Dotson also a Preseason 1st teamer.
I was bit surprised Doke got the nod here.
BeddieKU23
31745 posts
I think you will be surprised, a 4 star C will likely sign on Nov 1st and KK Robinson has said all the right things in the media about KU post NOA. They have been up front with recruits.
Yeah there's definitely concern about depth after this season in the backcourt. I think they can look to the grad transfer market if the NCAA crap isn't resolved by mid-spring. I think they sit in a good position with KK from everything I can see. It's probably a good thing Braun has surprised the staff at this point because I think its critical he gets some burn this season to set him up for a bigger role next season. I know a lot of people think Wilson is more of a 4 but we'll see where he settles in this season. Self may have to go more positionless with his lineup combinations in light of the type of players he's signed lately.
I agree he isn't a PG from what I've seen.
Maybe he proves us wrong stepping into a bigger role, a year older and 100% healthy. Freshman year he was up and down, Soph year, some flashes then the injury really cut into his season. I think we have a somewhat incomplete book on what Marcus can do..
If the staff likes Harris as much as the staff claims to be behind the scenes then maybe the PG talk for next year is a nothingburger
Good response.
When looking at next years roster without Dotson where does Self go? Give the keys to the freshman Harris who's red-shirting? Expand Garrett's role? Rely on a unsigned HS kid or transfer? Not great options with the current details we have.
Since Garrett is going to bet the de-facto backup this season its at least a possibility that responsibility could expand into next season. He'll probably have to noticeably improve on many of the details you listed. By Marcus's comments recently he sounded excited to get back to playing the position he played in HS. Defensively Marcus could cause some havoc with his size and skills in harassing ball handlers. Will be something to monitor
I'm interested to see how Garrett does in the complementary role at PG this season. I think its foreshadowing what his Sr year might be. We know Self he's done this in the past with EJ, letting the player he trusts run the team. I can't imagine he'll go into next season trusting a player more then Marcus and even with a redshirt I think you want Harris to learn from Marcus (so that's he's poised as Soph). I can definitely see Marcus being our main PG next season in order to get Braun or Wilson in the starting line up in the scenario that both Agbaji and De Sousa return. One of those guys stepping up into the lineup would solve a lot of spacing and potential offense concerns.
A starting 5 of Garrett, Agbaji, Wilson/Braun, De Sousa & Big Dave is a long and talented team
It's also a possibility that they have limited him so the issue can heal and minimize risk going forward. Obviously these things can be touch and go. I think them playing caution right now helps but we could certainly use him ready to go against Duke
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 @BShark Might be a good season to be on probation. We could seriously lose Dotson, Moss, Doke, Agbaji, DeSousa and Moss. We know we lose the first two.
Yeah a worst case scenario puts the returning scholarship count at 6 or 7.
Garrett (Sr), Lightfoot (R-Sr), McCormack (Jr), Wilson (So), Braun (So), Enaruna (So), Harris (R-Fr). Mitch is still undecided on his plans for this year (at least to media, fans).
De Sousa really isn't on the NBA radar right now. A good year maybe changes that. His Girlfriend is on the softball team so maybe this is a situation like Mason, Graham, Doke where he comes back since his stock going into this year is slim. Overseas is always an option but I think we know what his goal is.
Agbaji, again dependent on his season. Could be a potential 1st round pick this year or one in 2021. Not really getting a ton of hype for this year yet (good for us). ESPN mocked him 2nd round in 2021. He's the type of kid where exposure in March could really change his stock.
If KU somehow returns those two guys now your up to (8 or 9 players overall) 4 starter level players with PG the huge mystery. The behind the scenes talk is they really like Harris.
You have Grant-Foster (Jr) and if we are to assume Gethro Muscadin picks KU on Nov 1st, KU theoretically could have 11 scholarship players (also assuming Mitch takes a red-shirt). Not a bad roster to play with in the face of possible sanctions etc.
KK Robinson seems the main realistic PG option at the moment. Top 100 kid who's playing his final year at Oak Hill. That board will have to expand if they don't land him.
As always a very fluid situation
Good news! Gethro has some bounce to him. Will be interesting to see what the new S&C coach can do to him..
After eating a black hole full of Grimes hype coming into last season I'm actually more pessimistic about incoming recruits then ever before.
Somewhere in the middle of why KU recruited a JUCO (out of desperation, necessity) whatever terminology we want to use, there must be something the staff likes right? This is the staff that found Frank Mason & Agbaji. Both players likely were identified as being on the upward trajectory in their development. It seems like Grant-Foster could be one of those that might have something to give at the next level if we trust the staff knows what it's doing here. I honestly don't know but I think its best to stay a bit neutral until we see how his last year at Indian Hills goes. Might be a good topic to backtrack on in the future
BShark said:
Like for real how bad does it have to be that Nike can't get that cleared up looool. They got Bagley cleared somehow...
I guess its still the difference between it being Duke vs Oregon?
Woodrow said:
N'Faly Dante that played at Sunrise and went to Oregon is ineligible for the first semester. Trying to get cleared for the second. Wouldn't be surprised if he never plays college ball.
As soon as I saw he wasn't cleared when school started that made sense. Surprised swoosh couldn't clear up his academics. I also think its up in air whether he plays at all before going pro
HighEliteMajor said:
@BeddieKU23 It seems to me that a move like this is just one of desperation. This is the proverbial pig that we can’t really change by putting on some lipstick.
When have we ever done this? Twice? Appleton? Little? Appleton flamed out and Little way underachieved.
This kid didn’t start but five games at a JUCO. None of the “starters” are heading to any big time programs, are they? Central Michigan, Cleveland St.?
If he’s a stud, great. But on its face, as our first commit, it’s a really bad look. Folks talk about “optics” in recruiting. This one ain’t good.
Here me out.
Jeff Graves was a JUCO KU took as well although that pre-dates Self.
Little, at least was in the rotation at points. Appleton was a bust.
The sample size is obviously very small since KU doesn't have to recruit a JUCO player often. If there is no grey area in that discussion, yes, JUCO's have done nothing for KU under Self. Why should we expect this one to be any different. Moving on.
The optics can be turned around. KU got a 2020 recruit despite facing a uncertain future. Could entice the other two known targets, both Top 150 kids to jump aboard as well. Not disagreeing the optics of getting a JUCO look bad to some? The hard truth is KU can't recruit OAD's, Top 50's, Top 100's with certainty they will not be coming into a crapstorm. What else is there to recruit right now that hasn't already ran away?
Grant-Foster is being evaluated as a 4 star recruit, Top 5 Juco in the Country. Who knows what that will translate too. Could be the equivalent of Mitch Lightfoot or one of the JUCO's over the years that was an outlier . Look at his offer sheet, lots of Power 5 offers, KU wasn't fighting McNeese St for him.
BShark said:
Forgot we had this thread.
@BeddieKU23 KU offered this kid from up in your neck of the woods https://247sports.com/Player/Alex-Tchikou-46083649/ ↗
May end up in 20 class. My buddy texted me that the other day. I read it somewhere as well its a possibility. If its 20 don't expect KU
BShark said:
@BeddieKU23 Seems like the Robinson camp isn't leaking anything. Zero picks on Rivals or 24/7.
Pretty rare. Maybe hasn't made up his mind yet? He has more visits right? Something to monitor after his other visits.
Given what we are facing on the recruiting trail he's about as good a prospect as we can land right now. Certainly has the film of a player Self likes to have in the program. Harris & Robinson battling for the PG spot next year would be a bit intriguing and scary.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
I'll root for him, we need bodies and if he sticks around we will see
One question is do we recruit him without the sanctions. Since without the sanctions we likely get Bryce I would say in that case no.
The JUCO he goes to is historically very good and they do not really play FR much.
He's very athletic and his jumper is serviceable. He got to 36% from three in conference play so he was coming along. His goal is 40% this year.
Of course we don't get a JUCO kid, even one that looks talented enough to translate without the NOA etc.
Agree, Indian Hills has been produced kids that go D-1 for a long time.
Certainly has the athleticism. The versatility looks intriguing. The jumper doesn't look broken and can be tuned in. I think its solid depth to have in the program at minimum since we were very unlikely to sign a Top 100 SG/Wing type with what we are facing as well as the guards we currently have in-house.
Side note: after bypassing a ton of local talent over the years we certainly have plenty now. Either a concerted effort by the staff after some high profile whiffs over the years or necessity from a changing recruiting landscape. Probably a bit of both if I had a guess.
Optimistically Self and Co identified and scouted a player they believe can help them right away in the face of all this uncertainty. Pessimistically we got a JUCO when the standard at KU is far away from that level of play. Tough times but they never last. Hopefully this years film gives us reasons to think there's something there
BShark said:
jayballer73 said:
Now Ok so next up Gethro - -& KK - -I'd take that ok
I would bet on both committing before the first game of the season. Not saying the picks will be KU just that both are looking like fall signees.
Kk has said all the right things regarding KU lately. Both kids have either foreshadowed a commitment or just playing the game
Sure the reasons we get a juco kid this year are well known. He could be one of those late blooming kids that has a chance to prove the stigma wrong. We will have to wait and see. Some good things to like with his tape and hopefully he has a big year in Juco as he is being hyped to have.
I'll root for him, we need bodies and if he sticks around we will see
Can't imagine he starts the season having been less then full speed for the past month..
http://www2.kusports.com/news/2019/oct/13/ku-newcomer-isaiah-moss-thinks-kus-outside-shootin/ ↗
In the discussion for top junior college player in the country, Grant-Foster has now landed offers from programs like Arkansas, Georgia, Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas State, LSU, Miami, Oklahoma State, Oregon, SMU, St. John's, Texas and others. He's got size, athleticism and versatility.
"What separates me is my versatility," said Grant-Foster. "I can play multiple positions. Say our big man is in foul trouble i can go down and play the four. If our point guard is in foul trouble I can play the point. I can guard and play multiple positions. I feel I can pass the ball really well too."
Credit to Jerrance Howard here. Been the ace recruiter the past few cycles.
Grant-Foster also cited the job assistant coach Jerrance Howard did in building a relationship.
“That relationship is great and it is definitely important," said Grant-Foster. "Me and coach Howard have clicked since day one. I feel like he’s my guy and we can talk about anything. My family loves him and once they met coach Self too they loved him. My little brothers love him too and we feel like he will be a guy I can trust."
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Scotty Barnes lands at Florida St.
Nike controlled this one no matter where he went. Guess they want him in the ACC
Looks like the ole crystal ball got fooled.
Being a FSU football fan (unfortunate these days) there was optimism Ham did a good job with this one. It's a big time grab for them.
JUCO Guard/Wing from Kansas City becomes the first 2020 commitment.
Welcome Tyon!
Scotty Barnes lands at Florida St.
Nike controlled this one no matter where he went. Guess they want him in the ACC
Would seem like Lock City for Cunningham to UK after Evan put his pick in.
The have's and the have-not's are really starting to show now.. KU is trending in the latter
FarmerJayhawk said:
Okie Lite is out on Cade. UK or UNC, but likely UK. Bryce is OU or UNC, likely OU.
Wow.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
Maybe a good sign concerning Grant-Foster and KU as Iowa St picked up a Top 150 Small Forward yesterday.
Davion Bradford expectedly picked Kansas St
Oklahoma St recently lost their Top 100 PG who probably has seen all the Cunningham press and bolted
KSU is currently one over now I believe. Hilarious they think they might still get Gethro. Not saying he is 100% coming to KU but if he does go elsewhere I do not see it being KSU when Memphis and Louisville are recruiting him too.
I at least haven't seen many KSU fans claiming Bradford as a win over KU when KU never offered and the visit felt like keeping the new found good relationship with MOKAN going.
KSU has a great class for them. #11 in the country on 247 but that won't hold up. Still a very solid class, the after effects of a good tournament run followed by sharing the league title.
Looks like ISU is still recruiting in the 150-300 range. I can't really doubt them though with how good Haliburton and Conditt look. Their evaluation game seems strong. Wouldn't surprise me if they took him knowing Grant-Foster is leaning heavily towards KU. He could easily be KU's first commit in this class.
I think there's a few bodies that will move on from Weber's team as always. Nobody wants to listen to that pip-squeak
ISU has to be done at wing since they have a sit-out transfer that will likely start next year. I think the Blackwell commitment was foreshadowing of KU's chances with Grant-Foster.
Maybe a good sign concerning Grant-Foster and KU as Iowa St picked up a Top 150 Small Forward yesterday.
Davion Bradford expectedly picked Kansas St
Oklahoma St recently lost their Top 100 PG who probably has seen all the Cunningham press and bolted
This should surprise no one. Cannot blame the kid
Making a player sit 3 semesters is a new one for them. They tried to do 4 full for Silvio. Next is a complete 4 year ban for kids. It's not that far off
Tough Love. Guess Uber wasn't an option
Gradey Dick seems like a 22 recruit that is all but certain KU's to lose at this point. However its the 2022 class and that's far away
He's more or less a 6'10 guard. I think your right about fit.
Juco recruits at Blue Bloods or perennial Top 10 teams is almost non-existent so there's very little data to even discuss such occurrences. If you expand the discussion to Power 5, you'll get at least a handful every year that make contributions or become key players in the right situations.
If your not in trouble (like KU is currently) they could recruit at a level we expect from this staff. I understand the optics of this- the "sky is falling" because we're getting slapped around by the FBI/NCAA right now that we have to look at Juco's just to potentially fill spots.
Personally I didn't think we'd get anyone on campus after the NOA came, much less have a chance to sign 1-3 guys in the fall (regardless of their rank, talent). I have to give the staff credit if they close on some guys this fall despite the issues facing them.
If the evaluators are right about this years JUCO kids there may be a few outliers in the bunch. Louisville just got a commitment from arguably the top JUCO guard in the Country instead of going all in on Some Top 100 HS kids they were definitely in contention for.
Juco's definitely have a low success rate. Foster has a lot of High Major attention so its not just KU that wants him. It is unusual for KU to have to go this route but we all know why that's happening this recruiting cycle. Foster is intriguing with his size and skills. From a numbers perspective KU will need them and really can't pick and choose to the standard they were accustomed to
Mading was #393 coming out of HS, signed with Rhode Island, left shortly after.
Foster was unranked in the 2018 class.
Sometimes you find good ones but I get the sarcasm built in your comment.
Recruiting Juco's and developmental type players is the result of recruiting the Billy Preston's of the world. KU's rep on the recruiting circuit has hit a big speed bump for now
Juco 4 star Prospect Tyon Grant-Foster is visiting KU this weekend.
Eric Bossi had this to say recently about him:
I know that Scrubb has been given the title of best prospect in the Junior College ranks, but do-it-all wing Tyon Grant-Foster of Ottumwa (Iowa) Indiana Hills has to be in the conversation as well. A native of Kansas City, Kans., Grant-Foster is extremely versatile, athletic and still developing physically. There's a good reason that he's now racked up offers from Georgia, Kansas, Iowa State, LSU, Miami, Oklahoma State, Oregon, SMU, Texas A&M, Virginia Tech and others.
Bossi also says the Juco ranks this season is the deepest he's seen in a while.
My buddy has been working with him for a bit. Really good athlete with a ton of potential. I would say his ranking is more based on potential then actual at this moment but he's getting there. He is going to keep his ear out on his recruitment now that the hawks offered
Agree I think Arkansas is the team to fear here with Mussleman taking over and running a NBA style offense.
Definitely got the wishful thinking meter up a few notches hearing the fit comment. Those tend to be important details to read in between the lines from. We'll see, he still has visits left.
BShark said:
BeddieKU23 said:
thx hopefully can close on KK
One to pay attention to at least.
If the staff can close on KK and Gethro in the fall in spite of everything I'll be very impressed with the recruiting efforts.
thx hopefully can close on KK
Not a surpise. They swing the big Nike check
Any chance at Davion Bradford? Announcing Friday apparently after visiting over the weekend...
Perfectly okay with Gethro instead of Todd (if that's how it ends up)
I understand the difference in their talent level, one is clearly better then the other at this stage but Todd is the type of recruit that got us in the mess we dug ourselves in.
You wonder if a recruit like Todd ends up at Michigan if they still had Belein? I would think he doesn't.
BShark said:
Todd down to KU and Michigan. Announcing Oct 17.
wow.
Overseas tbd later I'm assuming
Surprised Duke didnt buy him.
That let's you know how much they are looking for
None