sulked so much that he could not help guard Matisse whatever his name was, and stop him from sinking KU, and he could not make shots until it the game was out of reach at the end.

I know. I know. I am really getting down on Malik. But he appears deserving. All the troubles he is apparently causing are unnecessary. They are things he could simply snap his fingers, change his mind, and they would disappear. We are not talking about a shooting slump, or an injury, or being asked too play out of position, at least I don't think he's injured. If he were injured, it must really be a bad one, because it is screwing with his floor game, and his defense and his helping in a big, BIG way. Self has never put a guy like this in a starting lineup before during his tenure at KU. He has never put up with a guy like this. He sent Malik a big memo in the form sashimi Marcus Garrett the second half; that's for sure. The old Bill Self, the Bill Self that used to be able to get enough scholarship athletes before the apparent embargo, not to have to put up with these kinds of horse manure head issues, for more than a few minutes of a game (and run them after a season), THAT Bill Self surfaced during half the second. That Bill Self indicated that he would rather watch Marcus Garrett, a guy that couldn't make trey if his life depended on it, play shooting forward than the GREAT MALIK NEWMAN. Talk about swinging a baseball bat at a clueless player to try to get him to come outside of his inner world!!!! Self apparently ate an L to try to "woke" Malik.

But I am going to cut Malik just a little slack here. I am going to mention that he can't clear the floor more than a couple inches right now. I never watched feeds of him during his illustrious season at Mississippi State. I don't recall if he could ever get up or not. But in the Washington game, I could have filled up the space between Malik's tennis shoes and the shellac on most of his shots and lay ups and attempts to get a hand in someone's face with, oh, let me think, uh, yes, with a fingernail file laid flat! Where did this guys springs go? Shit, I can still jump higher than that and I'm having trouble going up and down stairs now.

But I am not letting Svi out of this mess without some blame either. Svi is along with Devonte the old man of this team. Svi is a worldly man. Svi is from a war torn country where people's lives are in peril most every day--a place where bad persons on all sides have been given budgets to destabilize the hell out of Eurasia's version of Kansas--the bread basket of Eurasia. Svi knows how tough the world is and how much allies have to lend a helping hand to those in need. Svi knows, or should know, that you don't always get to pick and choose who you work with. Some times the enemy of my enemy HAS to be made my friend. And that there are young men developing awkwardly that need an older brother's steadying guidance and that being an older brother is often a thankless task (Just ask mine). Svi has some growing up he has to do to be that older brother. He has some manning up he has to do. He has to figure out a way to make it work with Malik, until Self can figure out how to re-wire Malik, or cryo-ice him in a season, when that might mean rotating Marcus Garret and Clay Young. OMG!!!!!! Svi, baby, you've gotta become a major big brother to Malik. Devonte is apparently trying to be his friend and apparently its not really addressing the problem. Someone has to take him under this wing knowing full well that he might (prolly will) fight it every step of the way. Svi, man, you just cannot do that cold Ukainian look over the shoulder thing with this apparently emotional and presently frustrated little brother. You've got to get past your differences and find the magic button in Malik that even the master himself, Bill Self cannot find yet. Svi, this is on you, because life isn't fair and you are the senior that learned how to fit in last season and so know what it takes to fit in. If not you, then who? LaCobra? That guy appears to be using all his CPU just trying to stay not TOO weird and trying not to crack from Self basically telling him he has to do everything on the team EXCEPT point guard, whenever Self gets a wild notion that something else might work. LaCobra is maxed out, Svi. LaCobra is running with a full current load in his copper cable. Devonte? Devonte is busy playing 40 and trying to run a team that is literally a bunch of unconnected nodes right now, and being told by Self to go out and score 30 points a game until Self can figure out how to wire the nodes together. No, I don't think Devonte is quite the cat for the job. And speaking as a one time unreachable, myself, there is no assistant coach on the face of the earth that will ever reach Malik. Not. Going. To. Hap.

I know Malik is not new to the team. Been around one season waiting to get eligible. I get the impression that the guys on the team know that he can ball. I suspect he even has some good friends not he team already, but that they are not the big brother types--the older guys--the guys that he doesn't necessarily impress with his trey gun. Someone like you. Someone that is just as competitive as he is.

We need you two to be trying to beat other teams and not beat each other. Now, its true that if this goes on it will eventually end in one or the other of you winning and the other basically being useless to the team. The trouble with that is that this team is so short handed that it needs both of you, not just one of you. Hence, the old coaching reliable of pitting guys against each other and letting one beat the other doesn't solve this team's problem. The only solution here is BOTH you guys becoming good and for that to happen both of you have to become the best, most helpful teammates that ever lived to love another teammate.

Malik appears to need a big brother. Malik may even need a friend more than a big brother. You may need one or the other two, but you are older, and have been around longer, so I'm casting you in the big brother role. I can't be sure about this, of course. I 'm speccing from outside in. But its apparent even to a layman like me that you guys are not exactly carbon cultural copies that are the most likely candidates for bosom buddy pals, but....drum roll please...that's what has to happen for this team to succeed. This is what many players before you at KU have had to do, maybe not in this short-handed a circumstance, but Self's teams are nothing if not cornerstoned on helping teammates, on making things better for them, on loving them and getting loved back. It is the real secret of the 13 titles. You have to reach down to the deepest level inside yourself and find the common ground between a kid from Ukraine and a kid from somewhere USA and you have to make Malik feel like not just somebody likes, but YOU like him. Malik appears like Sally Fields before she won her Oscar for Norma Rae. Gifted, but professionally insecure. Malik isn't playing like a guy that feels like someone really likes him; that his teammates really want to hang with him and trust him to make the pass to win the game (frankly, because so far he appears often unwilling to), or make the shot to win the game (which he can easily do with his shooting gifts). Malik still does not appear to understand why things did not go right in Mississippi. I don't either, but it doesn't matter that I don't, because I'm just a board rat. But it matters that Malik appears to still be searching for who he is as a player, at least within this KU team. The guy flat looks like an NBA player, if ever a player could look such. But book covers and looks aren't enough in this world. The insides have to equal the outsides. Malik's parents probably thought Bill Self was the guy to help their son realize his potential, to help him make the inside fit the outside. Well, Malik's parents were smart, and right to try Self, and if Self can find someone to bond with Malik on some deep, teammate kind of level, then Self can then coach this guy up. It is about mutual respect leading to actual love of one another.

But Self cannot be his big brother, his friend, his pal. And right now no one else on this team seems to be able to connect with him either in the way this team and him seem to need to this outsider looking in. So: Svi, its up to you. May I suggest an all day and all night drive to South Padre Island, or a longer drive to San Diego, and a dip in the Gulf, or the Pacific, and then a drive back. It worked for me once. There is nothing like a road trip with two guys at that age to build a bond. I suspect Self might look the other way once. He likes this streak. He likes it a lot. But he like you both more than the streak. He wants you both to succeed. Its how coaches are. It puffs them up when you do, and causes them to clear wakes when its clear you won't.

Lincoln said something pertinent here. Have I not vanquished a foe by making of him a good friend?

He was having some trouble with Seward and Stanton that was getting in the way of him saving the Union.

Think about that.

Rock Chalk!!!!!

@HawkChamp

I have never missed a shot from being tight, have you? It’s always my mechanics, or the defender denying me a comfortable stroke at a desirable spot.

Not arguing. Just never missed a shot from tightness. Had quite a few blocked though.

Shooting is subject a normal distribution around ones own average, too. 1/3 hot, 1/3 cold, 1/3 in between.

Games Tonight (Dec 5) • Dec 07, 2017 07:43 AM

@truehawk93

This is one of those games where UW just shot better. If you think Self coached KU to shoot 25% from trey and 50% from the FT stripe, then he got out coached. Otherwise it was just a bad shooting night and this team isn’t big enough or deep enough to overcome 25% from trey.