@jaybate 1.0
"We are making this up as we go and I am no longer first string here."
You are right... there is no string. You're just first!
drgnslayr
11251 posts
"I am going to guess that the conference will split the bay, sort of speak. Smart will get a suspension no less than 3 games and possibly as long as the rest of the regular season; the TTU fan involved will be asked to not come back."
You nailed that!
According to the investigation the fan called Smart a "piece of cr@p" and volunteered to not attend any more home games this year.
This will soon quiet down... until March Madness when the sports media world will be there to remind us all over again!
Guys... I started this to recognize good hustling play.
It's a real positive when others come on the FLOOR BURN threads and give their own praises... doesn't have to agree with mine. It's all about giving some fan appreciation for these guys.
So a big ROCK CHALK for @Crimsonorblue22 and @jaybate !
I hope you are right. I want to have that optimism, too.
I could see us losing because of all the freshmen we have... going into that over-sized county fair building full of crazed purple fans and freaking out. Turning soft and throwing TOs everywhere.
This is a game I want Tharpe and Ellis to step up! Also... maybe Black. He doesn't have B12 experience but he has plenty of D1 ball under his belt and with his age should be a man.
I've got us as 50/50 on a win!
You are correct... heck.. he may have just made a flop comment. It has been reported that Smart was getting sensitive on all the attention he received for flopping. He did comment last week about it and made it sound like he was the victim in all of this....
He may have been victimized in his childhood or whatever... but in the game of college basketball, it is hard to look at Marcus Smart and see a victim!
Karma is always just around the corner... at the next turn....
Gheez... I'm scared about Monday! I don't know what team will show up... the one that showed up at Baylor or the one that showed up for Texas! It better not be like the Texas game or we will get stomped!
This idea that "the B12 regular season championship always goes through AFH" is not always correct.
Sometimes I think I'd go with "the B12 regular season championship always goes through the Octagon!"
How many times in the last 10 years has the Purple Kitties helped us secure the B12 championship?! I don't know but I'm sure it adds up quite a bit! Their mashing of Texas sure helped us out!
As long as we can win in Manhattan we always stand a good chance at winning the B12 title!
I just hope the right team shows up at the Sherronagon on Monday!
This game can also help our team confidence considerably!
Bruce Webber... no wonder they named a carburetor after him... he has the best choke in the league!
That quote needs to make it over to the quote thread!
Rock Chalk! Time to stomp the Kitties!
"4. Running the fastbreak: This is perhaps my biggest frustration with Tharpe."
Me, too! I can't believe it when we finally push the ball in the open court and Tharpe brings it all the way to the paint then stops... then maybe pivots and throws the pass out to the wing. Every time he does that he is letting the defense off the hook.
Tharpe has the talent and athleticism to take it right to the defender in the paint. If he hasn't learned to create scoring space then he needs a crash course in doing so. In most of those cases where he takes the ball right into the paint he should be taking it to the rim. Then, at the last second force the body contact (90% of the time it will draw the foul) and then score because you know exactly what scoring space you need.
Maybe he should watch tape of vanVleet for WSU. That guy is short and less athletic than Tharpe but he makes the most of his drives.
Another thing Tharpe could improve on (and the entire team... especially our quickest players, like Wiggins). The second we secure the defensive rebound our quick guys needs to sprint down the court. At least half the time they will create a scoring opportunity in the open court if they do it. In the least, Wiggins should be out on the break because he is deadly in the open court! Maybe Tharpe stays back to help secure the ball. Selden is a capable finisher, too.
Just imagine what this team could do in March if the lightbulb would go off in their heads?
So far, we haven't even reached half our potential.
I know, I know... I expect a lot... especially out of kids. I was a kid once and I didn't reach half of my potential then either!
It is what it is... and we'll get what we get in March. I'm just trying to enjoy the ride... regardless of our final destination!
Right on!
It is a downer for our entire conference. March is going to come around and east coast media is loading their file footage now... I'm sure they will spin it against our entire league. In the least, they will spin it (constantly) against OSU. How fair is that to do to the entire university? What about players like Nash and Brown? So instead of showing pregame action of all of OSU's weapons (like Nash and Brown) they will can the positive and just go negative... with long stories about Smart pushing fans.
Smart's overall body of work at OSU will probably have a negative impact. Too bad. I'm not a Cowboy fan, but I am a B12 fan... not a good thing for our conference.
I'm with the group that Ford dropped the ball a long time ago. A situation like this was primed to go down because he didn't have his thumb on Smart.
Ford needs to stand up and take some of the hit, too.
I remember a few times we've had discipline issues... like with the twins. Self went after them to clean up their act. His actions and policies helped curbed the twins and pointed them back on the right track.
About the only thing that is crystal clear on this issue is that Ford is sitting in the back seat!
"There is zero evidence that the fan in question called him by a racial slur...."
It has been all over Sportscenter today. I'm not saying it is true... but what if it is? Do we condone that in our league?
It might have just been Marcus defending his actions... but then, why did he go after this one guy? The fan already had a reputation for heckling.
This will be investigated and hopefully the truth will come out.
"The best way to beat a zone is by ball movement."
Good point. We still freak out when teams use a perimeter pinch. We don't attack those situations.
That's a practice issue. We should be exposing a 1-3-1 with backdoor slam lobs and other easy picking attacks. Instead, our guards often play defensive. The first mistake they often make is to turn their body away from the basket on those pinches. Instead, They need to go in attack mode. That means a combination of some strong pivots to establish some spacing, and then step through the pinch gaps to pass (or sometimes dribble). With today's abundance of foul calls there is no way we should be getting beat in these pinches with the quality of athletes we have. They should be in attack mode and know how to draw fouls if teams are pressing in too tight. Just stay away from the sidelines and then our other players need to be hustling with movement to create opportunities.
WVU is not a good defensive team. There were huge gaps and holes in their 1-3-1. And we never tested it enough to know if they knew how to bring responsive weak side help.
We just don't understand (as a team) that perimeter pinches and defenses like a 1-3-1 are OPPORTUNITIES TO ATTACK!
We need to get this team to break out of this "laid back" team concept.
ATTACK! ATTACK! ATTACK!
Had to give you a fav on that post!
You've, once again, brought a solid basketball knowledge prospective in your post!
Basically, I agree with all your points. I do give credit to Staten, however, for being THE best driving PG in college basketball today. That doesn't mean I totally excuse any of our perimeter guys for not being able to shut him down.
This game illustrates just how important it is to be able to stop penetration from the perimeter. Look at the foul trouble we faced yesterday! How many of those fouls came about because of their guard penetration?
I don't know... but I think I have to go back to RRob when thinking back to the last time we had a PG who could defend the drive.
I'm really starting to believe that our coaching staff doesn't know how to teach defense on stopping the drive.
I never see our guards hedge the drive... NEVER! It seems like we don't even scout other teams' perimeter players. Yesterday was a perfect example. Staten has one of the fastest first steps in college basketball, but even better, he has the absolute best lateral change of direction I've seen in many years, maybe ever! Okay... we know that. So why didn't we do more to stop it? Especially since we know that Staten isn't a good 3pt shooter! He also doesn't have one of the best crossover dribbles either. Knowing this information should help us decide how to play him... but it didn't! We didn't play him right!
The way our guards played him yesterday it wouldn't matter if we have TRele or any of the premiere NBA guards yesterday... all of those guys would have been burned by Staten if they didn't hedge him right.
Playing good defense to stop the drive starts with hedging. And you learn how to hedge a player by first studying the scouting report. A big reason why Travis Releford was so good at lock down was because of the work he put in before every game. He would always study his obvious assignment and then study the other team's most-prolific scorer because he knew he may be required to switch up on him at some point. Travis would then plan his hedge and all aspects of defending that particular player.
We have none of that going on today. Half of Staten's game could have been prevented by proper hedging. Force him into a dribble crossover... force him to use the weaker aspects of his game.
Tharpe never hedges a drive. He hands the driving lane right over to the ball handler. What a shame, because Tharpe is fast, and he'll never be known as a quality defender until he learns the hedge.
It appears that no one on this coaching staff understands this or surely they would be teaching it.
I'm pretty certain Marcus Smart is going to receive a big penalty for his shove. And he should. There needs to be clear boundaries in place, and first comes physical protection of both fans and players.
Now... on to that fan. If he did use the "N-word" that is unacceptable fan behavior and he should be permanently banned from future TT games. Once again, there needs to be clear boundaries set.
There is no other workplace situation where it is acceptable for anyone to taunt another individual with the "N-word."
It shouldn't stop at this... the B12 Head Office needs to (for once) be just a little bit proactive (in comparison to other conferences) and formalize stronger laws around fan behavior. They can levy penalties against schools for fan behavior, and in this case, if the allegations are correct, they need to penalize TT.
When behavior and actions go so far off base (as in this case) disciplinary action is the way to go! The B12 should mandate that every school put court side video cameras to review behavior and use it as evidence when problems occur. Warn the fans, so they are educated, then stick to the rules!
If I ever go to a game in AFH and catch a KU fan doing something like that, I will remove the fan from the game myself! Pay heed!
This was a lot tougher game than many fans were prepared for. Two months ago, we would have viewed this game as a sure thing, but Bob Huggins has shown us, once again, why he is a shoe-in for the Hall of Fame someday. WVU has several talented offensive weapons, one sticking out above the rest, Juwan Staten. Staten showed all day how easy it was for him to cut through the Jayhawk backcourt like it was warm butter. It has been realized for quite some time now that KU's backcourt defense needs improving, especially at the PG position.
Staten gave Naadir Tharpe fits all day, and it didn't take too long for Coach Self to make the strategic move to pull Tharpe off of Staten, if for no other reason than to save Tharpe from foul trouble.
I've been on Tharpe all season for not being able to stop the drive, however in this case, there may not be a single defender in college basketball capable of stopping Staten. He is that good! In the case of Staten, the best option is to use team defense to slow him down, or at least, limit the driving lanes for him to use. There were times in the second half where we accomplished that quite well.
This game turned out to be a really good test for us, and an excellent preparation game for us as March approaches. For the most part, we played good, solid team defense. There were several players who deserve credit for helping us secure this victory, including several key hustle plays that stand out.
Wayne Selden, once again, proved he doesn't mind going after loose balls. Even the commentators mentioned his efforts and how he is earning the reputation for hustling after loose balls.
Andrew Wiggins is continuing his efforts to become known for his defensive skills as much as his offensive skills. At one point in the game, a WV player had the ball and was down on his knees... Wiggins was the only Kansas player who realized the opportunity to go after him and the ball. He created a key steal that helped us maintain our edge.
Perry Ellis is also starting to sniff out loose balls more as the season progresses. He was able to snag 2 big steals in this game.
The Traylor/Black combo is really starting to pay big dividends for this team. The combo seems to realize that they need to make every playing moment count. Black is really asserting himself well on offense. He definitely doesn't shy away from the basket when he receives the ball in the paint. And every time we see Traylor, he appears to have just watched an old tape of Kevin Young and is all jazzed up to play! His energy has played a key role with this team, especially helping the overall team synergy, which sometimes can flatten and is too laid back.
So many key plays and key players in this game. But my pick for the winner of the FLOOR BURN AWARD is Joel Embiid! Joel has been stuck in a tiny rut the last few games. One issue is fouls, another issue is not finishing near the rim, and last, perhaps the biggest issue is his inexperience. Joel's game really exploded this year, but now everyone in the country has made him a target, and no team plays us now who doesn't develop a plan to stop Embiid's game. The most obvious, and probably easiest method to attack him is to get him in foul trouble. Every player coming into the paint with the ball is using countless head, shoulder and ball fakes. Anything to get Joel off his feet so they can draw the foul.
For the most part of yesterday's game, Joel appeared to be on his way to playing a limited role in this victory, until the last minutes, when Joel returned to the game (with his 4 fouls) and he decided he was going to finish this game on a high note. And boy did he!
Joel's return became pronounced immediately during a missed Jayhawk free throw. With the game's outcome still not established, Joel fought for the rebound and secured the ball and was fouled. He made his two free throws, creating what could be considered a 3-point play. That was the turning point in this game. It helped charge the team, and put us at a safer margin for victory.
At this time of year, coaches look for closers. Which player or players know how to close out a game? The best answer would be if an entire team is on the same beat and good closers... but it starts with one player who bumps up his play in the final moments. Joel was that player yesterday! After he made his two free throws he continued to dominate the game, without fouling out. He snagged more rebounds, blocked more shots, and scored key points. He did exactly what any quality coach would want to see... he hustled and gave it his all until the buzzer sounded to end the game!
If we can start developing that kind of a team attitude to closing games we will become a tough out in March! That is a common characteristic with teams who do well in March!
Now... upwards and onwards to the Purple Kitties on Monday!
Rock Chalk!
Conference Season Tally:
Wayne Selden 4
Joel Embiid 3
Perry Ellis 2
Andrew Wiggins 2
Naadir Tharpe 2
Tarik Black 2
Frank Mason 1
Better yet... look up the price on what they are trading for!
No question, this is a dangerous team!
We need to attack Williams in the post. Get him in foul trouble and we own the post all day.
Tharpe needs to step up on defense and shut down the drive on Staten. Staten is very capable of giving Tharpe fits and maybe foul trouble!
Selden should be up for the task of shutting down Harris.
WVU doesn't turn the ball over much, so we need to be good on the boards today. If we don't come ready to play, and we turnover the ball and don't crash the boards, we are in for another loss at AFH! A big part of this game will be decided by the number of possessions.
I'm feeling like this will become a battle to win the foul war. We need Joel to stay on the court. We have way too many scoring weapons that are capable in the post... so we need to use them and attack Williams. While we are at it, attack Dibo, too. Once WVU gets into post foul trouble, we'll own the post to score in and we'll own a rebounding advantage... two factors that will be hard to overcome for the Mountaineers.
This could be a big game for Wiggins... he's probably ready to put up some good offense again. I think he reads the sports tabloids and sees he is falling behind several players concerning NBA draft positions. WVU really doesn't have a way to stop him.
Embiid might be ready to get back on track, too.
Regardless how our young guns play, Ellis should go big today. This is his kind of team to play and he can dominate. I wouldn't be surprised if he pops in 20!
What about Bitcoins?
"How many times can these reporters keep asking the "NBA" question? It is really unbelievable. What's the kid going to say? "Yea, I'm definitely leaving?" Or "I'm definitely staying.""
It is because most of the media doesn't prepare for interviews. Most of the media doesn't know an interesting question to ask Joel... only the obvious. Heck... any of us in here could interview him for an hour and keep it interesting!
You earn bonus dollars today!
Yikes! That was like pulling back the sheets on an old guy without his underwear on and handing him a mirror!
I like your optimism!
But seriously... if these two teams played 10 games against each other in March... what would the outcome be?
6 games Kansas, 4 Kentucky?
I like to crunch my head around probabilities.... but to be honest, this is a tough one. First.. we are a good month out still. Both of these teams are improving rapidly, plus there is the chance for injuries and other issues between now and then. Just running through a lineup giving advantages doesn't nail down a game outcome prediction. It will be more about the synergy the teams bring to the game.
If we can throw out the Texas game, I like our synergy, and I like it better than Kentucky's. And Kentucky doesn't have the total beast interior that gives our guys trouble (like Texas has). Randle is a beast... but that is on offense. His defense sometimes vanishes completely. I'm keeping an eye on Johnson to estimate where he will be in a month. I'm not worried about Willie C.
The key for us is to keep Perry and Naadir pushing hard. That's our big advantage because these guys are about the only ones who have seen March territory before (on both teams).
I give an advantage to KU because of Perry and Naadir... no other reason. Wiggins, Selden, Embiid... are all very capable of becoming invisible in March. We've now seen all 3 vanish during games! So you can't count on any of them in March... you just hope they show up, at least some of the time!
Nice work!
I wasn't surprised with Embiid's progression... I think most of us in here thought he would make a big leap. I think it is more the crowd outside of Lawrence, who weren't paying attention.
Tharpe wasn't supposed to be a scoring machine. I recall Keegan said we never have to count on him for a single point. Well... glad he's provided more than assists! I guess probably 3 games he has taken over and won. Imagine if we were siting here with 8-losses and behind Texas in the B12 standings?
Even with the bigger guards at Kentucky, if Tharpe can belt deep 3s he'll shoot over length unless they play out, and if they do that then they will expose their foul-prone interior for us to attack. We have the same issue with our post and need good guard play to add a protective layer around our post players.
Sounds like a marriage contract! ;)
I've been thinking about it. I usually catch Kentucky games, but have missed the last couple. Missing just two games makes me put a question mark over what to expect. They are a bit like Kansas, but with even more freshmen. You can watch just a half of Kentucky basketball and either see nothing impressive, or you see a big run and also experience one of their players breaking through a barrier.... figuring out how to achieve something in D1. We've seen it happen with Wiggins and Selden... and several times with Embiid.
So it is easy to update match-ups... more difficult to make a prediction. All of those star freshmen (on both sides) are down as a 'maybe' in March. The result details of a game have too many possibilities to predict.
Right now... to be honest... the surprise player of them all (over both teams) isn't a star freshman. It's star junior, Naadir Tharpe. We've suddenly found his 'on' switch and when it is 'on' he carries us to victory! Tharpe owned Baylor. Guess the question is how many more times will Tharpe put his big boy pants on again? Will his light stay 'on' every game now, through March?
With Tharpe 'on' we possess a threat from the 3-line. Defenses eventually have to go get him. When they start doing that our game changes and our options on offense start opening up. By the time mid-February comes around, a lot of teams will put up pretty solid defense. Successful teams need a consistent tool they can pull from their belt that will conquer solid defense. Often times, it's these teams that start surging around March Madness. It's the teams that are starting to play sound defense, but also have a good offensive weapon that can tear apart another team's solid defense. That's the kind of edge you want to be good at as March approaches...
I've got to hand it to USAToday. I normally put their journalism level down towards the bottom, but they have stepped up on a few good basketball pieces this year. They stepped up again:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaab/big12/2014/02/06/university-of-texas-longhorns-basketball-coach-rick-barnes/5264209/ ↗
↗
Pretty good information concerning the recruiting battles in Texas, and who runs the show.
Also explains where Rick Barnes' head is at. Pretty sound guy and the B12 is lucky to have him.
Sounds interesting!
@jaybate 1.0
"I think Self's move of Wiggins to the two is his first step in moving in the direction that you would like to see. We are soon going to begin to see him impacting Games in the fashion of BenMac coming off screens and some cutting through the clutter."
I hope so! I think you are right!
You are probably right... and I think fan bases and administrations can only take so much, too. Martin reminds me of my dad... so I have had over half a century to get used to the screaming style!
At least Martin was completely respectful to Self and the program at Kansas. He constantly went out of his way to speak highly of Jayhawk basketball!
Maybe we can make him an assistant after he gets canned! hahahahehe!
Really nice post!
I don't know the ins and outs of Drew's coaching philosophy. I did read that he is really popular with his players. Barnes is really popular with his players, too.
I sort of put those two in the same boat. It feels like Barnes is a bit more capable however. Coaches that are really nice and popular with their players usually don't make the best coaches.
We often get critical about Self screaming too much at his players, but he gets results. To some level coaches need to scream at players. If nothing else it proves they care just by their intensity.
I only had one softy type coach that everyone liked and he sucked! Coaches have to be intense... I've recently seen Drew show more intensity on the sidelines.. maybe he is feeling the heat.
You know they have a renewed spirit for sports success at Baylor! They seem to be doing pretty well in most of their programs.
We've all put Drew in the same Calipari boat a long time ago... Rolex watches as gifts, etc. But maybe Drew is just a soft guy who knows how to befriend players.
I'm guessing in my post... He definitely doesn't seem like a capable coach. All that talent and he really doesn't have much to show for it!
Excellent counter!
I never liked the Mizzou rival because it was in-conference. Half the time they might suck, but they would give us a run for the money because they get up for games with Kansas. Rival games, in general, are battles to the end so we have no advantage by starting one with another B12 team because no other team in our conference keeps up with our success. By making one of them a rival just puts them on a competitive balance with us in games. I really don't want another B12 rival!
Hard to say what direction WSU will go... but if they sink, we can always kill the rivalry. We aren't signing a deal into perpetuity! The Kentucky/Louisville rivalry didn't start until Louisville beat Kentucky in the NCAA tournament. BTW: they call it "Battle for the Bluegrass" and is ranked as the 3rd best rivalry in all of college sports. Conference affiliation has nothing to do with it. The Cards, up until this year, were in the AAC, not one of the power conferences. Personalities helped get this rivalry kicked back up... mainly, Pitino switching camps!
If it helps WSU stay strong, then that is a good thing, even for KU basketball. We are better to be surrounded by good programs and playing them, then out in a desert. It certainly seems to help teams back east because they are very close in proximity.
Yes, Self is a great recruiter. I hope he can stay at KU for eternity. Highly unlikely. When I was a student at Kansas we completely sucked in basketball.
We can't just manufacture a rivalry. The "loathing of fan bases" just needs to be there in the first place, and you illustrated it is already in place! I'm certain quite a few people on both sides feel the same way. That is how rivals get going!
The big disadvantage is you live in Wichita! So you are bound to catch an earful on that one oddball year they beat us.
If you want some help I'll get you with a pro Kansas crowd in Woo-town... I hate to think of you stuck around a bushel of wheat mascot!
I miss having a rival. The Purple Kitties just aren't up for the task! Who else do we despise? I'll give you a clue... starts with black and ends with gold...
I see this like I see the B12... being reactive to teams leaving the conference. We can either be reactive and wait until damage is done, or we can be proactive. I hope we aren't missing a rivalry 20 years from now. We will feel the effects, I guarantee. And Self will be at least a decade away from Kansas basketball. I'd hate to think we revert back to where we were when I was at KU!
That is why I'm proactive... I remember plenty of bleak years of Jayhawk basketball. Yes... we are great now... and we should be proactive to keep it that way!
@jaybate 1.0
"KU's offense has seemed to be getting less and less diversified each game recently."
I totally agree with that!
We are starting to play that spacing game... where we think that just moving the ball quickly, from side to side on the perimeter, will suddenly create offense. I've been getting a little taste in my mouth of other teams we had with stagnant offense... three perimeter players passing back and forth and all 5 players basically not moving around.
Offense needs to be fluid. Most of the players need to be in a constant state of motion.
Andrew Wiggins could easily punch 30 ppg with just a tiny change. Instead of him setting up on offense on the perimeter, just waiting to get the ball and then look at his defender and see if he can take him one-on-one... Andrew needs to be playing his game off the ball. While our 1 and 2 are playing catch back and forth, Andrew needs to be darting diagonally through our interior players, which creates big multi-player screens. Usually the other teams' interior players will screen for Andrew every bit as much as our interior players! Then he pops out of the pack and he is wide open.. either in mid range or at the 3pt line!
This would be the first time all year where we actually use his foot speed to create an advantage!
His potential is totally being wasted now.
In years ahead... Andrew will learn the pro game so well that he will understand the single inch of scoring space he needs to score. All the great scorers develop this skill. It allows them to usually stand around and then score once they get the ball because they know just the single inch of scoring space they need. Andrew isn't playing at that level yet. He needs plenty of space to feel comfortable on his shot... and he still needs some extra space to prevent someone from blocking his shot.
The way for him to get the space he needs at his current skill level is to hustle (off ball) more on offense by running through the post clutter and popping free on the other side. Yes.. it requires more running... but it is the sure way where he can receive the pass with plenty of scoring space!
Excellent post, my friend!
I believe every word you stated!
You are explaining how things are today. Back in my college days... there were only two teams out west given a decent amount of recognition.... UCLA and Indiana! Noticed how I said "teams out west"... because in the media, Indiana and California might as well have been neighbors because both were considered "out west."
All of this goes beyond basketball... it is just a culture thing. In recent years, with growth of 24 hr news media (including sports) and the internet... news west of Kentucky is now being sprinkled into the media scene, even on the east coast!
Where you don't want to be today is on the west coast. There is no way to schedule games to fit the time slots in the east or even midwest. We are lucky to be only one time slot away from the east. This is the reason the west coast started lagging competitively... because as the east coast media market started showing more ball, we benefited, as did other teams in the midwest, but the time zone issue has dampened some of the growth out on the west coast. It really hurt their recruiting efforts because players wanted more national exposure.
Today, I think the west is starting to finally "rebound" back. Teams like Arizona and SDSU are proving they can play ball out west again. There just doesn't seem to be enough space to showcase more teams out west. Once you go east, even many of the crummy teams get plenty of press, because they are in the right place and right conference... and they have already built a big fan base.
It is hard to find commentators that are totally unbiased.... in any part of the country! I guess it is only natural that they have their biases just like all of us fans do. I'm sure if someone put a microphone under my chin I would be quickly hated by all non-Kansas fans!
@jaybate 1.0
"If Wichita State wants to be considered the equal of KU, then they need to stop knocking KU and start winning at 80% for the next 25 years, plus go to several more final fours, plus win a ring. "
I hear you, JB... but I've never heard WSU claim to be the equal of KU... definitely not in the stature department. In that area, I've only heard praise from Shockers.. both fans and coaches. They just want to play every year. And the past years they've had a good team.
We have the potential to develop a rivalry, and that is good for both programs and the State of Kansas!
Hey... just look at Kentucky vs Louisville. That rivalry really isn't very old... back in the day, Louisville was the WSU and was always wanting to play Kentucky. They never would until Louisville beat them in the tournament. Kentucky fans suddenly wanted a piece of Louisville back so they signed up and have never gone back! Today... both teams (and fan bases) have nothing but praise for their rivalry! It has become a huge deal in the State and both programs were lifted by doing it, including Kentucky!
Rivalries are where it is at, and is one of the best advantages a program can have for recruiting. If you don't believe me... go to a Kentucky-Louisville game and see how many recruits are in attendance! Recruits want to be in an environment that is juiced and nothing gets players, coaches and fans more juiced than a rivalry!
Kansas is really blowing this deal!
Missouri, our bast*rd stepchild is gone! We have no more rivalry in basketball! KSU is a joke! WSU represents the perfect situation to build a rivalry. The fans already have plenty of animosity towards each other. And it is a HUGE ADVANTAGE to build a rivalry that is not in our own conference! We can play WSU every year and it won't threaten our string of conference championships!
With the new arrangement of 3 games... one at AFH, Sprint and Intrust in Wichita, the gate outperforms games in AFH! We pick up 500 in ticket sales! The sell of licensed goods would be huge! And it is one more big game KU can have on their schedule every year in pre-conf that gets boo-coo media attention!
Just converse with anyone from the State of Kentucky and ask their opinion... if they would like to give up their rival game! 100% want to keep it!
We are reacting out of fear and this idea that it is about propping WSU up to our status level. That is simply not the case, and WSU will never be on our status level. Really... NO PROGRAM IN AMERICA IS! Not even Kentucky! The inception of basketball rests in Lawrence, Kansas! But we can't use that fact to keep us locked up from challenges. I've never heard anyone from WSU who believes their program has the status equal to Kansas, or anywhere close! That is a red herring manufactured in Lawrence, Kansas!
Let's play the Shocks... and let's kick their arse back to Wichita!
Thanks a million for posting on this thread. I believe we all have our own experiences that should be discussed in here because nothing is more important than competitiveness when it comes to most things in life... including college basketball at KU!
I'm definitely not a psychologist or have any formal background in psychology, beyond a couple psych classes in college. In my personal experience, it seems that much of competitiveness may even be a part of our genetic code. But then, everyone has some level of competitiveness, and it seems that we can teach them to reach their potential for what they have. That addresses both of your posts.
About 3 decades ago I coached some kids... it seemed like I reached them better with a "carrot strategy" even though in my own experiences growing up I did pretty well when receiving the whip!
@JhawkCB - I've got some ideas for you to try. My teams always scrapped hard for balls because of some drills I put in place. First off, only practice on wood floors so you cushion their efforts. I tried to get all of my players to buy both elbow and knee pads. Once they did that, it gave them a sort of license to go sliding for balls. I would have specific practice drills where the only thing we did was slide for balls. Have 2 or 3 players going for a ball you would roll down the court. Within a few minutes you find out who are your scrappiest players. But if you give rewards for scrapping (lots of clapping, complimentary words, a show of excitement, and sometimes a bribery prize, like a soda or little trophy or something) everyone gets a bit more competitive because they want to be rewarded. The players who stand out will quickly earn rewards. With the other players you have to find ways for them to win sometimes. Everyone has to receive a reward now and then or they feel inferior and give up, but that doesn't mean you give everyone the same prize when others are clearly better. You have to reward them at different levels.
A big part of all of this relates to how well you bond with your players. Never talk down at them, talk across at them, eye-to-eye, and they will be excited to do what you want.
We sometimes would get yelled out from other coaches and other players' parents for scrapping too much. They thought we were kind of bullies on the court when clearly we were just hustling for the ball.
The biggest key is to design practice drills that focus in on only one particular thing you want out of them. If your players have a 15 minute drill every day where they scrap for balls, eventually it will become second nature and they'll do it in a game. You can even use a command like "LOOSE BALL" hollered out every time in your practice drill. Then during a game, when the ball is loose yell "LOOSE BALL" and it will trigger them to go scrap for it. By using a command it makes it easier for them to apply your practice drill to a game situation.
Another good drill is to have two players face each other and both wrap their hands around the ball. Then blow a whistle and have them both try to rip it free from the other player. Rotate players all the time so everyone faces everyone eventually. Do that drill on a regular basis, even for just a few minutes. It gets them conditioned into realizing they can take the ball away from another player, and also they can prevent other players from ripping the ball out of their hands. Few, if any, of the teams you play will practice this, and because you practice it and help them learn it, you will win all those 50/50 balls.
Make practice fun. Make every drill more like a fun game and you will keep them interested. We always did fun things, like learning how to party on the sidelines... players high five'n, jumping up and down and going crazy. Kids like to party that way, and we would celebrate constantly in practice, like when any other player did something good. I was the trigger judge and would indicate something well done and the players watching would do some kind of celebration move. It was a good way to bond them as a team, and it would encourage players to do their best so their own peers would celebrate their success!
You can quickly have the scrappiest team in your league!
The key is he continues to help the team out regardless if he nails shots or not.
Then when his shot returns, he has to make sure and still do the other things he was doing when his shot wasn't dropping. He shouldn't trade one for the other. We'll need him to be productive on both sides of the ball in March, but in the least, he needs to keep up on rebounding and defense.
It just doesn't do us any good to belittle the Shockers. It shows that they get under our skin.
I'm happy for the Shockers and we'll see how both teams do in March. There won't be any excuses on SOS then... and both KU and WSU have to pull their weight or go home.
I like that I have another Kansas team to cheer for. Obviously... I won't be cheering for them if we have to play them!
I hope the Kitties at KSU make March Madness, too. I just wish they still had Frank Martin... someone I liked as head coach!
Concerning Smart and how he nailed the inconsistency in refs this year...
I precluded with "Smart's perspective is driven by his competitiveness... and so it is going to be tilted... " because he was correct in his general statement, but concerning his own predicament, he has been treated with way too much 'fairness'.
Yes... he complains about everyone else, and he will always portray himself as the victim. He is warped in his competitive views.
Seems contradictory to their early enforcement of hand check rules.. calling even the smallest hand check.
Actually, I agree that it should fall under the discretion of the refs as to the penalty because of the variation in severity. But the refs need to all go to one school in preparation for a season, and they need to go back to school at the end to be graded on their season.
I sincerely apologize.
What I found interesting in this article was how many times they kept mentioning that Marshall wasn't for everybody. It kind of seems Marshall isn't for anyone outside of Shocker fans.
I'm impartial towards him, but I do like the competitiveness of his team.
Right on!
Here is the link:
Smart's perspective is driven by his competitiveness... and so it is going to be tilted... but he nailed this part:
""It's so inconsistent," Smart said about the new rules. "We have no idea what to expect. And as a player, it messes with your mind. It's incredible how inconsistent the new rules have been.""
I'm certain all players feel this way.
Good post on Embiid, and all true!
"Joel is finding out what is like to play the toughest schedule in Division I basketball."
And if he thinks college is long... he has a lot to experience at the next level. The No Boys Allowed league is 82 games long, and then comes the playoffs! And that doesn't include the additional 8+- games each team plays in preseason.
Joel should return for another year just to build his body to withstand the rigors of the NBA. Once he gets into the league, he won't be in "build up" mode any longer... he'll be in "tear down" mode because that's what happens to their bodies when they play a minimum of 90 games in one year. And the playoffs can add as many as 28 additional games to the season! Imagine playing 118 games in one year?
Joel doesn't have the leg strength to endure a season this long. He'll have a higher risk of injury. He needs to spend all his off-court time with Hudy until he leaves!
Guess it is all in the camera angles!
Bet she can rope some steers!
Notice the congenial smile from the A&M fan? He better play it safe!
"Regarding the starters still in with a 16pt lead..."
That was the right thing to do. To keep on the gas, instead of possibly leaving Waco with a small-margin victory.
Also, by keeping in starters, it gave them clear possession of this game. The owned it, and they posted a decent beat down on Baylor in Waco!
This team needs confidence, and it starts with our starters!
They have to be held accountable, and the first step with that is to make them own it!
I found something rare this morning... a quality write-up on USAToday:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaab/mvc/2014/02/04/college-basketball-wichita-state-coach-gregg-marshall/5202599/ ↗
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This explains a lot.
"After a year, Marshall was off to the College of Charleston to work eight years as an assistant under John Kresse, who recalls Marshall absorbing some losses so hard that afterward he would enter the restroom and vomit."
That's a common trait of competitors... people who can't stand to lose! They'll puke over any kind of loss... even a silly bet over a game of Nerfball.
Unfortunately, I missed that game!
This was a different team than was on the floor in Austin three nights earlier. This team brought one key ingredient: hustle! If we didn't bring hustle we would have endured the same fate we suffered in Austin. We didn't start out a hot team last night. Our "three amigos" freshmen were colder than the arctic front blasting over America now. If we didn't hustle, and continue to hustle all night, Baylor would have pulled away from us and gave us a good pounding.
Since we hustled all night, that single asset kept us in the game and didn't allow Baylor to pull away because we dominated the boards and got a fair share of loose balls. Possessions mattered in this game and we did an excellent job of controlling possessions.
It may seem that Naadir Tharpe is the obvious choice here for the FLOOR BURN AWARD because of his offensive domination, but this game required a lot more than Naadir's hot hand to secure the victory. This truly was a team effort, so many Jayhawks deserve a carrot for playing an important role in the win.
First off, Naadir. He was the man on offense, knocking down 22 points off a blistering 9-of-13, 4-of-6 from trey. He did more than knock down shots, he ran the team and kept the tempo moving. There was no jogging in this game! He also nabbed 5 rebounds and had 4 assists. He limited his turnovers to 2, pretty solid performance on the road!
Next, Perry Ellis deserves a juicy carrot, too. He scored 14 points off 5-of-10 shooting and had 10 rebounds, giving him a double-double on a night he had to face the big, athletic Cory Jefferson in the post, and he limited Cory to only 1 rebound! Perry also had 2 assists to go along with 2 blocked shots. Perry brought energy with him and he was rewarded with good play and excellent stats... and a victory for his team!
I'm glad I can compliment Naadir and Perry for this game. When things go wrong (like in Austin) I first clamp down on these two for not pulling their weight. From here on out we have to count on these guys more than the rest. Every game counts and competition will tighten. They've both been in this position before.
As the first half was winding down, and we were behind by a few points, Wayne Selden quietly did his thing. He didn't rack up points or rebounds... he shut down Heslip. Self moved him over to Heslip in hopes of shutting him down, and that is exactly what Wayne did. Heslip's day was over from that point forward. He didn't score another point, and it was his 3's that were keeping Baylor in the game. Wayne deserves a lot of credit! Wayne also helped in other areas, scoring only 4 points but grabbed 3 rebounds and helped our offense with 5 assists including a couple off of penetration that helped break down Baylor's defense.
Tarik Black had a great game. He played 23 minutes while Joel Embiid only logged 17 minutes, because of his foul trouble. We needed presence in the post. That was an area we were lacking in Austin. Tarik came through with 9 rebounds, 6 points and a steal. He wasn't the defensive presence Joel was, but he definitely cushioned our loss of Joel, and actually played better offense than Joel did in this game. Few teams in this country have a decent 5 they can bring in off the bench who can do what Tarik does.
Last, Andrew Wiggins deserves a lot of credit. He wasn't on his game on this Texas swing, but he hung in there, and gave us a big push at the end which gave us a safe margin of victory. Andrew gave us plenty of hustle, leading the team with 3 steals along with 7 rebounds and 5 assists. Those are good stats for a guy who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn all day. Everyone looks at Andrew for points, but he will go through ups and downs with his shot. Other areas of the game he can give us solid performances every night; like rebounding, lockdown defense and team defense. Andrew gave plenty of effort away from the ball, and we needed a possession advantage in this game.
We should take a big lesson away from our road journey to the Rattlesnake State. Our game with Texas showed how bad we can look when we don't bring hustle to the game. Our game with Baylor showed us how we can win even if we don't play our best basketball if we just hustle for 40 minutes! Our Baylor game could have been a repeat of our Texas game and would have if we hadn't brought hustle with us!
Rock Chalk!
Conference Season Tally:
Wayne Selden 4
Perry Ellis 2
Joel Embiid 2
Andrew Wiggins 2
Naadir Tharpe 2
Tarik Black 2
Frank Mason 1
@jaybate 1.0
I agree with much of what you are saying. The whistle was swallowed to let the game clock run out so programming could go on.
The game was losing points for several reasons. There is total defensive freedom in college ball. Pros can't play full out zone. College coaches have been investing more in defense over the past decade or so because they realize defense wins championships. Coaches like Self, who win a ton of games, is noted for defense. Others follow.
Look back 20 years in college basketball and you would never hear the term "lock-down defender!" 20 years ago teams didn't play nearly as good of defense, and the offense wasn't typically as prolific either. The game has developed, and the development slightly favored defense over the last 10 years.
There was plenty of contact in college ball... hand checks... did it reduce the scoring? Maybe a touch. But not to the point where you flip the game on its ear to counter it.
Half of these guys playing college ball think they should go on to pro ball. Well... pro ball has plenty of hand checks. It has plenty of everything, including body slams at the rim. The old college game prepared these guys better for what is to come. It was still a much softer game of basketball. Most freshmen playing college ball can adjust. Few of those players are ready to adjust to NBA-style basketball... or Euroball... or anything where they will draw a paycheck.
Personally... I never minded a guy giving me a stiff hand check. It gave me several options. I could usually swat his hand check which sometimes slowed him down. Or I could absorb his hand check and use it later to tie up his one hand to prevent him from blocking my shot. Another thing... it helped me know where exactly he was concerning my spacing. Scoring space is sometimes calculated down to only an inch. I was never a prolific scorer. But I was respected at my level of ball and my numbers wouldn't have been any different if hand checks were not allowed... let me revise that.. my numbers would have been higher because I would have shot more FTs and I could nail FTs!
I think Marcus can end up an excellent pro.... if he can just reel himself in a bit to where he can function within the standards.
Man... when that guy is on, he can own a game. Not many players can do that. The NBA rewards alpha dogs.
It's like everything else in this society. When the bottom can't reach the bar, lower the bar.
The NCAA wanted more offense. So restrict the defense.
Why not just have an extra 6th man on offense?! He can only go to the half court line, and he always stays on offense!
I can't even be serious anymore.... because the NCAA took something that wasn't broken and they changed it... to broken!
You got that right!
Kane = Smart
...and now... did you see Syracuse vs Duke? Boeheim must record all of Okie States games and use for training purposes!
Heaven forbid... but college ball now has the capability of repelling as many fans as the NBA did!
Hell... let's just add another 70 games to the season.... give each player 6 fouls.... end all school music for the pop elevator music... make zone defenses illegal...
At least the league lets them play some defense.
True.. but do you think that has been caused by his flop? He is using the flop in order to salvage his game.
Marcus Smart College Success ≠ Rule Changes
No one took a bigger hit than Marcus. The NCAA wanted to increase offense and reduce injuries. Yes... that meant dismantling defense. But it also meant targeting bulldozer players like Smart. I saw this coming last year for Marcus. His game was too aggressive and they started popping him with more calls.
I think his flopping is more about him saying... "hey, I'm a victim, too!"
People who victimize always like to proclaim themselves the victim.
Truth is... Marcus should have left for the league last year. I have no idea why he came back for more. I'm guessing it is his competitiveness... he has too much of It and it distorts his ability to make decisions... in games... in life. We all know people like him. He was getting tagged last year, and he wanted to come back and prove everyone wrong. He is competitive to the point of being sick. Ford has no way of controlling Marcus (even if Ford was a man).
I'm sure Marcus will probably dig himself in a hole in the NBA just like he did in college. He'll over-compete to the point of sickening a crowd of people... like he did in college with his flopball. He needs boundaries around his competitiveness.
I'm actually thinking someone is getting to him. Someone is reaching him. He is still flopping. But he has been backing down quite a bit ever since his tirade where he left the bench and went under the bleachers.
I always like competitors... until they go over the edge. I hope Marcus finds a way to pull it back and compete at levels that are socially acceptable. Like... back off all the flops!