🏀 KuBuckets Archive

@justanotherfan I don't think we have seen the last of AW3 in the college game. To me he is a casualty of the OAD craze. He could have been a 4 year or 5 year player with a red shirt who we all loved and talked about like Releford. Instead we got Wiggins and Oubre who were obviously too hard for him to deal with when Greene was part of the same mix.

It is hard for me to argue that Wiggins was not a great sign. We may have lost in the 2nd round to Stanford the one year he was at KU but the kid is already a legit stud in the NBA and could be part of the reason guys like Bragg and Diallo want to come to KU. But that is the only presumed OAD example I can say I am happy with. You can't count JoJo as he was not supposed to be an OAD. Same with B Mac. Those just happened to come together in one year. But Selby, Xavier and Oubre don't do a whole lot for me. I'll take a AW3 type player or a Releford or Russ Robinson any day of the week over those guys.

All that said, I am excited about Diallo and I know that the OAD kids are simply part of the new normal. They are not going anywhere until (or if) the rules change. I have to get used to it but I will still always hope that we have 4 year guys like Perry Ellis more often than 1 year guys like Xavier Henry.

@FarSideHawk Right there with you. I do not want Brown at all just as I did not want Ingram. I think we got what we needed today by landing Diallo. Now we have our pieces.

I hope that this helps quiet some of the negativity about Bill Self as a recruiter on that "other site".

@BeddieKU23 Agreed. Even if he is a bit "raw" I think he will do things that our current post players can't do. Or I hope.

For those who don't have ESPN Insider.

Strengths:
Diallo has a terrific motor. He competes at a high level on both ends of the floor. He rebounds on both ends with two hands at rim level. He runs the floor with extra long strides where he finishes with power. Diallo simply attacks the opponent. He is capable of defending both post positions as well. Diallo is a finisher, rebounder and top notch shot blocker and defender. Call him an eraser or a rim protector, either is appropriate.

Weaknesses:
This is where significant improvements must be made. He lacks feel on the offensive side and while he's got major awareness as a shot blocker he's opposite in terms of catching and scoring. His touch is fleeting. Needs one move and he'll be a kid that can impact games. He must continue to work to develop on the offensive end of the floor including his ball handling.

Bottom Line:
Diallo is a high energy, finisher, rebounder and shot blocker. His defense and rebounding is what make him special. He will need to continue to work to add some offense to his game but he competes at a high level and can dominate the game defensively. He is a sure shot high major power forward with off the charts upside.

Where is this made fact? Not questioning...just would love to see where.

@BeddieKU23 ha! Great post.

@RockkChalkk I don't know either. I just know that I took them in times of great need...2nd half of MSU game in 2009. 2nd half of the Northern Iowa game...2nd half of the Michigan game. You know where I am coming from.

Good idea to have a celebratory drink instead of an "oh my god we are going to lose this game I need to be more drunk so I don't remember this" drink.

@RockkChalkk Special drinks? That sounds awesome. Are they Mario Miracle shots from Lottie's?

@BeddieKU23 I remember a similar post like this about Julius Randle. As you say, just useless.

Rock Chalk.

@HighEliteMajor I wish we had a Kevin Young on every team. He was certainly not the most talented player of the Self era but he played really hard. Dove for lose balls. Hustled up and down the floor. Essentially played the garbage man and with a huge smile the entire time. Probably the best "energy guy" we have ever had.

I got up around 5 a.m. this morning and unfortunately my productivity to this point has involved reading the comments on that other site we all used to use.

I am sure a lot of you have already seen these but there is a pretty long thread about missing on Ingram, potentially missing on Diallo and essentially being "the same" team we were last year. Many of the what I consider pessimistic arguments revolve around the idea of this "same team". Referring to next year as the same old team to me is really selling ourselves short. Honestly, 95% of the country would love to have this "same team" returning whether we land anyone or not and that is our reality.

So, that is at least how I feel. Even if we strike out on the rest of the big names left undeclared I personally think we are fine. We are going to have a team without an above average 5. It will certainly require Bill to change up his scheme. Playing through Landen and Jamari is simply not going to work. Luckily even these less than average guys that will play the 5 spot are old. Two seniors and a junior. Shouldn't be a learning curve issue.

Also, we are returning more than most in the entire country. Think about the top 10 last year and the Final 4 teams. Everyone is losing a ton. Sure, they are all doing their best to reload but it is going to be tough for Wisconsin, Duke, Kentucky, MSU, Arizona and others to match the talent level they had last year.

What other pre season top 10 team is going to have more upperclassmen than KU? I honestly don't have any stats to back this up but I have to assume we will be the oldest elite program. Maybe UNC will be up there as well.

This is just who we are for next year. A junior / senior team with one hell of a perimeter, one of the best players in the country (Perry) and a pretty big gaping hole at the 5 spot. Things have been worse and I expect a 6-7 loss season and a 1 or 2 seed from this squad even without any additions from the OAD circus.

Man, I really hate Duke.

@BeddieKU23 I'm not basing this on anything but I see him going to UK. Partially just because he seems like a UK player and partially because I selfishly don't want any more perimeter players when we are set in that area (at least I think we are).

Please land a kid who can play 4/5 so we don't have to have another year of watching Lucas fumble the ball to the other team and seeing Jamari grab 2 rebounds in 25 minutes on the floor.

Good. This means Svi and Greene were not successfully recruited over.

I think Bruce Weber comes in at the last moment and lands both Diallo and Ingram. It has been his plan all along. Just needed to get rid of 5 guys to prove that they will get their playing time.

@BeddieKU23 Exactly. Too difficult for us. When two of the best college basketball programs of all time are in your home state it is going to be tough to leave.

Also, this may upset the apple cart a bit but I don't really see why we need this kid. I am 100% convinced we need to focus our entire recruiting plan on a post player.

Yes, Ingram is a total stud but this is classic "over recruiting".

@HighEliteMajor Unfortunately I agree on Lucas as a 4th big. I like the kid as I have posted before because he plays really hard and obviously wants to be on the floor and wants to be better. My issue is that he doesn't really have much of a ceiling. Slow and not a great athlete which is a bad combo. Even when Jeff Withey struggled his first couple of years in college you could tell there was a lot of potential there. I just don't see this with Lucas. If I am wrong and Landen Lucas turns into the next Jeff Withey I will be the first to admit that I missed something. Just not holding my breath on making that post.

Man, I really hope that Bragg is the real deal. If we don't sign another big and our post players at the 4/5 (other than Perry) are Bragg, Lucas, Bam Bam and Hunter we better hope that Bragg can contribute right out of the gate. I truly hate being negative on this board but if our starting lineup next year includes either Jamari or Lucas I may cry.

@HighEliteMajor Love it. I 100% agree on this kid. The best post players of the Self era come from this same cloth. Top 20-40 kid. A bit raw. Needs some tweaking but has a high ceiling. Withey, TRob, Morris Twins, Darnell, Ellis, etc. Really love this idea and I hate to think how many kids great programs (not just KU) lose by scaring off recruits like Bolden by going "all in" on the OAD's. It is sad and bad for NCAA basketball.

The highlights are of course to be taken with a grain of salt. Remember Selden's highlights? Or Cliffs from last year? Both guys dunked everything. Fun to watch but that is about where it stops with the exception that I agree that it is fun to see him use both hands around the basket. If he already has that ability he could be a great finisher in college after a couple of years.

@jaybate-1.0 Let's get serious. UK has the same situation that KU has. They win every game at home. It makes life for them a lot easier in the conference that 50% of their games are essentially a done deal.

UK has a number of high prospects coming back...Lee is back, Ullis is back. I highly doubt they take anything other than 1st in the awful SEC.

I hope I'm wrong.

I hate this part of year too and the story below is even more reason to hate the recruiting season and to hate Duke.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/recruiting/basketball/mens/story/_/id/12734195/duke-blue-devils-land-derryck-thornton-play-pg-next-season ↗

They lose their elite PG to the draft and then convince this 17 year old PG to reclassify so he can play now. Sometimes this recruiting crap is pretty awful.

@jaybate-1.0 All good points but hey, you asked who we think will improve the least and that is my answer. Hope I am wrong. I hope Tyler Self improves the least.

I think Jamari. I thought he would be a pretty huge piece of our puzzle last year and he probably regressed. He is a great athlete and will have an occasional amazing dunk or block or hustle play but I think what we have seen is what we are going to get. A 6'7 guy who is stuck playing the 5 spot who can't rebound and can't shoot.

Love the guy. I just don't think he is going to ever get better which goes against how I have felt for the last few years. This last season just gave me the impression that he is not ever going to be good.

@BeddieKU23 Fully agree. I think our best starting lineup is Mason, Graham, Selden, Ellis and whoever is going to play the 5 (Bragg or an OAD kid).

Great idea for a topic for sure.

My vote is Graham. The kid is an absolute stud and is due for a huge season. I think it will be a similar situation that Sherron was in during the 2008 season where he didn't start but got huge minutes off the bench and was essentially a 6th starter.

Graham has great handles. Great IQ. Good jumper. Very quick. Most importantly he plays with confidence and swagger. Now that he is not a freshman I look for him to be a vocal leader of this team and to be a 10 point 4 assist a game guy off the bench.

@jaybate-1.0 The French speaking duo at UK is a scary possibility. I am sure Cal will use that to his advantage.

I do think the Embiid factor for us is helpful. There are obvious similarities (including French if he ever wants to ask JoJo questions in that language). Embiid came in "raw" and left the #3 pick in the draft. Would have been #1 if he stayed healthy. That could help us.

Also, does a kid like Diallo look at UK and see what I see? The never ending recruiting. Marcus Lee and Dakari Johnson come in as blue chip recruits and after two years barely play...especially Lee as Cal brings in Towns, Lyles, etc. I don't think he will have that problem at KU. Although I supposed Alexander did not exactly get the minutes this year you would expect from a top 5 recruit? Maybe I am wrong on that.

Man, it is crazy to think that all of this speculation over Diallo could just turn into another Alexander type season next year if we land him. I am not trying to be a pessimist. Just saying that none of this kids are "can't miss". Cliff was supposed to be an immediate impact player and that is not exactly who he ended up being.

I guess I am just being a realist about this entire situation. We may not land anyone else and we already have the guys who are going to play big minutes. We may end up landing Diallo and he will be a good player but not great and will average 8 and 4. You never know.

@BeddieKU23 I think you have to like the odds of Diallo developing a move or two in his one year over the idea that Jamari / Lucas / Hunter will somehow develop moves over the summer.

That said, I think we have to get used to the idea that we may not have a back to the basket threat again next year no matter what. Perry will be a stud. Bragg will be solid. Hopefully we get Diallo and if not we will have to pray that Landen makes a Withey-esque leap in production.

@dylans How in the world do these kids not just have heads the size of basketballs with all of these in home visits? Can you even imagine this circus at age 18? Multiple guys you see on TV every day all of the sudden in your house telling you how wonderful you are.

I remember when my folks and I were talking about where I was going to go to college. The three of us were at the dinner table and my Dad said, "You are going to KU. Now eat your super that your mother made." Great talk, Dad.

@drgnslayr I like Perry at the 4 but a "stretch" 4 or whatever you want to call it...like Kaminsky was this year for Wisconsin. I am not saying that Perry is going to have the same sort of year as big Frank but hey, why not dream?

@FarSideHawk I don't want that. I really feel the OAD players should only be taken if there is an obvious hole in our roster. This year that is in the post. We are in good shape at the 3 spot, right? Svi is going to be a 3. BG is a 3 when he comes back. Wayne Selden can play the 3 if we have both Mason and Graham in at the same time.

All I want is a good post player to help compliment Perry and Bragg. We already have too many cooks in the kitchen on the perimeter and I hate the idea of a stud like Svi not getting minutes. He has so much potential and a year already in the system. I expect him to have a really big year if he just has the opportunity.

@HighEliteMajor I agree and disagree on the OAD guys. Duke cut down the nets this year with a mix of older players and OAD guys but for the most part they won based on 3 guys and they were all OAD. I hate this as you do but it seems to be a reality. The only Final 4 team this year that actively does not go after OAD guys is Wisconsin. MSU goes after them, they just don't always land them. I have posted this before but some of the supposed OAD kids end up staying 3 years...Selden, Brandon Rush, etc.

That all said, I do agree that we don't have to go all in as Coach Self has this year. I'd love to have a top 50 guy who is 6'11 already signed.

I full agree on Lucas. The guy plays his ass off and I love that about him. The problem is he is not that good and never will be. He is slow. He is not a great shooter. He is not even a freak athlete like Jamari. He is just a big guy who tries really hard and his ceiling is averaging like 8 and 4.

@dylans Good point about Bragg. That was part of the reason UK looked so good out of the gate with freshman. They had been playing real games against real competition for longer than anyone else when the season started.

Very exciting. I really truly lost sleep thinking about what we would look like next year without Perry.

This is now going to be the most veteran team since 2012-2013. I loved that team. Yes, that team had the YMCA game against TCU and yes they had the meltdown against Michigan but I really liked the age of that squad. The mixture on that team of seniority (Releford, Withey, KY) and pure talent (BMac) seems like the recipe to me. It is just nice knowing that a large majority of our players will understand Bill's system which is apparently hard for freshman and even sophomores to get.

Our starters should include a senior and 2 juniors. No matter who fills the other two spots it feels great knowing at least that. Graham and Svi (especially Graham) seem poised to have big sophomore years. BG's hip surgery is a huge issue but with Perry's announcement I feel refreshed and revitalized. Rock Chalk!

@BeddieKU23 To me the worst part about all of this is B. Greene's surgery. I am excited about the World Games but this 5 month layoff for Greene seems like a huge loss. That means he may not be back on the court until September which is just 2 months before the season starts. I don't know how he is going to knock that much rust off as a shooter and get in shape. Greene in my mind was going to take that huge sophomore to junior season leap where he became more than a one dimensional player. That may all be jeopardized now. Self says that a red shirt is not going to happen but I wouldn't count it out if we sign a big time guard. If Greene does not improve much or at all over the summer it may be best for him to play two more years at full strength after sitting for a year. Obviously this is all total speculation but I am really bummed by this news.

@Crimsonorblue22 It makes me feel pretty old seeing that the current KU recruits were born in 1996.

I am glad to hear Wayne is back. Not sure that I was actually concerned since he is not on 1 single draft board but good to see it in print and I love his positive comments.

Wayne is a good example of why Self needs to continue to go after top talent. I am with you guys that feel the OAD players are often times an unnecessary circus but occasionally the presumed OAD ends up being Wayne Selden. Wayne was the #12 player in the nation coming out of high school and along with Wiggins was thought to be an NBA ready player after his freshman year. That did not happen. Now after a very up and down sophomore season we are going to have Wayne back. This happens and I know I speak for everyone when I say that I hope we see that #12 in the nation talent realized.

Some of the OAD kids are going to be just that. One season and done. But a lot won't be. Cliff Alexander would probably be back next year if it wasn't for the off the court issues as he needed some time to develop. B Rush was supposed to be a possible OAD. An injury certainly helped him stay for this junior year but I am really glad we went after him even with the risk of him leaving.

I agree with @HighEliteMajor and @FarSideHawk that Wayne is better than any OAD option this year. But when we have voids to fill such as we do this off season in the post I think you just have to go after top talent. Diallo might be an OAD but he might not. If he ends up being a huge piece of a Final 4 run as an OAD that is fine with me. The Duke mix of OAD and veteran leadership seems to be the recipe.

Now, please announce you are coming back for your senior season Perry!!!!

@konkeyDong This is all amazing and detailed info. Really appreciate it and I am now going to spend the next hour of my life watching youtube videos of him (thanks for that, too?).

Sadly with the loss of 7 guys from UK I think things just got a bit too interesting. God knows what may happen now. Could Cal just pick up every top 15 recruit that was "waiting to see" who was going to the draft? I am not sure I can handle another year of their b*llshit.

@Bosthawk Not sure that I qualify as a board heavy but I will weigh in.

I personally can't imagine that he leaves. I have posted this before but...

He is from Kansas.

Always wanted to play for Kansas.

Hasn't had a good post season run (actually has been part of the worst post season streak in Bill Self history).

He will be one of the top 10 players in D1 next year if he returns.

He may actually go undrafted as he is a classic "tweaner".

He has a chance to be an All American Senior next year if he stays and to me has little to lose by staying. Oubre has to leave. Cliff has to leave. Perry certainly does not need to leave and if he stays another year and averages 15 and 6 how does this negatively impact his stock? If he comes back and averages 18 and 10 and leads KU to a Final 4 that can only help.

Also, I can't handle the idea of him leaving. It makes me want to vomit thinking of our post play next year without him.

@Crimsonorblue22 Awesome. I was pretty tired of seeing those guys. Seems like they were at UK for more than just 2 seasons.

@wissoxfan83 Agreed. We will be a far inferior team if Perry leaves. I can't imagine he leaves, though. He is not going to go in the 1st round. It is his life long dream to go to KU. His 3 years at KU have all ended early in the NCAA. I think the home state kid will be back for his senior year and that he will be an All American.

Well I guess it was a lot to ask for both Kentucky and Duke to lose in back to back games in the Final 4. Those are my personal 2 most hated teams in all sports. I suppose I am still thrilled that the final at least didn't match up both of these programs. Wisconsin slayed the dragon and unfortunately didn't have the ability to slay Rat Face two nights later.

I really do respect Coach K. The guy has like 100 Final 4's and now 5 titles. The numbers are incredible. But my respect certainly doesn't make me like the guy. Coach Cal is a sleazy salesman but Coach K bothers me just about as much with his better than though attitude. The putting his hand on the chest of opposing players in the post game handshake line. The "I'll have one of my assistants do the halftime interview" crap. The constant complaining to officials. The "Me coaching the Olympics team doesn't help me with recruiting". These things bother me and I fcking can't wait until he retires. For gods sake please fcking retire.

@drgnslayr I tend to agree on Cliff. As much as I would like to see him back I think that this situation leaves KU no choice but to let him leave. Just in case something comes back to haunt us down the road.

@drgnslayr This may be blind optimism on my part but I truly don't think the 9-10 McD's rosters are sustainable and I feel there will be a shift very soon. Too many kids like Marcus Lee and Dakari Johnson are going to see that they could play at another school and actually see the floor. Yes, Johnson is being mentioned as a potential late first round pick even though he was a backup all year but I think that is an anomaly as well.

Duke and UK have a large majority of the McD's All Americans in the entire country just between the 2 schools. This has to be difficult to maintain. Most of the elite recruits have waited around this year and are waiting to see where they can "get minutes". If UK only loses 4-6 kids there are only going to be so many minutes to give. Is this platoon BS going to work again? I doubt it. Will kids that are looking to play at Duke going to be willing to play behind superior talent year in and year out?

I feel that the talent is going to begin to spread across the country and that less kids are going to want to be a part of recruiting classes with 3-4 other blue chip players. This is just a theory and can probably be debunked very easily but this is my gut feeling.

I hate Coach Cal as much as the next guy but does it really matter if he is a good coach or not? He has been to a ton of Final 4's very recently and has won it all just 3 years ago. He is obviously a snake oil salesman but he is doing something right. I doubt the UK fan base is questioning him.

I don't see the Harrison Twins in the 1st round or even early in the 2nd round on any mock draft boards. I know this could change but are they really going to leave without being guaranteed to go early 2nd round? I hate to say it but I fully expect to see them on UK's roster again next year.

I don't think I have ever been more excited about a non-KU game as I am about Wisconsin beating UK last night. We should all enjoy it while we can as the Evil Empire that is UK will be back. Lee is back, Ullis is back. Johnson is back. As stated above I think the Twins are back and that does not count whatever silly class they bring in. Cal just keeps this stupid circus going.

Hopefully last nights post game performance by Cauley Stein makes some of you feel better about not landing him. You lose one game all year and you don't have enough class to shake the hand of the other team? F*ck him and the other UK players who disrespected the entire WIsconsin team by simply walking off the court.

@wissoxfan83 Typically I would agree with that 100%. I always hate when OAD guys come in and get big minutes in front of guys who seem like great 4 years players. AW3 obviously comes to mind. He was going to be a stud at the 3 and in come Wiggins / Oubre for 2 years of 9-10 losses at his position.

But is our front court in the same situation where an OAD would be taking away minutes from a potential future stud? As of today an OAD post player at the 5 position would take away minutes from Jamari (a senior), Hunter (a senior) and Landen (a junior who does not appear to my eye to ever be the answer in the post). How would this KU team benefit both in the short term and the long term by having our current post players or by only adding a low ranked project post player who is going to take a couple of years to develop? It seems like we don't benefit as next year will be another year of no offense and pretty bad defense at the 5 spot. Jamari/Hunter/Landen is not the answer. Not sure that Diallo is the answer either but with the guys we have coming in at the 5 and two of them leaving after this year no matter what I think it is worth the risk.

@ralster I'm pretty sure I speak for most KU fans when I say I like Rick Barnes. Even during the seasons when UT was stacked and just as good as KU I never really said "I hate UT" and it was mostly based on Barnes. He was a great recruiter and luckily for KU not the worlds greatest in game coach...but he was always gracious whether his teams won or lost.

Shaka on the other hand appears to be flat our arrogant. He has played KU once and is already making nasty statements about what his "havoc" defense can do to upset the KU dominance in the Big 12. It is going to be different when the pressure is on. This is not VCU where 20 of your games are played against teams no one has heard of. This is Texas. National television. Oil family alums. McD's recruits. Big 12 teams week in week out. I'd like to see Smart win a few games in the Big 12 before his head gets too big and to me success won't come soon. The guys coming back are not his recruits and are not prepared for his style of play. Hopefully a few mediocre seasons will not him down a peg or two.

I could kind of care less about the Big 12 "streak" for KU but all of the sudden I care again. I truly don't want to see Shaka win our conference. Watching him do a defensive slide on the sideline makes me want to do things that should go without mention.

Agree. I envision this Zimmerman kid being "Cush" from Jerry Maguire.

@drgnslayr Ok. I am 100% sure we would not go to the National Title game without EJ in 2012. He had a huge tournament and was a big part of the 6-7 man rotation that somehow won 5 games in March.

The 2013 season / Michigan game will always hurt our opinion of EJ. But EJ and TT will always be thought of fondly for me based on what they did in 2012 even if they both had pretty lack luster careers the other 3 years they were at KU.