🏀 KuBuckets Archive

Personally, I don't like the T-Rob/Bragg comparison for much of the reasons @Lulufulu stated. They seem like different players to me. I mistakenly compared the two a while back, and I believe @konkeyDong corrected me. He pointed out that Darrell Arthur may be a better comparison. I think he is right.

Bragg is much more skilled away from the basket than TRob, and his ball handling is excellent for a post player. Really, his ball handling looks better than some threes we've had on the court here. TRob was about force and presence near the basket. To me, they seem like much different players. Bragg plays under control right now. TRob, it was a matter of dialing it back a bit and playing in control. While I think TRob would have progressed much quicker being thrown into the mix as a freshman, I think Bragg is game ready now. Rough edges, some silly mistakes -- sure. But he is ready to play now.

I definitely agree that but for some big change, though, he won't be a OAD.

Regarding Vick, I just don't know how he gets PT. Six is too many. If Greene doesn't heal fully, that will be Vick's chance. But if not, it could be one of those frustrating deals where we have a guy worthy of playing, but numbers limit his opportunities in 2016-17. But this season, if he has to sit, that's all in the plan.

I'm a Greene fan. Always have been. But I've been discouraged by how Self has used him (misused him). That's the key for Greene. If Self does open his mind a bit after the late season offensive debacle last season, and after he "learned a lot" at the WUG, Greene may be much more of a regular force. If not, if it's Self's offense and system as it's always been, and the relative disdain for the three pointer, I just don't see Greene as a good fit.

A best right now, Greene is the 5th perimeter guy. I don't want transfers, but if I'm Brannen Greene, I would have seriously considered it given the entire picture.

@JhawkAlum Thanks .. in my example they would switch, so the interference action you are referring to (probably more that than a screen) would be nill. Defenders stay underneath. So the top defender, who was guarding Mason before he went to the wing to meet Selden, doesn't stick with Mason, but stays behind and attacks right at the time of the handoff, basically off of Mason's hip.

Now, if you know that double is coming, have Selden take an inside path and flare to the hoop and Mason could drop a little over the shoulder pass to him ...

@JhawkAlum I like it ... but not all the time. Like the four flat.

I don't like doubling until you attack the receiver with his own defender. Envision Selden at the wing moving to top. Mason hands to Selden. The mid top defender, who maintains his spot (because they switched), attacks Selden just as he's receiving the ball. Doing this nearer the wing (very important). The wing defender, who is now Mason's defender, attacks Selden's back. Mason now behind Selden. The post defender on Mason's side (post defender one) slides to the open zone near Mason, to defend that. The other perimeter defender guards the third perimeter player, but is moving toward Selden with the offensive player (due to the weave), and creates a little logjam.

The only real weakness is if Selden can find post player one (who's defender shaded Mason), and find him at the right angle, inside, toward the basket, over the double team.

Another option is the second post defender zones a bit in the middle to partially cover his man, and the semi-vacated first post man (whose defender shaded Mason). The wing defender could help cover that space by dropping down a bit from the anticipated second hand off spot.

Personally, I like creating one option for the offense (the inside angle pass to post player one). If they beat you, they beat you.

Hopefully I explained that so it can be visualized easily.

Can't defend it that way every time. But I think it is one strong way to contest the weave.

@JhawkAlum The chop play is excellent, but in small doses. Self used it by and large perfectly in the WUG. Last season, though, it was way over used (much of the time with four perimeter guys). We were in the dilemma that Self had put a clamp on our three point shooting -- clearly pressing our guys to get different looks. This allowed teams to pinch their defense to shut off driving angles without much concern. "Bad ball" became pretty bad (conventional definition). This was very obvious vs. ISU and WSU.

The chop "play" is exactly that -- a "play." With certain targeted shots.

The chop play, though, is exposed when it is used as the offense. This was the case in the latter part of last season.

I would also argue that it can be more easily defended than some teams seem to be able to execute. I would strongly attack the handoff points nearer the wing (vs. up top) when the lesser ball hander is receiving, then bring a back side man to trap hard. I'd slide a defender up to zone the open space created by the displaced defender. You could get hit for an easy bucket, but it would be hard to do.

@Statmachine There is room for five .. I tend to think that unless the three point shot is given more value, Greene will be our 5th perimeter guy. Mason 32 mpg, Selden 30, Graham 25, Svi 20, Greene 13. It can work. If Greene's hot, maybe he gets more.

I could also see Greene really getting zeroed out if Svi is a even a bit better shooting. Svi is basically the same height, but quicker, a much better ball handler, drives to the hoop better, a better defender, and a better passer. Greene is a better spot up shooter (which is a big deal) and a better rebounder.

If Self prefers ball handling guards, Svi has an immediate role as the backup to Mason and Graham; whereas Greene is only truly suited to the three spot backing up Selden -- all if we are to focus on this ball handling thing.

And I think we are, given the Nic Moore experience over the last few weeks. Very nice to have that second dude in there all the time.

Ok, we've seen what our guys can do when they are not under the strict restrictions of "system."

This should help a little bit in permitting those without a critical eye to gain a more critical eye regarding Self's restrictive offensive system.

Imagine Wiggins in South Korea. Yikes.

It is not free lance, or run and gun, or scrimmage stuff .. it's just loosening the system enough to take advantage of each player's unique talents. And trusting guys to a larger degree to make plays. It is important to have the system. Just looser.

@DoubleDD I upvoted your post. Then came back to it and wanted to upvote it again. I share your optimism.

I asked Fran yesterday about it, here was his reply on twitter:

Fran Fraschilla ‏@franfraschilla · 21h21 hours ago
@HighEliteMajor it's a great experience for Kansas but it is not considered a high-level international event. No university hoops in Europe. 2:05 PM - 12 Jul 2015 · Details

I included Mike Decoursey, Goodman, Biancardi, and Wetzel. Decoursey then tweeted some info about the event a bit later yesterday that got some snide remarks from some.

I had heard that Germany's highest mpg guy was only 23 or something for the tourney coming into our game. Can't verify that.. Compare that to Selden/Mason's epic minutes.

We are now front page of ESPN's home page ....

@tundrahok I did see the quote - appreciate you posting it. There are other ways to play this game, and other ways to win. What's interesting, of course, is that he has "never played this way" and we won eight straight. I love the high-low. But it offers a variety of options beyond "get to the third side" and "feed the post." Our offense this tournament looked pretty good to me -- except of the stretch today when all we seemed to want to do was feed an overmatched Perry Ellis. The ghosts of seasons past. We'll see how much he learns (or more precisely, if he's willing to change a bit).

Amazing, hard fought victory. Mason put this team on his back. Shots weren't falling, we persevered. Selden, after a rough, rough day, bangs home a dagger 3. Shooters have to keep shooting and he hit the one that mattered most. But goodness, back to Mason. Ice.

To the game -- I was singing Self's praises throughout this tournament .. but my mood changed in the second half. It really seemed like Self puckered a bit and didn't trust the rotation that served him so well this entire tournament. I was really wanting Self to put Vick in for a few stretches to give Moore and Selden some blows. The fresh legs thing would have been no issue for Vick. And he's proven he can bang home the three, something we desperately needed. Seemed like the perimeter was pretty open after penetration. Perfect spot for Vick.

And Self pretty much banished Mickelson to the bench. Puzzling. Mick came in and immediately changed a shot from the German big guy ( at 3:35). Plus, all of those 15 footers that Lucas turned down, Mick had been hitting at a pretty decent rate in the prior games.

But on the positive side, he resisted any urge to play Traylor. In fact, it was clear that Bragg was a better option and Self did use Bragg over Traylor.

Great win. Great end to the trip. And there is nothing better than extra Kansas basketball.

4:30 is a touch early for me when the DVR is at the ready .. 5:45 start time worked fine.

@Lulufulu - Agreed. Mason is definite alpha dog. Watching Selden/Mason play with Moore has me very excited to see the pair with Graham on a regular basis. Add in Svi and Greene (or Vick if he's not healthy). What a perimeter.

This is a national title team.

Back to Selden .. did he go to "finishing" school in the time since the season ended? This is unreal.

@brooksmd ESPN has a 30 for 30 on the losing 1980 Soviet hockey team. If anyone hasn't seen it, it is well worth watching.

It would be interesting to know what Svi thinks of the Russians, who were for years the oppressors -- one of the silent atrocities was Stalin's mass execution and forced starvation of some 10 million Ukrainians. This is real, violent oppression -- a bit different than what some here refer to as oppression. And given the political climate in Russia, one might argue that a regression to the Soviet days is in progress.

We made the ESPN scroll this morning.

Selden keeps demonstrating why he has turned the corner. The three pointer after Russia took the lead was just another example. We have our alpha-dog. Just took a little development.

In looking at the boxscore, I think a few stats got missed. Bragg had at least one block, maybe two, in one sequence. He also had a rebound I recall.

Hunter had a few blocks, one of them was real big. Active around the rim.

Perry Ellis, after a rough start, just kept plugging away against bigger guys. Personally, I thought his persistence inside was a big deal in this game.

I know it's going to be hard for Vick to leapfrog anyone, but the kid has been really impressive. I thought he did a pretty decent job defensively on a couple possessions when I paid attention. Seems like he has a quick first step.

And Mason is as he always is .. terrific.

@JayHawkFanToo It's pretty funny. You regularly insult me. It matters little to me. I don't whine about it.

I liken you to a little gir
l, and you get all offended. You even offer "offense" for other posters. That supports the hypothesis.

I don't care who I offend. Never have. I say what I think. And I think your "don't challenge my opinion" routine seems to fit more with a whiny little girl than anything else. I'm struggling for a different analogy.

@Crimsonorblue22 I think it's funny. But I doubt you laugh at yourself too much. I'm a "douche", which is a female hygiene product (I think .. though I've never actually seen one in action). I think that's kinda funny.

Also, I differentiate the beat up thing from an injury -- Embiid's injury changed our team.

Now, did we adjust our approach to Embiid's absence? Did we do all we could have done knowing we didn't have Embiid? That's another question.

@JhawkAlum Yea, I do think so. When you make that response it sounds to me like you seriously think that WSU beat Kansas because Kansas was beat up. Is that true, or am I misinterpreting?

I bet Self did reference that about Mason. But everyone, every team, is in the same boat. As it applies equally, it's a meaningless excuse.

I think it is absolutely silly to blame our tourney travails or anything else on being beat up, or whatever. How beat up was Duke from the ACC? Or UK from the SEC? Or Wisconsin from the Big Ten? I'm guessing Tyus Jones took as much punishment (if that's what you want to call it) as Mason did.

Glad Embiid turned pro when he did ....

@Texas-Hawk-10 I'm more talking about the run till you puke stuff. You are right, there are conditioning programs at every university. Anyway, Self, I'm sure, will handle it in a way that fits what he's seeing with the players.

@JayHawkFanToo Ok, I edited my original reply where I likened you to a little girl.

So let me get this straight, when you post your opinion (as we all do) no one is supposed to challenge it because it is "non-defensible"?Thus, it can't be refuted?

So when you talk basketball, give you opinion on KU's offense, or your opinion on Diallo, we should all just let it pass and not challenge your though process or logic?

You're on another planet.

I express an "opinion" that Bill Self is making poor choices offensively (and I have the audacity to actually line out why) and it's as if I've shot the Pope.

You make no sense.

@jaybate-1.0 Right on. Conditioning should be an on-going, continuous process.

@JhawkAlum I think you way, way overplay the "contact". There is more significant contact in one football game than these guys get in an entire CBB season combined. I sure hope that Frank wasn't worn down from bumps and bruises. It sure didn't seem like Wichita St. was worn down from the same bumps and bruises they surely had when they kicked our ass.

@Texas-Hawk-10 Did UConn have "boot camp" in 2013-14? Did Duke have "boot camp" in 2014-15? Or Louisville in 2012-13? I ask because I don't know. But I also ask to point out that there is more than one way to skin a cat. The Self way is definitely not the only way, and definitely not the only way to have a national title winning season.

@jaybate-1.0 -- You said, "Nic Moore a helluva player, despite short, stocky size. Long strong legs and cuts off opponents."

My first thought was Naadir Tharpe and the short legs thing.

I think this 6-0 run is one of the those deals that falls directly at Self's doorstep. Short prep time, melding some new guys, getting the most of certain guys in certain situations, terrific in-game management.

One of the interesting topics from last night is the increased marginalizing of Traylor -- 5 minutes (and no rebounds/points; one TO). Bragg played twice as much.

I'll pound the drum now .. there is no reason why Traylor should ever see the floor ahead of Bragg. Just suck it up, play him, get him experience, and the reward will come when it really counts. Or, alternatively, play Traylor and get what you know you're going to get. Traylor should be, at the absolute best, the 5th post guy.

@KUSTEVE Here's a youtube deal on the topic

@Statmachine I think you are exactly right. The entire "wearing down" thing always strikes me as a completely invalid excuse when it comes to young men. Every year that we underachieve in March is because we wore down, or we had injuries, or something other than the real reasons for our failures. In years we do not underachieve, amazingly, after the same grind, we are not worn down. Heck, in 2012, our starters played the most minutes our starters ever had, and we were a few breaks away from a national title.

@Lulufulu Great topic .. and I never think we need boot camp, or anything like it. It's one of Self's preferred ways to "team build" a bit. One of the greatest motivators a coach has some times is to get the team to bond together in their distaste for the coach, or with what they are having to do. I personally don't think it relates at all to whether we are fresh in March. I think Self should do it if he thinks the team building part of it is needed. I really wouldn't worry about the fatigue thing -- that, to me, is more driven by how practices are managed late in the season.

@JayHawkFanToo I'm challenging your illogical and flawed thought process. On this board, opinions get challenged. If you don't like being challenged, don't post your opinions. Better yet, try defending your opinion. I refuted your opinion as illogical. You have nothing, as usual.

You responded to my original post about Diallo being a presumed OAD, as follows:

"It really depends on how you see him and who applies the OAD label. I prefer to see him as TAD and if he develops fast he can turn into a OAD."

That is clearly, plainly, and irrefutably a challenge to the statement that Diallo ("him") is a presumed OAD. You say .. again pretty clearly .. that you see him (Diallo) as a TAD and if he develops, he can "turn into a OAD." Which is much different than presuming he's a OAD. You presume him to be a TAD -- that's what you said.

My response then was, basically, who in the basketball world doesn't view Diallo as a presumed OAD? I also cited Diallo's comments.

You then responded as follows: "What a player thinks and what ends up happening are often enough quite different. Every single player in the to 30 considers himself a OAD but very few actually end up that way. Like I said, I prefer to see them as TAD ..."

You now say that you never said Diallo isn't a presumed OAD -- so it's only that he is not a presumed OAD in your world?

Your "opinion" makes no sense. I'm interested, as always, as to how you defend your opinion. But you continue to play this silly game of "it's only my opinion", expecting that folks won't challenge it. You did that with @jaybate-1.0 recently.

Guess what, I prefer to view Diallo a four and done. Makes sense, doesn't it? Just my opinion. Be quiet and don't challenge it.

The reason for my condescending tone is that it is well deserved.

With you, it's same story, different verse. I have to admit that I do prefer your double-talk on topics like this, as opposed to when you attempt to wade into the deep end of the pool related to scheme, game planning, etc.

@Kcmatt7 Ok, I read the blog you cited. What in that blog provides any insight suggesting that Diallo is not a presumed OAD?

@JayHawkFanToo Thanks for the insight. So, what a player thinks .. meaning what is in his mind .. and what ends up happening .. meaning the final result .. may actually be quite different? Very helpful. But what does that have to do with whether Diallo is a presumed OAD as we sit here in July?

You can "prefer to see them as TAD" all you want. You can click your heels and sprinkle pixie dust over their images on your iPad. You can even wish upon a star.

But nothing changes the fact that Diallo is a presumed OAD. The definition of presumed is, "assuming that something is the case on the basis of probability and information."

Again, there is apparently difficultly understanding the word presumed. That means we should assume that he is an OAD unless we hear otherwise. It would mean that it is reasonable to assume that he is an OAD. It doesn't mean it will happen for sure.

But Diallo sure as heck isn't a presumed TAD.

As for stats, in the last 5 seasons, 21 of the 25 top 5 players in the Rivals rankings turned pro after their first CBB season. Last season, every player in the top 10 turned pro.

That would help support the fact that Diallo is a presumed OAD. A Rivals top 5 player is a presumed OAD, really, unless we hear otherwise.

And as for Diallo in particular, we have his intentions, in his own words, to go on top of the inescapable numbers.

In my humble opinion, the only reasonable way to look at this is how @RockkChalkk has stated it -- "I do think there is a chance he stays for 2 years only to develop some offensive skills. But, it's just a small chance." That is reality. The word "presumed" has meaning.

@Lulufulu I still think Traylor starts with Ellis in game one. Energy, ya know.

@Texas-Hawk-10 You're right on the practice and experience. I guess I thought we'd get some publicity. At least some mention on the ESPN basketball page. Or something on the scroll.

@Barney Ooooh. I want you to name names. Which one of our comrades thought Wayne would be watching from the bench.?

We need to form a committee on Anti-Selden activities. Hold hearings. But we need names to make this interesting.

@ParisHawk By the time he hit campus, he was a presumed OAD -- I regularly cite the Rick Pitino comment about Kansas possibly having the top two pick in the draft. A comment made in July of 2013. And I'm just talking the results. We got nothing from either Embiid or Cliff in March. Harsh? Sure. True? Sure.

@JayHawkFanToo Who in the basketball world does not presume that Diallo is a OAD? The word presumed means something. We all know nothing is for sure. He is in that group right now that is presumed to turn pro by nearly everyone. You cite Cliff and Selby as apparently folks that should have stayed -- yet they were both presumed OADs that turned into OADs. My point is not what folks should do -- it's what they actually do. Your citation of Cliff and Selby enforce the point that many of these guys get their value in their head, and despite logic, still turn pro.

Also, when the man himself says he's plans on being an OAD, that means something too ... here's what Diallo said: "When asked if he sees himself as a one-and-done, Diallo, who has been compared to Serge Ibaka of the Oklahoma City Thunder, said, 'Of course, yes. That’s what I’m looking for.' ” Here's the article ↗ where Diallo made the comments.

I certainly hope Diallo stays. But no one can presume that when he's a top 5 recruit, and listed as going anywhere from 4-8 in mock drafts right now. And I'm sure Self won't assume that he's staying n his recruiting. He'll assume he's leaving -- thus "presumed."

On Diallo, if he can't come in and be a starter and make a significant impact, then why waste the time? We expect a lot of presumed OADs because we won't see the development down the road.

Freshmen have a learning curve. But we have every right to expect nearly immediate production from a guy that is using Kansas as one year pit stop.

If it's a guy that is committed to being around and developing, I have a much different attitude.

If Diallo isn't an immediate impact, and isn't a big minutes starter, we have wasted our time.

Embiid translated to nothing in March. Cliff translated to nothing in March.

It is very reasonable to understand freshmen need to develop.

It is also very reasonable to expect much more out of presumed OADs than the normal freshman, and to be more impatient, and to be more critical of the lack of production commensurate with their ranking.

@jaybate-1.0 Curious, why do you think Mickelson benefits from the international game? I guess until you said it, I hadn't considered any difference in congestion. So that's more the question -- you see more congestion in the college game?

I have been looking at it from the perspective that he was really holding up well inside with the physicality. He seems quick off his feet (tip-ins and rebounds), and his length has impacted the game. And he hustles everywhere. Loved the play last night. Very importantly, he seems fine on defense inside.

As I'd mentioned in another thread last week, the Mickelson love is relative. Is he better than Lucas and Traylor? That's really all this is (in my mind). Now, the answer seems a pretty clear yes.

Just wondering how that answer can change so clearly in a matter of months?

It is very reasonable to assume that if Mick had been given bigger doses of playing time, we might have seen the same positives on the court last season. Tough to do that in just 133 minutes spread out over 30+ games.

I'd really like to know why Traylor -- and all that his bad statistics demonstrated -- was the better choice. Or why Lucas was the better choice. Particularly when we desperately need some rim protection. And when neither of those two were effective around the rim.

See Jesse Newell's article ↗ related to scoring at the rim.

It's hard to imagine the light switch just going on in the months between his 4th and 5th college season.

@jaybate-1.0 Great topic .. Coach Self has the team exquisitely prepared for this format, and on a short turnaround. I also like his more calm demeanor, and what appears to be a more patient approach. Or maybe it's because he's behind a barrier. Whatever. I like it. Everything looks in much better flow. Any complaints on playing time and player usage? I don't have any. All looks about right in my book.

@clevelandjayhawk Right now, I think the starting 2 is Devonte Graham. There was a quote from coach Townsend last week in the KC Star where he said the likes Graham and Mason together. I had thought Svi over Graham, but sounds like the staff prefers Graham. Either way, we have a terrific group of perimeter players.

Wayne is looking like a bad-ass right now. And I'm dead serious here -- he will be the Big 12 player of the year this season.

We all recall that he changed his shot from his freshman season (not pulling it back over his head). There was some improvement. But now, we're seeing a lot of it. We're also seeing him finish at the rim, which has been a nagging and frustrating issue for Wayne.

It is hard to fit a square peg in round hole. Many, including myself, felt Selden was the perfect 2 man -- until we saw his body of work last season. Thus we began discussions of Wayne moving to the 3 spot. It's nice to know that Self considers our suggestions (and that he ignores many of our suggestions that aren't very good).

Clearly something had to change. Heck, he should not have been starting in the latter 1/3 of the season, in my opinion -- see my post from February. He was down right bad at many points in time.

Kelly Oubre turning pro, and KU missing (thankfully) on Jalen (OAD) Brown, could have changed the course of Wayne's future. Where would Wayne be right now if we had landed Brown? Playing the 2? We don't need no stinkin' Jalen Browns. We don't need that at all for this coming season. We have something much better.

@FarSideHawk and @BeddieKU23 posted three months ago that they thought Selden would be the most improved. Here's @BeddieKU23's post. Looks pretty good right now. Here were my thoughts: I agree that the most improved will be Selden. I see the guy averaging 12-14 points per game next season. He’s that close, I think. It takes some guys a little time. He was obviously overhyped, and was ranked probably 20 spots too high, given what we have seen. No shame in taking some time to develop.

@Crimsonorblue22 made the point in a post, "I’ll take Junior Selden over any OAD."

My response to that post, "Absolutely. No question in my mind. Selden is the kind of guy that could just explode. I’m very optimistic on Selden for next season."

Selden - better than any OAD. Selden - most improved.

What Wayne needed, in large part, was to be significantly further away from ball handling responsibility. Free mind = free play. We've said it here a million times.

But I'm upping the ante. This guy looks better than he's ever looked. He looks like a guy that has turned the corner. He looks like a guy that is on a path commensurate with his ranking. That doesn't mean he might not be bad vs. Switzerland, or have an off game. What I'm talking to is a guy whose baseline performance level has significantly increased to his talent level.

Wayne Selden: 2015-16 Big 12 Player of the Year.

I thought I'd toss in here ... Traylor got put in the game late. Self said he had his best switching defense team in. That's why (if anyone wondered). I saw Self's quote this morning. Traylor is certainly quicker in a late game situation than Lucas or Mickelson, and mentally ahead of Bragg given Bragg has had very little practice under Self at this point. Self would pull Embiid in similar situations. Another school of thought is to have more of a rim protector on the floor, and to slack off his man who presumably would not be an outside threat. It is really all personnel based. Interesting.

Jesse Newell mentioned this on twitter -- here's a link ↗ to his page. And here's a link ↗ to a discussion of the topic.

And while @Crimsonorblue22 might not care (and is just rude enough to say that without explanation), those that actually want to discuss and consider basketball strategy might find it interesting. Thanks @jayballer54 for the post on the topic.

As for me, the only way I would foul, in tie game, is if I have Shaq level free throw shooter to foul and I have lost key guys due to fouls or I have very strong feeling that my team is spent as compared to my opponent. Otherwise, play it out.

@Crimsonorblue22 Seems like he hit on a key strategic move by Serbia that didn't work, but that some might consider reasonable. If you've read anything on the topic ... which is doubtful.

I do think that we can take certain things from this game (all without watching it) that fit the pattern.

Three main things -- Selden's excellent play (at the 3), Traylor's poor play and Mickelson's surge.

We have seen all of this occur against the better WUG competition (Turkey and Brazil) too.

Chile obviously sucks -- as @Statmachine said, like "kids at a Bill Self camp." That game, in a vacuum, means nothing.

We have story lines that have developed, and I think those three items really lead the way so far in Korea.

Based only on the http://worldonline.media.clients.ellingtoncms.com/news/documents/2015/07/07/USA_Chile_Boxscore.pd ↗\f" target="_blank" rel="noopener">USA-Chile box score ↗, here are some things that stuck out to me:
1. Landen Lucas 14 rebounds.

1. Hunter Mickelson 8/10 shooting, 16 points.

2. Wayne Selden 3/3 from three point range, 7 rebounds, 3 steals, and 5 assists.

3. Carlton Bragg, 7 rebounds in 12 minutes of play.

4. Perry Ellis 9 points.

5. Jamari Traylor 2 points, 2 rebounds in 14 minutes, and 4 turnovers.

6. Lagerald Vick 16+ minutes, no turnovers.

7. Frank Mason 23 points, 67% shooting, 80% from the line.

Anything else stand out?

I am completely "in" when it comes to playing Mason and Graham.

But here's a quote from last August. Take a guess who said it, referring to playing two ball handling guards: "You could see ... two playing together a lot ... I just don't know if we could guard anybody."

@drgnslayr I love your point about proper rebounding technique. I've seen Traylor, more times than I can count, simply trot to the rim after a shot. He doesn't locate his man and put a butt in his thighs, he doesn't attack an offensive player to keep them from rebounding (which creates opportunity to rebound). Much of the time, he's very upright. This makes him much easier to move on contact.

When you mention basketball IQ, one element is understanding simple geometry and the angle of the shot, or understanding how a ball is going to react with a certain trajectory. That make be an area in which he's lacking. He seems to overrun rebounds sometimes, meaning he is moving quickly to the hoop and reaches back over his head, out of position. He's more horizontal in his attack than vertical sometimes.

The point that @KUSTEVE made on another thread puzzles me as well .. "I can’t explain it- why does he pull Landen after mishandling two entry passes, and keep Jamari in after he makes bonehead play after play?"

It is almost as if Traylor's bungling means nothing sometimes. Traylor seems to get more rope than a normal non-OAD would.

I think your point on that same thread about Traylor offering speed is one explanation. He is the fastest of the three. He does get up and down the court. That is certainly one of his attributes.

It was very hard not to notice that Traylor had just 2 rebounds in 19 minutes vs. Brazil, while Nic Moore managed 3 rebounds in 10 minutes of play.

That's 3 rebounds by Traylor in 37 minutes vs. Turkey and Brazil, which is .081 per minute played.

Of all the things I've witnessed in basketball, Traylor's inability to rebound (as a post player in prime position to do so) is perhaps one of the most puzzling.

@jaybate-1.0 This is perhaps where I need some help. The game today gave Hunter Mickelson his biggest opportunity in a Kansas (now USA) uniform. And Mickelson delivered.

Mickelson was extremely active, he changed shots, he rebounded the basketball, and he was able to defend the post. What am I missing?

Mickelson seems to offer a type of game that neither Lucas or Traylor offer. It makes one wonder why Mickelson languished behind those two last season. But this is not a situation where we are overreacting on one game. We have seen Mickelson's positives. And we have seen Lucas and Traylor (and their below average-ness) in a much larger sampling.

Mickelson clearly rebounds the basketball better than Traylor. He's longer and he is more of the rim protector that we regularly discuss, than either Traylor or Lucas. And he appears to be a better scorer than either of the two, showing not only some dexterity around the rim but also a decent 15 footer. His stats from last season really offer us no valid guidance because his limited minutes included lots of scrub .. er, bench player time.

Supporting Mickelson is a "relative" undertaking. Supporting Mickelson is related to the nature of his post competition. I'm not a fan of any of the three -- Lucas, Traylor, or Mickelson. And I don't think any of the three is very good -- meaning good enough for meaningful time at Kansas. This is just a matter of getting the most we can out of this group.

But Mickelson's package of positives just seems to outweigh the other two's positives. It seems to me that when Mickelson is in, we would get consistent rim protection and consistent rebounding. I think Lucas offers decent rebounding -- I think with regular time, Mickelson would exceed Lucas in that category. I think Mickelson would outscore, outrebound, and out rim-protect both Lucas and Traylor,

But what nags me is why Self didn't play him last season? Mickelson was completely out of the mix. This was odd, particularly when we needed at least a quasi-rim protector last season. It was also odd when we saw how Lucas and Traylor were regularly abused down low.

It would seem to make great sense for Mickelson to back up Diallo down low, and Bragg to spell Ellis as we get deeper into the season (displacing Traylor). But I doubt it will be that simple.

@KUSTEVE Your post hit on the most important points from last night's game. Our "big doughnut hole in the middle", Bragg's activity, and Selden looking quite at home at the three spot.

Self really previewed the doughnut hole yesterday when he said, “You take Perry out of our frontcourt, we don’t have a lot of scoring. So that could be a concern."

I love when Self says stuff like this. He helps verify the points that we make here. And the quotes live for eternity.

Here is reality. If Diallo and Bragg are not our 2nd and 3rd bigs, this team will disappoint again in March. Our three underwhelming bigs look basically the same as they always have, and I suspect basically the same as they always will. Some nice peaks here and there, but the same.

But first and foremost, they are scholarship cloggers.

Regarding Selden, he does seem at home at the three spot. Selden looks great. And again, I love when this happens. Many of us have been saying since the first time we saw Selden handle the ball that he was a poor ball handler. We've seen him get the ball picked. We've seen him fumble away chances on the press break. We've seen it all.

And we persevered through the absolutely silly "Selden at point guard" talk. Now, heading into his junior season, they move him further away from ball handling responsibilities.

This is just as it should be. Moving Selden to the three is an absolutely great move.

Kurtis Townsend said in the KC Star today that the staff likes playing "Frank and Devonte together" -- I think this is our best indication that our perimeter starters will be Frank, Devonte, and Wayne. Svi will be coming in off the bench, it sounds like.

Wayne may have found his home. And with that, we might have found the Wayne Selden we have all expected and hoped for.

@Texas-Hawk-10 I don't know, do they?

As Stewie said on Family Guy, it must be an absolute casserole down there.