Nuleaf, I watched the live broadcast of the game and the original replay they had (from the base line camera) clearly shows Kane stepping on the side of his foot and it looked painful to watch. A lot of the replays I saw later (sports news) are from different cameras or have the score overlaid on the bottom portion of the screen and you can't really see well. The injury is real, how severe it is? I don't know, but I would guess he is having intense therapy today and it is probably painful.
JayHawkFanToo
13427 posts
You knew it would be a good game when Tarik came in and did not get his customary foul just for checking in.
You knew it would get better when Tarik did not get his fourth foul after 3 minutes in the court.
You knew it would be a great game when Tarik actually drew 2 charging fouls; who knew they still called charging fouls.
Are you writing off Tharpe ? You know he is only a Junior, right? Unless something dramatically changes and we ignore precedent, Tharpe will be the starting PG next season.
"And his suspension to start the season shows he makes bad decisions and was in the wrong place, wrong time" has a bad connotation.
Tharpe was suspended for playing a basketball game during the summer outside his geographical home area, something only the NCAA thinks is wrong.
Have you ever heard the expression:
Behind every successful man there is a woman.
Well, that's is the incomplete version. The full version goes something like:
Behind every successful man there is a woman who keeps telling him is doing it all wrong.
And no, I am not saying that this is the case with Coach Self and wife.
I am still having issues with IE11, particularly with the "Unread" tab. It will show the number of unread posts (say 4) but there are a lot more threads(say 12) shown in the page. I go though all of them and the count does not reset; it might display "4" but there are still 12 threads shown below. I can go to Recent and make sure there are no new post but the count will not update. I have tried all the usual refresh tricks with no luck. I do not have this problem when using an Android tablet and the issue seems to be specific to IE11. Since this is the latest version and Microsoft automatically upgrades you to, it would be good if the bugs could be ironed out.
I have been saying for a while that Perry should be playing the 3 and developing his long range game next year, since this is the position that he will likely play in the NBA.
I kind of like this one myself, although I had not seen the tweeter version:
Lots of re-tweets from KU players...and the picture are not bad either. Give it a try and thank me later :)
A student athlete can in fact retain an attorney for legal matters and many do, such as when they get a DUI or get caught doing something they should not be doing in the first place; there is absolutely no limits on that. Remember how many attorneys Brock Berglund had?
However, if they hire a sports agent to represent them in their sport, then they are no longer amateur and hence ineligible to compete in college sports. Even players considering entering the draft can always come back if they change their minds, provide they do not hire an agent; once they do is game over.
Top athletes have a lot more opportunities than the average student has, They can chose form literally hundreds of schools and whatever school they select, they do it knowing full well the advantages and disadvantages. The average student very seldom has this choice, If you are extremely gifted you might get scholarship offers but none are as good as the ones athletes get. Most student are limited to the state school or the one the parents can afford.
In short. athlete have a lot more options than the average student...and the average student is a lot lower maintenance than the average athlete, and actually has to pay to go to school.
I had not thought of that but you theory of having Bilas call the game and the excessive foul calling certainly has merit.
As I posted in another thread if this trio would have called the KU-Georgetown game, every player would have fouled out by half time.
Physical condition is not an issue; all top players are superior athletes and one summer with Andrea will take care of that.
As far As Selden, if he continues to play the way he did last night he will be gone after this season.
I was surprised with the way the game was called, OU was in the double bonus with more than 10 minute left on each half; not that they need it because they were great from the charity stripe. Even in the second half when I though OU had more fouls, suddenly they are in the double bonus and KU is not even in the bonus. Weird.
I kept thinking that if this crew would have called the KU-Georgetown game the game would have been stopped at half time because every eligible player would have fouled out; Tarik certainly would have been done with 18 minutes left n the first half. What is it about Tarik? It seem that the refs look at him and automatically call a foul.
Embiid's left eye looked quite swollen and it was obvious that he was not comfortable with the goggles. When he pulled them up to take free throws, he made them both.
I seriously doubt anybody in this forum thought your post was hilarious. I personally think it was disrespectful and puerile.
First, let's stop pretending that Student Athletes don't get paid; they do, very handsomely.
Here is an article from Forbes explain how much athletes really get:
Here is another one that outlines the money football players get paid every year:
How Much Football players get paid in cash ↗
Closer to home, the published cost to attend KU as an out of sate student is $32K which covers the tuition, room and board for 2 semesters. Now add Summer session and the figure becomes $45K. Now, the apartments players have are considerably nicer than those the average student gets; and the food is order of magnitude better and specially prepared for them under direct supervision of the training staff. Now we are close to $55K.
And we have not even began to address the cost of having the best coaching staff and the best trainer in the business; any one of us paying for that would be easily looking at $20k per year; so we are now at $75K per year. Assuming a student stays for 4 years, this translates to $300K or $375K if he stays 5 years like many do; this figure is considerably lower than the one Forbes came up with.
The student athlete can graduate with zero debt and having spent zero out of pocket money. How many of us can says we got those benefits? I certainly cannot.
Wigging is doing well on defense but on offense his progress has been slow. I believe it might have to do with his personality and no wanting to look like a prima donna ball hog, with the net result that he is way too deferential to other players at times when he should be more assertive and take over games. A couple of his turnover were something you could expect from a freshman playing his first or second college game, but not from a player of his stature 14 games into the season.
Maybe like Sampson, cutting his hair has sapped his strength; maybe he needs to grow it back.
@nuleafjhawk
I believe the "T" Coach Self got was the key; KU went on a 13-0 run after that and never looked back.
The best solution is the one proposed where a Committee of NBA managers select 5-10 players every year that are deemed ready for the NBA and they would be eligible to be drafted out of high school; the rest would have to wait until they are 3 years remove from high school before being eligible.
Not having the urgency of immediate playtime to prepare for the NBA, players would be more open to bide their time, polish their skill until they are eligible.
Yes, we would not see some of the super stars, but the teams, with the added experience would be much better and the level of play would be higher.
As I mentioned before, I believe that a 14-4 record will win the conference. To do this, KU must hold serve at home and win 5 out 9 games on the road.
Assuming KU wins out at home, the chances on the road are as follows:
Likely wins: TCU, TTU,WVU.
Can go either way: KSU, UT, OU
Likely loses: OSU, ISU, Baylor (if Drew gets suspended and an assistant coaches)
This is based on what I have seen the different teams do so far. Every game KU loses at home makes it that much more difficult. A win against OU would go a long ways towards improving the team's confidence.
I read sarcasm font just fine thank you very much. On a related note, when was your last prostate exam @JayHawkFanToo?
Not that long ago that I still remember. However, if you are volunteering your services, I will pass; I will stick with my lady doctor, less creepy that way.
@HighEliteMajor I agree with you. Mason has shown time and time again that he is ready for the big moments. He drove to the bucket and scored with time running out against Villanova, he nailed a clutch 3 against San Diego State, and above all, he has no fear. That's how you survive and advance in March.
Mason is not our best 3 point option, in fact he is probably the least desirable 3 point shooter. Yes, he made one against SDSU but I can assure you that it was not the shot Coach Self wanted taken.
The only problem I have with Mason is that he tends to hog the ball and take shots when he should be looking for a better option; a correctable flaw.
The best 3 point shooters in the team are Frankamp and Greene. They were part of 8 invited to the National 3 point championship and Frankamp won and Green placed 5th. Unfortunately, Frankamp shooting has not yet translated to the next level and Greene seems to have a standing reservation at the Doghouse Hotel.
I take it that MDs and theoretical physicists are not big on sarcasm...
@jaybate 1.0
I too grew up watching Coach Wooden's teams since 1970, so I witnessed a good part of his success. It was not until later that I found out about Sam Gilbert.
Once you find out about what went on at UCLA that Wooden turned a blind eye to, it puts his legacy in a different perspective. Saint John was not quite the saint he is portrayed as being.
Google "Sam Gilbert UCLA" and form you own opinion.
As bad as we think things are working out so far - and yes, I do not like how the season is going - let's keep things in perspective.
KU has 4 loses to 4 current top 15 teams by a combined total of 17 points. Again, 4 LOSES TO 4 TOP 15 TEAMS BY A COMBINED TOTAL OF 17 POINTs!!!
The Villanova and Colorado were decide by a long shot at the end of the game, and the SDSU went essentially down to the wire. Now, compared our schedule to currently #3 Ohio State who has yet to play a single Top 50 team. Yes, we have four loses and Ohio State has none, but come March, which team do you think will be better prepared to handle the competition? My gut and KU bias tell me that by that time, the players will have embraced Self-ball and will be playing at a much higher level.
When you look at the schedule and our player's inexperience, is the current 9-4 record really that surprising?
Wow, was I wrong on this one. I thought KU would have no problem scoring and the key would be defense. Defense was by and large not bad, although way too many put backs were allowed, but the offense was just nowhere to be found.
Sooner or later the team will start playing complete games when both the offense and defense show up; hopefully starting with conference play.
We need not be so fast to criticize Coach Self. None of us attend practice, none of us is aware of what happens behind closed doors, none of us know if any of the players have health or off the court issues; in fact, we pretty much know very little of what transpires with teams until the coaching staff deems necessary to disclose the information.
Coach Self has won more games than all of us could dream of winning combined. He has won with all types of players at 4 different schools, so he probably forgotten more about basketball than we all combined know, as Coach Bobby Knight would say. I am sure that Coach Self and the coaching staff go over the game plans and scouting report with a fine tooth comb and design a game plan, that depends on players executing it; he has done this hundreds of times and he has been very successful at producing wins. Why is it that we think that suddenly he has forgotten how to coach and feel like we need to tell him what to do? I am sure that he wants to win more than we do and every loss is a lot more painful to him than it is to us.
The main problem with this team appears to be that as soon as things don't go the way they planned, the they do not stick to the game plan and start to revert to their high school way of playing where they all were ubber-successful, of course the competition was not Mac Donald all-Americans but kids that worked at Mac Donald.
In a way it reminds me of a bowling class I took in College (yes, a PE class was required). I had played bowling on and off like most people and I could consistently score around 100. After the instructor taught me the proper technique, at first I could not score over 50 and I would try to return to the old ways where I was a lot more successful. The instructor insisted that I stick with the proper technique and by the end of the semester I had an average close to 200. Lesson learned.
Again, the new players are being asked to play a style different than the one they played in High School, where they were all the stars of their teams, and in most cases the starts of the conference, state or even the entire country. Coach Self system starts with defense, which for most of them is counterintuitive to what they know, and they have yet to embrace the system. In time they will come around and the level of play will go up dramatically. When you think of the '08 Championship team that played like a finely tuned German car, think of how rough they were a couple of years earlier before the co-opted Coach Self's system.
The one weakness I have noticed on this team that past teams did not have is that they do not have a sense of urgency, probably the result of the inflated opinion they have of their collective talent and the belief that talent alone can overcome the lack of 100% effort. Kentucky was much the same last year and ended up losing to Bobby MO in the NIT; maybe Coach Self could show them the tape of that game and hopefully ring a gigantic wake up call or else we might be asking Mr. Zenger to black out more games.
Again, this is my personal opinion and it is not meant to antagonize or criticize other posters. I am sure others look at the situation differently, and I respect that and then, as the reasonable adults we are, we just agree to disagree.
What happens if the San Diego-Cincinnati game goes long? Will we have to wait for it to end or will our region be switched to the basketball game?
"Laws are like sausages, it is better not to see them being made."
I believe the concept applies to college sports recruiting as well...
Even my son-in-law who is a huge MU fan thought some of the calls were..shall we say strange?
After the KSU win and other close conference games yesterday, for all of you older classic movie fans, Margo Channing (Bette Davis) called the Big 12 (from the great beyond) and left this message:
"Fasten your seat belts. It's going to be a bumpy ride."
P.S. Full disclosure requires me to say that the original quote used "night" instead of "ride."
I have no doubt that KU will be able to score; however, the main question is if it will allow SDSU to control tempo and score of turnovers, and I believe that this stat will dictate how the game develops.
20+ turnover - Loss
15 turnovers - Close game
10 turnovers - Win
5 turnovers - Comfortable win
@jaybate 1.0
I love Danny Manning the player; in my opinion, only Wilt was a better player than Danny at KU and Danny has the title Wilt could not get.
The questions is: Does the proverbial Peter's principle apply to him? Has Danny in fact reached his level of incompetence after being very successful at the lower level?
We all know that he was very successful player in the NBA, and his knees, rather than his talent is what kept him from being a true superstar. At KU he worked with the bigs, although I have never read anything that indicates he was the only coach working with the bigs; his reputation is more related to - he played as a big in the League, he must be coaching the bigs at KU - rather than factual evidence to that effect. Apparently Coach Roberts is working with the bigs now and if we can measure success by the bigs progress, particularly Embiid this year and Whitey the year before, he is doing a heck of a job.
This begs the question, is Danny better as an assistant/position coach than he is a head coach? If you look at the NBA and college, the bulk of successful coaches played guard or SF in college or the NBA. Many bigs including Kareem and yes, Wilt, tried their hand at coaching and the only somewhat successful HC I can think of is Jeff Ruland that had some good years and others not so good. A few bigs, like Ewing, have stuck around as assistant coaches but have not been able to make the jump to the top position.
The majority of coaches played guard or small forward in college/NBA and perhaps, being the director/general on the floor translates better to being a head coach, where being a more specialized position player, i.e. "big" does not. A couple of players transferred out of Tulsa when he was hired, so obviously his reputation was of little or no consequence.
I truly wish Danny success and hopefully he can turn the Tulsa program around. There is a lot of competition in Oklahoma with 2 powerhouse programs, OU and OSU, and another major competitor in Oral Roberts. Compare this with other states like Missouri with almost twice the population and only one major university and other than Saint Louis, just a few inconsequential mid-majors. I know that recruiting is not restricted to in-state players, but you have to attract the better local and regional players before you can go after top national players.
Unlike football, with its complement of 80+ players, a basketball program can be turned around in less time. It is still a little early to judge how Danny's tenure at Tulsa will eventually work out, but progress needs to be shown in the nears future to indicate that long term success is indeed feasible. In today's environment of immediate gratification, patience is a virtue that is in short supply, both with program administrators and fans alike.
@jaybate 1.0
Snopes is full of stories that someone initially and incorrectly reported and soon the story gets quoted all over as being true. I read before that Lindsay did not have any Division 1 offers and apparently the writer did too and was too lazy to check the facts; obviously the Newspaper's fact checker must have been busy that day as well. You have to admit their story is more entertaining than the factual story, and interesting stories sell papers.
SDSU has been a program on the rise and so has Long Beach State and Coach Self has always tried to schedule a game or two in Southern California against decent competition. Long Beach State came to AFH a couple of years ago and a return game is probably in the future. With the demise of the hardwood series between the Big 12 and the PAC 10, scheduling SDSU seems like a sound decision and consistent with KU and Coach Self philosophy. This explanation is as or more plausible than the conspiracy put forward by the SD Union, but not nearly as sexy. wouldn't you agree?
You hear about this type of allegations all the time but most prove not true. If there was any evidence of misconduct the NCAA would be all over it. Even Coach Self is not big enough to deflect an investigation of this magnitude, and the NCAA would love to nail KU like it did after the 1988 Championship season for what could be considered minor violations.
The main flaw in the story is that Lindsay had no Division 1 offers; in fact, he had signed with Texas Tech and de-committed from them and also visited Marquette before signing with KU.
With an error that big, the story folds like a cheap suit.
I also watched the OSU-MU game. Was it just me or did it look like several plays that could have been reviewed and would have favored OSU were not reviewed, particularly the pass interference towards the end of the game that would have given OSU a first down? On the other hand, every play that could have helped MU was reviewed and ruled in favor of MU, including calling an OSU TD back.
Maybe it is just my anti-MU bias, but the refereeing seemed one- sided; they indicated that it was the head ref. last game. Looks like our neighbors to the East have learned from their new SEC brethren how to grease a few palms :)
I agree with you on Mason. Sometime we forget that he has played only handful of games and is still trying to figure out the game at this level.
Mason is fast and quick but speed for the sake of speed is not always a good thing. I remember freshman Sherron flying to the other end of the court only to find himself trapped on the base line. Senior Sherron played under control with much better results. In time, Mason will learn to plays smart and with his quickness, take advantage of the new contact rules; he might end up being one of the better if not the bets penetrator we have had at KU.
There are only 3 "experts." The top table is against the spread and 2 out of 3 pick SDSU. No surprise there since most think it will be a close game. The bottom table is straight up and all 3 picked KU.
Do you still write checks? I don't believe I have written one in a couple of years; all electronic transfers, credit cards or PayPal.
The $180M figure has been widely discredited as being completely and utterly unrealistic. Not even established megastars like Jordan or Tiger Woods get that kind of money.
Wiggins initial contract will likely be one order of magnitude less and the second will be considerably larger, depending on how he performs in the NBA and how marketable he is.
having said that, I will state that both Wilt and Robertson would be in my list of 5 top all time players.
Would you put Jordan and Abdul-Jabar in the top 5 as well?
If so, who is #5?
If they make it just 4 games for second offense it would be way to obvious why. I wonder it they will wait to see if the DA will prosecute before assessing a suspension.
Question, would Colorado player be arrested for having pot, now that it is legal in that state? Will this be considered and impermissible benefit by the NCAA?
Apparently it is Stevie Clark's second offense this season, so it is fair to assume he will be suspended for more than the 4 games he was suspended for the first one.
In all fairness, with the current rules, Releford would have likely fouled out In most games by half time; although he is a smart player and would have (hopefully) adapted to the new rules.
Oklahoma State guard Stevie Clark arrested for pot possession, apparently the second time this season...
Add Michael Cobbins loss and OSU fortunes took a big hit. Saturday's game at KSU will be interesting, since the Wildcats have been playing decently lately.
The Big 12 is going to be tough this season, 2 top 10, 4 top 16 and 3 other teams getting votes. This is 70% of the teams in the conference getting votes. I cannot think of any other conference with is this much talent top to bottom.
Is Julia Hudy Andrea Hudy's sister?
I am sure that when you write about Charlie Weiss your are referring to Charlie Weis, right?
Is Mike Kruschevsky related to Mike Krzyzewski also known as Coach K?
...jus jacking with you wissoxfan83, no malice intended...
The problem with Xavier Henry was not that he could not handle not being the best player; he was not the best player or the second best or even third best at KU and he did just fine. The problem he had was being drafted by the Grizzlies who refused to pay the bonus all lottery picks get and then, his agent and father managed to have him not play in the summer league, the one place where rookies are evaluated and earn playing time; further, an injury ended what was left of hi initial season and he was never able to get in sync with management and coaching personnel. New Orleans was much of the same and he was released at the end of his contract. He was fortunate that he Lakers picked him up and now he is finally showing the potential we saw flashes of during his short stay at KU. He might not be a superstar but he seems to be in a path to a solid NBA career.
If anything, Henry has been a level headed athlete that has stayed put of trouble and has returned often to Lawrence, has been proud and loyal Jayhawk and a good representative of the program.
@jaybate 1.0
Selden is the player that can best match physically with Smart; I expect him to play until he fouls out.
Self has always liked a 7-8 player rotation, and statements to the contrary early in the season notwithstanding, he seems headed in that direction. Again, no big surprise.
I feel your pain. If you call Surewest, their initial recording now has a message about not having the KU games available; I imagined they have been flooded with calls. I talked to them anyway and they indicated that they are still negotiating to have the games on but they do not have a target date. I am going to guess that the fees have gone up with the expectation that enough fans will complain and will place cable provider in an untenable situation. This used to be called blackmail and was against the law and KU's Athletic Department is smack in the middle of it.
I have now figured out how to get one of the streamed ESPN3 broadcast via one of the many European feeds (don't download any plugins and be very careful with viruses) although the quality is normally subpar.
When it comes to Mr. Zenger, the expression...many levels above an atomic wedgie,,, comes to mind.
Coach Self has always said that his goal is to have a 7-8 player rotation by conference time. At the beginning of the season he mentioned that with all the talent available and the new contact rules, he might play more players; however, he is quickly reverting to the format that has served him well in the past. No big surprise there.
This was very good game for KU. Toledo is a very solid and experienced team that came to play and not lay down and play dead. They had a good game plan and they were successful in disrupting the Jayhawks and creating turnovers. Ultimately KU's talent prevailed despite the many flaws.
The bad things - Like the game at Florida, way too many turnovers. Some were unforced due to lack of concentration, other were due to overconfidence where they were surprised by Toledo players playing hard the full court; this is the one situation that I imagine had Coach Self upset. Defense could have been better particularly when Toledo scored closed to the basket over KU's height; however, some of the shots had a high degree of difficulty and still went in; they also shot lights out from the 3, at least until they got tired and started missing. KU played 6 players over 20 minutes and 3 others less than 10 minutes each, which means the rotation is slowly getting set but having so many quality players available must be comforting.
The good - The offense seem to be coming along. Wiggins is becoming more assertive and at times he was dominant. Tharpe found his 3 point stroke and this is really good news; on the other hand Mason seems to have lost his and driving to the basket seems to be the best option for him. As long as KU faces zones Tharpe is going to be the man.
All in all, good preparation for a tougher, #21 San Diego State next Sunday.
@jaybate 1.0
...so, you have to pay to play and then play the odds, count cards or have an ace up your sleeve...or maybe have just plain dumb luck.