Moore has 5 assists, acc to ESPN box score. And still managed to find his way for 2 bad shots.
mayjay
7180 posts
The full statement by the NCAA announcing what they laughably term Silvio's "reinstatement decision" says that the decision was based on facts provided by KU. Whether de Sousa was not a party to the statement of facts would be pretty much the only factor that would allow him to challenge the factual basis for the decision. If he was, his only challenge would be to the severity.
From NCAA.com:
NCAA provides reinstatement decision for Kansas’ Silvio De Sousa
February 1, 2019 6:05pm
University of Kansas men’s basketball student-athlete Silvio De Sousa must sit out the remainder of the 2018-19 season and the 2019-20 season because his guardian received payment from a university booster and agent and agreed to receive additional funds from the same person.
According to the facts provided for purposes of the reinstatement request, De Sousa’s guardian received payment of $2,500 from an agent and booster of the school. He agreed to accept additional payment of $20,000 from the same individual and an Adidas employee for securing De Sousa’s enrollment at Kansas.
According to the guidelines adopted by the NCAA Division I membership, when a prospective student-athlete allows a third party to involve himself in the recruitment process, the prospective student-athlete is then responsible for the actions of that person, regardless of whether the prospective student-athlete had knowledge or if benefits were received. Membership guidelines state the starting point for these violations is permanent ineligibility, but the NCAA staff recognized mitigation based on the specific circumstances of this case when making its decision.
When a school discovers an NCAA rules violation has occurred, it must declare the student-athlete ineligible and may request the student-athlete’s eligibility be reinstated. The NCAA staff reviews each student-athlete reinstatement request individually based on its own specific facts. This decision may be appealed to the Division I Student-Athlete Reinstatement Committee, which is comprised of representatives from NCAA schools.
@wissox It wasn't directed particularly at you. I was reacting to the automatic "what about..." that seems to permeate every discussion when anyone gets caught or accused of anything. We saw it with Trump (what about JFK? and HRC's email servers?), with the idiot Va governor today (what about McConnell and the Confed flag?), with BLM (what about inner city shootings?)... And on and on. And my major point is that people have said "what about KU?" for years.
Every "what about" may or not be a legit question, but they distract from any discussion about an offense or punishment. My sole concern is whether SDS was treated too harshly--not because I think other schools get treated better but because I think the NCAA doesn't give two shits about individual athletes when they decide to set a brutal example.
Ayton? I have no idea, but I am actually very sure if UAz had consented to the facts we did while Ayton was still in school they would have been treated the same way.
@wissox I believe his finalized package got to the NCAA while they were closed over Christmas and New Years. Then it took until the 3rd game in January for his eligibility determination to be made. (Incidentally, Wikipedia incorrectly says he was ruled ineligible fall semester last season for not meeting IMG requirements, but he actually was just still in HS!)
Very harsh commentary from Norlander with some new info:
@Fightsongwriter Maybe a huge tractor trailer. He would probably block the bus, then get replayed on ESPN highlights forever.
I think he is being held responsible for the guardian's Maryland arrangement as well, not just the $2500. So the amounts discussed about DJ, and others, pale in comparison to the $60K.
Oddly, this initial solicitation by the guardian could be the type of thing that leads to a Zion apocalypse--if KT reveals what he knows about the family seeking money before signing with Duke.
So, ESPN is being looked on here as being biased in favor of KU. Maybe Fran is secretly talking us up among his colleagues? And, for you Fran haters, maybe his motive is to keep us ranked higher so it would look even better if ISU wins?
@KirkIsMyHinrich Maybe they could save money by just offering it to the "general students" living in the bb dorm.
@DanR My point was that other people have long said those things, and I was responding to someone else who brought up our recent AA's as if that disproved my comment that KU haters say stuff.
@DanR The initial eligibilty determination has nothing to do with information subsequently received. Now, if SDS or his guardian ever informed the NCAA about the guardian's shitty discharge of his fiduciary duties, that could be a good basis for an appeal!
Anyway, ask Rose and UMemphis about whether a school can ride an initial clearance into clear skies.
@Crimsonorblue22 Yes, let's snipe at people on this board who say things that make us uncomfortable.
I heard no rumors about Mason or DG or other hidden diamonds. I have, however, encountered many accusations about claims of KU illegal recruiting going back to Philadelphia native Wilt. I remember comments about Mario's dad, and then there is Danny. Let's see--do you buy Shady's dream? Few people outside KU do. The Morii? I remember all types of comments. For virtuslly every top recruit we have had. Remember a car accident last year we thought saved our bacon?
I am not saying I believe that stuff--only that we cannot defend ourselves successfully by crying a river about equally unproven accusations.
@DanR The best precedent I see was Bowen, who tried to get them to do his as basically a one year ban. He was made inactive before ever playing for UL, and transferred to SC in January that year. SC tried to get him ruled eligible after the standard two semester period for transfers (i.e., at midseason his soph yearl -- essentially trying to get credit for not playing his freshman year. The NCAA said being held out wouldn't matter, and he would be out his full soph year. So he entered the draft after freshman year after all.
The Bowen case seems really close in severity given that his total time sitting after eligibility concerns were raised would have been exactly the same as SDS--2 years bench time. SDS, of course, actually played his freshman year, which I think greatly hurts his case.
@jayhawkcsg The NCAA statement quoted in the LJW article says exactly what you suspected: the punishment for accepting improper inducements starts at permanent ineligibility and can be reduced from there.
The two year ban for SDS says that the NCAA considered the facts as almost bad enough for a permanent ban. It really should not surprise anyone because his guardian was involved in what had to be a slew of transactions to accomplish the several payments and the planned repayment.
I hate their approach of not seeming to care whether Silvio benefitted personally, but this is vastly different from accepting gifts or a training trip or the crap Selby got 9 games for. It involved, if the charges are accurate, not one but two schemes to "pay for play" at 2 different schools. The alleged booster was working to get SDS to KU instead of UMd.
Protecting the eligibility rules is obviously the highest priority of the NCAA--lower schools would scream bloody murder if tens of thousands of dollars were allowed to purchase an athlete's switch in attendance from a "lower school" to a blue blood and all he had to do to get away with it was to send out the 3 monkey emojis.
The fact is, we all hated the safety net of convenient ignorance that protected Cam Newton. So the NCAA got rid of that precedent. Now we don't like the consequences.
Haste makes waste, and our desperation to get SDS eligible at midyear may have hindered KU"s due diligence here. I hope it was an excusable oversight, but as it is, labelling the Adidas guy a KU booster means, I believe, that we may be toast.
As to all the whining about UAz and Zion, give it a rest and stop blinding yourself. UAz was a rumor based on unsubstantiated claims of a leaked tape. No direct evidence, as was essentially the case with the Zion family demand revealed (allegedly) by KT (whose failure to back away from recruiting ZW after that is possibly damning in itself).
I wish people would not be so anxious to point fingers based on suspicion and conjecture. KU has long been the butt of speculative jokes about how we must pay urban elites to come out to farm country to a good, but by no means elite, school. Those accusations have infuriated me. Now we see there may be some shadiness after all, and it is scary. But no excuse to act batshit crazy whining that "Johnny didn't get an 8th hour" like our guy did.
Stand up, face up, take it like adults.
Suffering greatly here in SC. Got down into the 20's. Supposed to get up to 72 on Tuesday.
We miss the snow sometimes, but not that bitter cold! Good luck, everybody. Stay smart and stay safe. Gets to the teens here and people start acting real stupid. So, no indoor bonfires no matter how much you want s'mores to warm you up. And don't plug 5 portable heaters into 3 extension cords.
@Fightsongwriter No problem, I assure you. I am sure he is as flattered as I!
@Fightsongwriter That might be the first time anyone has confused me with @HighEliteMajor!
@Fightsongwriter Great post, but I hope Kurtis only says any particular number for 3 or 4 days, then reduces it.
@approxinfinity We forget that 30 years ago, no one expected very many freshman to contribute very much (remember the quote that the best thing about a freshman is that he would be a sophomore?). Our expectations have risen substantially as college ball moved inexorably into the OAD era. Some kids may simply still have the longer learning curve.
@Texas-Hawk-10 This year's doldrums by the starters certainly caused lots of us to wish for the energy we watched Silvio provided off the bench last year. With him unavailable, Ochai has fulfilled the role of jumpstarter nicely. We have seen others do it over the years. In '08, it was Collins, who played more minutes off the bench in many games than some starters.
That said, it is more important to find a way to prevent the doldrums on the starters than to keep applying a fix during games. Introducing Ochai's energy at the beginning instead of suffering through Grimes' indecisiveness would match his athleticism with Vick's, and with Dotson's speed added to the mix, who knows? It might be really fun to watch, reminiscent of the Razorbacks' Delph, Moncrief and Brewer in '77-'78.
wissox said:
@KirkIsMyHinrich I saw that. I blinked, rubbed my eyes, looked away thinking it was part of a bad dream, looked back, and yes, it was still there.
Actually, although it is real, it IS still a bad dream. Nightmare, really.
I wonder if Bill sees the UK game as less important in the long run, and could be willing to let mistakes be major teaching moments. If a loss, then he motivates the kids (i.e., kicks their butts to Jupiter) for the following trio which are conf games.
Kcmatt7 said:
Taking bets on the day Sutton gets fired/retires?
Disappeared?
@approxinfinity Last online 25 days ago. He might be on a federal contract stranded overseas by the shutdown....
@approxinfinity I love how often we tell @BShark what he really means!
@approxinfinity By then you will be a typically frustrated angry parent who cannot remember your heart melting.
@tundrahok Well, okay, but wrapping him in a blanket and cuddling would likely not have gone well.
@approxinfinity Good choice! Sometimes babies, even if totally nuts, are easier to deal with than the endings of games.
Especially when, upon calming down, they just give you the sweetest innocent look and your heart melts.
When did anyone's heart melt looking at a player who had been driving you nuts?
@DanR Sounds pretty screwed up to me. 🏀 or 👶 . . . How to choose?...
Better at the end tonite!
@Crimsonorblue22 Checked on our private jet, but alas, it is not available. Hope you have a blast!
@tundrahok I got the airball shot 30 secs before confused with his end shot.
I was only commenting on Vick's desire to be the man, not whether he should be or whether his choice was smart or even acceptable.
Do you remember Sherron Collins shooting as he fell out of bounds after dribbling into the corner during the Comeback? I thought it was an idiot move that would cost us the game--until it went in. I doubt that anyone watching thought otherwise.
@Bosthawk Vick tried at the end. Had his 3 ptr gone in, we would have been acclaiming his taking over. All this discussion about needing someone to step up ignores that he tried to.
Now, obviously, an air ball is more of a trip up than a successful step up, but he did not shy away from the moment.
In addition, I have not heard about the FBI sharing information other than what was presented in the court cases by document production, disclosed depositions, and court testimony. The NCAA's new enforcement protocols allow them to use info developed by outside agencies. Forgive me, but there is no evidence of collusion.
Interestingly, the reports of Ayton's 100K payment and the supposed tape of Stumpy (I prefer Sweaty), were from leaks allegedly from FBI sources. But, as we know, nothing came of that--maybe because leaked hearsay evidence is precisely among the types of info on which the NCAA won't base a case.
@dylans Yes, he was brilliant. No other way to look at it with those numerous 3rd and long completions.
They made big plays, both good and bad (Ford!). But secondary couldn't stop any 3rd and 10 in last 3 drives. Safeties always set up beyond the 1st down line. Coverages should at least occasionally have been designed to deny the ball, rather than post-catch tackle. Berry was in great position, once, but allowed the big Gronk catch by paying no attention to the ball.
And don't get me started on KC's inability to actually tackle a running back. Finger tackling is not actually a successful football skill.
@Texas-Hawk-10 Oh, of course! But there would be much less drama if they can just spike it. After today, I hate drama.
@Texas-Hawk-10 I don't think you can spike a fumbled snap. A spike has to be done immediately by the qb under center. I think that would be intentional grounding, as happened in 2011 when the Bears qb backed up a couple steps and spiked. 10 sec runoff of the clock.
However, the holder could pick up the snap and throw out past the downfield guys to stop the clock.
Couldn't resist. Sorry.
@Crimsonorblue22 Well, then, I guess it really applies: YOU GO, GIRL!
Crimsonorblue22 said:
Thx for letting me cuss
A lot of that going around. Even my wife!
@Texas-Hawk-10 He didn't bother me as much as Vick returning to playing a position 14 feet away from the basket and allowing a 3 pt shot. Twice, he actually started moving closer to the shooter. Then the shooter hesitated, Vick stopped moving out, and a 3 pt swish followed. I can only surmise that Vick is utterly terrified of someone driving baseline right by him.
I have no source for advanced stats and metrics, but I would be willing to bet $10 that Vick's assigned covers have cashed more 3 ptrs by far than any other KU defender's assigned guys.
Woodrow said:
Anthony Edwards will officially visit February 9
Will his residuals from ER and Top Gun cause amateur issues?
jayhawkcsg said:
Crimsonorblue22 said:
🐦 View Tweet?s=21
OK, i watched it. He didn't hammer him. questionable for sure.
Looks to me after 12 or more viewings like Grimes' arm could have hit the shooter's arm or shoulder. If not, the shooter's body still seems to twist on the way down, maybe from a flop stemming from remarkable body control.
More importantly, it could have looked like contact to the refs, who did not get to view this play from that angle, in slow-motion, with many repeated playbacks, and enlarged. One ref on the baseline was blocked by Grimes, and the ref on the sideline was blocked by the shooter.
They could only see a sequence where the shot goes off, then the shooter's sideways body movement just as Grimes is within inches, and then the shooter appears to fall from contact.
Wong calls are not automatically bad calls just because technology provides after the fact opportunities to second-guess everything. This was both a reasonable and an understandable call under the circumstances. Had the shooter been our guy, we would have screamed bloody murder if a foul had not been called.
KirkIsMyHinrich said:
Virginia is the last man standing. Might lose to Duke later today, though.
UVA might be extra motivated after their swan dive in the tourney last year.
@dylans Sports isn't the temptation we were thinking about. 🤑
@jayballer73 "Huggy doesn’t think the Doctors want him jumping and running at this point right now."
I am totally sure the doctors have advised Huggy not to run and jump around as well, but nothing stops him!
@dylans True friend!
My understanding is that when there is a serious question about eligibility the NCAA and the school put a hold on the player's eligibility status pending the school's investigation, and then the findings are submitted. Then the NCAA makes its own review and determination.
Playing a player in a hold status means you are playing a player not determined to be eligible. At best, you can only hope to get away with it if all the facts completely dispel any questions about eligibility, but I think that even in those circumstances a school commits a new violation.
The NCAA determines every athlete's eligibility. Until an athlete is declared eligible, you cannot play him. Silvio's back at square one in this process.
@approxinfinity Higher volume outside shooting, perhaps?