A few figures from the KU site, enjoy them...

• Kansas is the only NCAA DI program that can boast five players averaging at least 11.9 points per game.
• The Jayhawks rank among the top-10 of NCAA DI in five offensive categories: First in scoring margin (+30.6), first in field goals per game (30.6), third in field goal percentage (53.5), third in assists per game (20.3), sixth in points per game (91.9) and 10th in 3-point field goal percentage (43.5). Kansas also ranks 11th in the NCAA in 3-pointers made per game (11.6).
• No Kansas team has averaged more than 94 ppg in its opening six contests of a season since the 2000-01 Jayhawks and no KU team has scored more points in its first six outings since the 1988-89 squad that averaged 95.2 ppg in the opening six games of Roy Williams' tenure at KU.
• KU features four players that are shooting over 50 percent from the field (w/ min. of 3 attemtps per game), including, Udoka Azubuike, who boasts a 76 percent clip, the second-best mark in NCAA DI .
• Kansas is averaging 51.7 points in the first half and is outscoring its opponents by an average of 22.8 points in the opening 20 minutes - The Jayhawks have also proved to be an efficient offense, scoring an average of 1.18 points per possession. Only five other DI programs boast a higher figure.

@kjayhawks

Best time is for the Big 12 Tournament, the weather is usually nice and the entire area (Power and Light District) is jumping. If you can't get tickets you can watch the games on the big screen. Huge party.

@HighEliteMajor

It sure did not look like top 5 team last night. We will find out soon enough...

@mayjay

Excellent point about presumption of innocence that is often misinterpreted. Also because guilt cannot be proven beyond a reasonable doubt does not necessarily mean the accused is innocent, as you mentioned, and hence the "not guilty" rather than "innocent" verdict.

Now I have a question for you. In the Kate Steinle case in San Francisco, the defendant was found not guilty because the defense claimed the shooting was accidental and the result of of mishandling the gun. Shouldn't he have been then convicted of involuntary manslaughter? Isn't this the textbook definition of it? Was jury nullification the only reason for this verdict? I have read dozens of articles on the issue from all sides and I don't believe I read one that finds the verdict was correct.

@BeddieKU23

He had made 17-18 or something like it prior to that.

Davis and Ayton are the real deal. Davis will be hard to stop with what we have but his rebounding was limited to 2 at this game. ESPN was hyping up the Ayton-Wiliams match up and I understand he is the higher ranked player but Davis is in my opinion the best player on the team. A&M has 7 players 6'-9" or taller.

Funny take. On the Arizona last foul on the 3 point attempt the refs went to review if his foot was on the line...of the NBA 3 -point line; he was well behind the college 3-point line. :smile:

@mayjay

Jennings was the Interim AD when Self was hired; I am sure he had consultants helping him. The ticket gate came much later in 2010ish?

Here is the link; go to the 1:20 mark.
[Here is a link](

@kjayhawks

Coach Self said in hi presser that they might let Sosinki suit up but he will not play.

@jaybate-1.0

Interim AD Drue Jennings was in charge when Bill Self was hired.

The late Bob Frederick hired Roy Williams, another great hire.

@kjayhawks

I agree, LiAngelo was a 3-star player coming out of High School and not an NBA prospect. He also pulled LaMelo out of HS because the coach told the team, forget about taking 50 shots per game, it is not happening here but had a coach with a 30-3 record fired first. Ido't know why schools cater to this clown

He said he can go to the streets of LA and pick guys to practice in his own court at home that would be better competition than UCLA. I understand they are now looking at overseas opportunities for both of them; too bad China is out of the question.

@mayjay

I remember Swen (sp?). Hard to start in college when you are playing behind Bill Walton. :smile:

@KUSTEVE

I agree. Other than their bigs they don't have much of anything, a good outside shooter could have put that game away but they kept passing open looks to go inside. Like I said before, Arizona will continue to improve and with the talent it has is a legitimate top 10 maybe even top 5.

@Crimsonorblue22

A lot of second guessing by Wake Forest fans (and analysts) about the extension considering his record to date. He does have a nice class coming next season.

@kjayhawks

I agree that everyone has the presumption of innocence until proven guilty, this is after all the basic tenet of our judicial system. We all know people that have been falsely accused and many times (not always) it turns out to be a case of buyer’s remorse and in most cases it comes down to he said, she said which makes it difficult to prove and makes women reluctant to come forward and relive the whole thing all over again. Every accusation should be taken seriously until proven false. Having said that, using Masterson might not be the best example; apparently the LAPD has had overwhelming evidence with multiple complainants for 10 years but the Church of Scientology of which he is a member and has a cozy relationship with the Department has stymied the investigation.

@mayjay

Several of us posted on that thread; I guess I also missed the part that got heated.

@jayballer54

It was an OK game but game of the year? No, not even close. Interesting, in the recap a ESPN lists Davis as having 21 points and 10 rebounds when he only had 2; Ayton had 10 rebounds.

@Gorilla72

Nebraska beats Minnesota in big upset.

Big win for a Tech over #22 Nevada in OT.

Wichita gets it together and comes back to beat SDSU.

Arizona barely gets by A&M. Davis is really good but Ayton is better and A&M has no outside game and Arizona is not that good either.

Bad loss for Notre Dame, good wins for West Virginia and TCU.

Texas almost gave away the game to Shaka’s old school VCU.

With KSU win the Big 12 goes 5-o.

Interesting scores...Notre Dame 3 points down to Ball State at the half, Michigan State and Rutgers tied at the half, Villanova ahead of Gonzaga by 13 at the half.

@dylans

Preston definitely has NBA potential and before the current situation, it was pretty much the consensus that he was THE sure one and done.

The entire thread shows as being deleted...

@wissox

I have to refresh the browser often. Also, scroll to the bottom f the page and you will see a number of pages, go to the next and your post will show. I just noticed this in the lats couple of days and I don't believe it did this before. I am not sure if one of my settings got messed , a new version of Firefox is doing it or the Forum software had been updated and it is now a new "feature."

@Big-Clyde52

Until the very end Ayton was 100% KU. Hard to believe something did not happen to change that.

@jayballer54

Arizona will bounce back; way too much talent not to be at least somewhat good and Miller, despite some opinions here to the contrary, is really a good coach. I understand some people don't like him personally but it does not take away from what he has accomplished every where he has coached. I believe his brother Archie is even better and I would like him or Brad Stevens to be the coach at KU when Coach Self retires.

Two top 20 team in the schedule for KU, good opportunity to prepare for a deep run in the March. The Conference will be tough with no gimmes and no taking a game off. Once ISU starts improving, every conference team will be in the top 50.

@BShark

A little more serious when they visit or schedule visits to schools, wouldn't you agree? On paper the kid was good and had 2 years of eligibility to boot; more than a one year bench warmer.

@Crimsonorblue22

You called it from the beginning. :smile: He would have been huge this year.

Some interesting game on tap this evening.

4 Villanova - #12 Gonzaga. Tough test for Villanova; we will see how good they are. The game is at MSG so advantage Villanova.

Line: VILL -4.5 O/U: 150

15 Virginia - #18 West Virginia. Good ACC - Big 12 match up.

Line: WVU -4.0 O/U: 134

22 Nevada - Texas Tech. Good Chance to see what Tech. does against a top 25 opponent. Line: TTU -5.5 O/U: 148.5

7 Texas A&M - Arizona. A&M looks like the real dealt and possibly the best team in the SEC and coming to AFH as part of the SEC- Big 12 Challenge. Arizona has been a disappointment so far but having the game in Phoenix might give them an edge; a lot of talent that so far has not shown up except for Ayton and Trier. Line: TAMU -1.0 O/U: 146.5

SMU -#20 TCU. Good Texas showdown. TCU can earn credibility against a team that is usually tough. Line: TCU -3.5 O/U: 136.5

@BShark

Here is from the horse's mouth ↗ mentioning the visits he made and the ones he cancelled after selecting KU.

BShark said:

JayHawkFanToo said:

@BShark

GIYF.

I posit that you are lying. No one else went after Maxwell. Not sure he had another place he could have actually landed at. Many people thought it was baffling at the time and he wasn't a KU level player.

I know some fluff piece from a KU slanted source mentioned Arizona, but no way could he have ended up there.

Calling another poster a liar is way out of bounds.

Here is a link to the transfer ↗ that lists Virginia Tech, Baylor, Arizona and Cincinnati as pursuing him. Apology?

It is really not that complicated. Billy was probably told he would not be making the trip because it made no sense for him to do it when he will not play. This is not unprecedented, I know Bragg missed two trips while his situation was under review and I believe Alexander did as well. Coach Self just gave Billy an easy way to save face.

Nothing to see here folks, move along.

@BShark

GIYF.

@wissox

LiAngelo was 3 star player out of HS and not on any NBA radar, not even close. He is considered the least talented of the 3 brothers and his chances of ending up in the NBA were small then and even smaller now. A great season at UCLA would have gotten him some attention but that is gone now. He will not be drafted and his only chance to play in the NBA is being a walk-on. Too bad he burned the bridges in China since it would have been a likely destination.

@Crimsonorblue22

Several major programs with available scholarships in need of bigs were after them. Not all that uncommon since at that stage of the recruiting process when all the traditional prospects are taken you either pick up a player that might contribute some without having to sit and will be gone after one year or let the scholarship go to waste. Transfers are very popular now and graduate transfers able to play immediately are at the top of the list. Ten years ago there were 200 transfers and now is well over 700, that is 2 for every team or 15% of all players in Division I.

@HighEliteMajor

You seem to forget that Whitman and Maxwell were non-controversial and highly coveted transfers at that time and also, they were not brought in to be starters but only as a stop gag measure; most graduate transfers are . I am sure they were aware of this and hard to blame Coach Self for them or Coleby leaving. I seem to remember a considerably more controversial transfer that worked out pretty well, Tarik Black, who many thought should not have been offered a place at KU in the first place. It is the nature of the beast.

You also indicate that Coach Self wasted scholarships on transfer that are sitting this season that could have been used on other players. Keep in mind that that KU DOES HAVE a scholarship available and the Lawsons and Moore did not take scholarships that would be needed this season; there are only so many quality players available and none that would come to KU.

@dylans

Actually, members of all the women's sports such as rowing get a full rides since because of Title IX, there is plenty of money for women's sports and available money is not allowed for other men's sports. This is why at KU there are 10 women's teams and only 7 men's teams even when money is available. KU cannot even field a men's soccer team. The men's basketball team has only 13 scholarships available while the women's team has 15 and so on.

@justanotherfan

I respectfully disagree. Nobody was talking about Lamelo any more until this moron brought it all back again. Think about it, if not for him making his kids part of his freak show, no one would know or care about it; most people can’t even name the two other players.

What he is teaching his kids is that there are no consequences to their actions. Had the President not intervened, the kid would be in China facing a 10 year sentence. As I mentioned, lots of stories on how the two kids became the most hated athletes in high school, is this what you want for your kids? How is this protecting your kids? I think not and he is not.

Do you think the youngest ever sets a foot at UCLA or any other college? He is by now likely not even eligible anymore because of the shoe deal and what college would take him short of him declaring himself an emancipated minor and separating himself from Daddy Ball? Liangelo will not play college basketball, period. He would have to sit one year since he would be considered a transfer and what school would be crazy enough to take him? The Sarasota Clown College closed when Barnum and Bailey went out of businesses.

He has made sure the kids are cult-like dependent on him and in the process made them the two most hated players in High school. Maybe Lonzo that now has the money of his own can step in and free his brothers from this moron.

@wissox

OK, I have to admit that was funny...:smiley:

@Gorilla72

Sound like a really good addition. The kid was a good JuCo Player so at least he has some experience...and size. After playing for the football team I wonder how he will deal with winning consistently and will he move to the Basketball dorm...like winning the lottery. :smile:

@HighEliteMajor

I don't believe the transfer were his first choice but what was available at the time. As good a program as KU is, it is hard to compete with the programs on the Coasts, particularly the East Coast that gets all the hype or the West Coast with the California glamour. In comparison, small Mid West towns are pretty boring and not really attractive to the urban prospects; by and large Coach Self has really done well . If recruiting to KU with its history and tradition and proximity to KC is hard, imagine what it must be like to recruit to Manhattan, Kansas. Just sayin'...

@KUSTEVE

My reply was in response to posts that indicated that Malik needed more experience. He has plenty of experience; the other players adapted, he did not. He did have 5 assists and 5 rebounds so he did some things well; it was his shooting and defense that was off. He will learn and get better. It is really no big deal.

@HighEliteMajor

Again, you cannot place an order for the ideal transfer players, you have to take from what is available and the ones he got were coveted transfers. Coleby played well below expectation last season and there was no indication of improvement like we have seen as his new destination. He wanted and needed extended playing time if he has any hope of getting to the next levels and, if Preston is playing and the 'stache is producing, his playing time would have been very limited. It was the right move for Coleby and I don't believe there was much Coach Self could offer to keep him.

BShark said:

Somehow we have the #3 D but I think that is in large part due to our schedule.

Most top teams tends to have a soft schedule at this point unless they play in one of the early tournaments with other top teams. KU's SOS is middle of the road and better than Villanova which is ranked #1 by Pomeroy and #2 by Sagarin and Massey. The next 5 games should improve the SOS quite a bit and once conference play starts the SOS is going to be considerably better since the Big 12 is the top ranked conference in all the ranking I have seen.

@HighEliteMajor

There are things that are well beyond the coaching staff control. Once Preston signed other players saw too much competition and bolted and had Preston not signed I would think KU had other prospects that might have signed instead.

If I recall correctly, there was a concern about Preston clearing the NCAA and who would have thought that after he was cleared an unrelated issue like this would surface? Should KU run background checks on prospects, families and friends and hire PIs to do further digging? I think not. With Preston playing there are no issues. Can't really blame Coach Self for this particular issue.

@KUSTEVE

The last time KU played Syracuse before Saturday was in November of 2008, so none of the current players have seen the Syracuse zone before. Newman also had a chance last year to watch KU play Baylor that uses a zone and I believe teams in the SEC use a zone defense as well.

I am sure practice at KU is more intense that most games and Newman is now the equivalent of a Junior. Again, experience should not be an excuse, he just had a poor game and he will get over, no big deal.

Newman played 29 games at Mississippi State and averaged close to 28 mpg (805 minutes) in a major conference; he has also practiced with KU for one year. This is more minutes than SVI or Lucas played in their first two years combined or Lucas in his Junior year and only slightly less than Lucas in his Senior year. Lacks of experience cannot be used in his case.

@Kcmatt7

Rebounding is all about position and opportunity. Some of the better rebounder in the game are/were not necessarily tall but know where to be; obviously it requires basketball IQ. Mason, often the shortest player on the court got a lot more rebounds than most people think he would because he knew where to be; of the regular rotation players only Lucas and Jackson averaged more rebounds than him. Doke could rebound in HS by virtue of his height alone but in college it is quite different and he is not a natural rebounder. This not to say he could not become a good or even great rebounder but at this time it is what it is.

@nuleafjhawk

The farther OU moves the more money the Conference gets and since all the bowl revenue (after expenses) is equally divided, KU gets free money. Go OU.

Boeheim’s comments are just an excuse to how badly he was out coached by Coach Self and how his vaunted zone defense was rendered worthless by KU.

@Kubie

All foreign records require several levels of certification before they get to the NCAA. Locally, all non-accredited school and the so called “basketball factories” or sports prep schools that are in the NCAA “watch list” also receive addional scrutiny because the education they provide many times does not meet even the minimum standards for core subject that is very low. Applicants from most accredited public schools or quality private schools, such as most of the Catholics HS, that have completed the core requirements sail through the process without a hitch.

I posted the number before during the Diallo fiasco and if I recall correctly, the NCAA processes all over 100,000 applications per year and only a tiny fraction of those get the “Diallo” type of delay. In DeSousa’s case the issue seems fairly simple, his required test score is not high enough. He can either retake the test like he is doing or do remedial work for one year (Jamari, McLemore) before becoming eligible.

@drgnslayr

Admission to KU is dictated , well...by KU and it is free to override the rules and accept the student as a hardship case and there is nothing the NCAA or Conference can do about it. However, to be ruled eligible to play is regulated by the NCAA and the Conference and here is where the problem lays. DeSousa can be admitted to KU and not permitted to play; I believe Jamari and Ben McLemore, among others, had the same issue.