@cragarhawk Both of those mind-halves are taking me off to bed! Nite!
mayjay
7180 posts
The coolest thing about the entire night was seeing how both our offense and defensive efforts fed into and reinforced each other.
Astounding defensive play by Mason on his steal of the inbounds pass leads to a step back 3 by DG--shades of Sherron '08 (except SC got the ball back and made the 3 himself).
@approxinfinity He was simply stating a fact, which sounded like a depressingly negative prediction when it was really just a conditional "if....then." Not necessarily predictive, just sort of morose analysis perhaps.
Of course, you can reply in kind from a more optimistic perspective: "If we play the entire tourney like we did in the last ten minutes, we will never lose." Also a fact!
@approxinfinity said:
So you see, it’s a holy war.
And it can be fun when people give information to support their thought. But, when two or more fans of opposite belief sets just ruin an entire thread for everybody by doing nothing else but sniping and name-calling, it is more of an a--holey war.
@justanotherfan
Now, don't get all sensible on us. Don't you know that whether a coach is any good depends only on whether he has at some point pissed us off?
If I felt about college basketball the way @jaybate-1.0 does, even if he just thinks engineering is a possibility, I would never watch it again. What would be the point?
@HawkChamp said:
2013
And what if EJ doesn't have the absolutely most idiotic mind cramp in the history of sports by poking Michigan's big guy in the bits?
@JayHawkFanToo said:
there is no question that most if not everybody that participated in that thread felt the same way
I have literally never seen a game thread on this Board where the majority of posts thought the refs were not screwing KU.
@Jayrawks1 Joel has stated that is very unhappy that the 76ers stated publicly that his knee was day-to-day while telling him it was going to be at least a 4-5 game hiatus.
No doubt to keep ticket sales up.
@RockChalkinTexas I am pretty sure we need to get you involved in recruiting. You seem to have been able to get everyone signed!
@JayHawkFanToo I remember watching it and thinking the refs favored whichever team was going toward the end of the court that Wisconsin was going to in the first half, and Duke was going to in the second half.
@BShark said:
Milton Doyle
Hmmmm....idle thought while waiting for Senior Night....I occasionally wonder if HEM kept up his BFF pen-pal realtionship with Milton's brother?
@nuleafjhawk said:
@drgnslayr I think we will be saying goodbye to Josh when he is a senior.
I wish
I hope we aren't saying goodbye when he is on Spring Break.
1 RPI
1 AP
1 USA Today (coaches)
1 CBS Power Rankings
1 College Basketball Talk (NBC)
1 Bleacher Report
9 ESPN BPI
@HawkChamp said:
@jaybate-1.0 its the refs! Its the refs! Never the players! Lol Come on, sounds like what I hear from the cryclone fans. Was it the refs in 2013? In 2011? I think we know the answer.
It is always the refs, don't you know? You left out 2003. At the horrible rate we were making free throws, the refs screwed us by not engineering increasing the # of fouls called on Syracuse to about 34 so we could catch up. (Sarcasm font!)
@drgnslayr A hurt thumb is a big deal for a big with a history of comparative inability to hold onto the ball in a crowd. One out of 4 fingers might be no big deal, but there is only one thumb on each hand. If it ain't working, evolution on the unique human grip is set back a couple million years for that hand.
@mayjay Update: 247 has us as warm, along with other blue bloods plus local school Clemson. Cool on S Carolina. Happens a lot with upstate kids.
Does anyone with access to the recruiting sites know anything about whether Zion Williamson is actually considering us? I don't recall anyone here mentioning him but he is Rivals #2 in 2018 class, and sites indicate we have offered. He is a junior here in SC, and the local paper has twice written him up as a major force of the future. I am sure Frank Martin is salivating, and Roy, too.
And then the other day there was this:
http://www.goupstate.com/sports/20170225/zion-williamson-scores-51-as-spartanburg-day-earns-repeat ↗
@BeddieKU23 We have pretty much been on eggshells all conference season!
@BShark Spying helps.
@Texas-Hawk-10 said:
People were screaming for blood after Self got eliminated in the 1st round twice in a row
More recently, some people were screaming for blood because he went 4 years in a row without a FF.
@Texas-Hawk-10 said:
he probably does know much more about this situation than we do.
....or (hopefully) much more than some random fan at a Texas game.
If it were really really bad, that would implicate the whole program. Would the guy still go to an away game?
I might have missed it, but was that the only game in which the announcers haven't mentioned Bragg's paraphernalia issue? I wonder if Dave had been warned by producers not to bring it up? Bill might have gone FULL Monty in protest!
@autohawk ...go in with them knowing who we are....
BWKU!
@Blown No way. Still deserved to be considered. Win? Maybe not.
@Crimsonorblue22 posted: "Bruce Weber says nobody is critical of his job performance except for media at press conferences."
Rumor has it Sean Spicer has recently been auditioning for a gig as Squeaker's spokesman.
@drgnslayr Not only do we not know the complete story, the freakin' case hasn't even gone to arraignment, let alone been adjudicated! The modern version of lynching is the internet demand for punishment.
One poster here said when this stuff first surfaced that "the facts don't matter" because we should punish them because we have been so humiliated. And another says Devonte getting arrested justifies suspension regardless of any explanation he could possibly have.
Now those are well-reasoned responses to a difficult situation.
Okay, sermons are over. People who want to bail can bail. I won't, not without more.
@dylans Maybe to elChicken for playing a KU fan? Oh wait, his performance didn't convince anyone....
@DoubleDD NBA took Hield much higher after 3rd and 4th year than they would have after 2. DG could raise his stock to first rd if he shows ability to score by going for 18-19 sr year, in combo with his proven handles. And he can improve those handles, too.
@Crimsonorblue22 said:
@ralster Wiggs and cole
And Cole is one of the other guys (with Sherron) from '08 who will have his jersey retired, hinted by HCBS as next year. Besides bb accolades, was Academic All American of the Year.
@Blown Apologies. Ignorant wasn't describing you. I meant Justice is not to be uninformed of the character of the people appearing in the dock.
@stoptheflop They no doubt had to work really hard to figure out where he would be at 12:30 a.m. after his birthday and sent out the warrant-SWAT team to find the fugitive who had eluded authorities successfully for a year! It took the FBI 16 years to finally track down that other famous fugitive, Whitey Bulger. No doubt DG moved up the list and no one had any idea where to find him.
More likely, he got pulled over for a ticket or warning and running his license revealed a bench warrant. Routine.
As to contacting the Athletic Dept, there I disagree. Not a high school student. Kid is 22 that night. You go directly to an adult, not their boss, or coach. No "in loco parentis."
@Blown said:
Let's cut to the chase: when you perform on the court, you get a longer leash. For those that support justice, that is the hardest part to accept.
I think people, having effed up, who demonstrate that they are bearing down on their responsibilities are always treated more leniently for minor offenses. Go to some bail/bond hearings and see how often having a job with a boss coming in to testify about good character results in the judge giving people a break.
Justice is supposed to be blind, not ignorant.
@HawkChamp said:
He did pay KU a compliment the other day. He said that he was watching some of our games and thought they were a really good team.
Nice it filtered into his fog! Where can I find a job somewhere paying thousands of dollars per year to come up with incisive thoughts like that to say about a team that is the winner of a hard conference, ranked no. 3 (soon, likely 2), and has the leading POY candidate?
@Blown said:
@mayjay are you suggesting he won't be charged with the misdemeanor crime of property damage? If he is charged and convicted are you suggesting JJ punishment shouldn't be in line with similar infractions from current and past players ?
Not entirely, but I am saying that the process shouldn't be accelerated to suspension just because Josh is OAD. If the police hadn't taken so long,the charges could have been leveled in early January, and that would have left a lot of time for arraignment and possible resolution by plea or diversion.
I do think diversion is a realistic possibility for any non-sexual-assault misdemeanor. And the time it has been percolating could play a factor in whether the prosecutor thinks JJ is a good candidate.
As @Crimsonorblue22 pointed out, the difference between this and Bragg's quick suspensions could be the existence of prior issues with Bragg. And remember, his first puublic instance was an assault charge. Even though dropped, it came out there was a September incidence investigated as well. So the drug charge was a 2nd or 3rd strike (depending on if you count the dropped charges as either nothing because exonerated, or something, because it was avoidable trouble), meriting a quick suspension until resolved by the diversion decision. Josh's is the first.
Remember, we don't know when these things were brought to Self. If JJ and Vick went directly to him, a few points on their side for candor. We only know when they went public. I am surprised we never got rumors since last year of Vick's alleged assault, and that last semester's events all came out so long after the fact. Has the Board lost our inside contacts in the student body?
Finally, the big elephant in the room looming over everything is the rape investigation, even though arguably people have compiled timelines suggesting that no KU player could have been the perp. But that is the thing that has caused most people around the country to start believing the worst. It is guilt by association.
I just think we don't impose more drastic punishments for events prior to that because of getting fed up from hearing about it.
@HighEliteMajor I don't believe we know enough about any of it to make a firm conclusion. We have no clue, but you are making some condemnations with little evidence other than some news reports. If you know what really happened, either this incident's particulars, or how Self handled all of them from September 2015 to now, then you should enlighten us.
In the meantime, that is why the word "trust" gets used. Faith based on a lifetime of demonstrated good character. If information comes forward that he has violated his or KU's values, there will be more than enough time to light him up.
As for Graham, have you wondered how many people could technically get arrested for driving to the DMV to get a DL renewed? I came back with an expired license (7 mos) to Kansas from school out of state, and they just laughed when I worred about it, and gave me a renewal. His explanation makes sense. The "no-excuse/suspend him" approach makes no sense for this apparently unintentional violation, which I chose not to even count in my list on another thread.
@jayballer54 Vick and the woman should have had mutual restraining orders.
@drgnslayr said:
It isn’t common for the DA to knock down a felony slamdunk to a misdemeanor the way they did it.
Let's call it "a very close friend's son" and his buddy found another guy's mother's purse in a car. They took the credit cards and went on a crime spree. Bought gas, bought hundreds of dollars in clothes, thought they had been really clever.
The deputy investigating the incident went to the other kid's house and the kid denied everything. He went to "my friend's" house. (We will pretend I heard this from someone and wasn't there, but then we also have to pretend I didn't dragged him aside and tell him his entire future depended on the next few minutes). The son admitted everything and said where the booty was hidden. The deputy left saying he would refer the case to the local prosecutor.
Later, the deputy reported that the charges identified as possible included some 6 felonies for identity theft, forgery, false presentation of a credit card, god knows what else, plus over a dozen misdemeanors for theft of the stuff bought with stolen cards. All a clear slam dunk, with video and a confession.
He called back later and said that the prosecutor decided not to press charges. The reason was how impressed the deputy was with the kid's remorse and honesty (and no doubt with a parent who--ahem--might have been there). All the stolen stuff was recovered. The other kid was sent to JD.
We later had the deputy take our little miscreant through a booking process. Everything must have worked. He has gone from uncharged felon to being first a state correctional officer to now being a federal law enforcement officer. (And he, by the way, credits a certain warning he got for helping to turn him around.)
My point is that prosecutors sometimes exercise discretion. They can even give a nobody teenager a break. Giving a break to a celebrity should be the same as anyone else, without everybody crying favoritism.
When was the last felony conviction imposed for car damage in a single incident?
As I count it, there are 3 players who have been implicated in a total of 5 incidents this and last year. Three for Bragg, two for Vick, with one of his overlapping with JJ's.
That is not "this team" nor is it KU. This is 3 out of 15 guys. I have seen posts earlier from people saying they are embarrassed to wear their t-shirts. Don't generalize that all of our guys have been involved in malicious or questionable behavior. That isn't fair to the good guys on the team, the ones who do uphold the classy behavior we want and hope for--the ones who represent us well. Yes, this stuff is impossible to defend, but the program ain't sliding into Hell.
We just had more guys make Academic All Big 12 than have been implicated in this crap. We can look with open eyes at the bad, but don't stop being aware of the praiseworthy.
@Kcmatt7 When it takes the police two and one-half months to investigate a damaged automobile, it is probably acceptable for a seven week delay to get into court. Especially if the prosecutor uses potentially dropping the charges as a bait to encourage a civil settlement.
@KUSTEVE Well, it was a Ford Focus. Let's see, new tail light plus one door equals $3,000. At this a la carte menu rate, the 4 doors and 2 tail lights, plus 2 headlights say, would add up to $12,000. The top of the line Platinum with $2K in high tech options went for $26,000. Good thing no mechanical systems-cheap little things like engine or transmission--were involved. And that they didn't total the car--base starts at $18,000.
Now, if it was the $35 grand sports car model of the focus, well, ahem, the damages could really add up.
@HighEliteMajor Reading the article sounds like there were other perps who also may have done the rest of the damage. In any event, I'm not sure where your hostility comes from. People negotiate disputes down from initial demands all the time if that is what happened.
@HawkChamp Victims can be witnesses, too. Interestingly, way back in English common law they eliminated the "he said/she said" quandry by ruling that victims could not be witnesses. That rule went out about the same time as the Dodo bird or even earlier.
Bottom line: Third party witnesses don't matter. Especially if the victim witness's story is first, credible, and second, corroborated by other facts (eg., damage to the car; alleged perp seen in the vicinity; altercation preceding incident; etc.).
What hasn't been brought up is that this happened the same night as, and a few blocks away from, Bragg's stairway event. Related? Or just a really freakin' bad KU night?
@jaybate-1.0 And he increasingly sounds like a rabid Tasmanian Devil.
Blair Kerkoff has a nice retrospective ranking the 13 conference championships. What struck me in reading it is that (assuming FM gets it this year) KU has dominated the league while only having the Big 12 MVP 4 times.
http://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/blair-kerkhoff/article134454894.html ↗
@BeddieKU23 If I used drugs, I might prefer Walton, but I'd rather have Bilas.
By the way, Rob Dauster's Colloege Basketball Talks weekly podcast had a guy on today who used to work for ESPN. He is convinced by the way the reporter kind of hemmed and spelled her way through "sucked" that she was, let's say, presenting alternate facts so as to not upset the bigwigs at Disney.
Perhaps the word was said but more as a request or perhaps a demand? The imagination can run amok with the various expressions that might have been used. Remember the football scene in the movie MAS*H (1970) where our hero docs concoct a scheme to provoke the big guy who is just devastating them into chasing one of their little guys all over the field so he is ejected?
@HighEliteMajor I would actually agree with you in almost everything you post. As everyone knows, Lord Mayjay is the Defender of Decorum, ad nauseam.
Except for the sense I get that you perhaps think people here are defending the chant or something like that because of past posts dissing coaches, or schools. I think people are saying these things happen. No, the coach shouldn't be treated that way. But, since it happens in 95% of arenas, then, yes, Pitino is expected to be above the fray, as is every competitor. It is pretty irrelevant what the chant is, or whether it is ridiculously inaccurate as you posit.
I have heard the BS chant at KU games directed to the refs, and my memories take me back to the mid-70s when we yelled it then. The treatment of refs everywhere is what I deplore--but that comes from a career of being the guy in the middle of highly charged disputes with everyone hating that guy.
@Lulufulu said:
He has won how many hundreds of games?
Officially 101 less than he thinks, and in reality 101 more than the NCAA thinks.