I hate that call against Young. There's no way that dude was set.
wissox
13106 posts
Wondering if I'll keep my tradition of getting the first game of the tournament wrong ruining my chances of a perfect bracket 1 game into it?
@dylans I've gotten the same way. When the Jayhawks (or in most years the Badgers) lose, I'm about done. I've not even watched the semifinals the past few years except for a few minutes. I still watch the final but kind of bitterly!
Best snow storm in history happened in 1997 near Madison where I was living at the time. About 15 inches fell Thursday into Friday on the first two days of the tourney. School called off. KIds were young enough that they didn't care if I hogged the TV all day. My wife may have minded a little bit though! Of course the strange and horrific end to the season a week later took all the shine off of those two glorious days.
Nice thread. I think there's an assistant out there who would fill in nicely, just like Roy did. Got to find him though first. I have no clue who.
@BShark I've got a friend whose grandson plays for Marquette, Sam Hauser. Makes me kind of a marquette fan. His other grandson is going there next year.
Syracuse winning helps our RPI or strength of schedule or something right? Maybe they'll give us an easier 16 seed.
Is the bed and breakfast at your house? :) Sounds like a fun day. Who plays in it? When is it? Are the players current college guys?
Gunman said:
wissox said:
I even picked the Jayhawks to win it in 1989 so you know who I've got.
We would have won if they'd let us in!
Actually that was probably about the weakest KU team that I remember since I came to KU in 85!
@dylans IDK! Hows that for an answer! I think you nailed it when you said the skills are varied, more than ability to run, jump, etc.
@dylans I think all DI athletes are elite. I really do. If you compared them to the general population especially, then I think they're elite. Now I know there's some degrees of elite, but in general there's no difference. They're all athletic enough to run and jump out of the gym, short, tall, makes no difference.
BShark said:
@wissox SEC teams almost always have great athletes. I think that's the crux of it. I have UK in the FF and Florida in the EE. I won't be tricked again.
That comment irks me a bit. Great athletes abound in all our major conferences. If I had a dollar for every time I heard the comment Wisconsin wins despite not being very athletic. These kids are elite athletes! They're fast, can jump, have great ball skills, they're tremendous! That's all, rant over! Carry on!
@Texas-Hawk-10 You know what burns me every year in my picks? I undervalue the SEC and then they go and put 3 in the elite 8 when I might have 1 get that far, and I, of course, over value the big12 and big 10. I've done the same again. Got all 4 big 10 teams getting to the Sweet 16 which realistically could happen, and I'm gleefully eliminating SEC teams.
I just saw a list on Yahoo ranking all 68 teams. Virginia (list was made before Hunters injury) and Nova were their top 2 then Duke, MSU, and us! It's the 2nd very similar list I've seen. I'm really glad we're not on the 2 line in this region as that would be a super tough region. But having to play either Duke or MSU is a bit of a break. I don't think we overlook them like maybe we overlooked our elite 9 opponents the last two years. I think we play that game (and we really should get there) with laser sharp focus. That's why I've got KU in the final four, and of course winning it.
@Texas-Hawk-10 Although I don't like Cincy, I agree with your other picks.
I even picked the Jayhawks to win it in 1989 so you know who I've got.
Virginia just lost their 6th man to injury. I guess he's pretty important to their team.
It's interesting to read this post and come home this evening and turn on the TV and see UCLA struggling to beat St. Bonaventure in the play in game. It would be a very sad day in Jayhawk Nation the day we're in the play in game.
!0_1520995374624_Championships-since-1965-640x356.jpg ↗ This was my original reason for hating ESPN. When they had this on Sportscenter, they actually tried to say they didn't snub the White Sox, they were just putting championships people cared about.
@mayjay Let's hope we can watch the Final Four with our announcers. It was really great when I could do that with Wisconsin a few years back.
@Texas-Hawk-10 That team actually started the season 15-2 and went 9-8 to finish the season. One really good 17 game stretch and one really bad 17 game stretch. One of those losses was probably the worst i remember since being at KU. 86-53 at OSU. No shame in losing at OSU, but ouch, what a beatdown that was.
@Texas-Hawk-10 Ok, I guess regular season only was 27-7? I got that record from the link I used above. When I said it might have been a tv matchup, it was because if they had to match us with anyone it might as well have been Duke. I don't remember the game much, but we lost by 5, so we were competitive.
Here's the box score with the apparent Duke whistle.
https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/boxscores/2000-03-19-duke.html ↗
That team started 3 freshmen in Kirk, Gooden and Collison. What a trio they grew into!
@JayHawkFanToo I edited my post above to that comment. I think what I wrote bears some merit.
@JayHawkFanToo First off, I'm not whining about playing Penn. 2nd, every time we play out of state, but nearby like St. Louis, Omaha, or OKCity it sounds like a home game for us. Our fans travel well. The point of my post was more for the sake of the fans being able to travel, not the teams. Sure there might be some locals who might buy tickets because they like hoops and then cheer against us. But in North Carolina, in any location they play, there's probably a lot of Duke haters because they're fans of the other ACC teams in that state. And they're rabid haters too. When we play in OK, those fans who might hate KU are few because they really care way more about football than basketball.
And yes there is a narrative, because I hear it constantly from KU fans. Duke and UNC get to play virtual home games every year. I think I proved this is not true. They, like us, get to play close to home because, like you point out, get high seeds, and because our fans travel well. We're one of the privileged teams. We all receive the same treatment more or less equally.
BeddieKU23 said:
approxinfinity said:
Well I guess Michigan would face either SD St or Houston in Omaha. Of all the pods only the Midwest seems to have pods that are regionally appropriate. Based on locations, Wichita, Omaha and San Antonio is fantastic for us.
Xavier, for a one seed didn't get jack. Nashville Tenn, Los Angeles, San Antonio.
Wisconsin's final four years they had to go west for the regional and play Arizona in LA both times, once as a 1 seed, once as a 2 seed. Someone's always going to have to travel west, but the pods keep them closer to home.
In my analysis of where teams play on the other thread I notice one year Duke was a 1 seed and given a Houston regional. Having lived in the south, I learned how big the South is. Louisiana where we lived is as close or closer to Chicago than Miami. Durham to Houston can't be done in a day of driving. It's 1200 miles!
As for FF picks, probably not going to do one this year. (minor rant here) ESPN lets you make a bunch of brackets and I don't have much interest in competing against someone who makes 6 or 8 brackets and then brags when they get the best bracket! Just a preference really.
@DanR I've heard people make comments almost every year saying Duke and UNC always get to play in NC. I've countered that it's not true and that KU has the same advantage in the tourney. I'm sure there's a lot of teams through the years that have grumbled (like might happen this year that they have to play KU within a 3-4 hour drive of Lawrence while fans of MSU, Duke, Auburn, Clemson, Seton Hall, etc. are driving pretty far or having to fly to Wichita or Omaha)
Thanks for adding up those miles. I think it proves us both correct and I would say that KU plays in a far less populated state with fewer D1 programs and arenas so there's few options for us to play in Kansas. IF there were, I'd imagine we'd get the same privilege that Duke and UNC have.
@BeddieKU23 You're asking me to do this for UNC? A little unclear on your post, but I will when I get home.
DanR said:
@wissox I don't have a narrative in this. I was just curious about other teams and thought maybe you had a place to easily get the info.
Whether playing within a four hour drive in a beige midwest city vs. a 3 hour charter flight to a more exciting place is easier on the team is an interesting idea. We've had a nice situation for fan travel for sure, but I'm not convinced it's better than for any other team seeded 1-2 for the past couple decades.
Here's an easy to use link:
@JayHawkFanToo I'm really looking at it from the distance travelled standpoint. We've had the obvious advantage. But again, don't let the facts ruin your narrative!
Duke this year, Pittsburgh, (about 500 miles) then Omaha
2017 Duke Greenville SC then NY
2016 Duke Providence, RI then Anaheim
2015 Charlotte, then Houston
2014 Raleigh (the infamous Mercer loss)
2013 Philadelphia, then Indianapolis
2012 Greensboro (the infamous Lehigh loss)
2011 Charlotte, Anaheim
I could go on, but you see, they haven't been blessed with as favorable of first round sites as we have.
@DanR I could, but it might ruin yours or others narrative. I did a few years back and it showed that if Duke gets a sub regional in NC, then UNC has to go somewhere else, therefore, we get more games close to home than either UNC or Duke. The pod system changed . that a bit. When I get some time, I'll do it.
mayjay said:
Blue blood criteria (mayjay definition): Multiple titles, at least 10 F4s, at least 30 NCAA appearances, at least 15 conference titles (at least 2 before 1939), at least 15 All Americans, at least two Hall of Fame coaches, and numerous players on any All-Time Best 100 College Players.
One or more criterion can be missed if another is way beyond the minimum.
You missed founder of basketball coached at school, have an historic old fieldhouse, not a mall park, have an ancient cheer, has a history linked to the winning side in the civil war.
Keep going, I think we could whittle it down to we're the only true blueblood.
Maybe I can go back further, but as a geography person, this stuff is interesting. Mileage is to first round site.
2017 1 Tulsa, then KC 221 miles
2016 1 Des Moines, then Louisville 233 miles
2015 2 Omaha 210 miles
2014 2 St. Louis 290 miles
2013 1 Kansas City, then Arlington Tex 40 miles
2012 2 Omaha, then St. Louis, then NOLA 210 miles
2011 1 Tulsa then San Antonio 221 miles
2010 1 OK City (dang, that team was 32-2) 317 miles
2009 3 Minneapolis, Indianapolis 475 miles
2008 Omaha, Detroit, Then San Antonio! 210 miles
2007 1 Chicago, then San Jose 549 miles
2006 4 Detroit 803 miles
2005 3 Oklahoma City 317 miles
2004 4 KC then St. Louis 40 miles
2003 2 Oklahoma City, Anaheim, then NOLA 317 miles
2002 1 St. Louis, Madison, Atlanta 251 miles
2001 4 Dayton, San Antonio 638 miles
2000 8 Winston Salem (played Duke 2nd round, we had 7 losses got an 8th seed) 1006 miles
Analysis:
The committee has been pretty kind to Kansas. The pod system has helped of course, and being a high seed has also helped a lot obviously. But we have little to complain about. It's a great show of respect to Kansas to be given close by first and second round sites.
The last trip for KU in early round games that was more than an easy drive was Chicago or Detroit.
Interesting that in 2000 we had 7 losses and got an 8 seed. NCAA went for the TV matchup and gave us Duke which I'm pretty sure they complained about. Interestingly to me at least is that another 8 seed made the final four that year, Wisconsin, and got Roy's ire when they played the Spartans in the final four and the teams combined for 40 points in the first half.
It's a little disturbing that given the proximity of these sites we haven't gone deep into the tourney more often. Wichita and then Omaha should give us some advantage, but last year teaches that always doesn't work out.
@Crimsonorblue22 Free enterprise at its best. Is it at the same arena Witchita plays their home games?
How does this work? Will Wichitans (wichitanians, Witchitites, Wichitarians, or witches?) show up for these games because they purchased tickets hoping the Shockers would be there, and if so will they actively cheer against KU? Or are KU fans going to get their hands on the majority of tickets and create a pretty decent home court? I can't see any of our potential 2nd round competitors travelling that far with a lot of fans.
KUSTEVE said:
I think they set us up against Penn in the first round, and Seton Hall in the 2nd round to try to get us to lose. The Sweet 16 match up might be the only reprieve we get until we have to face NBA talent in the Elite 8. Still, it's much easier than Kentucky, or Virginia. Notice how easy UNC's bracket is in comparison.
I think TV eyeballs would be important to them so I don't think they set us up to lose. Seton Hall might be attractive, but we are playing them in our home state don't forget so that's not exactly setting us up to lose.
@Kcmatt7 They didn't beat anyone but 13 Big 10 teams. I understand their resume is lacking big wins, but they beat the schedule placed in front of them. I don't give a squat if Alabama beat so and so. They lost 15 times. They lost 6 of last 8. They're an NIT team if there ever was one!
I was out til 9 last night so didn't get to watch the selection show and hear all of the analysts. USC sounds like a major snub too. PAC10 weak, I guess, but they went 2-1 against the Big12 champs!
MSU is scary. I've seen them 3 or 4 times this year. They defend very well, block a lot of shots and can fill it up too.
By the way, CBS ranked all 68 teams and we were ranked 8th, MSU was 3, Duke was 2.
@Kcmatt7 So just play tough teams and lose to them and you'll get in? Or play and beat easier teams and not get in? Nebraska beat the teams they were supposed to except Illinois. Bama's record sucks. They've lost 6 of their last 8! They lost 15 games but the NCAA makes room for the populous south. It's pretty sick. I'm not even going to talk about all the other SEC teams playing this week. Penn St. had a good case. 1 bad loss to Rider, and a bunch of tough losses to good teams and some good wins in the conference. Once the NCAA gets it in their minds that a league is good or bad it sets the tone. Wins get excused for the Big10 because it's bad and losses get excused for the SEC because it's good. Heck, OkSt should be in if Bama is in. OKState had quite a few good wins as we know.
Meanwhile 22-10 and 13-5 in the league Nebraska stays home and 19-15 Alabama gets in. 8-10 in the weak SEC. I really can't stand the preferential treatment given to the SEC. Bama losers of 6 of last 8 by the way and early season losers to Minnesota who was one of the two worst teams in the big 10.
We're in the champions classic bracket. Funny season. MSU 29-4 3 seed, we go 27-7 and get a 1 seed in the same region. I don't like seeing Duke in our path. But we've had recent success against Duke too. Everyone here is saying it's a good draw, my first take was it was tough, but I do like the path to the Elite 8.
And it's really strange to not see Wisconsin's name. One of the unlikeliest long tournament runs comes to an end. When their streak started in 1999 they had been dancing all of 4 seasons, winning it all once believe it or not. 3 final fours since, 1 title game, 10 sweet 16's including the last five years. And all with very few bonafide stars.
Wisconsin and KU could have met in 2008 but upstart Davidson got hot behind some kid, I forget his name :) and they nearly prevented us from winning it all that season.
When did Konate yell at the fans? If it was after the game, no T's could be assessed. I'm guessing if it happened during the games the refs would have issued the T.
It's also pretty amazing to trash talk to a team that's won about 75% of the time during Huggies time, and of course, had won twice this year.
We let our play do our talking, but I'm pretty sure that Self wouldn't allow that to get out of hand.
@jaybate-1.0 Ok Swami, or whatever you want to be called, since you're on a little hot streak. Tell me how the next four weeks are going to go!
@cragarhawk Thanks!
@jaybate-1-0 , come on bro, you do a fair amount of theoryizing! Of course, most of your theories are 99% accurate 3/5th of the time except on Sundays and days that are above 82 degrees.
Is it true that kid is Grayson Allens little brother?
Funny season. We were all hyped about the team putting it together, then came the OSU debacle, and then the Doke bad news and we were all writing our season off. Now we've steamrolled the competition without Doke, and riding another wave of confidence. But the fact is, we've lost 7 games, but another fact is we've won 8 of our last nine, we'll probably be a 7 loss 1 seed. We'll probably hear some crying about it amongst others, hear some reminders of our 'failures' in the dance since we lost to Kentucky 6 years ago, endure some taunts, can't win the big one, and even among our faithful, we'll be pessimistic about our dance prognostications, except when we fill out our brackets with KU on the final line!
It's all over but the shouting boys and girls. The field is almost set. The committee is debating, the talking heads are blathering on and on, the proctologists, I mean bracketologists are making their headline grabbing prognostications, the fans are hoping, dreaming, Vegas is gearing up, travel agents are pedaling packages, personnel offices are bracing for lots of sick days on Thursday or Friday, college fans are lamenting no more home games, and of course Duke is plotting, scheming, conniving, conning into the most favorable position with the best refereeing crew from Durham, NC. CBS is doing their part to ensure that ratings will be high so Kentucky will probably play OSU in the 2nd round, 'Nova will lose again to a overseeded 2nd round opponent, MSU-MU will be slotted oppositely so they can meet, KU/Missou/WSU are all being bracketed together so those dream ratings busters can be scheduled.
@jaybate-1-0 is theororizing, @Crimsonorblue22 is sharing momentus news in very few words, @mayjay is analyzing, @HighEliteMajor is lecturing like a physics of basketball instructor, @BeddieKU23 is looking for every angle to help our team, @BShark is poring over the WWW looking, for news that will help, @JayHawkFanToo is educating us about every nuance we need to know about, @kjayhawks is cheering or worrying or both, @Texas-Hawk-10 is trying on his championship T-Shirt, @drgnslayr is teaching us, @RockChalkinTexas is cheering all the way from Austin Texas in the midst of a sea of orange longhorns who care much more about football anyways, @Red-Rooster is upvoting, @Kcmatt is not worrying, @jayballer73 is RockChalkAllDayLongBabying, @DoubleDD is guardedly optimistic, @KUSTEVE aka Jethro is getting some pointed barbs ready for whoever would disparage our team, @Dylans is applying the wisdom that age brings, and @approxinfinity is just keeping an eye on all of us making sure we obey. (sorry if I forgot someone, I know I did, but once you start a list like this it's tough to include everyone)
Me, I've been pessimistic for several months now, but no other team scares me a ton. Nova usually flames out except against us of course, Virginny can't get over the hump, Xavier are too jerky, Duke scares me, but lost as much as we did, UNC, I just don't know, Purdue's height scares, but they've got a Bruce Weber assistant for a head coach. MSU, too scandalous, Zona too much Miller to achieve greatness. So it might as well be us. Let's win this darn thing, make it an every 10 year thing instead of every 20-30 year thing. Rock Chalk!
I'd imagine it all was above board, but it just seemed odd when I heard about it. MSU wasn't in Chicago for any sort of game or anything. Tournament was a week ago in NY.
Michigan State's Cassius Winston on BTN talking about the team having some freed up time because the conference tourney was a week earlier. He mentions that "Since the Big Ten tourney, Michigan State Basketball scrimmaged, saw "Hamilton" in Chicago & took in a Chicago Bulls game."
Now if you live under a rock. Hamilton tickets are through the roof expensive. 222 for a showing today on stubhub. College student athletes presumably do not have spare cash sitting around for hot ticket broadway shows and professional sporting events. I suppose there's a legit answer for it, but.....
MSU, coming off of a scandal plagued season if there ever was one flaunts its privilege by somehow attending Hamilton together? And the BTN brags about it on their network? This crap makes me sick.
Bruce Weber because he, uh, wait, what was the question?
I just can't believe how friggin dirty that guy is. That's the way Roy would say it.