Also curious if UCF is going to keep fronting Hunter and Flory because that isn't working for them.

I also believe I heard the announcers say Moore got the start today because of his defensive abilities which he is a top 2 defender on this team.

Best half KU has played in awhile. The Dickinson-Bidunga line up appearing like it is KU's best overall line up.

@approxinfinity said in Central Flaw rid unh-uh:

Who thinks Elmarko can have a monster season next year?

Depends on how well he recovers from his injury and if he loses any explosiveness. He is who Self chose of Labaron Philon.

@rockchalkjayhawk said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@approxinfinity said in West Virginia- a game finally:

Wasnt there a players only team meeting after which the consensus was that Lucas should start in 2015-2016? Did we put Mickelson on mothballs after something like that? A precedent to put a Hunter on the shelf.

I don’t see Hunter being benched. He’s a walking talking double double! He could improve his effort level for sure, but the coaching staff needs to help him out and spread the floor to give him some room to post. If dumb asses like me can see that, surely Self can. Why he won’t is a mystery.

Would love to see him at least try four out for a spell more often.

This is a flawed roster that has a major weakness somewhere no matter what line up combination Self puts out there. A 4 guard line up couldn't average 85 ppg, but that 4 guard line only has 1 good defender and would give up 95 ppg.

Self has always prioritized defense first and that hasn't changed this season. Notice how Dan Hurley's name hasn't been thrown around as the model much this season even though UConn still has one of the top offenses in the country, their defensive ratings are pure trash and why nobody has them as a legit title contender this season.

@approxinfinity Lucas became the starter on that team because he was the best rebounder on that team which was the biggest hole on that roster. That team was by far the worst rebounding team I can remember.

@approxinfinity said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@Texas-Hawk-10 ah thats right.

Are you in the “Bidunga will start by years end” camp, if you had to guess?

I don't see Flory becoming a starter barring an injury to Hunter and I don't see him starting at the 4 under any circumstances.

Flory is a worse partner for KJ than Hunter is because Flory is a non-threat from 3 that doesn't need to be guarded out there like KJ. The reason the Flory-Hunter pairing works well is that Hunter is enough of a threat from 3 that he needs to be accounted for and that opens up the paint for Flory and KJ and when they've had the most success on offense.

Also, Flory fouls way too much still be think he can play starter level minutes yet. If he starts over KJ, he's going to be targeted and likely pick up 2 fouls pretty early most games and sit the rest of the half and not be available to gove Hunter a break.

@approxinfinity said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@rockchalkjayhawk lucas’ senior year we had dwight coleby, freshman udoka and sophomore carlton bragg. The talent was there but bragg was a headcase, and udoka was not in great shape until junior year.

As far as I can tell, Bidunga is a better option than any of those. The only problem is he is not a 4.

Doke got injured 11 games into his freshman year and had taken over the starting spot from Lucas prior to his injury, but not playing big minutes because he was still extremely raw on offense and couldn't play defense without fouling yet.

@kuballin10 said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@kjayhawks said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@Jhawk69 said in West Virginia- a game finally:

AJ and Rylan are not playing good basketball and they are causing our struggles. They are not the only factors but are the biggest factors by far. I find that fact to be obvious. Is there anyone who disagrees?

Yes as well as KJ @Kcmatt7 said and as I said above it’s because they are scared of getting yanked at every wrong move. They ain’t playing free minded in the slightest

Genius and not difficult to see. I've harped on this though with Bill on many many freshman. He gives leashes to a few but he just absolutely hates some.

He's the literal parent that plays favoritism and unless you have 4 years here to fix it he won't view you any differently. You show up and within an few practices he either likes how you play or doesn't.

AJ was brought in as a volume scorer who couldn't defend well or rebound

Self tries to make he rebound and defend and in the process kills his aggression so now he's left with a guy who can't score anymore either....took the Alpha right outta him

I got connections with the Bama program and don't be surprised to see Rylan jump back there this offseason. He's tired of watching guys get to play through mistakes after getting blasted in the RD32 last year while he played big minutes and contributed in a final 4

AJ Storr came to KU to be developed into an NBA caliber player, summarized version of his words when he committed. Being a volume scorer as a career 43% shooter and 35% from 3 wasn't going to get him to the NBA.

Here's a scouting reports on Storr after last season and what he needed to do to become an NBA level player.

"The swing skill for Storr as an NBA prospect will be his ability to score efficiently. Many players around the country can put up points on a high number of shots, but in the NBA it’s about making each one count. Storr has been fairly up-and-down as a 3-point shooter in his career, so that perimeter efficiency will be something teams monitor. Furthermore, his shot selection has been poor at times, so continuing to develop as a decision maker will be key.

At 6-foot-7, Storr has the ability to play multiple positions. However, if he’s really going to take that next leap, his ability to make those around him better will be of extreme importance. In each of his first two college seasons, he produced less than an assist per game on average. On the defensive end, he has the positional size, athleticism and ability to be impactful, but will need to become a more consistent player on that end of the floor to emerge as a two-way threat."

I find it curious how a lot of the things you're criticizing Bill Self for in the skills he's attempting to develop in Storr line up pretty well with what NBA scouts believe AJ Storr needs to work on to get to the NBA.

I also believe that Storr now being at his 7th different team in the past 7 years says a lot about his mindset. I understand moving from a public HS to a private school basketball factory like Bishop Gorman. Why leave Gorman after a year to go to another top private school in Arizona? Why leave that school for IMG for a post-grad year? He didn't leave Gorman for better exposure because Gorman is one of those schools at the top of that food chain. When he gets to college, why did he only stay with Rick Pitino for one season? Anybody going to make a legitimate argument that Pitino isn't one of the top coaches in the sport?

His career trajectory screams one of two things to me. Either AJ Storr doesn't have the mentality toughness and desire to put in the work to get to the NBA, or he's got someone in his ear (dad, if stories are accurate) being way too involved as a parent to the detriment of AJ.

Rylan Griffen was overhyped from the moment he committed to Kansas. People were expecting him to step in and replace McCullar when Griffen has never been that style of player. Griffen was the 4th scoring option for Alabama last season and the 2nd worst defender on an already terrible defensive team.

He's a role player than many claimed would be more than a role player here. His main skill is shooting, but he hasn't been making shots recently and he doesn't add enough in other areas of the game yet to justify giving him the minutes that Coit is getting right now because those two guys largely fill the same roles and Coit is playing much better than Griffen right now.

@approxinfinity Any specific genres? Co-op, shorter or longer games?

@kuballin10 Remy bought into on offense and finally understood his role on the offensive side and where to be on the floor. There were quite a few times that season where Remy ruined end of half or end of game plays because he didn't understand what his role in those situations were and he would bring an extra defender with him into the set play and ruined what KU was trying to run for Ochai or Braun.

That's where AJ Storr is right now. If we talk about Self's offense being too complicated, then why have there been plenty of other newcomers that haven't had the same struggles that Griffen and Storr have had? Zeke Mayo is a newcomer just like Griffen and Storr so why hasn't he had the same struggles or leash as those two?

Two years ago, why did Gradey Dick or Kevin McCullar not have that same short leash that Yesufu, Udeh, or Ejiofor had?

It's not about Self being blindly loyal to players like you claim, it's about players understanding where they are supposed be on the floor together create the best opportunities possible for the offense and defense to work. We saw that with Bidunga on Tuesday in the second half until fouls dictated his substitution patterns and that Self left KJ on the bench. Flory just isn't consistent yet, but it's obvious the light is coming on for him.

Storr and Griffen aren't there yet, but Mayo is.

People keep talking about Storr's mind being messed up right now. Storr absolutely has the physical tools to play in the NBA, but he doesn't have the mentality to make the NBA yet. There's a reason he's in his 3rd year of college instead of the NBA despite his physical tools. Storr needed to be mentally broken to get to the next level and that's what we're seeing right now. Is AJ Storr patient enough and tough enough to allow Self to finish rebuilding AJ's mentality to get AJ where he wants to be?

Rylan Griffen is a different story. I believe many people here overhyped or overvalued Griffen's talent simply because he was a starter on a Final Four team. Reality is Griffen was the 4th scoring option, had the lowest PER of any of Alabama's rotation players, and was the second worst defender among their rotation players last season on a sub 100 ranked defense. Simply put, Rylan Griffen is a catch and shoot player who's pretty much useless when he's not making shots. Griffen was much more of a project player than what many here want to admit and we're seeing that play out now with his inconsistencies.

@kuballin10 problem with what you do is you kill any legitimate conversation because you derail just about every conversation you join by repeating your same points ad nauseum to anyone who has a different opinion than you. It's killed a lot of the legitimate conversations here because people are tired of you derailing every conversation back to your difference of opinions on Self's approach.

You like to repeat how much Self got lucky in 2022. Remy didn't do what he did in 2022 until after he finally bought into Self's plan and vision and that's when Self finally started trusting Remy on the floor amd giving him extended minutes. That's what everyone is waiting for with Griffen and Storr, particularly Storr. I just don't see it ever happening with Storr because I've said from day 1 of him committing that he was a bad fit at Kansas because he's a Temu version James Harden and that style of player doesn't work in Self's system.

@kuballin10 said in West Virginia- a game finally:

@dylans bless your heart….

You are like a talking parrot that repeats the same thought over and over

Pot meet kettle

@kjayhawks When KU got the lead down to two the first time, the refs blew a call against KU that gave WVU momentum back. Zeke Mayo chased down a bad pass, jumped before crossing the half court line and passed the ball back into the front court, but the refs called him for a halfcourt violation that they admitted after the game was a bad call.

I'm not screaming about the refs costing KU, but that missed call significantly altered the momentum of the game and let WVU go on a mini run to get the lead back to 3 possessions late.

I'd be curious to know which assistant coaches do the advanced scouting for which games and comes up with the scouting reports for each opponent.

It seems like this has become a major weakness for the staff and that's not all on Self. It seems Norm Roberts and Jeremy Case are pretty weak in this area and if there's any discussions about replacing assistant coaches in the offseason because it does seem like our scouting and preparation for games has been a major weakness the past couple of seasons.

@NormRoberts AJ Storr was never a good fit for this roster. He's never played any defense, still hasn't here. His idea of playing food defense is the same as most of my 7th grade team who have never played organized basketball before which is chase every pass to swipe at taking himself out of the play. On offense, Storr us a ball dominant player who plays like James Harden, but has about 30% of Harden's ability.

I also believe Storr is a bit uncoachable which is why this is his 7th different team in 7 years going back to high school. Storr has the physical tools to be an NBA player, but he doesn't have it between the ears to be one at this point. I don't know whether that's all on AJ, his family, or whoever is in his ear, but unless he figures something out, he'll be with his 8th team in 8 years next season.

Until the light comes on for Storr and Griffen, this team won't be any better than last season.

@nuleafjhawk said in And so it begins -- Players won't play without promised NIL $:

@Texas-Hawk-10 It IS a job. A job that these highly talented and greedy teenagers know that they are calling all the shots. The NIL must die or college sports will.

This is my point. Regardless of anyone's personal feelings about NIL, it's not going away and it's here to stay so schools and coaches have to adapt to this new reality that players are now employees and sports has become their jobs. When someone is doing a job for an agreed upon amount of money and doesn't get paid, they won't keep doing that job. If your boss came up to you and said, "nuleafjhawk, the company is financially struggling right now so we can't pay you any salary for the next 6 months, but we still expect you to come in and do your job everyday like you are being paid.", I guarantee you wouldn't show up and do your job for free for the next 6 months.

I tell my athletes all the time that as much as I love coaching them, I also don't do it for free and that if my school district stopped paying my stipends for coaching, I would not do it anymore.

@Jhawk69 I don't see OSU bouncing back. I think Mike Gundy has lost that locker room and program and OSU should've fired him after this season instead of restructuring his contract.

As much as I'm not a fan of NIL, I don't blame the players here very much. It has turned college sports basically into a job, so my question is how people here would keep doing their job and going to work if they stopped being paid? I know I wouldn't keep showing up to work if my employers weren't paying me.

Coach Bechard just announced his retirement from coaching.

@kjayhawks said in 2024 NFL Season:

The next question is do you play starters at all in Denver? You hate to lose this momentum you have built these last few weeks but don’t want to risk any injuries. Maybe play them for a quarter? 26 days to the divisional round that’s a long time to get rusty.

Doesn't Andy Reid typically rest players once KC has locked in their playoff seed?

Made it home to the motherland for this one. Better atmosphere than I expected for a Sunday afternoon game during the holiday break. Always nice to see KU play well in this game before Christmas when they've had a history of laying an egg in this game. Hopefully Rylan's not out long term.

OU remains undefeated with an improbable win over Michigan. OU was down 3, Jeremiah Fears hit a deep 3 with 11 seconds left and was fouled on the shot and hit the FT to win it after Michigan missed a couple of attempts to win it.

In theory, there's two versions of KU's best offensive line up. One with KJ and one without KJ. With KJ, Dejuan, Mayo/Coit, Griffen, and Dickinson. The one without Adams would be Storr in his place. Griffen, Mayo, and Coit can space the floor which allows Harris to drive and do his thing on offense.

Storr isn't as effective this season because there's not the space for him to drive. It could work if Dickinson at the top of the key setting a screen for Storr.

In least shocking thing ever, Dybansta has officially committed to BYU.

Every player on this roster has significant holes in their game and every line up combination Self can utilize has at least one glaring weakness on one end of the court.

Self did upgrade the athleticism of the roster, but he over corrected and brought in a bunch of guys who either don't try on defense (Storr and Mayo) or just aren't good defenders (Griffen and Coit).

The newcomers that can play defense (Moore, Bidunga, and Passmore) are offensive liabilities at this stage. I do believe Passmore and Bidunga will be serviceable offensively next season. The rumored Moore for Tillman swap doesn't help that issue as Tillman isn't a great natural athlete based on scouting reports so he won't fix the defensive issues in the front court.

This was something I was saying all offseason about the roster construction for this year being very flawed and the incoming players skills not complimenting the returning players skill sets.

Next season is what I'm much more looking forward to because KU will have a group whose games compliment each other better. Jackson, Peterson, Passmore, Tillman, and Bidunga is a good line up that is much more complete than this season and that's before any other transfers come in.

KU has hired DK McDonald as the new Defensive Coordinator and CB coach. He's been a DB coach with the Philadelphia Eagles for the past 4 seasons and was at Iowa St. for 4 years before that.

@SlimShaddy54 Big 12 doesn't release the football schedule for the next season until the end of January. The only 3 KU games that have dates for next season are the 3 non-conference games against Fresno St. (Aug. 23), Wagner (Aug. 30) and at Missouri (Sept. 6).

The home and away opponents during conference play through 2027 are known, just not specific dates yet.

Game was lost because KU couldn't stop turning the ball over in the first half and Self waited too late to switch who was guarding Bates. Having Mayo and Storr on Bates let him do whatever the hell he wanted to do today.

The defensive liabilities of this team are starting to show up and play out and the rumored roster move at semester isn't going to help, it's only going to make that issue worse.

@SlimShaddy54 Conference schedule hasn't been set yet, only opponents and home/away.

@DCHawker I don't think Alabama should be in over SMU this season. You should read up a few posts and you'll see that.

Your post I was responding to was specifically comparing Penn St. and SMU's rankings. PSU has "better" losses than SMU is why PSU is ahead of SMU.

@DCHawker Quality of losses. PSU lost to two teams were in the playoffs regardless of beating PSU and are regarded as the two favorites to win the national title this season. SMU's losses are viewed as worse because BYU didn't make the B12 title game and Clemson is only in because of beating SMU.

SMU shouldn't be punished for losing by a FG in a conference championship game when Alabama didn't play in one at all. For Bama, don't lose to a pair of 6-6 teams

@Crimsonorblue22 Zuby is the one I'm most disappointed in losing in recent years. Many thought I was crazy saying I would rather have had Zuby over Udeh, but Zuby to me always had the higher ceiling because of his defense. With some range in his game now too, Zuby has become the more versatile player overall from Udeh as well.

Here's the stats for the Big 12 RB's this season.

Devin Neal had 1266 yards and 16 TD's rushing along with 24 receptions for 254 yards a 1 TD for a total of 1520 yards and 17 TD's.

1st Team RB's were Cam Skattebo (ASU) and RJ Harvey (UCF)

Skattebo had 1398 yards and 17 TD's rushing and 35 receptions for 468 yards and 2 TD's for 1866 total yards and 19 TD's.

Harvey had 1577 yards and 22 TD's rushing and 20 receptions for 267 yards and 3 TD's for a total of 1844 yards and 25 TD's.

The second team backs were Tahj Brooks (Tech) and DJ Giddens (KSU).

Brooks had 1505 yards and 17 TD's rushing and 28 receptions for 199 yards and a TD for a total of 1804 yards and 18 TD's.

Giddens had 1343 yards and 7 TD's rushing and 21 receptions for 258 yards and 1 TD for a total of 1601 yards and 8 TD's.

Skattebo, Harvey and Brooks are guys I don't have a problem with being slotted ahead of Neal because their numbers all around were better than Neal's. Giddens is who I would strongly argue didn't deserve 2nd team honors and should've been Neal because of the TD's.

It's December, Self isn't emptying the bag of tricks this early in the season. This is also a team we'll have the potential to see again in March so why show everything? Also being shorthanded with the guy out being the key piece to countering Creighton's defense because of his shooting meant Self likely knew this would be a long game.

Also, did the Creighton game really expose anything that Self didn't already know about the weaknesses of his team?

Losing sucks and brings out the worst of this fanbase, but there wasn't anything shocking going on here. KU played a good team short handed that exploited a known weakness. Self isn't going to show what his counter to that strategy is in December, especially without Griffen available.

@nuleafjhawk said in Finally Some RESPECT: Jayhawks Favored At Baylor:

@Texas-Hawk-10 Yeah. We probably would have wound up something like 5-7 with him at the helm. My bad.

Marshall clearly wasn't ready this season. Remember how awful Daniels looked as a true freshman in his limited reps? It was obvious that Daniels wasn't ready at that point. There's a reason why Leipold didn't move Marshall up the depth chart until the last 4 games and why Leipold was looking at potential transfer QB's had Daniels left. It's clear by the staff's actions they don't believe Marshall is ready to take over as the starting QB at KU yet. Next season will likely be a battle between Marshall and incoming freshman McComb to see who takes over at QB in 2026 and the loser of that battle likely transferring out.

There's not a chance KU would've gone 5-7 with Marshall at QB this season.

@kjayhawks Giddens was a dumb ass while at KU who deserved to kicked off the team for that bar fight.

Volleyball with a 3-0 sweep over Colgate tonight in the 1st round of the NCAA Tournament. Will host Florida tomorrow night at 6:30pm in the 2nd round.

@stoptheflop Hunter being the last one down on offense after a defensive rebound is intentional because of 2 things. First, it keeps the lane clear while KU is bringing the ball up the court so our guards and wings can drive the ball into a clear lane for a layup. Second is that Hunter is a good enough outside shooter that if he's the trailer and left unguarded at the top of the key, he will take that shot.

Also, before he got hurt, Banchero was averaging 29 ppg, 8.8 rpg, and 5.6 apg. He legitimately deserves the hype he's getting because it won't be much longer before he's a legit top 10 player in the NBA.

We rip on other fan bases for letting KU live rent free in their heads so why are we letting Duke live rent free in ours?

Biggest concern for Mayo is his defense. In the Duke game, he was the one consistently leaving Proctor open in the corner when he was scorching the net.

@nuleafjhawk said in Finally Some RESPECT: Jayhawks Favored At Baylor:

@Texas-Hawk-10 the "star" ratings aren't Always the most reliable judge of a player's ability. 55 tds and 5,000-ish yards in one season says something. He was recruited by a lot of too ranked teams.

HS football in Michigan isn't the same as Texas, Ohio, Louisiana, Florida, or California. Michigan and Ole Miss were the only highly ranked programs at the time that offered. He was not someone they were looking at with the intention of starting from day 1. He was depth for each program.

Marshall may end up being a really good QB, but he was never expected to be at that level from day 1, including here at KU.

@nuleafjhawk said in Finally Some RESPECT: Jayhawks Favored At Baylor:

I'm curious about why this guy is sitting on the bench.

Isaiah Marshall

H.S. Athletic Background
2023: Had 3,114 yards and 39 touchdowns passing with 1,507 yards and 16 rushing touchdowns while leading his team to a state title.

Marshall was only a 3 star recruit so it's not like he was expected to come in and tear it up immediately. 3 stars generally need a year or two before they start becoming ready to play.

@kjayhawks said in Finally Some RESPECT: Jayhawks Favored At Baylor:

@Texas-Hawk-10 in 2006 we actually went 6-6 and were bowl eligible. There just wasn’t near as many bowls as there is now. I wish this team only gave away 4 games, then we’d be 8-4 or 7-5z I hate to break this to you but this isn’t D3 football. We don’t have to argue but mark my words this will cripple this program for a half of decade. Hope the next staff can sustain success.

D3 titles mean Leipold and his staff had to identify and develop talent because the best athletes in the region weren't banging down the down to go to a D3 school. Those players went there because they weren't good enough players to play FBS, FCS, or D2 football and Leipold and staff had to develop that talent to maintain that level of success because those are the only 6 titles in that programs history.

And when transfer players are considering KU, they don't just look at the overall record, they will look and see that KU was very close to being a 10 win team and has lots of playing time available. KU isn't going to have the on field drop off you think they will next season.

@kjayhawks Just fucking stop with the cancel the program bullshit, joking or not. It's played out, unoriginal, and just stupid fucking take. Leipold didn't win 6 D3 titles by accident, didn't make Buffalo relevant by accident?

Were you spouting this same shitty take after 2006 when KU didn't make a bowl and lost 4 games they should've won as well?

I know today was frustrating, but at least we didn't have to deal with the dumb shit that's gone on at several games today including the Michigan/OSU game, UNC/NCST game, the ND/USC game, and the UT/A&M game which had fights either during or after the game.

KU scores 86 and only has 2 in double figures. Didn't get to watch due to driving back from Waco, but sounded like that 3 from Furman that made it a 1 point game is what lit the fire because KU outscored Furman 59-25 over the last 26 minutes of the game.