Me, too!
I recall seeing something recently showing KSU as conference champions a while back... and I said... WHAT? WTF?
It was a year we shared it. They get the same claim we get.
I like having tougher competition in this league... but I don't want to share a crown with ISU. It will just help them recruit better and test us harder in the future. Granted... it would probably be good for us.
It's like eating a kale salad. You know you should like it... but you don't!
There are so many factors involved when parsing PT minutes. Many of the factors none of us see, like what happens in practice.
I've defended Self on this but I've ran out of rope.
Usually by this time in the season Self has shaken down his team minutes and pretty much sticks to them because he knows he needs to develop that chemistry for the all-important final games of the year. If you consider that, then he doesn't have Cliff as a player who will potentially make key contributions in March. It is hard to imagine this team doing anything in March without Cliff being a factor. Yes, he does have his weaknesses... but sometimes players need to play through those to improve.
This is vintage Self. Putting a fast hook on a freshman for philosophical reasons. This gets to what I've been saying for weeks now.... the main difference between NBA and college coaches. NBA coaches are only about winning. College coaches are about winning, but from within their philosophical context. Self is as much a teacher as he is a coach. This is why I'm certain he would never make a great NBA coach. I say that but Coach Pop is in this camp, too. So maybe I'm wrong!
Right now, he is not putting his best players on the floor because he is teaching his philosophy. At the heart of his philosophy is the "Self doctrine"... defense.... defense... defense...
Cliff doesn't get his minutes because he misses defensive switches. He is a long ways from understanding team defense. He just isn't getting it yet. And this is the area where he could (defensively) really help his team out. He should be getting a respectable amount of blocked shots. But he doesn't because he is 8 feet away from his man who is scoring the easy dunk. This drives Self into a frenzy. At the very heart of good defense is the team concept that the defense is no stronger than the weakest link. Cliff is often exposed as the weakest link. And that costs us not only a few points, but it is part of what is weakening this team's spirit and strengthening our opponent's spirit. Giving up the easy basket is just not in Self's DNA.
Okay.... we get all of that, and it appears, we get it better than Cliff. But at what point are you willing to continue to throw the entire team under the bus to prove a point? Cliff isn't getting it. Maybe it's time his teammates help him get it. Maybe he needs every player on this team to teach him, too, and not just the coaches.
Stats do not tell the only story. BamBam earned minutes because he is focused on what Self is looking for.... hustle. And when BamBam makes plays like he did in Austin, the entire team feeds on that. But where has BamBam been lately? His energy is the only part of the game he owns over Cliff. Now it is time to look at the stats. The weight is all on Cliff's side. BamBam better create a lot of big momentum-changing energy plays a game to match that. He isn't doing it. Worse... BamBam is supposed to be energizing his teammates... but does having 6 TOs succeed at that?
So even without considering what is ahead of us, Cliff should be getting most of the minutes.
Now let's consider March. Let's consider what happens when the bright lights go on, and the competition is tough and motivated. What guy do we want on the floor? Right now... it is about a tie. Why? Because Cliff isn't getting enough minutes to establish his game. He still doesn't have an identity. He isn't being prepped for March.
Cliff needs to be on the floor as much as possible between now and March. If he isn't in shape, then getting more game minutes will definitely help that out.
Is Cliff learning too slowly? Maybe. But after our bad loss at Ames, when our guys gave up 20+ points in the open court, which guy on this team did I notice running back hard after every offensive possession? Cliff!
I'm on board with your post. The UK loss was tough because it was Calipari. But our guys performed admirably and we didn't have a single McDs AA in that game. UK sent a record... what.... 6 guys in the NBA draft that summer? The following year for Calipari tanking in the NIT taught him a lesson about losing so many guys in one year.
The OSU game really got under my skin. I think we are all a bit defensive this year because we know just how young this team is. We know we lack the big shot blocker and rebound sweeper. We all so wanted that 2 game buffer against a dangerous ISU team.
So the extra buffer is gone. And we still have many tough road games ahead. The last thing any of us wanted to experience was a melt down. OSU second half was a complete meltdown. In that opening OSU run... I recall at one point we had 4 consecutive TOs on our possessions. We didn't even get up a shot. And they were all really dumb TOs, like throwing the ball directly to a Sooner or dribbling high right up to a Sooner.
What I came to learn from that game is this team doesn't have a leader. Games back we turned to Frank... but he was just a late-game finisher (who is now struggling). That reminds me of Sherron towards the end. When he tried to carry the team on his back, but couldn't. This isn't a game for one guy to do it all. And that isn't what leadership is all about anyways.
What does it take to lead? It takes someone who is a communicator and someone who the team will listen to. Someone the team respects and believes can lead them to victory. Someone who has enough alpha-dog to take charge.
Who can lead us?
Obviously, the first place to look is our elder players. That would be Perry and BamBam. Neither of these guys seem to be verbal, take charge guys.
Then we have the sophomores... Frank, Wayne and Brannen. Frank is sitting in the driver's seat. Brannen is more the spiritual leader... when he hits his 3s, the team responds, but that isn't enough. The last thing we want to do is ask anything more from Wayne. He is just recovering from his slump. Let him be and let him continue to work on Wayne.
Would we even consider having a freshman lead us? Doubtful. They've never been where we are going. From what experience could they bring to the table? However... once in a while there comes someone special who can lead without experience. Could it be Devonte, Kelly or Cliff? I'm not seeing it.
That leaves Frank Mason. He is our only choice. He's the guy who refuses to step backwards in the military lineup when asked to do a suicide mission. Frank is our man.
The team should hold a meeting today, without Self and coaches. They should all work it out together. This is the time for them to use the great bond they have... and they need to elect Frank Mason as the man. And they need to communicate to Frank that he needs to be more vocal, more expressive. We need every bit of his alpha-dog moving forward.
I fear tomorrow. I fear if this team didn't fully grasp the poor level of play on Saturday they are going to walk into a buzz saw on Tuesday and totally jeopardize #11. If they do that the pressure will be on to win out... and young teams don't usually handle that kind of pressure well.
Check out 48 seconds in....
This is a great old comedy and it's half about superstition...
[link text](
Guys.... it doesn't do us any good to vent our frustrations on each other.
Vent out anything you like but you will be taken more serious if you provide reasoning for your vent and possible solutions.
We should all bend and be open minded.
BTW: I do my best when someone totally picks apart my posts. Many times I need to be straightened out and I never seem to reach that point by myself. That is actually the most beneficial thing for me in participating here. All the knowledgeable posters help keep me straight. If I didn't have that I would think of myself as a true know-it-all jerk. So now I'm just a jerk! :-)
I think our offense can use quite a bit of tweaking to open up more 3s. We need to run more than a Perry pick-n-pop, Perry at the top of the key, others running high ball screens etc. Most everything we are running now generates on the perimeter. Those kinds of plays usually don't open up someone for a wide open shot. The shots remain contested. Even Greene has his limitations.
We should be running stuff where Greene has to cut through the pack and go from one side to the other side or out top and in an open area. Or get Frank to drive more and feed out.
I think our best shot is to run Frank, Devonte and either Brannen or Wayne. Frank and Devonte should be driving and feeding either Brannen or Wayne. With two guys very capable of driving like that it really shouldn't be tough to free one perimeter shooter. Part of it is just clearing out a spot so team defense doesn't get to the shooter too quickly.
We still don't really make use of corner shooting. Brannen should be a marksman from the corners. This is the toughest spot on the floor to cover.
We were just having Brannen and another guard playing ball screen out on the perimeter in this game, and that isn't the way to open up the long ball. That is a way to open up a driving lane by preventing drive hedges to be set.
Another thing I've noticed lately...
When Frank goes down, he is slower getting up. Part of it may be exhaustion, part of it may be him checking out if he's added another pain.
He went down in this game and two teammates pulled him up.
One thing I recall from early games this year is Frank almost springing up after a tumble. It seemed to be part of his attitude of invincibility.
A big lesson for kids is financial responsibility. I'd set her up local first and receive the benefit. She can still get her diploma from KU.
There is a better chance she will really appreciate her opportunity at KU if she has to struggle to get there.
I wasn't able to afford all 4 years at Kansas back in my day. So I had my KU experience and got a job and went elsewhere. I never took out a loan, never borrowed from my parents. It all just made me appreciate KU that much more!
@reader22 has a smart post. There are so many scholarships available. She can qualify for several. They can overlap and be exclusive of each other. I had two academic scholarships that helped me and had a very minimum requirement.
Every year there are many scholarships that go unclaimed because students and parents don't research what is available!
We went through this with a young Perry Ellis. Remember how fast he got the hook as a freshman?
I think Self knows best on this one. Cliff just hasn't stepped up yet. He has basically fallen off the national radar. Remember just 6 months ago when he was considered head-to-head with Okafor? Man... those guys aren't even on the same planet now! I don't think Cliff getting more minutes was going to solve that. He just isn't playing hard.
This is a team. A definite team philosophy. These guys don't play as individuals. And to some degree that is good and some degree that is bad. I know we like all the assists and these guys gelling as friends. It's one big family. That's the positive.
But on the negative... it only takes a bad apple or two to spoil the team concept. Their energy is one! So if someone like Perry doesn't show up, why will a young freshman Cliff show up?
This is really a time when we need a leader. The guys sort of superimposed Frank as the leader, but he really isn't the guy. Frank just proved that he is somewhat bulletproof and will fight if others do or not. That isn't leadership.
It would make a huge difference if Perry could stay stepped up on his play, and also be more vocal. I know we are all doubtful this will happen... maybe Wayne will do it. He is starting to get his game back.
Who will lead this team? That's what we need to know.
I've always had that opinion, too. I played several years on what can only be described as a "tournament team" and we often had to play two games in one day. A few times we played three games.
But my experiences are not the same as playing D1. I played some second division basketball in Europe, too. It is considered "semi-pro" ball. I put that level of basketball equal to D2 ball. I never ran so much before. I thought I understood basketball until I made that step. It was exhausting... and it was at the level of D2 or juco ball.
I've been paying attention to how often Frank goes down. It's often. And many of those falls I see make me cringe. I didn't go down like that and that often in my experiences.
So I'm changing my perspective on all this and young players. I don't think it is Frank wanting to screw up or play slower... something has changed, and I suspect it is both reasons... Frank wearing down and teams have him scouted. He may also be a bit banged up and we don't know it.
That even explains the post by @tundrahok and how Frank's FT% is dropping. When guys get tired, it's hard to hit FTs. We often look at guys that step up at the end of a game and miss FTs and say they choked. But I think a lot of that is the fact that they just played a tough 38 minutes of basketball and their exhaustion hurts them at the line.
I'm not trying to make excuses for this horrible loss. There is blame to go around and the guys need to be held accountable. But we also need to be realistic fans. That is part of the accountable put back on us!
Frank hasn't been Frank lately.
Is it because he is wearing down, or is it because most of the teams have already seen him once this year so they have him scouted and are playing him different than the first time?
Both?
Comments?
RIP, Coach Dean Smith!
"They need to prevent having a big skid right now."
We play TT on Tuesday in Lubbock.
Could this be our "TCU" game?
Could this be our 3-game dip?
If I was a betting man I would have bet on a KU victory yesterday. I did everything right.... right KU gear for game time and I refused to make a jinx pregame prediction!
I really thought I iced the game for us!
I wonder how many KU fans out there think that THEY blew the game yesterday?
Okay... come on... someone in here needs to fess up? Who forgot to wear their favorite Jayhawk t-shirt?
Someone is guilty. There has to be a reason why we stopped playing in the second half.
Maybe a fan did something at half time.... maybe some sexual play? You know there is a reason why boxers and many other pro athletes pull back from the love table days before a big event.
So if it wasn't one of us who blew it on superstition, could it have been the team's own superstition? Could this team be carrying the curse of superstition with them every time they step on the floor?
In my books, the most negatively alarming game we played this year is a game we won... OU at home! That was a game where we came out red hot in the first half, and went from a 21 or so point lead to falling behind only minutes into the second half. I know Self used that as a major lesson for this team. Might that have been the cause for yesterday's disastrous second half? Maybe the lesson was learned too well, and it carried the curse of superstition into the second half. What did slow down these guys so much in the second half? We hadn't played a game in 5 days. Might they have felt some superstition from the OU game because they were so hot in the first half? So they came out worried about a repeat of OU. We all know what happens when basketball players think too much... they slow down!
Superstition is a huge part of sports. It must play a part in at least half the games and players involved in the sport.
Take a break from the Sunday morning woes of a bad KU weekend and journey with me.
Do two things: 1. Click on Stevie's video clip below to get the music rolling. And while that is going on, click on the link below and open it in another window, so you can read about famous NBA players and teams that fail to be confident enough on their own so they play to their own superstitions through preventative rituals. Might this young Jayhawk team just need a ritual to help them believe more in themselves? You be the judge...
[link text](
Writing this thread made me hungry, so I decided on a peanut butter and jelly sandwich for breakfast. Did you know where the trend came from for basketball shorts to become long and baggy? Are you thinking it was from rappers? Guess again... it was from Michael Jordan and his superstition. So without superstition, the game might still be played in tight hot pants!
Top 10 Most Superstitious Players in NBA History ↗
Kick back and enjoy. Reduce your blood pressure with some Stevie Wonder and a nice read. Through it all, come to realize how maybe our young guys played into a superstition... the same superstition that ruled the beliefs of some of the best players to ever play the game.
This is the place to let out all your bad juju.
Get it out here and now.
We'll all feel better and we'll put this behind us. And we should all give allowance to those who need to vent out. There is a lot of stuff to process.
Kubuckets is not a lynch mob site... but we do have the luxury of not being affiliated with anything commercial or the university. So this is the place to vent out stuff just to feel better and get on with it.
I'm not going to get down on anyone for saying anything right now. It's best to let things out. Healthier.
Once things are out, we can start rebuilding some trust and spirit.
Could it be that this loss will help these young kids?
This is one of the youngest teams in college basketball. They don't have so many losses to draw from. Seems they will have a let down every X amount of games.
What alarmed me most about this loss was Frank Mason... our rock.
He seems to be wearing down. We were 5 days without a game, and he looked exhausted. He made mistakes he seldom makes. I think many of us have seen this coming over the past several games.
The question is.... if Frank is now only firing on 7 cylinders, what is the chance he will soon be firing on only 6 cylinders?
It is crystal clear that Self needs to lighten his minutes now... right now. next game. And he needs to pull him off of the extra drives to the hole. Frank has been the savior for this team all year and it's time the other guys step up and save Frank now. Freshmen need to man up now, but even more, what about our most senior players, like Perry? He had been coming on, but he reverted back into being mostly invisible this game.
Kansas needs to look at some areas where they are weak, and they need to protect those areas. For example, Wayne's shot is coming around and we are all thankful for that, but his dribbling skills are very much lacking. He had at least 2 dribbling TOs in this game. And we've seen him make many ill-advised drives to the basket this year. It is a pity to handcuff part of his game, but someone needs to set him straight because this is really hurting the team.
BamBam's role in the offense of coming out top needs to be reassessed. First.... he's not an outside shooter, so pulling him out top isn't really effective. His man on D just mushes back in the lane to block the post area. BamBam is not a skilled passer. He is fine when others are wide open and he isn't sped up, but when the game is on the line and our opponent steps up to play some real D, he becomes a liability. He is best used as a slasher, and in that role, he actually becomes a legitimate scoring threat.
We are going to need to pick up more offense from players NOT named Frank.
This team is NOT the team we had in '08. We can't constantly run the top of the key weave. Teams are figuring out that they know what will happen next so a defender has started to step out in front of the next KU player to receive the ball. I can't believe it has taken 10 years for defenses to figure it out.... but now they know. It is a "flow" type movement, and the guy with the ball just wants to finish out his movement and pass. It is beyond being telegraphed.
Last... it would be great if this team could carry a chip on their shoulders again. I think we carried a small chip after Kentucky, because no one took them serious for a while. The Temple game provided a little extra momentum. These guys need to think to themselves.... does it take a complete shellacking by another team to get these guys motivated moving forward? Really?
This is a great time for these guys to call a team meeting without the coaches. This is a great time for one or two guys to step up and take charge. What would really help the most is if Perry could step up and verbalize leadership to this team. He is the less likely guy and that means it has the most potential for helping get these guys fired up. They need to prevent having a big skid right now. There are many tough games left, and this team is lacking leadership and direction. Add that into their youth and we have the potential for a horrible skid and #11 quickly becomes out of reach. They should see that now, while they have time to get it together.
I only want to know one thing:
What happened over half time? That was the softest basketball I've ever seen this team play in the first part of the second half, when OSU sort of fell in to a 11 point run.
It did really seem like they had taken a nap at halftime, or smoked some killer herb, or just decided to not come out and play.
If this was boxing, and a fighter suddenly quit like that it would be under investigation by the boxing commission as a betting conspiracy.
They did a bit better after that, but the damage was done.
I'd like to say it was the heavy pressure applied by OSU... but it wasn't. In fact, they came out slow, too, but bounced on us after it was apparent we weren't going to play.
I could never coach these guys. I would have called time out a few minutes into the second half and I would have taken my starting 5 and told them to go to the locker room because their day was finished. They can wait on the bus. The other guys would have been motivated and probably won the game.
Could Self had said something to them that made them all just decide to come out and protest with super soft play?
I am really lost here. Maybe someone in here can clue me in.
We lost because of a new strategy put in place. In order to come out fresh in the second half, our guys took a 20-minute halftime "power nap."
Guess they didn't quite wake up after 20 minutes.
Here is my prediction and the only prediction I feel certain about:
When I make a prediction I jinx the team.
I think I'm something like 0 for 10 this year.
My new standby reply is that Tyler Self is due for a monster game!
I remember several severe pranks we pulled back then that involved condoms. I think it best I keep them a buried secret.
Hard to forget Louise's. Is Louise's West still alive?
It's not too late for KSU to fix their problems.
First.... fire Weber.
Second.... visit Santa Fe, NM, late at night and bring a shovel.
Third.... move the coffin of Jack Hartman back to Manhattan.
Fourth... move out some animal husbands and midwives from one of the farm buildings to make room for the coffin.
Fifth.... stick an AM radio with Mildcat game action beside Jack's coffin.
Sixth... aim a laser beam microphone on the coffin to record movements during Mildcat games.
Seventh.... develop an iPhone application to send the live recordings to someone on a phone.
Eighth... hire someone and call him "coach" who has great interpretative skills and doesn't mind being on the phone for a couple of hours at a time.
Ninth.... actually... omit #1. Keep Weber and buy him a new phone!
(some malice intended)
"What I don't like about Kentucky is they have hijacked this game we all love by stockpiling talent like never before. I don't loathe Duke, Syracuse, or other bluebloods like I do Kentucky. Part of it is their fans. Their arrogance. Their bragging and boasting. Part of it is their coach. You applaud him, and well you should, I guess, but I just can't stand him for what he's doing to the game."
I agree totally... but I still accept Kentucky as a blue blood. I don't agree with a lot of their fans, and I hate how Cal has highjacked the game.
But it is up to us to prove his strategy wrong. It is up to Self to beat Cal. Cal just raised the stakes. We continue to recruit more talented players. It is up to Self to figure out how to do it and win on a national level.
Kansas is working on going head-to-head with Cal. We've now invested in the luxury player suites. We have the rules and are upgrading AFH with a new facility to offer more.
We should easily be able to compete with Kentucky for players, even surpass them. But in that process, it would be a gigantic mistake to have the Cal strategy that "more is better." There are many areas where we are ahead of Kentucky... we play in a real basketball conference, there is no comparison between AFH and Crupp, our history in the game and legacy is superior, we have a much better strength and conditioning program (the tops in college sports) and we have a superior coach who can not only recruit but knows his Xs and Os.
We aren't far away from being in a superior recruiting position. We are getting top talent now, including the ability to snag top players. We just need to be able to make sure we don't have holes in positions. We are one big man away from this team being a great team, and they might still get there without one.
I agree with others that we should be able to win consistently on a national level without completely stacking the deck like Kentucky has done. Their big advantage this year isn't about who they brought in, it is about all the players that decided to stay. We should be able to battle any team in the nation with 4 or 5 McDs AAs. We should never need the stack that Kentucky has. But what we truly need is the right kind of depth at every slot. We are just one big man away from having a dream team and it didn't even have to be a McDs AA.
One of our biggest issues is youth. We sort of got going in a tough direction when we lost so many players a couple years ago. That sort of created a lopsided year of young blood, followed by another year of it because we lost two OADs. We are now on good ground again because we have a solid core of freshmen and sophomores, most will return and stay 4 years. It is fine to continue to recruit several OAD-type players as long as we balance it out with some experienced players that provide the glue and all the other needed play that isn't SportsCenter highlights.
I think Cal has finally figured it out that his strategy doesn't work to only recruit guys that all will leave after 1 year. He isn't going to lose all 9 of his McDs AAs this year. Some will be back, and that is why he'll maintain a competitive team. But watch his games this year. They have one saving grace.... their size and athleticism is intimidating and they block a lot of shots. Their offense just plain stinks. Their games are boring... and full of sour, flat minutes. Cal hasn't been able to resolve his offense, but he can rely on his defense to win games.
I think we are blessed to have a team like ISU and the Mayor in our league. He has brought a higher standard of offense to college basketball. I do believe Self is starting to get it. This is an area that will definitely help us recruit in the future if Self can adopt this style of turbocharged Princeton. It is far superior to Cal's dribble drive... an offense he seems to have forgotten to teach this year.
I didn't forget.
Glad we are talking about Larry again.... because the last time I went down this path, we were looking for the perfect spot in Lawrence to place a sign "Welcome to Larryville!"
Anyone have good ideas?
I'd be happy to crowd fund this and we would build something very special. It would be great to put it somewhere on Iowa, on the way in from the turnpike. Or thinking different.... it could be installed in a park, where people can walk up to it and appreciate it.
I'd be happy to put my two cents in on this and work on the organization and crowd funding. I'd need help, especially in Lawrence because this would have to go before the city.
This is definitely a job for crowd funding. It doesn't make sense to force taxpayers into doing this. We have the fan support to raise enough money to do this first class.
It would be smart to build a board. Decisions have to be made. How is the sign designed? It would be great to list "Danny and the Miracles".... others?
Volunteers?
How about a broader perspective... a park all about Jayhawk basketball!
I've got a special spot for Larry because he was the guy that got us back on track. In that same mentality, I toast Calipari for bringing back Kentucky basketball. Whether or not we are Kentucky fans or not, Kentucky was a blue blood program before Cal got there, and he has done wonders to bring back the momentum to Lexington. Good for them!
OSU players are passive-aggressive towards Kansas players because they come to Lawrence and they witness the love Kansas fans have for their players. They go back home and they experience Ford visiting cafeterias, begging students to attend a game to support their ranked team (when they were ranked).
I feel for OSU players. Definitely for Nash. He is a quality player that deserved better from a program. His frustration with his own world is very visible to all. We just addressed the attendance issues in Oklahoma. This is wide spread across America. There is a saturation of games, TV games and other sports. The key is to build momentum in your program and fight to keep it going. Hey.. Kansas has been there before. The "father of basketball" program has suffered long periods of less than capacity crowds. I remember "upgrading" my seats for years in AFH at halftime.
We should all remember that and fight for what we have to keep it at the top!
I pity the poor fool basketball coach hired after Self that fails to keep to our standards. We'll burn him at the stake! We are going to fight to keep Kansas great and we'll do whatever we have to do to make sure we keep the momentum rolling!
What about Larry?
"I like KY: the Royal Blue beatings of Mizzoo cont'd at the hands of that blue blood..."
Priceless! I love it, too!
It is the one time I become a Kentucky fan.
The Tigs ran away from their master only having landed in a place with a new master of the same royal quilt.
Eventually their football will fall and the SEC will be ready for an upgrade. I see a new conference for the Tigs.... welcome to the Sun Belt Conference!
Love the stamps. Love how they had to stretch them long to an unconventional length to fit in the Big Dipper.
Zim would be a monster get.
He will instantly turn us into a top team for the trophy in March.
We'll have back just about everyone and add in Bragg... So we have the 1-4 covered with guys that are experienced playing without a strong 5 who can shot block. Now add in Zim.
The problem we have had before is our 1-4 were spoiled with someone like JoJo so we were easily beat at the 1-4 spots. Adding in Bragg isn't adding in a slouch either.
And on offense.... hopefully Self keeps the threat alive from 3, and then adds in low post scoring feeds, instead of discounting the 3 like he used to. Hopefully, he continues on the Mayor path of taking what the defense gives and exploit match up areas.... spread the floor.
Does anyone know... can Bragg or Zim shoot on the perimeter? I hear Zim talking about pick and pop... but does he have range?
I ate up your post like a bear on honey! I'm lovin' it!
Yikes. You opened the drgnslayr can of worms! Shame, shame!
Everyone, their dogs, and their cousin's dogs know where I stand on this. We can't just create a rivalry out of thin air. It looks like we are stuck with KSU, WSU or MU.
KSU is like our cross-eyed cousin. We tend to feel more pity for the poor fools than anger. We used to have a solid rivalry until KSU focused more on football than basketball. To be honest, it was a wise move for them, bringing in a lot more revenue.
Mizzou. Forget it. There is no part of a real rivalry there. It is just pure hate. It is too much hate. And now that they are a member of the Kentucky Farm League, they will never be a potential threat. Beating their heads in every year won't qualify them as rivalry material.
WSU. While it is true that we don't know for how long Marshall can keep this team's pants up... he did bring them to a level where we could start developing this as a playing rivalry. A home-home-Sprint scenario actually works well financially. I've been stating all along, that this is the time to start this, while WSU is a ranked team. Once we start this thing, we help their program more than ours. Fine. Help them maintain a quality team so we can snook them every year! ha... I'm not saying this could ever equal UK vs UL.... but it would instantly be a high-demand view of national prominence, and it would give us someone to rival with every year.
We need to think broader. We need to realize that having good basketball around us is a positive. It is good for our State, and it is good for both schools recruiting. Plus... it just adds some real spice to our schedule. The UK/UL event makes them a lot of attention and it especially helps Kentucky because their schedule can never be that great since they play in the SEC. Kentucky needs to play good teams where there is national interest. Who gives a poo when Kentucky plays Georgia? Borrrriiiinnnggg!
It is a benefit that WSU is not in the B12. Some people mention ISU as a developing rivalry. There is a certain point where Kansas gets hurt with that. There is the situation where we have everything to lose and nothing to gain. By making our games with them real grudge matches (even more than now) we put our games on a closer competitive level. Teams play to the strength of the rivalry and we don't need to make our games even tighter with ISU.
If we lose to WSU, we mostly lose pride. That just fuels the next opportunity to play. A big part of what makes basketball so good back east is the quality of teams within a short proximity.
Good basketball is like a magnet with fans. We can use more magnets in the Midwest.
I vote we play the Shocks. And I vote we kick their arses all the way back to Wichita! Every single year!
"Maybe you have access to better information on Hield than I do and I would be interested in seeing it,"
I don't have better access than you and I probably study this less than you. I just see a guy that can play. He can shoot and he just looks more NBA than anyone else in the B12 (IMHO).
These "mock" people are often wrong. NBA GMs are often wrong. I'm often wrong. But I sense a big career ahead for Buddy.
I don't consider 6'4" to be short or tall for a SG. He does have a nice wingspan, is athletic, can shoot well and handle the ball. He has big hands and can control the ball like a big man.
Rivals had him at 86th... the 17th best SG in his class. Not too impressive, but he didn't attract a lot of attention. I don't think Sunrise players get the same attention as other prep schools do. We always like to go to areas where players tend to be over-ranked, like back east.
I think Buddy would have jumped to be a Jayhawk, had he been offered.
Absolutely! He didn't want to release this info to the public because he knows how hard it is to walk it back later. So when he said it, he meant it!
Wow..... the burden has been lifted off this team and off this program! With the quality of players we recruit we shouldn't go back to being a dud trey shooting team again!
I think there is a lot going on here. I do think Self played rope a dope with ISU. The OU game was a big wakeup on how this young team can flip flop.
Self wants consistency.
He'd rather have two good halves, than a great half and a bad half. I think we need to keep that idea in our heads. The OU game was a disaster, and we are very very fortunate to have won that game.
Self knows how hard it is to force momentum on to his guys. It is easier to throttle them back and let them release energy gradually (consistently) over having them come out amped, then run low and in trouble, then refocus to finish strong. Granted, the last way builds character, but Self isn't interested in building character in AFH. Self is interested in protecting home turf. Now on the road is a different story (concerning character)... but for a team this young, you don't want to bite off too much character building in one game. It's best to control what he can control. The character building will come through the season regardless.
I think a big part of this is Self starting to lax up on 3s. In the old days, I don't care what he said or what other players said... If a guy hoisted up a brick 3, good chances he'd get pulled to the bench, unless he was a OAD, like Wigs.
Now Self wants them to take open 3s. Brannen is on fire because he has been in there earlier in the year where he rushed some brick 3s and didn't get pulled. That very fact made him start to relax and loosen up on his shots.
We shoot better percentages from 3 because Self has lightened up.
You are a real Jayhawk!
RCJH!
"Chiefs and royals back each other and I like that they have added KU to that mix. I know self supports them."
Right on! I think this has a lot to do with Kansas playing games at Sprint. We have been building a love affair with KC for a long time, but even more in recent years. Sprint is a great venue... especially when you add in the P&L District. Lots of seats and an "away" game!
Brett has always supported the Jayhawks, even back in his playing days. He was constantly coming to Lawrence with Hurdle to party. Many of us have drinking experiences with this HOF'er.
"Have you, or any one else seen any tracking of average length of possession in the NBA across the decades, or of late?"
No... would make an interesting read.
I think we can look at the scores to get somewhat of an idea. And it would be interesting to compare average length of possession between pro and college.
The pro game is what... 8 minutes longer?
What is the average NBA score versus college?
I know college scoring is nearing record lows. And of course total zone defenses are legal and the players not as skilled in scoring. But it seems to be quite a difference.
I go to pro games every year and they always seem to go back and forth more. Concerning the actual speed in which they move down court... not so sure. But they have 11 less seconds just on the shot clock so I'm sure they get shots off quicker.
I think it would be cool to put distance monitors on players and see who runs furthest in a game, college or pros? You can correct for the extra 8 minutes.
NBA players pace themselves during the year because of the amount of games. 100+ games.... around 3 times more than college ball. I've been to NBA Playoffs and those games definitely move faster than regular season. Everything bumps up in the playoffs.
The NBA has been experimenting with shortening the game to 44 minutes.
I think the focus of the game, in the NBA, is all around the 3-pt line. That is where teams want to do their damage, and stick the knife into their opponents. No matter how vicious the slam dunk, it only counts for 2 points.
So now it is all about hitting the trey, and the push is to get footers to shoot treys. This also helps bring out defending footers away from the basket, opening up the middle.
Another thing is the pace of the game. It moves fast in the league. The days of big post players waddling down court are over. You could just as easy move the NBA shot clock down to 10 seconds and you would hardly notice.... except with teams like SA that really want a high percentage shot regardless of where it is on the floor.
It is a game of x-axis with quick horizontal players tall enough to defend and attack with the y-axis.
You touched on Calipari's newest tactic. First, he learned to recruit OADs. Now he has learned the skill of talking them into staying another year or two. Gosh... look at a player like Marcus Lee. That guy should have been playing somewhere that would have made him a star in one year. He could have been an OAD. The guy might end up a 4-year player, especially if you consider where he is on the status totem pole at Kentucky.
Over the years I've thanked the purple pansies several times for making it an easier path for us to be conference champs again. I especially liked Frank Martin and his constant show of respect for Kansas and Self. Frank was always entertaining with his red face and murderous expressions.
Weber is starting to challenge Frank for "entertainer of the year" in Lawrence, Kansas. His explosion in the first half of our game truly made my day. I'm really starting to love that guy. He is so fun to beat.
I can't really knock Snyder. He has done what Kansas should have done.... build a program from the ground up. I recall KSU and KU being on a similar status before Snyder entered the picture.... actually... KSU was even below Kansas! Kansas State had a cumulative record of 299–510 (.370) in 93 years of play, which was easily the most losses of any team in Division I-A at the time Snyder took over.
My biggest strike against Snyder is that he attended Mizzou for a year as a student. At least he was smart enough to transfer out after only a year, but I"m afraid the Antlers had already poisoned his soul.
"can fault turner to much, everyone was thinking Texas was going to be great."
He was completely influenced by friends and family. He was an instant hero at his HS right after he went public with his choice.
He had to look no further than his mentor, KD, and though he had a spectacular year in college (25.8 ppg, 11.1 rpg, 1.3 apg) Texas didn't even win the B12 and didn't even make it through the second round in March.
I agree with @Crimsonorblue22 ....
The biggest threat to Barne's loss of employment is if he can no longer recruit. The biggest thing he has on his resume so far is the recruitment of KD. That extends beyond their FF appearance.
Unfortunately for schools in Texas... their vision never goes beyond their State borders. What counts there is how these guys recruit against each other. Barnes is competing against Drew and others, not the rest of the world which is outside the Texas borders. Very shortsightedness, but that is what counts in Texas. Football is the same thing.
I really am curious what spins in the head of Turner. I wonder if he realizes he only lives once, and basketball is a one-shot proposition? He could have played on a contender but instead he gave in to the shortsightedness that runs rampant in Texas. He will get a very fast education once he leaves the educational institution of UT. The reality may never set in because his friends and family are Texans. He will always have to visit home and he is a hero for becoming a Longhorn and always will be. KD is a God in Texas... perhaps the only non-football sports figure there to be nominated a God!
I wasn't really that hot on Turner when we recruited him... mostly because of all his talk of wanting to play outside and mimic KD's outside game. He was thin... and I thought maybe he would just create problems at Kansas and hate Self for putting him in the post. Meanwhile, Myles put on weight and strength, and he has a solid low post to mid range game. Gosh... could he have stepped right in to this Jayhawk team and made a huge impact!
I will never understand why any 5-star recruit would go to Texas. ... if for no other reason than having to look at burnt orange constantly. That has to be the worst color in D1. It looks like the exiting result of a bad enchilada dinner from yesterday.
"The biggest hurdle for him coming to KU at this point is Big Cliff's semi-failure to launch."
I agree with a lot of your post... but not this part. Cliff has shown his lack of inside game and often not hustling. Zim realizes this and doesn't put himself in Cliff's shoes. He is more likely to turn back the clock a year and look at JoJo's performance. At least it is a player he can better relate to.
I have a hard time seeing Thon at Kentucky. He doesn't seem like a social mixer with whoever Kentucky has on their roster. We are definitely in the hunt for him... but if he does decide to play in the State of Kentucky, I see him more eating a bucket of KFC in the greasy Yum! Center.
I see us having a solid chance with Thon because Self has been pursuing him for a long time, and the early bird could easily get the worm on this one.
Self is ready to crawl out of his own skin, especially if he doesn't sign a quality 5 soon, and the pickings aren't much. This is when he does his best.
I wonder how many recruits he is pursuing have autographed signed books from Hudy?! :-)
"As far as Buddy Hields, he was ranked in the 80s out of HS and much like Niang,"
I can see how Self could miss on Niang... but Buddy has the body and athleticism and he showed plenty of signs over at SCA... Self actually looked at him, but didn't see it. So it wasn't like he didn't take a look because Buddy wasn't ranked high enough. Sorry... but that was a major blunder. Buddy certainly passed Lon's eye test.
If that kid stays healthy I believe he'll be one of the better NBA players to come out of the B12 in recent years.
Right... but what great college basketball coach wants to go to Texas and play second fiddle to football?
It would be great for the B12 if they could land someone better.
The B12 does have some quality coaching... Self, the Mayor, Kruger, "Huggy Bear"..... but Texas gets so much attention and Barnes continually drops the ball. I recall just a couple of months ago all the rage about Longhorn basketball and a possible FF appearance.
I have a hard time seeing Zimmerman in a UK uniform. He just doesn't seem like a UK-Cal kind of player.
I still think he is bound for Kansas or UCLA.
But Cal is hot on his trail...
I really think Wayne will be here for 4 years. There is nothing indicating he is considered a 1st round pick.
I'm very doubtful Cliff will leave, either. He doesn't even start for Kansas. I see him to likely be a 3-yr player maybe even 4. He hasn't even defined who he is as a player. Just stuffing down vicious dunks doesn't create an identity. He needs to fill his skills toolbox with tools that can earn him a living at the next level. He reminds me of a young TRob without the motor. But he does have potential, and now he has the time to work on his tools.
I think Kelly has the best shot of everyone on this team of leaving this year. I'm still doubtful he goes... but if he keeps improving at the rate he is going, who knows?
Lucas has great fundamentals. If he can build his body and strengthen up, he could get picked up by a NBA team if the right opportunity is there. He doesn't have the dream body Black has! But he has a long long ways to go. He needs to dine on swine... hormone-fed bacon, by the truckloads, and stuff it in his jaws between long workouts in the gym.