Might as well start a thread heading towards March Madness.

Here's the madness part. I thought I saw this on the game last night, something about Auburn being on the #1 seed line by Jerry Palm who apparently must be an SEC cool aid drinker. They lost to also ran SC.

Winners and losers on CBS today has Kentucky as a winner because they broke a 5 game losing streak. They called the SEC a winner because all their top teams lost to middle tier teams which by their convoluted logic makes the middle tier teams now dance worthy.

How many big 12 teams make it? Hard to say with OU's meltdown and all, but I'm seeing 7 teams dancing, but not saying which 7 besides us, and TT. I mean, WVU is 8-6 in the league. OU even worse I think. CBS article says Texas is now a last four in team. We shall see.

I have MSU, Villanova, Xavier as the best locks for #1 seeds, and they'll probably include whomever gets hot from a major conference in the next few weeks. Could be us even, but who knows.

We're probably a 2-3 seed is my bracketology guess.

@wissox Some crazy people are saying 1 seed but I would agree, likely a 2 or 3 depending on how things shake out. Disaster scenario is 4/5 but that would require a lot of Ls.

I wouldn't have objected to Auburn on the 1 line before yesterday. They were 2 up in a conference that's probably going to get 8-9 teams in the tournament. They're a legitimately good team.

@Texas-Hawk-10 The were ranked as high as 9th in the various polls and that was before their loss yesterday. Can't really see Auburn getting a 1. If TTech could win our conference and our tourney, as strange as it sounds, they'd get my vote for a 1 seed.

@wissox I don't see Auburn getting a 1 seed at this point without help after yesterday. I think if KU or Tech win out, they'd be a deserving 1 seed. I think Nova and Michigan State are pretty well locked in as 1's at this point.

@Texas-Hawk-10 agreed. they were talking about TT being a 3 seed prior to their loss to Baylor, which makes no sense unless they fall off.

I would be shocked to see us on the one line regardless if we win the conference, 6 loses is a lot for a 1 seed. OU IMO should be on the bubble right now, 16-10 and losers of 8 of their last 10. If they lose to us Monday no reason other than Young viewership to put them in.

We need to bury OU tomorrow night.

OU being ranked and KSU not being ranked is hilarious and sad. Trae effect!!!

@BShark Very true, the only reason KSU isn’t a lock right now (1 more win and I think they are) is their 330th non conference SOS and a terrible loss to Tulsa. I said on different thread, I didn’t know what the selection committee was thinking saying they are a top 16 team. They are 32nd in RPI, 40th in BPI and 38th in kenpom. That sounds like a bubble team to me, at least ESPN is paying attention to Midwest hoops lol.

KU is back in the top 10. Can KU win out the regular season? That is the real question! https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-rankings-kansas-climbs-into-top-10-after-win-over-west-virginia/ ↗

BShark said:

We need to bury OU tomorrow night.

Here is what I can see easily happen tomorrow night with Oklahoma. - -I think quite possibly Trae will come out have a huge game meaning some where close to 30 - -BUT with this swoon this team is in, I don't see the supporting cast giving him enough help.

I think we get the win despite Trae's big game - we just have to make sure we don't let Trae AND Manik is his name right? - they both can't go off -but with the way they have been playing I think we take this.

I noticed yesterday and some other that I have talked to says it looks like to them that some of the Oklahoma players have cashed it in - -very well might be some chemistry issues we will see - -but I think we come out play hard as a team - -we take this game - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

kjayhawks said:

I would be shocked to see us on the one line regardless if we win the conference, 6 loses is a lot for a 1 seed. OU IMO should be on the bubble right now, 16-10 and losers of 8 of their last 10. If they lose to us Monday no reason other than Young viewership to put them in.

I agree I don't think there is anyway we end up as a # 1. - Actually personally I don't care if we are a 2 - -not a lot of difference and maybe a better ending. Just seems we just don't that well as a # 1 maybe a little less pressure who knows. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

According to CBS Sunday top 25 the possible 2 seeds or TT, Duke, and KU have a challenging schedule for the next 4 games! There should be some movement in the #2 department lol!

Palms has moved us up to a #1 after the win over the Hillbillies, and Auburn's loss. We have a very solid base with 11 top 50 Kenpom wins. Only Virginia has as many. Still, it would be a longshot to make a #1 seed, but I think we're a real solid 2 seed.

@kjayhawks

Where did you get that SOS ranking for KSU? Sagaring has KSU's SOS at the 42, Massey 45, Pomeroy 49 and the NCAA at 58. Once Conference play started the SOS for all the Conference teams went way up.

Well I just read from zag's blog - -that ol Joey L - with ESPN has us as a # 1 seed along with Virginia - - Xavier - - Villanova.

Sorry guys I can't see it. I don't see how you can keep Michigan State off the one line, with the way the been playing and then how they came back yesterday and I think they are what # 2 in the Nation and you don't have them as a # 1 seed? - -come on - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73 Tech beat NW by 35. Yes, great comeback yesterday. But Sparty doesn't have the schedule to support a 1 seed. 2 Top 50 RPI victories is less than alot of midmajors that aren't even ranked. Not saying they can't play like a 1 seed, but they will punished for the cupcake schedule.

@JayHawkFanToo He was only referencing nonconf SOS.

@mayjay

Do you remember having this discussion early in the season when KU's SO was pretty low? Most elite programs have weak SOS before conference because the play cupcakes. Most cupcakes have seriously good SOS at the bogging oif the season because they play the part of a punching bag for elite teams. Once conference play starts the SOS becomes more realistic. Pre-conference play SOS has not that much weight, particularly for teams in elite conferences that play tough conference schedules.

The NCAA selection committee had Kansas as a 2 seed (#6 overall) as of one week ago. Given that three teams ahead of us lost this week and we had solid wins, it’s not unreasonable to say we are on the 1 line. MSU was a 3 in the selection committee’s preview. Barely beating a bad Northwestern team doesn’t vault them to a 1 seed.

@JayHawkFanToo That’s their non conference SOS according to RPI, it’s 328 on Kenpom. I doubt their non conference is any better on the sites you listed.

@JayHawkFanToo F it is really bad it can hurt, so KSU's nonconf SOS can make a big difference when it is only 20th from the bottom. That is what kept S Carolina out of the Dance 2 years ago (as one of the first 4 out they automatically became a 1 seed in the the NIT). The whole SEC has been trying to upgrade their nonconf schedules to try to get more teams in.

I don't want the #1 seed. To be honest I'd take about a 4 or 5 seed and let them be the underdog. Tired of the losing to a lower seeded team scenario that has afflicted our team the past 5 seasons and 9 of 10 or whatever it is. This is one year we really don't deserve the #1 seed. We have too many ugly losses obviously with the home losses to good but not great teams.

Nebraska just saw its tourney hopes take a huge dump after losing to Illinois

Houston is an intriguing team that is likely in this year.

Bigs wins- Arkansas, Wichita, Cincinnati.

Bad losses- Tulane, LSU, Drexel

21-5, 11-3 in conference.

Only 4 ranked teams haven't lost in the past TWO Weeks. How crazy is that.

Ranked teams went 27-20 this week. 15 ranked teams lost this week alone.

Auburn lost one of its starters Anfernee McLemore for the season. Was averaging 7 and 5 and nearly 3 blocks a game. Huge loss for them especially since they weren't a huge team to begin with. They are down to two 6'8 guys now

Two teams are locks for #1 seed right now, Virginia & Villanova. They are a combined 28-5 vs Top 100 competition (RPI).

KU is not out of the race for a #1 seed which sounds crazy but its true. 17-6 against Top 100 is the most wins and most games played against Top 100 competition in all of D-1. If they won the last 4 regular season games and won the Big-12 tourney there is no way they are not getting a #1 seed at 28-6. I can't see a team that potentially wins the Big-12 regular season, tourney championship and the resume they will potentially have not being rewarded. Of course the road to get their is difficult. Most likely they end with a #2 seed which was their seed line in the initial reveal.

What does the committee do with Michigan St. They have a 26-3 record and have had the easiest schedule of any Power 5 team in history. 11 wins against 150+ opponents. They have only played 11 teams all season in the Top 100. In the initial Top 16 reveal they were a #3 seed which was surprising but at the same time who have they played? They have no bad losses which helps them. Avoiding the loss to Northwestern who played the best half of their life and the worst half of their life all in one game was essential to a #1 seed. They could get one by default because their record and reputation. Michigan St is just 2-3 vs the top 50. The Big 3 in the Big-10 (Mich St, Purdue, Ohio St) is a combined 10-11 against the Top 50. It looks like the Big-10 has very overrated teams on resume. Don't get me wrong St & Purdue have very good squads to the eye and Ohio St has had a great bounce-back season.

So who else? Xavier still has a great chance despite being blown out by Villanova twice. No bad losses, lots of quality wins overall. If they take care of business to end the regular season and say upset Villanova in the conference tourney final they would be the most likely next #1 seed. Even if they lose to Nova again they should be rewarded. However we all know reputation matters and Xavier wouldn't be a "sexy choice".

With Virginia a lock its hard for Duke or UNC to get a #1 seed. Duke is in a similar position as Michigan St, weak resume overall, just 11 games against Top 100 competition. Beating Clemson on the road minus Bagley helped them. 3 of the next 4 are at home and they get the payback UNC game to end the season. Duke would have to win the next 4 and win the ACC tourney and have KU lose along the way.

UNC is in a similar boat. The bad loss against Wofford really sticks out. They have to win out in the regular season and have a good conference tourney. Their resume keeps them in the hunt but they can't lose again it looks.

Purdue doesn't have a #1 seed resume unless they win the Big-10.

Auburn isn't a #1 seed candidate, much less a #2 seed.

@BeddieKU23 Duke isn't getting a 1 seed. That loss to a terrible St. John's ruined any shot they had.

This is also why using the RPI and this new quadrant system is garbage. Michigan State has clearly been a top 4 team this season and should be the 1 seed in the Midwest this season.

@Texas-Hawk-10

I disagree that Duke isn't still in the discussion. The St Johns loss wasn't as bad using the RPI as the Oklahoma St loss was for KU. Who knows how much of a factor the RPI will still have in final decisions.

Duke is Duke and they have 4 winnable regular season games (3 RPI Top 50 games, 4 Top 100) + the ACC tourney which could put them at something like 29-5 if they won out.

Lenardi has us as a 1 seed now. Kind of crazy in my view. Ours is the kind of team that could easily suffer an embarrassing 1-8 seed loss.

wissox said:

Lenardi has us as a 1 seed now. Kind of crazy in my view. Ours is the kind of team that could easily suffer an embarrassing 1-8 seed loss.

There are so many teams that could lose early.

Michigan St has a ton of talent but is 2-3 vs the RPI top 50. They are vulnerable. The Northwestern game was a prime example of a team that could lose itself for a half and not recover.

I generally agree KU having a shot at a #1 seed is crazy and also gives you an idea how volatile the rest of the field is as well. This isn't a typical year for anyone really. Virginia might be the only #1 seed that would get a #1 seed in past years.

Lunardi didn't agree with KU being a #2 seed in the initial reveal. He made a good point though, when the teacher gives you a preview of the answers you take notice to that and adjust. With another wild weekend in the books KU's strength of resume stands out, especially with the Quadrant/tier they are using this season

@mayjay

The selection and seeding has changed quite a bit now and it has switched to a system of quadrants ↗ which assigns more weight to neutral and road games. The conference schedule provides plenty of opportunities to pad the resume with wins against top teams so the weak pre-conference schedule does not hurt as much as it helps teams from the smaller conferences that play strong pre-conference road schedules.

KU is really well positioned with the most wins in quadrant 1. Sometimes we take the team for granted and concentrate on the losses and don’t really realize how many good wins the team has and how good its SOS is.

I don't understand the "logic" used to pick brackets and seedings.

Kansas a #1 seed, says Lunardi? Gheezus. Okay.. we have some nice wins. What about some of those horrible losses? This is the sort of junk that creates Jayhawk haters... putting us in the same "rigged narrative" as Duke.

KUSTEVE said:

@jayballer73 Tech beat NW by 35. Yes, great comeback yesterday. But Sparty doesn't have the schedule to support a 1 seed. 2 Top 50 RPI victories is less than alot of midmajors that aren't even ranked. Not saying they can't play like a 1 seed, but they will punished for the cupcake schedule.

Possibly so, I just feel and it's just me - I just don't feel we deserve a # 1 seed/ = Actually guy I am not sure if it would do us better NOT to be a # 1 seed - there is not that much difference between a # ! & 2 anyways - Purdue - - - Michigan - - - Ohio State pretty salty - not trying to disagree just me myself feel that they should get the #1 at this point anyways a # 1 over us. -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

drgnslayr said:

I don't understand the "logic" used to pick brackets and seedings.

Kansas a #1 seed, says Lunardi? Gheezus. Okay.. we have some nice wins. What about some of those horrible losses? This is the sort of junk that creates Jayhawk haters... putting us in the same "rigged narrative" as Duke.

The only bad loss KU has to date is Oklahoma St and even then OSU is still hovering inside the Top 100 in RPI because of their own big wins when they feel like playing.

There are other teams with equal bad losses, UNC vs Wofford, Purdue vs Wisconsin, Duke vs Boston College, St Johns & NC St, Villanova vs St Johns, Tech vs Iowa St, Gonzaga vs San Diego St, Auburn vs Temple & South Carolina, Wichita vs SMU & Temple, Arizona vs Western Kentucky, SMU, Colorado, Clemson vs Temple.

Just about every team has had its fair share of letdowns

wissox said:

I don't want the #1 seed. To be honest I'd take about a 4 or 5 seed and let them be the underdog. Tired of the losing to a lower seeded team scenario that has afflicted our team the past 5 seasons and 9 of 10 or whatever it is. This is one year we really don't deserve the #1 seed. We have too many ugly losses obviously with the home losses to good but not great teams.

I Actually have to agree with you on this lol. - I know we have had a couple of times umm we didn't agree BUT I couldn't agree more actually. - Again I really don't care if we are a # 1 this yr or not - -like you say for one thing being a # 1 hasn't really been that beneficial to us anyways.- -I'm not sure about a 4-5 but I think anywhere from a 1-3 is possible for us - -I would be satisified with a # 2 -we have had our share of early exits with a # 1 seed and losing to lesser teams - We actually haven't had any dominant wins against quality teams this year. - -What's our biggest margin of victory in the Big 12? - -We have ONE game by double digits - - that was to K- Straight - other then that they have been - - -6,4,5,1,5,3,7,&5- - -that's not what you call dominant solid wins.- - -while in the main time have been beatin pretty solid 2 times - -12 by Tech and 16 by Baylor - -so yes some ugly losses.

I'm just not convinced we need or deserve a # 1 - we are top 4 seed we going to be in Wichita chances are anyways but ya I have to agree with ya. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

BeddieKU23 said:

Only 4 ranked teams haven't lost in the past TWO Weeks. How crazy is that.

Ranked teams went 27-20 this week. 15 ranked teams lost this week alone.

it has been really crazy this year. - -I don't think you have that one really dominant team that is head and shoulders above the rest. - Could prove for a really interesting Dance. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@BeddieKU23 Thank you for the info. Guess goes to show how naïve I am. I didn't realize Michigan States schedule sucked so bad & here I was thumping my chest saying they deserved a number 1 spot. - Guess I was feeding to much into their record and how many they have won in a row and where they stand in the rankings right now in the top 25. - -Well what about Texas Tech possibly? - of course a lot of that would ride on how the game turned out with us and the big 12 tourney I reckon. - Heck I don't begin to know now lol. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

drgnslayr said:

I don't understand the "logic" used to pick brackets and seedings.

Kansas a #1 seed, says Lunardi? Gheezus. Okay.. we have some nice wins. What about some of those horrible losses? This is the sort of junk that creates Jayhawk haters... putting us in the same "rigged narrative" as Duke.

True. Plus all it does is feed the frenzy when we are a # 1 seed and then lose the 2nd game or 2nd weekend-- - just feeds what we here yearly - -how we are so overrated - -how we constantly wet all over ourselves - I just don't see us as a # 1 I just don't. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@wissox It is still an amazing thing to be a #1 vs. a #2. The #1 seeds remain 100% perfect against the #16 seeds. The #2 seeds have become more and more vulnerable over the years. I would hate to be another #2 to go down!! That said, I will be thrilled with a #2 seed if that is what we get this year based on the ups and downs of the regular season and our lack of consistency at AFH.

joeloveshawks said:

@wissox It is still an amazing thing to be a #1 vs. a #2. The #1 seeds remain 100% perfect against the #16 seeds. The #2 seeds have become more and more vulnerable over the years. I would hate to be another #2 to go down!! That said, I will be thrilled with a #2 seed if that is what we get this year based on the ups and downs of the regular season and our lack of consistency at AFH.

Which would be a worse scenario , ANOTHER #2 to go down OR be the 1st # 1 that loses to a # 16 seed in the history of the tourney?

You may think that sounds crazy -- but with the type of year we have had - some really bad nights shooting the ball seemed like our heads just not in the game - - the way this season has gone with so many ranked teams being beatin during the season losing to some un ranked teams - - - the way there doesn't seem to be a really dominant tem - - this season - -we sure are not dominant which would you rather see between those two scenarios? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

checking out the sites: - - -Lunardi -has 8 - - yes 8 teams in the tourney right now:

South : - -Texas Tech - 3 - - -Texas - 12 - - - -East:- - West Virginia- 5- - -Oklahoma- 6- - - West:- - KU - 1- - - Baylor- 11- - Midwest- - TCU- 9- - - KSU- 11

Jerry Palm from CBS - - has 7 teams in the tourney right now

South- - Texas Tech- 3- - East:- - West Virginia - 5- - West:- - KU- 1- - KSU- 10 ( vs # 7 Mizzery by the way )- - Midwest- - TCU- 8- - Oklahoma- 7 - - Has Texas/Flordia- - 11's--playin- - & Baylor first four out.

USA Today Bracket: - -has 8- - -yes 8 teams in the tourney right now

South- - ZERO from the Big 12- - - East:- - Oklahoma-6- - KSU-9- - West- - KU- 1- - West Virginia-5- - TCU-10- - & Baylor- 11- - - Mid West- - Texas Tech- 3- - Texas-10

Geez - - Trae Young is pulling LOT'S of Weight - -announcers yesterday talking about their free fall and to them if they not careful - -Oklahoma will or could very easily become a bubble team. - -Then I see these brackets as of today and they are ASTILL very solid. -- a 6 - - 6 --& 7 - -man oh man I don't get that. Going to be interesting - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73

Do you really think that if KU gets a #1 seed it would lose to #16 seed?

@BeddieKU23 Our only bad loss is OSU? Oklahoma with 1 vote in todays poll stands as a so so bad loss, Washington, no votes stands as a bad loss.

Now, my real beef with your post. Purdue losing to Wisconsin is a bad loss. That's it, you've crossed the line. Losing to Wisconsin is never a bad loss! It's to be expected!

Just kidding!

Most of ya'll probably know this but Princeton came a missed shot away at the horn from being the only 16 seed to knock off a 1 seed when they nearly beat Georgetown. Southern came quite close against Gonzaga about 3 years ago as well. It's bound to happen some day and this could be the year.

@wissox

I never thought I would say Wisconsin being a bad loss would be true but this year is unlike any in recent memory for the Badgers. As we've discussed before, injuries and an inexperienced coach have hurt them this year. Hard to believe Wisconsin is in the #130's for RPI. Are fans calling for a new coach? What's the deal with the mood around them.. Any program that is used to sustained success like they had and have a down down season cannot be easy for the fans.

@jayballer73

Michigan St is still one of the most talented teams in the country. However I think they are the most talented team likely to lose early in the tournament according to the weak schedule they have played most of the season. They have legitimate NBA talent and Izzo is a good tournament coach who knows how to maximize his teams. I think they are vulnerable, some bad teams have given them scares (like Northwestern) and I'm not sure even Michigan St fans are convinced they have reached their ceiling or will play up to it in tournament time. I get the feeling that they are a bit overrated despite the talent 1-5 on that squad. The eye test says they look as good as anyone out there when they are all engaged (which you could say for any number of teams with enough talent).

@BeddieKU23 They're giving a Gard a pass this year. Lost a ton of experience, and then two season ending injuries. The pressure is mounting however as recruiting misses this year has really begun to mount. He's especially missed on in state kids like Ellenson who went to Marquette for one year, Stone who went to Maryland, and now losing Tyler Herro. Even losing the kid from KC to KU, normally no shame in that, is stinging a bit too. He can point to his last class (this years freshmen who are all decent players and will grow into very good players I think. Next year with a senior Ethan Happ, and healthy experienced players younger than him, they should expect to dance again, but if not, he'll really feel the heat.

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer73

Do you really think that if KU gets a #1 seed it would lose to #16 seed?

With the way this season has played out -- with there not being a really dominant team - with the way how badly as Ku has played at times this year - the scoring droughts we have went through this year - the way so many ranked teams have got beaten by non ranked teams this year - -you dam skippy it cold happen with out a doubt. - -Do you think beyond a shadow of a doubt can say they couldn't? - anything can and has happened - -not really sure why you couldn't think it couldn't. - it's gonna happen sooner or later - - NOTHING would surprise me in this year of Basketball - -that's why they play the games. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@wissox Their demise this year has contributed to the B10 being pretty weak this year. Of course, Minnysota and NW's collapse hasn't helped matters either.

@jayballer73 Being the first #1 would be one of the all time upsets. Goes without saying. That would cut as deep as any loss in KU history. But I don't think that is reason enough to not want a #1 seed. In theory the #1 has the easiest path and #1 seeds have been to the Final 4 more than any other seed. I fully understand what you are saying though. It sort of feels like the year that would happen!!

joeloveshawks said:

@jayballer73 Being the first #1 would be one of the all time upsets. Goes without saying. That would cut as deep as any loss in KU history. But I don't think that is reason enough to not want a #1 seed. In theory the #1 has the easiest path and #1 seeds have been to the Final 4 more than any other seed. I fully understand what you are saying though. It sort of feels like the year that would happen!!

Ya not saying it will happen - just saying t could happen without to much of a stretch with the way this season has gone.

I just don't really see a huge spread between the #1's - -and # 2's this year - and we never have had a lot of success when we are a number 1 seed so either way I'm good. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Oklahoma drops to 16-11 losers 9 of their last 11, most places still have them as a 9, not even on the last 4 byes list SMH. If they get in without winning at least 3 more games including the B12 tournament, its rigged for viewership plain and simple.

We play more like this we just might be a top seed. I still don't want it.

@wissox i was actually getting excited about playing as a lower seed but you’re right if we win the b12 we will be a 1 for sure.

@jayballer73

I don't agree. This team is just too good to lose to #16 seed. All the loses have been to very good or good teams, a #16 seed would likely be ranked outside the top 100 and would have had to be in a play-in game. The parity in college basketball is in the top 20-40 teams not between a top 10 and a below 100 team. No way, no how, no ma'am.

@jayballer73 @JayHawkFanToo This team will smoke the PANTS off most 16 or even 15s I can think of. Absolutely drilled all similar teams we played like that in the non-con. Those kind of teams don't have the defensive athletes that give this KU team a lot of trouble.

OU simply has to be on the bubble if not out right now don't they? I don't see justification for anything otherwise. Don't have time to look it up. But I wonder of any other team has lost 6 straight at any point during the season and still made it. And that's 6 and counting by the way...

@cragarhawk Supposedly they are on the 8/9 line now. Kinda crazy. KSU is in a worse spot allegedly. I guess after KSU smokes OU again that will change. And I'm no KSU fan I've just seen this KU team play both of these teams twice and KSU is much better despite KU's record against both of them.

KSU if they win out would be looking at going 0-6 vs the three best/most talented teams in the league, but 10-0 against the others. I am not sure I've seen anything like that before.

The only team that made it with a conference record of 4 games below even was ISU a long, long time ago. OU needs to win the next 3 or it will be in serious trouble; anything less than 2 wins and it is out.

@cragarhawk

I believe Lunardi said they were dropping a seed line with every loss. Despite the losing streak and downward trend they are still in due to the high quality wins they have. They need to get to 8-10 or 9-9 in conference and survive a round in the Big-12 tourney in order to change the narrative that has been painted on them now. I would say they are still in as of today but that their situation is still fluid. They are not making the tournament if they finish conference 6-12. Only one team ever (Iowa St back before the Big-12) has ever made the tourney with a 7-11 conference mark.

@BShark

That would be rare.

Does that make KSU actually better then OU though? OU has big wins which K-St has none. OU and K-St are different teams now so the argument could be made that K-St would have a better chance of winning a big game now

@BeddieKU23 Certainly is KSU wins out in the regular season they should be ahead of OU in seeding. They will have beat OU twice and OU will at least have another loss.

Their rancid noncon is definitely hurting them now. The ASU loss isn't bad, but the Tulsa game bites hard. When you schedule 95% terrible teams in the non-con you have no margin for error.

@BeddieKU23 "I believe Lunardi said they were dropping a seed line with every loss."

So they will be an 18 or 19 seed by the end of the season?

@mayjay OMG :joy:

@mayjay

in 2021 when the NCAA tourney is expanded to 136 teams a 18 or 19 seed won't look so bad

BShark said:

@BeddieKU23 Certainly is KSU wins out in the regular season they should be ahead of OU in seeding. They will have beat OU twice and OU will at least have another loss.

Their rancid noncon is definitely hurting them now. The ASU loss isn't bad, but the Tulsa game bites hard. When you schedule 95% terrible teams in the non-con you have no margin for error.

Well I wouldn't seed KSU higher then Oklahoma just because of a H2H. KSU is definitely better, I imagine having Stokes back is only helping them now. K-St will be a tough team to seed as you said on their horrid non-con.

If they win out against three other fringe tournament teams as well though (Texas, Baylor and TCU) they should be firmly in regardless of what happens in the conference tournament.

@BeddieKU23 KSU's wins are a stark contrast a their horrible losses. Even I, as fierce a fan who ever pointed an oil can in Squeaky's direction, have to give him some points the past few weeks.

K-State's remaining schedule gives them an opportunity to play themselves in. Go 3-1, plus win their first Big 12 tournament game, and they probably get in. 2-2 leaves them on the bubble. Worse probably eliminates them. I do think it's a little ridiculous that the bracket has KSU, Baylor and Texas all in, but solid teams from middle tier conferences (Boise State, St. Bonaventure) are in the same position or worse. I really do think the NCAA should move to a .500 record requirement for an at large bid. While that would hurt the Big 12 this year as one or two of TCU, Texas, and Oklahoma would probably miss the dance based on that, but if you aren't good in your conference, why should you be competing to be the best team in the country?

.500 in conference isn't some crazy requirement. Big 12 would still get 5 or 6 teams in this year. SEC probably would still get 8 teams in. Pac 12 would likely get 5. Big 10 would probably get 6. ACC would probably have 8 or 9. Half the field would still come from Power 5 conferences. The only difference would be that Baylor, Texas, TCU, KSU and Oklahoma would all be playing for their tournament lives over the next couple of weeks to stay above .500. Meanwhile, lots of first and second place teams from middle level conferences wouldn't be playing for their lives just because they lost their conference tournament final. No, St. Bonaventure couldn't win the Big 12, but this year, neither could Baylor, TCU, Oklahoma, Texas, or K-State. We shouldn't compare these teams to the top teams in the conference and say they would finish towards the middle or bottom of a Power Conference when that's exactly where Baylor is going to finish this year.

@justanotherfan

I'm all for that requirement. would add an interesting competitive dynamic to these last few weeks

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer73

I don't agree. This team is just too good to lose to #16 seed. All the loses have been to very good or good teams, a #16 seed would likely be ranked outside the top 100 and would have had to be in a play-in game. The parity in college basketball is in the top 20-40 teams not between a top 10 and a below 100 team. No way, no how, no ma'am.

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

No Texas or OU. I’m for cutting the field in half and making it double elimination.

jayballer73 said:

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer73

I don't agree. This team is just too good to lose to #16 seed. All the loses have been to very good or good teams, a #16 seed would likely be ranked outside the top 100 and would have had to be in a play-in game. The parity in college basketball is in the top 20-40 teams not between a top 10 and a below 100 team. No way, no how, no ma'am.

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Yes Washington is a decent team and quite a bit better than a sixteen seed.

All of these "who deserves to get in" are dependent on conference tournaments proceeding as seeded.

When did that ever happen? For you fans who pay attention to lesser conferences, how will, say, 3 to 5 upsets in mid-major conferences change things? Which regular season champs, if upset, are automatically out, and which ones supplant the proffered "last 4 in"?

Edit: I realize a team considered in right now might stay in despite an upset. But the committee also has a history of punishing upsetees.

jayballer73 said:

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer73

I don't agree. This team is just too good to lose to #16 seed. All the loses have been to very good or good teams, a #16 seed would likely be ranked outside the top 100 and would have had to be in a play-in game. The parity in college basketball is in the top 20-40 teams not between a top 10 and a below 100 team. No way, no how, no ma'am.

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Have you looked at the PAC 12 standings? 5th place Washington is a clear bubble team that has a winning conference record right now. Baylor and OSU are both worse losses for KU than Washington is right now.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

jayballer73 said:

JayHawkFanToo said:

@jayballer73

I don't agree. This team is just too good to lose to #16 seed. All the loses have been to very good or good teams, a #16 seed would likely be ranked outside the top 100 and would have had to be in a play-in game. The parity in college basketball is in the top 20-40 teams not between a top 10 and a below 100 team. No way, no how, no ma'am.

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Have you looked at the PAC 12 standings? 5th place Washington is a clear bubble team that has a winning conference record right now. Baylor and OSU are both worse losses for KU than Washington is right now.

LOL, you just answered the whole subject - - PAC 12? - the conference is a joke- I know your not trying to say the Pac 12 is better the big 12 right? - -I know you didn't just try and say that did you?. - -Have you seen what Baylor has been doing? - KU isn't the only Big 12 team they are beating - -Pac 12 - - Big 12 - - Big 12 - -Pac 12 - -no comparison - - hell the YMCA team that Coach Self talked about a few years back when we got beat could have over a 500 winning pct in the Pac 12- Ucla isn't squat - - USC - - - please - - -Arizona State has proved what they actually are -have you happen to see how they choked showed what they truly are - - - Arizona -- possibly - their decent - - other then that - - pssssssssssssttt please get off me with that.- - Like has been stated by broadcasters analysts - - you have no given wins in the BIG 12 - -every game is a war. - -You put Washington in the Big 12 - they be right down there with Iowa state this year bottom dweller sucker. - - Washington? - - please - but that was a good joke though made me laugh thanks. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONGBABY

@mayjay

That always has some effect on the bubble.

Nevada is a projected #8 seed, has been ranked multiple times during the year. If they lost the Mountain West to say UNLV or Boise St who are bubble teams (Boise St is on the next 8 out right now) that's an example of a team maybe sweating it out Selection Sunday.

Lousiana- 23-4 currently would not get in without winning the Sun Belt, projected #12 seed. Their RPI is currently higher then Baylor, Washington, Texas, K-St, Nebraska- teams that have beaten KU or given them a tough time this year.

South Dakota & South Dakota St are a combined 47-12 but in a 1 bid league.. Seperated by a 1/2 game in the standings currently, they play each other on Thursday to decide the league. SD St a team KU crushed in Allen is a projected #13 seed.

East Tennesse St- 21-5, projected #13 seed made the tourney last season and just gave its coach an extension in hopes of keeping him (likely to attract attention in the coaching carousel). They have a few bad losses, a close defeat to Xavier (by 2) and just 1 Top 100 win (against UNC Greensboro).

Loyola-Chicago 23-5 RPI #41 currently a #12 seed has a better RPI then 30+ Power 5 schools. They have a win over Florida. Could be left out if they don't do their business in Conf Tourney..

Meanwhile a #11 loss Oklahoma team is still a projected 6 seed..

Oklahoma and Kentucky for the play in 16th seed game!

@BeddieKU23 Follow the money....

Wouldn't be shocked to see two of 3 make it out of USC, UCLA and Washington. And somehow St. Bonnies won't make it because of some stupid Quadrant thing...

Also, in ESPN's bracket, I would rather see several of the 6 or 7 seeds than the 8/9 seeds at the moment. If this were really how it played out, I'd be kind of pissed.

Also, if KU wins out the Big XII title outright, don't we deserve to win the MidWest 1 seed over Xavier? Of course I'm biased.

jayballer73 said:

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

So, what is your definition of a good team? Would you say a team that is in the top third of all Division I is good? How about 70 percentile? Washington is there and currently a bubble team for the Tournament. It might not be a title contender but as teams go, it is not a bad team...didn’t it beat KU after all?

No need to take my comments so personally, they are just comments. I thought you were going to try being less thin skinned.:smile:

JayHawkFanToo said:

jayballer73 said:

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

So, what is your definition of a good team? Would you say a team that is in the top third of all Division I is good? How about 70 percentile? Washington is there and currently a bubble team for the Tournament. It might not be a title contender but as teams go, it is not a bad team...didn’t it beat KU after all?

No need to take my comments so personally, they are just comments. I thought you were going to try being less thin skinned.:smile:

and when I comment back I have - - -and I didn't take it personal. - -not really sure how I can make people understand I'm not. guess it's my twisted approach boy if some REALLY knew me - they would faint lol.

Ya your right they did beat KU - -and that is a BAD loss -a team that's what in 5th in a weak conference ya - -BAD BAD loss. - The Pac 12 sucks - -Arizona is really the only legit team they got. - -Arizona State fell back to earth they really ain't squat and it's proven it'self out. - - Hell who isn't a bubble team - -lol --and their bubble is pretty weak.

I'm not taking anything you say personal my friend this is just how I am- not meaning to sound insulting to you - love your thoughts - love the site. - -See someone has to kind of be a rebel I guess keep things stirred up -Everyone should have their comments. - -hope were good. - -wish I knew how to use all the little emoji's can't even find them here anymore - whoops their is my computer stupidity showing again lol. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@BeddieKU23 Thank you!

jayballer73 said:

JayHawkFanToo said:

jayballer73 said:

well I know one for sure that's not good. - - Washington is not a good team - you consider Washington a good team ? - if you do you need to grab a websters and look up the definition of good. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

So, what is your definition of a good team? Would you say a team that is in the top third of all Division I is good? How about 70 percentile? Washington is there and currently a bubble team for the Tournament. It might not be a title contender but as teams go, it is not a bad team...didn’t it beat KU after all?

No need to take my comments so personally, they are just comments. I thought you were going to try being less thin skinned.:smile:

and when I comment back I have - - -and I didn't take it personal. - -not really sure how I can make people understand I'm not. guess it's my twisted approach boy if some REALLY knew me - they would faint lol.

Ya your right they did beat KU - -and that is a BAD loss -a team that's what in 5th in a weak conference ya - -BAD BAD loss. - The Pac 12 sucks - -Arizona is really the only legit team they got. - -Arizona State fell back to earth they really ain't squat and it's proven it'self out. - - Hell who isn't a bubble team - -lol --and their bubble is pretty weak.

I'm not taking anything you say personal my friend this is just how I am- not meaning to sound insulting to you - love your thoughts - love the site. - -See someone has to kind of be a rebel I guess keep things stirred up -Everyone should have their comments. - -hope were good. - -wish I knew how to use all the little emoji's can't even find them here anymore - whoops their is my computer stupidity showing again lol. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

I think Arizona State had one of their best shooting nights against us. I saw them miss open shot after open shot at Arizona, shots they made against us, and lost. They were just hot for a few games and we had an uninspired outing. All there is to it.

@HawkChamp YEP pretty plain and simple. - -I've seen them multiple times and they got lucky to be ranked as high as they were - -un deserving the only reason they got that high was the process of elimination - -teams above them losing - -they didn't stay long.
Actually the only player I was impressed with was the Remy Martin kid - -decent player - -other then that - -not so much - -BAD loss for KU. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73 All I'll say is that while you're laughing at the PAC 12, KU went 1-2 against the mid level teams in the Pac 12 including 0-2 in home games. Perhaps the Pac 12 isn't as weak as you think they are.

@Kcmatt7

If we win the big 12 and the conference tourney we will have a resume that will be hard to ignore. I can see us being the highest 2 seed if we lose a game between now and selection Sunday. 7 losses is a lot to reward a 1 seed. KU has had as tough of a sustained schedule as any in the country. Teams in the big 10 and ACC have had to play some bad teams and it's padded records.

@BeddieKU23 I'd prefer being the top 2 seed honestly...

Texas Hawk 10 said:

@jayballer73 All I'll say is that while you're laughing at the PAC 12, KU went 1-2 against tye mid level teams in tge Pac 12 including 0-2 in home games. Perhaps the Pac 12 isn't as weak as you think they are

HOW ain't no sweat of my you know what - but bring those teams to the Big 12 see how they fare - -5th in the pac 12 - -9th in the big 12 end of story. - but here again is why this is good you can voice your opinions and I mine. - -just because KU lost to them doesn't mean they are a strong team - can mean just as easily that KUY played like warm dog doo that game - - which they did - doesn't make them or their conference a powerhouse

@wissox Nice thread. This has to be one of my favorite times during the year. I love this stuff.

My opinion about KU is that we will be a 2 seed...IF KU wins or ties for the league and wins a couple games in the big12 tourney.

Now, I realize its a big if. But, we just saw KU pick apart a very tough WVU team at their place, foul discrepancy not withstanding.
We also saw Silvio's "light" go on. We now have 3 bigs to shore up our post now. That's huge for us going forward and the timing couldn't be any better.

So, yah IF all that stuff happens, KU should be a 2 seed...possibly even a one seed. Were the field picked today, I personally wouldn't put KU higher than the last 2 seed. Maybe even a 3 seed.

@Lulufulu It is fun to discuss. And we really don't know, except,

1. The committee usually treats us very well.

2. The committee has really liked the good matchups and they'll overseed someone else or underseed someone else to make it happen. See Wisconsin last year getting an 8 seed. See KU having to play WSU in 2nd round three years ago.

3. The committee always puts Duke or UNC in first two rounds in NC, but rarely both meaning on average KU plays closer to home than Duke or UNC in the first two rounds. Sorry to ruin everyone's narrative!

4. We'll hear some 12 loss team whining why they had 12 good losses and deserve to dance over a mid major who had only 3 good losses, but zero bad losses.

5. Speaking of whining KU fans (even a few bucketites) will whine about the bracket despite the fact almost every year we're the 1 seed in the midwest bracket meaning we're playing within a days drive of Lawrence for all of the first 4 rounds every year.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

@jayballer73 All I'll say is that while you're laughing at the PAC 12, KU went 1-2 against tye mid level teams in tge Pac 12 including 0-2 in home games. Perhaps the Pac 12 isn't as weak as you think they are

I think our guys made them look good. Those two games were pretty pathetic performances.

@HawkChamp

Ya that's kind of my point and why I said Washington was a bad loss. - It wasn't so much that they were that good -it was more of a fact that we sucked during these games played like doo.

We made them look better then they are - -and then with them being 5th in a conference like that - that really looks bad. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73 The PAC 12 is the number 5 conference in the country, they're not as bad as you want to believe they are.

Texas Hawk 10 said:

@jayballer73 The PAC 12 is the number 5 conference in the country, they're not as bad as you want to believe they are.

who is the # 1 conference in the Nation? - Big 12 isn't it? - -I rest my case - - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY - they are that bad

Washington is going to end up with well over 20 wins they aren't completely terrible. Should KU have beat them? Sure but this KU team has lost to some other average teams as well. There are no juggernauts this year and everyone has bad losses.

Washington turned out to not be a terrible loss and Nebraska turned out to be a solid road win. TCU in a battle with ISU right now that they need to win. Baylor’s chances took a hit last night, they prob need 3 or 4 more wins including the B12 tournament.

@jayballer73

You did not answer my question. What would you consider a good or a poor team?

Would you say the top third of all Division I teams are good or better, the middle third average and the bottom third poor or worse?

wissox said:

@BeddieKU23 They're giving a Gard a pass this year. Lost a ton of experience, and then two season ending injuries. The pressure is mounting however as recruiting misses this year has really begun to mount. He's especially missed on in state kids like Ellenson who went to Marquette for one year, Stone who went to Maryland, and now losing Tyler Herro. Even losing the kid from KC to KU, normally no shame in that, is stinging a bit too. He can point to his last class (this years freshmen who are all decent players and will grow into very good players I think. Next year with a senior Ethan Happ, and healthy experienced players younger than him, they should expect to dance again, but if not, he'll really feel the heat.

I can see them giving Gard a pass this year but he has to start recruiting at a higher level. Wisconsin even with its success hasn't signed Top 100 kids regularly which made Ryan's success even more impressive. He maximized talent so well and always found program players. Of course they have gotten guys like Dekker and Happ in the past so you can get kids there. The misses in recruiting as you noted are starting to pile up. I worry that Gard isn't establishing his own identity with Wisconsin as well as one might hope he would already. Of course I don't follow them as close as you do but even the 10 foot view looks as if he's trying to do the same as Ryan did without the success.

Next year will be a huge year for the program and Gard. If most of the team returns (which I think will happen) there's a lot of promise if everyone is healthy. The key to next years team seems to be having an established post rotation alongside Happ. Ford & Reuvers are young and have received valuable playing time this year to build off. Wisconsin has had remarkable success getting little-used big men to come out of no where, Van Vliet & Illikainen do not seem to be candidates to follow that path which has to be a big disappointment to fans and the staff.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 Follow the money....

Wouldn't be shocked to see two of 3 make it out of USC, UCLA and Washington. And somehow St. Bonnies won't make it because of some stupid Quadrant thing...

Also, in ESPN's bracket, I would rather see several of the 6 or 7 seeds than the 8/9 seeds at the moment. If this were really how it played out, I'd be kind of pissed.

Also, if KU wins out the Big XII title outright, don't we deserve to win the MidWest 1 seed over Xavier? Of course I'm biased.

Xavier has a really good chance of getting a #1 seed despite likely to be the 2nd best team from the Big East. It looks likely they will at least tie for the Big East championship with Villanova, Xavier plays Providence at home & @ Depaul left meanwhile Nova has road tests at Creighton, Seton Hall and then ends with Georgetown.

If they win the Conference tourney and say beat Villanova while doing it they are likely a #1 seed. They have no bad losses as far as losing to teams they shouldn't have. In a season that has seen so many upsets every week Xavier is one of the few that has been consistent. I will note that when they lose, they don't even lose competitively (avg 16) in their 4 losses. I've seen them play a handful of games, they are a good team. I'm not convinced they have a Final 4 type ceiling which you would expect from a #1 seed. Maybe I'm undervaluing them a bit, they seem like a safe team that scores a lot. They are not a defensive juggernaut by any means which I think is the biggest risk with them (Kenpom's 70th ranked D).

I think at least 2 of the 3 Pac-12 teams are tournament teams.
I think Washington has work to do like winning its next four games. If they can't beat Stanford, Cal, Oregon St & Oregon they don't belong in the tourney. USC is currently 2nd in the Pac-12 with an extremely weak resume. The 2nd place team in the Pac-12 is making the tourney though. UCLA is in a really tough stretch. End the season with 3 straight road games and none of them are easy. UCLA has to win one of them, beating Utah tonight in a true bubble game for both would go a long way in keeping them in.

I agree as it stands it looks like the committee is valuing the quadrant thing heavy. You might see 8/9 seeds that are better then the 6/7 seeds and it could all be because of resume and scheduling. As always we are going to see teams under-seeded and over-seeded and wonder how they came up with it all.

If KU continues this turnaround and momentum they will be a #1 seed. Winning out would be the easiest way that happens. Winning the Big-12 gives us another ace in the hole. Winning the Conference Tourney would give us a chance at overall #1 depending on how things shake out. If we have 7 losses we'll need help to stay on the 1 line. Anything more then 7 losses is going to land us a #2 seed I believe. Our strong resume with quadrant wins keeps us in play for everything. I'm pumped to see how the next couple weeks go!

Syracuse really needed that home win against UNC last night. Jim lives on the bubble every year and whines for days when he's included or excluded. Cuse isn't a tournament team IMO.

What does the committee do with Oklahoma St. 4 wins against ranked teams. They will have to keep winning.

Louisville is another ACC team that does not belong in the NCAA tourney. Are they even allowed? I have no idea they have so many in-house and NCAA penalties its been hard to keep up.

Alabama got crushed by Auburn, that would have been a big upset for them. Can't see them dancing

Clemson is falling apart having lost 3 straight. Virginia Tech looks safely in.

Florida is definitely a team with work to do. 11 losses and more to come. Definitely trending towards the bubble.

K-St & TCU did what they needed to do last night. TCU has a brutal stretch to end conference play. Beating Baylor & K-St would put them safely in.

@BeddieKU23

I would love to see Xavier win the conference over Villanova. Villanova has the longest streak of tiles after KU with 6 and losing would put them back at square one...and 15 or more years away from breaking the streak...assuming KU does not continue to win titles.

@JayHawkFanToo

Xavier is in a good position to win the Conference by itself if they take care of business and catch a lucky break.

Villanova's upcoming road games are tough. Creighton and Seton Hall are projected in the field right now. I wouldn't say either is likely to beat Villanova unless either plays the best game of the year. Nova just got back one of their guards who had been out 7 games with a hand injury.

I didn't realize Nova had won that many Big East Championships in a row. Much like the Big-12 its a round robin schedule so I do give them a ton of credit for having that kind of sustained success.

I would love to see Xavier get the #1 seed and then become the first #1 seed to lose a first round game. They have become my least liked team in America that isn't named Missouri. Even Duke at least gets my grudging respect because they run a clean program.

But Xavier, wow. They were involved in a fracas the other day. Wisconsin played them two years ago in the dance and Xavier strutted all over the court like they were gods gift to college hoops until Koenig drilled them out of the tourney with that amazing 3. This year Xavier comes into Madison to play a suddenly undermanned Badger team which hangs with them, but in the end disappointment. But along the way Xavier shushes the crowd, taunts Badger players and then when they wrapped up the win starts doing the Florida Gator chomp thing towards our crowd. Florida knocked out the Badgers last season on that amazing buzzer beater and so somehow Xavier thinks that they need to remind us fans of it? Totally classless. Don't know how teams that have to play them regularly stand it, but I guarantee if KU had to play them they would be one of ya'lls least favorite teams also.

@wissox

!0_1519358398305_16D5BFB1-DFF1-42D5-97C3-7AAD4D28BA3C.jpeg ↗

@JayHawkFanToo I like the pic, but am trying to figure out the reason it was posted!

@wissox

You wrote:

”along the way Xavier shushes the crowd.”

So did Mason at Bramledge, just sayin’...

@JayHawkFanToo Gotcha. Slight difference. KU players have earned the 'right' to do such things. Not sure about Xavier.

After posting yesterday I read about an Xavier player addressing the Cincinnati coach with an F bomb in the hand shake line. Of course Cincy is still Cincy and the coach said he should have gone and fought him. Maybe it's something about Cincinnati!

@wissox

Every player or team that does it feels they earned it.

1 seed nearing reality?

@wissox still work to do. But is looking like more of a probability

With Syracuse getting whipped by duke and Roach’s heroics to lift Texas by Okie State they may still have a chance to get in. Baylor was in but another loss on the road to TCU hurt their chances. It may depend on who goes further in the B12 tournament to determine who gets in between Texas and Baylor, I personally think OU should be in the same boat tho most had them as a 9 or 10 before today’s win over KSU. At this point it seems that KU, WVU, TT, TCU and KSU should all be locks IMO. Oklahoma, Texas and Baylor probably all don’t get in but it looks like there is a fat chance 2 of the 3 do, ether way 7 or 8 of a 10 team league is pretty salty. Hopefully the conference can back up the hype that they have had all year about being the best conference.

wissox said:

1 seed nearing reality?

I think if we win the next two and a game or two in the Big 12 tournament, the one seed is a good probability.

@kjayhawks you mean Trae young team? He'll get in

The more I look at it, the more I think Xavier will not be a 1 seed. They have 1 win over a ranked team. They have double digit losses to the other ranked team ( Nova ) they have faced. 3 ranked teams...2 losses. I see them losing in the BE tourney, and either Michigan Slease, or Dook passing them on the 1 line.

@KUSTEVE

Xavier with one game lead over Villanova and 2 easier games to finish conference play. If Xavier wins over Providence and De Paul, it wins the conference ending Villanova’s streak of 6, currently second longest to KU.

@JayHawkFanToo Understood. I still am not sold as them as a 1 seed. I think they're a 2 seed.

@KUSTEVE

It was more of a mention of the second current longest streak of 6 titles likely coming to an end. The next longest I believe is 4 which means the earliest KU’s streak could be broken is in 11 years (2030), asumming KU stops winning the conference (definitely not next year) and the other team continues winning; both highly unlikely.

KUSTEVE said:

@JayHawkFanToo Understood. I still am not sold as them as a 1 seed. I think they're a 2 seed.

I agree they look more like a 2 seed watching them play. Still their record is impressive, winning the Big East which also has a round robin schedule has to be considered as well and they don't have bad losses from a RPI standpoint. Xavier has beaten 4 ranked teams at the time that they played them. They are 13-4 against the Top 100. What hurts them is the publicity Villanova has received all year long and losing both games to them, badly.

Duke is in the same boat, being overshadowed by Virginia in their own conference. They have to win against UNC Saturday and the ACC tourney to get a #1 seed IMO. Duke's resume doesn't give them a ton of room for error if they don't.

Michigan St has a great record but has the weakest resume of any team being considered for a #1 seed. So weak they were a #3 seed in the initial reveal a few weeks ago. Michigan St will be the last #1 seed if the cards fall right for them.

@JayHawkFanToo The streak will actually be broken next year. :joy:

KU keeps winning and Kenpom keeps dropping its defense.

Meanwhile Duke plays a bunch of cupcakes and see's their defense go from #90 to # 17 in two weeks. They have defended better playing zone defense, I'll give them that.

We have all agreed this could be the most topsy turvy tourney (like that?) in history. Any of the top 8 seed lines could probably beat any others. Figuring out distinctions between seed lines is probably hopeless.

But, if history is a guide, when things go crazy, consistency is paramount. KU is playing its most encouraging ball of the year in the most stressful circumstances--we were effectively in a single elimination situation involving our second most important season goal for 4 games running. Major factor in our favor!

mayjay said:

We have all agreed this could be the most topsy turvy tourney (like that?) in history. Any of the top 8 seed lines could probably beat any others. Figuring out distinctions between seed lines is probably hopeless.

But, if history is a guide, when things go crazy, consistency is paramount. KU is playing its most encouraging ball of the year in the most stressful circumstances--we were effectively in a single elimination situation involving our second most important season goal for 4 games running. Major factor in our favor!

Agree! Momentum is on our side. Hopefully we can sustain it.

This team has a ton of guts when the stakes are the highest. It's been impressive to see

@BeddieKU23 No kidding. We went from #24 to #41 in defensive efficiency by giving up 74 to OU, and 72 to TT. Inexplicable. I have always thought that Kenpom's # have been sketchy, so I don't put much stock in whatever he's cooking up. If you listen to him in an interview, he sounds like an oily used car salesman.

@KUSTEVE Does defensive efficiency by KP factor in opp's offensive rebounds?

@mayjay That would have to be the only possible explanation. I still don't see how that would make that huge of an impact. The other thing is we out rebounded OU by 13, then we lost by 5 to tech on the boards. Last time, I think Tech beat us by 15 on the boards. We held Tech to 42% shooting %, so I am still not seeing how we dropped so far.

Yes, I have noticed improvement defensively, and I normally don't put much stock into advanced metrics. The eye test reveals improvement, so that is what I am going with.

@HawkChamp Agreed.

@KUSTEVE Did it go down after OU, or just after both games combined? It could be that the OU game had little influence but TT alone was the reason. Acc to sports-reference.com, the only thing besides off rebs that was noticeably different between the two was TT's off rtg of 112 compared to 102 for OU. 112 with the 13 off rebs by TTU may have been enough to drop us.

By comparison, UVA's last 4 games have held opponents' off rtgs to 100, 87, 100, and 67 (Pitt on Sat). We have not held a team below 102 since TCU on Feb 6 (95).

mayjay said:

@KUSTEVE Did it go down after OU, or just after both games combined? It could be that the OU game had little influence but TT alone was the reason. Acc to sports-reference.com, the only thing besides off rebs that was noticeably different between the two was TT's off rtg of 112 compared to 102 for OU. 112 with the 13 off rebs by TTU may have been enough to drop us.

By comparison, UVA's last 4 games have held opponents' off rtgs to 100, 87, 100, and 67 (Pitt on Sat). We have not held a team below 102 since TCU on Feb 6 (95).

Some of the bottom feeder ACC teams are not very good. Tech and West Virginia are much better than Pitt and its not even close.

@mayjay We beat OU by 30, and our defensive eff goes from 24th up to 33. We beat Tech, and it went up to #41.

mayjay said:

@KUSTEVE Did it go down after OU, or just after both games combined? It could be that the OU game had little influence but TT alone was the reason. Acc to sports-reference.com, the only thing besides off rebs that was noticeably different between the two was TT's off rtg of 112 compared to 102 for OU. 112 with the 13 off rebs by TTU may have been enough to drop us.

By comparison, UVA's last 4 games have held opponents' off rtgs to 100, 87, 100, and 67 (Pitt on Sat). We have not held a team below 102 since TCU on Feb 6 (95).

The defensive #'s have been going the wrong way for the past month or so. KU was holding in the 20's and now they are #39.

The offense is up to #9 after spending most of the season in the teens. I think that has been an encouraging sign for this team. When we make shots like we did against OU, Tech etc everything else improves.

The three teams KU compares the most on Kenpom include Villanova (#1 O, #34 D), UNC (#5 O, #40 D), Auburn (#12 O, #37 D). Villanova isn't the stingy defensive team we remember playing a few years back in the Elite 8, UNC doesn't defend anything, and Auburn's best defender is out for the year which will impact their numbers going forward.

Doing a quick search there are at least 16 teams who Kenpom says their defense is better then KU's but they have more losses then KU has on the season.

If KU can ride its offense the rest of the way and find defense when its needed we can win this whole thang'

BShark said:

@JayHawkFanToo The streak will actually be broken next year. :joy:

I see what you did there. However, I said as long as KU stops winning and the other team stops losing; neither is likely.

Nightmare bracket from Lunardi for us. And no...not Missouri. Kenpom #20 Butler as our 8 seed...

CBS has the same. Rest of our CBS bracket I would like a lot though.

BShark said:

Nightmare bracket from Lunardi for us. And no...not Missouri. Kenpom #20 Butler as our 8 seed...

It's Lunardi's weekly lunatic bracket. It's either Mizzou or Wichita we are destined to play every week

Butler is seeded accordingly IMO after watching them a bunch. Their ceiling (beating Nova is a worry) but they haven't played to it other then that.

Would take that bracket in a heartbeat honestly

@BeddieKU23 Defensive minded slow paced teams give me night terrors.

Way too much basketball to be played and way too early to predict the brackets. Lunardi's Bracketology is click bait and big business for ESPN; he even teaches a class in Bracketology at some East Coast University.

BShark said:

@BeddieKU23 Defensive minded slow paced teams give me night terrors.

Their adjusted tempo is right around ours on Kenpom.

KU has gone more to half-court execution anyway. I think its helped Graham and Svi recently stay fresh on the court (as much as that possibly can).

Butler is no defensive juggernaut like they used to be under the old coach. They actually like to go up and down the court with teams that like tempo. They are solid, not taking anything away from them. Comparing them to recent 2nd round matchups such as Michigan St & UConn I feel they are around par maybe slightly less formidable then those squads IMO.

Martin is a good player, a tough matchup for us at 6'7 with girth on him. Baldwin is a good complementary guard. Wideman would have to pack a lunch guarding Doke, they have nothing to even attempt at him. We have very favorable matchups elsewhere. Not seeing it with this team especially given the new coaching staff

I will admit I haven't watched a single Butler game all year.

BShark said:

I will admit I haven't watched a single Butler game all year.

The game they beat Nova, boy that was a clinic they put on offensively. They thrived with the pace of the game and Nova doesn't defend so it was an exciting game to watch.

They recently lost at home to Georgetown by double digits. I'm surprised they are so highly rated by Kenpom. 20th on KP but tied in a logjam for 3rd in the Big-East. College BBall is having the strangest year ever

@JayHawkFanToo It's starting to settle in at this point. It is down to around 8 teams that we would play in the 2nd round at this point. Most teams probably only have 3 games left?

@Kcmatt7

Yes, plus conference tournaments, so more like 5-6?

@BShark Lundardi hardly ever gets it right. I mean, it might be close, sort of. But what his bracket looks like and what the seeding committee actually releases on selection sunday aint ever been similar. Except for maybe the 1 and 2 seeds

Tech taking a big hit in seeding here the last week, Evans didn’t play tonight and WVU jumped out to a 16-0 lead in a easy win.

kjayhawks said:

Tech taking a big hit in seeding here the last week, Evans didn’t play tonight and WVU jumped out to a 16-0 lead in a easy win.

Zach Smith didn't play either. Seems like Beard was content to rest them from this game due to style of play and physicality and take the L

@BeddieKU23 So weird that they were good to go for the KU game. :thinking:

BShark said:

@BeddieKU23 So weird that they were good to go for the KU game. :thinking:

Of course, the game meant something especially with Gameday. After losing it seems Beard choose the future over the game vs WVU. I don't blame him, he could ill afford to lose either for the stretch run with both recovering from injuries. The Collapse of Tech in a week has been epic

@BeddieKU23 They could finish 4th. TCU KSU is big tonight for the final standings.

If TCU wins out and KSU wins their last game that will be 3 teams at 10-8.

BShark said:

@BeddieKU23 They could finish 4th. TCU KSU is big tonight for the final standings.

If TCU wins out and KSU wins their last game that will be 3 teams at 10-8.

Good to know. I still want Tech/WVU to finish 2-3 so that they play each other in the semi's of the Big-12 tourney

Agree! Though honestly I don't care too much about the B12 tournament.

Lulufulu said:

@BShark Lundardi hardly ever gets it right. I mean, it might be close, sort of. But what his bracket looks like and what the seeding committee actually releases on selection sunday aint ever been similar. Except for maybe the 1 and 2 seeds

Lunardi and other bracketologists' real goals and measures of success are (1) to correctly predict who is in, (2) to predict the order of the 4 number 1 seeds, and (3) to get teams on the correct seeding line. I think they don't care at all in measuring their accuracy about their matchup predictions, except where they might make an adjustment using the protocols the committee uses when dealing with the geographic placements of top teams near home if possible, and in avoiding early same-conference matchups when possible.

We are always put in with someone like WSU just to yank our chains and generate clicks. I have seen it in years past with other "predicted" 2nd round games that look like they would be interesting matchups, such as UCin or WVU vs UK, or UNCC vs NCSt.

@BShark I am starting to really like the idea of having the Conference Tourney in December to kick off the year. And then giving NCAA automatic bids to conference regular season winners.

Or be like the Big 10 and have the Conference Tourney early so you can rest up for the Big Dance. They start tomorrow.

@Kcmatt7 I don't think that would work. I really dislike the conference tournament though.

@BShark a lot of beat up teams

@BeddieKU23

TTU learned the hard way what it is like to be at the top and have a bull's eye on your back with all teams gunning for you. KU is used to it, in fact it seems to thrive in it.

JayHawkFanToo said:

@BeddieKU23

TTU learned the hard way what it is like to be at the top and have a bull's eye on your back with all teams gunning for you. KU is used to it, in fact it seems to thrive in it.

Tech definitely felt the pressure. The perfect storm though occurred with Evans getting injured and having some road games that exposed them just a bit. 17 of their 22 wins at home is something to keep in mind as we fill out our brackets.

The good thing for is we've proven to be the same team no matter the venue.There have been many years where KU is so dominate at home and good enough on the road/neutral that we see different versions of the team depending on where the game is played. Outside of a great shooting game in Allen Fieldhouse Tech has been a below average away from Lubbock. I'm hoping our success away from home is something these guys can continue to fuel a championship run

@BeddieKU23 nice new avatar

@BeddieKU23

KU has played well on the road which is encouraging considering there are no more home games left and must win on the road to advance. :smile:

@JayHawkFanToo OU and Young are finding out what it is like to have a target on their back. Getting blown out at halftime. Still may get in the Dance because of all the fuss over Young.

@Big-Clyde52

Several upsets in the making. UNC trailing Miami by 7, Auburn trailing Arkansas by 9, Rhode Island losing to St. Joseph by 30.

In the conference Baylor destroying OU by 25, OSU beat ISU to keep some hope alive and KSU and TCU in a tight game with seeding implications.

There's no way OU should be in right now. I think a couple missed Doke fts may be the only reason they are still in right now.. minus Trae. Even with that if they lose one more game they should be out no questions asked in my opinion

@cragarhawk I agree, Trae young team, isu and KSU all have looked really awful! Baylor and Osu, 'cept for next game have looked better, lately.

And yet when I looked on ESPN site early this morning there was NOT even one article or mention of OU's loss last night.

@RockChalkinTexas maybe it was filed under Trae young?😳🥊

St Marys is going to be a 10 seed or so which is incredibly stupid.

Who wants to bet that somehow, some way, we are set up to meet MU in the 2nd round -- 1 vs. 8/9, 2 vs. 7/10? Seems like the easiest bracketology prediction we could make.

BShark said:

St Marys is going to be a 10 seed or so which is incredibly stupid.

St Mary’s is a legitimate top 25 or even top 20 team, a 10 seed would be ridiculous.

JayHawkFanToo said:

BShark said:

St Marys is going to be a 10 seed or so which is incredibly stupid.

St Mary’s is a legitimate top 25 or even top 20 team, a 10 seed would be ridiculous.

Agree! They should be a 5-6 seed. Current projection is a 10 however...

HighEliteMajor said:

Who wants to bet that somehow, some way, we are set up to meet MU in the 2nd round -- 1 vs. 8/9, 2 vs. 7/10? Seems like the easiest bracketology prediction we could make.
I agree. I fully expect that if we win one game and Mizzou wins one....we will play them.

@Hawk8086 I agree. I fully expect to play Mizzou assuming they win one game.

HighEliteMajor said:

Who wants to bet that somehow, some way, we are set up to meet MU in the 2nd round -- 1 vs. 8/9, 2 vs. 7/10? Seems like the easiest bracketology prediction we could make.

If I still had a farm, I'd bet it on this.

@BShark I predict Mizzou as our 8/9 seed to get the border war back. Kentucky as our 4/5 seed to give the Blue Bloods another shot at one another this year. North Carolina as our 2 seed for the always juicy former coach matchup.

I wouldn't bet the farm but if KU is a 1 seed I bet 2 of these 3 pan out.

Of course Mizzou would choke away their opportunity to play us. They have a current 3 game 1st round losing streak including of course the loss as a 2 seed!

7 losses, still #1 seed? I just don't see it.

@BShark putting Saint Mary’s as a 10 seed is almost as dumb as putting a 3 loss #23 ranked UNI team as a 10 seed. Bilas said something today that I really agree with about how some of theses mid majors that are on the bubble with 24 or 25 wins are at huge disadvantage because they don’t play top 50 or even top 100 teams in their conference tournament. I personally think a team like Old Dominion deserves to be in more than a team like OSU. They are giving a ton of respect to the big east with both Nova and Xavier as one seeds.

HighEliteMajor said:

Who wants to bet that somehow, some way, we are set up to meet MU in the 2nd round -- 1 vs. 8/9, 2 vs. 7/10? Seems like the easiest bracketology prediction we could make.

NCAA had a chance to do this in 2013 when both Missouri and Wichita St. played in different regions in the 8/9 game. The committee instead gave KU UNC/Villanova as their 8/9 seed. If the committee didn't set up a potential Border War game that season (Missouri's 1st in the SEC), Then I don't see them putting Missouri in a potential match up with Kansas this year either.

@Texas-Hawk-10 The main difference I see there is the passage of time without renewal of the rivalry. But you never know what the tourney folks are thinking.

Nebraska might have the dubious distinction of winning 13 league games and not making it to the dance.

@kjayhawks I agree. The committee has a history of this kind of stupidity.

wissox said:

7 losses, still #1 seed? I just don't see it.

I agree. That does not compute.

@HighEliteMajor Welp as of this morning your right. -at least one of them. - -ESPN and Lunardi has Missouri as a # 9 in our region which means if we were to win and them beat Butler they would be a 2nd round matchup

Jerry Palm from CBS has V/Tech vs St Marys as a 8/9 matchup in our Region. -And of course the talk is Micheal Porter will play - talking about really good chances of him playing in the SEC tourney - -so there you go - - - go figure. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73 Top 20 team in the country by any measure St Marys. Unreal that they won't be a 4/5 seed.

@jayballer73 I just feel it coming ...

Just a note. - - -Radford becomes the 1st team in the dance. - - Big South Champs - - -22-12

Loyola of Chicago is now in. Great story. 1st bid since 1985. Their chaplain is a 98 year old nun who prays before the game and throws in a scouting report into her prayer. I.E "We pray we'll have success boxing out #42 who grabs 5 offensive rebounds every game". After games she emails the coach and players what they did well and what they need to improve upon.

wissox said:

Loyola of Chicago is now in. Great story. 1st bid since 1985. Their chaplain is a 98 year old nun who prays before the game and throws in a scouting report into her prayer. I.E "We pray we'll have success boxing out #42 who grabs 5 offensive rebounds every game". After games she emails the coach and players what they did well and what they need to improve upon.

Surely that is against some NCAA rules. Is she payed? Are they over the limits on assistant coaches? Maybe Yahoo will break the story.

jayballer73 said:

Just a note. - - -Radford becomes the 1st team in the dance. - - Big South Champs - - -22-12

Murray St. got in first

Libscomb tops Joe Dooley and FGCU to get to the dance. I watched this one and FGCU flatout didn’t show up till the last 15 minutes, they were down 29 at he half and by as many as 32 in the second. They got it down to 5 points on a few occasions but didn’t have enough stops in the end to pull off what would’ve been the biggest come back in NCAA history.

kjayhawks said:

Libscomb tops Joe Dooley and FGCU to get to the dance. I watched this one and FGCU flatout didn’t show up till the last 15 minutes, they were down 29 at he half and by as many as 32 in the second. They got it down to 5 points on a few occasions but didn’t have enough stops in the end to pull off what would’ve been the biggest come back in NCAA history.

Wouldn't have even been the biggest this season. Drexel came back from 34 down a couple of weeks ago.

@wissox

Lots of 13 win teams don’t make it to the dance. Considering how weak the Big 10 is this year and that it does not have a true round robin so many of theirs wins are against the weaker team they played twice but played MSU, Purdue and OSU only once and lost. Their RPI is #64.

@Texas-Hawk-10 - - lmao - - ok, ok, glad you jumped on that wouldn't want to rock the boat roflmfao. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@Texas-Hawk-10 MERCY we are on a roll today - - just quick as quick can be -dam must be nice to be so correct lmao - -oh ya baby -- -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY -- - -

JayHawkFanToo said:

@wissox

Lots of 13 win teams don’t make it to the dance. Considering how weak the Big 10 is this year and that it does not have a true round robin so many of theirs wins are against the weaker team they played twice but played MSU, Purdue and OSU only once and lost. Their RPI is #64.

You also don't really ever see 13 win teams from major conferences miss the NCAA tournament so this might be unprecedented for a power conference team.

@Texas-Hawk-10 correction biggest 2nd half comeback

@jayballer73 there is always one hard a**, just kidding @Texas-Hawk-10 lmao

Would like to see FGCU make it. They could upset someone...

@Gorilla72 FGCU is going to the NIT this year.

@Texas-Hawk-10 - :-( Surely Dooley can death stare them into the NCAAT!

@Texas-Hawk-10

The last 8 wins for Nebraska we’re against unranked teams in the very weak Big 10. Only 2 of its wins have been against ranked team teams including the 3rd game of conference play against Minnesota which since then has fallen on hard times and has not been ranked for awhile and finished the season 4-14 in conference play and the other against then #23 Michigan which just returned the favor in the last game beating Nebraska by 19 points. Not the record of a solid candidate.

@Gorilla72

They did win the regular season conference title by 2 full games.

It's going to be funny seeing what the Selection Committee does with the Pac-12 & SEC. Two conferences that have been mediocre at best again. Some good teams from smaller leagues will again get the shaft as they do every year.

What team other then Arizona from the Pac-12 is even going to be favored to win a game? Find one.

Seems like 7 will get in from the SEC. Auburn has been solid but lost a key player. Tennessee has had a very good year and is playing well. Who else? A up and down Kentucky team likely to have 11 losses going into the tourney? A&M likely to have 12 losses? Arkansas 11, Missouri 12.

@BeddieKU23 After many years of living in SEC country I really loathe them! And I always feel a little guilty about it because they're one of the more successful leagues in the dance. SC making it last year and beating FL to get to the FF is just the latest example. Funny thing is their fans don't even appreciate it.

I don't want to see Michigan, Florida, or any Pac 12 team until the Final Four if they, or we make it that far.

I see Lunardi has us today as a 1 seed. MSU a 3 seed. No clue how that coul be accurate. My assumption is we better beat OU / OSU if we want a shot at staying on the 1 line and possibly 2 wins in the Big 12 tourney.

wissox said:

@BeddieKU23 After many years of living in SEC country I really loathe them! And I always feel a little guilty about it because they're one of the more successful leagues in the dance. SC making it last year and beating FL to get to the FF is just the latest example. Funny thing is their fans don't even appreciate it.

FL and SC were good teams last year, much better then anything in the SEC this year. This year Auburn & Tennessee fit the bill of good teams that could go far. I'm bullish on Auburn now that they lost their best defender and post player. 4-4 in their last 8 (started 21-2). They are a young team, no seniors and no tourney experience leaves them vulnerable in the first weekend. It will be a major surprise to see any SEC team beyond those two getting past the first weekend.

joeloveshawks said:

I see Lunardi has us today as a 1 seed. MSU a 3 seed. No clue how that coul be accurate. My assumption is we better beat OU / OSU if we want a shot at staying on the 1 line and possibly 2 wins in the Big 12 tourney.

It is accurate. Michigan St has played the weakest schedule of any Power 5 team. Losing record vs the Top 50 RPI. They were a 3 seed in the initial reveal of the Top 16 teams weeks ago and did nothing since to raise their seed.

KU has to win the Big-12 tourney to keep the #1 seed. Xavier or Duke can leapfrog them with their own conference tourney wins.

Bill needs to play this just right. Win the first game and lose the 2nd. Give us a 2 seed in the Midwest instead of a 1 seed in LA. jmo though.

I want to win them all but that's just my opinion. Having to play either Oklahoma school a 3rd time is potential payback city. Either K-St or TCU in the Semi's who we went 4-0 against and then whatever comes out of West Virginia/Tech.. Win it all and go in with some momentum. Losing again does nothing IMO for this team

Kcmatt7 said:

Bill needs to play this just right. Win the first game and lose the 2nd. Give us a 2 seed in the Midwest instead of a 1 seed in LA. jmo though.

Interesting thought. I wouldn't mind being the #2 with Xavier.

@BeddieKU23 Exactly. Bill needs to play this right if he can. Keep an eye on the other tournaments and then let's see what he can do to effect some change. Or at least try to get this team on the easiest road.

Looking at it right now as well, I like the 3-6 matchups much better than any of the 4-5 ones. Right now, I see underseeded 4s and 5s and overseeded 3s and 6s.

@Kcmatt7 If we get the 2 seed, they'll put Michigan St as the 3 seed...just watch them..lol.

Interesting note, KU is 1-3 against OU and OSU, I would prefer playing OU since OSU seems to be a bad matchup for KU.

I would like tournaments to reseed after the early rounds. I know there have been proposals to do it in the NCAA but I seriously doubt it will ever happen.

@KUSTEVE Lol stop. Nope. Positive vibes only bish. We are going to get the 2 seed and then be in a bracket where and 11 seed has upsets over the 3 and 6 seeds and then we end up playing a 15, 10 and 11 seed on our way to an Elite Eight matchup vs. Xavier in Omaha.

Really need a couple of teams to steal bids though. The 11 seeds at the moment are a little bit scary for being 11 seeds... Although I'd love another shot at ASU.

We need to start rooting for some crazy Conference tournament results though. Some of these 11 seeds need to get knocked out.
Below is a list of teams that could steal bids from these 11 seeds:

• A-10. Will get Rhode Island and St. Bon in for sure. But I think another team could actually win the tourney if they get hot.
• Big East - This one is a long shot. Would take a crazy run by St. John's or Georgetown most likely.
• Conference USA - If MTSU can get knocked off, that is an extra bid for the league.
• Mountain West - If anyone but Nevada wins, boom there is a bid.
• WCC could steal one if BYU or SFU can somehow pull off some magic.

Those are probably the biggest tournaments to pay attention to that could drastically change any brackets at this point. The link below is the best bracketologist over the past several years. I can tell you I much prefer the 3-6 matchups in his bracket to the 4-5s.

https://bracketville.wordpress.com/bracketology/ ↗

Can we fast forward to next Thursday already?

Schedule strengths are funny beasts to me. Seeing MSU as a 3 is a little puzzling because in the first several weeks of the season they played (rankings at the time of playing) #1 Duke, #5 ND, #9 UNC, caught a break by only seeing OSU, Purdue and Michigan 1 time (at least until conference championship). And in those games they're 4-3. That's against teams that have all been top 10 in the country at some point in the season. Not sterling, but not terrible either.

We have played top 10 at some point Kentucky, Tech, OU, and WVU and ASU. Not positive if Baylor was ever top 10. 5-4 against top 10 teams. We have been getting lauded for a tough schedule, MSU getting ripped for it.

Now, let me clear this up too. MSU has deservedly been under a very dark and heavy cloud of suspicion this season, from the sex scandal which miraculously seems to be pushed out of the spotlight and the paying Bridges thing. I've gone from a MSU admirer and Izzo fan to a much less favorable view of them. I really hope they fizzle out. I think they will. Shorthanded UW played them down to the last possession Friday and nearly beat them the weak before, and of course Michigan beat them solidly yesterday. But a 4 loss team this season, in my view deserves better than a 3 seed.

@wissox

You have some good points.

What seems to hurt Michigan St more then their record vs ranked or Top 50 teams is the putrid non-conference schedule that saw them play North Florida, Stony Brook, Southern Utah, Houston Baptist, Long Beach St, Cleveland St, & Savannah St. Impressive list, my grandma and her friends could be competitive against that bunch.

I cannot forgive the Big-10 either for scheduling them to play Michigan only once during the regular season. That's a joke having to play your inner-state rival one time, at home, which they lost BTW.

Some of their opponents hit hard times when they were used to being perennial Top 25 teams. Uconn, Maryland, Wisconsin, Indiana. I don't hold that against them its just the luck of the draw in that situation.

Now I don't think their record (29-4) is a true indication of how good they are. There's a good chance this is a 24-7 type team (Like KU) had the teams they played been better or the Big-10 schedule been different. I think the record is a bit exaggerated due to the competition and they got extremely lucky in that regard.

You do watch the Big-10 more following Wisconsin which gave them two scares in a week..Does Michigan St really strike you as better then a 3 seed after seeing your shorthanded Badgers almost beat them?

@JayHawkFanToo but but but how will I print my bracket?!?

@BeddieKU23 the early season Spartans yes. Lately not sure but in a season of losses piling up for so many I still am struggling with the possibility of them being a three seed. Of course two years ago I thought they got screwed by being given the two seed and then they lose to mid tenn so who knows!

By the way the Big 14 really screwed themselves up by expanding. You're right about that and then they go out and play their tourney in two east coast locales the last two years.

@wissox They are 3-4 in quadrant 1 games. Not good. Undefeated in all of their other quadrants, but the played nobody.

They played a total of 12 games in the first two quadrants. Including their conference tournament. That schedule is weak af. Even if they did play some top of the top teams. The rest of the schedule was sooooo bad. They played 9 quadrant 4 games. 9 dog crap teams.

For comparison:

KU played 24 games in quadrants 1 and 2. With a potential for 3 more in quadrants 1 and 2 with the conference tourney still yet to be played. And we have a record of 18-6 in those games. Only 4 quadrant 4 games played

Duke has played 19 games in quadrants 1 and 2 and are 13-6 in those games. Only 4 quadrant 4 games played.

Virginia played 16 games in the first two quadrants, going 14-2 in those games. They only played 5 quadrant 4 games.

Villanova played 18 quadrant 1 games and 4 quadrant 4 games.

Xavier played 18 quadrant 1 games and 4 quadrant 4 games.

UNC played 21 quadrant 1 games and 4 quadrant 4 games.

Purdue played 17 quadrant 1 games, and 9 quadrant 4 games.

Tennessee played 18 quadrant 1 games and 3 quadrant 4 games.

MSU played a very, very very bad schedule.

If anyone wants to look at the "team sheets" the committee uses, here is the link.

https://extra.ncaa.org/solutions/rpi/Stats%20Library/March%204,%202018%20Team%20Sheets.pdf ↗

@Kcmatt7

You left two very's off the very very very bad schedule. That is pretty putrid the way you put it.

But they beat all their bad teams. We beat all of ours too but did lose to some mediocre teams and I'm not sure MSU did. They lost to three solid tourney teams, one twice.

@wissox Another stat that is on the team sheets is average RPI win and average RPI loss. What we have been talking about is exactly Michigan State.

• Average RPI Win Rank: 151
• Average RPI Loss Rank: 13

Exactly what we were talking about. You mentioned they played really good teams early in the season. And they lost those games. Ala, the RPI rank when they lost. But then, you see the flip side. Their wins at 151. What a weird season and schedule from Izzo.

I do think the Big 10 was disrespected this season and that hurts them a lot. We will see though. I wouldn't want to face any of the Big 10 teams that made it.

@wissox

As per Jeff Sagarin KU Strength of schedule is #7, Michigan State is #69, according to KenPom #8 and #62...not close at all. KU does have a strong SOS, Michigan State does not. As I indicated before, it would not surprise me to see MSU as a 3 or even 4 seed; the price you pay for playing in a weak conference and a soft schedule. Nebraska is in the same boat and might not even make it to the tournament.

@dylans

Printed brackets are overrated. Go to a digital schedule that resets automatically.:smile:

Interesting that most still have OSU out after they beat us Saturday, I personally think the loser of the OU OSU game Wednesday should be out. How OU is safely in at a 10 currently tho they spilt the season series with OSU while having the same conference record coupled with more bad losses.

@kjayhawks

OU is in because Trae Young, first half of the season Trae Young that is, is a big draw, without him they are out.

@JayHawkFanToo yep all about he viewership

wissox said:

@BeddieKU23 the early season Spartans yes. Lately not sure but in a season of losses piling up for so many I still am struggling with the possibility of them being a three seed. Of course two years ago I thought they got screwed by being given the two seed and then they lose to mid tenn so who knows!

By the way the Big 14 really screwed themselves up by expanding. You're right about that and then they go out and play their tourney in two east coast locales the last two years.

The Spartans are an interesting team. NBA talent, NBA size, elite coach. You don't get 29 wins without being good. We've seen the good & bad of Michigan St in one recent game against Northwestern in which they were down 20+ at half and came back to win improbably.

Early season Sparty looked good as you mentioned, I suppose their biggest wins of the season were the B2B wins against UNC & Notre Dame. After that their best win is? Home by 3 points against Purdue was probably the last big impression they left . I've watched about 10 Michigan St games this season including the recent one's and I don't see a team that is playing better then a #3 seed. I see some individuals that look as if they are thinking ahead towards the next level. Besides having Jaren Jackson this is the same team that KU beat down in the 2nd round last year.

People that see their gaudy record might think a #3 seed is low for a team like Michigan St. If the committee follows through with the principles in seeding teams Spartan Nation will be happy to have a #3 seed because the schedule is dreadful. I think the AD for MSU has some work to do to clean up how they schedule.

I also think for comparison there are people looking at KU possibly being a #1 seed with 7 losses as outrageous. If its all about wins and losses I'd agree, 7 losses is a lot to reward a team a high seed. If they win the Big-12 tourney and get a #1 seed it will tie the record for the most losses given to a 1 seed in NCAA Tournament History. In a normal year KU would be lucky to stay on the #2 line. As we all know by now this isn't a typical year in CBall. KU just has a really good resume that's going to give them an edge with the committee, maybe even inflating their true seed line. I've seen some bracket sites listing KU as an over-seeded team. Our non-conference didn't seem all that difficult on paper and the Big-12 didn't look like it was going to have 7-8 tournament worthy teams but both have given KU a resume that's as good as any in the country. What's better the gaudy record or better resume?

kjayhawks said:

Interesting that most still have OSU out after they beat us Saturday, I personally think the loser of the OU OSU game Wednesday should be out. How OU is safely in at a 10 currently tho they spilt the season series with OSU while having the same conference record coupled with more bad losses.

I agree. Oklahoma St has 6 wins against ranked teams. Must be their non-conference weighting heavily against them right now.

Saint Mary's lost in the semi's to BYU. Saint Mary's didn't help themselves with seeding at all. A great record without great wins except @ Gonzaga.

BYU can steal a bid tonight against Gonzaga. Yoeli Childs went nuts last night scoring 33. Will have to do it again if they think they can beat Zaga. Zags won both meetings pretty comfortably during the regular season.

Two more teams got in last night. Iona won the MAAC & UNC Greensboro won the Southern.

UNCG is an interesting team, won 27 games. They beat NC St who's likely in and only gave up 60 to Virginia. Kenpom's 31st ranked defense FYI which is 15 spots better then KU. Francis Alonso can really shoot the rock, over 100 3's on the year.

Tonight the Horizon League, CAA, Northeast, WCC & Summit League all have their finals.

South Dakota & South Dakota St battle for the 1 bid with their combined 53-13 records. We crushed South Dakota St in Allen earlier this year. South Dakota dropped close games to TCU & UCLA in non-conference. The loser will not dance..Should be a good one.

@BeddieKU23 It seems that the opinion of KU and the quality of the wins again relies on the opinion of the quality of the Big 12. I mean, who did we beat in the non-con? Not one team in the top 25 as far as I can tell. Syracuse, TAM, UK all have had down or disappointing seasons. And we lost to UW and ASU who have slid back. They’re not even getting votes. The inflated value of the Big 12 is puzzling. I think we should slide into the two seed, and that fits our season about right.

HighEliteMajor said:

@BeddieKU23 It seems that the opinion of KU and the quality of the wins again relies on the opinion of the quality of the Big 12. I mean, who did we beat in the non-con? Not one team in the top 25 as far as I can tell. Syracuse, TAM, UK all have had down or disappointing seasons. And we lost to UW and ASU who have slid back. They’re not even getting votes. The inflated value of the Big 12 is puzzling. I think we should slide into the two seed, and that fits our season about right.

The non-conference certainly wasn't daunting. It's ranked 22nd according to the RPI. We just minimized playing bad teams, only 4 outside the Top 100. Smart scheduling, KU knows what it takes to keep itself at the top.

The inflated value of the Big-12 can be attributed to the Round Robin Schedule. Teams get 2 cracks at KU, its the only reason Oklahoma St is even on the bubble line right now. So either the Big-12 conference is a genius for keeping at 10 teams or its just luck really. It's helping the bubble Big-12 teams stay afloat. Just Iowa St having a bad season makes the conference look strong top to bottom and the middle is so cluttered you don't even know who's really any good.

However their are some atrocious Power 5 teams in the ACC, Pac-12, Big-10 & SEC so just because those conferences have strength in numbers doesn't make them any better. Pitt didn't even win a conference game. The bottom 4 in the Big-10 barely combined to win more conference games then KU did. About 50 mid-major schools could have beaten Cal this season. 8 teams in the SEC were 500 or less in conference play.

If we throw tournament success into the mix then of course the Big-12's regular season success becomes a mute point. Not much we can do as fans, we hope KU wins the championship and the rest of the league does well to validate the conference overall.

I think more important if we are talking KU is did the 2017-2018 schedule prepare us for March? I think we are battle tested, we have no misconceptions of what this team is. Even if we are a #1 seed or a #2 seed I think most of the fan base knows this team will have to play its best ball to win every game after round 1. If we don't we go home to a long and sulky off-season full of who's leaving, transfer talk, recruiting, lineup projections that only carry us so far.

Our leaders have to shine bright now. This team goes as far as Devonte & Self can carry them.

@HighEliteMajor 8 of the 13 non-con games were quadrant 1 or quadrant 2 games. SDSU was a great schedule. A Quadrant 2 home game.

Self and his staff have mastered the art of building a schedule that sets us up for situations like this. A 7 loss team still apparently in the drivers seat for the 4th #1 seed or the 1st #2 seed is a little bit crazy.

Lunardi (thankfully never accurate) has #6 Gonzaga as a 5 seed in KU’s bracket and preseason #1 Arizona as KU’s 4 seed. Gonzaga as a 5 is grossly underseeded. Arizona is about right, but a tough draw with Ayton playing like he is. MSU and UNC as the 2/3 so get to the elite eight and it’s a more favorable matchup.

!0_1520350099903_61E1F084-D4A4-4C7F-A035-50796C20925D.jpeg ↗

@dylans Of the ones Lunardi has on the 4/5 line, I would like to avoid Florida, Ohio State and Wichita State at all costs. So I am ok with the current bracket. I think Doke could dominate the Gonzaga game, and I think he is about one of the only players that could hang with Ayton. Arizona is also a terrible Defensive team. The combo of Doke being able to guard Ayton combining with how poorly UA plays defensively is the type of matchup I like for us.

I would put Arizona on upset alert opening weekend tbh. Can't play D. They get matched up with a slow-paced, defensive oriented team, and they will find themselves in a dog-fight. SDSU would give UA a run for their money.

@Kcmatt7 I was just preparing my we got screwed in the bracket speech. 😜 Match-ups matter more to this team than the last two years. If their guards can pressure our guards 10ft beyond the 3pt line we're screwed.

@BeddieKU23 @Kcmatt7 I have to admit, I need to look at the seeding criteria. You two seem to really be on top of this. And our coach is obviously on top of it.

@dylans Lol exactly.

I'm hoping for the path of least resistance. Literally! At this point, I think our best chance to advance far is to play less athletic teams, and poor defensive teams.

@HighEliteMajor Well they actually came out and defined a lot of things this year with the quadrants. And after the first bracket release, it looked as if they were actually following the said criteria.

They also make the "team sheets" readily available with the info on them which is super convenient when looking at brackets.

dylans said:

Lunardi (thankfully never accurate) has #6 Gonzaga as a 5 seed in KU’s bracket and preseason #1 Arizona as KU’s 4 seed. Gonzaga as a 5 is grossly underseeded. Arizona is about right, but a tough draw with Ayton playing like he is. MSU and UNC as the 2/3 so get to the elite eight and it’s a more favorable matchup.

Unfortunately Gonzaga is seeded correctly I think. They might be more talented then a #5 seed and they have a great record (could be 30-4 after tonight) however playing in the WCC continues to do them no favors when their non-conference schedule doesn't give them enough quality wins to overcome the conference they play in.

I saw recently they were in some preliminary talks about joining the Mountain West which would improve their metrics a bit. I think its time Gonzaga moved up, similar to what Wichita St just did this year. The talent Few is bringing in and developing is simply better then the competition they are playing.

Gonzaga in the non-conference beat Ohio St (before they got better) lost to Florida in 2OT, beat Texas in OT, beat Creighton who was #25 at the time, was crushed by Villanova, and crushed Washington (the game after KU lost to them in the Sprint Center). They split the H2H with Saint Mary's who's in a similar position, having a lot of wins but not a ton of quality wins.

I tend to think this Gonzaga squad is a bit underrated. They returned guys who contributed to last years F4 run which I think is important for them going anywhere. I would welcome the challenge playing them though, I think we would matchup okay with them

@BeddieKU23 Gonzaga and St Marys need to move up in basketball. Do they even field football teams? So that's a consideration for w/e conference they want to join.

@dylans The Achilles Heal for this team was supposed to be depth, but I agree with you that we really struggle with teams that pressure the guards all the way out. We have a lot of trouble getting into any offense at all.

dylans said:

@Kcmatt7 I was just preparing my we got screwed in the bracket speech. 😜

Everyone here has their speech ready to go!

Speaking of St. Mary's, and Wichita, and MSU, this guy has us as a 1 seed and potential 2nd round against St. Marys, 3rd round with WSU, and either Duke or MSU as elite 8 competition. It's been 3 long years since Duke has won a championship so the powers that be will be affecting the whistle in that elite 8 matchup I'm sure. I don't think a team west of the Appalachians is going to win a championship ever again!

Here's the link which I forgot in the original post.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-spt-ncaa-tournament-bracketology-20180305-story.html ↗

wissox said:

Speaking of St. Mary's, and Wichita, and MSU, this guy has us as a 1 seed and potential 2nd round against St. Marys, 3rd round with WSU, and either Duke or MSU as elite 8 competition. It's been 3 long years since Duke has won a championship so the powers that be will be affecting the whistle in that elite 8 matchup I'm sure. I don't think a team west of the Appalachians is going to win a championship ever again!

Here's the link which I forgot in the original post.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/ct-spt-ncaa-tournament-bracketology-20180305-story.html ↗

Wouldn't mind St Mary's as a 2nd round opponent. Londale is one of America's best bigs and would be a good matchup for Doke/Mitch/Silvio. Their defense is ranked about 80 spots below KU's so we'd have a really good chance of scoring on them.

Not an athletic team either which would favor KU even more

@wissox Those 7,8,9 and 10s from non P5 schools are so much scarier than the p5 schools on those lines.

@HighEliteMajor

Very few major programs have strong non-con schedules anymore. Unless you play another big school in one of the early season resort tournaments or like the one with Duke, KU and MSU, the chances of playing other major programs are slim. Major programs want to pad their records and small programs are willing to travel and take a pounding for a paycheck. I believe there is small program that played the first 20 games on the road and the paychecks funded the entire athletic department.

Computers rankings look strictly at numbers and don’t usually play favorites and they unanimously have the Big 12 as the top ranked conference.

@JayHawkFanToo You could probably argue that we're the top ranked conference because of the bottom of the conference. I wouldn't call the top of our conference anything to get all excited about although OU, TTU and WVU have all had good moments this year.

If you could and if you have time, pull up the team that had the top ranked schedule and lets look at their opponents. It'd be interesting to see.

@wissox

Conferences are ranked based on the strengths of all team not just the ones at the top. KU, OU, TTU, WVU and I believe TCU have all been ranked in the top 10 at some point and Baylor and Texas have been in the top 20 with KSU also getting votes, so it is not like the conference does not have good teams. You can put the Golden State Warriors on the Big 10 and the conference would still not be good overall. I know you are a Big 10 fan but the conference is very weak overall this season and will likely end up with 4 out of 14 teams in the tournament while the Big 12 might have an historic 8 out of 10 teams.

I read where one of the better known analyst wrote...would you really like to have a Big 12 team, any team including ISU or OSU as your first opponent in the tournament? The answer was no...about what other conference can you say the same thing?

@wissox

According to the RPI, North Carolina has the #1 schedule of strength in the country. I didn't include teams they played outside the Top 100 which was 8

Wins (RPI 1-50)

RPI DATE OPPONENT SCORE

29 Nov. 24 Arkansas* 87-68

13 Nov. 29 Michigan 86-71

9 Dec. 17 @ Tennessee 78-73

21 Dec. 23 Ohio State* 86-72

11 Jan. 16 Clemson 87-79

4 Feb. 8 Duke 82-78

46 Feb. 17 @ Louisville 93-76

37 Feb. 21 @ Syracuse 78-74

Wins (RPI 51-100)

RPI DATE OPPONENT SCORE

90 Nov. 15 Bucknell 93-81

72 Nov. 20 @ Stanford 96-72

78 Dec. 1 @ Davidson 85-75

97 Jan. 9 Boston College 96-66

65 Jan. 13 @ Notre Dame 69-68

52 Feb. 10 @ NC State 96-89

65 Feb. 12 Notre Dame 83-66

Losses (RPI 1-50)

RPI DATE OPPONENT SCORE

15 Nov. 26 Michigan State* 45-63

43 Jan. 3 @ Florida State 80-81

1 Jan. 6 @ Virginia 49-61

47 Jan. 22 @ Virginia Tech 69-80

11 Jan. 30 @ Clemson 78-82

25 Feb. 27 Miami 88-91

4 Mar. 3 @ Duke 64-74

@JayHawkFanToo But given our conference's history in the dance during these seasons where we're the top ranked conference it doesn't look like it after the first weekend of the tournament, so I guess, just to be the devil's advocate, I guess teams might be saying sure, we'd love to play the big 12 in the madness of march. Of course two years ago, we're within a last minute meltdown against 'Nova to having two Big12 teams playing each other in the FF and of course one of them in the finals, but that season is an anomaly right now rather than the rule.

@BeddieKU23 Thanks Beddie! Pretty good list of teams there, but it also illustrates the reason why KU would benefit by having a tougher top half of the league.

Teams dancing after last night.

Gonzaga put a beatdown on BYU which helped the bubble.

Wright St put an end to 12 win Cleveland St's upset bid.

Charleston beat Northeastern in OT for a bid.

LIU Brooklyn upset Wagner in the final to steal a bid. LIU is 18-16 and a candidate for the first four.

South Dakota St beat South Dakota 97-87 in an exciting game that saw 102 points scored in the 2nd half. If South Dakota St catches a bad defensive team they can win a game.

Vermont made the final of the America East. Could be a 28 win team going into the tourney. Lost to Kentucky in Rupp by 4 in non-conference

A true bubble game today at noon between Florida St & Louisville. Both teams need the win desperately to keep themselves within the field.

NC St can likely solidify a bid beating BC at 2pm

Arizona St must beat Colorado to keep its hopes alive. No team in the country has fallen further

7pm - OSU vs OU. KU's oppponent tomm.

Notre Dame tonight can keep its hopes alive beating Virginia Tech. Because of the ACC's 37 team league they did not play during the regular season.

Syracuse in normal fashion must beat UNC to keep on the bubble.

Later tonight Washington & Texas have must win games to stay alive.

@BeddieKU23 How can teams in the same conference not play at all in bb? That is just stupid. Once makes a little sense, zero times is nuts.

mayjay said:

@BeddieKU23 How can teams in the same conference not play at all in bb? That is just stupid. Once makes a little sense, zero times is nuts.

I misspoke they played once, Tech won the only meeting by 5

@BeddieKU23 Shoot, I was enjoying thinking the ACC's organization was even stupider than I had thought!

@BeddieKU23 I felt like SDSU would be a bad matchup for a poor offensive team. KU absolutely beat their pants off just because we could shoot AND were more athletic than them. I think they would be scary to play if you struggled to score because they ARE going to score some points.

But I guess that's what makes it so hard to predict the tourney :joy:

Literally couldn't have more opposite opinions lol.

@mayjay Of course it happens in college football a lot which is also just plain stupid. But those big time conferences have to preserve their traditional non conference games which fans are clamoring to see, such as Wisconsin-Wofford, or Nebraska-Louisiana Monroe, or Alabama-Citadel.

This is a little off topic, but I would love to see a college conference say, well this is just stupid so we're going to make sure that each team in the league plays each other. You might have to do away with the league championship game, but the fans would love it.

College basketball conferences could do it too. The Big 10 would need 26 conference games to pull it off. So they play a few patsies to get up to the required 32-34 games, so what, that would be a great schedule in any of the power conferences. It might hurt KU because we already play a round robin schedule and would have a struggle to find non-conf games if the SEC is playing 26 league games. Not even sure how many teams are in the ACC, 16 I think, so there, might be kind of tough, but so what! Do it anyways. Do it for the fans who would much rather see their team play a conference team twice than a patsy once.

LIU Brooklyn looked like a team you don't want to play, for what it's worth. They are better than their record. They have size and can rebound. If they come out hot, like they did last night, they are a good team. I'm pretty sure all 5 starters hit a 3 for them last night. That was the type of night they were having. Wagner went 6-32 from 3 or something close to that.

It was an entertaining game though that really came down to the last minute.

mayjay said:

@BeddieKU23 Shoot, I was enjoying thinking the ACC's organization was even stupider than I had thought!

Me tooo

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 I felt like SDSU would be a bad matchup for a poor offensive team. KU absolutely beat their pants off just because we could shoot AND were more athletic than them. I think they would be scary to play if you struggled to score because they ARE going to score some points.

But I guess that's what makes it so hard to predict the tourney :joy:

Literally couldn't have more opposite opinions lol.

It was just my first thought that if they got matched up with a bad defensive team that maybe a team couldn't stop them from scoring and it becomes a shootout which they like to play. But I see a bad offensive team being a good matchup for them as well. To me one of the three likely teams to win a first round game with UNC Greensboro & potentially Vermont

@BeddieKU23 I absolutely would not want to play SDSU again. Daum is a legit nightmare matchup. PTSD kicking in already. Nightmares of UNI already coming back just thinking about it. Must. Stop.

Bracketville (best 5 year average) has them as a 12 seed. So naturally they will be a sexy pick to win.

I don't think the committee would want to rematch us against a team we already played non-con. Plus yeah they aren't a 15 or 16 seed.

My sleeper FF team is definitely Florida if they stay hot out of the SEC tourney. Seem to be back to their beginning of the season form once White basically forced Allen to start shooting the ball more.

I can see Florida winning a few games. They lack size though so its going to be matchup dependent for them as they play 4 guards primarily with a 6'8 type. Jalen Hudson will be the key with Allen in whatever run they may make. They can shoot themselves in and out of games almost simultaneously

@BShark Oh I know. I was just thinking about it in a "what if scenario".

I Just feel bad for whatever 5 or 4 does end up playing them.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 I absolutely would not want to play SDSU again. Daum is a legit nightmare matchup. PTSD kicking in already. Nightmares of UNI already coming back just thinking about it. Must. Stop.

Bracketville (best 5 year average) has them as a 12 seed. So naturally they will be a sexy pick to win.

It's still the same non-athletic team we played in Allen. Self had a good game plan for Daum who's just a good College Player and doesn't have the physical abilities that often tortue KU. The freshman guard however has improved a ton for them and would be a difficult matchup for us as they have become more of a 2 man team instead of 1

@BeddieKU23 Who besides Duke and Purdue are good teams with size? Like to the point it is an advantage. This seems like a really small-ball year. But I'm sure I'm forgetting a couple of teams.

Also, potential nightmare matchup for Duke in round 1. I know TAMU has been hit or miss, and mostly miss. But I think they could actually crush Duke's zone with rebounding and would be able to keep them off the boards on both ends.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 Who besides Duke and Purdue are good teams with size? Like to the point it is an advantage. This seems like a really small-ball year. But I'm sure I'm forgetting a couple of teams.

Also, potential nightmare matchup for Duke in round 1. I know TAMU has been hit or miss, and mostly miss. But I think they could actually crush Duke's zone with rebounding and would be able to keep them off the boards on both ends.

Your right it has been a small ball year. Cincinnati and Michigan St were the only others I could think of. Even Kentucky went more small ball once Vanderbilt came back from injury.

We complain about the brackets, but I was just reading about the 8 team womens hockey tournament. The idea there is to save teams travel money so this is how the 8 team tournament works out. 1 seed Clarkson playing unranked 8 seed Mercyhurst. 2 seed Wisconsin playing 5 seed Minnesota. 3 seed Colgate gets 9th ranked Northeastern. 4 seed Boston College vs. 6 seed Ohio State.

So a 3 seed gets an easier game than the 2 seed. The 2 seed has to play a highly ranked bitter rival while a 4th seed plays an easier team than the 2 seed. Pretty crazy that the NCAA, pockets full of cash, can't help teams travel to a tournament game so they screw teams over in the brackets to save money. Imagine if they ran the mens basketball tourney this way!

@wissox Are there more than 8 women’s hockey teams?

@wissox @dylans I don't think there are 351 women's hockey teams. Men's Hockey is pretty cool I wish KU had a team.

@dylans Good question! I had to look it up, there's 35, so you win a national title, and well, it's an accomplishment, but not as much as in other sports.

Can CBS/TBS mess this up. Yes they can!

http://awfulannouncing.com/ncaa/tbs-cbs-executives-explain-rationale-unique-selection-show-format.html ↗

wissox said:

@dylans Good question! I had to look it up, there's 35, so you win a national title, and well, it's an accomplishment, but not as much as in other sports.

Coincidentally, only 35 schools have won the NCAA Men's bb tournament in 79 years. 15 schools have won multiple titles totalling 59, and 20 have won 1.

@BeddieKU23 Well, at least no commercial breaks during the first half while they announce the brackets.

@BeddieKU23 Interesting about the new format. We shall see how that works out.

I do know one thing. Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith annoy me a great deal during the Selection show. I watch tons of college basketball all year long and always find it insulting when these two are all of the sudden thrown into the mix come March when they essentially have not called any games or analyzed any games for the entire season.

mayjay said:

@BeddieKU23 Well, at least no commercial breaks during the first half while they announce the brackets.

I'm a fan of that. Always hated waiting through 3-4 minute commercials for them to do one region.

joeloveshawks said:

@BeddieKU23 Interesting about the new format. We shall see how that works out.

I do know one thing. Charles Barkley and Kenny Smith annoy me a great deal during the Selection show. I watch tons of college basketball all year long and always find it insulting when these two are all of the sudden thrown into the mix come March when they essentially have not called any games or analyzed any games for the entire season.

I agree, this what you get though when you combine networks. There's a sort of entertainment value they are trying to project. They could do better but they won't!

The last few years, the brackets were leaking on twitter before the show. So it was a waste of time anyways.

Louisville crushing Florida St at the half

@BeddieKU23 One of the prices we pay for being able to watch 3 or 4 games simultaneously.

mayjay said:

@BeddieKU23 One of the prices we pay for being able to watch 3 or 4 games simultaneously.

Yupp, I'm fine with it. This year the NCAA App has added a feature where they will pop in and out of all the games going on at the same time- sort of in the mold of Red Zone for Football

@BeddieKU23 I hope that can get casted to a TV

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 I hope that can get casted to a TV

If you have a smart tv you might even be able to download the app right to it!

Louisville held for the victory. Sets up a big game for them with Virginia. Win they are safely in. Lose they sweat it out

Boston College up 14 at half on NC St. NC St can ill afford to lose to a non-dancing team.

Tad Boyle and Colorado may have ended Arizona States chances by spanking them in the PAC 12 tournament today.

Doke our for the conference tourney. Should be back though for next week. Still not great. Only benefit I see would be it let’s Silvio get serious minutes and we can see what he’s capable of. If we make the finals without Doke, have to think we guaranteed ourselves the 1 seed.

Not that it matters much anymore but oklahoma st up 11 on OU at half

Round 3 of Oklahoma st tomm. Sad they get gifted another win

@BeddieKU23 I hope you don't watch

Crimsonorblue22 said:

@BeddieKU23 I hope you don't watch

Thanks so inspirational

Notre Dame comes charging back from 20 down with 13 minutes left to top Virginia Tech. They are making a strong case for an at large bid.

Stick a fork in OU. Maybe the ball hog will figure out why he didn't win CPOY when he's playing in the NIT.

@kjayhawks I will be disappointed if they don’t make it.

Grayson has looked like a legit NBA PG prospect so far this game though. I hate to say that too. But damn, a lot of teams look like they could do worse at backup PG than Allen.

Although, Duvall looks like one too... This Duke team is stupid talented. And K has coached them well this year. Would be hard to bet against them right now.

@Kcmatt7 Zero defense in this game but yeah Duke is extremely talented. I was hoping we'd have a shot with Bagley but swoosh.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/bracketology-updates-duke-kansas-xavier-vie-for-two-no-1-spots-in-ncaa-tournament/ ↗ ↗

this has a zillion brackets listed:

http://www.bracketmatrix.com/ ↗ ↗" target="_blank" rel="noopener">http://www.bracketmatrix.com/) ↗

The plot thickens, OSU lost, Texas lost, ND lost and Middle Tennessee loses, which will give conference USA 2 teams instead of one. OU lost early yesterday and Baylor is in a must win shortly against WV. Looks like OU, OSU, Texas and Baylor are all on the bubble, it will be interesting to see who gets in because they all finished the B12 8-10 and have similar records, ratings.

The official criteria for #1 seeds: 1. Best team in the nation 2. 2nd best team in the nation 3. 3rd best team in the nation 4. Winner of the ACC Tournament

Xavier losing helps KUs chances at a number 1 seed, if Dook loses I’d say we have a fairly good shot at a 1 regardless of tomorrow’s outcome.

@BShark genius🤓

Dwight Coleby and Western Kentucky will battle Marshall for the conference USA crown tomorrow and a trip to the dance. I hope that they can pull off the win and get in for Coleby to have another shot to play in the tournament. I just hope they don’t play us lol, they are a good enough team, I wouldn’t sleep on them.

UCLA has too much talent to have double digit losses in the Pac.

BShark said:

The official criteria for #1 seeds: 1. Best team in the nation 2. 2nd best team in the nation 3. 3rd best team in the nation 4. Winner of the ACC Tournament

I thought #4 seed was: 4. Team with Trae Young

I think if KU wins today that gives KU the 1 in the Midwest. Today is actually important, as much as I hate to say that about a Big Xii tournament game.

@Kcmatt7 KU probably already gas the 1 seed in the Midwest now with Xavier's semifinal loss and Duke's loss to UNC. As long as KU doesn't get blown out today, I think they'll be the 1 seed in Omaha.

@Texas-Hawk-10 I just don’t think that is a guarantee if we lose.

Be careful what you wish for....

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology ↗ ↗

@KUSTEVE Not that we'd get past Wichita State for it to matter as they would win by 20+ but MSU and Duke on our 2/3 line would suck.

@BShark while Xavier is out there with auburn and purdue. I'm not afraid of the shlockers at all.

@KUSTEVE They'd hang a hundred or more on this KU defense.

@BShark You're overrating them- you must live in Kansas.

@KUSTEVE

If that is the case, I rather go West, but Lunardi is not the best so I am not worried...yet...

@KUSTEVE I've seen them play. They would have won the Big 12.

@BShark They wouldn't have finished top 3. I think they would've finished with a winning record, though. I've watched 6 or 7 of their games this year, and I like them. Good team.

@BShark if we have a paper thin D, idk what to call WSU’s. They have like the 97th worst defense lol. Our shooters would light them up.

WSU is overrated even at the 4 imo.

@Kcmatt7

WSU has some very good players and depth, lots of depth, something KU does not.

Doke would eat Morris alive. This team would smack WSU right in the face. They couldn’t even win their own conference, don’t think they could survive the beating they would have taken in the Big XII night in and night out.

I’ll take KU by 8 against WSU if that’s how it shakes out.

@Kcmatt7 Something tells me they'd play the defensive game of their lives.

@Kcmatt7 And what's our ranking on Defense?

jayballer73 said:

@Kcmatt7 And what's our ranking on Defense?

Would you believe it is somehow top 50? Because it is.

Of course getting Doke back is CRUCIAL defensively.

@KUSTEVE Your right they are a good team. - -I've seen them enough that I understand that their pretty tough - they have beaten enough quality teams over these past years that I know that they are not a fluke.

Would they win the big 12? - - Probably not. - -Would they be in the running just like these other teams that is in the league now like WV - - -Texas Tech? - - I believe they would. - - I just think that there are some here that no matter how good they were would just refuse to acknowledge that they are for real.

Now do I like them? - - OH HELL NO - - I can't stand Marshal - -I think he is a arrogant shit. - -but he does get his guys to play hard, and they produce - - - It's just that some don't want to give credit where credit is due. - - Some think that unless it's KU - -our boys that then any other team can't be any good. -- -There are a lot of teams that are good - -some are better for sure believe it or not.

I agree with what you say - I think WSU probably would end up in the top 3-4 of the league and if things just fell their way - then ya they actually might challenge for the title. - -Thing is we will see after this year what Marsha is going to do -- they are losing ALOT we will see how he handles next year. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@BShark Thank you man. - - -Now I am not sure if they would win it - - BUT I too have seen enough of them that I know that they would sure give teams a run for their money here in the Big 12.

I'm gonna give credit where credit is due - -doesn't mean we have to like them -- -I can't stand them - but I'm not gonna bull shit and say they suck - far from it - -their pretty solid. - - - Some here wouldn't say that if their life depended on it - -their Crimson and Blue blinders are getting in the way. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@BShark Whoaaaaaaa, hold up now bud , like I said in another of your posts - -I for sure agree they are good - -but ummm hang 100? ummm I don't think sooo. - I think it would be a pretty open game high score but I don't think anyone is hanging 100 on KU no matter our defense - -just not happening

kjayhawks said:

The plot thickens, OSU lost, Texas lost, ND lost and Middle Tennessee loses, which will give conference USA 2 teams instead of one. OU lost early yesterday and Baylor is in a must win shortly against WV. Looks like OU, OSU, Texas and Baylor are all on the bubble, it will be interesting to see who gets in because they all finished the B12 8-10 and have similar records, ratings.

Never thought I'd be saying this - -BUT - - - I actually thought Baylor was the safest of them all -- lmao - -guess that goes to show what I know. - -from what I hear now sounds like Baylor is OUT - -I think Okie State is in the Crapper and I think it's 50/50 on Oklahoma. - -Then the team I thought that had the least chance of making it in - -Texas - -looks like they MAY just sneak in. - - -I think we end up with 7 teams in - - -- ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@BShark I think we would come in with a chip on our shoulders. I hope they are our 4 seed because we would be motivated as hell to play that game. I think moreso than any other 4.

@BShark - - NO LMAO. - - -no way -- are you serious? lol - - no now in all seriousness I would of never guessed that. - -Well that's a lot better then I thought. - I was thinking more in the lines of bordering 100. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

jayballer73 said:

@BShark - - NO LMAO. - - -no way -- are you serious? lol - - no now in all seriousness I would of never guessed that. - -Well that's a lot better then I thought. - I was thinking more in the lines of bordering 100. - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

Yep. #46. If we don't have Doke we aren't at that level defensively though.

Well guys we got the B12s auto bid so we won’t have to sweat it out tomorrow 🤪

Providence and Nova headed to OT.

As much as I hate to admit it, UK looks to have grown up a ton these last few days. They’ll be a tough team in the tournament.

kjayhawks said:

As much as I hate to admit it, UK looks to have grown up a ton these last few days. They’ll be a tough team in the tournament.

I actually called this when they were struggling, because it's that obvious.

@BShark - Are you speaking of Xavier or WSU? WSU didn’t even win their own American conference. They fell by two games. Are you saying The American Conf > Big XII?

Funny season. We were all hyped about the team putting it together, then came the OSU debacle, and then the Doke bad news and we were all writing our season off. Now we've steamrolled the competition without Doke, and riding another wave of confidence. But the fact is, we've lost 7 games, but another fact is we've won 8 of our last nine, we'll probably be a 7 loss 1 seed. We'll probably hear some crying about it amongst others, hear some reminders of our 'failures' in the dance since we lost to Kentucky 6 years ago, endure some taunts, can't win the big one, and even among our faithful, we'll be pessimistic about our dance prognostications, except when we fill out our brackets with KU on the final line!

It's all over but the shouting boys and girls. The field is almost set. The committee is debating, the talking heads are blathering on and on, the proctologists, I mean bracketologists are making their headline grabbing prognostications, the fans are hoping, dreaming, Vegas is gearing up, travel agents are pedaling packages, personnel offices are bracing for lots of sick days on Thursday or Friday, college fans are lamenting no more home games, and of course Duke is plotting, scheming, conniving, conning into the most favorable position with the best refereeing crew from Durham, NC. CBS is doing their part to ensure that ratings will be high so Kentucky will probably play OSU in the 2nd round, 'Nova will lose again to a overseeded 2nd round opponent, MSU-MU will be slotted oppositely so they can meet, KU/Missou/WSU are all being bracketed together so those dream ratings busters can be scheduled.

@jaybate-1-0 is theororizing, @Crimsonorblue22 is sharing momentus news in very few words, @mayjay is analyzing, @HighEliteMajor is lecturing like a physics of basketball instructor, @BeddieKU23 is looking for every angle to help our team, @BShark is poring over the WWW looking, for news that will help, @JayHawkFanToo is educating us about every nuance we need to know about, @kjayhawks is cheering or worrying or both, @Texas-Hawk-10 is trying on his championship T-Shirt, @drgnslayr is teaching us, @RockChalkinTexas is cheering all the way from Austin Texas in the midst of a sea of orange longhorns who care much more about football anyways, @Red-Rooster is upvoting, @Kcmatt is not worrying, @jayballer73 is RockChalkAllDayLongBabying, @DoubleDD is guardedly optimistic, @KUSTEVE aka Jethro is getting some pointed barbs ready for whoever would disparage our team, @Dylans is applying the wisdom that age brings, and @approxinfinity is just keeping an eye on all of us making sure we obey. (sorry if I forgot someone, I know I did, but once you start a list like this it's tough to include everyone)

Me, I've been pessimistic for several months now, but no other team scares me a ton. Nova usually flames out except against us of course, Virginny can't get over the hump, Xavier are too jerky, Duke scares me, but lost as much as we did, UNC, I just don't know, Purdue's height scares, but they've got a Bruce Weber assistant for a head coach. MSU, too scandalous, Zona too much Miller to achieve greatness. So it might as well be us. Let's win this darn thing, make it an every 10 year thing instead of every 20-30 year thing. Rock Chalk!

@wissox terrific

@wissox

I said we would win the 14th 2-3 weeks before we did. We did.

I said the wheels would come off Tech after we beat them. They did.

I said Doke going down for two weeks the day after he got hurt was the best thing that could have happened to this team. They won 3 in 3 in KC. It was.

No theorizin’ from the ‘bate 1.0.

Just clear vision.

Now for next: I don’t like how hot we got in KC. Needed the hot game for the second game of round 1 in the Carney–the last one before Doke plays again. If we flame out from trey in game 1/round 1, we can labor through
Without Doke. But if we flame out game 2/round 1, we will likely get beat. Ugh!!

Here’s hoping we stay hot till the second round!!!

@cragarhawk Thanks!
@jaybate-1-0 , come on bro, you do a fair amount of theoryizing! Of course, most of your theories are 99% accurate 3/5th of the time except on Sundays and days that are above 82 degrees.

@wissox

Actually theories are what I NEVER do.

THEORIES are for suckers!

Yeeeee hawwww!

It’s CARNEY time at last!!!

One more weekend and Doke is back!!!!

@jaybate-1.0 We'll win the 2nd round game, period.

@wissox Hey now, I'm not trying on championship shirts yet, I'm looking up hotels and ticket prices in San Antonio. Enjoyed it though.

@jaybate-1.0 I was thinking that last night......should we have saved our 15-27 from 3 for the sweet 16? I guess it doesn't work like that.....

Lunardi has Fizzou and Silo T playing each other out West as the 8-9 game.

Can we have an Asian Regional and send them further?

KU in the MW, with Purdue, Auburn, WSU and Gonzaga. Not thrilled if Purdue gets a rematch revenge chip.

@kjayhawks It was just a matter of time for their freshmen. - - Their talent was always there - just needed to adapt to the College Game. - Like always they are going to be a tough out. - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@wissox :joy:

wissox said:

@cragarhawk Thanks!
@jaybate-1-0 , come on bro, you do a fair amount of theoryizing! Of course, most of your theories are 99% accurate 3/5th of the time except on Sundays and days that are above 82 degrees.

What I am, of course, penultimately thrilled about is how "conspiracy theory"-- lately sheepishly being reduced to "theorizing" and other variations--by persons so long conditioned by the CIA's MSM meme-ing them with "conspiracy theory," came to be proven to be CIA/Deep State memes (thanks Judicial Watch). I admit, I figured "conspiracy theory" and "theorizing" had to be propaganda terms propagated in the CIA shaped reverb chamber of the CIA-shaped MSM, but, well, even I couldn't predict that the term itself would be tied straight to the Company. Damn, that was very sweet and I missed it! There. I admit it. I'm only good at forecasting KU basketball. Good forecasting requires true love. I don't love politics and propaganda, as I do KU Basketball. But you know that.

Ultimately, I am all yeeeee hawwwww, its Carney time at last, and as usual, that ain't no "theorizin'". :-)

Oh and I refer you again to my "playful predictin' ":

1. Called 14th title 2-3 weeks before and stuck to forecast, when the hand wringers were bed wetting. Check.

2. Called the wheels coming off TTech-less, after Self and his players exploited their weaknesses. Their wheels went off in every direction. Check.

3. Said losing Doke was best thing for KU that could have happened. They won 3 in 3. It was. Check.

"How sweet it is," as Jackie Gleason used to say.

But these are just the usual results for the Oread Oracle, as you know. :-)

Rock Chalk, my theorizin'-projecting fellow Jayhawk!

Does anyone know what time the actual bracket come out today?

Now the dilemma - how do we go back to not rebounding with DeSousa on the bench? Will Dok and Silvio play together??? Will Silvio cut into Dok’s minutes, Mitch’s, or a guard (Vick/Garret)? Ahhh new variables for the Dance. Let the fun begin!

@dylans Bill will finally be able to tell Doke and Mitch to play balls to the wall. Knowing we have Silvio to come in means that we just gained 5 fouls at that position. So now Mitch and Doke can really play aggressively.

@kcmatt7 Mitch is pretty aggressive as is - he tries to swat every shot.

Silvio is pretty aggressive as is too - he puts his butt on someone every shot and boxes out to the stands. I love this quality and he and Garrett are the only ones with it.

Dok is too reserved going for rebounds and blocks some so maybe that’s where the improvement could lie.

@dylans There are still times where Mitch or Doke is trying to avoid a foul and we give up an easy basket because of it.

@Kcmatt7 All our posts have a ton to learn about positioning. It’s the one thing Lando had going for him.

@jaybate-1.0 Ok Swami, or whatever you want to be called, since you're on a little hot streak. Tell me how the next four weeks are going to go!

Davidson just popped a bubble.

@BShark this year the bubble is crazy, the committee will leave out some guys that thought they were in. It will be interesting to see if the B12 gets 6,7 or 8 teams in. I’d say most likely 7.

Can anyone tell me or does anyone know how the brackets set up for the NCAA tourney? - what I mean is it - - The South vs the East in the final four and the West vs the Midwest ? - is that the set up? anyone know - - ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY

@jayballer73 http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology ↗ here’s a bracket projection with the matchups you are looking for.

You knew they couldn't leave out Un Young.

@BShark Texas?

@Crimsonorblue22 Whoever gets OU and UT will be licking their chops.

Doke's throws got ou in.🤯

Wow. This selection show is awful. Lol

cragarhawk said:

Wow. This selection show is awful. Lol

No drama. Sucks.

@Crimsonorblue22 OU has 7 wins this year. SEVEN.

@cragarhawk Agreed, not a fan of revealing the teams first.

Lawrence Police
‏Verified account @LawrenceKS_PD
13m13 minutes ago

Please do not call 911 to complain about the format of the NCAA tournament selection show. We can’t do anything about it, no matter how bad it is.

So the B12 get 7 teams in: Kansas, West Virginia, Texas Tech, Kansas State, Texas, TCU and Oklahoma. I’d would’ve took Baylor or Okie State over Oklahoma with how they finished. Interesting that Syracuse got in.

I read a statement from Marsha that he wouldn't be available to the media after the selection show. What? He would speak tmrw.

St Mary's a top 30 Kenpom team is not in. Had to squeeze Un Young in there somehow!

Poor Bruce just can't catch a break. UVA will dumpster them.

That's if they get past Creighton. You know Foster is gonna be jacked to try and eliminate Bruce.

Glad Arizona isn't in our bracket.

Arizona Kentucky in the SECOND ROUND. HOLD ME. MERCY.

Yes

DODGED THE SHOCKERS. CRISIS AVERTED.

We won't get duke, right?

@Crimsonorblue22 Duke and MSU I bet.

Or UNC and MSU

Also you know Missouri is gonna be in our 8/9 game. @HighEliteMajor called it in advance too.

And Michigan?

Seton Hall is a tough match-up. Delgado inside is a beast.

Clemson and Auburn though, that's not bad for us!

There's no reason we don't make E8 in this bracket

Couldn't have been gifted a better route to the elite 8

@cragarhawk Really is wide open to the EE.

Well?

BeddieKU23 said:

Couldn't have been gifted a better route to the elite 8

Agree. Not getting to the FF though. Duke/MSU will win this region.

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

Couldn't have been gifted a better route to the elite 8

Agree. Not getting to the FF though. Duke/MSU will win this region.

Nope

We can beat both teams

@BeddieKU23 is that you?

It's a long way to the FF. I won't say we can't win against either if those teams. Just take care of business before that for sure. Never get an easier trip

As good of a bracket as you could have hoped for.

BeddieKU23 said:

We can beat both teams

Have you seen Bagley?

Exactly take Care of business

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

We can beat both teams

Have you seen Bagley?

Have you seen silvio?

Kcmatt7 said:

As good of a bracket as you could have hoped for.

Definitely.

@Kcmatt7 absolutely the friendliest path to the E8. Must take advantage

If mich st and duke meet in the s16 it's a payback game for izzo

West looks like they type of bracket something crazy could happen in.

I think we got the best 16 seed bye leaps and bounds, none of the roads are easy let’s go.

Gonzaga as a 4 is the team I think might get out of that bracket

Either that or they just gifted Roy another final 4

Mizzou pt guard was picked up for dui last week too.

Kcmatt7 said:

West looks like they type of bracket something crazy could happen in.

I could see Missouri knocking off Xavier with Porter working his way back into the mix.

@Texas-Hawk-10 didn’t want to play them for that reason.

I wanted roy

Current porter is terrible

@BeddieKU23 if they get through A&M.

That team could show up and compete when they feel like it.

I think the West looks easiest at the top. I like our bracket early, but we will have to get past a one seed type in either MSU or Duke if we get to the elite 8.

In Omaha with MSU and Duke? We're winning that game. But we gotta get there first. It can happen. This team CAN win this tournament

West Virginia and WSU potential🤪

Hawk8086 said:

I think the West looks easiest at the top. I like our bracket early, but we will have to get past a one seed type in either MSU or Duke if we get to the elite 8.

If we are good enough at that point we want to prove so.. bring it and let the rest take care of it's self.

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

Houston is the team I’d be most scared of in the West outside of UNC/Xavier

@Crimsonorblue22 maybe in the NC game

kjayhawks said:

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

I think we say this every year and it's overblown we crushed the same michigan st team last yr

Crimsonorblue22 said:

West Virginia and WSU potential🤪

Very ANGRY game.

Hawk8086 said:

I think the West looks easiest at the top. I like our bracket early, but we will have to get past a one seed type in either MSU or Duke if we get to the elite 8.

Elite 8 is supposed to be a top 10 caliber match up. Not supposed to be an easy one.

@BeddieKU23 Michigan State is much much better this year obviously they have a 3 seed not a 9. That and we are no where near as athletic as a year ago. It really it’s gonna depend on how we shoot, one game at a time.

BeddieKU23 said:

kjayhawks said:

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

I think we say this every year and it's overblown we crushed the same michigan st team last yr

That was a 15 loss MSU team. Cassius Winston is greatly improved.

kjayhawks said:

@BeddieKU23 Michigan State is much much better this year obviously they have a 3 seed not a 9. It really it’s gonna depend on how we shoot, one game at a time.

Sure they are better and they added a NBA player to the roster. Still they have an inflated record. They can be beaten

@BeddieKU23 anyone can be beaten lol

BShark said:

BeddieKU23 said:

kjayhawks said:

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

I think we say this every year and it's overblown we crushed the same michigan st team last yr

That was a 15 loss MSU team. Cassius Winston is greatly improved.

He is and Langford as well. Bridges and ward are mostly the same.
Mcquaid bothers me the most

kjayhawks said:

@BeddieKU23 anyone can be beaten lol

Except us we hope

Tech and west Virginia could meet in the sweet 16

I thought we got a good draw. i would've preferred a purdue as a 2 seed, and tenn as a 3. Still, I have always thought Dook was overrated, and Sparty is beatable.

can we start a new thread for bracket this one is taking forever to load

1st round games I'm looking forward to:

Florida vs. UCLA/St. Bonnie's

Alabama/VTech

Ohio St./South Dakota St.

Texas/Nevada

Creighton/KSU (Marcus Foster should be motivated for that one)

Texas A&M/Providence

Missouri/Florida St.

I'm sure they'll be other great games, but those 7 are the ones I'm most looking forward to now.

@KUSTEVE LOL

@BShark i was kidding, but i didn't want you to get mad.

@KUSTEVE It's all good. I hate WSU ftr.

Extra fun beating fellow blue bloods, though!

TIMEOUT!!! Lets get by Penn and make it to the Sweet 16 before we start worrying about Duke or Sparty. S Hall, NC State, Clemson, Auburn, all good teams in our half. Just one flat shooting game and we are out, just like the last two years. Lets go one game at a time and move on, and soon we will be in San Antonio

Great quote from Seth Greenberg on the top half of our region:

"You guys take the field...I'll take Kansas>"

'bout damn time !

BeddieKU23 said:

kjayhawks said:

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

I think we say this every year and it's overblown we crushed the same michigan st team last yr

This is not the same MSU as last year. Jackson is a beast....the other guys are better.

Talking heads say Nova has the easiest bracket to the final four. Ours is the toughest. Imagine that.

🐦 View Tweet?s=21

@wissox

batenac 1.0, the all seeing one from the east only predicts KU games, and is at this very moment withdrawing the KU bracket from a mayonaisse jar and will get back with you if/when he can foresee clearly the future.

To reiterate, after the thermonuclear hot shooting of games 2 and 3 in the useless conference tourney, I have great trepidation about game 2 of the first weekend, despite strong reassurances of other swamis that the first weekend is a lock for KU. One can now be assured that at least one game in the coming potential three 2-game tournaments will see KU having more difficulty getting the trey ball to fall through the orange rim than an elephant dancing on one leg through the sphincter of a Tse Tse fly.

But, I must make clear, that as of this moment, batenac 1.0 has no clear vision beyond the trepidation of Game 2 of Weekend 1.

And most certainly no theorizin'.

We're in the champions classic bracket. Funny season. MSU 29-4 3 seed, we go 27-7 and get a 1 seed in the same region. I don't like seeing Duke in our path. But we've had recent success against Duke too. Everyone here is saying it's a good draw, my first take was it was tough, but I do like the path to the Elite 8.

And it's really strange to not see Wisconsin's name. One of the unlikeliest long tournament runs comes to an end. When their streak started in 1999 they had been dancing all of 4 seasons, winning it all once believe it or not. 3 final fours since, 1 title game, 10 sweet 16's including the last five years. And all with very few bonafide stars.

Wisconsin and KU could have met in 2008 but upstart Davidson got hot behind some kid, I forget his name :) and they nearly prevented us from winning it all that season.

Meanwhile 22-10 and 13-5 in the league Nebraska stays home and 19-15 Alabama gets in. 8-10 in the weak SEC. I really can't stand the preferential treatment given to the SEC. Bama losers of 6 of last 8 by the way and early season losers to Minnesota who was one of the two worst teams in the big 10.

@wissox Nebraska only had 3 "quality wins" this year. While I think they got robbed from just the "eye test", they went 3-9 in quadrant 1 and 2 games. Their noncon schedule was really weak as well, and they lost all of the ones that would have been good wins. Tough break, but it finally looks like Tim Miles might have some momentum in Lincoln. Return their 4 best players and a few young guys should get much better this offseason which will allow them to be a better and deeper next year. I think they will be a big surprise this time next year.

Bama played a tougher noncon schedule and had a lot more quality wins.

The Big 10 perception really hurt them this season. And the conference members did themselves no favors. Nobody played a tough noncon. And the teams that did either got demolished or made the tourney as a top 5 seed. Over half of the teams had noncon strength of schedules ranked in the 100s I believe. And they lost some really bad games.

@Kcmatt7 So just play tough teams and lose to them and you'll get in? Or play and beat easier teams and not get in? Nebraska beat the teams they were supposed to except Illinois. Bama's record sucks. They've lost 6 of their last 8! They lost 15 games but the NCAA makes room for the populous south. It's pretty sick. I'm not even going to talk about all the other SEC teams playing this week. Penn St. had a good case. 1 bad loss to Rider, and a bunch of tough losses to good teams and some good wins in the conference. Once the NCAA gets it in their minds that a league is good or bad it sets the tone. Wins get excused for the Big10 because it's bad and losses get excused for the SEC because it's good. Heck, OkSt should be in if Bama is in. OKState had quite a few good wins as we know.

By the way, CBS ranked all 68 teams and we were ranked 8th, MSU was 3, Duke was 2.

@wissox @Kcmatt7 Nebraska got robbed IMO, when’s the last time a power 5 team had 13 conference wins and didn’t get in? While teams like Syracuse, Oklahoma, Texas and Arizona State all had finished 2 games below .500, Arizona State while playing in the weakest power 5 conference. I don’t like the idea of rewarding teams for wins in November and December because most teams get better as the year goes on, these teams got worse. Does anyone think we would lose to Washington or Arizona State if we played ether right now, I sure as heck don’t.

wissox said:

By the way, CBS ranked all 68 teams and we were ranked 8th, MSU was 3, Duke was 2.

MSU as a 3 seed is a joke. Committee hated the B1G this year though.

@BShark like I said earlier IMO, MSU and Dook are the most talented teams in the bracket. Doesn’t necessarily mean they are the best but it’s does looked like we got jobbed from the stand point that MSU, Dook are ranked in the top 5 in the latest AP and Coaches Poll. I personally feel like we get the toughest bracket about 80% of the time but there isn’t a easy road bye any stretch and if you’re the best you got beat the best.

@kjayhawks I don't understand how MSU isn't a 2 seed but w/e.

UK vs Arizona is the MOST INSANE 2nd round game since????

@wissox Nebraska didn't beat ANYONE but Michigan the entire year.

Nebraska did not earn a bid. They played the 291st ranked noncon schedule. Combined with the conference schedule, The 4 quality noncon games they played, they lost. The have only 1 win against teams that made the tournament.

Nebraska did not belong in the tournament and would have been crushed in the SEC this season. They earned nothing. They even got lucky enough that they didn't have to see 3 of the top 4 teams twice. Instead they played Illinois, Rutgers, Wisconsin, Minnesota and Penn St. twice. So that conference record you are boasting about was very inflated.

Alabama is the better team with the better resume. They played the 29th noncon schedule, winning 3 of 5 quality games. They only played 2 quadrant 4 games all season long. They have 7 wins against tournament teams on the year.

The entire B10 learned a lesson this season. Playing dog crap schedules in the noncon and then coasting on a conference record just because you are in a P5 conference won't fool the selection committee. MSU and Purdue are probably kicking themselves that they didn't schedule 3 or 4 more good noncon games. Could have put them as a 1 seed easily.

@BShark since UK and Indiana after Indiana won the B10 outright and still got a 5 seed lol.

USC was the truly absurd snub. Best team I can remember to not get in.

Every year there are teams that most of us think should be in and get snubbed and teams that do get in that most of us think should no be in.

I posted before that I would not be surprised to see Michigan State as a 3 or even a 4 seed. The NCAA has a set of rules it uses to seed teams and its record against quadrant 1 and 2 was not good, partly because the Big 10 was weak and marginally better than the PAC 12 that only got 3 teams in and two of them are in the play-in games in Dayton.

I’d rather be KU than Duke. Duke’s gotta get through MSU (you can reverse the two if you’d like) just to play KU. KU’s path is pretty wide open to that point.

@BShark

I wonder: would tournament promotion and brand management be helped, or hindered, if UK beat UA early and made the UA/Stumpy "issue" disappear ASAP from "the narrative"?

There. I used "narrative" to try to be hip and hypermodern.

:-)

Things to consider in the first round.

Missouri's 2nd leading scorer was suspended for their opening round game. I don't see how they win.

Miami's Bruce Brown will miss the rest of the season and they are definitely on upset alert against Loyola Chicago

Hawk8086 said:

BeddieKU23 said:

kjayhawks said:

I’m a little worried about a Duke or MSU match in the EE, those two teams may have the most talent in the field. But we’d have to get there first.

I think we say this every year and it's overblown we crushed the same michigan st team last yr

This is not the same MSU as last year. Jackson is a beast....the other guys are better.

Have you watched Michigan St play?

If the answer is yes then explain what makes them that much different. You mentioned Jackson, yes he's good, potentially Top 5 in the draft good. Can step out and make the 3 and has elite level rim protection ability. The other players who we spanked as freshman are sophomores. They have a few veterans with experience, Nairn, McQuaid, Goins who come off the bench. They rely heavily on 5 guys like we do. Winston has become a really good PG and has shot lights out from 3 all season long. I have watched them plenty. Its a lot of paper talent that hasn't played up to its potential all season long IMO. We talk a lot about being battle tested, Michigan St is the opposite of battle tested. When they play teams as good as them they struggle. I would welcome playing them in the Elite 8.

wissox said:

Meanwhile 22-10 and 13-5 in the league Nebraska stays home and 19-15 Alabama gets in. 8-10 in the weak SEC. I really can't stand the preferential treatment given to the SEC. Bama losers of 6 of last 8 by the way and early season losers to Minnesota who was one of the two worst teams in the big 10.

Collin Sexton hype all week from ESPN put them in. Then they get blown out by Kentucky and still get in..

Kcmatt7 said:

@wissox Nebraska only had 3 "quality wins" this year. While I think they got robbed from just the "eye test", they went 3-9 in quadrant 1 and 2 games. Their noncon schedule was really weak as well, and they lost all of the ones that would have been good wins. Tough break, but it finally looks like Tim Miles might have some momentum in Lincoln. Return their 4 best players and a few young guys should get much better this offseason which will allow them to be a better and deeper next year. I think they will be a big surprise this time next year.

Bama played a tougher noncon schedule and had a lot more quality wins.

The Big 10 perception really hurt them this season. And the conference members did themselves no favors. Nobody played a tough noncon. And the teams that did either got demolished or made the tourney as a top 5 seed. Over half of the teams had noncon strength of schedules ranked in the 100s I believe. And they lost some really bad games.

Nebraska is in if they beat KU at home. That 1 point loss is the difference between the NIT and NCAA tourney

BShark said:

UK vs Arizona is the MOST INSANE 2nd round game since????

Seems Kentucky gets a lot of 2nd round big games. Wichita St and Indiana in recent memory..

BShark said:

USC was the truly absurd snub. Best team I can remember to not get in.

2nd in their conference and lost in the conference final. A true head-scratcher..

I think they set us up against Penn in the first round, and Seton Hall in the 2nd round to try to get us to lose. The Sweet 16 match up might be the only reprieve we get until we have to face NBA talent in the Elite 8. Still, it's much easier than Kentucky, or Virginia. Notice how easy UNC's bracket is in comparison.

I'll get our bracket group going on ESPN at lunch.

@Kcmatt7 They didn't beat anyone but 13 Big 10 teams. I understand their resume is lacking big wins, but they beat the schedule placed in front of them. I don't give a squat if Alabama beat so and so. They lost 15 times. They lost 6 of last 8. They're an NIT team if there ever was one!

I was out til 9 last night so didn't get to watch the selection show and hear all of the analysts. USC sounds like a major snub too. PAC10 weak, I guess, but they went 2-1 against the Big12 champs!

MSU is scary. I've seen them 3 or 4 times this year. They defend very well, block a lot of shots and can fill it up too.

KUSTEVE said:

I think they set us up against Penn in the first round, and Seton Hall in the 2nd round to try to get us to lose. The Sweet 16 match up might be the only reprieve we get until we have to face NBA talent in the Elite 8. Still, it's much easier than Kentucky, or Virginia. Notice how easy UNC's bracket is in comparison.

I think TV eyeballs would be important to them so I don't think they set us up to lose. Seton Hall might be attractive, but we are playing them in our home state don't forget so that's not exactly setting us up to lose.

@wissox Seton Hall beat Texas Tech by 10 on a neutral court. They carry an RPI rating of 32, which is 12 spots lower than any other 8/9 seed. I think we can beat them, but I think this is a 5/6 seed hiding out on the 8 line.

KUSTEVE said:

I think they set us up against Penn in the first round, and Seton Hall in the 2nd round to try to get us to lose. The Sweet 16 match up might be the only reprieve we get until we have to face NBA talent in the Elite 8. Still, it's much easier than Kentucky, or Virginia. Notice how easy UNC's bracket is in comparison.

It's not that bad, lol.

I think this bracket is perfect for KU. The first game is a gimme. The second game is extremely winnable. Both of the first two games are the type of teams KU feasts upon. The 4/5 seeds don’t pose a matchup problem for KU should be equal to a middle of the pack Big12 team. The elite eight game should be against a name brand opponent. KU always shows up against the big boys - may not win, but they will give effort. I think there is a very realistic chance to see KU in the final four.

KUSTEVE said:

@wissox Seton Hall beat Texas Tech by 10 on a neutral court. They carry an RPI rating of 32, which is 12 spots lower than any other 8/9 seed. I think we can beat them, but I think this is a 5/6 seed hiding out on the 8 line.

every game will be a fight. Seton Hall is a bit better than NC State, in my opinion. They should have beat Nova a couple weeks ago but some poor play at the end cost them. If we aren't careful, we won't make it out of the first weekend.

@wissox they didn't beat the schedule placed in front of them. They got a lucky draw, and played a weak noncon. Can only blame themselves. They know the conference schedule, and they knew the conference would be weak.

USC was 100% a major snub though. Deserved to be in more than a lot of teams. Especially Syracuse. Nebraska deserved to be in more than Syracuse.

And then there is this:

"After hitting the biggest Final Four jumper since Keith Smart's in 1987, Mario Chalmers summoned his mother, Almarie, down from the Alamodome stands to courtside. The unflappable Kansas Jayhawk wrapped both arms around her, laid his head on her shoulder and bawled like a baby.

She pumped her left arm. He wouldn't let go.

"We did it, Mom," Chalmers said between sobs.

"A dream come true," Almarie said later, her own eyes glistening. "A prayer answered. We've been waiting on this moment since he was 2."

This moment -- this Shining Moment -- was almost preordained four years earlier, when Mario went to the Final Four in this same building with his dad, current Kansas director of basketball operations Ronnie Chalmers. They watched Connecticut beat Georgia Tech for the title, and Ronnie remembers one spectacular play from that game when he jumped to his feet but Mario remained in his chair.

"What's wrong?" Ronnie asked his son.

"I'm thinking," Mario said.

"What are you thinking about?"

"One day," Mario said, "I'm going to be out there winning the national championship."

Mario's quote didn't include "...if we get an easy draw" after the word "championship".

The positive for Seton Hall and potential issue if we play them in the 2nd round is senior leadership. Delgado, Rodriguez & Carrington have been through a ton of battles. They played very well in non-conference play and lost some close games in conference. They had a golden opportunity to beat Villanova weeks back and blew that! I don't think Seton Hall is coming in with momentum which would be a key to being scared against a 8/9 seed.

They have a big advantage over NC St in experience. I see Seton Hall as a likely winner because I tend to favor experience. If it comes down to guard play I would favor NC St maybe a little more. They have a better PG then Seton Hall who really doesn't have a true point and style of play for NC St might be something that catches Seton Hall off guard. The battle between Delgado and Yurtseven could be fantastic.

If I'm rooting for anyone I'm rooting for NC St. Is anyone really scared of Allerick Freeman who used to play for Baylor? Yurtseven might have 30 but who cares we do a good job of limiting others. The health of Doke by Saturday will be important to see.

@BeddieKU23 I hope Doke doesn't play Thursday. But we will need him Saturday. If the D stays active like it has been, I would love to play NC State. Not sure they can actually keep us from scoring, but if we can keep them from scoring that is an easy win.

I would take SHU in that matchup though.

Kcmatt7 said:

@BeddieKU23 I hope Doke doesn't play Thursday. But we will need him Saturday. If the D stays active like it has been, I would love to play NC State. Not sure they can actually keep us from scoring, but if we can keep them from scoring that is an easy win.

I would take SHU in that matchup though.

I hope Doke plays some Thursday just to get back into running on the knee and mentally being okay running and jumping.

If he's not going to play Thursday but Saturday I don't know what to think honestly.

It was impressive seeing Silvio step up and how he was able to impact the game rebounding and being around the rim. Both of those things seemed to be important. I thought our guards were able to create more instead of knowing the ball needs to go to Doke for an ISO. Am I crazy there? If we missed a shot Silvio or Mitch was there for a tip in. How many tip ins does Doke have on the season? I can't remember many at all honestly. The offense just seemed to click. Our defense suffered without Doke but the offense seemed even better.. Kenpom moved us up 3 spots on offensive after the weekend..

@BeddieKU23 Agreed. It is at least in the back of their minds when they catch the ball that it needs to go in to Doke. Instead, over the weekend, they caught the ball ready to attack.

We really do need to play outside in. Let our guards try to get free for the first 20 seconds of clock. If they can't shake the D, THEN you throw it in to Doke and let the big man work for 10 seconds. But we definitely need to keep the guards in 100% attack mode.