I take back anything negative I might have said about this whole Diallo process. It is now worth it.
BeddieKU23
31745 posts
Official
Officially happy
still a lot of moving parts, but it is heating up!!!
Brandon Tierney - CBS Sports Radio just said Diallo would announce today and he thinks he is heading to Kansas. Tierney does some play-by-play for St Johns games
more useless anticipating banter
I'm not exactly sure but I've read he might be flying to KU on his own dime because he's out of official visits.
Location could have been a factor when he initially chose VCU being from South Carolina. Now that Smart up and left him he could be upset about that and now that he was let out is experiencing bigger fish after him (KU).
I believe all the Brewster kids signed. We were after Adams, Simon & Mitchell but didn't get any of them. Not surprising as they were all guards. Crazy that 1 school fielded 8 D1 players this year.
I will say I will take the 11th hr dumpster diving Tevin Mack. Reported yesterday there maybe a good amount of interest from both sides. He would definitely be our only SF in Korea if he came. He would have played at VCU from Day 1 so conceivably could be a high level kid.
Great post,
You really nailed a bunch of things better than I would have explained them. I believe your 3 factors say it all.
I only mentioned the Towers because its clear that its a recruiting ploy to help lure kids here. We have world class facilities and play in the most historical building in all the land. But even that its hard to pull kids to the sticks as you put it.
3 seems to be becoming an even more important factor with these kids and that ties directly into #2. I don't think anyone would disagree if we went back to Nike. I think the impact of getting away from Adidas would be profound.
My optimism thinks we will be a better team, a 30 win team is very possible. From all reports, the schedule again will be brutal, and the Big 12 is just as brutal again.
I just have a hard time envisioning this team in March being great with Traylor, Lucas & Mickelson getting meaningful minutes.
we do need a full roster especially since 3 spots are guaranteed to be open after next year. If we don't sign anymore players we could have as many as 8 spots open (yikes). 3 left over Scholarships, 3 guaranteed spots open and pending Svi & Selden draft decisions.
Your right as well, I just think this decision was a lot easier than we are trying to say that KU was in it until the end. If Self was confident, I'm confident he wouldn't have gone after Mack or Ty Outlaw. That's why I believe Brown is heading to Michigan where his Mom is from. He knows he's not in it so he's already gone off to others.
Duke won a championship, you always benefit recruiting wise from it. They had 4 players on their team a few weeks ago. Now they have 10. Ingram didn't have anyone in his way at Duke. He gets 30 minutes easy. At KU, he's gotta play defense and beat out Svi and Greene. Doesn't sound appealing for an OAD. They had the recruiting momentum as you said, and they were in his backyard where family and communities can love him for 1 year.
Who wants to come to the middle of nowhere for a year? That's why the Jayhawk Towers are being built. To help negate the geographical weakness that KU will always have by giving recruits that "bling" factor. Tradition doesn't sell, branding does. Clearly Duke's brand will always be better than ours no matter how many years we end up better than them. If we want to beat players from other's backyards, we will have to step up the bling game and give them a reason to leave the den.
Quality post. A few rebuttal's though for thought.
We run a system that is absolutely dependent on our big men being competent scorer's. We currently have 1, we have 3 unproven (and presumably less talented) versions of the post players we are accustomed to having. We signed one gifted Big who's minutes will have to shift between backing up Perry or being used at the 5 which is not his cup of tea. And we've all seen how much time it truly takes for Self to be comfortable with freshman bigs. So the likelyhood that Traylor will play more minutes than Bragg is not a fluke.
Again without the post players to play in this system correctly, the system is flawed. That's why Self has reached so far and so wide for any post player he can plug into the system. He knows that without a player like Diallo we face the same hole we dug into this past March.
Without the quality posts, we lose our advantage on the competition. Every team searches for that advantage and ours is the H/L. Add in stingy defense and that's how KU has built itself into a powerhouse since Self took over. Without those advantages we become a vulnerable team, a team that runs a system that could focus on a perimeter attack.
We definitely have a gifted back-court but we saw that you cannot overcome a weakness in the post with the offense we run. Shooting 3's is just not Self's way, or taking shots when you want to. Our system isn't meant to showcase individual play or guard play. Our guards are terrific and we will need them because the Big 12 has great guard play coming back again.
Without added talent at the 5 or more bodies to throw in, we are essentially the same team just a year older. The Big 12 didn't get any easier in fact it could be argued that its even better with the talent returning. We might be a more seasoned team that can deal with the Tournament pressure. We might be more ready for the season with the Summer we have planned. We might see certain players step up into a bigger role. Right now we are in the same boat as everyone, a lot of returning pieces and a lot of questions still to be answered.
2nd visit was to say Hey we got a point guard now, its okay to come out to the world now. BAM 5 days later you have the announcement.
The race was over when Self was out trying to get Tevin Mack & a Juco kid. You don't plan for brownies unless you know your not getting the cake.
The same for Diallo, we're after our 50th option in the post Anton Grady with 3 knee surgeries. Tells you Self is losing him as well.
Rinse and repeat
@Crimsonorblue22 said:
@BeddieKU23 didn't wigs go up a grade and then back down? He wasn't 17.
Very well could have.
Duke won a national championship and beat out unc for local recruit because unc has aligations. they won ingram because they are the popular kid in town
@hawkmoon2020 said:
I respect Ingram's decision, but I can't imagine Duke signing a 17 year old PG who is "unproven" at the D1 level, would help that much to convince him to go to Duke. We have a Jr. and So. PG's who would have fed him better..
Thornton will be one of the best freshman pgs in the country. He was a star at Findlay Prep And to base speculation that he is unproven because he reclassified is like saying the same about Andrew Wiggins when he did the same thing.
@joeloveshawks said:
@BeddieKU23 I'm not basing this on anything but I see him going to UK. Partially just because he seems like a UK player and partially because I selfishly don't want any more perimeter players when we are set in that area (at least I think we are).
Please land a kid who can play 4/5 so we don't have to have another year of watching Lucas fumble the ball to the other team and seeing Jamari grab 2 rebounds in 25 minutes on the floor.
I don't disagree with you in the fall brown said ku and UK stuck out to him. Michigan and unc his dream scool also rate a good chance with him. If we did land him he'd replace oubre's production and reduce Svi and Greenes role. the only reason we stand a chance is because until today he's said jack about where he may go. our odds are better than what I think we have.
Diallo is the only hope of landing a day 1 starter in the post but we are likely to lose to sleezy recruiting tactics and a slime Ball on his last leg to field a team
@joeloveshawks said:
Good. This means Svi and Greene were not successfully recruited over.
Still in it for brown, after he dropped UCLA his perceived favorite
@JayHawkFanToo said:
What makes you think that? KU seems to be the favorite for Diallo...
Because again we are fighting for a recruit who is being pressured to stay home. 2 assistants don't get hired for nothing that were at different schools a month ago. It's the definition of sleezy recruiting but if that's how it has to be done we should be hiring his high school coach.
There's nobody that wants the kid more I'm from the east coast and have watched his games since last summer.
But I'm a realist and understand that we we fans want and what we get are 2 different things
It will come as no surprise when he doesn't go to ku either
Lol I'm so shocked.
The sky is falling
sounds about right after all the backstabbing st johns did to get in the position they are in.
Per Evan Daniels, Twitter reports saying Diallo could announce Tuesday or Wednesday...
Not sure I believe it but that's the most valid news to come out in days.
Source on @cheick_diallo13 announcement: 'Earliest Tuesday, latest Wednesday.' UK, KU, SJU, Pitt, ISU
Wig's is 6'8 right? Ingram is pushing 6'9ish. What's striking about Ingram's body is that he just seems to be lacking muscle and weight especially in the lower half of his body. He may always be that way but for durability sake probably is going to need to put on muscle mass to give him the best chance of a long career. His game translates to D-1 immediately, not sure about his defense or his lateral quickness those are things that I'm sure he will need to work on. I think his rise in the rankings has as much to do with scouts seeing the long term potential of him in the league and his ability to impact the college game for his 1 year.
Of the Top 30 on ESPN 27 are signed.
Exactly 4 of those 27 choose schools not close to their HS or hometown. 3 of them are going to Duke, an elite school that draws from all over like KU has to. Derrick Jones is the only east coast kid to go west (UNLV).
Simmons chose LSU because of Family. Slab from Tenn going to Kentucky. Ellenson from WI going to Marquette. Rabb from Cali going to Cal. Swanigan from Indiana going to Michigan St. Newman from Miss going to Miss St. Zimmerman HS in Las Vegas, going to UNLV. Bacon from Fl going to Florida St. The list keeps going on with the same thing.
There's a little more flexibility in the rest of the top 100 going out of state or cross country but still the #'s overwhelmingly say that kids will stay close to home especially the top kids.
He could have that potential if his College play exceeds even his new top 5 status. His frame is likely to be his biggest issue going forward as anyone can tell he's a couple years from putting any serious muscle on. Simmons, Slab & Brown seem to be the trendy picks right now for 2016 top pick.
Good points, you could throw in that Bragg is friends with Ingram, not just buddy buddy's at the All-American game.
Ingram just fits into Duke's system better and his family will get to see him play. I think its safe to say that we put in the most effort of any school not in his home state. If there was even a winkling that Ingram was leaning towards coming here, there would be talk of it. It wouldn't be such an unknown at this point he's been much more vocal about his options than Jaylen Brown has been.
We need a post, and we could use another wing that can develop just not a OAD that will immediately scare Svi & Greene from PT.
not even KU recruiting insiders have any confidence to pick us in this. Just tough to win in someone else's backyard.
That's good but the Workouts will really be what separates him from the others. It's the most SF heavy class probably ever for the draft. Your talking about Winslow, Johnson, Hezonja, Dekker, Anderson, Jefferson all 1st round talent. He could be the 4th SF taken if his workouts aren't strong. It's likely Winslow is the 1st SF taken, and Oubre is fighting for that 2nd spot. ESPN has 5 SF in the first 14 picks but will they all really go that high? Worst case could be that teams don't want all these top level SF's because of fit and someone falls which could be Oubre or Dekker.
I'll be shocked if its anything other than Duke. Getting the PG they needed gave Duke the leverage to go back and tell him hey we have someone to throw you the ball now. They hold all the leverage with him, not to mention PT and all the press he will receive. Duke gets a good one but its only a pitstop. Most of the top recruits have picked local and I don't see it changing today.
He can wear a KU shirt, and his dad can talk all the game he wants about how great KU is but in the end its his son's decision and it will come as no surprise when he picks a hometown school.
If I'm wrong and he comes to KU then its great to be wrong and benefit at the same time. He's a great kid with a great future but we are at risk of losing someone to transfer if Ingram or Brown sign. Do we risk losing the benefit of system players to get 1 year pitstops?
Your right Self will never say that, but if the recent trend continues we should pick wisely which top prospects we do chase. We threw our hat into A LOT of bigs this year and so far got 1. We are still in the Diallo circus that has no end date yet. But if he chooses the hometown school we wasted yet again 2 years of recruiting and could have had Tyler Davis. Some may even say if we win the Diallo circus we still lose because he could be a 1 and done but Davis could be a 2-3 year player.
We still have the slightest chance with Brown because he's given nobody a clue. Yet again a year helper who leaves for the league.
2016 is a big year for recruiting and these same events that have taken place better not happen again.
With Herard you got a guy that's been said to be just as much a lean to KU as well. It's hard to tell which one has the higher upside because it's clear they are both a few years away from reaching their ceiling. I'd just sign them both and hope everything works out. The likelyhood that happens the way things have gone lately seems slim to none.
Self's gonna aimlessly reach for Harry Giles or Bam Adebayo, kids he has no chance with because they are not in our backyard. He's trying hard to make kids like KU when all their going to show is enough interest to string us along. 2016 kids like Bolden/Herard, Fox, Ferguson are all showing heavy interest in KU. They are all from Texas and in a geographical area where KU is the bigfish school and not fighting in others backyards.
Interesting choice @HighEliteMajor. Self is out today watching Bolden as we speak which bodes well for your post. He visited for Late Night and we've visited him twice since. Hopefully Self won't make the same mistake twice.
I'd also throw in his AAU teammate Schnider Herard as Self's other important recruit for 16. These 2 would be the perfect 5's to bring to the program but could Self really get both of them with Lucas. The only way I see that happening is if 1 of them had enough versatility to make them a big 4.
Lock em up!
Defintely would agree, Sorry didn't mean you were saying but that the Media has done a great job hyping all these teams that are supposed to be leaps and bounds better without actually getting better at their weaknesses. I don't view KU as a team who will be leaps and bounds better if we don't get say Diallo. Because that would mean our biggest weakness from last year still translated to next year.
media 1 for 1 now..
Hey why not make a 13 win team a 15 win team and bail out in 8 to 9 months. Doesn't help the program
Neither team is better than KU regardless of if we get Diallo or not. If the media is hyping them to be better than they can put the bottle down anytime now.
Iowa St lost 2 Seniors players who were vital to their offense. Didn't replace either of them. 1 transfer guard is good but doesn't fill a need. Burton isn't eligible to mid-season.
Oklahoma lost their starting PF and first guard off the bench. Their freshman guards aren't heralded so they'll take time to adjust. Juco bigs often need time to adjust as well to level of physicality just like Freshman bigs. Buford has a better chance with year in system. But they didn't upgrade either loss.
How are they better?
Unrelated but Buddy Hield back for Senior season. Guess who's hyping Oklahoma already no other than Franny frann.
They lose Thomas their best post player and Booker and there supposedly better. Media is comical
Bragg has a lot of offensive skills. His offense is an immediate upgrade to the team. Coach will have to lean on him to give effort all the time and get the defensive effort that will be asked of him. I didn't see Bragg play much defense or committed defense but in the HS ranks that's always a rare commodity.
Korea should help him tremendously getting early practice and PT in the system. Imagine how much farther along he could be going into fall camp as opposed to last year where your exposure to Self's ways were in October. He's going to get them in June. Huge advantage for Bragg having a lasting impact.
I'll believe it when I see. Logically your are right, but what we have seen on the court was different. Whatever reasons Self had for junking up the entire offensive philosophy is something we will never know unless @ralster finds out for us someway. If he was going to change wouldn't he have tried to do so during the season? Why does it take the failure of how the season ended to realize maybe I need to change it up, especially if the same players are back again. He's a stubborn man, he likes M2M defense and H/L offense no matter if he's got half the talent he's used to having run it. If you see us running the weave in the exhibition games against Canada, chuck the TV out the window you know all is lost!!!!
I think Lucas presents some hope of a low post game. He's some major lower body improvements away from some good things. Good thing we got the best strength coach. I'm optimistic he'll continue to improve his hook and leverage down at the 2ft line. Maybe that's asking a lot but if Self truly still has that development wizard in his corner, Lucas is the next poster child for a step up.
I agree about the media aspect of what your saying. But if Newman & Ingram both go where the press is saying then what else is there to say. Usually where there is smoke there is fire??
I hope the press and wrong and all 4 (Newman, Diallo, Brown, Ingram) go where the media isn't pushing them too. We will certainly see where the domino's start falling today.
A lot of good points as always..
I see we offered 2016 Mitch Lightfoot 6'7 kid from AZ. Has family in Kansas. May grow some more and has been labeled to have a great "motor". Rivals has him at 140 right now, ESPN hasn't expanded class yet, 247 has him 163 not updated fully as well. Was committed to New Mexico before re-opening. Some places have said he's a done deal to KU.
Thornton is a very good player. Have you seen him play?
He ran the show for Findlay prep with Trier at SG. When matched up against PG's he would dominate them with his ability to pass, get to the lane, and make perimeter shots. From what I say in games was a more than capable replacement for Jones & a guy who didn't need another year. I thought he was the top PG regardless of 15 or 16 class.
What will hurt Duke with just Thornton is the fact that cook graduated who was the other primary ball-handler and there going to ask their other guys to share duties when they don't naturally play that position.
But as far as Duke getting a PG, it was convenient enough in time for Ingram's double visit with Coach K to seal the deal.
I think Self will keep fishing in the sea until he finds a non-impactful player if he misses on Diallo. He's thrown his hat into Izundu, and Grady a 5th year transfer from Cleveland St. Doesn't sound to me he's confident in landing him and is now after his 200th and 201 choices..
Are you sure Self will change his system if we don't land a big capable of starting. We all saw him regress back to bang the post after success shooting the 3 ball. We are still going to see that useless weave. I hope your right that he'd change, but he's shown to go right back to what he knows
Hey if he doesn't choose Duke than I'll fully admit I'm wrong. All the evidence just points to him joining them now that they got a PG. He grew up a dukie fan.
Chris Walker PF/C from Florida leaving the program. I wonder if he goes pro (disaster) or transfers..
KU was in on him pretty good before he went to UF, was a top 10 kid 2 years ago. Obviously had his issues, heard locker room issues and what not. Think Self may take interest in him and get him to mature? Probably 3 hours from now he'll declare..just seems like that kind of player to make the worst decision ever.
The Eric Paschall kid from Fordham is going to Villanova. Confirming how little interest he really had in us and how far fetched reports get.
I see we have gone to visit Mack, Izundu, & Ty Outlaw a Juco player. Self keeps swinging his net farther and farther instead of casting it in the fall. Tell me why we didn't lock up Tyler Davis again??
Damion Lee the scoring machine off to Louisville. Not shocking that the rich get richer.
KU also interested in Anton Grady, transfer from Cleveland St. 6'8 junior who scored 14pts & 7.9rbs a game. Keep swinging guys
Being from the East Coast the only time I've ever seen UNLV on tv was against KU last year.
UNLV didn't get better getting Zimmerman when Wood declared yesterday. He had no choice but to go, because they had 4 to 5 front court players. Wood has a lot of potential but could have really shot up the charts with another season. But because a 5 star player came in playing the same position he had to go.
Sure Mario & Danny are good examples. Didn't we hire Mario's dad after he signed tho if I remember correctly?? Snacks was a former player of Self's at Illinois but it sure didn't hurt that he was also recruiting Cliff at the time. Not going to argue that we haven't done things to position ourselves in the past as well.
But I felt like ranting that if all these moves St Johns has made is the reason why he stays then its not even worth following these kids recruitment's anymore. I know KU has put in as much time and effort "the right way" as any program could possibly be with recruiting someone and to possibly lose out to St Johns who will struggle to win 15 games next year is maddening. We're supposed to be in that elite group of teams and I feel like kids are treating us the total opposite this recruiting period.
Of course, he's been in the limelight for years its how he got the ego he has. I just think its funny how people come out publicly and deny the reports that get put out and then when they announce people were right to begin with.
It's happened plenty this off-season. Zimmerman, Rondae Jefferson going pro, add Newman to list and others. Watch Jaylen Brown deny the report about Adidas & the Cal/Michigan rumor be true as well.
Why would you deny what your going to do. I don't get it
We've beat home the Diallo topic enough. Social media has made it a circus. I'll just be happy when its over regardless of where he's going. I'm just saying I'm detaching myself from this so if he stays home I'm not going to be mad about it. It's nothing new KU losing to a home school., its the same with Ingram.
The level of sleazyness by St. Johns at all costs to keep him in-state is exactly what's wrong with recruiting. They've now visited him what 4 times since Lavin was fired, and bought 2 assistants that were recruiting him at other schools.
he's going to Duke..