@Texas-Hawk-10 I wonder how many dunks Big Dave would've missed if he still weighed 290?
wissox
13106 posts
2nd or even 3rd time I've had to eat crow on NC winning coaches in the last 4 tournaments. I really didn't think Jay Wright had what it took with all the flameouts early on in the tournament every year. Watching him outreach Bill Self in 2016 was eye opening, and the destruction of our hot team in 2018 was breathtaking.
Tony Bennett had another can't win the big one tag, and for goodness sakes, had Purdue not sent three guys after that loose ball in the last seconds of the elite 8 instead of staying home and defending the basket Tony would still be FF'less.
And now Scott, after years of watching his deer in the headlights look as Self bludgeoned the Bad News Bears, and memorably for me, Bo Ryan turning him into a facsimile of a real coach in the Sweet 16, well he has improved, and learned. Seems like a nice guy, all that, glad to see this league becoming a regular in the last weekend of the tournament and notch a NC with nary a big east/Acc/SEC team anywhere near the FF.
I would think this is great motivation but I'm also wondering when this long overdue judgment comes down on our team so we know our consequences if any.
@drgnslayr said in Okay I Know but Hear Me Out:
Should we be robbing UA players now? lol Why change our old habit of competing for players with UA.
So would players trade a NCAA death march from Arizona to a NCAA death march in Lawrence? lol
Sean will be back coaching before you know it... "Bruce Pearl on line one!' lol
@nwhawkfan I didn't miss for church, but I'm glad you did! (priorities!). But I am visiting family, was having a great time playing games, totally forgot about the game. Came home, remembered they'd played, it was past 11 here in Pittsburgh and Figured it was over. I'd check score in a few minutes. When I did I couldn't believe that espn said 22 seconds left in OT. Quickly turned on TV to see Few shaking Cronin's hand. Started watching post game still unaware of how it'd ended until 5 minutes later they showed replay. Actually got my wife out of bed and said you've got to see this. Amazing. I wouldn't trade the fun evening with family but I'm a bit sad I missed the game, or at least the ending.
@mayjay See I’ve been a coach rising all the way to 6th grade so I do know how hard it is!
I don't think KU fans ever gave him credit enough for beating us while at VCU.
Wiggins got to be in there somewhere and Doke, and Embiid of course and TRob, and Mason and Graham, and Ellis, and Sherron and holy cow there are so many. Like how to you keep a starter on a NC game team like Withey? I'd love that Tyshawn played in 2010-11 like he did after new years day 2012 because we don't make that game without him. Newman for nothing more than shooting Duke out of the tournament.
I saw Porter Moser at a tournament two years ago. I told him I still had some eligibility left if he needed somebody.
Adam Miller surprisingly leaving Illinois. His mom told me he was high on KU before committing to U of I. Maybe he comes west a bit. Don't have a working relationship with the mom anymore so I can't recruit on the sly. He'd be a nice get.
@Fightsongwriter Makes me feel a bit better about Bill Self. Just so many what ifs, just like his predecessor.
So you were at KU in the 90’s when obannon and UCLA won or were you referring to their last 70’s championship?
UCLA is strange. They feel like they should be right up there with the rest of us blue bloods but I guess they’re living proof that a strong program can lose favor with the young guys who don’t know their history. Recruiting guys to UCLA should be the easiest part of the job for a Bruin coach but it’s not anymore.
@BeddieKU23 I think it'd be hilarious if his own son transferred!
@mayjay I'm sorry, it was a prediction actually that bad sequence spelled doom for the maize and blue.
Pitiful end to the BIG season. Airball and a prayer that had no chance of being answered even by a very merciful and benevolent God.
With ten minutes left on Thanksgiving Day we were behind the Zags by 1 point. It fell apart after that, but for 30 minutes we were as good as the best team in the nation. I really didn't take too much from that game as a sign of where this team was headed. But after watching the team that destroyed us a week ago get destroyed tonight makes it seem we're light years away. And yet, Baylor is a team we hung with before losing and then of course defeated. Strange KU season and if there's no covid affecting Jalen possibly we finished the year on a higher note.
A friend did her first bracket ever this year. She really doesn't follow college hoops. She picked her final 4 of Gonzaga, Houston, Baylor and Michigan. I'm sure two weeks ago we'd have told here all the 1 seeds never make it, and here we are in a tournament of epic upsets and double digit seeds in the elite 8 and now it's playing out almost as expected. I still can't believe Illinois choked their opportunity away.
I believe in mandatory vacations for everyone.
@BeddieKU23 Hedstrom is a big that couldn't find the court in his first two seasons....
Big 12 now has had 4 different teams represent the league in the last 5 tourneys' final fours. Interestingly it's those 5 years now that has twice seen us not win the league. @drgnslayr pointed out that a tough league should help KU.
@Bosthawk I think KU fans were so hard on him that we ran him out of town. I know he was frustrating, but he was still a pretty decent freshman basketball player.
Geographically Michigan is the furthest east team still alive. ESPN must be going crazy. Great year for the west. Since UCLA's run ended in 1975 there have been only 5 west of the Mississippi champs, KU twice, UNLV, Arizona and Arkansas and UCLA. KU is the only team since Arizona in 1997 to win from the west. TTech almost added their name to the list. From the central time zone, KU, OK AM, Wisconsin, Loyola and KU are the only winners EVER. I like geography and worthless related trivia.
@benshawks08 Have you ever looked at our path in 1988? Upsets galore! Easier path, at least until the EE, FF, NC!
@Texas-Hawk-10 Yeah it seemed like OSU got some motivation by my comment!
Looks like a former Jayhawk is going to the Final Four at least.
@justanotherfan I agree to a point except Doke was hurt against Auburn and our offense suffered. Still not sure we'd beat them but we don't know. This year wasn't our best year but Covid stole our momentum big time. Villanova in 2018, I'll take your word for it since you are not just another fan, your a fan who knows his stuff.
But there's 2020. I really believe that team would have won the championship. They were on a roll. 6 more games is all it took. So if it happens then this year we're singing a different tune?
@Kcmatt7 Hmmm, how would we define that?!!
He was probably the most un KUlike player we've had in decades
It's interesting to me that Gonzaga is the least hyped undefeated team in history. Their weak conference and of course a shorter season means they had fewer chances to lose games. I'm guessing they'll win the 'ship but they're not going to go down in history like Indiana in 76.
I do think Baylor can beat them and I'll have to give grudging respect to Scott. His revival of the program after a murderous scandal is really remarkable. He has fashioned the 2nd or 3rd best program in the league after us and Tech. His teams have become more and more feared as the years go by. And I have to admit. They're fun to watch.
I haven't the stomach to check the bracket, but is it set up so Baylor and Zaga play each other?
By the way should Michigan get Livers back for the FF watch out for them too.
@BeddieKU23 Maybe it's because I couldn't watch 2013 that makes it sting less because I'm sure I'd have been going nuts had I been watching it.
2016 still gets me when DG was called for a foul for diving after a loose ball. It's calls like that that make me think there's just a bias, a general favor of teams from the larger TV markets. It really didn't guarantee us a win had the call not gone against us, but we basically had no chance after that. And to add insult to injury, one of our guys, Thompson I think was injured in a game, I forget which this year, when someone did a full bellyflop on top of him, and of course no call.
@DanR Good catch, forgot about the NCState buzzer beater! Yes, definitely more epic than Christians shot.
@bskeet At the very least it's a testament to Bill Self that he's putting us in position to lose later in the tournament rather than earlier most years.
@mayjay No, I can't agree. I wouldn't even hold my nose and agree. I wouldn't even accept a 10,000$ agree with you fee and agree (ok, I might rethink that one). To me it was the fact that it was a shot to get to the Final Four. That's all. Sure, there's a different National Champion if Duke misses that shot, but I tend to believe it's only a famous shot because of the sports media obsession with Duke.
@Texas-Hawk-10 Losing to Michigan in 2013 which was semi robbed out of a championship? I'd argue they were better too. Villanova was clearly the better team in 2018, right?
But, and this I think was true during Roys tenure as well, when you lose to a team that reaches the pinnacle of the sport it's not necessarily a bad loss. If we kept losing to teams like Bradley and Bucknell then Bill is a March choker.
Do you think 1997 was a failure? Fantastic team for sure that happened to lose to the national champion. 2003 was more of a failure I think because of the missed FT's hid the fact that we were clearly better than Carmelo and Syracuse.
The announcer just before Alabama's play started. "This is the 29th anniversary of the Christian Laettner shot". I don't cuss but I felt like it. I mean his shot will go down in history, because of freaking CBS as the greatest shot in history. It wasn't better, (and this is just my memory) than Keith Smarts NCAA winning shot in 1987, or Scottie Thurmans shot in 1994, or of course Mario's shot in 2008 or the Villanova shot in 2016. Not even close. If Laettner misses his shot Kentucky goes to the FF instead of Duke. These freaking media types can't help but continuing to kiss Dukes a$$ even as it's been years since they were relevant.
Bill Self has had an interesting career. Racked up a lot of wins, and I mean a whole lot. Lots of conference championships led to lots of high seeds and lots of unfortunate losses. But if you look at who has eliminated Bill Self from the tournament the picture of his accomplishments is a little brighter.
I am not smart enough to figure out if he tightens up in the tournament leading to upsets and poor performances, but more than half of his tournaments since he's been here have resulted in being eliminated by a FF team or national champion the majority of the time.
2004 GTech
05-06 Only first round losses
07 FF team UCLA
08 Win it all!!
09 National Runner up Michigan State
10 NIU
11 FF VCU
12 NC Kentucky
13 Nation Runner up Michigan
14 Stanford lost in SS
15 WSU lost in SS
16 NC Villanova
17 FF Oregon
18 NC Villanova
19 FF Auburn
20 Would have been national champion
21 ???? Will know more this week.
10 times out of 15 years there was a tournament or that he wasn't the champion, he lost to a FF or better team. 67% of the time he's lost to a team that had a dream season.
Some have made an issue out of the bad losses. Some this year preposterously at KUSports were suggesting we fire him.
The bad losses are depressing to be sure. I'd chalk up Covid as an excuse this year and the injury to Doke in 2019. The recruiting drop off because of the shoe scandal is self inflicted.
But is Bill Self the right man for our job? Absolutely.
@BeddieKU23 That one took me by surprise. A lot of us, although never confirmed, think he had covid at some point and it impacted his play. He's a really nice stretch 4 when his game is on. School record for blocked shots. Smart player, he'd be a nice fit in Lawrence.
Those two brothers whose name I've forgotten already from EWU are transferring. Doubtful they'd travel east to a school like KU but a 3 point shooting big sounds cool to me!
@mayjay Hard to think of too many other blowouts. Oregon in the Elite 8 of 2002 is a memorable one too in my mind.
@drgnslayr It's sad, but I can't think of one comedic thing to say about that night.
@benshawks08 You forget about the Marquette game in 03. 70-30 at one point. Watched it recently on youtube. Might have made us a bit overconfident going into Monday?
@nuleafjhawk Sorry to ruin your day! I know it would actually make you feel better to call them a bunch of putties!
I say at the end of every non winning season that they can't take 1988 or 2008 from me and the joy felt from those years. Those are actually pretty rare for the majority of sports fans to be true diehards of a team and get to see them win it all. It just doesn't happen much. Just look at the teams in our league. There's no fans of any of those teams that knows a national championship in basketball. Some of those schools have some nice football memories of course, but even there, it's been at least a decade for Texas and Oklahoma since a championship.
It eases the sting a bit. I also believe, as stated above that Covid really impacted this team. We had a great chance in 2020 to win it all. This year, nice run towards the end and like that, no Big 12 tournament, Jalen lost really through today. I can't believe we get trounced like we did today with Jalen and Big Dave having played without missing any games. Were we good enough to win it all? I'm doubtful. So a big loss sucks, we'll hear it from others 'ku sucks' 'ku chokes every year' or whatever but just remember what I wrote here. We've got it really good. Next season holds some promise. We're gonna chase down Kentucky for the all time win record, battle for another league championship and deep tourney run. Keep your heads up!
I had to go paint the house and fix the transmission on the car and finish my taxes. So I missed the end of the game. Did we come back and win?
Opening day is next week! And then when baseball ends, college hoops begins again! I can't wait!
I hope theres a good house hunters on at halftime
Bill needs to show them the quick version of Hoosiers at halftime.
@Kcmatt7 Jalen was playing. Tonight the refs decided he must still have cover and they whistled him out of there so fast it made my head spin, which normally spins a little anyways
@DanR I noticed that too. USC is about finished!!
Why the heck can't they call a foul when our guys shoot? Our last two should've been and 1.
What sucks is last years team was going to win the NC. Everyone will be writing Auburn smoked us two years ago and USC this year and what's wrong with Kansas? We got pandemicked out of the NC and so the narrative will be written KU chokes in the tourney.