yeah if the game doesn't settle down quick. UCLA's coach has to figure out how to stop the high pick from going down.
BeddieKU23
31745 posts
Bruins got no chance when a 20% 3 point shooter making them
UCLA can't guard the high pick and roll with Fox
wow this has gotten out of hand quick
@BShark said:
Complete garbage. They just don’t have the athletes 1 through 5 to be much better either. Too many weak links. Ball and Leaf are NBA players though.
Yup, best to get ball going to the hoop or riding Alford's hot hand. Ref's definitely not gonna call this one fair
turnovers the difference as well. I think every UK basket has been off turnover
wow they call a foul when he walked 5 steps lol
UCLA's defense is swiss cheese
3-1 foul disparity already
Now 4-1
Kentucky's one weakness already showing.
UCLA good start
Yupp Alabama was terrible in that 2nd half, almost like they stopped playing hard after getting a lead. Bama is a bottom 5 SEC team.
Yes I do think we can win it without a quality big by the end of the year. I think as KU fans we have to open up our eyes to the change that has happened with this team and realize our strengths outweigh our one weakness.
We are so pre-conditioned to seeing a traditional lineup from Self. We are seeing the opposite. We don't know the outcome that 4 guard heavy lineup will give us so its easy to be scared that it won't end the way we want it too.
I do think Bragg is going to get better and give us a traditional 5 with Doke. Bragg is playing hard in spurts. Once coaching drills in consistent every play effort he's going to start producing. I also think we are seeing some good things from Coleby that can replace Lucas. I would have Lucas as our 9th man healthy or not. He's just not good enough with this team, we have too much athleticism at the other 4 spots to rely on him. Maybe that's unpopular to some but that's how I feel.
I think our guards are that good. Devonte/Frank in the tourney with Jackson, Vick & Svi wow.
Texas beat Alabama after trailing by 12 at halftime. To be fair- Alabama would be the worst team in the Big-12 if they were in the conference.
I'll be watching the UCLA/UK game before the KU game.
Baylor has an advantage being home and they are a much bigger team.
Zags should beat Arizona rather easily. Zona just missing too much to win I think
Also Virginia should best WVU.
I agree we played poorly but it was a fight. Some of it was due to Villanova making us play poorly. Some of it was just individual no-shows.
I liken Perry's play and Selden's terrible outside shooting to a slow death.
While the play with Devonte being the final dagger in the heart.
That's the problem for me, at least, the play with Devonte sticks with me more than what Perry didn't do and watching Selden's trey ball's miss the rim on more than 1 occassion.
At a key moment where KU still had a chance to win, our best player in that particular game was taken away by human error. Sigh.. Anyway's there's always this year!
Wow I never thought that but thanks for mentioning it. And the type of coach that Bill is, hard to see his players becoming "theater majors" all of sudden to get calls, Self expects his players to play and win the right way, except the "theatrics" way sometimes can benefit you more than in the long run.. The Nova game is still a tough pill to swallow 9 months later. That foul on Devonte, could make any KU fan throw their TV out the window!
Good detail about the lack of a top PG. You are right the PG spearheads what he wants to do on both sides of the ball- often times the extension of Smart on the floor.
Another point I didn't really detail that is lacking with this team is 3 point shooting. I mentioned Mack is a quality shooter- kind of like a poor mans Andrew White. VCU always had a bunch of these types, Texas does not. This is year 2 of him not having the type of shooters he needs. Playing pressure defense and making 3's was always a big part of VCU's success.
Having said all that, I think Pressure defense & 3 point shooting can often be what we call "fools gold". If you don't have the roster, perfected, what does a coach like Shaka hang his head on from game to game. While he's still transitioning I don't see a coach that great when he doesn't have everything in place for him. We know what Self teaches and preaches every year and most of the time he's consistent getting guys to do exactly what he wants no matter the turnover, no matter the roster makeup. Maybe its unfair to mention Self & Shaka together for any comparison sake but Shaka gets press like he's this unbelievable coach but yet we see plenty of evidence that suggest he's a bit overrated. I still think the jury is out whether Texas was the right choice for him
I'm also unsure there is a direct connection but its fun anyway to pick on Duke. I have tremendous respect for the university and its coach but its players- man they make it hard don't they?
I do think flopping is taught, I believe Coach K teaches it. He's not a defensive wizard like Bill Self, he's an offensive mind first that can mold top players together to win consistently. So he cuts corners in other area's like taking advantage of rules or his consistent whining in ref's faces to get what he wants. I find it hard to believe ref's are not intimidated by the his "stardom", ref's are human and as much as they all want to sound in-partial to the situation outside of calling the game, we all know that is impossible to do.
Coach K has influence, he influences his players to play a certain way- like flopping instead of defending. Even if we change word flopping to "trying to take a charge" I still think its poor defense. It's covering up a breakdown, and ref's are bailing out bad defense at what seems to be a historic rate this year.
I think the issue starts with the roster. They lost 4 starters and Isiah Taylor was a big loss for them at PG- which I think is the biggest individual position they are having trouble replacing. I don't see a true point guard on the roster- just a bunch of guys trying. A lot of athletic 2 guards on the team but none of them were known for sharing the ball.
Young team, little chemistry and you get a rocky start. I have no idea if Smart's havoc style worked at VCU right out of the gate but this is only year 2 and it could take a few more before he has a full roster full of guys that can play that style consistently.
The other big issue seems to be shooting. Mack is a quality perimeter scorer but what else do they got that can make a jump-shot consistently. Taylor was a play-maker, ultra quick and got wherever he wanted on the floor and right now they don't have one of those guys.
We've talked about Shaka's claim to fame on here a lot and how his style worked with under the radar kids with a chip on their shoulder. It's a different ball game when you try and bring the same stuff to the big leagues and your recruiting different types of kids- going from 3 star players to 4 star- Top 100 types. It requires a different type of coaching, one I'm not sure Shaka is meant for.
For instance he got Jarrett Allen to stay in Austin and play for Texas and Allen will be in the NBA next year. Not the type of kid he was used to recruiting/developing and training for 4 years which he got at VCU. Allen is not the type of player Shaka would normally recruit to play in his system but because he was a local Top 20 kid he really didn't have a choice, he had to lock down local talent. Now he's projected to be OAD and leave a big void in the middle for Texas. He's not Bill Self or other big-time coaches that can recruit/replace and not miss a beat. Simply, I don't think he's a coach that is meant for the upper echelon. Nothing I've seen yet to change that opinion.
They have another game tonight against Alabama. Could be another update coming
No visit scheduled for Wooten as of yet..
I don't think Bol will end up at KU as of right now. Bol is a unique player in that he's got guard skills at his size but his overall game is just hard to place anywhere in the KU offense. Whether its attention, immaturity, he's tried hard to get others to notice him.
It's important that the 2017 class ends strong. We know the 19 class has a lot potential so how do we bridge the gap in 18 which doesn't have a lot of elite players. Locking down Grimes and continuing to push for Devon Dotson- the PG from North Carolina would be a great start. Quickley, Langford & Williams other Top 20 guards that KU is recruiting seem like guys that will show interest but end up somewhere else.
Who else? Daniel Oturu seems like a quality big to go after now. I think the staff will be after a bunch of others that emerge over the season and into spring AAU.
Cincinnati gave out the blueprint on how to beat Iowa St. Slow down the pace to a crawl, take good shots and make them guard you. If you play to ISU's tempo they get shots and they look better then they are because volume will overcome weaknesses.
ISU still pushes the pace after missed/made shots which was one of the biggest factors in why KU lost in Ames last year. I doubt we will slow the pace, we like to play fast as well.
Cincinnati has a nice team, they play a tough style of play that is hard to beat if you don't shoot the ball. Washington- the transfer from NC St looks much improved and is an upgrade to what they had last year in the post.
By the way, enjoyed the read. Very well thought through
Dukes newest flopping star.... drum roll pleassse....
Chase Jeter. At dang near 7 feet tall this guy spends more time on the ground crying for calls then any player I can remember in years.
Get rid of him, your what's wrong with the game
Fully agree about the class in general and lack of guys that KU seems to be connected with at the moment. Gordon is a big miss if he sticks with Ford. I keep waiting for new names to emerge in the 18 class and it doesn't seem to be happening. Might be a class KU gets 1 or 2 really good players and targets some development guys like Vanover. Although I think Vanover needs to improve a ton for KU to look his way even at his size
You made a compelling argument for why they should do it.
Getting technical now. I'm sure after Saturday you can say 87.5% of the time? Too soon?
Had to see some video about this kid.
Not sure he's KU material honestly. Not athletic and is thin for a 7'2-3 kid.
He can shoot the 3 surprisingly pretty well and that part of his game seems the most advanced right now. At his size he's maybe someone you take and try and develop and get him to 240 at least. Not sure he's pushing 200 yet.. He's an okay rim protector but who wouldn't be at that size in the HS level. I don't know what to think of this one yet.
I agree, getting anyone from Texas would be a start. Garrett hopefully helps the momentum. If we get Grimes, I wonder if that would help with Liddell, I know Howard is keeping track of him.
I wonder what they will do next year when KU has to play UK in the Champions Classic. Can we really play them twice? Florida or A&M would be the next choices I would assume but neither of them would bring the Challenge star power like KU/UK does..
83% of the time you'll be right
Definitely he's consistently playing UNC, Louisville & the Champions Classic. As long as the SEC/Big-12 goes on it seems like KU/UK will play every year.
I agree with this opinion as well. The simple play for Doke is best right now. He gets the ball within 5 feet and has absolutely no immediate action on what to do with the ball. Eveytime he gets the ball with an angle I'm thinking dunk, drop step- go up strong but we usually see him throwing the ball back out.
Still so young and in the very beginning stages of learning how to use his body to score. The good thing is he looks talented enough to develop moves as the season goes on.
Definitely, we need to recruit at least 2 more guards/wings this class. Young or Duval is a good start. The other is definitely going to be someone not on our radar right now. A transfer guard would also be a priority
I hope this guy is an early commit
Nope they got beat pretty easily. St Mary's is a very good team, aussie, aussie nation
Those Gonzaga/St Mary's games are going to be the best in years.
I agree this is definitely the toughest game for Kentucky so far this season. UCLA will need to rebound the ball. limit transition and get some production other than Leaf from the post. The freshman post they just got back could be a key guy as he can offer some rim protection. If UCLA plays M2M defense, honestly they are up against it, Kentucky has 1 perimeter threat and I feel this is the first team with talent that could exploit their weak 3 point shooting. I don't think UK has earned the #1 spot but if they beat UCLA that will validate them
Kentucky also plays UNC & Louisville before KU comes in January. Both of those games should be stellar, wouldn't mind seeing them lose both:sunglasses:
Flopping would work for our guys. Duke does it 15 times a game, once you become known for flopping you influence the ref's. But I agree the game in the post is being called unlike any year before.
last year they needed OT to beat this team.
Bragg's foul trouble in the first half disrupted his flow. Self did say he had practiced really good leading up to the game. The fouls again are a concern. Although two of his calls were of the phantom kind. He played better in the 2nd half besides some misses, a lot of his issus are effort. He's playing aggressive in spurts and not all the time. He rebounds well for a few minutes span then disappears. Still young, and learning how to fit in this team.
Good discussion. Athletically I see BMac. Have to wait and see more games before I go any further.
Next year Vick could definitely be the "guy" offensively with Newman and whoever else is left. It's different when your the top scoring option as opposed to #4 or 5 on the scouting report.
For this years team if Vick continues to have games like this,only benefits the team even further. Which guard do you focus on, any one of them can have a game like he had last night.
So far Vick has exceeded my expectations as a rebounder, a defender, and chemistry within the offense. We were hoping he was going to get enough minutes this year to help us next year, he's already starting and leading the team in scoring for a game. Self was right, he looks like the most improved Jayhawk so far
@justanotherfan said:
My guess is that the following players test or declare:
Jackson (declare), Svi (test, unknown), Graham (test, likely declare), Vick (test, likely stay), Bragg (test, stay)
Sounds about right. Bragg definitely needs another year. Vick is critical to next years core
I brought up the Fool's Gold for fun. I did mention most of the 3's came off good passing and we know that most nights we are not going to shoot 14-26 especially away from home. LBSU definitely game-planned to clog the lane which they did pretty well for a small team. LBSU picked a poison and lost another way.
I thought it was encouraging to see a shooting night like that especially from Vick. Even Jackson made two of them.
He does attempt them but I can't think of any shot he's made that wasn't a dunk other than a up and under he had last night (which was a good move btw). Has he made a running hook yet? He'll get there
Surprised no one said anything. Shaka with another bad loss, now 3-3. Shooting woo's continue. UT controlled both half's. Problem is do you think Texas actually cares? They got a shiny new FB coach. Might be a while before the masses catch on
Doke is an exciting player. Rebounds well and moves very well for a footer. He's slightly ahead where I thought he would be at this stage. I'm pleased that he can be out there and impact the game enough right now to be a starter.
Honestly I don't see a NBA team gushing over him right now. Maybe in 2 years I could see it. Doke doesn't do anything offensively yet that will translate to the NBA. He still doesn't know what to do with the ball within 3 feet unless he's wide open and I keep waiting for him to use his power and athleticism to just dunk over people. He's in the infant stages on offense so far. I believe it will come so I'm not trying to be negative at all, just giving a fair opinion of where his game is.
He's got to improve his FT shooting, the coaches should look at his mechanics, because when he shoots you are not seeing a fluid motion at all. Often he seems rushed.
The good thing is he has picked up things fast, he's lost a lot of weight and is still adjusting to the speed of the game. He is the type that can improve game to game though which is a big plus for his future.
I would say yes to all of those questions. I've seen about half a dozen of Trae's games, most of them this past summer when he led the loaded Mokan team to a Peach Jam title. That team had Michael Porter Jr- top 5 kid we were after once and other multiple D-1 kids on the squad.
He's definitely a play-maker, actually that part of his game gets kind of unspoken about because of just how great of a shooter he is. Think Steph Curry range, release and precision. He can and will take ill-advised shots but what kid doesn't.
He is a leader, very good handles, can get where he wants at anytime. The knock on him is he is light and isn't an elite athlete and may struggle some as a freshman as a defender against more seasoned guards.
He can get where he wants though because he's quick. Has underrated floor vision and from the games I watched he was very good at making guys around him better- he got Porter Jr his shots and others quality looks. I would not worry with the ball in his hands.
One of the things that makes Trae unique for his 6'2 frame is that he can play both guard spots- we use Devonte in the same role, similar height. Both are not above the rim athlete's but get by with being really good at what they do.
As far as comps I would say he's Tyus Jones (Former Duke PG that led them to a title with Okafor) with in the gym range (like Steph Curry). I'm not saying he's as good as either player right now but the Jones comp (athletic ability, leadership, quickness, shooting) seem close.
We don't want this kid going somewhere else.
Games like last night, I'm sure scouts will be impressed with Vick. His shot looked great. Not just his scoring but he was the most active player on defense in the first half and one play on offense extended a play by coming out of no where for a tap rebound.
Just like Landen who took the starting spot and ran with it. Vick is doing that so far. Of course the competition hasn't been great so we'll have to wait to see what he does in Big-12 play but he's exciting to watch. He's what the 4th option on offense, crazy!
Vick and Jackson play with tremendous effort all game long. Really refreshing to see two guys that play the way they do