🏀 KuBuckets Archive

So by now the disappointing news has sunk in for most of us regarding Embiid's back injury. While we may speculate as to if/when he will be back, it is in the best interest of the team to prepare as if he will not be back. After all, they've had a whole season's worth of preparation playing with him, so if he is available at some point, re-inserting him in the line-up will not necessitate any adjustments. So make plans to play without him.

When it was revealed that we would be without Embiid for the final 2 games of the regular season, it was suggested & debated that perhaps we start Lucas. @HighEliteMajor suggested that, hoping to perhaps "catch lightning in a bottle". However, that didn't happen, and in limited minutes Lucas underwhelmed while on the court.

It has been largely suggested that the pivotal player in life without Embiid is Tarik Black. After his senior night performance, everybody was jumping on board that train. However, we were quickly reminded in the WVU game that the Black we had grown accustomed to seeing the majority of the year is one who cannot stay on the court due to foul trouble. Black certainly has the ability to do some nice things, but hoping he can put this team on his back, or even shoulder a normal share of the load for a deep run, is unreasonable and flies in the face of all evidence to the contrary.

So...what to do? My suggestion - play small. Self has continued using more players in his rotation than normal all year long, and perhaps this is where it pays off. Tharpe, Mason, Frankamp, Selden, Greene, Wiggins...even AW3. Use four perimeter players on the court at the same time, along with Ellis or Traylor. On offense, use the extra perimeter player to spread the floor, which will hopefully create more space for Wiggins, Selden, & Mason to drive. And while we haven't seen a great deal of driving & dishing from this team, with additional shooters on the court any collapsing defense on drives could result in kick-outs for open treys. On defense, you're not going to be able to replace a rim protector like Embiid, so don't try. Instead, try and create more turnovers. Press & trap more frequently. And I've been as big of a doubter and naysayer of us playing zone as anybody (not because I disagree with its merits, just the unlikelihood of it happening), but maybe try and find a zone we can develop an adequate comfort level with and use it 5-10 possessions/game.

Sure, there are drawbacks, rebounding being the biggest. And Self probably won't utilize something of this nature. But it's an outside the box type of thought that I thought I'd throw out there for debate.

@KUSTEVE Come on. Don't be that guy. The guy who arbitrarily decides who is and isn't a fan, because they don't experience things the same way you do. Because upon receiving disappointing news about one of our star players they didn't bust out singing the praises of Savior Self. I mean really, all that was missing from your post was to put fan in quotes, like this: "fan".

Personally, I don't think @Blown was out of line. Self has a history of playing guys through injuries. And I 100% agree with him, it's a toughness issue with him. There was a very large contingent of fans on these boards & the kusports boards who, upon seeing Joel torque his knee, thought he should have been sat down immediately. You don't need a medical degree to know the knee isn't designed to bend like that.

I'm not saying it's wrong to be optimistic, but don't begrudge other fans a little time to wallow in what is a blow to this team's success.

I really have a bad feeling about how this is unfolding. Not that I suspect anyone has the warm & fuzzies over the latest news on Joel's back, but so much of this just doesn't sit right with me. It's the knee that should have been taken more seriously & rested. It's the taking one measly game off for the back when lo & behold! lowly TCU was up next (meaning if it was Texas on the schedule and the Big 12 race was up for grabs, would he have sat?). It's as @bskeet pointed out, the reassurances that he wasn't going to make it any worse. The constant citing of medical experts. Going from missing the last 2 games of the regular season to missing the Big 12 tournament to most likely missing at least the first weekend of the NCAA tournament. It's the family insisting on a second opinion and him flying halfway across the country to get it. It's Self coming out early today saying he was 100% confident he'd be ready for the NCAA tournament. Why make that statement before hearing the results of this second opinion, unless you are trying to frame the decision to go your way?

A big part of me wonders if the Embiid "camp" (family, any advisors like perhaps Luc Mbah a Moute) has made the decision he has played his last game as a Jayhawk. Which if the injury is that severe, I have absolutely no problem with him missing the rest of the season. But it seems like...a month, 6 weeks ago we all were getting kind of a buzz that we might be able to keep him another year. Does anyone really think that now?

I'm sorry, but there are so many things about the Big 12 awards that are a joke. Marcus Smart on the first team? Andrew Wiggins not on the all-defensive team? Rick Barnes for COY? Oh wait, the voting is done by Big 12 coaches, so we know quite a few of them are voting out of spite & envy for coach Self & KU making the league our bitch...again.

@MoonwalkMafia Re: Marshall. Everything I have read about him and all the interviews he has given leaves one with the impression that him & his family are very happy with their current situation. If he remains here in Wichita, I don't necessarily think it means that he is afraid or doubts he could be successful at a bigger school with increased expectations. Some people, like coach Self, are built with a sense of competitiveness that emboldens them to always strive to accomplish more. Not just to be the best at what they do, but to be the best at the highest level. To always want to tackle new challenges. It's why it is often speculated that at some point Self will want to try his hand at the NBA. But there are also people who look at where they're at, and while they are still also very competitive, aren't seeking out to prove to themselves or anyone else that they can do something in another (often perceived as more difficult/challenging) situation.

I do think you are slightly off-base regarding the increased expectations at Wichita St. For example, they made it to the Final 4 last year and returned nearly everybody from that team (minus Carl Hall). Had they floundered and gone to the NIT this year, they would have been very disappointed. Mark Turgeon built that program up and the success has been continued and expanded upon in the Marshall years. I think if he had a few years of not reaching the NCAA tournament in a row, the program would most definitely be inclined to make a coaching switch. Now the expectations are certainly not as high as at a place like KU, but to think that they view their recent success as just icing on the cake is naive. If I were a betting man, I would bet Marshall will be there at least as long as this current core of players is. And considering VanVleet & Baker are sophomores, my guess is he's there at least for the next two seasons. After that, we'll see. To me the test for him is what will he do after this year in terms of recruiting. A quick look shows no ESPN top 100 recruits committed to WSU next year (interesting that you brought up VCU as the comparison. They have 3 top 100 commits, including one in the top 50). Will Marshall continue to find diamonds in the rough that he can coach up? Will he go the JuCo route (as a recent article I read on him stated that he liked doing)?

Re: KU's defense. It's obviously no secret Self is a M2M guy. Part of it is a toughness thing. Zones are viewed as soft in his eyes. I agree that with this group, as @HighEliteMajor has stated, it was built for zone. However, regardless of personnel I can't fathom Self ever playing zone as his primary defense. HEM, you say that you and Jesse thought he should have switched to zone back at the start of the season. So once you start teaching guys to play zone, do you come back next year and try again to teach M2M? If so, that means you lost a lot of opportunities the past year to work on your M2M defense with the returning players. So does one year of playing a lot of zone turn into two? With this group, most certainly, as the reasons for playing zone are the defensive deficiencies of 2 players that will be returning next year - Tharpe & Ellis. And then when they're gone, all of a sudden you have a young core whom you have neglected to indoctrinate with your most core philosophy, and that is tough M2M defense. Self is not about to get away from who he is, nor should he. You don't get to be as success as he is by abandoning who you are.

Now that being said, the question I often ponder on is how feasible is it in any year to teach the team the fair amount of zone principles to be proficient playing it in games? And with such a young core, how feasible was it this year? I've never been a basketball coach at any level so I won't pretend to comprehend what it takes to get players comfortable in a system. Comfortable enough so that they can go out there and just play within the system rather than think. But my guess is it takes awhile, and that especially with a young team, there simply wasn't enough time for Self to get everyone comfortable with the Self system stuff to expand a great deal into zones, traps, etc.

And that is something that I think most casual fans have as a misconceptions about zones & presses. It is not just "here, cover this general area". It is more nuanced than that. Consider the '08 championship team. Loaded with experienced juniors & seniors, many of whom were excellent defenders. Self has joked about how in the championship game he went to a triangle & 2 defense for a few possessions and got torched with it. So if that team wasn't able to successfully execute a particular zone/junk defense, what shot does a team full of freshman have? Sure it might help you get past a WVU, but you've got to be good enough to get by the middling teams with your core defense. Otherwise you have little chance of playing for the highest stakes at the end of the year. And that's what it's all about at KU. So given that, I think if you're Self you keep working on your M2M defense until you are good enough to win with it against most teams. Then you can move on to secondary defensive tactics. And maybe, as HEM has postulated, we need someone who has a fair amount of expertise in that area to be able to teach it.

This is actually a couple of days old, but if you haven't checked out Mark Titus on Grantland, you're missing out. A little something for everyone I think this past week. I thought @HighEliteMajor would enjoy the section about referees, given how I know you loathe them. He pretty much gives the Jayhawks the cold shoulder this week with this line "I’m putting the same amount of effort into the Kansas section this week as the Jayhawks put forth on defense in the second half of Saturday’s game at Oklahoma State." Ouch! But we deserved it, and he has had almost universally good things to say about the team all year. Anyway, here's the link:

http://grantland.com/features/titus-top-12-ncaa-power-rankings-watch-out-for-unc/ ↗

In other news, Wooden/Naismith favorite Doug McDermott, senior forward for the Creighton Jays, scored 45 points while also dealing out a measly 2 assists. Jeez, what a selfish, solo game performing, not making his teammates better performance. Probably just his daddy trying to improve his draft stock and earn him all kinds of awards. He's probably garbage.

@REHawk Oh for sure. Trust me it wasn't intended to be as much of a criticism of him as it was to illustrate what I view as the lack of feasibility of him as a point forward for the rest of this season. I fully believe, maybe as early as next year, he could be capable of doing so were he to stay in college.

@TheDrunkenJhawk I think you have a choice. I'd easily swap Staten & Smart. Staten led his team to a better conference record than Smart did. And despite losing both the head to head match-ups, Staten outplayed Smart in one of the contests and was probably equally as effective in the other match-up. And here are the season stats for the two:

Staten 18.2 PPG, Smart 17.6 PPG | Staten 49.4 FG%, Smart 42.3 FG% | Staten 5.9 RPG, Smart 5.7 RPG | Staten 5.8 APG, Smart 4.7 APG | Staten 1.2 SPG, Smart 2.6 SPG | Staten 2.0 Turnovers/game, Smart 2.7 Turnovers/game

So Staten is ahead in every category but steals/game. And he didn't get suspended for 3 games. And he wasn't seen kicking a chair and displaying an overall piss-poor attitude all season. And he isn't a flopper. For me, Staten all day everyday over Marcus Smart.

@Hawk8086 It's not a bad idea, as outside-the-box thinking goes. A couple of problems: first, he absolutely does not look to dish off the drive. Not a big deal, as Tharpe doesn't do so with any great regularity and Mason never does (sometimes Mason drives, gets in trouble, then looks to dish as a bailout, but that's not the same thing as driving with the intent to draw defenders and then pass. Mason's drives that lead to passes usually result in turnovers), and Frankamp doesn't drive at all, so nothing really lost there, but we should at least clear up that misconception that he drives looking to dish. HEM has posted some nice numbers on this.

Today is a prime example of why I don't believe it would work. Despite having the ball in his hands an increased number of times, he had 2 assists. Don't get me wrong, I am as impressed with his performance today as anybody. But either because he just doesn't look for his teammates at some point in the possession, or because his teammates find themselves standing around watching him, or because Self's offense just isn't designed for it, whatever the case we just don't see Wiggins creating opportunities for others.

Another big problem is turnovers. Wiggins is turnover prone anyway. The announcers during the WVU game kept bringing up the scouting report on forcing Wiggins to his left in order to create turnovers. If a middling team like WVU can cause problems for him, you can bet teams we'll face in the NCAA tournament would do the same and then some.

Now at this point I'm definitely in favor of running a great deal of our offense FOR him. Not through him, as again I don't believe he's there yet in terms of being a person the rest of the offense can flow through. But there should be tremendous focus on running offense FOR him. He should be taking no less than 20 shots/game. Now that doesn't mean he'll end the game with 20 FGA, as he'll get fouled on a good number of the shots he takes.

@Crimsonorblue22 No I don't. '93...that the Calbert Chaney led Indiana team?

@Crimsonorblue22 I just saw this. Doesn't leave me with a good feeling, either for when he'll return this season or the likelihood that he returns for next season.

@HighEliteMajor Nice post-game thoughts. I guess here's the thing that is most discouraging for me: we had already seen a couple of chinks in this team. We knew they struggled early in the season against physical front lines. San Diego State was perhaps the best example of this; the first Texas meeting as well. I believed that had at least been partially remedied. We knew this team struggled with turnovers. See games against Florida, Okie St. While the Okie St. game proved we are still susceptible to this, I believed we had partially remedied this as well, in that we were not so vulnerable to being pressed. However, today we lost the game in a completely different fashion. We didn't turn the ball over an exorbitant amount of times. We did lose the rebound battle, but I wouldn't say we were manhandled and over-matched inside. Today our defense was awful, which isn't completely new, but our offense completely went in the tank. If Wiggins hadn't put the team on his back this would have remained an UGLY loss. Aside from Wiggins, the team shot 36% from the field, 33% from trey, and 54% from the line. In the past we've played some horrible defense but survived by simply out-scoring our opponents in a shootout type game. Today, for the first time, we saw a complete breakdown on both ends of the floor.

Joel will fix some of this. It will allow Black to return to his role. For all the praise everyone was so anxious to heap on him following his performance Wednesday, today reminded us why we cannot lean on him. At all. Whatever we get from him is a bonus. And as excited as I think we both were to see Lucas getting some minutes the last two games, he underwhelmed in both instances.

As has been discussed at length, today and all season, the point guard position remains the big problem. Tharpe...no need for any further criticism. Mason? I was actually shocked that his line looked as good as it did. I thought he played pretty poorly today. His decision making is awful. Frankamp? You were impressed with his defense, but might we be looking at the reincarnation of Jeremy Case on offense? Remember how everyone would always say how Case was the best three point shooter on the team, but it rarely translated that way in games? If Frankamp can't make shots, he's a net negative, especially if he keeps gunning (as was the case today). Like you said, we really don't have any good options. Sadly I foresaw this LAST year.

Wondering why, with Selden in foul trouble, we didn't see a bit more of Greene. I know Self has said his defense is atrocious, so maybe he felt more comfortable with Frankamp & Mason in there with Wiggins.

I believe we need to come out and win the Big 12 tournament next week to have any hope of building momentum for the big dance.

@bskeet The cop-out answer here is - every team is different. The phrase "winning covers a multitude of sins" has often been uttered by Self in some manner. So I guess that is the question for each team: are you winning despite flaws, or do you just not have any major ones? Maybe Wichita St. doesn't have any major chinks. Hard to say given who they've played.

That leads me right into my next point, and that is regardless of wins or losses, it is not good to go into the tournament relatively unchallenged. This is where I think Wichita St. is at a disadvantage. If you haven't been punched in the mouth, how are you going to react when it happens? Rarely do even the best teams waltz through the 6 game NCAA tournament gauntlet unchallenged.

If I had to rank your three teams you gave as examples, I'd take Florida as my favorite of the three based on Billy Donovan's pedigree, as well as the talent of their team and the schedule they've played. Sadly I'd rank Wichita St. second, based on the experience of their players. I'd rank KU last in the bunch. Now do I think KU can beat either of those teams? Absolutely. I just think the other two teams are better positioned for a deep run over 6 potential games.

@HighEliteMajor I agree Ellis is also a liability on defense. I just tend to think that it hurts teams in general more to have a weak link on the perimeter as opposed to the interior. The reason for this is pretty simple, and that is that perimeter offensive players handle the ball at a much higher frequency, thus they are more often in a position to score. Interior/post offensive players need the ball put in their hands by the perimeter players. The fairly recent proliferation of the "stretch 4" has somewhat evened that imbalance in recent years, with post players more able to come out to perimeter to get the ball and either be in a position to score from further away from the basket or put the ball on the floor and get to their scoring area themselves. As you mentioned, Perry himself is an example of this on offense. For whatever reason it hasn't translated to the defensive end of the floor.

We've seen Self teams have great success defensively despite the presence of a sub-standard post defender. Thinking back to the '12 team, TRob was in my opinion a below average defender. I think this was in large part at Self's direction, as he could not afford for TRob to be aggressive on that end and risk foul trouble, but the result was the same - a superior defender (Withey) coupled with a deficient defender (TRob). Withey had to cover the entire post pretty regularly on that team. And the '11 team, while maybe not having any below average defenders, didn't have a rim protector. I don't think anyone would recollect stellar defense among the attributes that the rotation of the Morris Twins + TRob brought to the table. (Withey was the 4th post player that year, and didn't see near the minutes that say Black/Traylor has seen this year in that role).

I do agree that Embiid's health is the biggest key, but I think Tharpe's defense is the biggest question mark. What's it say on a team with this many young pieces that the junior leader is #2 & #3 on your keys to success, behind only the health of somebody else which really has nothing to do with their abilities?

@drgnslayr To me the biggest part of the puzzle, in so much that it is a question mark, is Tharpe. You mentioned the Texas game; he completely locked down Isaiah Taylor in that game. But we've also seen him getting torched often. How will he fare tomorrow against Staten? Going forward, if Self doesn't have to mask for Tharpe on defense and can have Selden & Wiggins commit solely to their man without worrying about helping on Tharpe's, I think that will go a long way towards making this look like a "Self-ball" team.

Something to remember for those who absolutely can't stand having presumed OADs on the roster, I respect your position, and in turn would ask that you no longer fondly recall the '08 championship season. After all, Brandon Rush came in as a presumed OAD, and you can bet we don't win it all in '08 without him. Heck, according to rivals.com both Julian Wright & Mario Chalmers were ranked ahead of him - Rush #13, Chalmers #12, Wright #8. Scout.com had Wright at #8, Rush #15, Chalmers #19, I only single out Brandon because the word was he was definitely a OAD, whereas Wright & Chalmers didn't have the same buzz. So what's the cutoff point for not recruiting players? No one in the top 10? Top 15? Top 20?

I don't like the OAD rule anymore than the next die hard fan. I'm sure Self doesn't like it. But I am of the opinion that you don't pass up talent when you can land it, because you never know when that level of talent will present itself again. My guess is that Self is of the same mindset, particularly after the recruiting drought a couple of years ago that had him scrambling for guys like Braedon Anderson and Merv Lindsay just to have enough athletic bodies to hold competitive practices. Is it ideal? Of course not, but my guess is that every other team in America has issues year to year where their roster composition isn't exactly to their liking.

There is hope that the new NBA commissioner will alter the NBA's rule to something that makes more sense for all parties involved. When that happens, who knows, maybe Self is holding the cards with three OADs on his roster that all of a sudden he gets to keep an extra year or two. Wouldn't that be sweet?

@nuleafjhawk I certainly understand that you are not attacking the players. And yes we are all entitled to our opinions, I'm just trying to understand yours. I agree whole-heartedly about not getting to know kids on a personal level after one year. I guess I'm just wondering why you don't seem to want to include Black in that as well. Regardless of motives and choices, he is in fact only here for one year as well. Surely we don't know him any better than Wiggins, Selden or Embiid because of his years at Memphis.

Another thing is, and I alluded to this in my posted response to Jaybate, is that without the OADs, we likely don't land Black either. You say he could have signed with anybody. But it was down to us and Duke. Wiggins is on board, and a week later so is Black. He was choosing a school that he thought was not only a good fit but also gave him a decent shot at a ring. That means a significant portion of talent on the roster. Without the OADs, Black isn't here. Speculation perhaps, but I'd say a pretty safe bet.

@nuleafjhawk "He'd be here longer if he could"

Maybe not if he had millions awaiting him in the NBA. We don't know that he would stay in that situation. Actually, we have a pretty good idea. Based on the article yesterday on kusports.com, Black says he wants to play in the NBA. So given that statement, might we surmise that were he presented the same choice that Wiggins, Selden, & Embiid are faced with that Black too might also choose to make the jump to the NBA?

Again all the negatives about the 3 freshman OADs are the same for Black, regardless of whether anyone would choose to be here longer or not. Every one of Embiid, Wiggins, & Selden could have also choose to be elsewhere but wanted to be at KU as well. To me I fail to see the difference.

Another thought on this - this discussion has centered around Wiggins, Embiid, & Selden. Why are we not throwing Black into the fray here as well? He's not a OAD, but think of all the negatives that are tossed around about OADs - that we don't get to enjoy them for very long, that KU is just a pit stop for them, that their being here is hindering the development of other players - is all of that not also true for Black? The only difference is that Black was certainly closer to his ceiling, so he was not likely to make as significant strides in improving his game. In that respect, given that he is not head & shoulders better than any of our other bigs (despite last night's performance), wouldn't Black be considered an even worse offender? Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge fan of his and am in no way attempting to disparage him, but for those who are railing away against the OADs, why have you not included him?

@justanotherfan Just FYI, the Morris twins were not outside the top 50. Since they were at a prep school, espn & scout did not rank them. Rivals listed Markeiff at 49, Marcus at 29.

addendum to my previous post @jaybate 1.0 -

After writing the above I then saw your more recent post, and would concede the fact that the long term effects very likely reduce next year's win total due to stymieing the development of players like Greene & AW3 who would have seen significantly more minutes this year without OADs Wiggins & Selden. However, as I also pointed out, the schedule had a large role to play in this as well. I've heard it thrown out there that our schedule was more difficult this year than that of any team in the past 8-10 years. That phenomenon is unlikely to repeat itself, so expect the win total to improve next year regardless.

Something to consider is that this is not a big change in philosophy for coach Self. He has ALWAYS heavily recruited the top players. It is just in the last two recruiting classes that he has started to land them in bunches. I think @ParisHawk made some very good points as well regarding roster spots. Consider the fact that for the third time in his tenure here at KU, Self was forced with replacing the entire starting line-up. If you, as a program, want to shy away from OAD type players, you need talented upperclassmen returning almost every year. You need a stacked bench of guys waiting their turn for playing time. And while we certainly have had our share of those types of teams before, expecting Self to forecast & predict the roster outlook even two years down the road is impossible. This situation was bound to happen. So yeah, we may have to have a few seasons like this one (and in all probability, next season) where we have a high OAD turnover rate. And while we all enjoy getting to "know" the players over longer stretches and watching them develop, we appreciate them more perhaps, I certainly couldn't have been more pleased with the freshman seasons of Wiggins, Selden, & Embiid.

And to @jaybate 1.0 's point about our record, your comparison of the 30+ win seasons without OADs to this year's 23-7 record with them is more than a little off-base. I mean, if you're insinuating/inferring that we have a worse record than in years past because we were playing a bunch of guys who eventually turn out to be OAD players, what do you think this team's record would be without the OADs this year? Let's say we sign a few non-OAD guys for the scholarships of Wiggins, Selden, & Embiid. Because of the lateness of the Wiggins signing, Self could not have hoped to get anyone better than in the 70-90 recruiting rating range, so that player would most certainly not have had much of an impact this year. You're likely looking at a starting line-up of Tharpe, Greene, AW3, Ellis, & Black, assuming Black still chooses KU over Duke without the OAD players, which isn't a given but for the purposes of this exercise we'll allow the assumption. Other posters probably have a better recollection of guys that we were in on that may have came had Selden & Embiid not signed, but I can't remember them. I can't fathom any of them being good enough to crack the starting line-up listed above. So that's the starting line-up, with only Connor Frankamp & Frank Mason as viable perimeter subs. Maybe Self adds someone with more height & length to sub some minutes on the wings. The post player brought in to replace Embiid would most likely struggle to garner minutes over Traylor & Lucas, so maybe a red-shirt candidate. But are you telling me that the team listed above, with some nameless non-OAD players, would have a better record and be closer to 30+ wins that the current squad? No way. The OAD players didn't create the void in wins. Losing the entire starting line-up combined with not having much experience on the bench to plug in combined with a brutal non-conference schedule is what is responsible. If anything, we should thank the OADs for getting us to 23 at this point, not blame them for not having us closer to 30.

@HighEliteMajor You're right, it was Peters. Funny, I'd forgotten all about him. Everything about his situation was so weird.

To your point about outside the top 100 guys, I think it works better for bigs than perimeter guys. I can't fathom us ever accepting players outside the top 100 being in the perimeter rotation.

@HighEliteMajor Love this idea. I also like how you threw in the bit about your doubts about this guy. I remember the posts well: your position was that Self had collected a bunch of bigs in hopes that 1 of the 3 - Traylor, Lucas, & Mickelson - would pan out. So far I'd say he's 2 for 2, with Mickelson still a mystery. I know you had once described Jamari Traylor as a "marginal" player in a program like Kansas. While I agree that he is no substitute for Embiid, I believe he has proved he belongs. And he's only a sophomore. I see no reason why he couldn't be every bit as good as say...Darnell Jackson by his senior year.

I also agree 100% on Self's handling of Embiid post-knee injury. Self has been steadfast in bringing up the opinions of doctors that say he can't make it worse, that structurally he's fine, etc. But pretty much everyone who saw the knee injury happen feared for the worst. It was obvious that he had came dangerously close to doing serious damage. The next few games bore out the inevitable conclusion that he was not right. So he sat for a game. We know Self is a toughness guy, but erring on the side of caution would have been the better option. That's not even a hindsight observation. The sentiment to sit him was resounding throughout Jayhawk nation. But hey, at least we got some "Ten there, done that" t-shirts out of the deal, right?

Something Dana O'Neil of espn.com touched on after Smart's incident at Lubbock and subsequent suspension is how absent Travis Ford is in this whole saga. It was apparent again last night. After a horrible first half, espn's sideline reporter (wasn't Holly Rowe or Doris Burke, some gal I'd never heard of) asked Ford after Smart's first half struggles, how do you get him back on track. Her response was that he sorta shrugged and said something to the effect of "I hope he has a better second half." You hope? Top notch coaching there Travis. Shortly into the second half Marcus Smart came down the court and bricked a ridiculous 3 point attempt, prompting Jay Bilas to say that Ford needs to take him out to let him know that kind of selfish shot selection isn't OK. Nothing. Ford left Smart in the game. It's apparent that Ford just let's Smart run roughshod over him and has absolutely no control over his team. Another thing that struck me last night was the sideline reporter saying that even after a 16-3 start, Ford felt the team was "disjointed." Yet, we all know he did nothing to act upon this feeling, instead he stood idly by watching Smart implode and in essence sink their season.

I know we've all grown accustomed to trashing the coaching abilities of Scott Drew & Rick Barnes (and to a lesser extent, Bruce Weber), but Ford may be the worst offender of all.

@HighEliteMajor I have been a skeptic of Tharpe's for some time as well. I have been a fan too, thinking his shooting and driving abilities both above average, but there's always been that doubt in my mind as to whether he was capable of being the starting PG at Kansas. I brought it up over a month ago, as I dare say Anrio Adams named hadn't been mentioned on these boards prior to me bringing him up, but I recalled how I lamented him losing the battle last year for the back-up PG duties. I just had a hard time seeing Tharpe as our starting PG for the following 2 seasons. But even that was based more (at the time) on Adams' physical advantages. And while his well-documented defensive deficiencies are still a huge drawback, his mental lapses, errors in judgment, & overall lack of leadership is the biggest hurdle for this team.

Options? Short-term it's Mason & Frankamp. Neither impressed at OSU, but neither were as big net-negative as Tharpe either. Lyle next year? I still see that as a stretch. As has been pointed out, it's not like this guy is a top 10, can't miss recruit. He's right in the neighborhood of most guys who take at least a year to flourish in Self's system.

To your point, yes we still should have won the game. Consider everything else that didn't go well - as stated, Mason had a pretty poor game as well, Wiggins shot wasn't falling, & Joel re-injured his back. I think we can survive against a team the quality of OSU in the tournament with a Tharpe "no-show" (meltdown might be more accurate) if we don't have a list of other things go wrong. However, against a team better than OSU...don't bet on it. So frustrating.

I think Bill Self is going to have a better list, entitled: Things to do in practice to make up for that inexcusable display of sloppy ball handling and questionable (at best) decisions

@REHawk I can't imagine AW3 wanting to keep it in the Bill Self/KU college coaching tree. If he tranfers, he probably doesn't have the best taste in his mouth about Self & KU. My guess is he ends up closer to home on the east coast somewhere. I agree 100% with your sentiment to want to see him succeed somewhere. Too bad the numbers game didn't work out for him here at KU, but I both understand the situation and will always wish him the best.

@approxinfinity KUsports carrying an article about Cliff Alexander's high school forfeiting all victories. After reading the article, I'm not as worried as I could be, but it is still a somewhat worrisome situation.

@drgnslayr It does seem to fly by! As others have suggested, hopefully we are all here talking about our championship!

Every year, regardless of how it ended, we always seem to go through all the line-up permutations for months on end. We'll call that topic #1. Operating under the assumption that Wiggins is the only early departure, other popular topics of conversation figure to be:

(2) Can Mason unseat Tharpe for starting PG duties?

(3) Will Self play Perry at the 3?

(4) With Wiggins gone, who will lead the team in scoring - Selden, Perry, or Alexander?

(5) Where does AW3 end up?

(6) Greene or Oubre (starting, minute allocation, etc)?,

(7) Any asst. coaches in line for head coaching gigs elsewhere?

(8) Should anybody redshirt? Most obvious candidates are unable. Frankamp maybe?

(9) Who will be the most legitimate contenders to challenge us for conference supremacy?

(10) Just how much of a beast will JoJo be returning?

And finally...

(11) Buried deep on the bench of bigs, but we'll finally get our first look at Hunter Mickleson. Who's not excited for that? Huh? Huh?

Obviously if Embiid departs for the NBA, the dynamic shifts, as we may have another recruit to discuss. Just went with only losing Wiggins because that is the simplest and really only definitive roster change (along with Black).

Myself, if my Dodgers are doing well I am able to immerse myself in baseball. If not...

@drgnslayr Well it was before my time, but my understanding was that it just wasn't financially tenable to keep football around. Now trying to build one back from the ground up has to seem like an impossible task.

You got me curious as to if they had in fact been any progress, so I've been looking at articles about them possibly reviving the program. There was apparently an effort to get a club team started by a group of students that would eventually hand over the team to the university, at which point it would be an NCAA team. In response to this movement, Wade Robinson (Vice President for Campus Life and University Relations) was quoted as saying "My suggestion is that everyone who is interested in playing football while enrolled at Wichita State should contact the Kansas Cougars or Wichita Wild to still continue their education and pursue playing football,” That tells me all I need to know about how serious the administration is about bringing football back.

(The Wichita Wild is a professional indoor team, and the Kansas Cougars are a club team that I have never heard of).

@drgnslayr Well, maybe I'll quantify that as saying a HUGE portion of the fans I encounter. It is true that a large portion of Shocker fans at the games are 50+ in age. Isn't that the case with KU games though? Kids don't have money for season tickets. Heck, I'm no "kid", but I don't have that kind of money laying around. You are also correct that their student section is not as large as KU's. In fact, the local news just did a piece last night about a handful of WSU fans that were camping out in the cold weather for good seats, and there were literally like 3 or 4 tents worth of students.

As for football, that rumor has been going around for awhile. 15 years ago or so I was attending WSU and did a paper (or speech for my public speaking class) about the likelihood of WSU bringing back football. I spoke to a number of administrators, and at the time the prognosis was bleak. One of the main reasons was Title IX, which states that equal funds must be allocated for women's sports as men's sports. That includes scholarships, and I was told they would have to create about a half dozen women's sports just to compensate for the scholarships necessary for the creation of a football team. I really don't know that they are any closer than they were 15 years ago, but I could be wrong.

@oldhwkfan No worries about the disagreement. I welcome lively debate, and we are all KU fans here and I have never encountered anything other than respect here. You are no different.

To me this statement says it all: "if they're not in the title hunt, it's only the diehards who care". I believe that whole paragraph just described bandwagon fans. If you're only in it for the good times, you're a fair-weather bandwagon fan. Not sure how you can call BS on that, when you in essence described to a T what it means to be a bandwagon fan.

Yes it is easier to be excited about your team when you are winning. I don't doubt the level of excitement & rabidness increases when teams are winning. I'm a Raiders fan, so yeah, it's hard to get excited for football season. However, my allegiance never wavers. I didn't become a Broncos fan all of a sudden because the Raiders are down. I'm silver & black in my football fanhood. And that's the difference in a HUGE portion of their fans now. People who had never before been WSU fans, and were in fact KU fans, have now jumped on the black & gold bandwagon. Don't get me wrong, if those fans are that fickle I'm glad to be rid of them. But to me it's as maddening as people saying "I'm a KU basketball fan, & a KSU football fan." To me, when people say that, it means they are a true fan of neither.

Saying Wichita State has always been a mid-major is a cop out. According to Wikipedia, the only conference older than the Missouri Valley is the Big 10, and some very good schools have emerged and moved on from that conference. KU? Cincinnati? Most of the former Big 8, Iowa, Memphis, St. Louis, Tulsa, and most recently Creighton...all former MVC schools. So if WSU wants to mope about it's situation as a lowly mid-major, I don't feel sorry for them. They should have moved out of that conference. You say they've always been a mid-major, I'd say that conference is a mid-major. That conference is a stepping stone for universities to improve themselves by moving on to bigger & better things, much like the coaches at those institutions. If they failed to capitalize and get out, that's on them. They probably have missed their window, as not having football really cripples them in today's conference realignment climate. So you're right, they're probably screwed.

As far as their scheduling goes, yes it has to be hard to get teams to play them. I have a couple ideas on this though. First, if I'm WSU, I go up to a few of the big boys and say "we can't compete with the same level of recruits as KU, but you can. How about a home-and-home series that would give you some visibility in KU's backyard?" And by big boys, it doesn't have to be UNC, Duke, Kentucky, etc. But maybe the second tier or third tier of schools after that. The Arizonas, Florida, Ohio St, Villanova, Cincinnati, etc. Maybe that works, maybe it doesn't. The other thing I think Wichita State should have been doing since the Turgeon years is an idea that ESPN practically handed them with the bracket busters games. Schedule other high-quality mid-majors. VCU, the Brad Stevens Butler teams, Gonzaga, Nevada, etc. A quick look at their schedule this year suggests they may have been attempting a touch of that, with games against St. Louis (their marquee win), Davidson, & Tulsa. And lastly, if you really want games against top-tier competition, you might have to bite the bullet and offer a one game deal at your opponents' gym. You don't see KU making return trips to Towson do you? The little guys have to do the traveling to play the elite. The problem is that WSU thinks they are above this now. Well, from a competitive standpoint they are above it. But if you can't get anyone to play you, the reality is they are not above it. So to me, you can either take a lesser schedule and deal with the criticism, or you can take steps to improve it. Or you can do what Wichita State is doing, and whine about it not being fair.

@HighEliteMajor Winning a couple back-to-back would be sweet. Obviously it wasn't going to happen in '09, given the gutting of the roster. But might the time be ripe for us to do it this year & next? Consider Florida's most recent accomplishment of this feat - they were a 3 seed the year they won the first of the two. We have the talent if we get hot to win it this year, and then even with the likely departures we keep a good size core and have already reloaded with some blue chippers...I can see it happening.

@drgnslayr You are right on your description of Wichita State. It is a commuter school, meaning the majority of the students drive to campus, go to class, then drive home (or to work). Combine that with the fact that there is no football, and you don't get the true "college experience" attending WSU. It's one of my big regrets in life, not going away to college. Told myself I was just going to get some gen-ed classes out of the way at WSU then I was off to Lawrence. Just didn't work out.

There is a large chunk of international (asian) students. If you are to linger around on campus, they are the ones you'll see the most. Not sure how big of a chunk are middle aged. Maybe, it's been 10 years since I've been in their classrooms. I know they have satellite "campuses" in and around different parts of town, so many students utilize those. It is a strange student base for sure.

I miss a rivalry too. I know we've talked about this. I don't think we can manufacture one with Wichita State. When I think rivalry, I think something lasting. I can't fathom WSU having the kind of long term success to sustain such a rivalry.

@drgnslayr I wish I had interactions like that with Shocker fans, but honestly I don't. Maybe it's a generational thing. I'm in my mid-30s, and most of my friends and acquaintances are roughly the same age. Also, I wouldn't say it's a lifetime of bad experiences. Until a couple of years ago, they weren't bad. But success has gone to their head. Plus for most of my lifetime they didn't have a "bandwagon", so there weren't the fair-weather fans to deal with.

I will say that I am not opposed to playing them. I wish we would just to shut their fans up! (hopefully). But I also respect coach Self's & AD Zenger's reasons why we don't.

As far as the trip to the Bahamas goes, that is a tournament. There's a difference between your regular non-con schedule and the pre-season tournaments. KU could not have banked those 3 games and instead scheduled 3 games in AFH. They couldn't have scheduled 3 additional road games either. There is a set number of games you can play each year, and the only way to increase that number is with the one "pre-season" tournament every school is allotted. Pretty much every school that can afford it takes advantage of the opportunity to expand their schedule with the pre-season tournament games. And next time someone asks you how many players KU is recruiting in the Bahamas, you answer "all of them". Because when Self walks into a recruit's home and says, "well, if you come to KU we play in places like the Bahamas, Maui, Vegas, etc.", you can bet that's an incentive.

The other thing about the Bahamas trip is that KU has to make trips like that to compete. Not to compete on the court, but to compete against other blue blood programs for recruits. It's not all that dissimilar from the building of the apartments for the basketball players. KU couldn't very well play every pre-season tournament in the Sprint Center and get away with it. So some of the trips are things they have to do, even if they don't want to (although I don't think anyone had to twist Self's arm about the Bahamas trip). Scheduling WSU is not something we have to do to compete on any level, so we don't.

@wissoxfan83 Allow me to do my best to describe the anti-WSU sentiment. Just to give you an idea of my "credentials", I was born in Wichita and grew up in a small suburb just minutes away from the city. I went to Wichita public schools. When I graduated high school, I moved into the city and began attending classes at Wichita State. I accumulated over 70 credit hours at the university. I still live in Wichita. I have attended a few Wichita State basketball games, the last of which were a couple of NIT games during the Turgeon era. So I would say that I have my finger firmly on the pulse of this issue.

Let me also say that despite my Wichita ties, I have been a Jayhawk fan for as long as I have liked sports. As a boy of 10, my grandfather sat down with me and we watched the '88 championship game together while my mom was in the hospital at the time. That memory planted the seed, but I wouldn't become what I would describe as a "die hard" until the '91 season. Since then, I have watched every game possible, known the rosters, worn their gear, etc.

With that boring history of me out of the way, let's delve into the issue of why there is such strong anti-WSU venom these days. The quickest and simplest answer is that it stems from a lack of respect from WSU fans, and to a lesser extent coach Marshall. The prevailing cry from their fan base is "KU is afraid to play us." You can try and explain to them all the reasons coach Self states - that we use home games to generate revenue to fund the athletic department and that any away games are done so in order to give us a recruiting foothold in a different area of the country - but it's just way too obnoxiously convenient for them to retort to the juvenile response of "play us, or you're scared." For a blue blood program to be accused of being afraid of anyone, it is insulting. And they get some of it from their coach, who I believe is obsessed with KU. We don't want to play them, OK, move on. Instead he is constantly trying to drum up media pressure, maybe even legislative pressure, to get us to play him. He taunts us, saying if he was KU he wouldn't want to play WSU either (because of the fear factor). He was at a pep rally and uttered the word "chickenhawks." For all the talk about how KU is scared to play them and they shouldn't be criticized for their weak schedule, I believe he if spent a little less time obsessing about KU he could have gotten a few more quality opponents on his schedule.

As I said, that is the simplest answer. There are, of course, more nuances to the issue than that. For example, Shocker fans are bandwagon fans. Obviously every sports team is going to have their share of fair-weather followers, but the gold & black bandwagon seems to have a larger than normal portion of bandwagon fans. As I said, I attended WSU in the late 90s and early aughts. There was no school spirit. No support for the team. Even after building a new arena, they still wouldn't start selling out for years. KU fans in Wichita single-handedly kept local sports bars open during the winter months for years. No WSU fans to be found. Now, they come out in droves like they own the place.

Another thing is that they lack any appreciation or respect for KU's basketball tradition. Like their bandwagon mentality, it is all about the now. Because they made the Final 4 last year and we didn't, and because they are undefeated this year and we aren't, we are "headed down" and they will "continue to rise to the top." I've been told that, or some variation thereof, by countless WSU fans. That their less than 2 full stellar seasons somehow has leapfrogged them ahead of KU in the heirarchy of college basketball. When I have (foolishly) tried to engage them in debate, and have called upon our all-time wins, string of conference championships, Final 4 appearances, possessing the original rules of basketball and inventing the game I'm usually met with "wow, you have to go back that far huh?" or "we don't care about the past, we're the future!" It's nauseating.

Anyway, that's my own perspective on why there is so much animosity towards the Shockers.

My biggest fear is poor PG play. I'm a Tharpe fan, but the games where we've had trouble and lost have been: when we are physically over-matched up front, and when we encounter two PG issues - either we are pressed/trapped and handle it poorly or we run into a PG mis-match and Tharpe's defensive deficiencies are exploited. I feel like we have gotten past the issue of facing more physical teams. I think we are better equipped to handle the press & traps. But I still think it's a crap-shoot as to whether Naadir can handle an elite PG on the defensive end. We did just see him completely shut down Isaiah Taylor in the Texas re-match. Can he get that dialed in consistently? I don't know.

There's also always the things that you can't control - injuries, poor officiating, and an opposing team/player getting uncharacteristically hot from 3.

@drgnslayr Maybe not calling us "chickenhawks" here, but here is a link to Marshall saying if he was Bill Self, he wouldn't play WSU:

http://jimrome.com/2014/01/03/gregg-marshall-on-ku-if-i-were-them-i-wouldnt-play-us-either/ ↗

And not exactly sure of the context (other than him "repeating the phrase" as the article says), but here is a link in which the word "chickenhawk" apparently did come out of Greg Marshall's mouth:

http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2011/04/20/wake-up-call-did-wichita-state-basketball-coach-call-ku-the-chickenhawks/ ↗

There was a dunk by one of the Morris Twins a couple years ago (I want to say Marcus) that used to be part of the video montage that was pretty vicious.

@Lulufulu85 Who are you, Doug Gottlieb? Be careful...word of your elite 8 list and omitting Wichita State is sure to make it to their fans' eyes & ears soon! LOL

There was some good back-and-forth discussion late last night on REHawk's thread "Mr. Ellis, meet Mr. Smith". The debate was whether this was a good win or a "low" win as Jaybate posted. Honestly, after years of reading Jaybate post about how Self will vary how he "amps" his teams from contest to contest, I was surprised to see him so down on the team.

Some observations:

1. Tharpe's defense...does it even need to be discussed anymore? He does try, as Reid Gettys pointed out last night when he broke through a double screen to blow up one of Tech's set plays. But those instances were few & far between. Combine that with his two late game turnovers and he hurt us more than anybody last night. At this point, if he doesn't get hot from 3 in a game, then we're just hoping to manage the net negative we take at that position. That being said...Mason with only 6 minutes?

2. Wiggins - Very aggressive. Definitely makes plays at the end of close games. I think at this point there isn't any doubt who our go-to guy is, or at least should be. Two plays last night that warrant some attention: first, some posters have been waiting for him to dive for a ball. I don't know that it was technically a dive, but he did go to the floor for a loose ball. Is that enough to placate the nay-sayers? Second, on a drive in the second half he got knocked down and slid across the baseline. Did anyone notice how three of his fellow Jayhawks rushed to him? My first thought was that maybe this was in response to the Marcus Smart incident, that they saw their teammate heading closer to the opposition fan base and immediately wanted to get him out of there. There were no Tech players around him, and the rate that his teammates came to his aid just seemed out of the ordinary. At any rate, there was also some discussion on what Wiggins' teammates think of him because he doesn't look to pass off his drives. I don't think there's any doubt his teammates like him and respect him.

3. Perry's struggles last night were a real head scratcher. This should have been a game he dominated. Tech didn't have the bruising front line that gives Ellis problems sometimes. And against zones...well Self made the comparison to Julian Wright after the TCU game. How when opposing teams went zone Julian's eyes would get real big and he could really dominate, and how Perry had a lot of that in his game. Granted Tech did a great job switching from M2M, to one zone to another. Also, the only thing I can attribute it to is foul trouble. It's not the first time I've posted how Perry gets completely out of rhythm and is a non-factor in a game he has foul trouble.

4. Embiid - Self said going in he'd like for him to play 25 minutes. He ended up with 32. A positive sign? He said he felt about 90%, but if that was the case that 10% was noticeable. He did have a veru good, efficient game, but wasn't the game-changer down low that he can be at times. And he was thrown to the floor a couple of times last night. Anxious to see how he fares in the rematch with Ridley & the Longhorns.

5. Black/Traylor - another solid performance from these guys off the bench. Such a luxury having great post depth. Love watching Jamari's offensive game evolve. He's not the natural that Embiid is, thus he isn't absorbing the game at an astronomical rate, but just imagine if this guy would have been playing hoops at an earlier age.

There was some good back-and-forth discussion late last night on REHawk's thread "Mr. Ellis, meet Mr. Smith". The debate was whether this was a good win or a "low" win as Jaybate posted. Honestly, after years of reading Jaybate post about how Self will vary how he "amps" his teams from contest to contest, I was surprised to see him so down on the team.

Some observations:

1. Tharpe's defense...does it even need to be discussed anymore? He does try, as Reid Gettys pointed out last night when he broke through a double screen to blow up one of Tech's set plays. But those instances were few & far between. Combine that with his two late game turnovers and he hurt us more than anybody last night. At this point, if he doesn't get hot from 3 in a game, then we're just hoping to manage the net negative we take at that position.

2. Wiggins - Very aggressive. Two plays last night that warrant some attention: first, some posters have been waiting for him to dive for a ball. I don't know that it was technically a dive, but he did go to the floor for a loose ball. Is that enough to placate the nay-sayers? Second, on a drive in the second half he got knocked down and slid across the baseline. Did anyone notice how three of his fellow Jayhawks rushed to him? My first thought was that maybe this was in response to the Marcus Smart incident, that they saw their teammate heading closer to the opposition fan base and immediately wanted to get him out of there. There were no Tech players around him, and the rate that his teammates came to his aid just seemed out of the ordinary. At any rate, there was also some discussion on what Wiggins' teammates think of him because he doesn't look to pass off his drives. I don't think there's any doubt his teammates like him and respect him.

3.

@ajvan At this point, it's hard to imagine anyone unseating a senior Tharpe next year for the starting PG position. If anyone has a shot at it, Mason would be the guy. A freshman, even one as highly ranked and long & athletic as Lyle, seems unlikely.

Normally we see Self have an almost unwavering support of his veteran players over the underclassmen. The most classic/infamous example of this was with BStar & Tyrel Reed vs. EJ & Releford. Other examples abound. This most likely stems from Self's comfort level with more experienced players to provide him with the level of defense he expects. However, if ever there was a player that seemed ripe to break that trend, it's Tharpe. He just doesn't seem to have Self's full confidence, which logically could be tied to his defensive shortcomings. We saw Self bench him for 2 games in favor of Mason, and we saw him sit Tharpe down the stretch of the Texas game. We also have the quote from Self (following the Texas game) where he says he isn't going to throw anybody under the bus, but goes on to say Tharpe wasn't impacting the game on either end.

I don't follow the high school game enough to accurately assess Lyle and his abilities. But my guess is it was just Alexander doing his part to try and recruit his friend who he knows Self has interest in to his new school. I also wonder if we'd have a scholarship available for him.

Regardless, thanks for posting the link and sparking some good conversation. Very excited for Alexander next year!

@jaybate 1.0 You referenced it a couple of times, but Brandon was never a senior. He left after 3 years.

Also, this seems to be a bit contradictory:

"This school believes that truth in assessment and comparison of what was done, no matter how harsh, or how praiseworthy, cannot be violated, no matter who's feelings get hurt."

followed later by:

"And this talk of Rush not knowing how to spell defense in the beginning is a lot of hogwash"

Sorry, nitpicking.

@HighEliteMajor I guess I don't have as big of a gripe about Wiggins driving yet not passing because I don't view that as his role. Now it would be great to have in his arsenal for sure, but I look at our junior point guard rarely drive looking to pass and that concerns me more. Also, I remember Xavier Henry and the biggest complaint on him was that he settled for too many jump shots and was protecting his body by not driving into the lane. I look at Wiggins, who is not yet in a "man's body" so to speak, yet he drives in there with no abandon. To me, if I was his teammate, that is what I would notice. That he is not so concerned about himself that he is afraid to drive and doesn't shy away from contact. Now he still probably takes a few too many jump shots, but I can live with them. I mean, the Florida performance that made you believe he has it in him to step up was built largely off of jump shots he made.

It's ironic that you ask how a vocal leader could help this team and how the pieces need to fit, given that it's been reported that Wiggins came to KU in part because he believed his personality meshed well with Selden & Embiid who he had met in some of the all-star games and such. I do agree that the pieces need to fit. We see that time & time again in sports. But it's not like we bypassed a vocal leader and choose Wiggins instead. We'd have the same team we have now, minus Wiggins.

Also, I see you view Embiid's departure as "likely". Not buying into all the hope that's been abounding lately about him possibly coming back?

@HighEliteMajor Funny, I was just referencing your view of Wiggins & AW3 on REHawk's post about Brannen Greene's benching today.

I don't know what it is about AW3 - but he never really seemed to be in Self's good graces, in terms of garnering playing time anyway. Even last year when he demonstrated the ability to create mismatches by playing the stretch 4, we very rarely saw Self utilize him.

As far as whether Wiggins was worth it if we don't win the title, I don't know. I guess thinking of an ancillary benefit, if Wiggins one year here is viewed as a personal success on his part, then it could help us recruit the OAD done the road that is the final piece of the puzzle. The way many thought Xavier Henry was supposed to be the final piece to the '10 team's championship aspirations. Up until now, I think you would have to classify our OAD experiments as unsuccessful. Selby was the #1 rivals recruit and was derailed by injuries & the suspension, and ended up falling out of the first round. Xavier Henry had a solid, but unspectacular one season as a Jayhawk. So having a OAD recruit come in and perform will probably make it easier for Self on the recruiting trail, as the Caliparis of the world won't be able to point to our track record of not being able to utilize/develop players in a single season situation. And I think Wiggins has had a very good season. Not "maple Jordan/next Lebron" good, but that was unrealistic anyway. 16 ppg, 6 rpg, very good defender. Obviously his immense talent and still spacious talent ceiling leave us wanting more, but I don't think anyone would call him a bust by any stretch.

I guess my belief has been that it is too hard to predict the make-up of one team to the next due to early defections (not just OADs), transfers, etc., and that given this you always take talent when it is available, because you don't know when that level of talent will be available again. Also, we never know until we receive the gift of hindsight how things will play out. Brandon Rush was largely thought to be a OAD prospect, yet he decided to come back for his sophomore year, injuries led to him coming back his junior year, and because of that we have the '08 championship. If Self passes on Rush because of his presumed OAD status, we don't win that championship. And Rush came into the program when we were just about as young as we are this year. So regardless of whether we win the title or not, I'm glad Self landed Wiggins.

(speaking of Rush, glad to see him there today, and always makes me smile hearing Self refer to him as the best defender we've had during his tenure).

So despite the loss at TCU last year, I think most everyone is thinking this will be a low-stress game, and that we should come away with a comfortable victory. That being said, if you had to pick one thing you'd like to see happen in the game, what would it be?

Certainly there are tons of things, but I think if I'm choosing one thing, it would be that Brannen Greene gets some decent minutes and positively contributes today. Basically for him to build on his performance at KSU and get some momentum going in his development.

@RockChalkinTexas Hell yeah! Sucks having to wake up at the crack of dawn (on a Saturday no less!) to watch the game, but it was worth it. Hoping we get a piece of Canada somewhere down the line.