@Crimsonorblue22 Which is all of them?
Marco
3146 posts
BShark said:
@Marco Shame shame we know your name.
And yes @Crimsonorblue22 is a nice lady. :blush:
Joke!
Someone mentioned Zach Harvey the other day. Wonder if we're interested? What did he get in trouble for?
What? There are women in here? (time to go politically-incorrect) Pics?
@BShark I'm sure that Kelvin Sampson will be texting him soon.
The OAD rule will soon be gone, but there will still be plenty of divas. I'm of the opinion that we should, for the most part, steer clear of them. We had no OADS in '08, and that turned pretty good - ditto '12. The Year before last was not too bad either (Final Four), even the year before and year before, though only Elite Eights.
So, predictions guys! Do you think we'll land Wilson?
....... And now we wait....
approxinfinity said:
@kjayhawks maybe, but Perry was a way more decorated High School player and valedictorian. It remains to be seen if he has Perry's smarts and work ethic.
Man, we would have been so screwed if Ellis wasn't around his junior and senior year.
@jayballer73. Jumpin' Josaphat,,, it's a gas, gas, gaaaasss!!
I we don't sign Wilson I'll take Braun getting six or seven points a game.
jayballer73 said:
BShark said:
justanotherfan said:
If a top 20 prospect busts, you get Quentin Grimes. If a lower prospect busts, you get Anrio Adams. One guy you can still play every night, and he can come through big in some games. The other is borderline unplayable.
The guy you recruit that's ranked 50 something better be legit, otherwise you get nothing.
This is spot on. There is generally a better floor the higher up the rankings you go.
True - but you have to get them 1st - you spend the entire yr battling all the other blue bloods and then when you strike out - - - you REALLY strike out. - you have spent your year on upper tier guys and then you lose and by then you haven't given the middle tier guys a sniff - -now they not gonna give you one.
I'm by far not against the one and dones for sure you ought to know that. - Yet my question is - are we spending ENOUGH time recruiting all the others ? -seems like all we are focused on is OAD'S or close to it - -we need a better mix in the years to come
Just like Jalen now they have him at 5oth - but yet have hear he is under ranked should be 10-15 higher - that card can be played with others - THEY very well could be under ranked - -just need more even mix'
I'm with you @jayballer73! Sure we should recruit a few top-tier guys and hope that one or two might sign, but in the meantime I think we should mine hard and heavy the top 100, and if there are no scholarships left after a few of them decide to sign and become Jayhawks then so be it.
drgnslayr said:
Marco said:
but don't go all in on six or seven guys who want to bolt as soon as possible.
Problems exist by chasing the top tier. These problems are far more than just the year we have them (starting guys with zero experience).
The problems start BEFORE we sign them, even if we don't sign one of them! Think about how many really quality players pass on Kansas because they don't want to sit on the bench behind an OAD? (only to be passed on again after the OAD leaves by bringing in another OAD!)
And then we have the problem of having all these players leave after only one year. Constant holes to fill, and we usually don't have quality depth built in that position because the OAD hogged the PT!
I really enjoy the eye candy of watching those guys stuff the ball. But I've come to think they are all "fool's gold."
Thank you, another point I was just fixing to make. The turnover with those guys leaving, on top of however many the number of seniors that happen to be graduating is too much. That's one reason why I'm looking forward to this year's team, none of our freshmen are going to leave early.
I think Enaruna is going to surpise, ditto Braun.
@FarmerJayhawk We can get Xavier Foster.
jayballer73 said:
Was doing some looking this morning with the rankings of 2020 recruits. Found kind of interesting. KU is listed as in the recruits top 5 schools mentioned - - OR has had a CB pick in10 out of the top 24 recruits for 2020 - -BUT then out of the next 56 recruits - -that I stopped at # 80 - - KU is only mentioned with - - 4 times.
So that got me to thinking this , Are we spending to much time on the top elite top 20 players/recruits & not enough time trying to recruit that middle tier player? - - -Just seems our success rate with these top level elite players are at a minimum Then we are losing out on some pretty quality 2-3 yr players - -plyers that might just need a little more time but yet very good players - -solid that will stick with the program and develop.
It kind of looks like we are spending all of our recruiting efforts on the Top - -Top players and not so much for the Upper end but not elite players - ending up costing us - -which puts us in a scramble mode - running around looking like a chicken with our heads cut off scrambling to fill the roster/position needs -- Plan - -A - - B -- C. - At least at 1st glance seems to be the case - I mean from the 24th ranked player to the 80th ranked player - -not to be even listed as one of the kids top5 School that the kid is interested in? - -only 4 kids out of 56? - Something seems kind of funny there - -Are we just not recruiting these kids? - - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Look, if we had a roster where all 13 scholarships were taken by top 100 recruits and even players just outside of it (guys like Mason, Graham, Agbaji, Enaruna, Braun and McBride) we would be no worse than now, in fact an arguement could be made that we might even be better. I say we keep our roster stacked with at least ten of those guys on a yearly basis. If one or two highly ranked players happen to fall our way (which they will, Duke, Kentucky and North Carolina cannot sign them all) then fine, but don't go all in on six or seven guys who want to bolt as soon as possible.
At the 5, Dok and Dave; 4 - Silvio and Mitch; the 3, Enaruna and Garrett. With Dotson and McBride running point and Agbaji and Braun at the 2 I am more than comfortable with that ten man rotation. McBride, Braun, Garrett and Agbaji are interchangeable, play them at three spots when and where as needed. I'll put those ten guys up against anyone this coming season. Rock Chalk, baby!
@approxinfinity I don't see where Wilson is any better than Enaruna to be honest, maybe a somewhat better shooter. What would he give us besides a body that we don't already have in Enaruna and Braun?
@jayballer73 I don't think he is going to sign with us. We'll zero in and try to nab Walker, concentrate on the '20 class.
@BeddieKU23 Nudging the door open and keeping it there. 😉
@BShark Like I said, there are ways to make them leave. He's a spoiled brat, had to go.
Fightsongwriter said:
@FarmerJayhawk seeing the pics it strikes me that they all are guys that will eat nails and love KU. With Q and Vick we had bad juju going. Psyched up for this group to get back to chopping wood!!!
As I have said, I am much more excited about this group than I was last. These guys have a chance to be special.
@justanotherfan I agree, now that Dotson has come back. Play DD and McBride at the point, Garrett as a reserve 3 and 2. I think we'll see Dotson and McBride play together quite a bit. This lineup has depth and versatility, all ten will play.
KirkIsMyHinrich said:
BShark said:
@dylans make KU rebound again!!!
And play defense.
Yeah, our defense has been lacking for awhile now. It would be nice to see them defend the three again.
JAYHAWKFAN214 said:
GUENTIN GRIMES IS GONING TO TRANFERRING PER TO BILL SELF
Now there's a surprise, huh?
I say that we split PG time equally between McBride and Garrett. McBride offers offensive firepower, and let's face it Garrett will be best served coming off the bench to fill in at three positions.
So @jayballer73 what happened to Apollo Jackson? Has he signed with anyone yet?
wissox said:
@Marco Good stuff, but you've got to discover the joy of writing in paragraphs!
Lol! I am more than capable of writing paragraphs.
dylans said:
As frustrated as I am as a fan about recruiting I can only imagine how the staff feels. And they have to keep a smile on and go do it again today. Played twice in the same month. Poor guys, hope they have a plan D E and F.
I think, at this point, that their plan is to get to the '19-'20 season and go all in on the '20 and '21 recruits. Three that I want to be Jayhawks? Xavier Foster, Ty Berry and Bryce Thompson.
jayballer73 said:
BShark said:
@jayballer73 I believe you like Kyree Walker about as much as I do. Sounding like KU will make a push to get him for next season, but it would be late, maybe even Brandon Rush late.
Ya I like him a lot. - when I watch clips of him , and I know they are high lite clips but looks like the kid can be a pretty physical player , like I've mentioned here I believe , seen where they call him like a positionless player. - - I think from the way it sounds and I know if he re-classifies I'm sure things will change drastically but as of the moment - for him it was like 3 teams he was listing -Arkansas - - Memphis - -& KU.
the kid can score for sure - -would be a nice fit at the 2 give us some outside scoring - got some serious hops as you know - -decent handles.
I think when you talking late you mean as far as him committing right ? - -If that is what you mean I understand as the latest article I saw on him was that he wasn't really even focusing on that right now - -with playing in the circuit - -I think I read that ends up in like the latter part of July. - I hope we can get him to re-classify - but like I posted earlier in one of the threads - even if we do I refuse to let my hopes rise until he literally commits as this year as really chapped my ass on this whole recruiting process. - keep our fingers crossed there is mutual interest buddy. - -ROCK CHALK ALL DAY LONG BABY
Lol! Man, I feel ya! I'm at this point ready to just start the season and see if we might be able sign someone come November!
Yeah, it seems (and I didn't want to be) that I was right all along about Dotson not coming back. Starting 5 - Dok, Silvio, Enaruna, McBride and Agbaji. Bench - McCormack, Mitch, Braun and Garrett. Need to start building for the future, that being Enaruna, McBride and Braun. Dok and Silvio should be fine in the interior.
Garrett is a bench player, nothing more, might as well turn McBride loose and get some scoring. Enaruna will surprise at the 3 spot and sometimes 4, ditto Braun who will get time at the four, three and two (and in a pinch could even play some 1). Garrett will back McBride and Enaruna. Agbaji needs to flat out ball at the 2.
Coach Self needs to play - and I mean really play - all nine of these guys, constantly mixing and matching for us to be as good as we can be. Defense, lock down defense needs to be this team's calling card. There are alot of mix and match possibilities. I do not think that we will get Wilson, though with that being said I am still looking forward to next season.
Grimes will never be NBA material. The Michigan State game aside (which also didn't impress me due to them playing off the ball thinking that he could and would drive), I knew it after only a few games - a slow mover both with and without the ball, hesitant while trying to decide on his shot, shoddy defender at best.
Three players that I want us to go all in on? Xavier Foster, Ty Berry and Bryce Thompson, all three being top shelf multi-year players.
@BShark This next team is going to D up.
KUSTEVE said:
Here's my case for Marcus being better at pg than anywhere else on the floor:
1- Teams sag off of Marcus because of his crappy jump shot. But teams NEVER sag off the ball, because that would leave all the passing lanes wide open. Man to man...zone...they all are based on playing the ball. This means that teams sagging into the paint when Marcus was playing the wing aren't going to do that if he's bringing up the ball. So, I don't think teams are going to be able to sag off him with the ball in his hands.
2- Last year, after Doke went down, and Vick went MIA, they started driving him to the basket, and he scored 20, 18, and 15 in 3 consecutive conference games. So, we know he has the ability to drive the ball. He will probably be one of our last options, but we know he can get to the hoop. And he made many really good assists on those drives.
- The Achilles heel is the shooting. But, like many other players growing into the game, Marcus's season was a case of shooting much better in conference than he did in pre-conference. In conference play he made 47 out of 88 shots altogether for a nifty 53%. Now, he didn't suddenly turn into Svi from 3, but he did make 8 out of 25 for a 32% clip. 33% from 3 equates to a 50% two point shooter, so I don't think he's as far off as many think.
4- The best ball hawker since Russ Rob would now be essentially playing on the ball every play. His 1.4 steal rate could rise considerably playing on the ball. 2 - 2.5, maybe? Add in a 5.0 asst rate, with 10 ppg, and you have a valuable guy any way you look at it. Yes, he's going to be a pass first guy, nor will he blow away defenses with his speed like a Frank or a DD, but he could end up being very valuable in his own way.
And perhaps be an even better shooter when he gets more PT?
Dear this year's recruiting cycle, please end.
Sincerely,
Marco
I'm telling you, I am more excited about '19-'20 than I was about '18-'19. Dok on a mission, a hungry Silvio wrecking havoc on the boards, and Enaruna bringing bigtime versatility. Hopefully Dotson (if he comes back, which I am now saying that he will) will be improved in all facets as will Agbaji - that is a great starting lineup. And what is wrong with a bench of McCormack, Mitch, Braun (bigtime shooter), Garrett (bigtime defender and distributor) and McBride (bigtime shooter)? How many teams in America would like to have those ten players? And how many teams have done more with less? I'll say it again, Coach Self was very smart in signing Enaruna, Braun and McBride. The question now is, who should we pursue in '20?
FarmerJayhawk said:
BShark said:
FarmerJayhawk said:
BShark said:
HighEliteMajor said:
Say Dotson doesn't come back. So what?
NIT
Lol at this. We could run out Free State High and Self would get them to 5th in the league.
G: Garrett
G: Ochai
G: Wilson
F: Silvio
F: Doke
That's a possible Sweet 16 team.
Now do it but w/o Wilson since he is far from a lock. It's definitely worrisome and Doke can't be counted to stay healthy all year. Even if he did I think it's borderline without Dotson. That said, hopefully Dotson announces his return in the next 24 hours. Seeing lots of kids announcing they will be back today.
Sure. I don't think there's much difference. Just replace him with Enaruna. If Self goes NIT starting 4 top 55 recruits then we may have a problem.
So you agree, Enaruna is a bigtime keeper? I don't think that we are getting Wilson.
We have to build around Enaruna, Braun and McBride.... Let me say this, I think that all three of those guys are future pros.
I got a new thread, Season 19-20 and Beyond, check it out.... I'm interested in your take.
Daddy has spoken,,, time to move on. A 2019-20 starting lineup of Dok, Silvio, Enaruna, Dotson and Agbaji with Dave, Mitch, Braun, Garrett and McBride - I am not factoring Wilson - coming off the bench does not sound half bad for next season. That is, in my opinion, a Big12 champion and Sweet 16 - possibly even Elite 8 - NCAA tournament team.
Where things are going to get dicey is after next season, when Dok, Silvio (probably), Mitch, Dotson and Agbaji (maybe) are all gone. If that were to happen, that leaves us having to fill eight scholarships with only five returnees.
Enaruna, Braun and McBride will be sophomores at that point, all three being important long-term cogs, you feel me? Big Dave will be a junior, add a juco and a redshirt (one we will have to add and sit this coming season) to round out that class. Marcus Garrett will be the lone senior, but if we can add a couple grad transfers - not huge names, just solid contributors - that will give us three seniors.
That leaves four scholarships to give. If we can land four freshman and out of those four get ourselves a highly ranked big man (twenty to thirty range) who is willing to wait his turn, a skilled at both ends PG, a versatile inside/out forward and a combo guard/forward then I am stoked.
I believe that that is going to be the case (eight scholarships to fill) and to be honest I am excited. The possibilities offered by such a scenario - class balance, depth, and the youth of Enaruna, Braun and McBride - point to great things coming our way, in '19-'20 and beyond.
I am quite serious, being not at all delusional, when saying that I am looking forward to the '19-'20 tip-off while keeping an eye on the upcoming seasons.
Enaruna, Braun and McBride make a foundational class, one that we can add pieces to and build around for the next four seasons. If they pan out the way that I expect them to (I think all three are future pros) their impact will be felt for years to come and alot of solid pieces will still be around long after they are gone.
It is time to zero in on the '20 class and cast a wide net for players who fill that mold. Do you agree, and who should we try to land? Imagine adding Xavier Foster, Bryce Thompson and Ty Berry (to name three that I like) to Enaruna, Braun and McBride. We need class balance, I am so looking forward to the OAD rule being gone.
And daddy has spoken,,, let's move on. A starting lineup of Dok, Silvio, Enaruna, Dotson (hopefully), and Agbaji with Dave, Mitch, and a combination of Braun, Garrett and McBride coming off the bench doesn't sound half bad.
Marco said:
Just taking everything into account, how he loves KU and the coaching staff, how they have been on him from day one, how he is announcing on Get Up tomorrow morning and with his homeboy Jalen being on campus Thursday (probably accompanied by RJ) I think, like I said, that we are going to land both RJ and Wilson, but, man!, daddy is starting to make me real nervous,,, in a LaVar Ball kind of way. Oh well, guess we'd only have to put up with him for one year.
And daddy has spoken......
Just taking everything into account, how he loves KU and the coaching staff, how they have been on him from day one, how he is announcing on Get Up tomorrow morning and with his homeboy Jalen being on campus Thursday (probably accompanied by RJ) I think, like I said, that we are going to land both RJ and Wilson, but, man!, daddy is starting to make me real nervous,,, in a LaVar Ball kind of way. Oh well, guess we'd only have to put up with him for one year.
@BShark I like Berry, alot. But it would appear by watching the highlights that he needs to work on using his left hand and going to that side. That being said, I think that KU should strongly consider offering him a spot
BShark said:
@HighEliteMajor It's a double edged sword. Don't offer a spot/minutes and you miss guys. Recruiting is a tough balance and there is a reason that it's always a handful of coaches/programs at the top with sustained excellence.
@FarmerJayhawk I can see the point of the staff on it. I really like all the guards you listed and have mentioned them before. But also in that post I don't see a ton of harm in offering and taking Berry early if he wants to be a Jayhawk. It really boils down to how many guards KU is going to need to take.
One last thing is that I think Self has been bitten more often than not with super early commitments in the past, these are ones I can remember...
Peters: development plateaued, some weird crap went down and eventually he quit basketball
Jacobs: development plateaued and also didn't really grow at all, got recruited over (McBride) before even enrolling and ended up at Depaul
Woolridge: not sure what the deal was here, but he wasn't good
Frankamp: not really B12 level
Brannen Greene: actually one of the most successful really early commits, which says a lot
So maybe Bill wants to mainly wait to take kids until they are SRs in HS.
Berry is a keeper..... An in-state PG as good as he is needs to - even if we offered would he sign? That is how good he is - be a Jayhawk. Don't forget, though we would presumably (if he signs) not have Hampton we would still have McBride who like Berry I say is way underrated. That would be a great PG rotation, perhaps splitting time and getting equal minutes while pressuring the ball at both ends. I don't necessarily think that we should bypass recruiting players like Hampton or Grimes or Wiggins, but do know that signing an Enaruna or a Berry along the way is worth its weight in gold. We haven't really had any depth the past few seasons.
KirkIsMyHinrich said:
Both. I believe he'll start at the 4, though. Silvio didn't attempt a 3-pointer as a freshman and I haven't seen or heard anything to make me believe that he'll be prolific from 3 as a junior. What we did from Silvio as a freshman is that he's a very good rebounder (his freshman numbers exrapolated to about 17 rebounds per game), so I'm hoping he is somewhere near the rim where he can give us 2nd chance points on offense. I'm also expecting him to be used as a screener in Dotson/RJ pick-and-rolls ad nauseam, using his quickness to roll to the rim for easy lobs or creating open floaters for Dotson/RJ. Occasional jumpshot or maybe 3-pointer from Silvio, but unless he's making that shot with some frequency, I don't think it'll be Kansas' most efficient form of offense.
So you think that Dotson is going to return? I do not.... But I have been wrong on countless occasions this year, so what do I know?
Marco said:
HighEliteMajor said:
@Marco You said, "... fill out the rest of the roster with top 20 to 75 guys." Your point is one that I have discussed here on multiple occasions. I think it is a good one. I firmly believe that the key is that the coach has to make a commitment to the players outside of OAD range (up to a certain level) that he will never recruit over them with a presumed OAD. Committing to avoiding the presumed OAD is the key. That is completely realistic. It's as simple as doing it. Further, it would set a tenor for the program, it would free up a massive amount of time that was otherwise spent chasing the next Andrew Wiggins, and most of all, it would fit better with Bill Self as a coach. If a school like KU focuses on that range of recruits, I fail to see how we can't land a nice crop each season.
@BShark I think sometimes we confuse the "fielding the best team" with pursuing presumed OADs. I firmly believe presumed OADs don't make the best "team."
I totally agree.
That is (prior recruiting whiffs aside) one of the things that I like most about this class, landing Braun, Enaruna and McBride. He locked those guys in, and now looks likely to also land Hampton and Wilson. Not too shabby - talent, depth, and (Hampton aside) four multi-year guys.
So, what - boring Memorial Day weekend, everything's underwater - do you guys think? Is Dotson coming back? Man, was thinking back on our (my) misses this year on recruiting (Tucker was a great miss), usually have a good feel. I'll say this, though, (mark it down fellas!) if Self reels in Hampton and Wilson on top of Enaruna, McBride and Braun I will never doubt him again. The trial and Silvio's suspension damn near tanked us.
@jayballer73 Been pretty hairy around here. I live near Neody, roads and even small towns in the surrounding 50 mile area are underwater and have been evacuated. The rain needs to stop.