Saw on twitter we could be getting the PHILADELPHIA EAGLES DB coach? Like from the NFL? DK McDonald. Was at ISU before Philly.
benshawks08
4625 posts
If we really want bench production, start Braun and bring in Hunter at the first stoppage.
Someone already probably said this, but did we learn anything last night or is OSU just bad?
@benshawks08 I gotta remember the rest of College Basketball is equally messy as our hawks. Still ranked #8 this week with a bunch of opportunities to win some big home and road games to come. A 1 seed is still very much in play.
@bskeet If this team makes the Elite 8 that will definitely surpass my expectations.
@bskeet This is good perspective. For how long was this board obsessed with Self focusing more on winning each individual game than preparing the team for success in March? Maybe this is actually some growth there. Then again you have the BIG minutes for the starters really piling up. But he even tried to manage that v ISU too with lots of subs early.
@BeddieKU23 I'd really hoped he'd turned a corner as a scorer after his hot start. But apparently that was a hot start rather than a legitimate change in who he is as a shooter. I do think he's continued to be aggressive and has taken on the toughest role as being the ONLY guy that can drive to score or try to go get a bucket, but yeah, more efficiency would be great especially because I don't think we can count on Furphy to maintain the level he's played at the last several games.
But really, scoring hasn't been the big issue the last several games. This team is getting picked apart on D. It feels very easy for the other team to score at times. Run ball screens until either Johnny, Nick, or Hunter are guarding you, then drive or step back. If that doesn't work, make two passes and someone will be open because the help Juan, KJ, and Kev are trying to provide to the weak links.
I imagine Jay Wright was chuckling all game watching Iowa State do to Self what he did. There will be adjustments and wrinkles thrown in especially against teams like Houston and Baylor if I had to guess but we let too many BAD shooters feel so comfortable that they can heat up and make 3s in bunches. Hopefully the law of averages will help this team later in the season as we've already had our share of fluky performances shooting wise from teams who don't usually light it up from out there.
@jayballer67 I've had a lot of the same sinking feelings. He is kind of the Anti-Juan. If you look at his stats, he's sitting here at 18 and 11 with double doubles everywhere and you have to think, wow this guy is GREAT. And as an individual player at the college level he is great because he's very tall and can shoot. But I'm not sure what he does well besides those two things. You talk about him being big but he really doesn't even get that good of low post position a lot of times because he either doesn't work hard enough for it, or is too tired or not strong enough to get it. He gets lots of rebounds but how often have we seen him GO GET a rebound? They mostly come to him because he's tall, generally camped out near the bucket and playing 30 minutes a game.
And I totally agree, I have no idea where we'd be without him on this team but it is starting to make sense to me how he could put up such big numbers on underachieving teams at Michigan. The big question isn't would we rather have him or Braun in. That's a no brainer. But, maybe like you, this is just a grass is always greener type take, but I think I might have been happier with Udeh and Zuby instead of Hunter and Parker.
And to be clear, Hunter isn't THE reason this team is 1-3 on the road in the big 12. That has more to do with a gaping hole at the guard spot. This team was counting on having one more guard who could, ya know, guard, but also handle the ball, shoot it, and be a threat to get his own shot. Elmarko just isn't ready to do all that yet. And Furphy is great at what he is doing right now but he's really more of a 3/4 than a 2/3.
So @jayballer67 I won't be cussing you or even disagreeing. Hunter is a great player, but the question of has he been great for this team is definitely up in the air to me.
@jayballer67 Hunter and Kev can’t buy a bucket
@kjayhawks My fear is that Hunter is the real problem. He is slow and often doesn’t appear to try real hard on ball screens. One of those last possessions where it looked like Furphy lost his man and recovered super late, in my opinion it was more a lack of communication and effort from Hunter on how they were handling that screen.
But yeah. The switching seems bad. We get torched because at this point everyone knows it’s coming and has a plan for how to deal with it. They either work to get the matchup they want and gone one one (wish we had ANYONE that could take advantage of a bad matchup on the other end) or they work to get Hunter involved in off ball screens where he either gets lost or just can’t get to the spot he needs to to support the guy getting screened.
Usually Bill has some wrinkles and I don’t think we’ve really seen any yet. He’s likely been saving them for what he thinks are the tougher teams but the record now means every game is huge.
On another note, anyone noticed a lack of moving screens being called? And not like disproportionally or anything but just in general. I feel like screeners are getting away with murder this year. KJ had to literally hockey check a guy to get it called today.
@FarmerJayhawk said in KU vs Cryclones Game Chat:
Caveats apply but interesting 🐦 View Tweet?s=46&t=c0LiaNrxev6XfT7LIH8dAQ
Really hoping we’re using up all our bad luck now and saving the good luck for later.
@Crimsonorblue22 Pretty sure it's Bilas then Fran when it comes to pecking order to get big 12 games for ESPN. Bilas is usually more of the ACC guy but will pop in for the BIG games in the Big 12. At least that's how it has seemed. I have no actual knowledge of the process for who gets what games. The ESPN plus announces almost always seem like back ups though I think I remember Bilas taking an ESPN plus game because it was KU vs. some other top 10ish team at Allen. I may have also hallucinated that.
@Crimsonorblue22 I think it's just that we've had more ESPN plus games of late and Fran isn't usually on those.
K state fans on twitter are acting like it’s the first time they’ve played at ISU. Of course the foul calls were bad. Of course the fans boo calls that are very regular and fine. Of course the fans are classless. Like where has kstate been all these years?
@drgnslayr Phones, sure. COVID year is big too. I think this is the last year of REALLY OLD guys staying around? Or is that next year? Must be next because Juan and Hunter can stay, right?
Another factor could also be COVID itself. Brain fog was a documented symptom and serious cases of Long COVID are still being studied as well. Wonder what the cognitive affects would be noticed if they are more mild and could be attributed to any number of factors.
Saw an interesting post that now I can't find the link to about where the last 10 NCAA Champs were ranked at this point in the season. I think only 1 was #1 (Nova) and most where hanging in the top 5 or top 10 with the UConn coming out of no where twice. So, sitting at 7 isn't the worst place to be. Though I'd be curious about the kenpom rankings of those champs at the same point in the season.
@BeddieKU23 I'd disagree about Hunter and KJ. Those percentages aren't bad and for KJ especially, it's how he is going to contribute to the offense and help provide a little more space for Hunter to get the truly easy ones. That doesn't mean I want KJ to shoot that 15 footer EVERY time it is open, but a couple a game can do wonders to keeping a defense more honest and prevent more clogging of the lane.
@drgnslayr You know they are hearing that four letter word over and over and over again right now. S - O - F - T !!!!!!!!!!
@approxinfinity said in KU vs Cincinnati game chat:
@rcjhdraft he made a midrange jumper from left wing yesterday. Decent form and everything (not a shot put). It shocked me. Maybe he is working on that midrange game.
Maybe we let KJ suit up for the other team some game this season. If a guy like him is playing against KU he can go 4-6 from three and really get confidence in that jumper.
@BeddieKU23 KJ's body language has not been good the last couple of games. He's either exploding off the floor for a dunk or kind of just standing around. When he's engaged and leaning on his athleticism, he is a legit player, but more and more I see him coming out of that stance and standing straight up and down or looking tired. Same goes for Juan honestly. These guys all seem TIRED. But they have the same schedule as every other team...
@BeddieKU23 I think there's a point where Self actually likes it if a guy talks back to him but I guarantee Nick isn't at that point.
I haven't gone back and read all 337 posts, but saw mention on twitter of a little back and forth between Timberlake and Self. Anyone catch when that happened or what it was about?
@kjayhawks said in KU vs Cincinnati game chat:
@wissox I have agree with @cragarhawk assessment we don’t look good even in victory. On to Saturday can we pick up a road win against a team that has a conference win? I honestly don’t care about conference titles anymore. Just go undefeated at home and sweep the Mildcats.
I'm so scared for the KSU games because you know they will at least bring energy and it doesn't seem like we can consistently count on that from our hawks this year.
@drgnslayr said in KU vs Cincinnati game chat:
The Halftime report mentioned how non-athletic KU is this year. I disagree. Sure, we've had more athletic teams... but this team just isn't hustling.
Furph the only guy to crash the boards. He still has his high school body, but he can do it.
I'm done being nice. I'm calling out the guys who aren't cutting it!
Starting with Hunter. 7'2" and only 6 rebounds. Seriously? Try moving your arse closer to the goal, also on offense, maybe score a few points.
KJ... come on, man! 3 rebounds in 38 minutes! Close your eyes next time and the ball will find you at least 5 times in 38 minutes!
Juan... 5 TOs... the worst at the end in the back court that kept Cincy in the game. Where is your head, dude?
Kevin... another great grinder game for you! The team is on your back now! Hope you can keep holding up the weight, brother! A+
Furph... what is he, 18? Body of a boy, but heart of a man... a big man! He's out there doing what our veteran guys aren't doing! A+
Come on, guys! Man the f up!
I think this is on target. I didn't watch the whole game but seemed to me when the whole team would play with energy and effort, we'd get out to a bit of a lead, then they either got tired or lost focus and would let them back in. You can literally tell every possession on D whether it will be a good one or a bad one based on how hard everyone tries on the first ball screen.
This is the most wildly inconsistent team I can remember. Game to game, even possession to possession. You just NEVER know what you are going to get.
@BeddieKU23 said in KU vs Cincinnati game chat:
Rebound game. We need this one.
Funny that you call it a rebound game. Rebounding was the main issue vs. WVU. KU got outrebounded by a lot. Again. Still, Furphy ends up with a career high 11 boards.
@jayballer67 said in KU vs No More Huggy Bear Game Chat:
@drgnslayr said in KU vs No More Huggy Bear Game Chat:
It's not fun to play the blame game... but I will.
I blame everyone except Furph and Timberlake. Both those guys played to their potential!
Everyone else played like they needed a nap. And we can't use the excuse that they play too many minutes. They do.. but so do other players in college basketball that still come to play.
We need some leadership. We need someone stepping up now and taking charge... someone to lead, cheer lead, bring energy, help establish team pride, help establish team identity.
I can see this team losing 8 - 10 games this year. Because of our wins on top teams, it should help keep our NCAA appearance string alive.
It doesn't have to be like this. We can play with anyone if we decide to.
I know this also , these two losses does not look good on our resume. I'd be willing to go out and say- -THIS Team will not be a # 1 seed come Tourney time, especially if they lose 8-10 games like you say - -I can seee them losing 8 anyways - -just not good
Looks like they have 6 more road games (is that right?). I'd say 4-2, 3-3, or even 2-4 are all possible for the road games but not really any worse than that. Then throw in 1 MAYBE even 2 losses at Allen and that's 5-6 more. another in the big 12 tourney and then more than likely one more in the NCAA tournament. That could get us to 10 or 11.
My hope is that they only drop one in Allen, and then get back to .500 on the road. That would give them a good shot at still winning the conference. As far as the one seed goes, doesn't look like anyone is solidifying themselves as a surefire 1 seed so who knows where everyone will be by March. Right now we have dropped 3 and there are only a handful of 2 loss teams out there. And it's not like those other teams don't have some headscratchers too as far as bad losses go...
@approxinfinity He definitely has more foot speed to do what needs to be done in those situations, but not the experience in Self's system. People always wonder why freshman and transfers struggle offensively but it's more about what he demands players do on D. When it works it's elite. Our title teams have both been able to lock teams down seemingly at will by turning up the pressure and having such help rotation that there just isn't a shot.
This team is getting there but WVU exposed the weaknesses pretty well and capped it off with just stupid good shooting. The 3s and all the turn around fade away jumpers don't help a defense look good. If they shoot their season average from 3 that game and nothing else changes, we win by close to double digits. I'd argue without the liquid hot first half from those guys from behind the arc, the game never gets close.
I think the defensive issues are mostly on Hunter and Furphy. They get out of position or are slow to rotate causing KJ, Kev, or Harris to have to cover MASSIVE amounts of space. They seem to be recovering late to 3 pt shooters because they've had to deny a pass into someone who is wide open under the basket. Self always says the best defensive teams help the helper. This team doesn't do that yet. And unfortunately, having 3 pretty good individual defenders can't make up for a couple of guys (more if any of the main 3 are on the bench) that just aren't engaged beyond trying to keep tabs on their own man and failing even at that. Hunter has shown some signs of improving as a low post defender but when he gets out in space, he just can't recover. The high p&r just murders him and he's left basically standing 30 feet from the hoop where he can't defend or rebound at all. They've been trying to hedge more on those to blow them up but it just isn't working. I do worry the overall switch 4 strategy just isn't going to work for this team which means we could be in for some ugly defensive games as we transition to something else.
@drgnslayr said in The Furph:
So now we expect Furph to do this every game and he'll get criticized when he doesn't make the snuff! lol
I'm hopeful we'll see a lot more games like last night from "The Furph" this year, and feel positive that we will. OSU showed off our entire team by not showing up... but still... we typically go down to Stillwater and play poorly. Not the case last night!
Furph definitely looks like our best fifth option... the team flows best with him out there. Without question!
I'm upset he was unable to duplicate his first half performance in the second. Bench him.
@approxinfinity said in Land Thieves Shooty Hoops:
Wild take: Juan is the focus of the offense next year and on Wooden Watch!
I will laugh so hard when he averages 19 and 7 a game. lol.
I think @BShark is right about the slow release. He tried to shoot vs UCF and got swatted.
I also find it contradictory that @kuballin10 says he doesn't create for others but follows it up with an example of him moving the ball to get someone else an open shot, describes him completing a difficult post entry pass for an easy bucket, and then explains how he creates for others in the pick and roll. Those are all creating for others AND show an attacking mentality.
I didn't watch all of the OSU game but do feel in the last few INCLUDING the loss to UCF Juan has been hunting his shot with a few floaters and drives trying to score.
And like it or not, Juan is a gamer. He rises to the occasion when he's most needed. He single handedly flipped the script in several games on the way to and including the National Championship so he will forever have my respect as a baller. Is he a perfect point guard? No. But no one is.
This team has the tools to win 6 games in March and Juan is one of those tools. He's not a swiss army knife, but he generally does what he's needed to do pretty well.
These Hawks also have the potential to lose in the first or second round. While this is always true, this year especially, this team has some vaulted ceilings. They can look really pretty but are really far from the floor and can be a struggle heat in cool in extreme weather.
Can you imagine if we had Grady and Hunter on the same team? Oh the spacing! I think the space of having 3 or 4 threats to score from beyond the arc on the floor at the same time is the biggest reason for the improvement in scoring and rebounding. Furph is also oddly, more of a threat in transition than we've seen from Elmarko (who seems fast and like a good finisher at the rim?).
It will be interesting to see how he holds up once some film gets out on him and some of the big 12 coaches make some plans to stop him. But he's at least made it clear, there has to BE a plan to stop him or he will score in bunches. 15 in the first half? Whew!
Felt a lot like the normal non con game before Christmas except in January. And it counts as a conference loss…
It's a little mind bending that a few of these guys are still playing. Feels like ancient history. I know the Grant-Foster situation is unique. But Enaruna? I don't even remember Isaac McBride. Latrell Josell seems like he was here 10 years ago. Who of these would we most like to have on the current roster? Thompson to sure up the 2 spot? Tristan for the 3 gun? I know some people will disagree but I still feel like Yesefu could be getting 8-12 a game here as the starting 2.
@wissox said in KU vs Wichita game chat:
I don't think anyone understands the difficulty of the school I taught in. 1/3rd of the girls who graduated my first year there were either pregnant or were moms already. Shootings, gangs, drugs, fights, etc etc were part of daily life in that neighborhood. I guess I shouldn't have brought it up since you all think you could do better in such a place.
To be clear, I’m not saying the coach was definitely a bad coach or anything about their value to the school or the community, just that the particular example you brought up doesn’t exemplify legendary coaching for me.
@benshawks08 that being said, if I can teach kids to hit a golf ball, a half decent basketball coach can teach em to dribble a basketball.
@nuleafjhawk a lot of the tournaments we played in were triple bogey max.
@wissox said in KU vs Wichita game chat:
@benshawks08 @kjayhawks He won 832 games as a High School coach, all at the same school. For a decade coached boys and girls teams simultaneously. Won 6 girls state championships. I can't believe I'm having to defend this guy but he is a coaching legend despite all of you thinking he's a chump. The situation was unique that year and yes, there were only 4 competent players. Even then they won quite a few games and qualified for the playoffs.
To me the idea that one players job was just to stay out of the way indicates a lack of commitment to teaching kids who may not come with the same advantages as some of the others. I’ve never met the coach and have no real skin in the game but maybe it’s the anecdote you chose to praise him with rather than the coach themselves. I’m sure development happened for a ton of kids and I guess it’s good they won some games. But that story just ain’t it for me.
I coached golf at a school where NO ONE on my teams had ever played golf before. Most had never even held a club or anything. By the end of each season, they could at least play a round of golf and feel comfortable on the course even if they shot 120… I coached girls soccer for a year with the freshman girls who most of whom had never played before. It never occurred to me to tell a player to just stay out of the way while the good players play. My goal was that all 24 girls got on the field every game and got better at the skills they wanted to learn. Oh and they went 11-3 that year.
@nuleafjhawk said in KU vs Wichita game chat:
You can't "teach" a kid to dribble. They either can do it or they can't. They might get better over time, but it's like running. You can either run or you can't. Or you love it or hate it. My opinion.
Yeah. That’s not how learning works. All skills can be learned if there is interest, instruction, support, and practice.
@wissox said in KU vs Wichita game chat:
@kjayhawks He's not a terrible coach. He's won multiple state championships. He coached in a really tough school.
Won state championships but couldn’t teach a kid to dribble? At the high school level I’d prefer a coach that teaches kids the game over winning any day.
We lost gage keys to auburn. Who else though?
@nuleafjhawk im really petty lucky because most folks I’m around, if i ask them to put on a mask they will. And obviously we are always wearing ours. But like if you are traveling through an airport or walking into buccees on a road trip, why not put one on to protect yourself, the people around you, and the loved ones you are about to see? Merry Christmas, as your gift I give you an illness that might impact you for the rest of your life. Hope you don’t have to work until mid January.
People not wearing masks in crowded spaces despite flu and covid going crazy while I have a chemo patient and an immunocompromised 2 week old in my house. Guess we will just stay in the house for the next 6 months. Oh wait, there’s that work thing…
@BShark said in Team discussion after 10 games:
@BeddieKU23 said in Team discussion after 10 games:
Bottom 5 offense in Self era so far via Kenpom, for whatever that is worth. They can get better and hopefully they do as you said, the sample size needs to be bigger. The early portion of conference play is a lot easier then the bottom part so we might have a chance to get into a groove and keep improving which would perhaps even out the numbers a bit. No doubt they have played a tough schedule and that's played a part in some of it.
Perhaps the one advantage to new teams joining the conference is that KU doesn't have to face every team twice. I did love that format but the last several years certainly made it difficult to have any element of surprise against teams when you face some of them up to 3 times in a season. Perhaps an advantage Self will gain against some league opponents when he doesn't have to face them twice.
The funny thing is we have shot pretty well, it's the damn turnovers mostly.
The turnovers are just a part of having a dominant big who is a clear option one. Everyone knows that’s where the ball is trying to go.
The ncaa net rankings has this team at 16! Lol. Hopefully the big 12 gauntlet will help all those computer see what’s really going on by the end of the year. If we were someone like Gonzaga, I’d be worried. But win the big 12 and all will be well for seeding.
@wissox That was supposed to be the joke. Guess it didn't land. I figured people would catch it as my "more reasonable" prediction was only a few points off of his National Championship prediction. lol
@nuleafjhawk Woah woah woah. Let's be realistic here. It is highly unlikely we would be able to hold Georgia to 3 points. A much more realistic score for us to win in that championship game would be something like 40-27 (and we still struggle with the dang extra points). So that's my far more reasonable expectation.
In other news a new jayhawk will be joining the club in 48-72 hours! My partner and my first. Wish us luck.
I think it’s important to remember that while we still have 3 key starters back from last season, the entire rest of this team is new to bill self and the system. We’ve known forever that it takes people different amounts of time to figure that out and get on the same page. Mari has an easier job off the bench. Bring energy. Play defense. Really that’s everyone’s job but it can be easier to play free when you know you aren’t being counted on to provide offense or ball control or anything else. I hope he leaves it how it is for a bit.
@Zabudda said in What to Expect at the Champions Classic?:
Hunter, Juan, Kevin, KJ
Sometimes all you need is the best 4 on the floor.
Was that Harris kid any good?