I realize that. Doke wasn't anywhere near their drivers when they finished at the hole. He couldn't challenge their shots because he wasn't close to them.
I just don't want to hear our guards use an excuse claiming they had to lay off guarding the trey shot in order to protect Doke from penetrating drives.
In the ASU game, we lost because their guards were much quicker than ours. Whether that is always the reality, or we just didn't come prepared, it was evident in this game.
I think they were too quick for us to fight through the screens. I thought we did the right thing.
But... we never defended against the drive. We were always totally out of position to do so. You can tell that when you see a defense that doesn't even come close to be able to try to draw charges. Heck... we never had one of our players anywhere near being in front of their driving guards.
In order to defend against the drive, our guards need to get up there (in their grills) and HEDGE against their driving priorities. I can't think of one drive they made to their left! Did you notice that? Where was our scouting? Why didn't we hedge for the right side drive? Get up in their grills and challenge their crossovers. Few college players can execute a decent crossover. Very few.
If you replay the game, you will see our guards pulling back on their guards and with ZERO hedging. The very WORST strategy for stopping drives! The WORST! Their guards could then pick up speed, while our defenders are standing flatfooted, and then only need to curl around them to finish.
Did you notice their drives almost always ended up being "blow bys?" Their guards would finish near the rim and not even be challenged because we didn't have a defender who could meet them at their release points.
Devonte can drive the ball. And we have seen him do this with great success.
But he is doing pretty much like what he did last year. He'd have a few big games and then vanish!
This is easily the biggest problem we need to address on this team. Forget adding post players. If we don't have a PG leader coming out and being consistently aggressive, we will not reach our potential or even come close. Lots of heartache ahead.
I've always had up/down emotions about Devonte. He shows us all so much potential, and then he disappears for half a dozen games or so.
We actually have very little experience on this team. It needs leadership. CONSISTENT leadership. I can almost guarantee we will lose every game where Devonte doesn't bring his best efforts.
What I see.... Devonte is GREAT when things are going well! He glows with confidence and he has plenty of aggressiveness.
But when things aren't going well, Devonte sort of seems to fade away into mediocrity.
I think that has to be addressed through the coaches. We can't have Devonte "go invisible" through many games.
Devonte is going to have to learn a different response to the "hard times." Instead of going soft and becoming invisible, he needs to learn to bear down, put out more energy, show optimism, pump up the troops, try other things to flip the mojo over to crimson/blue.
What gets to me is our guard failure in these games. That isn't going to be fixed by suddenly getting two post players. I'm mostly talking about defense.
There is the argument that our guards have to protect against the drive to save Doke from fouls. But... they didn't do that either!
All areas of our defense sucked. Perimeter shot defense. Sucked. Defense against the drive. Sucked. Transition defense. Sucked.
Okay... two miserable games in a row.
We all need to vent a little. We know this isn't the end of the season, just the start, perhaps a rocky start.
So how about venting with a word or phrase to describe the last two games. Hopefully keep it general, not targeting individual players.
Here is mine:
ONE BIG SUCK!
Actually.... two!
Our reinforcements wouldn't have saved us this time.
This was a complete breakdown of our guard play. Horrible defense. We couldn't stop wide open treys and we couldn't stop the scoring drives.
This loss is clearly on our guards. Bad, bad bad!
HighEliteMajor said:
At the heart of my opinion is a strong emotional tug, I admit – I just want to kick their a** into submission.
Same here!
We've all questioned what bringing Sosinski onto the team is about. Does it mean Billy and DeSousa will not become eligible?
Here is a different idea...... " F U M B L E ! "
I want to see Sosinski in a game when the ball is rolling on the court. Will he dive for it even when he's 20-feet away? My guess... YES! This may even be the reason why Self connected with him in the first place. Maybe Sosinski's main purpose is to show our guys HUSTLE! DIVING for 50/50 balls!
" F U M B L E ! "
I'm glad we have a biased anti-KU in the media. It's our one shot at developing a chip, and it's the chip we always lack in March.
What I don't like is being over-hyped, over-ranked... only to fall flat on our faces. And afterwards.... every time... we read and hear, "see how over-rated KU was again!" I'm SICK of that snit!
kjayhawks said:
The rest of the nation really doesn’t care about Kansas in anything.
I don't agree with your post. Sorry. Our nation is full of college basketball fans, and Kansas is a definite leader in that world, and WSU is (in comparison to Kansas) a newcomer on the move.
I thought we were missing several key pieces in this game.
Leadership - Devonte should have stepped up more. Doesn't mean he had to just score. But he didn't play aggressive and then as the game wore on it seemed too late for him to show leadership.
Svi - From these two zone games a definite pattern has become visible. Svi seems to have a big problem with zones like the 2-3.
Doke - Doke is just so so green. He's young and lacks experience. It is great to see his heart on display. It is obvious he has plenty of heart and desire. Just needs lots of PT to gain experience.
Pace - Ha... just when I touted how we now have the ability to control pace, we come out and give up the pace to a totally inferior team. There were a few moments, like when we pressed a bit, where we could see Washington start to speed up and we immediately cut their lead away. Then... we reverted to the slow pace again, and gave the lead back.
Soft - We played like a roll of Charmin. At least with Charmin, you can wipe your backside! Washington got the 50/50 balls, held their own with rebounding, and had enough motion on offense to get wide open looks. Our offense reminded me of some bad years of hi/lo where all our perimeter players just stood on their trey spots and passed the ball quickly hoping that, by itself, would open up the spacing. Where were the drives? Where? Strictly tossing the ball into Vick every time and then become spectators on the trey line will not win many games!
Solid explanation of why playing WSU would help us.
I don't think it is some kind of mental block for Self. It's just that we rarely play these high-energy teams. WVU and sometimes ISU are the closest games that match the intensity of WSU. I do believe it helps us to play more of these teams.
Every big game we play gets nationally televised. Playing the shocks would be on TVs across America... and that is good for Kansas, even when we lose.
I believe UK made a huge gain by starting the UL series again. The viewership of that game is similar to a FF game.
Look at everything Self & Company have done for our program... which has brought us to that very top tier. We can sit back and be comfortable about that... and watch our top status slowly vanish over time. Just ask other schools, like Indiana and UCLA. There is no guarantees we stay at the top.
I don't believe our pre-conference schedule this year has helped us. Mostly silly opponents that are a complete waste of time and is a major loss of opportunity. If we keep going like this, and if the Big 12 keeps going downhill... I may just stay away until March. Right now, I'm bored with these games so far... except the games with Mizzou and UK. Not sure what is interesting in these games where we drub some D2-quality team by 50 points. Some of these games I started focusing on specific fans in the crowd to watch because they seem more interesting than the game. That is pathetic.
Getting on national TV as many times as possible is a big help. Playing many big games in a year is a big help. We need these "toxic games" like with WSU and Mizzou. And no one can shout out "chickenhawk" again!
Just my humble opinion, and I respect those who think differently.
I FEEL exactly as you do.
But I've come to know Bill Self to be the "Riverboat Gambler" and that means he is often doing things that are unpredictable.
Let me ask you.... is it best that Kansas go undefeated into March Madness?
I seriously doubt it.
This team needs to get punched in the face. They got punched in the face last night.
Now... let's talk about TIMING! We get punched in the face, right before our big Christmas development period. PERFECT!
Perhaps, just perhaps, our guys try a little harder and listen to Self more in this period now that they surely must realize they are not invincible, and their future will only go positive if they work hard and follow instructions. Trust in their coaches.
As hard as this is to stomach.... I think this is the best thing that could happen to us. We will need to lose again this year, maybe more than one more time, before March. If we really do pick up 3 new players then they need to learn humility, too, along with all our current players who might start buying into the bull snit that we have become invincible with these 3 additional players.
Much of this loss has to fall on Self's shoulders.... but also Devonte. It is HIS team, and he has to stand accountable. We've all seen what he can do now. We know he can pour it on and take over games. My concern with Devonte has always been if he can MAINTAIN playing at a high level every game, and all the minutes within a game. That is a tall order of expectations... but that level has to be maintained high to be a real contender in March.
I do think this loss will help us... CONSIDERABLY! But for now.... big ouch!
Hard to say what Sosinki will offer us over time.
But the immediate impact is we get a big body who can take space in the post and has 5 fouls to give us.
It would be great if he becomes more than that. But in the least, we get this!
!0_1512489369316_eatersea0916_pike_place_market_shutterstock_mcarter.0.0.jpg ↗
Got to show the market...
Man, I'm hungry!
Kind of makes me wonder....
Are small players smarter than big players?
I know... it is a generalization.
But it seems we've had so much more problems with bigs than smalls.
Athletes still have to clear the same admission bar that all other students have to clear.
ACT/SAT scores are part of the equation for admission.
Really enjoying your enthusiasm!
And great to read your thoughts. I hope you keep posting.
I believe De Sousa took either the ACT or SAT test... whichever one is the basic admittance exam for KU. His score was just below qualifying. I don't think the admissions bar on this is set by the NCAA. I just think it is the standards set by the Kansas Board of Regents for admission into KU.
I could be wrong... but if this is the case, good chance De Sousa fulfills his admittance requirements on round 2!
And in the least.... another big gives us 5 more big boy fouls to hand out!
That, in itself, is worth bringing him into the fold.
Put this in my closing statement for the defense of the 4-guard offense....
Not only did we hold our own against the Cusey's bigs... we also made their high-pressure zone and press look "no pressure" and almost worthless.
There were a few times I thought they might catch us on their press... but then Devonte (or another one of our guards) just cut through it like a piece of soft cheese. Man... I can think back through the years when we could have used these 4 guards on the court!
Hey... we CONTROLLED THE PACE!
If we can control the pace every game moving forward, good chance we go undefeated! Yep. You heard me right! But I know we will probably let down in some games and give in to the opposition's pace.
Did you notice how we sped up the Orangies? They had a lot more TOs than usual, and often they took contested treys.
What a joy! That is what I enjoyed most from this game. We played OUR GAME! It seems like at least half the time we have to beat our opponent playing their game.
Consider how many of our key players had subpar games... and we still won with relative ease.
We saw several Syracuse players use shot fakes... most of them were freshmen. So it isn't like we should be waiting to teach shot fakes in their senior year!
Actually... Graham IS using shot fakes and often it helps him create space of draw a foul.
This is the reason I try not to watch KU games in bars. Heck... I will holler out just for seeing a KU player use an effective shot fake!
I think Malik just needs a bit more experience. Experience with D1 AND experience with this team. He did look lost out there. I wonder how many times he has faced a zone? Svi also looked lost out there against the zone and one time he threw the ball directly to a Syracuse player.
This was a good game to show us which players are ready for about anything on the court. Right now, it mostly looks like Devonte and Vick.
Doke looked frustrated most of the night. I think he was also adjusting to the officiating.... something young players have to adjust to and play through.
Lightfoot.... wow... what was that, 2 fouls in 13 seconds? He needs to play with a bit more basketball IQ in his game... just not to the point where he overthinks everything and slows down. The game needs to slow down for him just a bit. He hustles but often gets caught out of position or getting caught in the air off a shot fake. But hey... he's learning and he is hustling! Pretty hard to knock a player for doing that! He just needs more experience.
I agree with others... Young deserves to be praised! Bravo!
wissox said:
And DG started making threes, he started Mcnamaring Syracuse. Ball game.
So... is the trey line the McNamara Line?
It has been a while since I've heard Vietnam jargon.
I approach Shocker fans with an attitude of telling them how great they are and how bad we are. It not only diffuses everything, but immediately puts them on the defense.
I spin them around to the point where they are saying how great KU is and how the Shockers remain a "work in progress." The truth.
Finally remove orange Halloween decor, only because it is orange.
Go to garage sales in hopes of finding KU t-shirt # 289.
Remove all heavy, blunt objects from the viewing room to protect the TV screen.
I wish Self would teach our guys shot fakes.
This is the single extra tool that could put Cuse away. We are going to make their guys run to catch shooters. The way to deal with defenders having to catch up on space on shooters is to use shot fakes so after they foul a few times they can't continue those desperate leaps to close the gap.
I'm okay with being tagged "scrubs." It can only help build a chip with our guys, keeps us under the radar (a tiny bit), and then it becomes easier for us to outperform our expectations.
I bet Marsha at WSU would love to have his guys get called "scrubs" now. He would RUN with that and build a monster chip with his guys.
We don't need to play the hi/lo to effectively beat the Cuze zone... but just having that experience of knowing how to punch the ball in and out is HUGE!
Just knowing we have someone like Doke in the low post and we know how to feed him also opens up the high post for Vick!
I'm betting this ends up being a very entertaining game! All we have to do is hit a decent % from trey. If we do that then Boeheim has to decide who he wants to leave open.... low post Doke? high post Vick? perimeter shooting guards?
Then... what if we start driving through the seams?
This seems to be our best offensive team ever for Self to use against Boeheim!
This game will probably boil down to coaching. Hopefully, we will start this game and punch Cuze right in the face! Then.... Boeheim will have to counter by shifting his defensive focus somewhere else. Then.... Self will have to counter Boeheim's move... then... back and forth countering between coaches! I'd love to experience a game like that!
Yes, I agree.... and we've had our years of weak PG play, and it cost us dearly.
I don't think many fans realize the PG is essentially like the quarterback in football... the general on the team.
Just ask the Green Bay Packers how important the quarterback is!
That's what I think.
He could never compete with Devonte at the point and would have had to settle for "first off the bench."
Sounds like he wouldn't have liked that... causing team distractions for us.
Just goes to show how anything can happen in D1 basketball. No one really blamed Coleby for leaving, when he left.
I'm sure he is wondering what would have happened if he had stayed... er... maybe not. He appears to be busy now!
I hope he makes it. He's had so much to fight through... any success he has should put a big smile on Jayhawk fans' faces!
Except for some rare situations, I think "big ball" is largely dead.
Just because a team has maybe 3 players 6'10"+ on the court, doesn't mean they play "big ball."
Billy Preston is the perfect example. "Big" only fits him because of his height. Everything else about him is "small." He can handle the ball (small ball). He can quickly learn to become a very good passer (small ball). He has a good perimeter shot (small ball). He has a good motor with plenty of speed (small ball). He's pretty good in the open court (small ball).
Svi is another example. Svi is a "guard?" 6'8"? Isn't that the size of many post players? Let's see.... that's 3 inches taller than "Chab" (Charles Barkley). Barkley won NBA rebounding crowns.
Really... look anywhere in basketball. The goal is to have as much height possible that can play effective "small ball."
"Big ball" means "low post ball." Big ball also means sacrificing team weapons; speed... ball handling... passing... even endurance by playing bigger, slower players who are there to pursue a low post game.
"Small ball" focuses on horizontal spacing. "Big ball" focuses on vertical spacing (rebounding and shooting OVER defenders).
The day of big ball really started it's end when teams and coaches started focusing on trey ball. And the way to be effective at trey is to spread the defense. It's about using the entire court area on offense. It's about focusing on horizontal spacing advantages. THAT is "small ball!"
"I’m also interested to see how we handle a longer team 2nd time around, we are more prepared since Kentucky and have game film to prepare against Cuse against common opponents."
Kentucky posed a unique situation to us. Height and talent.
They were able to use these areas of advantage to pinch in on the seams of our offense; passing and driving lanes.
I can't recall now, but didn't Calipari stick strictly to a M2M defense against us? With his size and athleticism, even though the players are green, it isn't tough for them to be formidable on defense.
Self is definitely one of the best "zone-breaker" coaches in college basketball! Part of that relates to his long history of running a successful hi/lo. He knows how to get the ball in the post, from low post to high post around the FT line... and then back out on the perimeter to hit shots. Self also knows how vital it is to drive the ball. And now, in the last couple years, Self has added some amazing twists by turning his offense into a "two-man offense" when the ball makes it to the post area, having two players attack one defender at the rim.
I absolute LOVE Self sticking Vick at the FT line to become the hub in his attack of zone defenses. And if we ever get back Billy, he will also be a great hub player.
Nice response. Yeah... Boeheim's calling card is his zone defense, which is premised on him carefully recruiting the exact proper players for each spot in his zone.
Once you remove Boeheim's finely-tuned recruited players from his scheme... they become extremely mediocre.
And the real reason why he has had some level of success with his zone relates more to the level of novelty with his zone, because he recruits players as pieces to his specialized zone.
Spot on! I think Vick will be a key, maybe the key. Post up on the FT line and shot, drive or pass.
No, wait a minute... Doke will be the key! Syracuse will be focused on stopping our treys.
No, wait a minute... Svi and Malik will be the key! They will drive the ball since Cuse guards will be out top trying to stop the trey.
No, wait a minute... Devonte will be the key! He runs the team and will keep the pace moving. He has warmed up from trey and he showed us (in the last game) how he can easily drive and either feed or hit the shot.
Did I miss anyone? ;)
Fun to read Cuse's side of the story... they are just worried about us hitting the trey. Guess they don't understand that Self's funnest moments in life involve crushing zone defenses! Ha!
BShark said:
Preston will leave anyway.
Why will Billy leave anyway?
If he isn't high on the draft boards, you think he would rather fight his way through the NBA D-league than remain in Lawrence? He has elite potential.
If he transfers he sits a year, meaning at least two more years in college.
I might be way off base.
If I look at this through a glass half full, then Self is doing this to get another big body for practices because he is preparing to have 3 players become eligible and hopes to run more post-based offense, like his new hybrid hi/lo.
BeddieKU23 said:
Saturday will be a test. How we get points against the zone on a neutral court having to play at a slower tempo will test these guys.
You said the key... tempo!
Welcome to the 4-guard offense! We don't have to play a slower tempo game this time. If we get Cuse playing our quick pace, we should stomp them. Don't give them time to set their zone.
I suspect this will be a game of waves. We will probably build a big lead, only to have it reduced because we start slowing down and play to Cuze's pace.
When I read this my first thought was that Billy isn't coming back. Then I read others who think Billy will be back. If Billy is coming back, why bring on Sosinski?
Is it possible the Lawson brothers might leave after this semester? I haven't heard anything like this but I don't see why we add Sosinski if we get either Billy or Sousa. I wonder if they are happy with the post appearing more crowded next year?
One thing is for sure.... if Billy has hopes of leaving school for the NBA this spring, he'll have to earn his stat line against better teams.
Kind of makes me wonder if this situation has put a hitch in Self's recruiting plans.
What if BOTH Doke and Billy want to return next year?
It's starting to already look obvious that our 4-guard offense is going bye-bye. I have to admit I will be sad if that happens.
Good reply.
Yeah.. it may be correct that the March results aren't impacted. Not sure we have a big enough sample group to know though.
I vented some frustration mostly because I find these games totally boring. These games definitely don't help our SOS.
I can see playing 2 or 3 of these games, just to break in freshmen. Beyond that, I just don't see the value. There is always risk of injuries so might as well go for an opportunity to help our team more.
Not sure I can stomach any more of these blow out games. They are just like watching Mike Tyson beat up residents at a care home.
I don't think I can be convinced these lopsided games are good for us. Great for building egos, unrealistic expectations and the perfect reason for players to coast through their big developmental period over Christmas.
I don't care about National Championships. I just want us to have good team spirit.
No... just give our entire team a participation ribbon. That's good enough!
LOL
elpoyo said:
oh..and "#2 and content" would make an awesome banner.
Or maybe, "full of #2 and content!"
Ha... just jacking with you.
Welcome back, elpoyo! You always spark many responses and I like to experience that.
When will we go to Spain to play Toledo on their home court?!
lol
This is GREAT NEWS!
Nova is always a team we have trouble with. We need to play them regularly in order to figure their style out. And Jay is a very good coach, which always creates a challenge for Self to step up his game. So playing Nova is not only good for our players, but also our coaching staff!
We need to replace more of these silly November games with totally inferior teams and replace them with real challenges where we can learn from. I believe these current silly games have a negative impact on our season. These games build a false sense of where our team is at, so our players don't fight as hard to improve during the fall. Our main team development through practice happens NOW, until our Big 12 season starts. From there on, our development happens through game experience.
There will be several very dangerous teams come March. It's too early to know who those teams are. Many factors play into this, including injuries.
Injuries not only take players off the floor, but also many injuries are invisible to us fans. Most D1 players who play many game minutes will be dealing with some pains by March. Many will not be near 100% at the end and we really won't know exactly who these players are and how hampered they will be.
Right now, Duke looks like one of the favorites. But who knows what they will look like in a couple months of pounding the courts.
I've been trying to get a solid look at most of the Big 12 teams. I have to admit that what I've seen so far is not really that impressive. Texas may end up being a sleeper.
It is just too hard to say what impact Silvio will have.
His contribution could show obvious from Day 1. Or maybe we don't see a huge benefit until later.
He may contribute in every game, or just in a few games where we need more post help.
We should definitely view him as help because we need more post people. He will surely help us in practices, too!
His impact will also relate to if we get Billy back.
I look at Silvio as an insurance policy!
It's been a fun November. Fun to watch our Jayhawks develop while we dream about what our team might look like in March.
It's also fun to watch other teams. I watched the purple kitties blow their game with Arizona State yesterday. Bruce was in typical form; turning purple and screaming at the refs. I don't blame him because the kitties certainly got ripped the entire game.
It's fun smacking down Kentucky again. It's fun watching Calipari have to work with a group with a tad bit less talent, making them count on coaching more.
What isn't fun is stuff like the NCAA letting UNC off the hook. What isn't fun is watching the NCAA wiggle out of coming down hard on Louisville. What isn't fun is watching the NBA continue to hesitate in dealing with the OAD issue.
But I think the yin and yang in college basketball helps make it that much more magnetic.